What do you think of the Rhinos?

I've been thinking about the Rhino Palidan class lately, and it seems to me that this class is a bit... underpowered.
I'm leveling up my own pally class to see how they are and I can't stop noticing a few things.
The Rhino Might spell can be a good example. When compared to the Stomp the bears use, this skill is a weak. The range of effectiveness is 3m while Stomp has a range of 8m which is a very big difference.
The bear's taunt skill costs 0 mana to use and gives a considerable amount of dodge, but the Rhino's Summon skill costs mana and lowers enemy dodge with a very marginal DoT effect. The thing here is that bears can use a skill for free while Rhinos have to use mana to do about the same thing. Mana usage is an issue I'll bring up soon.
Soon as in now. Rhinos blow through mana like water going through a bucket with a hole in the bottom. I'm sure people notice this instantly. The only mana regeneration skill costs a hefty mana to activate just for a small 3 seconds of extended mana boost. (Just to say that it's useless. Why spend mana to regenerate mana? Especially with this class that is dependent on mana)
That's just a small part of the things that bring this class down from its true potential. I'd like to ask you all a question now:

What do you think of the Rhinos? Do you think they are underpowered, overpowered, or balanced?

Underpowered.....Im out of mana pots at lvl five....id choose bear over this ANYTIME!!!

made a rhino, ragequit after i saw all the skills and tried them out. Ugh, the rhino is pure support for the better classes

I have a 59 rhino, tried out 51-56 pvp, and got almost positive without rushes, kd was like 180-200. I usually have 2:1 kd on each character, so i know what in doing. The point is, rhinos are definately underpowered, even in ctf. Sure there buffs are strong, but even if youre str, you die easily. Plus, rhinos have no dmg besides there tornado

I'd say that another thing that blows Rhinos up is the fact that the Force buffs (Makes you think of Star Wars no?) can't be used at the same time while you have classes like the mage piling on two major buffs and blasting enemies apart.
Even the buff effects aren't even as powerful alone to be considered dangerous if they were to be used together compared to the other classes.

I agree that they're underpowered. I have to admit, though, that at 56 they aren't bad. They can tank alot of damage as well!

End game rhinos own in ctf with the charge spell.

the first 30 levels are annoying and do have mana problems but then you get iceberg set wich is the first set you get that starts your mana problem solution due to high regen of mana and higher regen of health . and also the paladin has 2 epic buffs which allows him to buff his whole party and epicly because they increase armor highly and damage highly , and his heal is almost better than the mage to himself but to his party it doesn't grant regen but still he is a SUPPORT class like the mage but just stronger :) so i think he is balanced because he is :
Bad because he has mana problems first 30 levels and he does have like 3 useless buff skills... and about 2 useless damaging skills
Good because he has 2 epic buffs / and can heal very gd and can resuruct :)
So overall the paladin is BALANCED

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Originally Posted by Shadowstar

Underpowered.....Im out of mana pots at lvl five....id choose bear over this ANYTIME!!!

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because you are only level 5 and why do you use pots at low level , if you are out of mana just use auto-attack , for me the most attack that i use is the auto-attack... so its your problem not everyone faces that problem if they just use logic

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Originally Posted by MageMaster

the first 30 levels are annoying and do have mana problems but then you get iceberg set wich is the first set you get that starts your mana problem solution due to high regen of mana and higher regen of health . and also the paladin has 2 epic buffs which allows him to buff his whole party and epicly because they increase armor highly and damage highly , and his heal is almost better than the mage to himself but to his party it doesn't grant regen but still he is a SUPPORT class like the mage but just stronger :) so i think he is balanced because he is :
Bad because he has mana problems first 30 levels and he does have like 3 useless buff skills... and about 2 useless damaging skills
Good because he has 2 epic buffs / and can heal very gd and can resuruct :)
So overall the paladin is BALANCED

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I don't get how you can call the party buffs "epic" in any way. It's +5 armor or +36 damage to party. That's like 1 or 2% for high level parties. It's basically meaningless and only one can be active at a time as was pointed out. The only meaningful support a rhino can offer is healing and rev, both of which can be done far better by mages. It's a decent tank I suppose, but bears blow rhinos out of the water in that department. The class has nothing to recommend it over other choices as it stands now.

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Originally Posted by Fusionstrike

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Originally Posted by MageMaster

the first 30 levels are annoying and do have mana problems but then you get iceberg set wich is the first set you get that starts your mana problem solution due to high regen of mana and higher regen of health . and also the paladin has 2 epic buffs which allows him to buff his whole party and epicly because they increase armor highly and damage highly , and his heal is almost better than the mage to himself but to his party it doesn't grant regen but still he is a SUPPORT class like the mage but just stronger :) so i think he is balanced because he is :
Bad because he has mana problems first 30 levels and he does have like 3 useless buff skills... and about 2 useless damaging skills
Good because he has 2 epic buffs / and can heal very gd and can resuruct :)
So overall the paladin is BALANCED

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I don't get how you can call the party buffs "epic" in any way. It's +5 armor or +36 damage to party. That's like 1 or 2% for high level parties. It's basically meaningless and only one can be active at a time as was pointed out. The only meaningful support a rhino can offer is healing and rev, both of which can be done far better by mages. It's a decent tank I suppose, but bears blow rhinos out of the water in that department. The class has nothing to recommend it over other choices as it stands now.

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It owns end game ctf.

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Originally Posted by MageMaster

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Originally Posted by Shadowstar

Underpowered.....Im out of mana pots at lvl five....id choose bear over this ANYTIME!!!

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because you are only level 5 and why do you use pots at low level , if you are out of mana just use auto-attack , for me the most attack that i use is the auto-attack... so its your problem not everyone faces that problem if they just use logic

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I WAS! But not only mana. The buffs can't stack and rhino might is bad compared to stomp. And summon costs mana while taunt doesn't

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Originally Posted by MageMaster:937966

the first 30 levels are annoying and do have mana problems but then you get iceberg set wich is the first set you get that starts your mana problem solution due to high regen of mana and higher regen of health . and also the paladin has 2 epic buffs which allows him to buff his whole party and epicly because they increase armor highly and damage highly , and his heal is almost better than the mage to himself but to his party it doesn't grant regen but still he is a SUPPORT class like the mage but just stronger :) so i think he is balanced because he is :
Bad because he has mana problems first 30 levels and he does have like 3 useless buff skills... and about 2 useless damaging skills
Good because he has 2 epic buffs / and can heal very gd and can resuruct :)
So overall the paladin is BALANCED

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Those "epic" buffs can't be used at the same time, and how are they balanced if they have 5 useless skills?
There are a lot more things sticking out saying "Underpowered" than any of the could-be good things that would've made the class unique but balanced.

Still underpowered

I actually kinda like it for pve as PL needed a true support class
Unfortunately the elixirs have killed pve...and the game

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Originally Posted by tHelonestud:971822

I actually kinda like it for pve as PL needed a true support class
Unfortunately the elixirs have killed pve...and the game

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Also bears are too stong they need more taunts and less dmg

In PvE Rhinos are tanks. They can survive a lot longer than a bear and can control mobs too. In PvP bears have to first make rhinos lose all mana before they can kill. Birds can kill rhino easily and mages can too. But in PvE Rhino is best class if you just buy 2000 mana potions sometimes

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Originally Posted by finnman

In PvE Rhinos are tanks. They can survive a lot longer than a bear and can control mobs too. In PvP bears have to first make rhinos lose all mana before they can kill. Birds can kill rhino easily and mages can too. But in PvE Rhino is best class if you just buy 2000 mana potions sometimes

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I agree rhinos can tank pretty well. However, I don't see them surviving better than bears in my experience, at least in PvE. I personally am much more effective at staying alive on my bear than my rhino, although maybe that's just because I've played my bear much more. But I think one key reason bear beats rhino as tank is the higher health and better defensive buffs. I can survive a lot of boss super wipe attacks on my bear that one-shot my rhino. Again, maybe I'm just not playing my rhino to its full potential, but my sense is the rhino needs pretty perfect timing with using its short defensive buffs whereas bear has longer-lasting buffs that are more forgiving against huge damage outputs.

This is a very good feedback thread.

My experience with the Rhino so far is the following:

1. I play a 56 Rhino twink at Nuri's
2. In 30-40 Elite dragon runs on my int/str mage we had a Rhino as tank (and he was doing a great job).

Personally I think that Rhinos are closer to Int/Str mages (Pallies). Compared to Pallies, Rhinos's skills are short ranged, however they have crowd control capabilities (summon and 2 stun skills) so they are more efficient at tanking. The Pallies's big advantage is that if there is a good tanker in the party, they can use a staff for decent damage output. On the other hand, Rhinos's damage output is not great. Therefore, Pallies are more flexible but Rhinos are better tanks.

Compared to Bears, Rhinos cannot pull which makes them less efficient crowd controllers. They also have less health and less total dodge (including buffs). However, they have nice party buffs plus heal/rev. This makes them great for support since they can stay alive using str gear and take good care of other party members when the team is under pressure.

Rhinos's big advantage over both Pallies and Bears is the charge skill. Like Ghost said, this makes Rhinos very good at CTF. But it is also very useful for tanking because it helps Rhinos stay ahead of the party which gives them some extra time to group mobs. A secondary use of this skill is when you enter a map late and you try to catch up :)

Also, I believe Rhinos are important for the game for the following reason: in several RPGs, people choose warriors because it's supposed to be the most straightforward class. In the case of PL, things were not that simple with bear being the only option for warriors because this class requires great skill (especially for efficient grouping using beckon and stomp). Bad bears can be very annoying for a party as they might not tank and/or scatter. On the other hand, bad Rhinos might not tank but even if they stay back and just spam skills they will still do some good with buffs/heal/rev. So a bad rhino is a lot better than a bad bear :)

Fusion mentioned that buffs are not very useful for high level which seems true. Especially this +5 armor is a joke. Therefore, some tweaking may be required.

Regarding mana regen problems, I did experience what Cahaun describes in the beginning, but I have no problems at lvl 56 using a str/int build.

In summary, I think the Rhino class is a good addition to the game but some adjustments might be necessary. Note that this class seems to be support oriented so it's not suitable for natural born protagonists. But supporting actors win Oscars too you know :)