The future of PL ... long term recommendations; my most important post for this year

Introduction

To begin with, I know that there have been others that have made other similar threads. My goal is to summarize the list of grievances and to make recommendations. I would like this kept in the General Discussion for now. I intend for this to be the most important post that I have ever made since I joined the forums, so please keep this civil readers (I desperately wish to avoid this being locked, moved, or to turn this into a flame war). The other thing I would like to say is that if you ignore every other post that I make, I would like this one to have the most weight. This will also be the first post that I at some point plan on blogging.


Recently, there have been trends in PL that have been ... controversial. Perhaps the last time that the PL was so controversial was the introduction of the Global Cooldown System which heavily split the community in two, resulted in heavy flaming, and a variety of other unpleasant effects. I am also a bit troubled at the long term direction that things have been going. There has been the perception that the developers have been less receptive to feedback overall (and in my opinion, not without justification).

I have played several MMOs before, and I can tell the long term trends. Were this any other MMO, I would not have bothered to have posted this and left quietly. I have known several people that have quit out of frustration with the direction of the game, most prominently (and those of you who are new to the forums will not know him), a player known as "Royce", who had disagreements with the random drop packs and the quality of the forums themselves.

I will split this into a 2 part post for readability purposes.







Today

The typical PL character looks something like this (this is my main, circa December 2011):
Attachment 3512

Many players have spent varying amounts of platinum and have put varying amounts of time into the game.

Lately however, there has been a decline in the satisfaction of players, particularly after the fall of 2011.







Nuri's Hallows

Ever since the introduction of Nuri's Hallows, there has been the perception that the developers have been more profit rather than quality of content driven.


Problems
For the most part, I found Nuri's Hallows to be somewhat underwhelming. There was nothing truly new in a sense. The last time I was disappointed was the introduction of the Shadow Caves. I felt that it was like Alien Underground, with the monsters of Alien Oasis (the Djinn, Shadow Monsters, and the like) with nothing truly new that only hit hard. I think that many others got similar motivation in Nuri:

1. The environment did not look "new"; it looked like the old Forest backgrounds in Symphony, old bog backgrounds, etc. Madness looked like Alien Oasis. The others, such as Lion's Den looked new enough.

2. The monsters were not new in the case of Symphony; they said the same things as before

3. They just hit harder, with nothing more interesting (ex: in Lost Expedition, monsters could freeze you)

4. The bosses said the same things that prior bosses in the Sewers (ex: Bandit King and Queen, Goblin King, etc) said; and King Mynas was reused for the Snake Charmer

5. There was less creativity overall it seemed

Contrast this with the Sewers, which had relatively new content, an acceptable difficulty level, and challenges for the boss. Up until 5 months in, people were not bored. The only good thing about it was that the Demonic sets looked cool. The custom, enchanted, and fortified by contrast looked plain, especially when one compared to their predecessors (void, rift, cosmos) which looked unique.


Demonic Glyph
Yet the demonic itself caused much controversy. I created a thread, recommending that people could craft their sets for platinum. The reaction from those that spent money was instantly negative and resulted in a flame war. I asked a friend of mine to tell me how much he spent to finish his demonic obedience dex set (he purchased it on the first day). He said ~15 million gold and 90 plat. What is astounding is that it was just the bow, helm, and leather. He would have had to spend more if he wanted the dagger and wing (which he did not). I suppose int mages are at a drawback here - they may need the staff, wand, and bracer. This also means that they need to spend more platinum than dex builds who just need 3 pieces.

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...able-with-plat

He was indifferent to the fact that prices dropped to 9 million shortly, but others were very protective of their investment. The point is that it illustrated the growing rich-poor gap in PL and resulted in a flame war. Unfortunately some of the posts in the thread above were deleted. Nonetheless, the gist of it is clear. It took months for many to get the demonic, by which point the depreciation was at a much faster rate. The poorer players had envy of the rich, while many of the wealthy resented how fast their demonic sets declined in value.

I think that for demonic, STS made it too hard to obtain. The many threads complaining about this are a testament to that. It was a chore, not an accomplishment. Fortunately, this was rectified with the latest level, Mount Fang.



The Elixir Controversy
However, the biggest controversy that resulted was the difficulty level. Combined with the aggressive promotion of elixirs that STS had made (free dailies, the placement of Vinnie the Vendor, etc), it led to the perception that all that mattered was platinum. At first, I defended STS, but when I realized that in a typical PUG, this game was approaching unplayable, I found myself frustrated.

Some of the oldies told me that the last time they recalled this level of difficulty was what they called the "pre-nerf" AO3 days. I have not been around long enough to know what that was like, so I am forced to take their word for it.

The point is that the game for many was extremely difficult without elixirs. A standard Bandit Boy Hideout run in the Sewers could be completed in 5-6 minutes, and under 4 minutes with a proficient team. Catacombs and other more difficult levels were also not as long. Without elixirs, the run length (I believe STS formally calls this the "rate of content consumption") was several times that of others, particularly for Symphony, with only Nuri's Madness being of comparable length.

Needless to say, STS made a significant windfall over this. But the bigger problem is that of lost goodwill. A lot of players no longer view STS as benevolent as before. Most of course understand that STS is a business, but they felt that things had gone too far.

In frustration, I introduced a guide for players:

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...nce-the-update

Seeing how few people read it, I will not be introducing a guide for Fang.








Mount Fang

Mount Fang relieved few of the problems that Nuri had, but worsened a few.

Observations


Timing - Earlier than Expected

The first problem that occurred was the timing of the release. The level cap was supposed to have been raised on the 24th of November. When it came sooner, several players complained as they had (barely) missed the cap. They were perhaps 0-30k of xp from the cap and had originally been timing for a release on the 24th. They missed their chance at the vanity shield.

For PvP Balance, I have voiced some ideas:
http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...-and-now-Armor

For those that are in this position though ... I'm at a loss on what to say. I thought it was going to be on the 24th as well. I think that the crown of persistence and vanity clothes should give the same set bonus as crown and shield. I also recommend that STS give more warning if they intend to do this in the future. People ... be advised, whenever there's a cap rise, get to the elite if you want it ASAP.


The Release

After the release came, there were other problems:

1. The background again: Nothing original - I though for a moment that I was playing in Balefort Castle only with harder monsters. Little things like this imply a lack of effort, especially combined with how rapidly the dungeon was released (3 months, although the 6 months of Sewers was mainly due to the bottleneck by SL).

2. The monsters hit less hard relative to the new equipment, but they had an insane amount of hp. Eyeballing it, I'd estimate 7-9 thousand hp. A standard non-elixir run requires for a bird 50-100 pots (depending on what level), although it can be less than 25 with a good bear (which are unfortunately in short supply and the bear will need to consume a lot of potions as well). This was huge. It worsened the perception that STS wanted platinum elixirs. This also worsened the fact that the levels would take a long time without elixirs.

3. Some people found the equipment ugly looking. On one hand, I do applaud STS for making the equipment original (the vampire theme), on the other hand it did not look truly "end game".

4. Some people are unhappy with PvP balance - in particular, dex gear needs a buff (preferably to crit).


Things Resolved

It is easier to get the end game gear now than it was in Nuri. This is a good thing. It means that the rich-poor gap has been somewhat narrowed. The introduction of the daily quests was also a step in the right direction. I do not understand why similar quests were not present in Nuri - they were there in the Sewers for crafting materials. For end game equipment to be optimal, it needs to be hard enough to seem like an achievement, but at the same time, not so hard as to divide the community and cause the controversy that it did.

The mobs do not hit as hard (which I said earlier), which makes the game somewhat more playable than Nuri. A competent group of players at level 60 with level 60 gear should be able to complete the level. However, this was largely negated by the volume of health the mobs had. It takes 2 nature strikes from a pure int mage with a staff to wipe out the mobs. Few PUGs have players that have the good enough timing to execute this successfully.

However, the big problems introduced in Nuri still remain.





The Big Problem

The big problem though still remains. There is the perception that STS has been milking people of platinum too hard while players do not feel as if they are getting their money's worth. I have asked some players in my guild. Apparently I am cheap by comparison. To date, I have purchased "only" 4,800 platinum. Others have spent $500 - $1,000 USD on the game.

I think that the biggest problem is that STS is going to make a windfall in the short run, but lose customers in the long run due to frustration.

I have seen similar trends in other MMOs.




In order for a game to succeed, 2 things need to happen:

1. STS must make enough money in order for its developers to enjoy a good living and to be able to afford high quality content

2. The players must feel as if they are getting their money's worth. Increasingly, #2 is in question.


I suspect that for a game like this, the initial cost of developing the game engine (which takes years) is the most expensive, and then the marginal costs of releasing new dungeons declines with time. However, server costs should increase as more players come in, although this should be more than offset by the increased platinum sales. If this is not true, please disclose. Transparency on these matters is always welcomed.

Part 2 will go on about my recommendations on how to fix this.

The PL Community

There are 4 basic types of PL Players. Let me Split them into 2 categories first.

PvE Players

1. Casual players. They may play PvP for a bit, but by far their main attraction is PvE. They don't spend a lot of time on PL, may or may not reach level cap. Only a portion will buy platinum. The main spine was made free in an attempt to get more of this type of player.

2. Hardcore PvE players. They may have experienced PvP, but do not like it, usually due to their poor performance or bad experiences. They spend a lot of time playing PvE and are among the richest players in the game. They can be a good source of revenue, with many consuming hundreds of plat (sometimes thousands) per month in elixirs, vanity, and other items. They may have serval alts. There are also many aggressive merchants in this category. A subcategory are a handful that do PvP, but mainly PvE.

PvP Players

3. Twinkers: They are hardcore PvPers. They usually have multiple twinks and spend lavishly per character, trying to get the perfect "twink". They play at many different levels and love what they do. Their only recent complaint has been the decline of twinking, which has seen a rise of rushers and sore losers.

4. Level Cap PvPers: I myself am in this category. They are usually the first to get to the level cap. Level cap PvP is why they exist. Money only matters as an end to get the best equipment. At each level cap, they get their quickly, get the end game equipment, and basically spend 80%+ of their time (some 100%) in PvP. If they did not have to, many would spend little or even no time in PvE.

Note that the first 3 people since the elite caps were introduced to reach them were:

Thelonercher ("Mike")
Dolloway
AlwaysDTF

All of them are hardcore PvP players. They want to reach the cap and go PvP not drag on in the world of PvE.



Categories 2-4 are a reliable source of revenue. Category 1 - only a percentage will become hardcore, at which point, they ultimately end up in one of those categories. Perhaps research should be done in how to make a higher proportion of category 1s into 2-4. By making more players around, there should be more money for higher quality content and the costs can be reduced (ex: less platinum for certain things) because they are now spread around a larger player base, which in turn attracts more people.










Recommendations

To begin with, it's important to recognize that STS is a for profit business (which many players do not). At the same time, I feel that STS has put a decreasing importance on each player's loyalty, perhaps due to the influx of new players.

It is also important to recognize that players that play more hours or spend platinum will have an advantage over those that do not play as much or spend as much. The important thing (which STS is now failing in my opinion) is to NOT force everyone to spend a lot of platinum, while making sure that people who do spend feel satisfied.



PvE Runs
With a growing number of people disenchanted about elixirs, there needs to be 3 categories of games. Basically, whenever a player hosts a game, I feel that they should be able to select 3 categories:

1. Default Category: People with or without elixirs can enter. This is like before.

2. Combo Only: Only 2x, 3x, and 4x combo players may enter. This is to prevent leeching and because as paying customers, they are entitled to their own games (think of it like a "first class" on a ship or airplane kind of thing). They want fast runs and are either levelling to the cap or are hardcore farmers. This is also because there may not be enough players on an elixir for a private game.

3. No Platinum Elixir: There is a growing number of people that lament the direction that this game is going. They are unhappy with the elixirs. In this category, people who buy anything other than a luck elixir for platinum are not permitted. People in this category may still purchase gold elixirs. I recommend for this category, that players here become a focus group for STS to do market research to see how they may please them in a manner that encourages them to spend platinum if STS wishes.

Another reason why this category is important is for players that wish for a challenge. Having a person jump in with a 4X ruins this.

Finally, this category will allow players that do not use a lot of plat elixirs to not feel marginalized and obligated to "pot up". In the future, they may spend more.



For those interested, I have completed a guide on how to optimize for 4X elixirs and to get the most "bang for buck".
http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...ely-in-a-group


On that note, it takes under 2 hours to get from level 61 to 65 and then another 12 hours for level 65 to 66, assuming you are in a good party with all 4X users and follow my guide. Good teams with all damage dealers may be able to do this in under 12 hours - remember that time is money with elixirs.




Rate of Cap Rises

As it turns out, people seem to like having slower cap rises. The Sewers lasted for 6 months. Why? SL bottlenecked it. By contrast, there are feelings of unhappiness from many players when the cap is raised to quickly. Why?


1. It makes the elite cap unreachable without platinum for busier people. I know that in the short run, this may seem desirable for STS, but in the long run, it is not good at all - people will get fed up and leave.

2. It amplifies the rich - poor gap. Each time a new dungeon is released, it forces everyone to level (when cap is raised) and for the hardcore, to get new items (due to the rise in difficulty).

3. It increases the perception that the game is all about platinum now. Every time, PvP players will want to use elixirs to get to the cap.

4. Level Cap PvP players (category 4) are at a huge disadvantage compared to their twinking and PvE brethren. PvP does not pay money. It means that they must get to the cap and get the money needed to buy the sets. Most PvP players would not PvE if they did not have to. This means for them, a second windfall is that they will often have to choose the easier crafting. At 30 plat, this means 150 plat or more. Not a problem for PvE players (who are rich from their farming) and twinking (who do not need to level with a new cap, although it may open up new categories for twinking, which usually entails a new character).

5. The quality of the new levels has not been up to par, and they do not compare favourably with AO3 or the Sewers, for reasons I have discussed earlier.



I recommend that the level cap be raised once every 4-6 months, based on player feedback. Humania should not be released until Q2 2012 for this reason. See how many people are "ready" for it by making threads on the forums.

The new level, Humania needs to be as polished as possible.





Quality of New Caps

The quality of the new caps must be epic. Alien Oasis 3 was considered epic for its time, although its difficulty was criticized and resulted in the nerf, people ultimately remembered it fondly.

1. The backgrounds must be truly unique. There are plenty of ideas. Underwater, lava, ice, middle ages factory, perhaps an Asian theme (ex: Ancient China now that Ancient Egypt has been done), etc.

2. The mobs should be original. What they say should be original. Perhaps even how they attack should be original. They should reflect the background theme (ex: look at Alien Oasis where the Djinn, Mummies, and Aliens reflect the desert theme or the monsters of Frozen Nightmare or the slime creatures in the Catacombs). This was broken in the Symphony.

3. Bosses need to be be unique and epic. For the most part, STS has gotten this one right. However, they should say original text. They need to be original too. (ex: King Mynas model reused as "Snake Charmer" in Nuri).

4. Equipment must look "cool" and be reflective of the theme. End game gear must look like it is worth getting and must be distinct from lower level gear (one of the failures of the Sewers).

5. For reasons discussed earlier, the ultimate end game pinks should not be too hard to get. The difficulty level of Mount Fang is fine - keep it and make sure that there are daily quests.

6. The difficulty should be balanced. On one hand, it should be somewhat harder than the prior level. On the other hand, it must be playable without elixirs. At the same time, there needs to be some incentive to get elixirs. This is the biggest challenge.

7. Elite level rewards should remain and they should offer something unique. I am disappointed at the rather uninspired look of the mage and bird vanity cloths (they look like mega mage and raid roach). The vanity shield could also look "cooler". One thing the Sewers did right was make the helmet look unique.

8. New obstacles. For example, perhaps more mobs should debuff. The vents of the Sewers (and earlier levels), along with the traps in Lion's Den were an example of an "obstacle". Perhaps things like a lava trap (for the lava theme I suggested) could be made. The dropping weights from Gustav is another good example. Monsters too should be given unique abilities.

To date, what we have are 3 generic monsters:

A. A melee monster; typical grunt
B. An archer; usually more dangerous than the melee guy
C. A healer or mage

Variants have been made, such as the slime creatures. We need to see more unique monsters and more unique obstacles.

9. Incentives to keep playing. The daily quests are a good example. We need more incentives to keep playing and more rewards. Remember - the more people play, the more they spend plat.

10. It is important that PvP be balanced. No single class of equipment should be overpowered or underpowered. I feel that dex in Mount Fang as I said earlier needed a buff. For a further discussion on what ideal equipment is, here is a somewhat dated, but still useful guide. I recommend that all future equipment follow this, not just for PvP balance, but also because PvE difficulty will only increase:

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...-from-the-past



Quality is more important than how often the cap is raised. Good quality means good replayability, which means a satisfied customer and not one that looks forward to the next cap because the current dungeon was underwhelming.







New optional things to get with platinum

The vanity pets were a movement in the right direction. They need to be completely optional (no stats), but cool enough for people to buy.

Thoughts:

1. Must have more variety of vanity pets

2. Distinction between high end and low end pets (bats vs turkeys/balloon, but more variety needed)

3. Should be not be annoying (bats in particular can be distracting)

4. Able to identify whose vanity it was (bats fly all over the place; need one big bat to circle the player)

5. Should not have stats to make it optional


There can be other ideas in this direction. The important thing is that they are completely optional, but cool enough to be worth buying. They should have no effect in game. Perhaps something like a personal space would by cool. I'm sure there are other ideas.





Incentives to spend

The deal of the day was a step in the right direction. However, I feel that there needs to be more for players in order to give them an incentive.

I am open to the following ideas:

1. Packaged deals - the ability to unlock everything at a discount, buy every ring, etc.

2. Unlimited deals (ex: if I were to pay x number of platinum, I could get 1 free respec per week for the indefinite future)


Monthly Subscription?
Another idea is to open up an optional monthly subscription. This would alleviate the platinum fears on elixirs.

Say, for $15 or $20 USD a month (give a discount for an annual subscription, say $150 or $200), a player has 4x elixirs whenever they enter a dungeon and a few other perks (need good incentives for this to happen). Combined with the fact that dungeons are now segregated, we should see:

1. More players willing to pay up, which should offset the massive amounts that individuals have spent

2. No obligation to pay up due to the segregation system I proposed

Perhaps a perk could be something like a discount on all platinum purchases. For example, if I buy this subscription and I buy a vanity, I get x% off.

This would alleviate the massive perception that STS only cares about platinum elixirs - people can farm unlimited now. Buyers would also need an option to "turn off" the elixirs when they wanted a challenge (not a loss as they already paid for this service anyways).

The goal should be to get a large and loyal subscriber base.

Again, I must emphasize that this is optional and that nobody should ever feel that they have to spend. In the long run, this will lead to more subscribers. Ensure that other incentives are given to give people a good reason for signing up and make sure that people who do sign up feel that they get their money's worth.







Completely new things to address the boredom

There has been increasing boredom of the builds. Skill combos are now uniform. If nothing happens at 71, we will basically be able to put 6 points in all but 1 skill. For now I recommend the following.

On the next level cap:

1. All non-buff skills should be raised to a maximum of 8 points per skill

2. Buffs for bear (rage, taunt, evade), bird (evasion, focus), and mage (blessings of might/vitaility) should remain at 6 points. This is prevent overreliance on buffs.

3. Points should give a percentage rather than an fixed value. For example, at maximum, rage gives 60 more damage. This is HUGE at low levels, but gets less important as levels go up. Percentages work better. Same with points. Example - blast shot. The first point gives the basic skill. The next point gives a percentage on top of that skill and so on. This will favor pure builds somewhat (intended because pure builds are at a disadvantage now with the new dual spec system). Base stats should offer the most skill damage. For bear, it should be adjusted so that str gives more than dex in skill damage.

A fundamental new skill system could be made. There could be branching or 4 new skills, of which 12 can be picked, or perhaps as many as 20. They should be all comparable in power and not lead to OP combinations (must test).





The need for a PvP reward system

After careful consideration, I have come to the conclusion that PvP players are at a huge disadvantage to their PvE counterparts. An hour of PvP brings satisfaction (if you weren't rushed or met a bad player anyways), but little else.

First, the goal should be to get more PvP players. Second, there needs to be an incentive to PvP. At the same time, PvP should remain optional. Out of fairness for PvP players though, if PvE players don't have to PvP, then why should PvP players be forced to PvE when many clearly dislike it?

I think that the reward for PvP should be either money or drops. An example - you get a drop every time you get a kill or score a goal (with a better chance in 5v5 CTF than 3v3). The rewards should be roughly equal to the amount of time that you spend in PvE. That is, an hour of PvP and an hour of PvE will give you roughly the same chance of getting say, an end game pink. A mechanism needs to be put in place for boosting. This would need a bit of tweaking though to prevent abuse from kill boosters (probably see if the target player is doing anything; if the target player has not used skills 3 times in a row; or based on their IP address, they are from the same location, something is up). More tweaking would be needed to ensure that the drop rates are fair and that prices are not affected. Remember that end game sets need to be tough enough to be a challenge, but not too tough to get.

This is a problem for level cap in particular, who need money to get the end game sets and go back to PvP.

I have also recommended new maps for PvP - there should be new maps every few months:
http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...e-new-PvP-Maps

New maps should occur roughly as often for PvP as level cap increases in PvE - to spice things up.






Greater developer involvement

One of the great things about PL in the early days was that the developers frequently were involved and posted in most of the threads. I feel that the developers overall have become more detached. It is true that the players deserve some of the blame. The quality of the newer generation of players has declined and you can see the decline in useful posts. Nonetheless, greater developer involvement would be a huge asset. It would allow the developers to see what the players wanted, what they feel affects them, and perhaps gain insights into how to get more platinum sales. Furthermore, it gives the feeling that customers are valued.





Forum Programs
The introduction of the GOA and other programs has led to disagreements on who should be selected and why. I think at this point, the GoA should just be scrapped and every GoA just become a regular member once more. The quality of GoAs has declined with each generation and selections appear arbitrary at times.

Who gets the AoA and the like should also be watched carefully. I recommend little or no perks for the AoA program. Otherwise, people will join for the perks, just as the GoA was an aspired title for the shield. Pick people who do it out of passion, not for perks.




Other Concerns
I am not sure what to do about these:

1. The quality of the average player seems to have seriously declined; many PUGs cannot finish a Mount Fang level, and sometimes, even with 3 people on elixirs, there can be a group wipe

2. The quality of the forums have declined, with more flame posts

Part of the reason that this is happening is that the first generation of players was dedicated. Eventually, the game got more popular and this led to the creation of the "Mynas Gen". The expansion into Android brought a lot of good players and also players that did not have a clue what they were doing. I suspect that the player skill level is similar between the 2 platforms now that the game has been on Android for over a year. Another problem may be that there are more younger players now, many of whom this is their first forum.

At the same time, now that the game is free (main spine anyways), there may be players who have come in with the feeling that they have nothing to lose as they did not spend platinum. Either way, the skill level has declined. Power leveling was considered a culprit and the blocking of low levels was a good solution (although to be honest, I think that alts from an established player should be allowed), but it evidently was only a small part of the problem.

I am open to suggestions on this matter. For now, I recommend greater enforcement and a willingness to use temporary bans. It's a far from perfect solution though.

In game, I am not sure how to improve the quality of player. There are for example, plenty of mages at level 65 that don't heal, bears that don't know how to use stomp, birds that refuse to do a lot of damage to bosses, etc. Nonetheless, it is a serious issue. It worsens the problem earlier - that people perceive the game as unplayable without elixirs. The culprit may be their own lack of skill, but they will blame the developers for it.


In an attempt to improve the quality of player, I have made a fairly comprehensive guide on game mechanics that I recommend newer player's read:

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...team-mechanics

For players who would like to know how to fight bosses correctly, I have also made this:

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...ighting-bosses

These guides will help you understand the game mechanics better. I also recommend reading up Physiologic's guides on birds, Ellyidol's bear guides, and the outdated, but still useful Enchantress Class Headquarters by Pharcyde for more class specific information.


Conclusions

Today, STS is making quite a bit on platinum. However, many players have voiced their dissatisfaction. This is good in the short run, but bad in the long run.

We could see a larger group of disillusioned players leave at some point. The new caps have offered little creativity and an increase in difficulty that many perceive are nothing more than a ploy to get more plat. Players do not feel that they are getting their money's worth, while the older players look at the "good old days" more so than ever before. I think that a ton of goodwill has been destroyed since Nuri has come out.

Failing to act will lead to the long term decline in reputation and perhaps revenue of PL. It has happened before to other MMOs.

Furthermore, if a success is made, then we could see other benefits. Players will be much more willing for example to recommend PL to their friends and STS will continue to enjoy a good reputation among gamers. Today in the PC world, many big companies like EA and Activision are disliked for "milking" customers through DLC, restrictive DRM, and other questionable business practices. STS so far has enjoyed a relatively good, but now declining reputation.

I will end this on an optimistic note. I think that STS has built a solid foundation so far, and I hope that these suggestions are considered and many implemented for a enjoyable game in the future.

Exactly spoken very well :)

A very good read. One of the best written recent posts I've seen. Sweet

LOve it. :) Well said.

Wow!! I want to commend you on a well thought out and wonderfully laid out post with excellent points.

I agree with all your observations. In my opinion, your recommendations seem just about perfect. Personally, I can't think of anything more that could improve it... I look forward to reading more.

Okay ... I think that is everything I intended to write on this matter. It remains to be seen how the community receives it.

Edit:

This has now been entered into my blog.

WhoisThis, thank you very much for a thread that I have never had the courage to post. I am looking at the benefits between playing a PC MMO vs a Mobile MMO like SL and PL. The reason why I continue to endorse STS instead of jumping onto WoW and other MMOs is that I still have faith that they can turn it around. Any reprieve on this would be incredibly welcome, as players are not used to spending this much money on games, especially MMOs.

I don't really have much to add to this, because your thread pretty much KILLED it and addressed every issue that needed to be addressed. Thank you for yet another insightful, well thought out post.

If I have anything to add as I ponder on this thread, I will surely post again on this thread.

Once again,

Thank you for having the courage to be able to address the faults that many of us have not had the time nor courage to address.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Apollo

WhoisThis, thank you very much for a thread that I have never had the courage to post. I am looking at the benefits between playing a PC MMO vs a Mobile MMO like SL and PL. The reason why I continue to endorse STS instead of jumping onto WoW and other MMOs is that I still have faith that they can turn it around. Any reprieve on this would be incredibly welcome, as players are not used to spending this much money on games, especially MMOs.

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Right now, I haven't seen any PC MMOs that have anything to offer that PL or SL doesn't.

Thoughts:

1. Most PC games tend to have more elaborate game mechanics. This can be a good and bad thing. Good thing in that it encourages variety. Bad in that certain combos require very hardcore playing and can cause more balance problems.

2. There are 2 distinct models for PC: F2P (which really aren't "Free"; typically you have to pay for stuff - not unlike PL, but I'd be careful; there are some questionable ones online) and P2P (typically a monthly fee like WoW)

3. Classes tend to be much more varied - again hinting at the problem in 1, although it can be an advantage too

4. So far, STS has been among the best dev teams in terms of responsiveness that I have seen among MMOs; surprisingly important for many reasons (bugs, balance, experience)

5. Most MMOs seem to suffer from the problems I hinted. Bad PUGs, unfriendly PvP experience, etc. FPS games are like that as well. Interestingly enough, the most welcoming games I have seen are generally indie multiplayer games.

I'd say for now, STS has one of the best MMOs around ... barring a further decline, it's well worth staying.

Has anyone sent this link to a dev? We should. Whoisthis, not that it means anything but, my respect for you just went up. ALOT. You did an excellant job of getting to the core problems and issues that have risen. Very nice.

@whoisthis I have alpha and beta tested several Mmorpg games biggest bein ffxl, Kudos to u, this is by far one of thee best posts in any mmo forum I have ever read. One hella of a job..

Indeed your most important, and IMO best, post yet. Fully agree on all points.

I also commend you for seeing the bigger and long-term picture; arguably more important than the short-term, IMO.

If I could just add as well, I miss the addition of more systems and features. More than just a new campaign bringing new maps, gear, monsters, levels, etc, I also miss the introduction of stuff like the CS, crafting, guilds (though this was new, it was almost "expected"). You get my point :)

Again, kudos Elf. Very well said and an awesome read.

Wow, I have to say, that was one hell of a good read. Very thorough and great points. I do hope a dev sees this post :)
Props to you WhoIsThis!

Great work bud.. DEVS should read it..

Excellent points, i pretty much agree on every single thing recalled on this thread. Really hope devs see this AND take the action needed...

Great post! Extremely well thought out and written on a sensitive topic that could have easily become an emotional rant!

One item for consideration is creating new end game gear quests similar to the Mystery & Cyber quests in AO to your new content or boredom section. I see this as a positive as:

1) it addresses the rich/poor gap, in that a casual player can earn quality gear (especially now that the experience curve has been reduced leading to less time to earn gold as a player climbs the ladder to end game)
2) it gives collectors something to grind for
3) it gives STS the opportunity to sell a player an elixir, vanity, etc... as the player may log in more often in order to complete the quest and obtain his/her next piece of gear.

Or instead of creating a whole new set of gear, perhaps the ability to complete a series of quests which would allow you to "craft" or "upgrade" an old set. (One of the coolest things I saw in Fang was a 4x elixir user in Shadow gear. Made me really miss those old looks!)

Thanks again for such a righteous post and for taking time to consider my recommendation.

I think you expressed what many of us feel, and provided valuable points on how to make it better.

I sure hope STS is taking notes from your post.

Great post!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kelstrick:506760

Great post! Extremely well thought out and written on a sensitive topic that could have easily become an emotional rant!

One item for consideration is creating new end game gear quests similar to the Mystery & Cyber quests in AO to your new content or boredom section. I see this as a positive as:

1) it addresses the rich/poor gap, in that a casual player can earn quality gear (especially now that the experience curve has been reduced leading to less time to earn gold as a player climbs the ladder to end game)
2) it gives collectors something to grind for
3) it gives STS the opportunity to sell a player an elixir, vanity, etc... as the player may log in more often in order to complete the quest and obtain his/her next piece of gear.

Or instead of creating a whole new set of gear, perhaps the ability to complete a series of quests which would allow you to "craft" or "upgrade" an old set. (One of the coolest things I saw in Fang was a 4x elixir user in Shadow gear. Made me really miss those old looks!)

Thanks again for such a righteous post and for taking time to consider my recommendation.

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It's certainly a possible idea. I do remember full cyber in the days of alien oasis 3. Achieving the full set then was a priority for me when i got my 50. It was considered a major achievement in the day.

A cyber equal... For people with time, but not cash.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by WhoIsThis

...Others have spent $500 - $1,000 USD on the game.

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Good lord!!!

This is a great example of how to provide feedback without drama. I bet G has read it 2 or 3 times already.

I don't agree on all points, but it is true that I don't like PvP so I see the game from a different point of view. The few times I went to PvP the other players were ... well ... darn I wish I could swear here ... let's just say they were rude. I don't know why anyone would actually seek such an experience. I play games for fun. So, in my opinion, this game started going downhill with the introduction of PvP. Since then, little by little, I have had to learn to accept that change happens here and we either find a way to have fun our own way, or go on to a different game. That's kind of an odd perspective for someone who has had as many suggestions accepted as I have, but I have also seen suggestions implemented then a half year later some other devs circumvents the change. (For instance, the anti-power-levelling movement finally succeeded but eventually they brought it back for plat.) And... I am 55 years old, and if I hadn't learned to accept change by now I would be in a constant struggle with reality.

I think the relaxed XP requirements help to offset some of the difficulty factors for people who don't use plat elixirs. In AO2 we could get 2x xp elixirs for 1500 and the mobs plus drop liquidation would come out to about 1500 gp, so there was a grind. And that was OK because, even though it was boring and repetitive, you could actually calculate how long it would take and dedicate the necessary time. But as things went on, the grind took over. That put them in a position to need to present alternatives to grinding.

The devs all came here from developing different games, but that just meant that they knew how to WRITE games, not how to MAINTAIN and EXPAND games. This they have had to learn by the school of hard knocks. And they have learned a lot! Just look at how much more balanced SL was from the start. But in PL they are in a phase where they need to create balance at higher levels. They need to make the high levels so that they are not just about grinding and rewarding the most hardcore grinders. They are not done. The problem isn't solved. They have reduced the huge xp needed, and made some level-anywhere elixirs. They are going to watch and play and learn and we will no doubt see other changes that try to address this.

Just one other thing, then I will re-read and maybe post again. Royce was highly disappointed when they didn't create new skills. They just bumped the max level to 6. He said before they did it, in chat, that if that was their solution, that would end it for him. He and others wrote detailed suggestions for new skills. He might have even stayed if they allowed us to add cross-skills from other classes after a certain level. But just increasing the max to 6 was disheartening to him. But you know, he just went on to another game where the devs were practically non-existent. So how could he have been happy there? I'll never get it. But that's his choice. Anyway, yeah, we miss him.