i changed my mind, plz don't take out elites in season 5

we all know the problems with running elites: hard to find good random groups, if someone rage quits no one else can join, etc... My idea to improve the game was to do away with the timers and implement PL's game joining system. For reasons i won't go into the devs don't like that idea. Their alternative was to do away with elites and place a random elite boss in the current maps we have. At first I loved that idea and expressed my support. I have since changed my mind.

The idea of not having elites and having random elite bosses is a good one. I just hate the way it's been put into practice. Since the spawn rate of bael has been nerfed I've yet to find him. For a week i played about an hour a day looking for him without success. I've since run every now and then but i think it's mind numbingly boring to rush to the same spot on the same maps run after run after run after run...I understand his spawn rate is low because his drop rate is all pinks. Why not increase his spawn rate but decrease the drop rate of pinks? When I run elites I know I at least have a CHANCE to get a drop every 10-15 minutes. I feel like that is more fun than the way it's working now.

I've learned if u wait in oltgar keep people will eventually join. If u can find a good tank then friend him. Any rogue and mage will do but a good tank is essential so spam friend requests to any good ones u run with. Then u can join them when they're on. It's not the greatest system but it's better than playing for days at a time and never seeing a super rare boss.

I'm like pavlov's salivating dog. U ring a bell and bring me food, pretty soon my mouth is going to start watering when i hear a bell. After that if u start ringing the bell but only bring me food once every four times my mouth will still water. If u go 100 rings without bringing me food I'm going to stop paying attention to it and go in the corner and lick my own butt.

Check this out man:
http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...=1#post1202854

Also, the worst part about the "new system" is that running the normal maps is pretty boring. Its a face roll until you find the boss. If you want to do the new method of boss spawn, the normal maps need to be made a little harder.

Take for example Pocket Legends. Before BSM, the maps were suffieciently difficult. They were harder than the normal mode of AL, but less difficult than elite.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aedenos

Check this out man:
http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...=1#post1202854

---

wow, that was fast. Thanks devs for the quick response! i didn't know I was so influential!

It seems like they will keep elites. I hope they improve elites because I completely agree with everything you have said. Also I hope they also include the random elite boss as well for next season. To give people different options for farming. However I'd like to see these bosses have different drops then elite maps. Because between the arena, bael and krunch; elite golden warchests & noble gear have lost a lot of value.

That was posted on the 31st of July - and Thanks for reiterating this wvhills - Elite Maps are really not difficult with the right players.

It's all about training - gear is irrelevant it just makes the runs faster - I used to run elites with bonechill armor and mountain teeth of tactics :). We have people in our guild who are brand new to the game (weeks old), lv 30, with trash pink gear, bad builds (waiting for free respec weekend) and they still hold their own when strategy is used to complete the maps and people don't fall apart. As long as there are two strong members in a group - our parties roll into elite without any trouble.

The most important class to Elites for newer players is tanks - if the tank is decent - then the party will survive and the run - albeit maybe slow - will complete (barring disconnects)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by falmear

It seems like they will keep elites. I hope they improve elites because I completely agree with everything you have said. Also I hope they also include the random elite boss as well for next season. To give people different options for farming. However I'd like to see these bosses have different drops then elite maps. Because between the arena, bael and krunch; elite golden warchests & noble gear have lost a lot of value.

---

I think they should just drop whatever the elite bosses for those maps drops. Of course, this would mean only kraken, nordr, and the new maps will hve them.

Each normal map should just have a random spawn of the elite boss for that map and only drop the elite drops that are available on that map.

Elites sux completly for now! They need to move their... minds and start to improving 'drop chance' at elites, it is boring to die for nothing...

Also it will be great idea to delete elites and make normal maps a bit harder.

I like the idea of dropping elites in favor or only having the regular maps, but I don't like how they are doing this thing with having elite bosses randomly spawn.

I don't dislike the idea completely, but that in itself is not enough to keep things interesting. Here's how I think it should be.....

Instead of having Elite Bael spawn in a Nordr dungeon, he should only spawn in Rook Nest where he is supposed to spawn. Here's what should happen.... A certain percentage of the time (maybe 10% would be good), instead of regular Bael spawning, Elite Bael will spawn. He will spawn in the same exact location as regular Bael does. And he will have the same drop rate and difficulty that Elite Bael currenty does in Elite Rook's Nest. I wouldn't even mind his minions (or mobs in the case of Elite Bloodhammer in Skull Cove) were also Elite in difficulty in these situations.

I think what makes elite dungeons annoying to most players is the difficult of the mobs. It takes so long to get to the boss, that by the time you get there, sometimes players get disconnected, or they just leave because it's taking too long. The solution is no longer to have elite mobs, and only the boss and his surrounding minions/mobs would be elite. But only make the Elite boss spawn 10% of the time. Maybe 10% is too much and needs to be 5%. I don't know. But adjust the rate so that the elite drops stay sufficiently rare while at the same time, encouraging players to still run the maps over and over. Implement this for all of the maps in every campaign.

What I like about this idea is that once you are at the boss, even if it's the regular non-elite boss, your group might as well fight him as there are still halfway decent drops to be had. What makes the current runs to Bael 2 and Krunch 2 so boring is that you never fight the boss. Everyone just runs through the mobs, sees Bael/Krunch isn't there, and starts over.

And if they want to have that occasional Elite boss like Bael 2 or Krunch 2 spawn very rarely in a certain location on another map and give 100% good drops, then let that be a bonus item that shows up on occasion, but not the main reason for running the map.

Anyone agree with this idea? If there is decent support for this, I'll make a separate thread for developers to see.

I think the difficulty of the mobs is what makes it fun. What makes it suck is getting one shot outside the red zone. And yes, the timer problem. Remove the timer or at least give us an option to disable it so people can still join.

Other than that, I think its good. Could be great, but sts isn't going to upgrade to the pl join system.

Sent from my ADR6400L using Tapatalk 2

My responses are already in here: http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...=1#post1202854

I don't see why we need another thread on this topic. Keep it consolidated for simplicity.

If we want to discuss the detailed pros and cons of these new elite bosses, then by all means start a new thread. To my knowledge, no Devs have stated on these forums that the new bosses are a definite prototype replacement for elite maps - so let's not jump to that conclusion. It would be more productive to speculate that the introduction of the random elite bosses are just an additional feature to make normal maps fun and interesting. Keep the discussions separate for the sake of maintaining the constructiveness of Swede's original thread.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aedenos

I think they should just drop whatever the elite bosses for those maps drops. Of course, this would mean only kraken, nordr, and the new maps will hve them.

Each normal map should just have a random spawn of the elite boss for that map and only drop the elite drops that are available on that map.

---

I would rather just have elites and have the best stuff drop there. But I am okay with having elite random bosses in normal maps so long as they keep elites. My concern is when they have the normal maps drop the same elite equipment/chests, it lowers prices for those equipment/chests. And they have to adjust drop rate across the board because you can't have more elite bosses spawning dropping the same stuff without lowering drop rate even more in elite maps. So drop rates suck in elite and the random elite spawning boss never shows up. If they have different drops then I feel like they can more easily adjust the drop rates. And gives a chance for people who don't play elites to make a good score, like Wrath of Bael.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Energizeric

Instead of having Elite Bael spawn in a Nordr dungeon, he should only spawn in Rook Nest where he is supposed to spawn. Here's what should happen.... A certain percentage of the time (maybe 10% would be good), instead of regular Bael spawning, Elite Bael will spawn. He will spawn in the same exact location as regular Bael does. And he will have the same drop rate and difficulty that Elite Bael currenty does in Elite Rook's Nest. I wouldn't even mind his minions (or mobs in the case of Elite Bloodhammer in Skull Cove) were also Elite in difficulty in these situations.

---

This is probably the worst idea so far because Rooks Nest doesn't even scale so to go from one end to another is just run and fire. Already I can run fast in any Nordr or Kraken map mowing stuff down and not even being slowed down by the mobs there. Then I get to the spawn point, if the boss is not there so I leave fast. Anything that isn't scaled is even easier and requires no skill. At least in Nordr or Kraken there is a slim chance I may die. Maps which aren't scale it means there is a zero chance. This is extremely boring and repetitive and doesnt count toward XP or PVE Kills. So now you say well scale these maps, then some other people are going to be upset. People were already complaining that Kraken was made harder after Bael. (Dont know if that is really true) So I am not in agreement with you at all. And means way more work for STS because for every future expansion they have to scale the old maps and play test them to make sure they aren't too hard or easy. They scaled Hauntlet and everyone cried over it. So I don't think your idea is sufficiently thought out. Keep elite just fix the problems with it. They are well known and it would make a lot of people happy. And I don't think it requires so much changes as what else has been proposed.

The only problem ive had with elites is the.time to complete some of them

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by falmear

This is probably the worst idea so far because Rooks Nest doesn't even scale so to go from one end to another is just run and fire. Already I can run fast in any Nordr or Kraken map mowing stuff down and not even being slowed down by the mobs there. Then I get to the spawn point, if the boss is not there so I leave fast. Anything that isn't scaled is even easier and requires no skill. At least in Nordr or Kraken there is a slim chance I may die. Maps which aren't scale it means there is a zero chance. This is extremely boring and repetitive and doesnt count toward XP or PVE Kills. So now you say well scale these maps, then some other people are going to be upset. People were already complaining that Kraken was made harder after Bael. (Dont know if that is really true) So I am not in agreement with you at all. And means way more work for STS because for every future expansion they have to scale the old maps and play test them to make sure they aren't too hard or easy. They scaled Hauntlet and everyone cried over it. So I don't think your idea is sufficiently thought out. Keep elite just fix the problems with it. They are well known and it would make a lot of people happy. And I don't think it requires so much changes as what else has been proposed.

---

I wasn't suggesting this specifically for the Rooks Nest and Bael. I meant this should be done for every single elite boss in every single dungeon.

Did you ever play PL? Players at level 76 still farm the sand caves which are level 25 dungeons. Yes, you run through it quick, kill the boss, then repeat. And you still have a chance to drop items which are worth 100k+ like an Earthquake Hammer. Even the boss is an easy walk there as there are no "elite" bosses in PL.

I'm suggesting that on every map, every once in a while the elite boss spawns instead of the regular one. And he drops the elite chests/gear/eggs just as he currently does on the elite maps. But without the elite mobs.

I am NOT suggesting that anything be scaled, ever. Let STS add new dungeons each expansion. They do not need to change the old ones. So yes, as you become more powerful, the old dungeons become easier. That's the way it should be, and is the way it is in most MMOs.

How about having the elite items from each campaign NOT be discontinued. How come when I was level 16 I was able to farm for elite level 16 legendary items, but a player who starts playing today cannot do that, he must level all the way up to 30 to do that? I disagree with this entire idea. I think it should be the same now for a player at level 16 as it was for me when I was level 16 many months ago. There is no need to change a campaign after it is released. Just release new ones and concentrate on that.

Just to show how popular of an idea that would be with the masses who play this game, I see tons and tons of players farming non-elite Jarl on a regular bases just trying to get crates. If there was always a chance that Elite Jarl would pop up there and drop elite chests, even more folks would be farming there, and also just about every other dungeon would become populated. This would give a whole new life to farming in AL. Because right now it is dying.

No more elite = less potions. :D
Elite map is fun. I just love it, even my potions always get depressed. -.-

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wvhills

....If u go 100 rings without bringing me food I'm going to stop paying attention to it and go in the corner and lick my own butt.

---

Heckuva lot better than licking MY butt, I'll tell ya that!! :smiley_simmons:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Energizeric

Did you ever play PL? Players at level 76 still farm the sand caves which are level 25 dungeons. Yes, you run through it quick, kill the boss, then repeat. And you still have a chance to drop items which are worth 100k+ like an Earthquake Hammer. Even the boss is an easy walk there as there are no "elite" bosses in PL.

---

If you like the PL system so much I suggest you play there. I don't find this fun at all because I like playing with others. And this kind of play doesn't lend itself to playing with others. Because it takes time for everyone to join and its faster if I just run these maps solo. In fact the mobs are much easier if you do it solo. If you look at a good example of what people want is maps like Elite Rooks Nest, Elite Mages mine, Elite Southern Seas etc. These are maps that aren't too hard but hard enough to keep it interesting and short enough to be played fairly quickly. And they have some nice drops.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Energizeric

I'm suggesting that on every map, every once in a while the elite boss spawns instead of the regular one. And he drops the elite chests/gear/eggs just as he currently does on the elite maps. But without the elite mobs.

---

I am fine with this so long as they keep elite maps. I see that both can fit into AL. I would just like to keep elite where you should have a better shot at more valuable drops. Otherwise I don't see much point in the party system because its not needed without elite, once you have obtained a certain level of equipment.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Energizeric

I'm suggesting that on every map, every once in a while the elite boss spawns instead of the regular one. And he drops the elite chests/gear/eggs just as he currently does on the elite maps. But without the elite mobs.

Just to show how popular of an idea that would be with the masses who play this game, I see tons and tons of players farming non-elite Jarl on a regular bases just trying to get crates. If there was always a chance that Elite Jarl would pop up there and drop elite chests, even more folks would be farming there, and also just about every other dungeon would become populated. This would give a whole new life to farming in AL. Because right now it is dying.

---

Pros:
1. New players learn to use strategy earlier on in the game
2. New players have a chance at better drops as they level up
3. Anti-elite map players now have an alternative way to farm elite gear rather than going to elite maps
4. Adds another incentive to run older maps for eggs/crates/chests

Cons:
1. This might add to the overall workload Swede was stressing in the elite maps thread - do we really want to overburden them with this?
2. This alternative method of farming elite gear may amplify the current problem of no one running certain elite maps. Why run elite Rook's Nest when I can run the normal version 50 times and possibly get elite Bael to spawn for my Malison egg? But more specifically to my point - why run elite Dead City Outskirts when I can just run the normal version (which is 10x easier).
3. This makes the elite archenemies achievements less admirable by some degree
4. There is not a lot of motivation for a level-capped player to farm any maps with grey-con mobs: no PvE kills credit, no XP for the player, no XP for the pet (if it's grey-con to them as well). We can run Kraken/Nordr maps for the same chance at elite Bael/Krunch

I can't say I dislike the idea entirely. But for the sake of STS improving the game, I feel that more focus should be on fixing the elite maps (take away timed mode, add more random drops, etc.) rather than implementing a whole new aspect that practically redesigns the content of the game. Let's keep the workload at a minimum for the Devs if we can. I think Energizeric's idea about the elite maps having twink gear (in the other thread) is a better proposition than this one. The normal maps seem fine the way they are, especially with the random Elite bosses now being added.