Korgar Goretusk - Reflect Cue

Ok, so first bit of feedback about the new expansion is that Goretusk is brutal. He's like Elite BloodHammer, Sorrax, and Alpha Wolf's bastard step child, LOL.

Not only does he have pretty quick wind ups that stun for about 3-5 secs, but he also has a reflect shield like our good ol' pal Alpha Wolf from the Nordr expansion. The reflect on Goretusk, however, is much harder to predict - with Alpha Wolf we had both the visual and audio cue of him stopping to howl in order to know when to steer clear of his reflect shield.

Goretusk on the other hand is a lot harder to predict. As a visual cue we get the animations for Razor Shield spinning around him, which is the red flag that his reflect shield is up and not to touch him, but there isn't an audio cue like Alpha Wolf's howl. At best, you might be able to see him do the classic warrior shout animations before the Razor Shield goes up, but that's only if you're not running for your life as he chases you across the boss room. And that's while you're also taking attacks from the band of merry Orcs (which are never ending and come at faster intervals) as his HP gets lower.

I can already see that it's designed to gouge you for ankhs at every 15-20 seconds if you're not careful. So I'd like to suggest that you guys give us a better set of cues for when that reflect shield is gonna go up. Because tbh, that particular skill is already a nightmare in normal maps I don't even want to think about what kind of horror that will be in elites.

i rather like it, the reflect is one part where warriors with higher health and lower damage are useful...its pretty simple, keep the warrior with the boss, let the rogues nd mages be at a distance shooting the boss and his minions as needed.
First 1-2 hits on purple shield can be survived by warrior and uses a consequent horn, saving himself and any rogue with an errant shot on the boss.
A reflect with too many cues is useless, too easy to avoid which renders it pointless

IMO the fact that the reflection shield isn't predictable is good because it will make warriors useful.

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Well as a mage with DOT skills, reflect is the bane of my squishy existence. So while it makes a warrior more useful it makes me farmable...

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Originally Posted by Sorcerie

Well as a mage with DOT skills, reflect is the bane of my squishy existence. So while it makes a warrior more useful it makes me farmable...

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Lmao,didn't think about that i'm a warrior XD

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Originally Posted by Dimitrian

Lmao,didn't think about that i'm a warrior XD

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Problem for mages is we can't use charged Fireball, Ice, or Clock on Goretusk without the possibility that any one of those attacks will get you killed so fast you won't know what hit you. So that leaves lightning, which will also reflect horrible damage if you manage a crit on the boss, and Gale, which might keep you alive a fraction of a second longer if you have the armor upgrade (but Gale still sucks, period).

So yea, maybe something for us mages to keep track of as cue would be nice.

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Originally Posted by Sorcerie

Well as a mage with DOT skills, reflect is the bane of my squishy existence. So while it makes a warrior more useful it makes me farmable...

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Yep. I still get the chills when I hear alpha wolfs name. Using all attack skills made him a nightmare. Killed myself so many times because his shield went up while my skills were mid way to him.

Use kelvin pt and this boss turns into a stunned Pussycat.

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Originally Posted by beezulbulb

Use kelvin pt and this boss turns into a stunned Pussycat.

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Lol, the good ol' Kelvin tactic.

That will work for about 50 - 75% of his health and then he starts summoning Orcs every few seconds, which will confuse Kelvin. Not to mention Kelvin lowers your stats dramatically which will make killing the Orcs slower, which allows him more time to summon more if you don't kill them fast enough, which can mean you'll be stuck killing Orcs because you can't target the boss properly. All this while he's chasing you with wind ups and reflecting damage.

A good tactic, but remember this is a normal map we're being introduced to. Elite Goretusk won't be nearly as forgiving.

thanks for the feedback on the fight guys!

For now I think the lack of tell will remain, as it can be timed out if you pay attention. The damage output of his reflect will likely be reduced however. On a related note, any DoTs on Korgar BEFORE he uses his reflect will be wiped away. You will only suffer damage on DoTs that are applied after his reflect goes up. Spamming DoT spells will be a dangerous move.

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Originally Posted by Carapace

thanks for the feedback on the fight guys!

For now I think the lack of tell will remain, as it can be timed out if you pay attention. The damage output of his reflect will likely be reduced however. On a related note, any DoTs on Korgar BEFORE he uses his reflect will be wiped away. You will only suffer damage on DoTs that are applied after his reflect goes up. Spamming DoT spells will be a dangerous move.

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You mean people will actually have to pay attention, instead of spamming mindlessly? The horror!!! :P

You watch Game of Thrones? ^_^

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Originally Posted by Carapace

thanks for the feedback on the fight guys!

For now I think the lack of tell will remain, as it can be timed out if you pay attention. The damage output of his reflect will likely be reduced however. On a related note, any DoTs on Korgar BEFORE he uses his reflect will be wiped away. You will only suffer damage on DoTs that are applied after his reflect goes up. Spamming DoT spells will be a dangerous move.

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I died at least 3 to 4 times with dot effect which is used before korgar used his reflect. Even died with critical shot of lightning in one shot with a hp of 4500 (ancient pendant) . Imagine a normal group of mages around 3300 to 3800hp. Also rogues with crit aim shot will die in one shot if even paying attention. Please look into this.

Atleast a small difference in korgar voice would help.

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Originally Posted by Bluesparky

I died at least 3 to 4 times with dot effect which is used before korgar used his reflect. Even died with critical shot of lightning in one shot with a hp of 4500 (ancient pendant) . Imagine a normal group of mages around 3300 to 3800hp. Also rogues with crit aim shot will die in one shot if even paying attention. Please look into this.

Atleast a small difference in korgar voice would help.

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Lol, with my full planarz and imbueds my 5.2k crit blasted me all the way from 100% to 0% -.-

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Originally Posted by Wazakesy

Lol, with my full planarz and imbueds my 5.2k crit blasted me all the way from 100% to 0% -.-

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xd. i know ur feeling lol. I felt the same :encouragement: haha

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Originally Posted by Bluesparky

xd. i know ur feeling lol. I felt the same :encouragement: haha

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my expedition rogue with full normal gemmed mythic set with planar amulet and with singe usually scores 3k crits, now when i got a 5k crit, i never knew i had such dangerous moves, truly what serancha said, THE HORROR!!!!

Well , R.I.P. Mages. (you will get rekt by your own skill) muhahahha

I'm a mage too. So.. Meh :/ *face palms*

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Originally Posted by Sheentaro

Well , R.I.P. Mages. (you will get rekt by your own skill) muhahahha

I'm a mage too. So.. Meh :/ *face palms*

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yeah, us mages haz been squashed again as usual :/

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Originally Posted by Carapace

thanks for the feedback on the fight guys!

For now I think the lack of tell will remain, as it can be timed out if you pay attention. The damage output of his reflect will likely be reduced however. On a related note, any DoTs on Korgar BEFORE he uses his reflect will be wiped away. You will only suffer damage on DoTs that are applied after his reflect goes up. Spamming DoT spells will be a dangerous move.

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Agreed with removing running dots before the reflect starts but you should keep the reflect damage up to make warriors more useful. And also, it's no fun if you're allowed to mess up without heavy repercussions on the last boss's special move.

At least the Elite version should stay as is.

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Originally Posted by Serillia

You watch Game of Thrones? ^_^

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Not since season 2. Why? I'm older than that show - any line I use that they did was mine first.

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Originally Posted by Madnex

Agreed with removing running dots before the reflect starts but you should keep the reflect damage up to make warriors more useful. And also, it's no fun if you're allowed to mess up without heavy repercussions on the last boss's special move.

At least the Elite version should stay as is.

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It would be nice, if this were actually a viable strategy to balancing things in pve. In some games it probably is. Unfortunately, AL is not one of them. One-hitting, especially when out of nowhere, is not the way to solve the current situation in pve. And will not make warriors more useful. While I like running with warriors (yes, even Arena) and I routinely do that, many others don't. Because no warrior can save you from a no-warning dog one-hit or a Stahl critical. The only thing warriors do, at least in the eyes of the majority here, is make runs slower.

We already have enough mobs and bosses who can one-hit dps classes, this solved nothing. Adding more won't either.

The solution lies in revamping the current skill system. Especially the warriors skills. Especially the way taunts work.

p.s. I actually find warriors much more useful against big bunches of mobs, who CAN'T one-hit me, but can overwhelm me with sheer numbers. For example against certain pulls in Shuyal or some of the bigger pulls in Tombs. I'd rather have a tank against 20 skeletons and vines than against 2 dogs, a giant and a mage.

Having a warrior means it takes longer to kill, meaning you have to survive more instances of reflect. Unless the warrior has superb timing with HoR, and the instances are timed to the cooldown like Alpha Wolf, I don't see this being a viable way to include fatties. But then, not being on the test server I can only speculate.

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Originally Posted by Tatman

It would be nice, if this were actually a viable strategy to balancing things in pve. In some games it probably is. Unfortunately, AL is not one of them. One-hitting, especially when out of nowhere, is not the way to solve the current situation in pve. And will not make warriors more useful. While I like running with warriors (yes, even Arena) and I routinely do that, many others don't. Because no warrior can save you from a no-warning dog one-hit or a Stahl critical. The only thing warriors do, at least in the eyes of the majority here, is make runs slower.

We already have enough mobs and bosses who can one-hit dps classes, this solved nothing. Adding more won't either.

The solution lies in revamping the current skill system. Especially the warriors skills. Especially the way taunts work.

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You need to run with experienced warriors if that's your opinion; a good warrior knows how to pull and prioritize feebling the most dangerous mobs. As an example, I was running with ungemmed myth set, maul and blood ruby and with two okay-experienced rogues (mari/sam as pets) we were doing 7-8 minutes in T3 without deaths. With a mage, maybe it could be done a minute or a minute and a half faster but nowhere near as safe, especially at boss. Experienced mages with decent gear are even harder to find than experienced warrs with ok gear because gear matters less for the second group.

I'd like major changes in skills too but all we're going to get is maybe small fixes not a revamp (dev said so).

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Originally Posted by Serancha

Having a warrior means it takes longer to kill, meaning you have to survive more instances of reflect. Unless the warrior has superb timing with HoR, and the instances are timed to the cooldown like Alpha Wolf, I don't see this being a viable way to include fatties. But then, not being on the test server I can only speculate.

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Well, of course this isn't going to help a newb warrior. But the razor-shield reflect move has a 25 second cooldown which means you can almost fit two HoR's in there.

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Originally Posted by Madnex

You need to run with experienced warriors if that's your opinion; a good warrior knows how to pull and prioritize feebling the most dangerous mobs. As an example, I was running with ungemmed myth set, maul and blood ruby and with two okay-experienced rogues (mari/sam as pets) we were doing 7-8 minutes in T3 without deaths. With a mage, maybe it could be done a minute or a minute and a half faster but nowhere near as safe, especially at boss. Experienced mages with decent gear are even harder to find than experienced warrs with ok gear because gear matters less for the second group.

I'd like major changes in skills too but all we're going to get is maybe small fixes not a revamp (dev said so).

Well, of course this isn't going to help a newb warrior. But the razor-shield reflect move has a 25 second cooldown which means you can almost fit two HoR's in there.

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You intentionally don't use your arcane ring on your tank? Anyhow I'd love to partake of one of those very fast runs with a tank in the pt. Last time I did one of those was with Skippleggday before he quit. In fact He, Calicus, an officer of enigmatic (a rogue , but not Tatman) and I did two warriors run in t3 in less than 8 minutes, which was my personal record for quite some time :-)

I do agree that finding good mages is really hard, but I find finding good tanks equally hard.

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Originally Posted by Madnex

You need to run with experienced warriors if that's your opinion; a good warrior knows how to pull and prioritize feebling the most dangerous mobs. As an example, I was running with ungemmed myth set, maul and blood ruby and with two okay-experienced rogues (mari/sam as pets) we were doing 7-8 minutes in T3 without deaths. With a mage, maybe it could be done a minute or a minute and a half faster but nowhere near as safe, especially at boss. Experienced mages with decent gear are even harder to find than experienced warrs with ok gear because gear matters less for the second group.

I'd like major changes in skills too but all we're going to get is maybe small fixes not a revamp (dev said so).

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This is not my opinion, this is the general opinion among players in this game. I've stated probably 100 hundred already that I like running with warriors. In fact, just like my friend Jazzi a few posts above, my best T3 time used to be with a tank in pt, and it stood as my personal record for a long time.

And I am sorry, but no matter how good/experienced/whatever a tank is, he can't prevent a dps being one-hit by certain mobs, if said mobs choose to do so (which they like to do). It's just how this game is.