Elite Boss Drop

[falmear]

My suggestion is buy a luck amulet with gold. If you can do some free offers for plat. And farm km3 as much as you can. You need to adjust to the game and right now 3-4 crates is worth one elite golden warchest. With a luck elixir + amulet you can do that in 30 mins depending on how fast your team can farm. With a luck amulet alone it will take you longer. Probably like 1-2 crates in 30 mins.

Also in response to Energizeric saying I am 100% wrong about elite golden warchests. All I have to say is look what happened to noble gear. Its the same thing that happened to elite golden warchests. I know what the prices for these chests were before arena was introduced and what they were before Bael was introduced. STS added more supply and with the same amount of demand the prices dropped. And they made it available to people who otherwise would have never been able to get these chests. I guess so long as Energizeric can throw around examples of supply and demand its 100% correct. But if someone else brings it up, they are 100% wrong. From now on I'll call this Energizeric economics. So long as Energizeric says it, it must be true.

[Taejo]

My suggestion is buy a luck amulet with gold. If you can do some free offers for plat. And farm km3 as much as you can. You need to adjust to the game and right now 3-4 crates is worth one elite golden warchest. With a luck elixir + amulet you can do that in 30 mins depending on how fast your team can farm. With a luck amulet alone it will take you longer. Probably like 1-2 crates in 30 mins.

Also in response to Energizeric saying I am 100% wrong about elite golden warchests. All I have to say is look what happened to noble gear. Its the same thing that happened to elite golden warchests. I know what the prices for these chests were before arena was introduced and what they were before Bael was introduced. STS added more supply and with the same amount of demand the prices dropped. And they made it available to people who otherwise would have never been able to get these chests. I guess so long as Energizeric can throw around examples of supply and demand its 100% correct. But if someone else brings it up, they are 100% wrong. From now on I'll call this Energizeric economics. So long as Energizeric says it, it must be true.

I don't think EGW prices are all that bad. Sure, they're 50% of the value they used to be before Arena came out; but they are still a great source of income. People still come along and mass-purchase them from CS all the time. I still farm EGWs in the Arena and the occasional Noble drop (if its a good one) is an added bonus. I agree that crates are more steady way to make gold, however. I personally need a break from crate farming every now and then just to mix things up and keep my interest sparked.

[xcainnblecterx]

My suggestion is buy a luck amulet with gold. If you can do some free offers for plat. And farm km3 as much as you can. You need to adjust to the game and right now 3-4 crates is worth one elite golden warchest. With a luck elixir + amulet you can do that in 30 mins depending on how fast your team can farm. With a luck amulet alone it will take you longer. Probably like 1-2 crates in 30 mins.

Also in response to Energizeric saying I am 100% wrong about elite golden warchests. All I have to say is look what happened to noble gear. Its the same thing that happened to elite golden warchests. I know what the prices for these chests were before arena was introduced and what they were before Bael was introduced. STS added more supply and with the same amount of demand the prices dropped. And they made it available to people who otherwise would have never been able to get these chests. I guess so long as Energizeric can throw around examples of supply and demand its 100% correct. But if someone else brings it up, they are 100% wrong. From now on I'll call this Energizeric economics. So long as Energizeric says it, it must be true.

I honestly dont see anything with energizes posts. He has been around enough sts games to know the economics behind them and this may be why you and the op are having such problems because your both to hard headed to understand. If you hate greens dropping from elites so much then dont do them and merch or hunt bael/krunch. I agree on the part it is.frustrating to run for 15-20mins for a crap drop but its what keeps the value of elite pinks in the.economy. If all there was is pink and purples then one.reroll means a pink=high price drop. A good example of this is in pl when they added purples to a map that previously didnt habe them. Sets were going for a 3mil+ then boom now there 700-800k

[Energizeric]

BTW, you are correct about the Noble armors dropping in value because of Arena. Yes, it was pretty dumb for them to have the same item drop from all the bosses there. But that's what they decided to do, so Noble armors are very cheap now.

As for Elite Golden Warchests, I disagree that Arena had anything to do with their declining value. Elite Golden Warchests are worth so much more than Elite Silver Warchests and Elite Copper Warchests because they have the chance to have mythic & arcane items. They are declining in value because the mythic and arcane items are declining in value. The same exact thing happened during the Kraken expansion with Elite Golden Pirate Chests, and there wasn't any Arena during that campaign. By the time it got to a few days before Nordr was being released, Elite Golden Pirate Chests were going for around 30k. I would guess the same thing will happen with Elite Golden Warchests over the next 2 weeks, and I don't think Arena will have much to do with it.

Unlike the Noble Armors, Elite Golden Warchests do not drop that often in Arena. I spent about 2 hours farming there earlier today, and from that I ended up with 6 Noble Armors and 1 Elite Golden Warchest. We had a party of 4 players for the first hour, and 3 players for the second hour. I must have seen more than a dozen Noble Armors drop, but only 2 Elite Golden Warchests dropped, 1 to myself and 1 to another player. I used to get more Elite Golden Pirate Chests when we used to do Elite South Seas during season 3.

[Szangheili]

My suggestion is buy a luck amulet with gold. If you can do some free offers for plat. And farm km3 as much as you can. You need to adjust to the game and right now 3-4 crates is worth one elite golden warchest. With a luck elixir + amulet you can do that in 30 mins depending on how fast your team can farm. With a luck amulet alone it will take you longer. Probably like 1-2 crates in 30 mins.

Also in response to Energizeric saying I am 100% wrong about elite golden warchests. All I have to say is look what happened to noble gear. Its the same thing that happened to elite golden warchests. I know what the prices for these chests were before arena was introduced and what they were before Bael was introduced. STS added more supply and with the same amount of demand the prices dropped. And they made it available to people who otherwise would have never been able to get these chests. I guess so long as Energizeric can throw around examples of supply and demand its 100% correct. But if someone else brings it up, they are 100% wrong. From now on I'll call this Energizeric economics. So long as Energizeric says it, it must be true.

I honestly dont see anything with energizes posts. He has been around enough sts games to know the economics behind them and this may be why you and the op are having such problems because your both to hard headed to understand. If you hate greens dropping from elites so much then dont do them and merch or hunt bael/krunch. I agree on the part it is.frustrating to run for 15-20mins for a crap drop but its what keeps the value of elite pinks in the.economy. If all there was is pink and purples then one.reroll means a pink=high price drop. A good example of this is in pl when they added purples to a map that previously didnt habe them. Sets were going for a 3mil+ then boom now there 700-800k

Lol i been around just as long as he has, yeah maybe he understands the economy in depth, I also understand how it works, but to call me hard headed once again is ignorance. So do me a favor and shut up if you're going to insult ppl. I understand it'll slightly make a difference to eliminate greens from elite dungeons, but I'm sure many ppl agree that if you run these you should at least get something a little more rewarding than greens. All you guys do is throw numbers around and boom, you guys call yourselves businessmen, honestly, this wouldn't damage the system drastically. And i guess that's why i don't run elites anymore, i went bael hunting recently and found him twice in 8 runs. That is more rewarding than greens in elites.

[Energizeric]

Buddy, it would not "slightly make a difference". My guess is it will result in elite pinks dropping in value by 90%+. Supply and demand is not linear. A 5% increase in the supply of an item may result in a 50% decrease in price. Since greens are the most common drop, eliminating them from the drop table would cause at least a 200% increase in the number of pinks dropping. With luck elixirs, almost every drop will be a purple that gets upgraded to pink. The most expensive pinks and eggs will become worthless like the radiant armors and helms. They will be worth 500 gold each.

How many Malison hunts will you go on if Malison eggs sell for 500 gold each?

Imagine a price crash like what happened to Noble armors, but 10 times worse -- remember that greens still DO drop in Arena. What do you think Noble armors would be worth if they didn't?

[Alrisaia]

From my experience, most players do not care about the color of the drops but rather how much they are worth, as most players farm not to get actual items to use but to get items to sell so they can then buy the items for themselves that they want. In that respect, it doesn't really matter what color the items are, it matters what they are worth. If they eliminate greens and have purples instead, then purples basically become the greens, and pinks become the purples. So then people will say no pinks are good and they will suggest that mythics should drop from elite bosses. And the cycle repeats....

If STS listened to all of these type of requests, the end results would be that everyone would be walking around with mythic and arcane items, and no item would be worth more than 5k, and most of the player base would grow bored with the game and quit.

Correct in that Ene - from a successful Elite Farmer and an unsuccessful merchant...

I could care less what color a drop is. In fact – I would actually prefer that the items in this game didn’t have colors in the first place – people would look at stats instead, and then maybe epics would come up in value a little bit…

Nevertheless. I understand where the original poster’s frustration comes from. Most of our elite runs end in 4 of us saying in unison: “Junk”…

That being said – here’s how I believe it could be corrected. Less Items, More Gold. There are enough Gold Sinks in this game to pull it out in the MIMO economy to prevent super inflation.

With fewer items in the game – the value of those items would increase, hence making the drops from elite bosses more valuable. Then, rather than rolling a rare or epic items from a bosses’ loot table, why not roll gold like what replaced the Locked Crate rewards? Could be a ‘chest’ full of gold even.

One of the biggest issues with this game is the supply of item drops – there are SOOO MANY Items MOST of which are completely worthless.

Anyway – my 2 cents.

[xcainnblecterx]

Lol i been around just as long as he has, yeah maybe he understands the economy in depth, I also understand how it works, but to call me hard headed once again is ignorance. So do me a favor and shut up if you're going to insult ppl. I understand it'll slightly make a difference to eliminate greens from elite dungeons, but I'm sure many ppl agree that if you run these you should at least get something a little more rewarding than greens. All you guys do is throw numbers around and boom, you guys call yourselves businessmen, honestly, this wouldn't damage the system drastically. And i guess that's why i don't run elites anymore, i went bael hunting recently and found him twice in 8 runs. That is more rewarding than greens in elites.

Sorry but being called hard headed is not a insult. I was trying to have a open and civilized discussion but all you can do is respond in a negative manner(ok maybe saying hard headed isnt civilized but i was raised oddly). Obviously you dont understand how the economy works if you think only purps and pinks in elite wouldnt effect the economy severly. Like i said one reroll would automatically go to pink, lots of people farm with luck elixers therefore alot of pink would drop. See hunting bael can be more rewarding. @alrisaia: I do agree better gold drops would be nice im not good enough with the al economy to know if it would effect cs any, maybe energize could shed light. I think it might increase prices though as more people would be makin easier gold

[Gesaffelstein]

What about gold drops (5k +) instead of greens?

xoxo

[Energizeric]

That being said – here’s how I believe it could be corrected. Less Items, More Gold. There are enough Gold Sinks in this game to pull it out in the MIMO economy to prevent super inflation.

With fewer items in the game – the value of those items would increase, hence making the drops from elite bosses more valuable. Then, rather than rolling a rare or epic items from a bosses’ loot table, why not roll gold like what replaced the Locked Crate rewards? Could be a ‘chest’ full of gold even.

One of the biggest issues with this game is the supply of item drops – there are SOOO MANY Items MOST of which are completely worthless.

Anyway – my 2 cents.

Yes, people may forget, but it was my suggestion thread that got them to make this exact change to the locked crates. In that same thread, I did not only make the suggestion for locked crates, but I made it for the entire game including mobs and bosses. In my opinion there is no point to having green & white items at level 30/31 as nobody uses them.

Really there are way too many rarity colors. There should be common (purple), rare (pink), mythic (orange) and red (arcane). But yes, this would only work if 80% of the time you would get no drop at all, and just get some gold instead. I don't have a problem with that. In fact, I think bosses should drop a decent amount of gold, not the normal 20-30 gold they usually drop. The one time I found Bael 2, he dropped 900 gold.

If they made it this way, then I agree the system would work much better. But of course, then people would complain that they spent 20 minutes doing an elite dungeon and only got 900 gold and no drop. So while this system would probably make more sense in general, it is not going to satisfy the complainers who expect to win the jackpot after putting $10 into the slot machine -- unfortunately those people don't realize that if the slot machine paid out every time $10 was put in, the jackpot would only be worth about $9.

Unfortunately there is no way to beat the rules of economics here. Every change has consequences. As they say, "the path to hell is paved with good intensions." Be careful what you wish for.

[Alrisaia]

Yes, people may forget, but it was my suggestion thread that got them to make this exact change to the locked crates. In that same thread, I did not only make the suggestion for locked crates, but I made it for the entire game including mobs and bosses. In my opinion there is no point to having green & white items at level 30/31 as nobody uses them.

Really there are way too many rarity colors. There should be common (purple), rare (pink), mythic (orange) and red (arcane). But yes, this would only work if 80% of the time you would get no drop at all, and just get some gold instead. I don't have a problem with that. In fact, I think bosses should drop a decent amount of gold, not the normal 20-30 gold they usually drop. The one time I found Bael 2, he dropped 900 gold.

If they made it this way, then I agree the system would work much better. But of course, then people would complain that they spent 20 minutes doing an elite dungeon and only got 900 gold and no drop. So while this system would probably make more sense in general, it is not going to satisfy the complainers who expect to win the jackpot after putting $10 into the slot machine -- unfortunately those people don't realize that if the slot machine paid out every time $10 was put in, the jackpot would only be worth about $9.

Unfortunately there is no way to beat the rules of economics here. Every change has consequences. As they say, "the path to hell is paved with good intensions." Be careful what you wish for.

i definitely didn't forget Ener and I'm a firm believer in rewarding players for completing challenging content. 900 gold dropping from an elite boss would make the single trip profitable for good players but not overly so while making it about a break even for the folks who have to spam pots the whole run.

when it comes down to it there are simply too many unused items imo. think if all the trash people liquidate daily... having pots or gold drop from mobs instead of smelly helms makes way more sense for guys like me who farm for gold.

i am willing to start up another thread on this in suggestions energizer if you think we could get some traction...

[Energizeric]

Yes, there is always the possibility of the developers implementing ideas if enough players respond positively to a thread. I've had it happen with my threads 3 times in AL (creation of mythic/arcane items, arcane achievement from hatching pet egg, and adding gold to the locked crates), and a couple of times last year in PL. They do listen to requests, as long as the requests are reasonable.

It is a shame this game was not better planned out as far as the economy and drop rates, gold supply, etc. STS has done a wonderful job with the game itself (action, battle, storyline, etc.), but unfortunately this one aspect of the game seems to be a "we will make it up as we go along" kind of thing. I guess STS does not have the budget to hire an economist to plan their role playing game economy....I guess I don't blame them. But the game would be immensely more fun if all these economic issues did not constantly exist.

I'm a bit older than most here, and I started playing role playing games long before the internet existed. So I'm a bit old school and started on games like Ultima and Might & Magic. In those games when you defeated the enemies you almost always found just gold. Only very occasionally did you find an actual item of use. You would then save up your gold and buy the items you needed from the weapons shop in town. In Pocket Legends those weapons shops actually still existed in some of the early (lower level) towns. But in AL they seemed to have gotten rid of them completely. Of course we have the auction which is way better than any NPC weapon shop. But I do think the game should get back to the idea of having an item drop being somewhat of a rarity. Then items would be worth more in general and you wouldn't need 250 inventory slots to carry all your items around. But of course we already have so many items in play at this point, that such an extreme change cannot be made anymore. But they could move in that direction very gradually. I think that would be a good idea.

[afrobug]

I agree with energizeric's standpoint. I used to complain about this too and the same way with the drops of elite golden chests(was frustrated with elite golden pirate chests, that is). Most people including myself will always have their focus on getting profit over what they spend time, gold and effort with. So naturally, you'd feel frustrated if what you invested in did not favor what you had hoped to get. We have to take a look at the long term effect of what you are suggesting to how the economy would roll in this game. Say for example, if STS increase the chance of elite bosses dropping elite gold chests, more people will be farming elites, thus more elite gold chests will circulate therefore price drops. And if sts eliminates greens and epics from the loots you can get out of chests, pinks and even mythic/arcane items will lose their value over time. So this scenario favors only few players in the beginning and the rest suffers the consequence during it's course.

[Taejo]

Yes, there is always the possibility of the developers implementing ideas if enough players respond positively to a thread. I've had it happen with my threads 3 times in AL (creation of mythic/arcane items, arcane achievement from hatching pet egg, and adding gold to the locked crates), and a couple of times last year in PL. They do listen to requests, as long as the requests are reasonable.

It is a shame this game was not better planned out as far as the economy and drop rates, gold supply, etc. STS has done a wonderful job with the game itself (action, battle, storyline, etc.), but unfortunately this one aspect of the game seems to be a "we will make it up as we go along" kind of thing. I guess STS does not have the budget to hire an economist to plan their role playing game economy....I guess I don't blame them. But the game would be immensely more fun if all these economic issues did not constantly exist.

I'm a bit older than most here, and I started playing role playing games long before the internet existed. So I'm a bit old school and started on games like Ultima and Might & Magic. In those games when you defeated the enemies you almost always found just gold. Only very occasionally did you find an actual item of use. You would then save up your gold and buy the items you needed from the weapons shop in town. In Pocket Legends those weapons shops actually still existed in some of the early (lower level) towns. But in AL they seemed to have gotten rid of them completely. Of course we have the auction which is way better than any NPC weapon shop. But I do think the game should get back to the idea of having an item drop being somewhat of a rarity. Then items would be worth more in general and you wouldn't need 250 inventory slots to carry all your items around. But of course we already have so many items in play at this point, that such an extreme change cannot be made anymore. But they could move in that direction very gradually. I think that would be a good idea.

Nice, didn't know you were a seasoned RPG fan. Anyway, we appreciate the work you've done in the past to improve this game. Just remember that the times are changing with MMORPGs - especially the mentality of their fan base. This generation of gamers seems to want everything served to them on a silver platter, and won't always understand your rationale behind what you're saying. STS has done a great job with this game being an MMORPG but with a very casual risk vs reward system. Not many players are appreciative of that, because they simply don't have enough experience with time sinks involved in the the big-time MMORPGs (like where you kill bosses weekly with 20+ other people for the chance at a single piece of loot).

Anyway, to keep my post on track with the rest of the thread, +1 to the increased gold drop idea. Maybe a way to keep a balance within the economy is make the elite drops rarer but gold drops of 500-1k gold more common. Also, +1 to reiterating Energizeric's ongoing demand to have the ability to farm twink gear.

EDIT: And to add an idea which I'm sure very few people will appreciate - having more "No drop" or "Bind on Equip" items always helps stabilize supply and motivates people to go work for their gear rather than just buy it. I wish there were more No Drop armors and eggs from bosses. It would create a more unique quality for the people who work hard for their gear. But again, AL is not your typical MMORPG when it comes to loot.

[Szangheili]

Yes, there is always the possibility of the developers implementing ideas if enough players respond positively to a thread. I've had it happen with my threads 3 times in AL (creation of mythic/arcane items, arcane achievement from hatching pet egg, and adding gold to the locked crates), and a couple of times last year in PL. They do listen to requests, as long as the requests are reasonable.

It is a shame this game was not better planned out as far as the economy and drop rates, gold supply, etc. STS has done a wonderful job with the game itself (action, battle, storyline, etc.), but unfortunately this one aspect of the game seems to be a "we will make it up as we go along" kind of thing. I guess STS does not have the budget to hire an economist to plan their role playing game economy....I guess I don't blame them. But the game would be immensely more fun if all these economic issues did not constantly exist.

I'm a bit older than most here, and I started playing role playing games long before the internet existed. So I'm a bit old school and started on games like Ultima and Might & Magic. In those games when you defeated the enemies you almost always found just gold. Only very occasionally did you find an actual item of use. You would then save up your gold and buy the items you needed from the weapons shop in town. In Pocket Legends those weapons shops actually still existed in some of the early (lower level) towns. But in AL they seemed to have gotten rid of them completely. Of course we have the auction which is way better than any NPC weapon shop. But I do think the game should get back to the idea of having an item drop being somewhat of a rarity. Then items would be worth more in general and you wouldn't need 250 inventory slots to carry all your items around. But of course we already have so many items in play at this point, that such an extreme change cannot be made anymore. But they could move in that direction very gradually. I think that would be a good idea.

Ok, well, I definitely see where you are coming from, I made this thread out of anger. Why? I spent 6hrs of my life doing elites and a few other maps with absolutely no luck. But now I totally see that I came out at the wrong end. You guys are correct, eliminating greens would inflate the amount of pinks dropping, especially with Lep and an Elix stacked. And Ener, I obviously can tell you are an old timer compared to me, someone who has only played MMO games for a few years so you honestly have gotten the knowledge over me there. But I still would appreciate some sort of a change. I deeply apologize if I had insulted anyone, and actually, thanks for the wake up call. Everything can't be easy or as someone said, "served on a silver platter". Lol

[Taejo]

Ok, well, I definitely see where you are coming from, I made this thread out of anger. Why? I spent 6hrs of my life doing elites and a few other maps with absolutely no luck. But now I totally see that I came out at the wrong end. You guys are correct, eliminating greens would inflate the amount of pinks dropping, especially with Lep and an Elix stacked. And Ener, I obviously can tell you are an old timer compared to me, someone who has only played MMO games for a few years so you honestly have gotten the knowledge over me there. But I still would appreciate some sort of a change. I deeply apologize if I had insulted anyone, and actually, thanks for the wake up call. Everything can't be easy or as someone said, "served on a silver platter". Lol

Your thread turned out fine. It's sparked some good ideas (see Alrisaia's) that may be looked into by Devs. Elite maps need some sort of overhaul, and of course drops are part of that. Thanks for your help.

[jabu69]

perhaps it is time to take a page out of some successful mmorpgs and copy their drop system, because i don't see many flaws with them.

a few examples:

WoW - each difficulty always drops their respective tier level. so in AL, that would mean normal mobs drop gold / very low chance of vanity, bosses drop rare, elite bosses drop legendary, rare bosses drop higher legendary or better. what drops what can be finetuned. however, low end gear will drop randomly for everyone, but hard bosses will only drop one item for the entire party. this encourages people to tackle the really hard stuff. anything high-end is bind on account so it can't be sold or traded, but can be given to someone in the party itself, which encourages taking one of each class and also going with guildies. normal gear can't also be traded or sold (not sure about this one), but there is always gear from special circumstances that can be sold (in AL that would be like bael 2 or glad arena).

GW2 - you can get drops from bosses themselves, each drop is individually calculated, but you also get tokens for running the dungeons so you can buy upgrades to your gear, or buy gear itself. in AL, that would be consistent with the hauntlet / story token theme. people would still have to be lucky to get gear, but if you're not, that's fine because by the time you run a dungeon 50 times you can buy your mythic gun. whether this gear can be sold on CS or not, is up to devs to decide.