PvP "guild wars"

[Crowsfoot]

I've observed, ever since I started PvP on a twink, that certain guilds legiteamently hate each other. They ruthlessly gang each other for the other ganging each other. No one remembers who started the fued, but either party will blame the later.

I tried to make peace on my own and just play friendly. However, as one of the stronger guild members I was given the option of helping at least sometimes in clashes, or to leave. I had more close friends in the guild so I, unhappily, aggred. I tried frivolously to bring order refusing to purposefully gang and only "trash talking" when directly insulted for no reason. I give a sarcastic jive in retort and try to live on, it is just a game​​​​. If no one insults me I hardly speak.

After awhile I saw that no matter how polite I tried to be I would still receive accusatory, hateful, and sometimes vulgar personal messages over being "<insert guild name> scum." I usually respond with a lengthy history lesson over how many people hate specific groups of people over time. Details and names unnecessary. We can all think of some group or organization that hates people for what we even label foolish reasons. Many wars have been caused over hating a group over a person.

I am currently trying for the PvP APs, so I am in end game PvP quite often. I see the same story from my twink days. It shows a lack of character, in my opinion, to ever say "your a <ganger/noob> <insert player name" when the only reason your saying it is a title. I have had the following conversation more times than I can count:

Person: "Your a <ganger/noob> Crowsfoot"
Me: "How so?"

<At this point they either answer and have a real conversation, spam "Lol," or log off>

Person: "Your guild gangs people"
Me: "But I didn't, did I?"
Person: "Your guildies ganged me today!"
Me: "So you hate people in my guild, no me?"
Person: "All of <insert guild name> are ganging noobs"
Me: "False, I don't gang. I did however see you spawn kill me last game"
Person: "Because your guild did"
Me: "So if a player on a sports team breaks the law, The whole team should go to prison"
Person: "Lol, that's entirely different"
Me: "It really isn't"

<Spams "Lol," or logs off>

---

It's a shame. I just wanted to point out that people shouldn't be judged by a title, and not a book by its cover. I don't know if anyone will take this to heart, but I figured I'd share my views.

---

I'd also like to define some term. These are my definitions and opinions on it.

Offensive Team's Offenses:

Ganging= purposefully attacking someone in a larger group.
- if you are being ganged, point it out I close the opponents menu since it limits my range of view. I always sit or leave once I notice uneven sides.
- request 1v1 if the map is closed. 1v1 is impossible to gang at unless your opponent (might be someone on their team and not them) truly is a "dirty" player.
- if your team leaves mid clash, I finish the clash. This is not ganging. Leave if your team bails, no one will blame you they were the cowards.
- to add on to the previous point, if you have less players on your team and run into the clash it is your fault, stay in the spawn and call or leave. If you run into a clash you are attacking and the "gangers" (who aren't gangers) are really defending themselves.

Spawning= running into an opponent's spawn and killing them before they can leave the spawn.
- I will follow you into a spawn if you run into it after exiting. Reentering a spawn is called camping. Reference that definition under "Defending Team's Offenses."
- If the other team is spawning, leave. I leave when it happens. No point fighting 1v5.
= Running back into the respawn to avoid dying.
- If you jet from a clash into the respawn I will follow you.
- This is extremely cowardly, we all die sometimes. If you want to run, run, but don't run to the respawn hoping a team mate with a bible will save you.
- Run to a base, heal pack, ect. but don't go to a spawn.

Defensive Team's Offenses:

Camping: Running back to the respawn to avoid dying.
- Once you leave a respawn, stay out.
- Running to where your team has the bubble isn't fair, if you want to run go anywhere besides a respawn.
- It is the most frustrating thing to me when campers accuse you of spawn killing. I would never be in your spawn if you didn't run back in.

Leaving While Under Attack= leaving mid clash to avoid your opponent getting a well deserved kill.
- You still gain a death. If you know your team is going to lose leave after respawning. There is no shame leaving after dying. I leave matches I know are lost.
- If you manage to run away from a clash (without going to a spawn) and no one is attacking you, leave all you wish. Its not polite in the eyes of many players, but I see nothing wrong with it (doesn't mean its not annoying, you just didn't do anything wrong).
- If you are being ganged or spawned the other team should be ashamed and you can leave while being attacked.
- You hurt your team a lot. You aggravate everyone in the game doing this.
- Some people may DC and do this on accident. I won't believe you though if you just so happen to "DC" every time you are about to die.

Feel free to post your views on my "definitions" and opinions on them.

[Frekken]

Just leave the guild, add some close folks and go like rouroni... The right way
You got a point tho

[Tehh]

Most twinking, especially ten, is drama and trash talk. Basically you have to have the mindset of "kill everyone"

[Sheener]

I dont go out to gang people.. but when the opportunity presents itself I will take advantage. I will not complain if I get ganged. This is all part of the game. All of this ruins the game... like not killing flaggers.. I say kill them. I usually let them be 99 percent of the time. But if anyone feels the desire to kill me go for it. People complaining about being killed in pvp makes me mad.....

[Sheener]

I dont think u r in the wrong at all

[becky_xil]

May I know what lvl are you twinking right now?

Send using my cellphone.. yes my cellphone

[Fauksuras]

I dont go out to gang people.. but when the opportunity presents itself I will take advantage. I will not complain if I get ganged. This is all part of the game. All of this ruins the game... like not killing flaggers.. I say kill them. I usually let them be 99 percent of the time. But if anyone feels the desire to kill me go for it. People complaining about being killed in pvp makes me mad.....

I like your attitude, if you gang you're fine with people ganging back. What annoys me most are gangers who complain or really go crazy calling for back up when favor is returned. Don't wanna do the time? Don't do the crime.

[Jig]

I like your attitude, if you gang you're fine with people ganging back. What annoys me most are gangers who complain or really go crazy calling for back up when favor is returned. Don't wanna do the time? Don't do the crime.

There are too many of them, many times this has occurred to me, I get 4v2'd, 3 on my team but one is afk, the 3rd guy wakes up, one guy leaves on the other team, 3v3 now, gets owned, crys cause he was ganged in a 3v3, then another leaves, then they cry even MORE because of 3v2. Bloody ridiculous.

[Crowsfoot]

Just leave the guild, add some close folks and go like rouroni... The right way
You got a point tho

Not plausible. The guild system is designed for competition. My only argument, which was largely ignored due to the inclusion of a ganging definition, is that it would be nice to see some people look beyond a guild title before judging someone.

[Fauksuras]

You're right. In my guild there used to be a few prominent. Pvprs who made quite a few enemies. I was surprised when one time somebody was egging people in my team to go against me because the aforementioned players and I shared a guild title, all this despite me having never before even met this "troublemaker"

On a related note I think the guildmaster should sometimes hold people accountable for their actions (if they don't want a certain reputation that is) since, let's be honest, we are only human, if a person behaves a certain way towards us it's difficult to differentiate them from their fellows.

If I were to leave my current guild for whatever reason I'd have to go guild less because due to PVP I really really strongly dislike at least someone in every major guild. It's not right, but it is what it is.

[Solid]

If you're part of a group, you are entititled to a little responsibility from them.

[Crowsfoot]

You're right. In my guild there used to be a few prominent. Pvprs who made quite a few enemies. I was surprised when one time somebody was egging people in my team to go against me because the aforementioned players and I shared a guild title, all this despite me having never before even met this "troublemaker"

On a related note I think the guildmaster should sometimes hold people accountable for their actions (if they don't want a certain reputation that is) since, let's be honest, we are only human, if a person behaves a certain way towards us it's difficult to differentiate them from their fellows.

If I were to leave my current guild for whatever reason I'd have to go guild less because due to PVP I really really strongly dislike at least someone in every major guild. It's not right, but it is what it is.

Welcome to my world. 100% agree and associate.

The only issue I see in your second paragraph is how to know. Seeing is believing, if I don't know you well I question all accusations because I don't want to punish an person who isn't guilty. Bye the time a "trouble maker" is identified damage is done.

[Crowsfoot]

If you're part of a group, you are entititled to a little responsibility from them.

Every group hasits faults. I know you of all people know two guilds which hate each other.

And, yes, I know "shame your kdr has to suffer because of your guild" is what you told me. And I reaffirm, "why should it be any better at yours?"

I don't particularly like certain player, we all have someone who rubs us against the grain, but I try to look beyond a stupid title.

[Slywannas]

If you're part of a group, you are entititled to a little responsibility from them.

Why should I be? For example my guild has 670-ish people at the moment, and if one or two of them go in pvp and piss off someone from a stronger, better guild, I shouldn't be subject to constant ganging or slamming based on what they did or said. I can't control what my guildies do, heck, not even guild GM's can. Maybe they can hold them accountable if the story is proven and kick them out, I on the other hand can't be. When I go in pvp I expect to be judged based on my skills, how I play and what I say or have said, not by the guild title I wear. Which is why this whole guild wars nonsense is pointless, and which is why Crows is dead on.

[Solid]

Why should I be? For example my guild has 670-ish people at the moment, and if one or two of them go in pvp and piss off someone from a stronger, better guild, I shouldn't be subject to constant ganging or slamming based on what they did or said. I can't control what my guildies do, heck, not even guild GM's can. Maybe they can hold them accountable if the story is proven and kick them out, I on the other hand can't be. When I go in pvp I expect to be judged based on my skills, how I play and what I say or have said, not by the guild title I wear. Which is why this whole guild wars nonsense is pointless, and which is why Crows is dead on.

So you have no relation to your guild?

[Tehh]

This is the stuff that happens in twinking, if you don't like it. Don't twink

[Slywannas]

So you have no relation to your guild?

Of course I have a relation to my guild, i just don't want to suffer because some of them go in and piss off other ppl. And there is no valid reason I should. I'll direct them to do what needs to be done and be fair in pvp, share my exp and info I know, but if they go and do what they want then it's on their head, not mine. Or it should ever be.

[Solid]

Of course I have a relation to my guild, i just don't want to suffer because some of them go in and piss off other ppl. And there is no valid reason I should. I'll direct them to do what needs to be done and be fair in pvp, share my exp and info I know, but if they go and do what they want then it's on their head, not mine. Or it should ever be.

I don't think you can make an opponent guild do anything. So you gotta deal with it, because you are part of the rival guild.

[Anarchist]

Twink pvp is a wonderful mix of ignorance and blood thirsty players and i like it.


I like when a guild call another one "noob gangers" when they just finished ganging a noob, i like the feud, i like the heat on the pvp ground, it makes me escape from normal routine of killing noobs.

When it comes to trash talk i just keep quiet and kill them with my guild. If i loose i stop keeping quiet and make fun of the opponents.

This is twink pvp people.

[xcainnblecterx]

Not to bash all young players or to say all older players are mature but if you notice if you play during school hours there is a whole lot less maturity. There's still some but not as the usual nights and weekends. Either way i still say just cause you're in a guild with a couple people that cause problems, people shouldn't judge every one in that guild. A off example some of you may not know and will probably hate on me for using but look up the lawsuit icp has against the fbi right now. Some juggalos went off and did/do crazy horrendous crap and it turned around that anyone wearing the clothing or has tattoos of anything juggalo realted is now a gang member. Ridiculous to see the few that turned bad now have the rest that are actually good people now be labled as bad. Take that as how people are acting towards a whole guild based on a few bad eggs. Crows post isnt about ganging (yes he mentioned gave guidelines etc) but on judging a guild cause of said bad eggs. Sucks when you can't pvp properly cause people wanna rip your head off for a non sense reason but meh reason i dont even play al for pvp anymore