Skills.

[Bellaelda]

Thanks Bellaelda. Can I ask you which skills you currently have mapped and which ones you feel you need to use but can't?

Grr... Keep trying to write out this novel and my windows keep closing (I got no computer skills at all!)

OK so here it goes...

MAGES:

The problem: need to be able to stay alive longer and die less somehow, lol... Here's some good ideas to attain this...

-ICE... Make it actually freeze. It doesn't need to be a long as it was before it was removed maybe, but right now it doesn't freeze anything we actually need it to freeze (like mages in elite, bosses, and pvp)

-Clock... See ice.. Great skill for easy mobs, but not much else

-Stun immunity... We need one... Only class with nada

-Lightning an or ice... AOE could work more often as of right now (especially ice) they don't work nearly enough

-Curse... Could reflect more damage on things like aimed shot that one hit us np, but reflect back very little of that dmage

-Shield... Needs to last longer (right now people just wait it out then kill us)

-Lifegiver... Maybe a longer heal over time or something... This skills needs a lot

Also could use more damage since right now we can't compete even with that since rogues critical just puts our damage to shame

And lastly armor.... If we can't properly stun anything that's gonna kill us in a few seconds than please allow us a bit more armor or health at least, lol

TANKS:

The problem: doesn't buff party enough for them not to slow down runs and can't hold aggro... Here's some great ideas from Maarkus since I think he says it best

-ArmorSkyward smash, it mentions 'increased damage during critic als' why not buff this part of the skill to act like the aimed shot of rogues

-Chest splitter has feeble, why not adapt it to cancel boss Windups like it used to in earlier seasons.

-Axe has an armor rebuff of 10percent why not increase this percentage and add it to wind mill as well

-Juggernaut skill and not just taunts but taunts need to have a duration wherein the aggro counter doesn't just reset but stays locked on the tauting warrior for at least 3 seconds to help us keep aggro better, this I say coz as soon as we taunt and a rogue crits it the mobs just refocus to the rogue, effectively we taunt for barely a second as rogues crit constantly.

-Rally cry why just buff party why not apply the debuff to mobs as well?

I'd also like to add that the buffs that tanks get to their primary stat from certain skills could buff the entire party... That would make them much more desirable in runs!

[G-M]

Grr... Keep trying to write out this novel and my windows keep closing (I got no computer skills at all!)

OK so here it goes...

MAGES:

The problem: need to be able to stay alive longer and die less somehow, lol... Here's some good ideas to attain this...

-ICE... Make it actually freeze. It doesn't need to be a long as it was before it was removed maybe, but right now it doesn't freeze anything we actually need it to freeze (like mages in elite, bosses, and pvp)

-Clock... See ice.. Great skill for easy mobs, but not much else

-Stun immunity... We need one... Only class with nada

-Lightning an or ice... AOE could work more often as of right now (especially ice) they don't work nearly enough

-Curse... Could reflect more damage on things like aimed shot that one hit us np, but reflect back very little of that dmage

-Shield... Needs to last longer (right now people just wait it out then kill us)

-Lifegiver... Maybe a longer heal over time or something... This skills needs a lot

Also could use more damage since right now we can't compete even with that since rogues critical just puts our damage to shame

And lastly armor.... If we can't properly stun anything that's gonna kill us in a few seconds than please allow us a bit more armor or health at least, lol

TANKS:

The problem: doesn't buff party enough for them not to slow down runs and can't hold aggro... Here's some great ideas from Maarkus since I think he says it best

-ArmorSkyward smash, it mentions 'increased damage during critic als' why not buff this part of the skill to act like the aimed shot of rogues

-Chest splitter has feeble, why not adapt it to cancel boss Windups like it used to in earlier seasons.

-Axe has an armor rebuff of 10percent why not increase this percentage and add it to wind mill as well

-Juggernaut skill and not just taunts but taunts need to have a duration wherein the aggro counter doesn't just reset but stays locked on the tauting warrior for at least 3 seconds to help us keep aggro better, this I say coz as soon as we taunt and a rogue crits it the mobs just refocus to the rogue, effectively we taunt for barely a second as rogues crit constantly.

-Rally cry why just buff party why not apply the debuff to mobs as well?

I'd also like to add that the buffs that tanks get to their primary stat from certain skills could buff the entire party... That would make them much more desirable in runs!

Wow, thanks for the awesome post Bellaelda! When we get specifics like this it's extremely helpful.

[HotttSauce]

Wow, thanks for the awesome post Bellaelda! When we get specifics like this it's extremely helpful.

This is in regards to pvp and Skill usage issues.

**1). Why am I unable to get health packs on the ground even when I'm standing "Right On Top" of them, while I've been stunned?

BUT

**2). But while I'm stunned & can't move/attk/get health packs on the ground directly under my toons toes, I CAN STILL use my pets AA ability to say (stun, freeze etc enemy players?

---To be clear I'm not saying I cant use/deploy heal or Health packs skill buttons while stunned. I'm saying I can run directly Over a health pack & in the 1.5secs it takes to process that my toon has touched a health pack, an enemies stun overides that & I do the stunned dance while standing ontop of the health pack and get NO HEAL at all until the stun duration that occured AFTER I initially touched the health pack has ended. --But I can still use my pets AA doe, while I do the stunned boogy- >.>

[Overweightank]

a 5th slot does sound cool O.O ... matter fact... it would make the game much better for middle class players. This way we might be able to fill the gap.

[yeldarbroz]

Wow

[epicrrr]

Can we a have a skill tree where a certain rog can lean to a certain "role" right now all classes the same skill build (at my home level of 13) AIM, PIERCE, HEAL. It could be fun where a rog can assume the role of a "heal rog" then i would have to focus my points to the HEAL (combat medic) skill tree of rog. Working with the current skills already there as the base for skill set. Now i know these will be a huge undertaking and will require a lot of thinking a game dev skills but i know u guys can pull it off.

Crit Rog(Aimshot skill tree)
Buff Rog (Shadow veil skill tree)
AoE rog (Shadow shot/Nox bolt skill tree/Pierce)
Disable/Trap Rog (Entangle trap skill tree)
Heal Rog (Combat medic skill tree)

a lot of promising role and scenario - with the points i have i can go Crit and AoE type Rog and lets not even get started with sorcs.. omg Fire mage, Ice Mage lol

[Dex Scene]

I think Mages's shield is fine..
If it lasts way too long, mages will be super tanky! Just my opinion

[Bellaelda]

I'm not saying they need to add every suggestion... That would be too much obviously, but those are just some ideas I thought were good ones.

Or if they want to ignore them all than at least buff our health, armor, or shield... Since if we can't act like mages then we should at least be able to live like other classes

[Dex Scene]

I'm not saying they need to add every suggestion... That would be too much obviously, but those are just some ideas I thought were good ones.

Or if they want to ignore them all than at least buff our health, armor, or shield... Since if we can't act like mages then we should at least be able to live like other classes

Health is good. Shield is powerful too.
Buff the armor. Give stun immunity. And what else, freeze should be working in some many cases where it doesn't.

[Zeus]

I. Armor Analysis of Classes:
- Tanks -> 2500-2900 armor
- Rogues -> 1798-1955 armor (when maxed)
- Sorcerers -> 1300 armor

I think that sorcerers should at least have around 1500ish armor. If STG cannot do that, then make gale's armor boost a static boost or apply a rule where debuffs cannot cancel out gale's armor buff + reduce mage armor. This should really help a mage's survivability in both PvE (wolves) and PvP (Axe, AS).

II. Sorcerer Related Fixes:

1. I think that mage's shield should give stun immunity. I am not saying for the mages to have stun immunity until the shield breaks because that can be both good or bad. However, it would be nice to have a guaranteed 7-8 seconds stun immunity upon activating arcane shield.

2. Ice should be able to freeze in PvP, however, with shortened duration and ability not to stack with itself. This insures that a sorcerer cannot freeze a target for all eternity.

III. Warrior Related Fixes:
The main issue with warriors are not that they are weak in PvP. They are actually quite strong and a group of them can produce a lot of damage as well as be very difficult to kill! However, this does not reflect in PvE. Warriors are far to slow to be able to run effectively with most parties.

1. Create bosses and edit current bosses to have group combos. By this, I mean that in order for the boss to be taken down, the boss will need to receive a skill from each class. Example: A rogue's aimed shot, a sorcerer's ice, or a warrior's chest splitter.

2. Axe's Armor Debuff. It currently is weak @ 10%. This should at least be buffed to 15-20% considering that most pet passive will reduce armor far more than axe's armor debuff.

This is rather simple than overly changing much class balance and it ensures that players will carry a warrior into their party.

IV. Rogue Related Fixes:

1. Fix the rogue razor shield so that when a rogue adds the extended duration upgrade, it does not stop the remove impairing effects portion of razor shield from working. In the current implementation, the extended duration upgrade will cause the impairing upgrade to work correctly on first cast and then never again until death or exiting & re-entering map. The current solution is to spec out the extended duration upgrade. This needs to be fixed...truly.


My two cents...

[Gorecaster]

Why are we being asked to list skills and what we think is wrong with them? ...again. These issues have been on the table and being discussed for the better part of a year now and this is going back to square one. I won't waste my time anymore trying to describe to developers of a game how to improve the dynamics when they've already been explained in detail numerous times and sts has clearly stated they are not addressing the skills at this point. Take dmg passive for example. This has been a legitimately broken skill for a long time. We need to tell u this? Again? At my job im expected to have a decent understanding of how everything works. I'll start avoiding repoire, acting as though I'm not sure how my tools work and asking my customers how i can improve after the shotty work is done promptly followed by a little misinformation and see where that gets me -.-

[HotttSauce]

This is in regards to pvp and Skill usage issues.

**1). Why am I unable to get health packs on the ground even when I'm standing "Right On Top" of them, while I've been stunned?

BUT

**2). But while I'm stunned & can't move/attk/get health packs on the ground directly under my toons toes, I CAN STILL use my pets AA ability to say (stun, freeze etc enemy players?

---To be clear I'm not saying I cant use/deploy heal or Health packs skill buttons while stunned. I'm saying I can run directly Over a health pack & in the 1.5secs it takes to process that my toon has touched a health pack, an enemies stun overides that & I do the stunned dance while standing ontop of the health pack and get NO HEAL at all until the stun duration that occured AFTER I initially touched the health pack has ended. --But I can still use my pets AA doe, while I do the stunned boogy- >.>

Ummmmm is this not a legitimate concern? Atleast this issue spans across PvP & Pve at ALL LEVELS of gameplay. Instead of like some suggestions ppl have listed -Endgame Specific improvements only- which only help a portion of the gaming community Rather than address an issue affecting THE ENTIRE gaming community.

[Ravager]

I. Armor Analysis of Classes:
- Tanks -> 2500-2900 armor
- Rogues -> 1798-1955 armor (when maxed)
- Sorcerers -> 1300 armor

I think that sorcerers should at least have around 1500ish armor. If STG cannot do that, then make gale's armor boost a static boost or apply a rule where debuffs cannot cancel out gale's armor buff + reduce mage armor. This should really help a mage's survivability in both PvE (wolves) and PvP (Axe, AS).

II. Sorcerer Related Fixes:

1. I think that mage's shield should give stun immunity. I am not saying for the mages to have stun immunity until the shield breaks because that can be both good or bad. However, it would be nice to have a guaranteed 7-8 seconds stun immunity upon activating arcane shield.

2. Ice should be able to freeze in PvP, however, with shortened duration and ability not to stack with itself. This insures that a sorcerer cannot freeze a target for all eternity.

III. Warrior Related Fixes:
The main issue with warriors are not that they are weak in PvP. They are actually quite strong and a group of them can produce a lot of damage as well as be very difficult to kill! However, this does not reflect in PvP. Warriors are far to slow to be able to run effectively with most parties.

1. Create bosses and edit current bosses to have group combos. By this, I mean that in order for the boss to be taken down, the boss will need to receive a skill from each class. Example: A rogue's aimed shot, a sorcerer's ice, or a warrior's chest splitter.

2. Axe's Armor Debuff. It currently is weak @ 10%. This should at least be buffed to 15-20% considering that most pet passive will reduce armor far more than axe's armor debuff.

This is rather simple than overly changing much class balance and it ensures that players will carry a warrior into their party.

IV. Rogue Related Fixes:

1. Fix the rogue razor shield so that when a rogue adds the extended duration upgrade, it does not stop the remove impairing effects portion of razor shield from working. In the current implementation, the extended duration upgrade will cause the impairing upgrade to work correctly on first cast and then never again until death or exiting & re-entering map. The current solution is to spec out the extended duration upgrade. This needs to be fixed...truly.


My two cents...

I agree with most of these.

I would prefer if the mage had higher armor. Same or similar armor to a rogue. In early seasons, mages had same or almost the same armor as rogues yet still struggled in pvp.

I'd like to see juggernaut heal back to the 50% marker in pvp like it used to. Now when juggernaut heals, it heals to the 38-42% marker.

[Bellaelda]

I agree with most of these.

I would prefer if the mage had higher armor. Same or similar armor to a rogue. In early seasons, mages had same or almost the same armor as rogues yet still struggled in pvp.

I'd like to see juggernaut heal back to the 50% marker in pvp like it used to. Now when juggernaut heals, it heals to the 38-42% marker.

Yeah sounds good to me too

[lavecina]

Mage are a joke, gale force armor upgrade does not seem to be activated after has arrived to the other side,, imposible to use it to cross a group of mobs.
Mage armor its another joke.

Rouge rising deadth does less damage but in description say should do more.
The rouge heal pack pickup area its so tinny sometimes....this could be a lag problem.

Why spend 20mill in a pet the groups mobs and 10m in an amulet that spread them out.

How can we do pure timed runs with a event boss that gives elixir runs? isnt loot non elixir item for runs?

We have some weapons that kill still in pvp, you should rlly look into this seriusly before release, same happend with some pets. you die but deadth does not count.
Another clear example its the frost bow: kill still being from yourself.
Frost bow also affects your own team related to the wind mill pull that does,, should not only affect the other team?

Makes me think if develops rlly play this game or is up to us to text in dev server and give you the points need to be sorted.

[Imsofancy]

I believe that the main problem for mags is that besides mana, there is no other defined aspect for them besides that, no extra health, armor, dmg, dodge....

I personally use Fireball, ice, lighting, clock, and shield and that works great for me. I use a build of fire, ice, clock, and shield for dealing with mobs, and when I reach the boss, (depending of the difficulty) I would switch clock out with light, so that I can do more dmg.

Fun fact: 1/5 light and 1/5 ice have the exactly the same stats except for range, light is 12 meters, ice is 14.

[Newcomx]

I would like to see Lifegiver become must have skill in pve... maybe if buff with lifegiver will give dmg boost or add health for limited time for defense purpose
I would like to see Warrior taunt stronger so Sorc or Rogue cannot steal mobs from Warr

I don't like to see 5 skill slot, because it is look smaller in phone, maybe implementing skill page would be good

[Limsi]

Shadow Storm for rouge is a vanity skill. It's entirely useless and a mortal sin to be included in a rouge's skillset. Make it useful(aoe massive armor/crit debuff effect, or simply a good aoe skill which)

[Kingofninjas]

Honestly, I think adding a fifth skill slot will not only sort of fix the skill system but will also be in a way a mage and warrior buff. Rogues will benefit from an extra slot but not nearly as much as the other 2 classes.

In a PvP perspective, mages can now spec fireball/gale, ice, lightning, shield, and heal. My only fear is that warriors using Axe, cs, as, jugg and horn will become extremely hard to defeat, especially 1 on 1. Rogues manage fine with 4 skills. It would help to be able to spec razor and nox at the same time but its completely unnecessary.

As an alternative, I would like to suggest some changes to make mages more formidable.
Ice needs to freeze. It also MUST follow stun immunity rules.
The heal over time on mages heal is little more than a joke. An elond bow heals about the same or more than it. My suggestion is to either buff it or replace it with a boost in armor for like 5-7 seconds. Instead of giving a % boost which will be useless, just provide a straight 150-300 armor boost to all allies in range.
Thirdly, remove the knock back on shield and give mages stun immunity instead.

I apologize for not being specific with numbers but I have not played the mage class since s2 and have no idea what ideal values would look like.

[ueveotadeo]

Even though a lot of you are talking about PVP and I agree that it is a big part of the game, lets not forget the PVE component.

Mages MUST be able to stun better than pets. Right now is more beneficial to have a rogue with breeze than a mage in some cases. Why a pet can freeze/stun/panic whatsoever mobs that mage can't if mages role is to mob control?
That makes no sense at all.
Also, it is ridiculous how squish they are. Either make mages have some upgrade that will boost their armor by a bit (could be a 5th shield upgrade, after shield goes down armor is buffed by a bit for a short time) or make gear according to the actual game difficulty (I mean STS money maker: the one hits)

As for warrior, as someone stated in other thread, arena's mushrooms can hold aggro better than us. Make taunt have a duration. Make rally cry range bigger and give us some more debuff mobs/buff pt skills . That could be easily added as a 5th upgrade for Rally Cry or Vengefull Blood for example. Make axe throw have at least same armor debuff as aimed, although I think warriors should get a bit more, 20% lets say. Make CS cancel boss attacks.

For rogues I think that fixing the current bug on razor shield and nox would suffice. If a 5th skill upgrade was the way to go, Ill have to apologize but I have no suggestions for rogues, in my mind they are OP the way they are right now.

As you can see STS, "revamping the skill system" would be as simple as correcting existent bugs and adding a 5th upgrade.

Also, I'm a PVE player. Usually everyone talks about PVP I just wanted to share some PVE thoughts.