1.7.5 Content Update (75561)

[WhoIsThis]

The 500 plat vanity was just a test to see how much some people are willing to cough up. It's funny how the same people who are complaining now are the same people who bought the 500 plat vanity.

To be honest, I'm not complaining about the 500 plat vanity. If people were crazy enough to pay that much for a vanity item ... well, so be it. So long as it has no stats, it's not really a problem.

What is a problem is that we are now seeing content restricted by platinum and that we have to pay for each run. That is, in most people's mind's unacceptable. It's one thing to charge for elixirs (which are optional) or to charge a one-time fee for unlimited access. It's another thing entirely to charge for every run.

[MightyMicah]

^diddo. Well put Whoisthis.

[derricks2]

JustG, can the WF be free on christmas day?

No need to reply, but at least give it some consideration.

To be perfectly honest, this would probably make matters worse.

If you think about it, they are not saying anything about what they intend to do about this. So, if they say it will be free on xmas, then all the people who ARE spending plat will not and simply wait until xmas to do their running. As such, if they continue to keep quit and DO make it free on xmas, all the people who spend 100s of plat on a hand-full of runs will be extremely upset that now its free for a day and had they known they wouldn't have invested all that plat, they would have waited for the free day. The last thing that they want to do is piss off the people that are paying right now.

As it is, theirs a bunch of pissed of players who arent paying for runs. If they make it free on christmas, they appease the people not "contributing to their business" (in other words make them money), and really pissing off the only people who ARE making them money by duping them into paying first, then making it free without letting them know beforhand.

To be honest, I feel like that would be a horrible decision by them. They need to make a decision and stick with it. Personally I think the 2p a run thing is a joke, especially since this is last years content with new loot tables.

[Southriver]

The devs lock down fourms and sat to send our feed back here but were getting ignored with the same answer. I'm not buying plat from STS i'm downloading it off tapjoy

[WhoIsThis]

This post has been copied from here at the request of Pandar:
http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...sponse-urgent.


The winter campaign employed a model where people would have to pay per run. Reception of this has been very poor, and the pink drop rates are not enough in the eyes of many players for compensation.

I find this one ironic. Earlier today, a player called csb told me that PvP players were all platinum burners and that is why they were skilled. I laughed in real life when I read his reply - it demonstrated a total ignorance of PvP. Platinum does not buy skill in either PvP nor PvE. But, for this campaign, csb's accusation that anybody that farmed a lot of the winter campaign would be a platinum spending "elite" holds true. Players are being charged by the run. I don't mean to pick on this player, but he/she does raise an important point, although not in PvP, but rather the Winter campaign.

In future campaigns (and holiday events), will we have to pay platinum for each run or will the main spine remain free (or accessible for a one-time purchase of platinum?)

Most players are willing to pay a reasonable amount of platinum for high quality content (see my long thread as to what defines high quality content) provided that they feel that they get their money's worth.

Edit:
What we are not willing to do is to pay for each run - this is simply prohibitive and unrealistic.

[Elyseon]

Did they stop posting?

Still listening, just not posting as much. Drop rates in WF are huge, if you want to farm it over and over to sell your pinks to other players, by all means do so. If you want to get in and out and score a few nice holiday items, it should not cost you too much at all.

My pink cost me about 44 plat (luck elixir and over 10 runs)


Also the 500 plat crown is totally different it was a one time payment for the best designed vanity IMO. What they are doing now is like if they rented the omnipotent crown out for 100 plat a day.

[Slush]

To be honest, I'm not complaining about the 500 plat vanity. If people were crazy enough to pay that much for a vanity item ... well, so be it. So long as it has no stats, it's not really a problem.

What is a problem is that we are now seeing content restricted by platinum and that we have to pay for each run. That is, in most people's mind's unacceptable. It's one thing to charge for elixirs (which are optional) or to charge a one-time fee for unlimited access. It's another thing entirely to charge for every run.

I know, but what I'm saying is that the people who bought the vanity spurred on STS to make the WF cost plat per run, as well as many other decisions unfavoured by most of the community. I think you misread or misunderstood my post, feel free to correct me however.

[Elyseon]

To be honest, I'm not complaining about the 500 plat vanity. If people were crazy enough to pay that much for a vanity item ... well, so be it. So long as it has no stats, it's not really a problem.

What is a problem is that we are now seeing content restricted by platinum and that we have to pay for each run. That is, in most people's mind's unacceptable. It's one thing to charge for elixirs (which are optional) or to charge a one-time fee for unlimited access. It's another thing entirely to charge for every run.

I know, but what I'm saying is that the people who bought the vanity spurred on STS to make the WF cost plat per run, as well as many other decisions unfavoured by most of the community. I think you misread or misunderstood my post, feel free to correct me however.

Nah I think it all started with the plat elixir system

[WhoIsThis]

I know, but what I'm saying is that the people who bought the vanity spurred on STS to make the WF cost plat per run, as well as many other decisions unfavoured by most of the community. I think you misread or misunderstood my post, feel free to correct me however.

I'd have to agree with Elyseon. Platinum elixirs were more like a pay per run kind of thing - or should I say pay per hour.

500 platinum is a one time expense that you never have to worry about again, assuming you even buy it (I didn't for obvious reasons).

There were people chugging elixirs before the 500 plat vanity. I think that the main decline started with Nuri - a level clearly intended for elixir usage.

[Protank]

It's just seems like sts would make more $ if they charged a one time fee like last year.

I can't see the #'s so I have no idea.

it just doesn't seem like this would be good for business.

[Pandamoni]

First, I'd like to preface my post by saying I've typed two responses and deleted them both after sitting on them for hours. I found myself rambling and couldn't understand why and then I realized it's because I'm all over the place with how I feel about the direction of the game. I can't really address how I feel about the WF this year without touching on how I feel about the game.

When I first started playing PL I was impressed by the diversity between levels. I loved the creativity I saw and I had no idea what I'd see next. It was exciting and new and fun. It was enough to pull me in and hook me.

I have not spent money on video games, aside from exercise games for my Wii, in my adult life but when I hit level 13 I bought the main spine without hesitation. I was glad I bought it and I continued to buy the other maps in order to access the really cool content. I felt that my money was well spent and I couldn't believe that this great little game was so much fun.

I started perusing the forums in order to learn my skills. Because I'd never played a video game like this I had no idea what I was doing and wanted to learn how to allocate skill points, etc. I would browse the forums for hours reading guides, learning more about my character and learning how to be a better player. In the process I found a community that was thriving with active players who were full of advice and knowledge and a palpable love of the game.

I was also shocked to see the game developers actively participating in threads. What I felt was almost like a big family. I come from a very close family so seeing this mutual respect between the developers and players (and the players seemed like more than players--they were contributors to the game whose ideas were respected by the devs) made me feel all warm and fuzzy. I'd see Asommers in town talking to people, having fun, showing off his yeti costume or alien costume and it was just really cool.

Eventually, though, the devs became more distant and much less visible. Rather than seeing the team on the boards the collective voice of the devs was spoken through Samhayne. Concerns were quickly shut down with, "please leave feedback here_____ and we will look at all concerns", with very little follow up. I can't speak for everyone but it began to feel that we were being dismissed.

I can understand some of the business decisions because, obviously, you do have a business you are growing. I get that. What I don't understand is where the creative content went. In the past you may have been charging too little for what you gave us (the creative content all the way up to AO3) but you did a complete 180 and started charging WAY too much for content that was inferior. I've seen people argue on the boards that creating more diverse dungeons would be cost prohibitive but I know beyond a doubt STS is making much more money than in the past, when the content was amazingly creative.

I think what you are seeing recently is negativity due to the feeling that we are being expected to pay money for what many feel is not great content. To take it a step further, many of us feel you are charging PL players obscene amounts of platinum in order to fund your other projects. This wouldn't be horrible if you were actually providing new content that was mind boggling but that hasn't been the case. Many of us who play PL are not interested in playing SL or DL so having to pay to fund the creation of games that don't interest us while watching our own beloved game become a cash cow/money drain is quite depressing.

Rather than getting defensive and feeling attacked I wish the devs could feel the amount of emotion people feel for this game. Honestly, how many games have players who would plead with the developers to listen to their complaints to help bring the game back to what it was rather than just bail? I know a lot of people have just left with their hands in the air but many of us are sticking it out and asking that you at least stop and hear where this frustration is coming from rather than going to the fall back, "we have to make money!" We get that. We don't refute that. But when making money usurps the quality of the game, the quality of game play and the decisions being made are obviously all based on how much more plat you can get people to spend I think the developers need to take a step back and ask themselves why they developed the game in the first place.

I worry that STS will either lose a ton of players and flounder. Or that they'll continue on the plat chase and not listen to the players and be happy being a game that consists of a revolving door of players who spend plat on ridiculousness and then leave. Great. You'll be making money. But you'll have lost the heart that so many of us felt when we first started playing. I can't believe you began PL with the sole intent of making dough or you wouldn't have been so involved initially. I'm still trying to figure out what happened--did you sell part of the company to a new firm who is demanding that these new changes take place or was I just imagining what I felt when I first started playing?

I won't be playing the WF this year, which is depressing because I really enjoyed last year's event. It was awesome and I met Drewcapu, a great buddy, playing those dungeons. I've chosen to not play the campaign because I feel that supporting your decision to charge 2 plat per run is just supporting the decline down a slippery slope of disaster. I'm starting to get less positive so I'll just leave you with one last point.

When you have a sea of old players who have consistently supported STS leaving I think that STS needs to stop for a moment and reflect on what that means.

[Slush]

First, I'd like to preface my post by saying I've typed two responses and deleted them both after sitting on them for hours. I found myself rambling and couldn't understand why and then I realized it's because I'm all over the place with how I feel about the direction of the game. I can't really address how I feel about the WF this year without touching on how I feel about the game.

When I first started playing PL I was impressed by the diversity between levels. I loved the creativity I saw and I had no idea what I'd see next. It was exciting and new and fun. It was enough to pull me in and hook me.

I have not spent money on video games, aside from exercise games for my Wii, in my adult life but when I hit level 13 I bought the main spine without hesitation. I was glad I bought it and I continued to buy the other maps in order to access the really cool content. I felt that my money was well spent and I couldn't believe that this great little game was so much fun.

I started perusing the forums in order to learn my skills. Because I'd never played a video game like this I had no idea what I was doing and wanted to learn how to allocate skill points, etc. I would browse the forums for hours reading guides, learning more about my character and learning how to be a better player. In the process I found a community that was thriving with active players who were full of advice and knowledge and a palpable love of the game.

I was also shocked to see the game developers actively participating in threads. What I felt was almost like a big family. I come from a very close family so seeing this mutual respect between the developers and players (and the players seemed like more than players--they were contributors to the game whose ideas were respected by the devs) made me feel all warm and fuzzy. I'd see Asommers in town talking to people, having fun, showing off his yeti costume or alien costume and it was just really cool.

Eventually, though, the devs became more distant and much less visible. Rather than seeing the team on the boards the collective voice of the devs was spoken through Samhayne. Concerns were quickly shut down with, "please leave feedback here_____ and we will look at all concerns", with very little follow up. I can't speak for everyone but it began to feel that we were being dismissed.

I can understand some of the business decisions because, obviously, you do have a business you are growing. I get that. What I don't understand is where the creative content went. In the past you may have been charging too little for what you gave us (the creative content all the way up to AO3) but you did a complete 180 and started charging WAY too much for content that was inferior. I've seen people argue on the boards that creating more diverse dungeons would be cost prohibitive but I know beyond a doubt STS is making much more money than in the past, when the content was amazingly creative.

I think what you are seeing recently is negativity due to the feeling that we are being expected to pay money for what many feel is not great content. To take it a step further, many of us feel you are charging PL players obscene amounts of platinum in order to fund your other projects. This wouldn't be horrible if you were actually providing new content that was mind boggling but that hasn't been the case. Many of us who play PL are not interested in playing SL or DL so having to pay to fund the creation of games that don't interest us while watching our own beloved game become a cash cow/money drain is quite depressing.

Rather than getting defensive and feeling attacked I wish the devs could feel the amount of emotion people feel for this game. Honestly, how many games have players who would plead with the developers to listen to their complaints to help bring the game back to what it was rather than just bail? I know a lot of people have just left with their hands in the air but many of us are sticking it out and asking that you at least stop and hear where this frustration is coming from rather than going to the fall back, "we have to make money!" We get that. We don't refute that. But when making money usurps the quality of the game, the quality of game play and the decisions being made are obviously all based on how much more plat you can get people to spend I think the developers need to take a step back and ask themselves why they developed the game in the first place.

I worry that STS will either lose a ton of players and flounder. Or that they'll continue on the plat chase and not listen to the players and be happy being a game that consists of a revolving door of players who spend plat on ridiculousness and then leave. Great. You'll be making money. But you'll have lost the heart that so many of us felt when we first started playing. I can't believe you began PL with the sole intent of making dough or you wouldn't have been so involved initially. I'm still trying to figure out what happened--did you sell part of the company to a new firm who is demanding that these new changes take place or was I just imagining what I felt when I first started playing?

I won't be playing the WF this year, which is depressing because I really enjoyed last year's event. It was awesome and I met Drewcapu, a great buddy, playing those dungeons. I've chosen to not play the campaign because I feel that supporting your decision to charge 2 plat per run is just supporting the decline down a slippery slope of disaster. I'm starting to get less positive so I'll just leave you with one last point.

When you have a sea of old players who have consistently supported STS leaving I think that STS needs to stop for a moment and reflect on what that means.

Very well said, loved the last point especially. Great post Pandamoni.

[Decur]

It was a calculated risk. They knew there would be many people unhappy about this situation. You'd have to be naive to think otherwise. However, people continue to pay and eat it up. That's why there is no change and they continue to push the envelope.

[Elyseon]

It was a calculated risk. They knew there would be many people unhappy about this situation. You'd have to be naive to think otherwise. However, people continue to pay and eat it up. That's why there is no change and they continue to push the envelope.

Exactly, I guess they wanna kill the game and the community. And just be powered by mindless mass plat spenders

[Decur]

Exactly, I guess they wanna kill the game and the community. And just be powered by mindless mass plat spenders

As we have been remiminded so many times, it is a business and their primary objective is to earn money. Unfortunately, it's a double edged sword. By alienating the community, they run the risk of losing the very thing that made PL great. Of course, this is just my opinion...

[noobmigo]

First, I'd like to preface my post by saying I've typed two responses and deleted them both after sitting on them for hours. I found myself rambling and couldn't understand why and then I realized it's because I'm all over the place with how I feel about the direction of the game. I can't really address how I feel about the WF this year without touching on how I feel about the game.

When I first started playing PL I was impressed by the diversity between levels. I loved the creativity I saw and I had no idea what I'd see next. It was exciting and new and fun. It was enough to pull me in and hook me.

I have not spent money on video games, aside from exercise games for my Wii, in my adult life but when I hit level 13 I bought the main spine without hesitation. I was glad I bought it and I continued to buy the other maps in order to access the really cool content. I felt that my money was well spent and I couldn't believe that this great little game was so much fun.

I started perusing the forums in order to learn my skills. Because I'd never played a video game like this I had no idea what I was doing and wanted to learn how to allocate skill points, etc. I would browse the forums for hours reading guides, learning more about my character and learning how to be a better player. In the process I found a community that was thriving with active players who were full of advice and knowledge and a palpable love of the game.

I was also shocked to see the game developers actively participating in threads. What I felt was almost like a big family. I come from a very close family so seeing this mutual respect between the developers and players (and the players seemed like more than players--they were contributors to the game whose ideas were respected by the devs) made me feel all warm and fuzzy. I'd see Asommers in town talking to people, having fun, showing off his yeti costume or alien costume and it was just really cool.

Eventually, though, the devs became more distant and much less visible. Rather than seeing the team on the boards the collective voice of the devs was spoken through Samhayne. Concerns were quickly shut down with, "please leave feedback here_____ and we will look at all concerns", with very little follow up. I can't speak for everyone but it began to feel that we were being dismissed.

I can understand some of the business decisions because, obviously, you do have a business you are growing. I get that. What I don't understand is where the creative content went. In the past you may have been charging too little for what you gave us (the creative content all the way up to AO3) but you did a complete 180 and started charging WAY too much for content that was inferior. I've seen people argue on the boards that creating more diverse dungeons would be cost prohibitive but I know beyond a doubt STS is making much more money than in the past, when the content was amazingly creative.

I think what you are seeing recently is negativity due to the feeling that we are being expected to pay money for what many feel is not great content. To take it a step further, many of us feel you are charging PL players obscene amounts of platinum in order to fund your other projects. This wouldn't be horrible if you were actually providing new content that was mind boggling but that hasn't been the case. Many of us who play PL are not interested in playing SL or DL so having to pay to fund the creation of games that don't interest us while watching our own beloved game become a cash cow/money drain is quite depressing.

Rather than getting defensive and feeling attacked I wish the devs could feel the amount of emotion people feel for this game. Honestly, how many games have players who would plead with the developers to listen to their complaints to help bring the game back to what it was rather than just bail? I know a lot of people have just left with their hands in the air but many of us are sticking it out and asking that you at least stop and hear where this frustration is coming from rather than going to the fall back, "we have to make money!" We get that. We don't refute that. But when making money usurps the quality of the game, the quality of game play and the decisions being made are obviously all based on how much more plat you can get people to spend I think the developers need to take a step back and ask themselves why they developed the game in the first place.

I worry that STS will either lose a ton of players and flounder. Or that they'll continue on the plat chase and not listen to the players and be happy being a game that consists of a revolving door of players who spend plat on ridiculousness and then leave. Great. You'll be making money. But you'll have lost the heart that so many of us felt when we first started playing. I can't believe you began PL with the sole intent of making dough or you wouldn't have been so involved initially. I'm still trying to figure out what happened--did you sell part of the company to a new firm who is demanding that these new changes take place or was I just imagining what I felt when I first started playing?

I won't be playing the WF this year, which is depressing because I really enjoyed last year's event. It was awesome and I met Drewcapu, a great buddy, playing those dungeons. I've chosen to not play the campaign because I feel that supporting your decision to charge 2 plat per run is just supporting the decline down a slippery slope of disaster. I'm starting to get less positive so I'll just leave you with one last point.

When you have a sea of old players who have consistently supported STS leaving I think that STS needs to stop for a moment and reflect on what that means.

Panda, I'd like to say,
If you ever leave.
I'll miss ya.

Thanks for the great times, especially last summer.

[Moogerfooger]

Pandamoni, I won't pull a noobiemigo and quote your whole post but this is one of the best posts on the subject, and in general, I have seen in a long time.

[noobmigo]

Pandamoni, I won't pull a noobiemigo and quote your whole post but this is one of the best posts on the subject, and in general, I have seen in a long time.

Oopsies, habit.

[Moogerfooger]

Moogerfooger, notice I said "cost" implying there is a cost. I agree 100% with what you said. I'm only stating that when you are spending it won't cost too much. The main thing I hate is the concept itself. If it ever progreses further than this one instance, you can count me out.

Gotcha, thanks for clarifying. Looks like we have a general viewpoint in common, as well as being at Osan (I was there several years ago) in common.

[MightyMicah]

No problem, and you were at Osan? Awesome!