Concerning PvP (not again!)

[Caspi]

Hey guys, I have seen some great suggestions here, but for every good one there is an equally bad suggestion. I thought I could try compiling not only what I have gotten from the many threads I have read here in the past few days, but also what I myself have learned from exstensive online pvping. So sit back and enjoy!

So, first off, what will work and what won't?

I have seen many ridiculous claims that 30+ people could be hosted on the same server. Having some limited expirience in online programming, I can assure you, this is not easy to accomplish lag free with the various obsticles such as server locations, WiFi vs 3g, cross platforms, and many more other things I do not want to get into. But besides the technical limitations, there is the practicle side to trying to have massive games. If a guild of 10 people join for a 10v10, they would have to wait for another 10 players to join the opposite side. Because a queue system would be problematic, this waiting would most likely end up in griefing single enemies who join alone, until they leave the server. 10v0 again, with the guild having gotten a few kills.
One way to fix this would be automatic balancing, but that would not be as fun as getting to fight with your friends.

What I think WOULD work are small scale battles on maps designed for pvp. Small scale means 1v1-4v4, although I believe griefing like mentioned earlier may start in a 4v1 situation. But finding 4 friends is much faster than 10.


Joining a pvp game

I think that the server select that is being used right now is close to what we want. Map name, level range of players, ect. In pvp, it will be very important to put level caps on games. We do not want a level 30 joining a level 3 game. Once you join, you should propobly be given time to ready up. Get to full health ect, then press the big Start Pvp button that confirms that you are now killable\can get kills.

The maps

As I mentioned, brand new maps should be made. Old themes are ok, but these dungeons would not provide fast paced action we want in small games. Arena style maps would be preferable, with a circlular design so that combat is forced to be in the middle. A few tunnels is fine, but no mazes.

Mobs in PvP, nty

I have seen this work before, but the way Pocket Legends plays right now, I do not want to see it. You need to waste cooldowns on mobs depending on your class, and in PvP, everything helps. Mobs would also decrease the amount of other stuff such as players in the game. And it would make it extremly unfair to be having a 1v1 and then suddenly being attacked by a pack of mobs.

Looting, death, and rewards

Looting
No thanks. No player looting. This is not a hard core mmo that you are supposed to play for 20 hours a day to get thr best gear over and over, this is a relaxed mmo for iPhones that you take out when you have a moment of free time. If this was supposed to be the other way, it would be clear. Leveling would be slower and harder. No, no looting. Maybe a honor system where you get a point for killing a player, or some gold. We want to keep our items and actually pvp, not grind for new ones whenever we die. I've had to do this in previous games, it's no fun. Maybe it makes it more intense, but really, please don't add this.

So if no looting, what do you get? I suggest a player kill count, simular to K/D. (which should also be shown). In this system, whenever you get or assist in a kill you would receive 5 points, and when you die you loose 2 points. Every 1000 or so, you are awarded a new title. You should also unlock purchasable gear depending on your title/rank. If we are going for a skill based grind, the last few levels should only give 10 or so points per kill and take 20 or so per death. This way those who do want to play hardcore would get their title rewards. This would of course go with leaderboards. And these figures are just random, they propobly need a lot of changing.

Other things

Well, you will hate me for this, but disable potions in pvp. Spamming 100 of them in a 1v1 is no fun, and just makes it unfair. Also, classes need more survivability. Warriors can not do much while being nuked from far, and archers can not get away fast from a warrior standing next to them beating on them. Also, a pvp and pve spec would be nice. Different things will work in different game types, and no one wants to spend so much money just to respec every other game.
I also was going to mention death somewhere, but forgot. Aside from loosing the point that I mentioned in the explination on my pvp system, you would have to wait for a new round. I doubt small games would take long, so rounds seem necissary. And if it IS a big game, wait a while to respawn. And most importantly, loss of ego on your K/D


Well, that's all for now, thanks for reading! Typed on my iPhone so sorry if it's short or has many mistakes. Cheers!

[Odvar]

excellant post, well said!

[Flamin]

I think that in a pvp room box, players should be able to change the side that they are on, so that they all dont end up on the same side. And also the creater/host of the game should be able to kick players or there should be a vote kick system.
Caspi, check out the combatarms game, and the dungeons in the mabinogi game, then get some ideas from it, then just uninstall them cause they aren't very good compared to all the other mmorpg games out there, but they got some unique ideas in them. (no advirtizment intended/meant)

[Demarrer]

What happens when you die, besides receiving a death?

[Caspi]

I think that in a pvp room box, players should be able to change the side that they are on, so that they all dont end up on the same side. Caspi, check out the combatarms game, and the dungeons in the mabinogi game, then get some ideas from it, then just uninstall them cause they aren't very good compared to all the other mmorpg games out there, but they got some unique ideas in them. (no advirtizment intended/meant)

Well the sides would be randomized unless you join as a group, in which case you would all spawn in the same side (or if you exceed the team size, split up). And the point of the maps would be to be balanced, so that you don't care which side your on.

As for me checking out the games, I can tomorrow. I doubt it will help in the long run though, as much as I would like to help in map design I doubt that I could help much in that. Giving ideas seems to be the most we can do, which is fine by me.

[Caspi]

Demarrer, updated last pharagraph if your interested in death. =)

[Demarrer]

Demarrer, updated last pharagraph if your interested in death. =)

So their is really no penalty for death. Why can't I just be resurrected? Mages have that spell? There should be a goal to the PvP battles rather than just first to X kills. Maybe first to kill the boss or open a chest?

[Banned]

I'm not really digging the unlocking items stuff. But everything else is pretty awesome.

[Demarrer]

I'm not really digging the unlocking items stuff. But everything else is pretty awesome.

Wouldn't that make things unbalanced? The higher you get obviously the better items you would receive. That would make things unbalanced.

[Flamin]

When pvp comes out, then in game guilds need to come out to along with a need/greed/pass by class system. (just see my really long thread for more info about the looting system). And on the pvp,, there should be pvps where guilds can fight each other which would be called guild wars. And there should also be like a 5v5 pvp too. And even if players don't make stakes, then the winner should get a random item of her/his class and a little gold too. and also players could get pvp tokens that players can turn in at a vendor for items and stuff. There should be a pvp arena for all pvp, an and some vendors right outside. And if there is going to be a pvp system like this then the max level needs to be at least 40, and players should get 5 lives (maybe just 3) in a pvp. And also in the pvp request box there should be an option so that players can dicide whether not they want healing an buff skills allowed and other skills (like the mage's fire skill and lightning skill)

On the thread “PVP – The Game Changing Idea” I agree with most of it but I don't agree about a penalty for dying. And on the potions, players should have more health and armor, because right now, because dying should be more rare, and because currently if you don't use potions then you like in like 5 seconds when there is a big mob. And if only 3 regular enemies are attacking you, then you can still quite easily die.

There should be a healer class and assassin class, and all classes should have an extra skill slot for healing. And also the max rank on skills should be 10 instead of 5, so that players can be more better. (read my really long thread for more info about classes. And also read buvet's thread about healer class, and Suzume's thread about theif/rogue/assassin class, and SirDarkened and Dakkine threads about attributes.

Once players are changed to have more armor and health, then they should add in a fear of dying. Or something like that.
Reply by Demarrer: Like I said, PvP isn't being added in the current system we have now. It will be added probably when bugs are fixed, classes are balanced, and everything works sufficiently.
Reply by Flamin: Ya but I really hope it will come out sooner.

Here is the loot system idea:

I think on the looting system it should be reallyneed/need/greed/pass because:

really need= I need this item for the current character I'm playing on because I'm the right class and level, and I do not have this item, and this item is better than the one I currently have.
need= I need this item for a different one of my characters or I need this item because I want to try it out or if someone has told me if I give them this item they will give me a different item (which is an item i need)
greed= the only reason I would need this item is if I wanted to sell it, or trade it.
pass= Ill just let someone else have this item item because I dont really need it or want it.

About guilds:
Players should have to be a really high level and pay like $0.99 and about 6000 gold to make a guild, BECAUSE this way there won't be a million different guilds.

I think that these things (guilds, trading, and looting systems) should be released soon after, before, or with the pvp system.

[Flamin]

What happens when you die, besides receiving a death?

if you loose then pvp then you loose the items/gold/exp/etc... that you staked. but if you win the pvp you win the items/gold/exp/etc... that you staked.
I dont know how the winning stuff would work with 2v2 or more. could someone please suggest an idea for that.

[Banned]

Wouldn't that make things unbalanced? The higher you get obviously the better items you would receive. That would make things unbalanced.

Not really unbalanced, but kind of unfair for the guy who just doesn't enjoy PVP. And the fact that if I happen to have 2 iPods and 2 accounts I could just rape my mule a bunch of times and unlock the items.

[Flamin]

Well the sides would be randomized unless you join as a group, in which case you would all spawn in the same side (or if you exceed the team size, split up). And the point of the maps would be to be balanced, so that you don't care which side your on.

As for me checking out the games, I can tomorrow. I doubt it will help in the long run though, as much as I would like to help in map design I doubt that I could help much in that. Giving ideas seems to be the most we can do, which is fine by me.

I agree, but the host/creater of a game have an option to either allow players to be able to change the side that they are on. And also the creater/host of the game should be able to kick players or there should be a vote kick system.

[Demarrer]

Not really unbalanced, but kind of unfair for the guy who just doesn't enjoy PVP. And the fact that if I happen to have 2 iPods and 2 accounts I could just rape my mule a bunch of times and unlock the items.

This thought alone destroys the PvP reward system.

[Banned]

NO on the kick idea. It's frikin PVP dude.

[Shebee]

Excellent post.
I would prefer to see something similar to arenas, maybe 2v2s? up to 5v5s?
Sounds good for me, also great point in the player looting.

I would love to see some leader-boards, maybe able to register your pvp groups like you would register a guild in the future?
That way we could rank the groups instead of individual people?

[Demarrer]

if you loose then pvp then you loose the items/gold/exp/etc... that you staked. but if you win the pvp you win the items/gold/exp/etc... that you staked.
I dont know how the winning stuff would work with 2v2 or more. could someone please suggest an idea for that.

Why not receive items in pvp areas just like you would now? Except the mob is actually people, however when you die it is loot-able. Now in this case we still have loot, but you lose nothing you had before.

[Banned]

Excellent post.
I would prefer to see something similar to arenas, maybe 2v2s? up to 5v5s?
Sounds good for me, also great point in the player looting.

I would love to see some leader-boards, maybe able to register your pvp groups like you would register a guild in the future?
That way we could rank the groups instead of individual people?

Group ranking sounds alot better then individual ranking.

[Shebee]

Or instead of everything being messy award people with currency they can buy pvp rewards they actually need?
Simple as that.

[ddarko18]

so then people who pvp all day would have better items than people who just want to occasionally pvp? wasnt your complaint earlier about looting system that this is a casual game shebee?