Mage skill improvment

[warbluefish]

As a mage i feel some of the mage skills r really odd ATM.

Lifegiver. Compare to warrior and rogue heal skills . lifegiver is the weakest. it heals the least has long cool down. really 70% of mages health is not that much. not even enough for one aimed shot without crit and a couple hit from warrior. The mana heal is pure group support skill. it only recovers 10% of mages mana but almost full mana fo rogue and warriors. as other classes their puffing skill mostly benefit themselves. warriors heal and new VB gives much better group support.

suggestion . anyway it will heal most mana for the teammates why dont make it more powerful . make it can heal mages mana as 30%. Warriors has their vb and allow them dont use any pots. why cant mage?

Shield.

The shield is the most used deffensive skill for mage. its very useful. specially the 2 sec. its the only thing mages can protect being one shot killed. but 500 dmg protection is a bit low as current level in pvp and pve elite maps. i understand mages r for support. but sometimes there is no warrior in ur side and u have to tank. even with warriors sometime when team vs team. warrior want mages to through fireball first before they jump in. in both case its a suicide mission. after the 2 sec. the shield can only take a couple of shot from rogue and not even a full windmill.

suggestion.

pls make the shield observe more dmg and u can make it last shorter to make the balance. as currently the shield never last the full length before break.


Time shift.

Time shift is a very very good skill when pve. but mobs only. its useless when fight bosses. it doesnt snare or root the boss with the upgrade. as rogues trap is much suppior crowd control skill in pve.

and in pvp time shift is a bit odd. as warrior skyward and rogues piercer all can jump out the time shift effect area. and also u have to go near the the enemy to cast it. it is too risky for a little tiny blue guy. as use it purely for kiting . i feel it wasted a skill slot.

suggestion. i know it would b unfair to the elite bosses that rogue and mage all have the skill to snare them. but as most rogues r spec for pvp. not many of them r using trap. pls make time shift snare the elite boss. and in pvp maybe make the time shifts dmg release evenly during the whole effecting time. as it can do dmg even kiting. its useless when chasing others anyway.

Course.

i used course when i was lv16 and lv21. it seems worked well. but at lv26 iwe just cant see the different it makes in pve. lol.



Over all mages skills dont have much side effects as others. defensive skills just defensive. no.debuffing or dmg like blade shield. it feels a bit boring as all stun and push depend on luck.

[Genuinous]

Improve heal, yes
Improve shield, make it directly linked to your dmg, just like all the other skills
Improve time, no need imo, it's super strong on mobs and weak on bosses, good trade off there

[warbluefish]

lol. seems no one cares. thx Genuinous.

[Lady_Pebbles]

I like some of your ideas but I agree with Gen, TS is fine the way it is. Anymore changes to TS and it could make Mages OP in PvP & PvE so no thanks.

I also made some suggestions in Skills Upgrades Ideas thread.Heres the section of Mage Skill upgrades I have on the thread:

| MAGES |

- Skill Tweaks w/Reflect DMG & Leech? -
Shield has a longer CD now (30secs). However, even with the sub skill to raise the damage absorbed it still breaks easily so it needs a little something to make it more useful as a skill. Perhaps adding an ability to reflect about 5-10% -dmg- back to the opponent for 2secs would do the trick to compensate for the longer CD?

Tweak Heal a bit, the extended range isn't as useful as an ability to up their survivability rates imo. So replace the range upgrade on the skill (its initial range is wide enough) with a "leech" type of ability, where the caster will drain 2-3% of their opponent's health. Lets say its casted in the middle of a mob (pvp or pve), it would only drain a total amount of 2-3% from the entire mob not from each one individually. Maybe the caster's team mates (who are within range) can also benefit from it as well.

Let me know what yall think! Theres more talk on the thread about other Mage skills like Curse and Lightning too.

[earhole]

Shield should be a mana shield type of thing. 60% of the damage deflects to your mana instead of health.

[warbluefish]

Great. we keep this going. Everyone shares the ideas.

Lady i like u ideas. lol i agree with u about TS. just feel petty such a good pve skill doesnt do much in pvp.

Maybe we just hope that they will give us a load up button for different build.

[Excuses]

IMO, Heal and shield is working good. Warrior's Jugg has 500 dmg covers only, HOR heal as it's dmg output(Of cause multiple time tho cuz they are TANK) too, but we are the only one who can actually heal mana. Even every party of us. Only think I don't understand is getting aggro after mana heal. Skill doesn't say anything about taunt, it should NOT taunt like it does now.

The real problem mage have is that it's skills are not working as described.

For Time Shift, I do think it has to ROOT, not just snare because warriors can jump out with SS, rogues can run out with Piercer. And you know what? Longest attack range of mage is 14m of Forst bolt, But Warrior's Axe throw and Rogue's Piercer are 16m. And it's not stun, ROOT. they can get out with a skill, still attack from it. while we drop it rogue can 1 shot kill with AS, warrior can pull us in(AT) or jump out(SS) and windmill to snare and kill us. It's not fair that we don't get what it is supposed to do with a skill point.
Just TS should snare, Charge TS with Freeze time upgraded should ROOT as it is made.

And Frost Bolt, too. It should freeze(stun) them as it is made. not slowing down only. it's cool down is 3 sec, so 1-2 sec of freeze will be reasonable. but still need to FREEZE.
And Ice wielder upgraded charged attack should freeze 'enemies around target' as the skill describes.

Fire ball should not stun if it is not upgraded with Impact(Knocked down and briefly stunned) and charged.
Lightning Strike too. if Shock is updated and charge, we should have 25% chance of stun for 3 sec.(3 sec is good because it is only 25% chance)
And I think these two are working. But TS and Ice, they need to be changed.



I think we are weak not because of lack of dmg or heal ability, but because our skill is not working as it is made. Why is this happening to mage only?
I don't see any skills that is not working as it is described in pvp on other classes.
This is NEVER going to make us OP, because, Rogue will still 1 or 2 shot kill us if they have a chance, we can't stun warriors with Jugg.
Mages' skill dmg output is about 200-300(thunder with crit never make even 1k), it will still take forever to kill a warrior, and even rogue is hard because they dodge like crazy.
It's not supposed to be just a dmg game, but strategy game with skills of each classes. Especially for mage.


Mage do need our skills working properly to have enough time to do enough dmg.
Well. I am not asking something too mush. Just make it work as YOU STS says on skill description.
That's it.



-------------- edit


And I do think mage need to better dmg than warrior. Not like rogue but slightly better. Right now it's same or less.

[Lady_Pebbles]

Devs fixed those skills a while back so they work differently in PvP. The description is strictly for PvE & work as intented.

I.e. In PvP Fire doesn't stun (they nerfed our stun) but the DOT works. Frost doesn't freeze, it slows. TS doesn't root, it snares.

Also, damage was nerfed for all classes in PvP in an attempt to help with balance issues... Among other changes listed on patch notes.

[Excuses]

Devs fixed those skills a while back so they work differently in PvP. The description is strictly for PvE & work as intented.

I.e. In PvP Fire doesn't stun (they nerfed our stun) but the DOT works. Frost doesn't freeze, it slows. TS doesn't root, it snares.

Also, damage was nerfed for all classes in PvP in an attempt to help with balance issues... Among other changes listed on patch notes.

That's exactly what I am saying.
Other classes' skills work SAME in pve and pvp. Why only mages' different?
It is supposed to work as it is made in pvp too.

Fire ball stun like 1 sec only, I think. But ice need to freeze, Time need to root too. That's what I think FAIR.


And for dmg, they nerf all class, but warrior got back little bit and axe throw became a serious skill against rogue and mage(it even make more dmg than SS), and rogue still do 1 shot kill. But mage got little more dmg on fire and time only. Anyone feels any difference?

Don't get me wrong. I have all three classes, all lv26 with all lv26 weapons and armors. I enjoy and play with them all.
I do think warrior need a little more dmg or amrors up to 1500 for better tanking too.

However, I do think STS discriminate mage somehow. Mages deserve better skills since we help other party!!!

[Lady_Pebbles]

I agree Mages are underpowered and squishie so we have to adapt to the conditions set for us. Some of us can adapt pretty well and others can't.

I play all three classes as well but mainly on my Mage. Its a challenge and hella fun! Thing is, if we get back our stun AND able to freeze opponents in PvP, we'd be hella OPed. Literally stun, freeze, lightning (or ts, or another skill) and repeat. It would be just like in PvE where we control the mobs and pwn. I think Frost is fine the way it is in PvP but would like stun back on Fire (as long as there is no way to stun lock again). However, with pets being able to stun constantly (Colton, Clyde, George etc.) there really is no need for it anymore imo. Theres ways to adjust to it.

I agree though the Warrior's skills need to be tweaked. Especially Axe Throw's long range (16m), cut it by at least 5. They shouldn't have longer range than a Rogue or Mage. Plus the short 7s cool down should be doubled to at least 14 or even 15sec like some of the skills Roggues and Mages have. Sure they got some skills with 3sec CDs but they don't have those types of upgrades on them either! Frost and Lightning don't really stun & slow! They have a -chance- to stun & freeze not automatic stuns & slow. Increase dmg on critical is on Fire and not LIghtning or Frost... Its just too much on that skill. A small but justified nerf is all thats needed. Or a way to escape/counter the throw/pull would be nice (other than just attackib and hoping our pets stun them while we are pulled).

[Excuses]

I think it's never gonna make us OP but make it fair because of our weak dmg.

1 sec stun from fire and ice is gonna just give us more chance to kite. Lightning has only 25% and time has root, not stun.
It's not gonna make them stun forever but give opponents a couple of secs to attack.
Bit like I said mage have shortest range attack. So we need to be in their attack range to attack too. This is pretty fair situation. (So I don't agree to nerf axe throw. It's only range attack of warrior. I don't know how long it removes crit, as long as cool time is shorter than it, it will be fine because now rogue does 1500 to 3000 dmg on crit for each AS)

I do love mag too. Only mage have all 26 lvl ring and necklace. (lol)
Like you said some adopted well, but I think generally it need to be improved.
Naturally warrior can heal and stay alive long, and rogue can do +1k or much more dmg. What for mage? Putting all 3000 mana on waarrior doesn't work, and rogue kill mage 1 or 2 shot. What we need is better STUN to stack up our dmg on them.
If STS is looking for class balance this should be considered.

[Lady_Pebbles]

It«ll just be another way to stun lock opponents. Colton auto stuns, clyde also stuns, and even George's arcane stuns literally all the time (its on the description lol). This will make Mages OP in that sense. We would be able to trap toons in a stun lock until they die. Its just as bad as a one hit kill from a Rogue. No bueno. :\

[vholt]

It«ll just be another way to stun lock opponents. Colton auto stuns, clyde also stuns, and even George's arcane stuns literally all the time (its on the description lol). This will make Mages OP in that sense. We would be able to trap toons in a stun lock until they die. Its just as bad as a one hit kill from a Rogue. No bueno. :\

Isnt that the point? Rogue's have aim shot, warriors have everything >.> why can't sorcs at least have a bit more stun? It's our one advantage and it wouldnt make us op at all. Sorcs have low hp and armor, imo sorcs are the fastest to die. If a rogue can aim shot, nox bolt, pierce combo in like 2 seconds, why cant a sorc have the ability to stunlock and yet take about 5-10 seconds to kill a rogue still. If a sorc is caught on cooldown, or low on mana, he is managable, like a rogue who is low on mana. People can find and adapt around stunlocks, like how sorcs had to learn to deal with aimshot. A good sorc could dominate in 1v1, yet good warriors, and good rogues can too. However, stunlock won't make them o.p. in 1v3 or even 5v5, because you can't stunlock 3 guys at the same time. So, i think it would be fair. All STS has to worry about is how long the stun would last.

[Bootydots]

It really bothers me that a warrior has a sorc's heal and shield pretty much combined in 1 attack, while we wud be forced to use half of our skills to even have some sorta survivability, then that leaves us with 2 offensive attacks which isnt even close to good enuff to kill a warr. I really could go on and on about the disadvantages of picking a sorcerer if you are into pvp'ing. if anyone disagrees please dont hesitate to tell me a sorc's strong point... oh and goodluck with this BTW. I have never seen such imbalances as bad as this on any previous MMO iv'e played, Flat-out terrible to be honest...

[Excuses]

Thanks vholt.

That was what I was going to say.
Pets with stun ability mean every clsss can stun now.

And that's why I ask little more dmg on mage too. Becasue everyone can stun like mage, and mage has no advantage.

If we make 300 average dmg for each skills, it will take more than 10 skills to kill a warrior and rogue, if they heal or dodge, maybe 15-20 skills. It takes literally more than 30 sec while rogue can 1 or 2 shot kill(AS + Piercer + maybe another AS). I don't think it's too much to ask to bring back our skill for a couple of secs to stun.

Now rogues are toooo strong. It will never make us OP.

[Cero]

IMO, Heal and shield is working good. Warrior's Jugg has 500 dmg covers only, HOR heal as it's dmg output(Of cause multiple time tho cuz they are TANK) too, but we are the only one who can actually heal mana. Even every party of us. Only think I don't understand is getting aggro after mana heal. Skill doesn't say anything about taunt, it should NOT taunt like it does now.

The real problem mage have is that it's skills are not working as described.

For Time Shift, I do think it has to ROOT, not just snare because warriors can jump out with SS, rogues can run out with Piercer. And you know what? Longest attack range of mage is 14m of Forst bolt, But Warrior's Axe throw and Rogue's Piercer are 16m. And it's not stun, ROOT. they can get out with a skill, still attack from it. while we drop it rogue can 1 shot kill with AS, warrior can pull us in(AT) or jump out(SS) and windmill to snare and kill us. It's not fair that we don't get what it is supposed to do with a skill point.
Just TS should snare, Charge TS with Freeze time upgraded should ROOT as it is made.

And Frost Bolt, too. It should freeze(stun) them as it is made. not slowing down only. it's cool down is 3 sec, so 1-2 sec of freeze will be reasonable. but still need to FREEZE.
And Ice wielder upgraded charged attack should freeze 'enemies around target' as the skill describes.

Fire ball should not stun if it is not upgraded with Impact(Knocked down and briefly stunned) and charged.
Lightning Strike too. if Shock is updated and charge, we should have 25% chance of stun for 3 sec.(3 sec is good because it is only 25% chance)
And I think these two are working. But TS and Ice, they need to be changed.



I think we are weak not because of lack of dmg or heal ability, but because our skill is not working as it is made. Why is this happening to mage only?
I don't see any skills that is not working as it is described in pvp on other classes.
This is NEVER going to make us OP, because, Rogue will still 1 or 2 shot kill us if they have a chance, we can't stun warriors with Jugg.
Mages' skill dmg output is about 200-300(thunder with crit never make even 1k), it will still take forever to kill a warrior, and even rogue is hard because they dodge like crazy.
It's not supposed to be just a dmg game, but strategy game with skills of each classes. Especially for mage.


Mage do need our skills working properly to have enough time to do enough dmg.
Well. I am not asking something too mush. Just make it work as YOU STS says on skill description.
That's it.



-------------- edit


And I do think mage need to better dmg than warrior. Not like rogue but slightly better. Right now it's same or less.

arcane shield burst after 500dmg absorbtion.
vengefull blood got an update which replinish mana to anyone who is attacked by someone who got vengefull debuff.

[Lady_Pebbles]

Its no secret those skills need a boost and hell even Curse needs to be improved. The stun on Lightning needs better chances to stun and AOE even in PvE. Fire's stun can stay as is but just make it so we can't stun lock anyone. It'll be way too easy & unfair imo... Imagine Colton or Clyde plus Fire stunning all the time. Smh. No bueno.

I hope they finally listen and cook up some good changes for the Mages skills.

[Excuses]

arcane shield burst after 500dmg absorbtion.
vengefull blood got an update which replinish mana to anyone who is attacked by someone who got vengefull debuff.

Jugg covers 500 only too. I don't get what's your point. Of course jugg is better cuz it has 20% dmg reduction. Just saying similar limitation of other class skills.

But if we can stun properly, we don't have to improve our heal or shield skill.
And even with stun pets, 1 sec stun is never gonna make us OP IMO.
Like I said, other classes do have skills to overcome it already.
We were OP with stun when rogue has about 1200 health and 1k dmg, and Jugg of warrior doesn't block stun.
Now situation is changed. We do need more stun now.


And oh yes. You are right. Veng does it too now. Hard to use tho. But still Lifegiver heals more mana (almost full of most other class) and easier to apply. Thanks for the correction.

[Linkincena]

Post this reply in Bugs forum so that Developers read it. It is correct.

[vholt]

I really agree with skills working like how they should. No skill needs a buff or a nerf, they are fine on paper. But when timeshift doesnt root, and when frost bolt doesnt freeze, you are taking away from sorcs what made them special. Sorcs are significant for their huge mana pools in which they can use their awesome skills without dismay. Of course, if a sorc is gonna have a lot of mana to blow, you need some awesome skills to blow it on. I love playing sorc because they get AoE, DoT, Freeze, all of these being unique abilities because sorcs are all about skills. This is the sorc's strong point. They have incredibly low armor, and hp. They couldn't crit without winning the lottery first, and dodging is not even an option. Why? Because warriors take the armor and health department, thats what they're there for. They won't have problems surviving. Rogues? They can stack their crit to dependable amounts, and forget hp when they can get their dodge over 50%. But what makes them survive is the ability to kill before they be killed. That dps right? However what about sorcs? Kiting? Is that even possible with Warriors throwing axes that can reach the moon and rogues dashing to you at the speed of light? Oh well, it's ok because we got an awesome clock that can root enemies and stop them in their tracks. Right? Well, not for pvp. But don't worry we can freeze enemies... Nvm.. But we can stun with a fireball. And that is all we have. The only advantage we have over other classes is the dependable fireball that every sorc has to use. For means of our survivability. So why strip away from a sorc what makes up a sorc? If you gotta take away our awesome abilities but keep our mana pool, might as well take away warriors armor but keep their health. Or keep rogues aim shot but take away their crit. Are we going to be too OP? Weren't rogues op because of aim shot? Weren't warriors op because of windmil? Well, if sorcs get stunlock we can all be op now then :P But that's not the point. Skills doing what they say = Good. You know what im saying? I hope so, this took a long time to type.