Decline in quality of PvP

[Seminole]

Hmm I agree that it does ultimately come to down to money in the end. If I had a wife and kids to feed, I'd probably be investing in AL as well. But do you really think that the sole reason for PL decline are the vanities at end game? Don't get me wrong. I don't have the vanities either and I know about the disadvantage that you speak of. However, I don't know if this is the single thing that has brought PL down.

Well their are many speculations and arguments about what brought this game down. There is no question that this is a huge contributing factor. Look at it from any standpoint. Even if you dont know about the bonus until you reach end-game, it will deter you from leveling another toon. Its just to long of a wait for the next level caps. Without enough content to keep us occupied, who will wait that long? I cant see why sts doesnt put side missions(example-acquire 500,000-1,000,000 exp for all three vanities) without having to wait. Can you imagine how much revenue that would bring?? I would be leveling up a wolf and rhino right now full elixers. If only STS was smart, this game could be a gold mine. Thus bringing more attention to this game. Heck, make me manager, as young as i am i can bring quick easy fixes to a dead game just by listening to the community.

[MightyMicah]

Well their are many speculations and arguments about what brought this game down. There is no question that this is a huge contributing factor. Look at it from any standpoint. Even if you dont know about the bonus until you reach end-game, it will deter you from leveling another toon. Its just to long of a wait for the next level caps. Without enough content to keep us occupied, who will wait that long? I cant see why sts doesnt put side missions(example-acquire 500,000-1,000,000 exp for all three vanities) without having to wait. Can you imagine how much revenue that would bring?? I would be leveling up a wolf and rhino right now full elixers. If only STS was smart, this game could be a gold mine. Thus bringing more attention to this game. Heck, make me manager, as young as i am i can bring quick easy fixes to a dead game just by listening to the community.

Good thoughts! I think listening to the community is key.

[Zeus]

Nope, that's not my tone at all, my tone is pretty much basic, I want logical to the point and constructive debate. I said you're pointless, when you try to point out what I do, what are my in game situation etc, is that matter? Or is it not pointless?

Again you mentioned, where I belongs to in real life? Really is that matter, if I'd belong to alaska, so mages could not fire me? O.o

You said I made mistake, prove it please.

Sorry if it sound like I'm rude nope. I'm cool minded your behaviour is gentle most of the time, I appricieate that.

You said it yourself - its pointless to argue. I laid out the facts for you and seriously tried to show you that a paladin should not be difficult for a bird at all. Unfortunately, even after laying out the facts and my reasoning behind it, you're still adamant that paladins are OP.

If you want to hold true to your opinion, that's fine. I completely respect that, believe me. However, if you meet me in game, I'd love to show you a demonstration of a bird being able to kill a paladin with relative ease.

[XghostzX]

You said it yourself - its pointless to argue. I laid out the facts for you and seriously tried to show you that a paladin should not be difficult for a bird at all. Unfortunately, even after laying out the facts and my reasoning behind it, you're still adamant that paladins are OP.

If you want to hold true to your opinion, that's fine. I completely respect that, believe me. However, if you meet me in game, I'd love to show you a demonstration of a bird being able to kill a paladin with relative ease.

Nerd-rage! Nerd-rage!

Silly Parth :P

[Caiahar]

^ lol will.

[Zerious]

Nerd-rage! Nerd-rage!

Silly Parth :P

This? the fuuuh?

[Waug]

You said it yourself - its pointless to argue. I laid out the facts for you and seriously tried to show you that a paladin should not be difficult for a bird at all. Unfortunately, even after laying out the facts and my reasoning behind it, you're still adamant that paladins are OP.

If you want to hold true to your opinion, that's fine. I completely respect that, believe me. However, if you meet me in game, I'd love to show you a demonstration of a bird being able to kill a paladin with relative ease.

Sorry Apollo, whatever you're saying (repeating), I never said that please read my posts.

Where I said pallies are problem for me? Show me/quote me.

Just arguing with you, isn't pointless, I explained 2-3 times, may I quote that again?

You didn't (so should I say could not) criticize my logical facts that I stated about this matter. Quote it please.

Again to summarize, I don't face problem against any class at any level.

Yes, I feel it unbalanced when a str class with shield do that much immense damage when this class literally one hit kill a full crafted set + elite ring + elite bow bird. (read my earlier post for more clarifications, that I didn't mention here)

In opposite, being str any class should tank more and damage less. That's what it meant to be, and this is against basic game mechanism.

Above all, it's not about me or you. It's not about mages or birds, it's about PVP balance

If you think, you can reveal some unknown game mechanics that can change our thinkings toward this matter, then do it, everybody will be glad to hear it from you.

[Jig]

Annnnnnnnnnddd thread locked..

Gf noobs

[Zerious]

not yet lolol

[Jig]

Btw before this gets locked passive skills would help fix the op skills .. Maybe they already have that planned if not well dam... They have it in all there 2 latest games so it's possible..?

[dudetus]

Funny nerds with their nerd rage!

[Extreme]

Nerd Shield instead Of MS

[Not Nick41324]

Awesome 3 posts, Nick?...

I heard nick41324 still stalks the forums. Pfff... Only god knows what his new forum name is.

[Jig]

^^^^^ O.O

Creepy 3 posts you have there "Not Nick41324"

[dudetus]

I wonder who Not Nick41324 is. His name tells us no clue about his true identity.

[Zerious]

I wonder who Not Nick41324 is. His name tells us no clue about his true identity.

even though i detect sarcasm it's true

[WhoIsThis]

Issuing ideas is one thing, but it sounds like you're talking on a whole next level. They haven't needed those things in the past, and they don't need those things for AL. Proof they only need to put in some effort, they don't need people laying out their work for them. They know the mechanics, from every aspect, we don't. As players I think we're capable of giving ideas and suggestions, but not capable of what it sounds like you're talking. I personally don't think a good explanation as to why STS isn't trying these things is because we're not going Physio style and laying out all the numbers and mechanics. As I said, they haven't needed that in the past.

Just my opinion. Even if we laid it out, they'd still need effort and to test it. They're not gonna trust "volunteer" players to test it lol. If they don't have the effort to try finding a solution with their absolute understanding of the game and their mechanics, they won't have the effort to try and implement our laid out numbers. Or am I misinterpreting what you're saying we should do?

Okay this is my first post in 7 months but here goes:

There isn't the playerbase of veteran PvPers left to do something like this. We're gone ... most of us anyways.

In 2011, at around level 61, I did make a general post addressing these issues:
http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...-from-the-past

I could update and create a new thread based on the outcome of the 66 sets, but there does not seem to be the demand that there once was.

At the time, it was ignored, although the 66 level (at least before Angel and the other gear was released) was acceptably balanced (I do feel that the dex sets needed a slight buff). Then the Angel sets threw everything right out the window. But it did give most players what they wanted - an easy set that with elixirs meant OP PvE domination.

For PvPers, it led to the complete removal of a skill cap. The reason - as was indicated here, luck-based PvP. To be honest, I suspect that in many ways, it's what the majority of the "Mynas generation" would have wanted as well. The reason being, well, becoming good at PvP in PL, whether it was tweaking or endgame required a lot of practice and careful tuning. It's like everything else in life - to be good at something that commands respect, something worth doing, it requires effort. For example, how many times did twinkers spend a bit of platinum to modify their builds to get a slight benefit? The problem is of course, newer PvPers did not want to put in the effort and thousands of kills/deaths that it takes to become truly good at something. In that regard, these "luck" based sets are merely answering the wishes of a large portion of the PL playerbase.

I do not believe however that this was STS' intention, but it was the end result. Of course, such a short term focus does have long term consequences - namely the attrition of the core player base. To be more specific, the problem isn't that the core playerbase is leaving (that happens with time), it's that no new players stepped up to replace that core. You do not for example, see a new generation of Ellyidols, Physiologics, etc nor a new generation of high end PvPers. An oldie would understand. Although core players only represent a small percentage of a playerbase, in any game, I do find that they have a disproportionate impact on the outcome of a game. I should also mention that quite a few people I knew appear to have been banned since I left - many of these were prominent people on the forums and in the PL community so the impact would have been substantial.

A while back, I also wrote another thread, noting that if STS continued on their current path, it would lead to the long term decline of PL. Well - I would argue that has happened. I think that STS knows this as well, and hence, the almost complete abandonment of PL and the re-focus of pretty much all efforts on AL. Eventually, I suspect it will happen to AL as well, at which point a new game will have to take over.

Edit:
If there is demand for it, I could put together a thread making recommendations on how a PL "revival" could occur, although I highly doubt it will be acted upon.

[Noi`ya]

If there is demand for it, I could put together a thread making recommendations on how a PL "revival" could occur, although I highly doubt it will be acted upon.

i hope u will!

[dudetus]

Okay this is my first post in 7 months but here goes:

There isn't the playerbase of veteran PvPers left to do something like this. We're gone ... most of us anyways.

In 2011, at around level 61, I did make a general post addressing these issues:
http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...-from-the-past

I could update and create a new thread based on the outcome of the 66 sets, but there does not seem to be the demand that there once was.

At the time, it was ignored, although the 66 level (at least before Angel and the other gear was released) was acceptably balanced (I do feel that the dex sets needed a slight buff). Then the Angel sets threw everything right out the window. But it did give most players what they wanted - an easy set that with elixirs meant OP PvE domination.

For PvPers, it led to the complete removal of a skill cap. The reason - as was indicated here, luck-based PvP. To be honest, I suspect that in many ways, it's what the majority of the "Mynas generation" would have wanted as well. The reason being, well, becoming good at PvP in PL, whether it was tweaking or endgame required a lot of practice and careful tuning. It's like everything else in life - to be good at something that commands respect, something worth doing, it requires effort. For example, how many times did twinkers spend a bit of platinum to modify their builds to get a slight benefit? The problem is of course, newer PvPers did not want to put in the effort and thousands of kills/deaths that it takes to become truly good at something. In that regard, these "luck" based sets are merely answering the wishes of a large portion of the PL playerbase.

I do not believe however that this was STS' intention, but it was the end result. Of course, such a short term focus does have long term consequences - namely the attrition of the core player base. To be more specific, the problem isn't that the core playerbase is leaving (that happens with time), it's that no new players stepped up to replace that core. You do not for example, see a new generation of Ellyidols, Physiologics, etc nor a new generation of high end PvPers. An oldie would understand. Although core players only represent a small percentage of a playerbase, in any game, I do find that they have a disproportionate impact on the outcome of a game. I should also mention that quite a few people I knew appear to have been banned since I left - many of these were prominent people on the forums and in the PL community so the impact would have been substantial.

A while back, I also wrote another thread, noting that if STS continued on their current path, it would lead to the long term decline of PL. Well - I would argue that has happened. I think that STS knows this as well, and hence, the almost complete abandonment of PL and the re-focus of pretty much all efforts on AL. Eventually, I suspect it will happen to AL as well, at which point a new game will have to take over.

Edit:
If there is demand for it, I could put together a thread making recommendations on how a PL "revival" could occur, although I highly doubt it will be acted upon.

D: !

I myself suspect that I speak for many other forum members as I think we all would greatly appreciate ur input and insight on the matter.

[CrimsonTider]

i hope u will!

Parth and Will have made similar threads dealing with both PvE and PvP and what needs to be focused on. All we can do is wait for the next update and see if the hundreds of suggestions threads will be listened to.