Are we hitting a cap on percent based buffs?

[eeknoh]

I lol @ the fact they -still- can't get it to show on stats page. I'm sorry but a bug like that existing for how long? As long as ive been plying thats for sure.. Is funny to me. I'm sure theyre able to fix it. I just don't know why they havent.. Perhaps its not that important in their eyes. But 90% of players care about knowjng their actual stats.

I /cry at the fact my damage passive ive used since day 1 has always been 5 wasted points.. I did the research and what I read caused me to assume it would be stacking. Actually my assumption was that the 5% was calculated and added to the damage stat before anything else it just didnt show. I would personally then take that # and add any other % after. I always assumed this capped at 30%. I keep saying assume because stg has made an *** out of u and me...and while I feel slighted to a small degree, I should know better. And i made the mistake of not asking exact questions to get exact clarification on how this works.. On the other hand..

Shouldnt there be a sticky somewhere that gives GREAT detail about how any and all % increases/decreases work in arcane legend? Come on guys.. These questions pop up constantly. Some programmer that deals with this needs to plop down, pop a bag of cheetohs, and get to typing out this info jn GREAT VERY CLEAR DETAIL....please. And thank you.

[GoodSyntax]

Glitched or not they should have said something sooner but all we heard was they don't show up on the stats page but they are working. See this well known thread:

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...hlight=passive



They could have mentioned you only get the highest modifier. There were so many threads on this but we were repeatedly told its all working. Well the devil is in the details and we should have been told when we were not getting it. I can't say I was too effected by this because I only spec'd passive damage in PvE, and used those points for crit in PvP. But like others I tested this without a pet so it was easier to quantify the damage increase. And this was a flaw in the testing. And if others tested it with a pet and that pet may not have given a damage boost. So this is something which should have been clarified.

As some of you know, I am a programmer myself, and I manage several software packages. One of my software suites has over 2.1 million lines of code on the client application, over 4 million lines of code on the database end, plus another 0.75 million lines of code in web services and system services. There are a lot of moving pieces that make up a piece of software. The more complicated the software, the less likely it will be that any one person will be able to tell you with 100% certainty how it all works together.

The best any development team can do is create test cases that test each independent scenario. I can easily see how this situation can develop, because individually, each test passes as expected. It isn't until you start mixing differing scenarios that your test cases can break down. No one in their right mind would write a test script to validate a 5/5 DMG passive plus a 10% DMG Bonus from a Pet, on top of a 15% bonus from Shadow Veil, a 2.5% bonus from an Archon ring and a 25% DMG Elixir. There are far too many variables to account for in that test case for it to correctly break down into a pass/fail condition.

The assumption would be that individually each scenario has been tested and validated, and it is inappropriate to test in all possible combinations. Conditions such as these fall through the cracks all the time in software development, so now that it has been identified, I'm sure STS will do something about it in their next client update.

[Anarchial]

1) If you use Abaddon 15% damage + 5% passive damage, you only get 15%. The damage passive is useless.
2) Archon Ring of Potency which gives +2.5% armor shows up on the stats page. So it works difference, so it doesn't negate the durable passive or vice versa.

I dont think 2.5% armor of archon works even if it shows in stats. I say this because the archon ring dmg version also shows +2.5% increase in dmg in stat screen but initial testing by Serancha did suggest that it does nothing. And since null_and_void already said that armor and dmg both work in the same way it is safe to assume that the buff of armor version of archon ring is rendered useless if u have 5% armor passive

[Kakashis]

I just hope STS addresses this lack of damage stacking in future updates. Abbadon is actually quite good after finding out all this out. It changes the dynamics of game play as well! No point standing in Veil to get extra damage if its going to just match your pet damage.

[falmear]

As some of you know, I am a programmer myself, and I manage several software packages. One of my software suites has over 2.1 million lines of code on the client application, over 4 million lines of code on the database end, plus another 0.75 million lines of code in web services and system services. There are a lot of moving pieces that make up a piece of software. The more complicated the software, the less likely it will be that any one person will be able to tell you with 100% certainty how it all works together.

The best any development team can do is create test cases that test each independent scenario. I can easily see how this situation can develop, because individually, each test passes as expected. It isn't until you start mixing differing scenarios that your test cases can break down. No one in their right mind would write a test script to validate a 5/5 DMG passive plus a 10% DMG Bonus from a Pet, on top of a 15% bonus from Shadow Veil, a 2.5% bonus from an Archon ring and a 25% DMG Elixir. There are far too many variables to account for in that test case for it to correctly break down into a pass/fail condition.

The assumption would be that individually each scenario has been tested and validated, and it is inappropriate to test in all possible combinations. Conditions such as these fall through the cracks all the time in software development, so now that it has been identified, I'm sure STS will do something about it in their next client update.

This is a documentation issue not a software bug. They probably knew this is how it worked from the beginning. And didn't reveal it to us until they had to.

[Serancha]

The code was built in this game for layered buffs. The proof in this is how the key functionality of the game is set up and marketed for stacking of luck elixirs and xp elixirs. It is impossible to believe that they "forgot" to put the code in, or to discuss how to accomodate for layered damage buffs as well. If nobody was thinking about it, archon rings would never have been developed. Their main attribute is % damage addition (for a certain variety).

I can't see anyone believing that the development team did not consider how archon damage would mix with damage elixirs and pet % damage. Or when pets come out with % damage buffs, that nobody even thinks "hey how does this work with passives" etc. The development in this game is not sloppy, and the devs are extremely intelligent. This is not something they would miss.

At some point it had to have been conciously decided how they were going to implement these multi-leveled buffs, of all types. This is shown in how they made luck and xp stack. There is no way around it, there was a choice made to make the damage buffs act this specific way. Keeping game mechanics secret is part of the fun. The problem here is that they were selling products by completely misleading the public as to what the items (elixirs) actually did.

[aspire]

If i use dmg elixir and some pet skill which should give dmg, like scorn,does they stack?
Or how about shadow veil and dmg elixir? Or veil and pet skill?
Last, aimed shot accuracy add? Does it happens if i have dmg elixir on

[falmear]

The code was built in this game for layered buffs. The proof in this is how the key functionality of the game is set up and marketed for stacking of luck elixirs and xp elixirs. It is impossible to believe that they "forgot" to put the code in, or to discuss how to accomodate for layered damage buffs as well. If nobody was thinking about it, archon rings would never have been developed. Their main attribute is % damage addition (for a certain variety).

I can't see anyone believing that the development team did not consider how archon damage would mix with damage elixirs and pet % damage. Or when pets come out with % damage buffs, that nobody even thinks "hey how does this work with passives" etc. The development in this game is not sloppy, and the devs are extremely intelligent. This is not something they would miss.

At some point it had to have been conciously decided how they were going to implement these multi-leveled buffs, of all types. This is shown in how they made luck and xp stack. There is no way around it, there was a choice made to make the damage buffs act this specific way. Keeping game mechanics secret is part of the fun. The problem here is that they were selling products by completely misleading the public as to what the items (elixirs) actually did.

Some pets that give damage buff are Flouder (5%), Cinder (5%), Bop-bop (10%), Timber (5%), Esteban (10%). This is just to name a few and these are all S1 pets. I find it hard to believe that they didn't know that the higher buff is the one which went into effect and these buffs don't stack. I don't care how it is, I just want to know how it works. Anyways, I am glad we now know but they should not have waited so long to tell us. Specifically because people were complaining that these buffs did not show up on the stats page and we were repeatedly re-assured they were in effect when in realty they were not.

[deathwraithx]

Does this also imply that shadowlurks AA and arcane don't stack? :/

Sent from my Xperia U using Tapatalk 4

[Limsi]

I've been using Singe + dmg lix + shadow veil = Zomg.

Props to Kalizza and the rest of the gang who are following this intensive research!

[Zeus]

As some of you know, I am a programmer myself, and I manage several software packages. One of my software suites has over 2.1 million lines of code on the client application, over 4 million lines of code on the database end, plus another 0.75 million lines of code in web services and system services. There are a lot of moving pieces that make up a piece of software. The more complicated the software, the less likely it will be that any one person will be able to tell you with 100% certainty how it all works together.

The best any development team can do is create test cases that test each independent scenario. I can easily see how this situation can develop, because individually, each test passes as expected. It isn't until you start mixing differing scenarios that your test cases can break down. No one in their right mind would write a test script to validate a 5/5 DMG passive plus a 10% DMG Bonus from a Pet, on top of a 15% bonus from Shadow Veil, a 2.5% bonus from an Archon ring and a 25% DMG Elixir. There are far too many variables to account for in that test case for it to correctly break down into a pass/fail condition.

The assumption would be that individually each scenario has been tested and validated, and it is inappropriate to test in all possible combinations. Conditions such as these fall through the cracks all the time in software development, so now that it has been identified, I'm sure STS will do something about it in their next client update.

To be fair, they did do this for PL although all the elixir stacking broke the game..LOL!

[falmear]

I dont think 2.5% armor of archon works even if it shows in stats. I say this because the archon ring dmg version also shows +2.5% increase in dmg in stat screen but initial testing by Serancha did suggest that it does nothing. And since null_and_void already said that armor and dmg both work in the same way it is safe to assume that the buff of armor version of archon ring is rendered useless if u have 5% armor passive

The issue with durable passive vs archon ring of potency armor buff is whether or not they are the same category. The archon ring of potency (warrior) shows the damage reduction icon. The archon ring of potency (rogue) shows the damage icon so I can see why damage from pet cancels out the ring's damage boost. But the question is what armor passives by pets, damage reduction by pets, equipment or passive skill fall into the damage reduction category. And which ones will cancel the other ones out. For example Singe has the text 'Damaged Reduced by 4%'. So lets say you have durable passive which is +5% armor. Are you not getting the 4%? Or if you have archon ring of potency with +2.5% armor, does Singe cancel out your ring's buff. Someone needs to clarify this because this would require massive testing and its too difficult to get everyone to test in the same way and eliminate all the variables.

[keikali]

If i use dmg elixir and some pet skill which should give dmg, like scorn,does they stack?
Or how about shadow veil and dmg elixir? Or veil and pet skill?
Last, aimed shot accuracy add? Does it happens if i have dmg elixir on

The issue with durable passive vs archon ring of potency armor buff is whether or not they are the same category. The archon ring of potency (warrior) shows the damage reduction icon. The archon ring of potency (rogue) shows the damage icon so I can see why damage from pet cancels out the ring's damage boost. But the question is what armor passives by pets, damage reduction by pets, equipment or passive skill fall into the damage reduction category. And which ones will cancel the other ones out. For example Singe has the text 'Damaged Reduced by 4%'. So lets say you have durable passive which is +5% armor. Are you not getting the 4%? Or if you have archon ring of potency with +2.5% armor, does Singe cancel out your ring's buff. Someone needs to clarify this because this would require massive testing and its too difficult to get everyone to test in the same way and eliminate all the variables.

Actually Damage Reduction is calculated differently from the Armor Passive which is a % Bonus to Armor. This was confirmed by null_void also, didn't remember to SS this convo in the chatbox.

[falmear]

Actually Damage Reduction is calculated differently from the Armor Passive which is a % Bonus to Armor. This was confirmed by null_void also, didn't remember to SS this convo in the chatbox.

We need a better explanation as to how because if you have a damage reduction elixir and Singe, do you get both? Also Archon Ring of Potency doesn't show up on the stats page until you equip it. And once equipped shows the damage reduction icon next to your name. How until these are specifically answered and clarified, I see this as still an open question.

[Madnex]

It's not likely that we'll get further specifications. However, damage reduction and armor are two interdependent yet also separate variables. In addition, they're worded differently in pet descriptions so it'd be logical to assume they don't overlap.

[Serancha]

Here's the related quotes re: debuffs / armor reduction:





and later on, discussng the damage buff mechanics....

[keikali]

Thats the SS I didn't get. Thanks Serancha!

[falmear]

Unfortunately the chat box was pruned by the time I looked this up, so the conversation isn't there. But it says they take the largest buff your character has and then later on it says damage and armor work that way. So if this statement was in relation to taking the largest buff, then the durable passive & archon ring of potency armor buff would conflict and they would take the durable buff assuming its greater then 2.5%.

[Serancha]

This would imply that pet debuffs (armor reduction etc) do not stack, at least in pvp situations. Nothing was said about debuffs on mobs though - it has always been thought that they do stack up on mobs.

[faefaefae]

Kalizzaa,

Thanks a lot for taking the trouble to do all these testings!

After reading all the above threads, I can just come to one conclusion: only trust what you can see from the stat page