Major damage bug on warrior gear

[Serancha]

it deff is the bug it doesnt make sense that "level" of weapon should affect the skill damage presented thats just nonsense LOL
ur talking like what mitno said around 20 dmg increase per level? thats ridiculous lol but im also not surprise if DEVS purposely do that
so that old weapons would expire aka maul / arcantestaff .. because i know for a fact that maul will remain pretty much the highest damage even in lvl 46- possible lvl51
its always gonna be somewhat +100 dmg unless they pull out another weapon that tops maul

It shouldn't be. If we go by what they did with hooks, the top weapons this season should be out-performing maul in all except proc. There is no way it should still be the best, come 46 or 51. That's outrageous to even consider. If you want an arcane item that will be good forever, buy a pet.

[Zeus]

attributes meaning passives etc? lol doesnt make sense still because technically speaking he got the same "attributes" and dps shouldnt increase damage skill

Attributes = Int, dex, str.

[falmear]

This has been brought up in the past in both Hali's thread and a few random ones but no one paid much attention:
http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?89787

If you are talking about the Borean Cage Rifle, then the bug with a certain set of guns that still exists today. On their auto attack they always do a charged attack. And the reason we know this is because in S4, Borean Cage Rifle does this spin attack on a non-charged attack. Other guns that season only do a spin attack on a charged attack. Borean Cage rifle gives more damage on non-charged auto attack then a charged auto attack.

Skill-damage seems to be solely dependent on the main attribute of each class (on the process of testing further). Makes you wonder, what exactly does the "Damage" in one's profile page actually reflect.

This is easily disproved. Go buy and equip these two rings:

1) Lvl 41 Silver Hoop of Brutality
41 INT 21 STR 3.0 DMG

2) Lvl 41 Silver Hoop of Force
42 INT 10 STR 2.88% Crit

Now go check any skill for example with lightning:

1) With Silver Hoop of Brutality gives 972-1215 skill damage for lightning

2) With Silver Hoop of Force gives 952-1190 skill damage for lightning

If you were right, the Silver Hoop of Force should give higher skill damage but it doesn't. But Silver Hoop of Brutality gives higher skill damage despite having lower INT because it gives 3.0 DMG. So how can you say that "Skill-damage seems to be solely dependent on the main attribute of each class" when this is proven false.

[Zeus]

If you are talking about the Borean Cage Rifle, then the bug with a certain set of guns that still exists today. On their auto attack they always do a charged attack. And the reason we know this is because in S4, Borean Cage Rifle does this spin attack on a non-charged attack. Other guns that season only do a spin attack on a charged attack. Borean Cage rifle gives more damage on non-charged auto attack then a charged auto attack.



This is easily disproved. Go buy and equip these two rings:

1) Lvl 41 Silver Hoop of Brutality
41 INT 21 STR 3.0 DMG

2) Lvl 41 Silver Hoop of Force
42 INT 10 STR 2.88% Crit

Now go check any skill for example with lightning:

1) With Silver Hoop of Brutality gives 972-1215 skill damage for lightning

2) With Silver Hoop of Force gives 952-1190 skill damage for lightning

If you were right, the Silver Hoop of Force should give higher skill damage but it doesn't. But Silver Hoop of Brutality gives higher skill damage despite having lower INT because it gives 3.0 DMG. So how can you say that "Skill-damage seems to be solely dependent on the main attribute of each class" when this is proven false.

It's not solely as Mitno pointed out earlier. However, skill damage might be reliant on attribute which is why I requested earlier in the thread for somebody to test the heal of a +18 glaive vs a +15 maul.

I'll ask my guildies later on this, I know they have both.

[mitno]

I tested horn too, it works like the other skills, i.e. higher skill damage - bigger heal

[mitno]

It shouldn't be. If we go by what they did with hooks, the top weapons this season should be out-performing maul in all except proc. There is no way it should still be the best, come 46 or 51. That's outrageous to even consider. If you want an arcane item that will be good forever, buy a pet.

As far as I remember, from dev's comments, arcane items should be OP for 3 seasons. Hence, maul should still be OP this season.
However, I really don't want to make this thread turn to a discussion about the efficiency of the maul vs claymore and whether maul still op or not. It is another issue completely. I made this thread to understand the illogical under-hood mechanics of skill damage. So please lets stay on topic

[falmear]

It's not solely as Mitno pointed out earlier. However, skill damage might be reliant on attribute which is why I requested earlier in the thread for somebody to test the heal of a +18 glaive vs a +15 maul.

1) Lvl 31 Solid Circuit of Warfare
- 30 STR 1.9 Damage 31 Armor
- Gives +7.6 Damage vs not wearing any ring

2) Lvl 37 Gold Hoop of Stability
- 14 STR 37 DEX 2.90% Dodge
- Gives +7.5 Damage vs not wearing any ring

Skill damage of lightning:

1) Lvl 31 Solid Circuit of Warfare gives 909 - 1137 skill damage for lightning
2) Lvl 37 Gold Hoop of Stability gives 909 - 1136 skill damage for lightning

I picked these 2 rings for these specific purposes:

1) The damage boost is very similar but Solid Circuit of Warfare gives me NO STATS that increase my damage except DAMAGE 1.9.
2) Level 37 Gold Hoop of Stability is 6 levels higher then Lvl 31 Solid Circuit of Warfare
3) Solid Circuit of Warfare doesn't give me ANY INT which is the primary stat for mage

So now why do I get 1 skill point higher with a level 31 ring that doesn't give me any INT or DEX which are the only stats which increases damage. Why does a lower level ring give me more 1 skill damage higher?

[Anarchial]

Can I ask a few questions? Did STS ever mention that skill damage depends on only "damage"? If yes, then only the conplaining is valid. But as I think that it was just common folk's knowledge that spread that skill damage is dependant on only damage. As Zeus pointed out that it was stated way before that weapon level is considered in skill damage and is also evident.

So in short no one has the right to complain that weapon damage solely isnt translating to skill damage unless any dev specifically confirmed that weapon damage only decides skill damage. I dont mean to be disrespectful to anyone but imho you cant bash anyone for some common folklore which apparently was wrong.

However if some dev did ever confirm that weapon damage solely defines skill damages then we should definitely take it up to STS by pointing to the thread.

[Zeus]

1) Lvl 31 Solid Circuit of Warfare
- 30 STR 1.9 Damage 31 Armor
- Gives +7.6 Damage vs not wearing any ring

2) Lvl 37 Gold Hoop of Stability
- 14 STR 37 DEX 2.90% Dodge
- Gives +7.5 Damage vs not wearing any ring

Skill damage of lightning:

1) Lvl 31 Solid Circuit of Warfare gives 909 - 1137 skill damage for lightning
2) Lvl 37 Gold Hoop of Stability gives 909 - 1136 skill damage for lightning

I picked these 2 rings for these specific purposes:

1) The damage boost is very similar but Solid Circuit of Warfare gives me NO STATS that increase my damage except DAMAGE 1.9.
2) Level 37 Gold Hoop of Stability is 6 levels higher then Lvl 31 Solid Circuit of Warfare
3) Solid Circuit of Warfare doesn't give me ANY INT which is the primary stat for mage

So now why do I get 1 skill point higher with a level 31 ring that doesn't give me any INT or DEX which are the only stats which increases damage. Why does a lower level ring give me more 1 skill damage higher?

I'm not sure about rings, as this is new code (jewelry did not exist in the previous games). If you can answer that question, that's great. I honestly have no idea.

I'm sure if we do additional testing on jewelry, we could figure out the logic behind that.

The rules that I have mentioned seem to be playing out for the weapons. As a result, I still want to see how the weapons play out in terms of heal.

PS: Thanks for proving that jewelry may/may not follow the rules that I listed. It's something I did not account for. It's appreciated!

[Serancha]

I would like to take this opportunity to thank the developers of Arcane Legends, for giving us all so many wonderful opportunities to totally geek out.

[falmear]

I'm not sure about rings, as this is new code (jewelry did not exist in the previous games). If you can answer that question, that's great. I honestly have no idea.

I'm sure if we do additional testing on jewelry, we could figure out the logic behind that.

The rules that I have mentioned seem to be playing out for the weapons. As a result, I still want to see how the weapons play out in terms of heal.

PS: Thanks for proving that jewelry may/may not follow the rules that I listed. It's something I did not account for. It's appreciated!

Lvl 36 Expedition Rifle of Fatality
116.5 DPS 10 DEX 39 INT 2.67% Crit
- Lightning skill damage is 799-999

Lvl 41 Indigenous Staff of Brutality
128.8 DPS 42 INT 21 STR
- Lightning skill damage is 732-915

The lower level Lvl 36 Expedition Rifle of Fatality gives +36.5 Damage over Lvl 41 Indigenous Staff of Brutality thereby giving higher skill damage. Previously you stated:

This is not a bug, allow me to explain!
No, this is not a bug. A sword is a high DPS weapon with low attack damage, but in return, it will give you higher skill damage. The glaive is the same way in this aspect! If you check a glaive, the skill damage is ~60 higher than the maul.

So why in this instance does a higher level weapon with higher DPS give lower skill damage. Everything you have said contradicts everything found here:

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...led-comparison

[Serancha]

It seems to work differently for different classes. Mage and rogue weapons appear to work in a similar fashion to each other.

Warrior, because of the negative damage / dps ratio in their mauls, work differently. The negative damage / dps ratio also affects charge time, whcih is interesting in itself.

[mitno]

There is one more possibility. There can be a hidden factor in each weapon that translates damage to skill damage.
If there is such factor it should not stay hidden and be displayed in the weapon's parameters.

[mitno]

Can I ask a few questions? Did STS ever mention that skill damage depends on only "damage"? If yes, then only the conplaining is valid. But as I think that it was just common folk's knowledge that spread that skill damage is dependant on only damage. As Zeus pointed out that it was stated way before that weapon level is considered in skill damage and is also evident.

So in short no one has the right to complain that weapon damage solely isnt translating to skill damage unless any dev specifically confirmed that weapon damage only decides skill damage. I dont mean to be disrespectful to anyone but imho you cant bash anyone for some common folklore which apparently was wrong.

However if some dev did ever confirm that weapon damage solely defines skill damages then we should definitely take it up to STS by pointing to the thread.

We are not claiming skill damage must or mustn't be a derivative of damage stats.
But i think that by looking at a weapon's parameters i should be able to decide which weapon is better. As for now this is not the case. Because by examining maul parameters the only conclusion i can make is that its better than other weapons cause its higher in ALL parameters. However, as you can easily see, it is not.
My point is that the attributes of any item should be known directly or indirectly from examining its parameters without the need of purchasing it and equipping it physically on your toon.

[Anarchial]

We are not claiming skill damage must or mustn't be a derivative of damage stats.
But i think that by looking at a weapon's parameters i should be able to decide which weapon is better. As for now this is not the case. Because by examining maul parameters the only conclusion i can make is that its better than other weapons cause its higher in ALL parameters. However, as you can easily see, it is not.
My point is that the attributes of any item should be known directly or indirectly from examining its parameters without the need of purchasing it and equipping it physically on your toon.

As you mentioned in this post that you want to know whether maul is BETTER or not? I dont think that only skill damage should be taken into consideration while deciding about a weapon's goodness. Maul has a killer proc and it is for that stun most people die in pvp.

One more thing maul isnt high in ALL parameters. It is 10 level down than the weapon you are comparing. Even then it dominates more than magma sword.

What I think you really want is to be able to identify your skill damage before buying the weapon, right? If that is the case I too want that. I would like to be able to guess my skill range(even approximate) before buying a weapon.

Edit: I read your last line after posting this. That I agree to bro. There should be a way to guess my skill damage before buying it and physically equipping.

[Madnex]

Falmear's disproving examples are correct. What I said seemed to be applying on the few bow-daggers comparisons I made but I was also testing other stuff at the same time; figured what got mixed up though.

So the equipment's level is not related to skill min-max damage range (at least for sorcerer). Then there's no explanation on the original issue reported?

[Serancha]

I think it's related to the negative damage : dps ratio on maul-type weapons. The mauls are the only weapons with that, and it is logical that it would affect skill damage somehow.

[alexdroog]

I noticed the same with entombed warfare.
Higher dmg than magma but skyward and cs do the same damage.
This is wrong somehow. What does dmg indicate at all now?

[mitno]

I noticed the same with entombed warfare.
Higher dmg than magma but skyward and cs do the same damage.
This is wrong somehow. What does dmg indicate at all now?

Actually magma has higher skill damage. Maybe the one lvl difference causes it

[Zeus]

Lvl 36 Expedition Rifle of Fatality
116.5 DPS 10 DEX 39 INT 2.67% Crit
- Lightning skill damage is 799-999

Lvl 41 Indigenous Staff of Brutality
128.8 DPS 42 INT 21 STR
- Lightning skill damage is 732-915

The lower level Lvl 36 Expedition Rifle of Fatality gives +36.5 Damage over Lvl 41 Indigenous Staff of Brutality thereby giving higher skill damage. Previously you stated:



So why in this instance does a higher level weapon with higher DPS give lower skill damage. Everything you have said contradicts everything found here:

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...led-comparison

I'm not a mage, that's for you to answer. For my class and the warrior class, the rule seems to follow. You're right, Falmear. Cheers!