Arcane Legends Skill System Feedback Wanted!

[GoodSyntax]

Hi everyone!

First, an introduction: I'm Fibus and I'm a Senior Game Designer here at Spacetime. I've been here for about a year now and in that time, I've worked on many of the AL features that you have all enjoyed. Going forward, I hope to continue that trend. One of my current projects is the AL Skills System update, which brings me to the focus of this post...

Over the last 2 years, Arcane Legends has grown and developed with tons of new content and changes. Now, we are taking the time to look back at what we have done and see how we can improve. As we have announced (read more at: http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...s-Skill-System), on part of the game we're taking a look at is the skill system, including all of the various class skills. While we have certain metrics that we can look at to analyze skill usage, it is also important to get feedback directly from the community, since numbers don't come accompanied with explanations. We want to know how these skills feel to you as part of your builds.

So, we would love for you all to tell us what you like or dislike about your class' skills. Providing any explanations with your answers would be extremely helpful!

• What class do you primarily play?
• What are your current builds for PvE? PvP? (If your builds are precious to you, I also accept private messages )
• Which skills/upgrades do you like using and why?
• Which skills/upgrades do you dislike using and why?
• Any additional information you want to tell us (but please try to keep it skills related)

To get this thread back on track, here are my thoughts on the various Rogue skills:

Shadow Piercer
Good skill to have, great for jumping across a map, evading boss windups and general damage (in uncharged form). Upgrades, for the most part have little value, so most Rogues just unlock the skill and use their points elsewhere.

• Gouging Rush - Not a useful skill at all for elite or PvE focused builds. No value in PvP either, so this is a throwaway upgrade that very, very few people actually use.
• Shadow Absorption - I don't PvP anymore, so the possibility of a 10% heal in Elite Tindirin is laughable when you are getting one hit by scorns, shamans, snakes, etc. I get it that you need to balance PvP with PvE, but I would prefer a 25% heal in PvE and a 10% heal in PvP; at least that way, this upgrade would be a bit more enticing for elite-only builds.
• Rising Death - The added damage from this skill upgrade honestly isn't worth the skill point. I see people using this upgrade once in a while, but I can think of a dozen other places where a skill point would be better used. If this also cast a snare or stun, then, it would be an interesting upgrade.
• Leading Dagger - The 3-hit upgrade isn't very effective in elite, since it generally gets people into trouble by piercing into a mob, hitting a second mob, then returning back to the first mob just as he is winding up. Another issue with the 3-hit upgrade is that it usually causes you to aggro mobs nearby which you don't want to aggro. So, for elite, this upgrade is nothing but trouble. A better option would be to 3-hit the same target. At least this way, it is a sacrifice, because you lose the evasion aspect of pierce, which gets you out of boss windups, but you get 3x DMG in return.

Noxious Bolt
The best AoE damage skill that a Rogue has! Other than the Serrated Arrowhead upgrade working the wrong way (by taking away DMG instead of adding to it), this is a must-have skill for every PvE Rogue! The only upgrade I would like to see is a larger radius and increased number of affected targets (likely through a tree-style upgrade, so you have to unlock Strengthened Shot first).

• Lingering Poison - Super useful for solo Rogues. This upgrade almost requires the Fragmentation upgrade, since the two are so complimentary.
• Strengthened Shot - Again, a basic staple for solo Rogues. To be honest, I wish we would upgrade this further, but excellent as it currently stands.
• Fragmentation - Complimentary upgrade with Lingering Poison, a must have for elite runners.
• Serrated Arrowhead - This skill is bugged! Instead of adding damage it is taking away damage. Not sure what to say about an upgrade that costs a skill point to reduce damage...

Razor Shield
A good skill to use. Has value in PvP and PvE. Main drawbacks are the long cooldown and, depending on upgrades, can be an aggro magnet in elite.

• Whirling Razors - For the most part, you pick up Razor for this upgrade in particular.
• Bleeding Cuts - This is the aggro magnet upgrade. Bleed does very little damage in return for making everything in the map hate you. This upgrade is used on blender builds, but it is nothing but trouble in endgame elites.
• Increased Duration - This upgrade is bugged! Add this upgrade removes the benefits of the Spinning Freedom upgrade, so, effectively, these two skills are mutually exclusive.
• Spinning Freedom - Great upgrade that is useful in both PvP and PvE (especially in Nordr and Tindirin)

Aimed Shot
Any endgame Rogue, PvP or PvE, that does not use this skill with all upgrades needs to respec.

• Accuracy - Yes!
• Critical Shot - Yes!
• Deadly Focus - Yes!
• Shatter Armor - Yes!

Entangling Trap
I know some Rogues that use this skill effectively, unfortunately I am not one of them. It is just hard for me to justify using, what is effectively a crowd control skill, when the most important aspect of this skill can be so infrequent.

• Adept Construction - Great upgrade if you are a Trap user. Personally, I would like this to be a higher chance, thereby making this upgrade a bit more worthwhile.
• Razor Wire - This upgrade has limited value, since bleed does so little damage and causes so much aggro.
• Combustion Tank - Useless upgrade. I honestly think an auto attack does more damage in almost all scenarios. A far better option would be an AoE stun with an AoE poison.
• Net Retraction - THIS is the reason why you spec this skill in the first place. Unfortunately, the pull is unreliable and infrequent. I would really like to see this be a 50% or 75% chance of a pull.

Shadow Storm Shot
Completely useless skill. Only worth considering for Rogues at lv15 or lower that do not PvP and primarily run tombs. Miniscule damage in endgame elite, so if you see someone running elite with this skill, leave the map!

• Spreading Shadow - Not worthwhile because the damage from this skill is pathetically low and doesn't affect enough targets as it is.
• Shadow Focus - Because the base damage is so low, adding 25% more on critical doesn't help much, so this would be a waste of a skill point.
• Dark Damage - I use this upgrade on my lv15 Tombs Rogue, but honestly, even if it were 40%, the damage from this skill doesn't approach what you get from Pierce, Nox or Aimed.
• Shadow Touch - Again, I use this upgrade on my lv15 Tombs Rogue, and it is somewhat effective if I can group enough mobs together, but even still, it feels like I'm just throwing mashed potatoes instead of an "arcane arrow of darkness"

Shadow Veil
An extremely useful party buff best used in pure, elite parties. Unfortunately, with the inability of the system to correctly stack DMG and Armor buffs, elixirs completely wipe out all value of this skill.

• Masked Presence - Terrific upgrade! But, this upgrade cancels out armor passives, and elixirs will cancel out this upgrade, so again, best used when running elites pure.
• Combusting Decay - See Combustion Tank upgrade on Entangling Trap.
• Shadow Absorption - Terrific upgrade! Again, cancels out DMG passives, and will be cancelled by any DMG elixir. In a pure environment, this and Masked Presence are the primary reasons for getting Veil in the first place.
• Lingering Fumes - Because this skill has such a LONG cooldown, this upgrade is almost a necessity.

Combat Medic
This is a PvP focused skill, it has absolutely no value in elites. No pure PvE Rogue would ever use this skill. My biggest gripe with this skill is the scattered, random locations of where the packs end up falling. One would think that a Rogue with pinpoint accuracy would figure out how to take some packs out of her pocket without making it a game of pick-up-sticks.

• Effective Packs - Terrific upgrade that is a requirement of any PvP centered build.
• Trauma Surgeon - Another great upgrade for PvP Rogues. Gives you just enough of an HP recharge to go and find the packs that scattered all over the place.
• Extra Packs - If you choose to get Combat Medic for PvP and you don't get this upgrade, I'm not sure where you are putting the skill point. This is an essential upgrade.
• Good Medicine - Many PvP Rogues use this upgrade. I, personally, never did when I was PvPing, since the other upgrades provide about 100% HP anyway. If you are taking that much of a pounding that you think you need this upgrade, you are probably just putting off the inevitable.

[powermaxed]

Shadow storm shot needs major buff, it is useless even in pve (unless solo)
Maybe add more dmg, stun, or even feeble.. yes feeble.

[Khaphyn]

For me personally,Its mage all day.I use Fire,Light,Time,& Heal and this combo seems to work well for my build...I would like to see the mage class (as well as all others) Branch off to a different kind,with in its own class..Example: Mages would have some sommoning or regenerate dead spells giving the option to go necro...Warriors would have some skills allowing that warrior to branch off to like a martial artist or something like that...and rogues could branch off to Rangers (adding maybe a duel wield skill)...Its just a basic idea with no real details but as a mage player I would def love to see a respec where I could be a necro,able to summon up to 10-20 Undead,elemental,golem,or what ever kind of temperary pets.

Sent by This Handsome Guy

[Naoavi]

The weirdest thing about skills is lack of stacking. Damage, armor debuff, pets, etc. This is really not expected or understood by players and it leads to people wasting skill points and not utilizing their skills effectively. Can STS please make a clear statement about stacking? Is it working as intended or not? Why are we denied the benefits that we "pay" for? Why doesn't it stack? Why don't you fix it? A clear explanation would be appreciated.

[Kaziscate]

I feel like the mage needs more support skills since most of the skills just stun and theres not enough skills that have buffs like defense or damage increase. And curse seems more like something only a tank would use and mages seem pretty much like the opposite. And mages seem to be bullied a lot in pvp in my oppinion so maybe fix some of the skills so they can have a fair fighting chance. Tanks have too many support skills that mages should have so maybe tone it down to 2 skills instead of 4.

[Avshow]

I just wanna say.....better make more skills and more skill slots, so players may have more ways to play this game,we can only use 4 skills from s1-s7....and the only once new skills systems introducing is passive......now it is time to change....pls look at pocket legend, we have so many skills there to choose and so many ways to play( because gears are not distinguished by classes, but by the basic stats, bear can use bird weapon if he meets the minimum requirement of dex)

[GoodSyntax]

I would love to see some new, more useful passives!

For instance:
HP Regen: 10 hp per second regen (even during combat) for each skill point used
Mana Regen: 10 mana per second regen (even during combat) for each skill point used
Aggro Sphere: 5m radius of increased aggro. Each skill point increases aggro radius.
Protection: 5% chance upon receiving damage to stun the attacker. Additional skill points increase chance of auto-stun.
Damage Reflection: 3% of damage received is reflected back to the attacker. Each skill point increases damage reflection by an additional 3%
Drain Sphere: 5m radius where you inflict low level damage every second to all targets in range. Damage inflicted is returned as HP to the player. Additional skill points increases radius.
Companionship: 5% chance of your pet's Arcane Ability becoming immediately available after invocation. Additional skill points increase probability by 5%.
Enrage: Any damage taken that drops your HP below 50%, you have a 5% chance to perform an AoE knockdown and increase your DMG by 25% for 3 seconds. Additional skill points increase probability by 5%.


With these types of passives in place, I can see Warriors as hugely beneficial in timed elite runs with Aggro Sphere, Protection and Damage Reflection Passives.

Here are some of the benefits I can see with this type of passive system:


Warriors
Running elites or PvP with Aggro Sphere (or Enrage), Protection and Damage Reflection passives maxed out. This would make tanks offensive weapons, instead of meat shields.
I can totally see the combination of Juggernaut plus Enrage being a very nice, complementary system.

Sorcerers
Running with Protection, Drain Sphere and Enrage could turn Sorcs into the stunlock, AoE killers that we really want them to be.
Alternatively, Sorcs could use HP Regen, Drain Sphere and Protection to become extremely tanky and difficult to kill.

Rogues
Obviously, Mana Regen will be popular, along with Enrage and perhaps Companionship. I know, you probably think a max of 25% chance of your pet's AA could be OP, but 5 precious skill points spent on a 1-in-4 chance of immediate pet AA is a difficult choice to make. Personally, with my play-style, I would take Enrage, Drain Sphere and Protection, since I like to fight in the middle of mob packs.

[Deadroth]

Welcome on forums Fibax!

I won't make Your head explode by detailed explainations. Just a few words.
I am playing mostly mage, and, as most (if not all of sorcerers), i am irritated by low level of our survivality.
If I could suggest something, it would be improving our shield, and overall, making our dmg higher, cause good rogues have higher dps and dmg than average mage,
what shouldn't take place in this game.

Regards.
Dead

[hozukreti]

Happy to see new skill, need more skill for verity build and supporting party.

[Ice]

I strongly Suggest new skills slot because players can have more combination of skills. ( rouge , warrior , mage )

New skills wont be enough in a few months people will get bored of it.. but with skills slot they can have 2 support skills and damage skills they can combine with.

Let me give you a good example ( HoR , jug , Axe , smash , CS ) Hor = heal - Jug is support skills unti stun. for now warrior can only use axe and smash and the rest is normal attach when cool down... just imagine with 1 more skills then they can combo better.

Same goes for mage ( heal , shield are the two support skills ) then 2 killing skills, with extra skills slot mage can do a lot of combination since the cool down of skills is fast. - mages can explain this better.

with extra skills slot people dont need to swap skills during in battle .

[oagrafr]

A guy has scammed my lunar pendant his nale is mom pls meet me my name is oagraaba

[Niixed]

So well thought out!

[Awesomazing]

What about let's say neww skills for each class?

Rogue:

- Flaming Arrow
>An arrow on fire that hits target and has upgrades to "burn".

Mage:

- Glory Spark
> The mage will briefly go up with like blue/green energy like on the mythic amulets but smaller and in like waves going around him and then the energy goes back down into the ground with a aura or circle on the ground that damages enemys.

Warrior:

-Rush
> He would boost forward like running with his weapon in front of him into an enemy.

Leave feedback on my idea please.

[extrapayah]

I recently found out that warrior's stun, and mage's lightning stun doesn't work on bosses -_-a

isn't it a bit too underpowered? okay i don't mind that the bosses are immune to 100% stun from fireball or gale, but immune to 25% chance on skyward, axe throw, or lightning??? don't you think it make the upgrade a lot useless? especially for axe throw and lightning which are single targeted (and supposedly made to strike ONE strong opponent?)

thanks

[conradev]

Release the cooldown on skill slots...the decision to add that was an atrocity.

For an underpowered class such as mage there is no reason why if we are skilled enough to access our menu and replace shield with an attack skill that we should not be able to do so. I think the feedback you got from players was a little skewed. The vast majority had no issue with it and a growing minority were using it. It REALLY took a lot of fun dynamics out of VS (our own class) VS (other classes) as well as timed runs...We should not find ourselves standing at a boss waiting for gale to cooldown so we can replace it with lightning.

Also, mages had finally seen remote success and AT LEAST interesting battles with tanks around the time a slim minority confused you into thinking there was some harm in switching skills. These people some how figured that because they had no success in PVP that you should limit other player's success and fun as well, because they either were not fast enough to switch effectively or refused to try.

The best way to create an environment with fair and balanced skills across classes is to allow the top tier of each class evolve into different strategies using what you have given us. Changing the mechanics of the game is a never win situation, and the players who were most belligerent about getting skill switching removed have since STILL found no success in PVP just like we told them they wouldn't, and thence believe the game is flawed and have posted "farewell to AL" threads perpetually and it annoys me... This game is a better game with switching and I wish you would at least explore the possibility that it was a mistake removing it and even that it was in fact a disgruntled minority who asked you to in the first place and that they were wrong.

Also, allow us to at least dismiss our pet when we have used his skill and not have to wait for a cd. There is no reason why we shouldn't be able to dismiss our pets but several reasons why we should be able to. And in my opinion we should be able to switch to a different pet during the prior pets cd time, and then have the same cd time just continue to where we are not able to use our newly summoned pet.

[conradev]

And btw, as a mage, I love all my skills, my permanent build uses all 8 skills and no passives...and every one I find extemely useful outside of knockback on shield and freezing puddles on ice...(I personally have no use for them but others very well may).

Please do not change gale force, it is a pro's skill and has a majority bad wrap because most don't understand how to use it...as an alternative, myself and others will promise to post tutorials on its uses and effectiveness. Any change, even a subtle one to gale could be detrimental to mage timed runs AND mage PVP.

[Alhuntrazeck]

I would suggest a couple of changes to the mage's skills.

The main problem currently is the lack of survivability. There is something wrong in the game if a max geared mage gets 1 hit/1 combo'd by a rogue using Druid gear! It seems unfair that the mage MUST have shield on if they don't want to get 1 hit or combo'd.

Some mages have found a workaround to the survivability issue by using Gale Force. Others, however, who wish to have a ranged attack skill like Fireball instead (or don't want to fly into the horizon, deep into the enemy lines where the opposing DPS can pick them out easily) find it difficult to survive.

My suggestion to fix this?

• Boost the mages' base armor by about 100-200 points. This would be a global buff so that all further armor boosts (such as gale, Glacian's AA, etc) will stack.
  
• Combine the HP and mana regen upgrades on Lifegiver and add a new one that gives +20% armor on healing to all allies for say 5 seconds.
  
• Give shield stun immunity. Or, if that is too OP, make clock gives all allies inside it stun immunity!
  
• Increase the values of HP and Mana regen to make it a viable upgrade.
  

[Gensin]

Buff mages, Its disgusting. In endgame and in twink.

Give the shield stun immunity in replace for that stupid knockback.

If you not follow our suggestions. Might as well delete shield and replace it with a teleporting spell.

[phillyr]

My feedback while being as nice as i can is to quit making these temp "events" and fix the gameplay as a whole. Yhere have been many many many great suggestions from long time pro players...lets stop BSing and get it done

just another upbeat positive comment from your friendly neighborhood forumer 😆

[whizzyrich]

I play mage. You need separate trees for PvE and PvP. You also have to consider the different play of those primarily solo and those in guilds - totally different playing experiences. Players can follow trees most closely conforming to their playing style.