With regards to the rogue armor nerf

[Ardbeg]

[QUOTE=Tapash Bose;2447157]

I strongly disagree.
2) Damage output of tanks is neglectable, it is mostly important for the healing output of hor, aegis or sword procs deal the real damage. (Aegis pve, sword pvp).This statement is especialky true with glintstone set.

If it is so neglectable better let stay it at 400..why 800 ? that will bring about more balance for sure..

The current pvp problem roots in the damage output from the lava sprouts from the dragon sword proc, not in the skill or autoattack damage. Do some tests with or without gear with a tank friend and find out. The number is misleading.

[Lawpvp]

I am not qualified to comment on pvp or twinking. And i have been through this myself when i made a mage during shuyal campaign, when dps checks were introduced and a rogue later after eyes made rogues indestructable. I always had rogue friends to run with (even when consisting of top tanks gone rogue) when the situation was bad for tanks. All i want to contribute now is:
1) We don t have seen a single good lvl 56 item yet, nor new belts. There's plenty of room for adjustments.
2) Please keep in mind, that Tanks current heads up in pvp solely relies on a weapon proc, not the skills (as it does in pve with the aegis) and while the triple axe of the glitstone set is great it is still a big stat sacrifice.
3) From my point of view pve parties are fun again, since mixed classes runs are most rewarding.
As Saf said, i have always been supported in tank threads by friends from other classes, and i will always support other classes myself in the ongoing debate for balance. All i am saying now is: Why not wait with the debate until we tested lvl 56 gear in elites and pvp? We did not make the full transition yet.

While i agree with your premise as for lvl 56, and i understand you said you cant comment on twinks, the main driving point behind this thread is that sts destroyed the balance of all twink levels, severely hurt the balance of pvp in endgame all for the sake of slightly and improperly trying to balance endgame pve. This still did not solve the issue of tanks being mostly unwanted in runs. I proposed possible alternatives to counterract that, and proposed other moderate changes that would buff mages at endgame, reduce the rogue armor nerf severely but still leave them slightly weaker than before the nerfs, adjust the arcane sword which im sure u admit, is absurd, aswell as fixing bugs associated with twink weapons that allow warriors to dominate those levels even more, in addition to changes to venge and jugg that would buff endgame tanks slightly in exchange for a small arcane sword nerf and bring twink warriors more in line with the other classes. This i came up with in a matter of 5 minutes before i took a shower this morning.

In addition I have developed what i believe to be one of the most complete and comprehensive arguments for why the armor nerf has hurt the state of the game, this thread now has over 3600 views and 140 comments, more than any other recent thread on these forums with the exception of those made my mods/devs. This is a clear problem given the attention its received and I have asked sts to comment on this issue seeing as how it coincidentally coincided with the release of a new arcane pet giving armor and they have remained nearly quiet.

STS PLEASE TELL US ANYTHING, are rogue alterations being considered for twinks and endgame, are they not being considered, failure to give us anything will simply result in me creating another thread until we have your attention.

[Avaree]

In addition I have developed what i believe to be one of the most complete and comprehensive arguments for why the armor nerf has hurt the state of the game, this thread now has over 3600 views and 140 comments, more than any other recent thread on these forums with the exception of those made my mods/devs. This is a clear problem given the attention its received and I have asked sts to comment on this issue seeing as how it coincidentally coincided with the release of a new arcane pet giving armor and they have remained nearly quiet. .

Just saying, (I think many forumers refreshing this thread gave it many views.) views & number of responses does not make any thread comprehensive nor complete. But will agree the devs need to hear all constructive feed back.

[Ardbeg]

While i agree with your premise as for lvl 56, and i understand you said you cant comment on twinks, the main driving point behind this thread is that sts destroyed the balance of all twink levels, severely hurt the balance of pvp in endgame all for the sake of slightly and improperly trying to balance endgame pve. This still did not solve the issue of tanks being mostly unwanted in runs. I proposed possible alternatives to counterract that, and proposed other moderate changes that would buff mages at endgame, reduce the rogue armor nerf severely but still leave them slightly weaker than before the nerfs, adjust the arcane sword which im sure u admit, is absurd, aswell as fixing bugs associated with twink weapons that allow warriors to dominate those levels even more, in addition to changes to venge and jugg that would buff endgame tanks slightly in exchange for a small arcane sword nerf and bring twink warriors more in line with the other classes. This i came up with in a matter of 5 minutes before i took a shower this morning.

In addition I have developed what i believe to be one of the most complete and comprehensive arguments for why the armor nerf has hurt the state of the game, this thread now has over 3600 views and 140 comments, more than any other recent thread on these forums with the exception of those made my mods/devs. This is a clear problem given the attention its received and I have asked sts to comment on this issue seeing as how it coincidentally coincided with the release of a new arcane pet giving armor and they have remained nearly quiet.

STS PLEASE TELL US ANYTHING, are rogue alterations being considered for twinks and endgame, are they not being considered, failure to give us anything will simply result in me creating another thread until we have your attention.

As i understand it, at least Endgame pvp balance problems root in the Dragon sword proc, one single item, not a class superiority. This could be corrected. The twink level most probably needs to be looked at deeply.

However, tanks who know how to handle their aegis and antistun pets are really in high demand now. which is a good thing.
The armor of Munch mouth looks like a fishy coincidence with the nerf, but a lot of people complained after each new arcane pet there s no armor. Just saying, there s still room for a natural explanation.

[Oezheasate]

Armor isnt gonna cut it there is more on that:

Proc the sword, pull and enjoy your madd skillz of your sword. I suggest Devs to go pvp and see whats going on there. This isnt just twink issue this is ALSO AN ENDGAME ISSUE. If 4 warr can run the new maps faster than balanced team then there is a problem in pve aswell.

As others stated on pvp stacking tanks is to key of winning in pvp and its not a joke that they eat up dps like being a dps. but also preserving tank abilities, whats wrong with this damage?

I'm done talking sense, anyone who thinks this is balanced class distrubution they dont know the game PERIOD.

This is not only rogue armor issue, its also that riddiculus arcane sword proc. If they dont change it it will be viable weapon for pvp this season too.

Lastly people who says" Rogues were OP now tables are turned, let the tank shine" go mock yourself! Having a 1m worth of sword doesnt make you pro, this is an insult for all those people who spend extreme amount of time and money into their characters.

Um since when do 4 tank pts run pve faster than a 1 tank pt with three dps? Never, we need the dps for bosses and the lone mobs. Yes tanks are faster on large groups of mobs but we need the rogues to pick off the single targets and kill the boss.

[glendame]

Im fine with rogues armor. just fix stun locks to death combo with arc sword, thats more imba. imo.

[Lawpvp]

Just saying, (I think many forumers refreshing this thread gave it many views.) views & number of responses does not make any thread comprehensive nor complete. But will agree the devs need to hear all constructive feed back.

Yes im sure it has been viewed numerous times by nearly everyone who has commented on here, i was simply using those numbers to show the rogue armor nerf dilemma clearly is of big interest to the community. I wasnt really using that as a basis to say its comprehensive and complete I was more referring to the length and depth of my first post, and as you have said, devs need to hear all constructive feedback and they have yet to show significant acknowledgement regarding the issue many people have with current class balance, not just at endgame but twinks as well and I would like sts to show some regard to this

[intrepd]

For all of you tanks, whenever i read threads about rogues buff i find out that you guys say "This is not PVP game, and the issue was that tanks does low dmg in PVE you guys say that sword damage is not enough and tanks still can't kill mobs and boases as fast in PVE, didn't aegis make a change and allowed tanks to kill mobs faster?

[Manuel Emilio]

Im fine with rogues armor. just fix stun locks to death combo with arc sword, thats more imba. imo.

The problem is not only with PvP, the pve is unbalanced, rogue 18 with normal gear (500 armor, 115 dmg) can't solo the second Dead City Boss, War lvl 13 with the golden skull armor (don't remember the name) can do it, in lvl 40+ is balanced but in low lvls the rogues are dying so fast. (Imagine the KDR 10000 Deaths/3000 Kills). I want a perfect KDR rogue and had to restart the char 3 times in a week.

[Masked]

Yes im sure it has been viewed numerous times by nearly everyone who has commented on here, i was simply using those numbers to show the rogue armor nerf dilemma clearly is of big interest to the community. I wasnt really using that as a basis to say its comprehensive and complete I was more referring to the length and depth of my first post, and as you have said, devs need to hear all constructive feedback and they have yet to show significant acknowledgement regarding the issue many people have with current class balance, not just at endgame but twinks as well and I would like sts to show some regard to this

Guess the below posts are not sufficient for you???

Thx. We're bringing back some of the old devs to work on AL. Expect to see me and Cinco around more

Give us a week or so to make a plan based on the feedback. More soon.

- g

There are a few new things this year. The 2 questions thread happened this week. It will take us a bit of time to act on it. Thanks for the patience!

[glendame]

The problem is not only with PvP, the pve is unbalanced, rogue 18 with normal gear (500 armor, 115 dmg) can't solo the second Dead City Boss, War lvl 13 with the golden skull armor (don't remember the name) can do it, in lvl 40+ is balanced but in low lvls the rogues are dying so fast. (Imagine the KDR 10000 Deaths/3000 Kills). I want a perfect KDR rogue and had to restart the char 3 times in a week.

Definitely you will start every time with 10k/3k pve kdr. Your pve skill is, I'm sorry to say this, is inferior. You will never have a perfect pve kdr even if the rogue's armor wasn't debuffed. Are you tanking the mobs and blame your armor rating for your deaths? I'm an average pve player but I can sure do better than that. No offense but most rogues would agree.

[Manuel Emilio]

Definitely you will start every time with 10k/3k pve kdr. Your pve skill is, I'm sorry to say this inferior. You will never have a perfect pve kdr even if the rogue's armor wasn't debuffed. I'm an average pve player but I can sure do better than that. No offense but most rogues would agree.

So, where's the balance? War can have perfect KDR but rogues can't? That's balance? (I'm a war user, I can reach lvl 40 with no die (I did it), rogue or mage can't, that's balance to you? War can solo almost all maps (Normal Backenridge-Firts elite nordr) with no die, rogues/mages can't, I don't see the balance here dude. (Sorry for bad English).

[Masked]

The problem is not only with PvP, the pve is unbalanced, rogue 18 with normal gear (500 armor, 115 dmg) can't solo the second Dead City Boss, War lvl 13 with the golden skull armor (don't remember the name) can do it, in lvl 40+ is balanced but in low lvls the rogues are dying so fast. (Imagine the KDR 10000 Deaths/3000 Kills). I want a perfect KDR rogue and had to restart the char 3 times in a week.

Kelvin...ftw!

[glendame]

So, where's the balance? War can have perfect KDR but rogues can't? That's balance? (I'm a war user, I can reach lvl 40 with no die (I did it), rogue or mage can't, that's balance to you? War can solo almost all maps (Normal Backenridge-Firts elite nordr) with no die, rogues/mages can't, I don't see the balance here dude. (Sorry for bad English).

Dont bluff me pro. Show me screen shot of your zero death pve warrior. I don't think u can produce that SS with 10k/3k kdr on rogue.

[Manuel Emilio]

Dont bluff me pro. Show me screen shot of your zero death pve warrior. I don't think u can produce that as with 10k/3k kdr on rogue.

Give me three weeks for reach lvl 25-30 perfect war KDR, (I can do it in that time). I delete my previous perfect KDR after die against last Shuyal boss.

[glendame]

Give me three weeks for reach lvl 25-30 perfect war KDR, (I can do it in that time). I delete my previous perfect KDR after die against last Shuyal boss.

You can't play poker bud. Just caught you bluffing. Now you deleted your warr with perfect pve kdr? Kk I wait. Lol

[Manuel Emilio]

You can't play poker bud. Just caught you bluffing. Now you deleted your warr with perfect pve kdr? Kk I wait. Lol

Buddy I said I did it (perfect lvl 40 KDR), I don't keep it because I die, if u die u don't have perfect KDR, only wait three weeks, I will do it again

[glendame]

Buddy I said I did it (perfect lvl 40 KDR), I don't keep it because I die, if u die u don't have perfect KDR, only wait three weeks, I will do it again

But why you waited 3k deaths on your rogue before reset? XD

[Manuel Emilio]

But why you waited 3k deaths on your rogue before reset? XD

I don't get 3k Deaths, is just a example

But why you waited 3k deaths on your rogue before reset? XD

I don't get 3k Deaths, is just a example

[Lawpvp]

Guess the below posts are not sufficient for you???

Considering neither of those posts have anything to do with the armor nerf, no