DPS vs Damage - a detailed comparison

[JaytB]

Introduction

In this topic, I’d like to shed some light on the DPS vs Damage (Dmg) mechanics. For this, I went out to find the highest DPS build and compared it to the highest Dmg build, in terms of skill Dmg.

I hope this will help understand some people what stats to focus on when making a Sorcerer. I’m looking at it from a PvE perspective in this discussion.

Personally, I believe sorcerers are made to deal as much damage as possible. As a farmer, I want to be able to kill as quick as I can. An effectively equipped sorcerer can help farming times go down by a lot.

Personally, I’m using 4 Dmg skills (no heal) in my purely PvE based build. Dmg Skills mostly have a decent range to them, allowing you to nuke from afar. I use the auto attack button only when all 4 of my skills are on cooldown, which isn’t a lot of times given to low cooldown of most dmg skills.

So, in order to deal the maximum amount of Damage, I would have to max out my skill Damage and not my auto attack Damage.


What’s DPS

First off, let’s start with what DPS actually means.

I’m sure everyone knows it stands for Damage Per Second. But what some of you might not know is that DPS is actually a really simple calculation, as in Weapon Damage divided by Weapon speed (DPS=DMG/Weapon Speed). A slow weapon could have a weapon speed of 1.2x, meaning it will fire every 1.2 seconds, while a fast weapon could have a weapon speed of 0.5x seconds, meaning it could be fired 2 times a second.

So, as you can deduct from the calculation, a weapon with a higher speed (lower multiplier) shows more DPS because it can be fired quicker. DPS has nothing to do with your skill Dmg, it only refers to your auto attack button. It basically describes the possible Damage per second you can do on an enemy without armor, using your auto attack button. So basically, fast weapons with low Dmg output could show a high DPS number as compared to slow weapons with high Dmg output.

If the mechanics are similar as in the other STS games, real Dmg dealt is depending on the enemies’ armor. Let’s say that you’d deal 1000 Dmg on an enemy with 200 armor… This would mean the actual Dmg you dealt would be less than 1000, depending on how much enemies’ armor is taken into account. In PL for example, it can simply be calculated as follows: Real DMG = Dmg dealt – Enemies’ armor. Or, for the example above, real Dmg = 1000 – 200 = 800 real Dmg dealt.

Why is this important?
The more Dmg you’d deal, the less influence armor will have on your actual Dmg dealt.


tl;dr? Here’s the summary…

• DPS=Dmg/weapon speed and refers to your auto attack dmg.
• Higher speed weapons, in general, will give you a higher DPS but lower Dmg value.
• Skill Damage is more important than Auto attack DMG for a high DMG output mage.

Give me the numbers

Let’s take a look at the highest (as far as I could find out) DPS vs the Highest Dmg (Damage) build.


The High DPS build




Let’s check out the the skill dmg…

Fireball: 245-306 Damage



Lightning Strike: 376-470 Damage



Gale Force: 245-306 Damage



Frost Bolt: 327-408 Damage



Time Shift: 327-408 Damage



And just for comparison purposes…

Life Giver: Heals 653-817 Damage




The High Damage Build



As you can see in the picture above, this build adds a nice amount of Damage while keeping your INT more or less the same. This to show that the only thing changed is the Damage value while keeping your INT value roughly the same. Notice the poor DPS performance? Does that mean this build does less Dmg?

In order to find out, let’s take a look at the skill Dmg output.

Fireball: 273-342 Damage (+28 minimum, and +36 maximum skill Dmg)



Lightning Strike: 419-524 Damage (+43 min, +54 max Dmg)



Gale force: 273-342 Damage (+28 min, +36 max Dmg)



Frost Bolt: 364-456 Damage (+37 min, +48 max Dmg)



Time Shift: 364-456 Damage (+37 min, +48 max Dmg)



Lifegiver: Heals 729-911 Dmg (+76 min, +94 max Dmg heal)




Conclusion

Given you attack mostly with your skills as a pure Damage mage, it should be clear that skill damage is more important as compared to auto-attack Dmg. And when comparing skill damage for a high DPS build vs a High Dmg build, it’s clear that the high Dmg build is vastly superior, in therms of dealing damage, as compared to the high DPS build.

So, next time when someone tells you ‘your DPS sucks’, you might want to point them to this topic


As always, leave your constructive feedback below

[meanakric]

I fully agreed

[JaytB]

Nice job, this should get better mages out there since theres a ton of noob mages omg

I noticed. A couple of days ago someone called me a noob when I tried to explain him how DPS was overrated. And if you see how wanted those overpriced/way overrated lv25 rods for end-game mages are, it seems some people have no clue which stats actually matter. It's sad when people make remarks about your 'low DPS' while you actually deal way more Dmg as compared to high DPS mages.

[Dreuefesie]

I didn't know you played al?

It's really good that some one has put together a guild of this detail. Usually you just see damage is better than dps, but these theories were never explained like this.

[JaytB]

I didn't know you played al?

It's really good that some one has put together a guild of this detail. Usually you just see damage is better than dps, but these theories were never explained like this.

Haha yes, I started playing AL for almost 2 weeks now. Got a bit bored with the scenery in PL, so decided to give it a try. And you know me, I love tampering with stats and gear so AL gives me something to keep myself busy in the quiet hours, until PL gets something new

I'll PM you my IGN's in a bit, so we can meet up in game some time.

[Mysticaleagle]

Ah! Awesome guide!

2 things, if I may ask is your Build/Skill you use (with upgrades) and what gear you use? I'm your new mage fan.

[JaytB]

Ah! Awesome guide!

2 things, if I may ask is your Build/Skill you use (with upgrades) and what gear you use? I'm your new mage fan.

Thx

The high Dmg build consists out of the following:

* Mythic mage helm (lv26 sealord of security helm would do, but your skill Dmg would decrease with 15 points, or 327 max Dmg for firebolt)
* lv26 sealord wrappings of security
* Ring: Lv25 sea captain's ring of warfare. It strangely adds 3 more to your Dmg stat as compared to the lv26 one. Talking about weird mechanics lol.
* pendant: Lv25 Infused brooch of assault. The lv26 one adds +0.4 Dmg, but I haven't found one yet. I do know they exist though, since a friend of mine showed it to me.

All points went into INT for maximum damage.

My skills are (for now, cause I change all the time lol):

* Fire 5/5: I included the hit debuff because it seems to help me stay alive. Fairly high Dmg spell, AOE (damaging multiple enemies) with fairly low cooldown (4s). 14m range, so can be fired far away from danger.
* Lightning with 1st and 3rd skill unlocked (15% more Dmg and 250% Dmg on crit). Really low cooldown (3sec)/high Dmg skill. 12meter range, so ideal to just stay outside those nasty red circles that some bosses cast, while still being able to land your skill

Now, the next 2 skills are debatable and are more personal preference. I love time shift for its initial impact Dmg and DOT (Dmg over time), but I simply hate dropping that clock. Sometimes the drop locations seem to life their own live and a skill with fairly high cooldown (10sec) goes wasted. You also need to get almost on top of a boss to drop it in the right location and so risking your squishy mages' life.

I went with following 2 skills:

* Gale force with 1, 2 and 3. AOE Dmg, and I love to run fast lol. But seriously, that speed boost can save your life sometimes. It's also nice that the boost doesn't end before your skill cooldown, so you could almost continuously charge it up and keep running quick. I also included the 25% dodge self-buff that lasts for 3seconds. It's just long enough to get in your 9m range and out of it again with a fair chance to dodge any attacks and so stay alive. Skill cool down is medium (5.5s), but not as bad as time shift (10sec).
* frost bolt: with 1 and 2. 20% chance of an AOE attack (20%) and DOT + very low cooldown (3sec) and high range (14m) skill. DOT only works when charged though, as far as I could tell.

As passives:

Knowledge: 5/5
Might: 5/5 I'll probably put that into Dmg in the future, but until STS fixes the stats issue for Dmg increase (not being visible in stats page) I'll stay with might. Problem with my build is that it attracts agro like mad. And you need some health points 'when' (not 'if') a boss or mob comes for your tiny blue behind.

Pet: I went with Clyde (monkey), adds 10STR, 30 INT and 7% crit. The arcane ability isn't bad either, it's a chance to stun (I'd say 50/50 chance) and even works on bosses. It's only drawback is its fairly long cooldown time of around 18 seconds (if I remember correctly)

Colton might be better for the high crit buff for 2 or 3 seconds. Colton also has a fairly low cooldown of 7-8'ish seconds if I remember correct. And its arcane ability adds a lot of crit but lasts only very briefly.

Overall, I like Clyde better. For looks (lol), its stun and the permanent 7%crit increase. 10STR also adds another 100HP's to your health bar.

So, that's my build and gear. It does huge Dmg and gives fair protection but it sucks mana like crazy. If you can live with the mana usage, I'd definitely give it a shot

[Mysticaleagle]

Thx

The high Dmg build consists out of the following:

* Mythic mage helm (lv26 sealord of security helm would do, but your skill Dmg would decrease with 15 points, or 327 max Dmg for firebolt)
* lv26 sealord wrappings of security
* Ring: Lv25 sea captain's ring of warfare. It strangely adds 3 more to your Dmg stat as compared to the lv26 one. Talking about weird mechanics lol.
* pendant: Lv25 Infused brooch of assault. The lv26 one adds +0.4 Dmg, but I haven't found one yet. I do know they exist though, since a friend of mine showed it to me.

All points went into INT for maximum damage.

My skills are (for now, cause I change all the time lol):

* Fire 5/5: I included the hit debuff because it seems to help me stay alive. Fairly high Dmg spell, AOE (damaging multiple enemies) with fairly low cooldown (4s). 14m range, so can be fired far away from danger.
* Lightning with 1st and 3rd skill unlocked (15% more Dmg and 250% Dmg on crit). Really low cooldown (3sec)/high Dmg skill. 12meter range, so ideal to just stay outside those nasty red circles that some bosses cast, while still being able to land your skill

Now, the next 2 skills are debatable and are more personal preference. I love time shift for its initial impact Dmg and DOT (Dmg over time), but I simply hate dropping that clock. Sometimes the drop locations seem to life their own live and a skill with fairly high cooldown (10sec) goes wasted. You also need to get almost on top of a boss to drop it in the right location and so risking your squishy mages' life.

I went with following 2 skills:

* Gale force with 1, 2 and 3. AOE Dmg, and I love to run fast lol. But seriously, that speed boost can save your life sometimes. It's also nice that the boost doesn't end before your skill cooldown, so you could almost continuously charge it up and keep running quick. I also included the 25% dodge self-buff that lasts for 3seconds. It's just long enough to get in your 9m range and out of it again with a fair chance to dodge any attacks and so stay alive. Skill cool down is medium (5.5s), but not as bad as time shift (10sec).
* frost bolt: with 1 and 2. 20% chance of an AOE attack (20%) and DOT + very low cooldown (3sec) and high range (14m) skill. DOT only works when charged though, as far as I could tell.

As passives:

Knowledge: 5/5
Might: 5/5 I'll probably put that into Dmg in the future, but until STS fixes the stats issue for Dmg increase (not being visible in stats page) I'll stay with might. Problem with my build is that it attracts agro like mad. And you need some health points 'when' (not 'if') a boss or mob comes for your tiny blue behind.

Pet: I went with Clyde (monkey), adds 10STR, 30 INT and 7% crit. The arcane ability isn't bad either, it's a chance to stun (I'd say 50/50 chance) and even works on bosses. It's only drawback is its fairly long cooldown time of around 18 seconds (if I remember correctly)

Colton might be better for the high crit buff for 2 or 3 seconds. Colton also has a fairly low cooldown of 7-8'ish seconds if I remember correct. And its arcane ability adds a lot of crit but lasts only very briefly.

Overall, I like Clyde better. For looks (lol), its stun and the permanent 7%crit increase. 10STR also adds another 100HP's to your health bar.

So, that's my build and gear. It does huge Dmg and gives fair protection but it sucks mana like crazy. If you can live with the mana usage, I'd definitely give it a shot

Dude! Mate! Man! Just wow.
Thanks for that! Let my thanks come back, I'll thank these 10x!

[jb57542]

Great guide one way to squeeze a bit more damage is buy brutality ring and pendant. They give best DMG stats to mage but are expensive right now for lvl 25.

[GoodSyntax]

Terrific guide JaytB!

I get the question all the time in PvP with my Rogue about what's your DPS. When I say 174, they usually laugh, but when I say my DMG is 150, all of a sudden it's o.O

DMG is so much more important for skill damage that I am glad that you took the time to show what the impact is.

Just out of curiosity, have you figured out what impact the Bonus Dmg stat plays? I thought that it was a multiplier for your weapon damage, but my calculations don't line up. I am usually off by 10-15% which is significant for statistical purposes. I sure wish that STS listed either DMG or Speed on weapons so we can calculate the other values.

At any rate, wonderful work on the guide. Two thumbs up!!

[JaytB]

Great guide one way to squeeze a bit more damage is buy brutality ring and pendant. They give best DMG stats to mage but are expensive right now for lvl 25.

Thanks! Didn't know that. The ring adds 0.2dmg and 153 HP, but loses 30 armor. I didnt find a better amulet though, maybe it's just not for sale at the moment.

[JaytB]

Terrific guide JaytB!

I get the question all the time in PvP with my Rogue about what's your DPS. When I say 174, they usually laugh, but when I say my DMG is 150, all of a sudden it's o.O

DMG is so much more important for skill damage that I am glad that you took the time to show what the impact is.

Just out of curiosity, have you figured out what impact the Bonus Dmg stat plays? I thought that it was a multiplier for your weapon damage, but my calculations don't line up. I am usually off by 10-15% which is significant for statistical purposes. I sure wish that STS listed either DMG or Speed on weapons so we can calculate the other values.

At any rate, wonderful work on the guide. Two thumbs up!!

Sorry for the double post, somehow missed yours O.o

Someone told me that in order to have high crit you'd have to sacrifice Dmg on a rogue, but I haven't played rogue much yet so can't be sure. I would have thought Dmg would matter more though, especially with relative low crit numbers.

As for the bonus Dmg, I tried several calculations as well but haven't figured it out yet. And I agree that it would've been nice to get wep Dmg and speed instead of DPS in the description.

[GoodSyntax]

It's not so much that you have to sacrifice DMG for Crit, it's more that you have to choose between Crit and Dodge.

Instead of going all-out on any one stat, I choose to go with a high damage/high crit build with reasonable survivability statistics (Dodge & Armor). I had a Red Beard <something or other> of Security, which added more DMG, HP, but I ended losing 130 mana, which ultimately nerfed by ability to deliver damage.

My Lv 22 Rogue's Stats:



It's all a balancing act, because I have builds that get me to almost 30% crit, builds with >30% dodge, builds with >155 DMG, builds with >800 armor, but each one of these extreme builds introduces a significant weakness. My DMG build had low armor and such low mana that I couldn't fully realize the added DMG because without mana, I can't use my skills. My "tanky" build has such low DMG and Crit that I had a hard time killing anybody. My Dodge build was totally worthless (I believe that Dodge is an overrated stat, especially at endgame, because you really aren't dodging that often).

Rogues don't get the benefit of shielding, so, with extreme builds, they are like Staff Mages in PL - awesome nukers, but constantly one-hitted.

[CrimsonTider]

ZOMG!! It's a REAL guide!! Who authorized you to do such a thing to these forums??

[CosmoxKramer]

Nice guide

With the new Higher Damage weapons and the lack of fast lvl 26 weapons, Damage is definitely the way to go. At 21 max, damage wasn't as high, and i was getting a Rod of assault to have higher total dps than any gun.

There are 3 different scenarios where you play the game 3 different ways
PVP, trash clearing, boss fights

For PVP, crits and charging abilities is king because of the secondary effects and spiking damage.
For clearing trash, aoe is king with CC abilities being right up there on importance.
When you talk about which build high DPS or Damage damage does more damage, the only way to compare is 1:1 versus a boss or even a practice dummy.

I ran your numbers through my Sorcerer Calc (in sig)
On the DPS build i put the following priority
1 weapon
2 frost
3 lightning
4 fire
5 gale

i got the following assuming 45% armor reduction, and about 5% miss/dodge. I have done a lot of testing and it appears that crits do about 125% normal damage (except your lightning)
total DPS with above assumptions ranged from 452-463

Then using your High damage build i plugged in the numbers and i got
total DPS with above assumptions ranged from 504-521

For you Jaytb, i think you are really missing out on using Colton. I haven't built in his 6s of 15% crit Arcane ability into the calculator, but it does factor in the 10% damage. I think you are over valuing Crit and undervaluing Passive Damage% and Pet Damage%. Using your High Damage build:
total DPS with Colton (not using arcane) is 546-563
<Edit>fixed the value above with colton<edit>

My calculator is 300sec long to better average out your damage over a long boss fight.

[JaytB]

It's not so much that you have to sacrifice DMG for Crit, it's more that you have to choose between Crit and Dodge.

Instead of going all-out on any one stat, I choose to go with a high damage/high crit build with reasonable survivability statistics (Dodge & Armor). I had a Red Beard <something or other> of Security, which added more DMG, HP, but I ended losing 130 mana, which ultimately nerfed by ability to deliver damage.

My Lv 22 Rogue's Stats:



It's all a balancing act, because I have builds that get me to almost 30% crit, builds with >30% dodge, builds with >155 DMG, builds with >800 armor, but each one of these extreme builds introduces a significant weakness. My DMG build had low armor and such low mana that I couldn't fully realize the added DMG because without mana, I can't use my skills. My "tanky" build has such low DMG and Crit that I had a hard time killing anybody. My Dodge build was totally worthless (I believe that Dodge is an overrated stat, especially at endgame, because you really aren't dodging that often).

Rogues don't get the benefit of shielding, so, with extreme builds, they are like Staff Mages in PL - awesome nukers, but constantly one-hitted.

It's the same for mages, I mean the balancing act. I can get way more armor and health, but it will inevitably reduce my Dmg output. My build sucks mana like crazy, but for PvE that's not an issue because we can use mana pots.

I don't know much about rogues yet, I just started with a warrior and mage. I might come to you for advice on them if I ever decide to lvl my lv13 noob rogue a bit higher.

ZOMG!! It's a REAL guide!! Who authorized you to do such a thing to these forums??

Lol, ikr! Hope I won't get banned

Nice guide

With the new Higher Damage weapons and the lack of fast lvl 26 weapons, Damage is definitely the way to go. At 21 max, damage wasn't as high, and i was getting a Rod of assault to have higher total dps than any gun.

There are 3 different scenarios where you play the game 3 different ways
PVP, trash clearing, boss fights

For PVP, crits and charging abilities is king because of the secondary effects and spiking damage.
For clearing trash, aoe is king with CC abilities being right up there on importance.
When you talk about which build high DPS or Damage damage does more damage, the only way to compare is 1:1 versus a boss or even a practice dummy.

I ran your numbers through my Sorcerer Calc (in sig)
On the DPS build i put the following priority
1 weapon
2 frost
3 lightning
4 fire
5 gale

i got the following assuming 45% armor reduction, and about 5% miss/dodge. I have done a lot of testing and it appears that crits do about 125% normal damage (except your lightning)
total DPS with above assumptions ranged from 452-463

Then using your High damage build i plugged in the numbers and i got
total DPS with above assumptions ranged from 504-521

For you Jaytb, i think you are really missing out on using Colton. I haven't built in his 6s of 15% crit Arcane ability into the calculator, but it does factor in the 10% damage. I think you are over valuing Crit and undervaluing Passive Damage% and Pet Damage%. Using your High Damage build:
total DPS with Colton (not using arcane) is 557-572
<Edit>I forgot to subtract 7% crit but that is probably just 5-10 dps, I'll fix when I get home<edit>

My calculator is 300sec long to better average out your damage over a long boss fight.

Maybe share your calculator? Is it an Excel sheet or something else? I'd like to have a look at it sometime, if possible of course

As for crit doing 125% Dmg, I didn't know that. I assumed that like in PL, it would be 200% Dmg. If it's indeed just 125%, you're probably right about Colton. The crit buff only lasts 2 or 3 seconds though, so about half of your cooldown time. But yeah, I might give Colton another try and see where it leads me.

Thanks for your input!

[CosmoxKramer]

I posted the calculator in my signature. It's shared in google docs

I haven't tested crit damage since the KI patch. Too busy leveling when I can vs testing so far. Colton's arcane ability says it lasts 6s. Robots 40% crit buff is only 3s, but Colton gives 15% crit to the party instead of 1 person. So the 15% shoul last 60-75% of cool down.

[drgrimmy]

Good review. You should take note of one important point, armor and damage reduction works differently in al than in pl. Although I still agree with going with a higher damage build, the mechanics in al makes dps not as useless a stat as in pl. In al damage inflicted is a factor of your damage times a percentage damage reduction based on your enemies armor. It is not damage minus armor like it is in pl. You can see how this distinction makes a huge difference...

In PL: say you have two weapons with 300 dps, one a high dps weapon with 100 damage and the second a high damage weapon with 300 damage. Throw in the mix an enemy with 75 armor. With the high dps weapon in one second you will only do (100-75)x3=75 damage. With the high damage weapon in one second you will do 300-75=225 damage. Here you can clearly see that a high dps weapon is not as effective as a high damage weapon against an enemy with high armor.

In AL: say you have two weapons with 300 dps, one a high dps weapon with 100 damage and the second a high damage weapon with 300 damage. Throw in the mix an enemy with 75 armor, which for the sake of this argument (since the numbers are not really known) yeilds 50% damage reduction. With the high dps weapon in one second you will do (100x0.50)x3=150 damage. With the high damage weapon in one second you will do 300x0.50=150 damage. So disregarding skill damage (which is a huge deal with mages and mob clearing), the same amount of damage is done to a single enemy over time with a high dps versus a high damage weapon with the same dps.

Again, needless to say I would always choose a high damage weapon over a high dps weapon as I focus my build to clearing mobs and charging aoe skills. I just wanted to clarify the armor and damage reduction side of things, as this makes dps not as useless a stat in al as it is in pl.

[JaytB]

Good review. You should take note of one important point, armor and damage reduction works differently in al than in pl. Although I still agree with going with a higher damage build, the mechanics in al makes dps not as useless a stat as in pl. In al damage inflicted is a factor of your damage times a percentage damage reduction based on your enemies armor. It is not damage minus armor like it is in pl. You can see how this distinction makes a huge difference...

In PL: say you have two weapons with 300 dps, one a high dps weapon with 100 damage and the second a high damage weapon with 300 damage. Throw in the mix an enemy with 75 armor. With the high dps weapon in one second you will only do (100-75)x3=75 damage. With the high damage weapon in one second you will do 300-75=225 damage. Here you can clearly see that a high dps weapon is not as effective as a high damage weapon against an enemy with high armor.

In AL: say you have two weapons with 300 dps, one a high dps weapon with 100 damage and the second a high damage weapon with 300 damage. Throw in the mix an enemy with 75 armor, which for the sake of this argument (since the numbers are not really known) yeilds 50% damage reduction. With the high dps weapon in one second you will do (100x0.50)x3=150 damage. With the high damage weapon in one second you will do 300x0.50=150 damage. So disregarding skill damage (which is a huge deal with mages and mob clearing), the same amount of damage is done to a single enemy over time with a high dps versus a high damage weapon with the same dps.

Again, needless to say I would always choose a high damage weapon over a high dps weapon as I focus my build to clearing mobs and charging aoe skills. I just wanted to clarify the armor and damage reduction side of things, as this makes dps not as useless a stat in al as it is in pl.

I don't think there are weapons with .33x (3x a second as in your example) weapon speed, are there? Maybe the example is a bit extreme but I get what you're saying. This mechanic would indeed explain why high DPS weapons are more effective as compared to PL.

But that's if you auto-attack (or however it's called here). I got hardly any dead spots in my skill rotation so I don't really get a chance to use the attack button a lot. And then there's that generally terrible weapon range, especially with those lv25 high DPS/rods.

Anyway, thanks for clarifying. Learning something new everyday

[CosmoxKramer]

Hey Jay, i fixed the value with Colton and removed the 7% crit from Clyde. it dropped the total DPS by 9.