Has rouge crit been Nerfed?

[Soundlesskill]

Howdy

THIS IS ONLY TESTED IN ELITE :)

I noticed today thag my dmg in elite maps and arena is wayyyyyyyy lower than it was just 24 hours ago. I see my crits barely reaching 1k anymore. 800 if im lucky. I have full crit passive too, using ribbit a few times. I crit but its barely 1k.

I know I asked for a crit nerf, but now that warrs have as much HP as they do our crit should be able to hit 2k. With the low mana it would be almost impossible to kill 6k hp only crit if 800 per shot.

EDIT#1: It would make it more impossible, because warrs armor is around 2,5k and would lower our crit even more 400 probably + chest splitter... Yuck, stop the what if's Noisy!

BUT I dont know if the crit has been nerfed, if it had I suggest you raise our dmg again seeing as crit is the better way to kill a mob.

ALSO if crit has been nerfed, please inform us so we know our pros and cons so we can adjust...

[Bless]

Im done with AL is this is the case.

[Derezzzed]

Howdy

THIS IS ONLY TESTED IN ELITE :)

I noticed today thag my dmg in elite maps and arena is wayyyyyyyy lower than it was just 24 hours ago. I see my crits barely reaching 1k anymore. 800 if im lucky. I have full crit passive too, using ribbit a few times. I crit but its barely 1k.

I know I asked for a crit nerf, but now that warrs have as much HP as they do our crit should be able to hit 2k. With the low mana it would be almost impossible to kill 6k hp only crit if 800 per shot.

EDIT#1: It would make it more impossible, because warrs armor is around 2,5k and would lower our crit even more 400 probably + chest splitter... Yuck, stop the what if's Noisy!

BUT I dont know if the crit has been nerfed, if it had I suggest you raise our dmg again seeing as crit is the better way to kill a mob.

ALSO if crit has been nerfed, please inform us so we know our pros and cons so we can adjust...

I noticed this in Elite and PVP that my Crits are hitting significantly lower than yesterday I hope there wasn't a silent patch or more nerfing :/

[Soundlesskill]

Ye:/

[Bless]

......It would be nice for a dev to shine a torch in right now.

[Veluthe]

I hope this isnt true. I think devs would have mentioned it though considering wars just got buff dmg and mages crit. It wouldn't be fair if they got buff and us rogue nerf.

[Alfai]

I tried not to pay attention tho i admit some differences.ive never died of same mobs for almost 10times in inan that really pissed me off ystrday.its been my worst run,even for my poor arena performance.and i didnt simply remaked the runs as i hardly believe theres been a change.i did reckon the damage taken is slower than my usual.but i divert it to my party setup and build,still unable to erase this small hint of doubt.
If it was the result of a poor build its hard to convince me as ive been maximizing my dmg output for different conditions.and the diff in my pvp build is too small to make the change if it is in fact a changing to be noticable.which explains why most if my time todag spent on forums not in game.

If it did change i cant hide my dissapointment.not because of whatever changes and its details but solely on not beinf made aware that this was made.ive felt useless enough by not being able to contribute and perform my role well in a fight.so double that with the nerf dmf if its real.

If this is done in a silent manner i can expect a rage from the rogue community towards such act without even going into the details of change.i have faith that perhapss some slight faulty had happened yesterday thts worth a check n tell.

[Derezzzed]

A Dev really needs to shine some light on this *bump*

[Soundlesskill]

Yea devs... Cmon

[Derezzzed]

*bump* this needs to be answered there ls a SIGNIFICANT difference in the crit damage output output since 24h ago

[Soundlesskill]

Hahahha BUMP!

[Derezzzed]

*bump*

[Veluthe]

Should have put devs read in title lol.

Cmon devs us rogues are worried...

[Energizeric]

Very interesting... Last night when doing a few elite runs I did notice that the rogue did not seem to be pulling their weight. I just thought maybe we had a lousy rogue. But it seemed like it was taking forever to take out the bosses.

On the plus side, I have noticed a significant damage increase in the critical hits on the mobs. It seems I am much more powerful against mobs now than I used to be. But against the boss it's not a noticeable change.

[Derezzzed]

Very interesting... Last night when doing a few elite runs I did notice that the rogue did not seem to be pulling their weight. I just thought maybe we had a lousy rogue. But it seemed like it was taking forever to take out the bosses.

On the plus side, I have noticed a significant damage increase in the critical hits on the mobs. It seems I am much more powerful against mobs now than I used to be. But against the boss it's not a noticeable change.

That's because of the Sorcerors spell crit dmg getting increased as well as the ability for your DOT to crit, nonetheless still waiting for a answer to this thread

[Kraze]

A Dev really needs to shine some light on this *bump*

It's the weekend you won't be getting a response today. Also and feel free to correct me but didn't the patch notes mention reducing damage in pvp?

[Derezzzed]

It's the weekend you won't be getting a response today. Also and feel free to correct me but didn't the patch notes mention reducing damage in pvp?

It's not straight damage were talking about its critical damage (the damage on a crit) and its not just for PVP it's for everything, normal, elite & pvp and it's been a lot lower damage just today yesterday no problem hitting 1.2k Crits but now I'm barely hitting 800 (same map, same mobs, same gear, same pet) & obviously I'm not the only rouge that feels that there's been a "change" since last night that's why we are all waiting for a dev to answer guess it'll have to wait till monday

[Zeus]

Perhaps they accidentally applied the damage reduction nerf to PvE as well? That's a likely possibility.

[Derezzzed]

Perhaps they accidentally applied the damage reduction nerf to PvE as well? That's a likely possibility.

Possibly but like stated in this thread it's only really been noticed since last night/this morning

Have you personally felt a difference yourself?

[Kraze]

Perhaps they accidentally applied the damage reduction nerf to PvE as well? That's a likely possibility.

Possibly but like stated in this thread it's only really been noticed since last night/this morning

Have you personally felt a difference yourself?

Wouldn't that require a patch? Pains me to admit Apollo could be right.

[Derezzzed]

Wouldn't that require a patch? Pains me to admit Apollo could be right.

It could be possible that no one really noticed/said anything till today, it could be possible that Apollo is right but if that true wouldn't it effect all classes and not just rouges??

[Kraze]

Wouldn't that require a patch? Pains me to admit Apollo could be right.

It could be possible that no one really noticed/said anything till today, it could be possible that Apollo is right but if that true wouldn't it effect all classes and not just rouges??

I don't know if there was a flat reduction in damage to all three classes one line of code could fix but if the % drop was not even its possible the rouge could of been written to include both

[Derezzzed]

I don't know if there was a flat reduction in damage to all three classes one line of code could fix but if the % drop was not even its possible the rouge could of been written to include both

Yes that's quite possible actually, guess we won't know till a dev comments but it's a little frustration feeling like its less crit dmg when we dmg got nerfed earlier in the season :/

[Derezzzed]

*bump*

[ooommmggg]

Maybe there's a reason that the devs aren't replying... like (cough) it's true (cough)

[Soundlesskill]

I've noticed the 'nerf' on crit not dmg..

[KingMartin]

bump

I had the same feeling yesterday - taking down Ferrix took forever and I thought our sorc's pet was to blame (lousy pets he had).

It can very well be that my crit bow shots did not work as usual.

I am sure there have been hidden changes (like crate drop rate) during the last patch.

[xcainnblecterx]

As far as i can tell it seems fine. Dont play rogue much but in pvp im getting taken down quick with or without shield on sorc from rogue crits and in pve i see rogues hittin crits alot

[Soundlesskill]

As far as i can tell it seems fine. Dont play rogue much but in pvp im getting taken down quick with or without shield on sorc from rogue crits and in pve i see rogues hittin crits alot


Howdy

THIS IS ONLY TESTED IN ELITE :)[/B]


:)))

[iluvataris]

I noticed this aswell. Over the course of about 10 runs I did not hit an aimed shot higher then 1.6 on normal frostbite.

[baddiva]

thank god.. i almost think that i've messed around my setup or forgot to wear a gear

Sent from my LG-P970 using Xparent Green Tapatalk 2

[Derezzzed]

Maybe there's a reason that the devs aren't replying... like (cough) it's true (cough)

*bump* I hope it's not

[FluffNStuff]

Can you explain the nerf on crit that you speak of. Do you mean less crits, all your crits are hitting for less damage, or specific skills are critting for less damage?

[Zuzeq]

I don't think it's just crit. I have seen all around lower damage output during this pass weekend while running elite.

[Alrisaia]

My best guess is the high armor of Shuyal Mobs.

[Yakiniku]

Perhaps they accidentally applied the damage reduction nerf to PvE as well? That's a likely possibility.

Haha it wouldn't be the first time. I remember when they first adjusted stuns for pvp, mages couldn't freeze anything in pve that had already been stunned by a fireball. I guess the newly implemented immunity was being applied in pve too.

Hopefully a dev sees this thread and can check on this. Watered down rogue crits kind of defeats the purpose of the class.

[iluvataris]

And not just shuya or elite. My case was normal frostbite in crystal caverns.

[FluffNStuff]

If it is ~just~ arena, then that would make sense. It means they finally upped the enemies there to 36. The enemies ~should~ have armor that does a 45% damage reduction and if they were level 31 before, then the damage modifier of an attacking level 36 would 'nerf the mobs armor'. It is the same way a level 31 can one shot crit Mother for 6K while Ribit farming. Players may have just been over powered before.

[Jenvy]

My best guess is the high armor of Shuyal Mobs.

Yea. I think it is this. Elite Rooks seems about the same. Perhaps you're just now noticing the lower numbers in Shuyal and Nordr.

Dev comment would be nice though.

[Khylan]

I wish there was a log we could parse to see what the numbers actually are :(

Single pulling as much as I can in elite Ashral Tower, only using AS and Haze as pet, the highest crit I made on a trash mob was 3423. Low crit range 1700's, most between 1900 and 2200. This is with 370 skill damage and 346% damage bonus.

I tried Elite Brackenridge and was able to score a crit of 4500 using AS, so I think maybe Shuyal mobs in general may have had an armor increase?

Does anyone know the formula for max theoretical damage on an unarmored target using charged AS?

[Derezzzed]

If it is ~just~ arena, then that would make sense. It means they finally upped the enemies there to 36. The enemies ~should~ have armor that does a 45% damage reduction and if they were level 31 before, then the damage modifier of an attacking level 36 would 'nerf the mobs armor'. It is the same way a level 31 can one shot crit Mother for 6K while Ribit farming. Players may have just been over powered before.

It's not just shuyal it's everywhere in general, elite, arena, normal maps & to answer your previous question it's the damage hit on a critical shot seems a lot lower

[FluffNStuff]

I wish there was a log we could parse to see what the numbers actually are :(

Single pulling as much as I can in elite Ashral Tower, only using AS and Haze as pet, the highest crit I made on a trash mob was 3423. Low crit range 1700's, most between 1900 and 2200. This is with 370 skill damage and 346% damage bonus.

I tried Elite Brackenridge and was able to score a crit of 4500 using AS, so I think maybe Shuyal mobs in general may have had an armor increase?

Does anyone know the formula for max theoretical damage on an unarmored target using charged AS?

Uhh, there is NO issue then. Elite Breckinridge mobs are 25. Elite Ashral are 36. So 34 on a 36 vs 45 on a 25, yeah, that sounds about right. If players are used to beating up on lower level mobs, even elite ones, and are now seeing their damage going down, it is not going down, it is just returning to earth.

[Derezzzed]

Still waiting for a dev to shine some light down on this though

[DexterityX]

i just tumbled upon this thread and log in to the game and tested for my self(havent farmed since the last patch).. yes critical damage got lower.. previously i could make critically from boss from 1.5k - 2k+ something.. but now cant hardly get 900+ critical damage on bosses.. devs should check on the damage system.

free bump!

[Swede]

Nothing was touched on Rogues in this last patch. We wouldn't just change Rogue crits and not put it in the patch notes. The only bosses that were made tougher were Bael II and Krunch II.

[iluvataris]

Hmm thats strange because i remember hitting much higher at 31 in normal crystal caverns then 1.6k on normal frostbite. But yesterday at 36 in normal crystal caverns there were alot of triple digit damage aimed shots. highest crits being 1.6k ill try some more runs after work. Now ill be really looking at the numbers.

[KingMartin]

Nothing was touched on Rogues in this last patch. We wouldn't just change Rogue crits and not put it in the patch notes. The only bosses that were made tougher were Bael II and Krunch II.

Thank you Swede :)

So, does that mean that feelings about doing less damage and having significantly reduced crate drop (Km3, Tunnels) are just subjective feelings, respectively bad luck of the parties?

[Jenvy]

Nothing was touched on Rogues in this last patch. We wouldn't just change Rogue crits and not put it in the patch notes. The only bosses that were made tougher were Bael II and Krunch II.

I don't think anyone seriously believes that crits were nerfed without y'all telling anyone. I think they're suggesting that there might be some bug, or other factor that is decreasing damage.

IMO, it's just the shock of seeing such huge crits in kraken and below, then shifting to scaled Nordr and Shuyal and seeing your damage go back to normal.

Worth a double-check though.

[iluvataris]

I just did a fast normal crystal caverns run. Maybe yesterday i was wearing lep pendent in my runs . But not today, i was wearing all my mythic and hj pet. Only aimed shots on NORMAL frostbite. My highest crit was 1.75k. then instantly went to ELITE brackenridge and im hitting ez 3k+

Is that how its suposed to work?

[Soundlesskill]

Can you explain the nerf on crit that you speak of. Do you mean less crits, all your crits are hitting for less damage, or specific skills are critting for less damage?

Crit dmg is lower than usual.

[Soundlesskill]

I just did a fast normal crystal caverns run. Maybe yesterday i was wearing lep pendent in my runs . But not today, i was wearing all my mythic and hj pet. Only aimed shots on NORMAL frostbite. My highest crit was 1.75k. then instantly went to ELITE brackenridge and im hitting ez 3k+

Is that how its suposed to work?

Same same

[FluffNStuff]

I just did a fast normal crystal caverns run. Maybe yesterday i was wearing lep pendent in my runs . But not today, i was wearing all my mythic and hj pet. Only aimed shots on NORMAL frostbite. My highest crit was 1.75k. then instantly went to ELITE brackenridge and im hitting ez 3k+

Is that how its suposed to work?

Absolutely. ELITE Brackenridge mobs are 11 levels lower then you, so you were pretty much ignoring their armor.

[Soundlesskill]

Nothing was touched on Rogues in this last patch. We wouldn't just change Rogue crits and not put it in the patch notes. The only bosses that were made tougher were Bael II and Krunch II.

I would like a double check too

[Derezzzed]

I would like a double check too

^same, there's just something not right with the dmg

[Swede]

Yeah going to any of the lower level Elites, you'll get huge numbers because you're so much higher level.

We'll keep an eye on it and see we can figure anything out. Any accidental change that affected it though would have affected all three classes, not just Rogues.

[FluffNStuff]

Yeah going to any of the lower level Elites, you'll get huge numbers because you're so much higher level.

We'll keep an eye on it and see we can figure anything out. Any accidental change that affected it though would have affected all three classes, not just Rogues.

As I and a lot of players were rushing to 36 this past weekend, delaying the patch that closes free respecs till tomorrow would help players to test this.

[Derezzzed]

Yeah going to any of the lower level Elites, you'll get huge numbers because you're so much higher level.

We'll keep an eye on it and see we can figure anything out. Any accidental change that affected it though would have affected all three classes, not just Rogues.

I figured it would have affected all 3, but idk check it out just to be sure, I mean socerors may not have noticed it due to there crit dmg getting boosted and there dot being able to crit, warriors idk, but let us know if anything is or isn't changed :p :)

[Carapace]

One of the possibilities here is being out of sync with previous changes and returning players.

About a month ago we nerfed BOWS across the board for the most part, fixing a bug and bringing them all back in the realm of normality. If the players raising these points are just returning to the game they may not be aware that this change was made and feel they are missing out on that damage potentially.

We are still looking for anything that points to foul play and have yet to turn up anything that would effect such a thing just yet. We're still looking into it.

[iluvataris]

I think thats alot of armor for a normal nordr map, I wonder how well it goes for players with cheap gear : /

[Derezzzed]

One of the possibilities here is being out of sync with previous changes and returning players.

About a month ago we nerfed BOWS across the board for the most part, fixing a bug and bringing them all back in the realm of normality. If the players raising these points are just returning to the game they may not be aware that this change was made and feel they are missing out on that damage potentially.

We are still looking for anything that points to foul play and have yet to turn up anything that would effect such a thing just yet. We're still looking into it.

I can't speak for anyone else but I've played pretty much every day since that nerf xP it's not that, I'm aware my regular damage is lower since that nerf but the damage hit when a critical happens seems a lot lower just recently

Edit: Thank you for keeping us updated

[Soundlesskill]

I think thats alot of armor for a normal nordr map, I wonder how well it goes for players with cheap gear : /

The only mobs with high armor is the ones at Mariner Reed and Lost Cove. Ghost mobs and Kraken Mine 1.
The new mobs has high HP Before te suspicious nerf my 4k crits woul only take 1/8 of the mages HP

[Derezzzed]

*bump* (?)

[Derezzzed]

Bump

[Jenvy]

So, I did an extensive bout of solo testing today. Going to supply you with the raw numbers.

The following tests were performed by a L36 rogue with 320 damage and a Devourer bow. I spent about 5 mins in each run, slowly killing the first couple sets of mobs. I did two runs of each zone, one run with shadowveil, and one run without.

I'm using the devourer bow, and these were all outliers from the average shot... probably meaning these AS crits had the 'Bonus damage' proc applied to them (perhaps someone with similar damage could repeat the same test with a different weapon).

Elite Rooks nest

- Highest regular crit 4.4k
- Highest shadowveil crit 4.9k


Elite Dead City outskirts

- Highest regular crit 2.4k
- Highest shadowveil crit 2.9k


Elite Windemoore Harbor

- Highest regular crit 2.6k
- Highest shadowveil crit 3.3k

Elite Oltgar

-Highest regular crit 2.6k
-highest shaodwveil crit 2.9k

Elite Shuyal plains

-Highest reg crit 2.6k
-Highest shadowveil crit 3.0k

Overall, the average shot did seem a little low, but perhaps I was never really paying attention before. Let me also say that I noticed significantly lower damage on undead enemies.

I'll let you make of that what you will.

[FluffNStuff]

So, I did an extensive bout of solo testing today. Going to supply you with the raw numbers.

The following tests were performed by a L36 rogue with 320 damage and a Devourer bow. I spent about 5 mins in each run, slowly killing the first couple sets of mobs. I did two runs of each zone, one run with shadowveil, and one run without.

I'm using the devourer bow, and these were all outliers from the average shot... probably meaning these AS crits had the 'Bonus damage' proc applied to them (perhaps someone with similar damage could repeat the same test with a different weapon).

Elite Rooks nest

- Highest regular crit 4.4k
- Highest shadowveil crit 4.9k


Elite Shuyal plains

-Highest reg crit 2.6k
-Highest shadowveil crit 3.0k

I noticed significantly lower damage on undead enemies.

I'll let you make of that what you will.

Couple quick comments. There is a significant level damage modifier that has been discussed and is showing here. But what I wanted to mention is your undead enemies. Those are 'warrior' class mobs, which typically have a 40-45% armor reducer, and your damage will be lower on them then it will be on Mages or Archers, as they typically run 20-25%, just like player Sorc/Rogues.
Another big issue with this testing is that Aim Shot is both a roll and has a stacking armor reducer. The roll part means your damage on unarmored same level is roughly 700 + a Roll from 0 to 500. It is that value that then crits. This is why you are seeing such wide ranges. The reason this makes it so hard to test is if you have that armor reduction in, you CAN NOT compare the first Aim Shot to the Second or the Third, because by the Third shot, the Target has about 30% less armor then when you hit him the first time. So if you are Rolling high on your first shots in one area and rolling high on your third shots in another area, then that throws everything off.
FUN!!!

[Carapace]

These numbers look appropriate, and since yesterday we have not been able to identify anywhere that something like this would have been adjusted by us. Accidentally or intentionally. We feel like we're on a wild goose chase, as we have turned up nothing to indicate the issues outlined throughout this thread.

Thanks for your diligence! It's very useful.

[Soundlesskill]

Ive only ben farming arena like 100 times from day 1 of expansion and I definitely feel weaker there. Only there..