View Full Version : Razerbacks in PvP
Hey all,
So, I was just wondering about anybody else who has tested the Razerback daggers in PvP. In my experience, I was critting 3.1k-3.4k pretty often (50% or more of the time). Now, against a rogue or sorcerer, that is instant-death to those going up against it.
Those who have faced the Razerbacks, what is your opinion on them? What about those who use them? As of right now... I think that they may have just tipped PvP completely in the rogues favor.
P.S: Keep in mind that I was replicating those numbers without the damage proc (or so I think...it was late at night).
Haligali
09-24-2013, 09:35 AM
I think its the most op of the 3 new weapon, +94 point to str int dex stats..
i'll pass pvp in this season.
Limsi
09-24-2013, 09:44 AM
I own one and I'll admit it's a little bit o.p. If this is an answer to balancing classes (assuming here), I'd have to say it went a little overboard.
But then again 5-8 games of testing won't conclude.. I'll give more feedbacks in a week's time.
falmear
09-24-2013, 11:48 AM
If either of you want a test dummy, you can hit me with aimed shot and record the damage. To one shot me you'd need to crit 3.3k with mythic staff. Or 3.1k with mythic gun.
keikali
09-24-2013, 12:50 PM
Parth, I believe the proc comes up pretty often no?
Its good to see that even Rogues agree they went a bit overboard on the daggers.
iluvataris
09-24-2013, 01:17 PM
Actually the proc rare in pvp and when it does proc mostly its when i dont need it. But i have to admit when it does proc in 1v1 gg. Or 5v5 pop that razor shield dive bomb rogues and sorcs. Can't a brotha keep his daggers?
Do you guys want every rogue to use a bow?
wvhills
09-24-2013, 01:25 PM
i quit pvp at the end of last season and probably won't play this one either. I got tired of rogues being nerfed. If they are OP then keep it to yourself and go own all those whiney tanks and mages!
iluvataris
09-24-2013, 01:26 PM
If daggers were nerfed i would choose mythic bow over daggers. You have the ranged stun better survivability iin a way cause you can kite.
It would also cause me to switch builds back to aimed,nox,sp health packs. Just like every other pvp rogue.
Daggers have to have some edge to them for having to be up close and personal.
We need some variety for rogues and i think this helps.
iluvataris
09-24-2013, 01:27 PM
Im sick of being nerfed aswell since the beggining of pvp
gundamsone
09-24-2013, 01:28 PM
It's too hard to decide if the wep is OP or not in PVP b/c most the regular in pvp havn't yet upgraded their gear.
If you got razobacks chances are you're one of the few in the game with it.
In my last 10 CTF matchups, good 80-90% of players don't have the new weps.
To me, if you got it, it means you're a supporter and/or you've earned your gold.
People who have it deserve it and should obviously be performing better than the outdated geared players.
Just because a bunch of players feel like they're overpowered does not always mean they need to be nerfed.
I see far too many pvp regulars who don't farm or attempt to make money trying to "nerf" everything that's more OP just b/c they can't easily obtain the gear themselves.
..so maybe they should spend some time and make some money instead because pvp skills can only give you so much advantage and after that it comes down to gear/pets/luck.
To sum it up, with a 5 level advantage and 290 hp, 2 crit, 15.5 dmg increase over the bow, it seems like a balanced weapon.
keikali
09-24-2013, 01:33 PM
What needs to be nerfed is the Arcane Shield <.<
I could care less about the damage.
gundamsone
09-24-2013, 01:44 PM
How about we stop with the "lets nerf/buff new weps"
Someone go make a thread ask 10 good pvpers with the new weapons.
Balance the team and make them play 10 ctf games.
You'll get your OP or not results from those games.
@dead I think sts gave what rogues want (survivability) in the form of a wep proc that really only activates at best 5-10%
it's really not that op b/c we're the only class without a shield, without 2s invincibility, and the only class that has to hunt for their heals
hey don't activate on their own and only activates on auto attacking which is somewhat usless in big 5v5 clashes
the time it takes to charge auto (and hopefully get the buff) is far less productive than spending that same time and charging your nox/aimshot etc.
I actually did about 30 1v1's vs aquatrex and frynoodles and they did not activate once b/c any good rogue will know it's not worthwhile to slash in midair for the proc...that's just suicide in a fight
overall the shield buff favors more for pve farming and survivability in elites
i quit pvp at the end of last season and probably won't play this one either. I got tired of rogues being nerfed. If they are OP then keep it to yourself and go own all those whiney tanks and mages!
I too am tired of the rogues getting nerfed honestly. There's those complainers like Frohanatur who complain about rogues being underpowered but when you look at their gear... there's not even one mythic in the equation & they're going up against mythic rogues. What did they think will happen?
However, that being said, I do like the daggers! I wonder how a 1v1 vs bow would play out with them.
Bless
09-24-2013, 02:29 PM
I too am tired of the rogues getting nerfed honestly. There's those complainers like Frohanatur who complain about rogues being underpowered but when you look at their gear... there's not even one mythic in the equation & they're going up against mythic rogues. What did they think will happen?
However, that being said, I do like the daggers! I wonder how a 1v1 vs bow would play out with them. The weapon in general is well deserved after 2 seasons of the rogues not getting any buffs etc.
For an overall conclusion for pvp: I think luck will devour the real pvp experience. (From all classes: stuns, crits, dodge) These factors will probably raise over 40 dodge+crit for a rogue and damage over 500 for mages, 7k hp for tanks etc next expansion. I do not think that all of these stats will be balanced. I love the way STG used the dmg nerf to shorten fights - lets hope it will last for over 2 expansions.
Taejo
09-24-2013, 03:03 PM
I love the way STG used the dmg nerf to shorten fights - lets hope it will last for over 2 expansions.
I was under the impression that they modified the damage in PvP in order to make fights "more interesting" (implied as longer from my point of view), not to shorten them.
Back on topic: I think the Razorbacks are pretty powerful, and I agree with Limsy that we'll need to use them longer than one weekend to make an accurate assessment of their "OPness" in PvP.
Soundlesskill
09-24-2013, 03:10 PM
How come rouges is the dmg class when cleary our class has the least dmg. Lol.
How come rouges is the dmg class when cleary our class has the least dmg. Lol.
Honestly, in none of the STG games are the damage dealing class the highest in damage. However, their skills are designed to maximize efficient use of the damage that they do have. That way, the lower damage can be up to twice as efficient due to debuffs. Also, when it's like this, it makes a rogue essential to have in the party so that all party members can hit harder... not just rogues.
Bless
09-24-2013, 04:05 PM
I was under the impression that they modified the damage in PvP in order to make fights "more interesting" (implied as longer from my point of view), not to shorten them.
Back on topic: I think the Razorbacks are pretty powerful, and I agree with Limsy that we'll need to use them longer than one weekend to make an accurate assessment of their "OPness" in PvP. I meant longer* not shorter derp.
Soundlesskill
09-25-2013, 12:16 AM
Honestly, in none of the STG games are the damage dealing class the highest in damage. However, their skills are designed to maximize efficient use of the damage that they do have. That way, the lower damage can be up to twice as efficient due to debuffs. Also, when it's like this, it makes a rogue essential to have in the party so that all party members can hit harder... not just rogues.
Lolololol it's just kinda weird o.o
Haligali
09-25-2013, 03:58 AM
How come rouges is the dmg class when cleary our class has the least dmg. Lol.
Rogues got the most damage, maybe stat wise you dont see, but i think you know it. :)
Razor gives +94 points to overall stats, orbital just +79, that means +3 extra skill point on passives. The sorcerer weapon got a bit 0.04% armor but that does not pay off the huge difference, not to mention the proc, they can not be compared.
kharmel
09-26-2013, 02:55 PM
Lolololol it's just kinda weird o.o
high crit chance and 250% damage makes our damage higher though based on stat page,we have the least damage.
high crit chance and 250% damage makes our damage higher though based on stat page,we have the least damage.
not to mention the -armor (that stacks?)
Haligali
09-27-2013, 02:13 AM
not to mention the -armor (that stacks?)
I noticed that here in the forum we have a very successful acting rogue lobby, they argue exact opposite what the reality, result is they got always the best weapons.
Yesterday i joined some ctf games, where the speakers here got half of the kills, what nerf are they talkin about?
Paulsebi
09-27-2013, 02:28 AM
I noticed that here in the forum we have a very successful acting rogue lobby, they argue exact opposite what the reality, result is they got always the best weapons.
Yesterday i joined some ctf games, where the speakers here got half of the kills, what nerf are they talkin about?
Agree :) lmao always same rogues same complains...but as I will quit and tired of these rogues ... I don't care anymore :)
Soundlesskill
09-27-2013, 02:47 AM
Rogues got the most damage, maybe stat wise you dont see, but i think you know it. :)
Razor gives +94 points to overall stats, orbital just +79, that means +3 extra skill point on passives. The sorcerer weapon got a bit 0.04% armor but that does not pay off the huge difference, not to mention the proc, they can not be compared.
Yeah ik, but it's still a lil weird ;o
Soundlesskill
09-27-2013, 02:47 AM
Remove the shield proc in pvp..........
Haligali
09-27-2013, 04:09 AM
Im sick of being nerfed aswell since the beggining of pvp
Hey Illu!
No offense, but look what i found in your signature:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwJe2ur4Kas
you kill warriors with arcane weapon in row under the lvl31 cap (the warrior expansion) wish i can do that :)
iluvataris
09-27-2013, 07:01 AM
None taken : )
Energizeric
09-27-2013, 07:28 AM
I've noticed something in PvP this season that I've not seen anyone else discuss. Probably due to the normal 5 level increases in stats that occur every campaign, rogues are starting to get to the point where the dodge % is becoming very noticeable. It reminds me of how bears were at level 76 in PL.
The formula for me to beat a rogue is to stun them with fireball, and then use the panic from slag shortly afterwards. If either of those 2 fails, I will lose the battle every time. I'll add that I am full mythic, so it's not like I have bad gear. During last season, I could land both of those stuns about half of the time. The other half of the time one or the other would miss. Also, even if I did land both stuns, it was no guarantee to win as some rogues had enough health that I couldn't finish them off before the second stun wore off and then they would get to their health packs and take me down.
Well this season, I'm lucky to land both stuns 20% of the time. I played tonight with rogues I normally dominate and I failed to win a single battle. I spent an hour in TDM and had 3 times more deaths than kills. This has convinced me that in order to be successful in PvP I need to upgrade my weapon to the arcane staff. So I'll be taking a break from pvp until the time comes when I am able to afford that weapon. I'm about 20% of the way there, so I'm guessing I won't be back until 2-3 months. Unless there is some major change in PvP which convinces me to come back.
iluvataris
09-27-2013, 08:16 AM
Razor shield ftw!
ipredator
09-27-2013, 04:36 PM
tested it for few hours.. easily to win any handicap.. eg 3v1 against fully geared rogues.. it procs alot.. it either needs a nerf, or the bow needs a buff.. bow for pvp is faster, more safe, means less deaths and more kills.. for 1v1, i preffer a bow, team battles.. daggers for sure.
iluvataris
09-27-2013, 05:23 PM
Selling mythic razorbacks.
iluvataris
09-27-2013, 05:27 PM
The bow is level 31 the daggers 36 what do you expect?
Do you want there to be no reward for the risk of being up close to use the dps?
Azepeiete
09-29-2013, 05:42 PM
Don't you dare get my daggers nerfed
Don't you dare get my daggers nerfed
LOL!
Making a thread right now...;)
iluvataris
09-29-2013, 09:40 PM
(shakes fist at apollo)
(likes azepeiete's post)
Ebezaanec
09-29-2013, 10:26 PM
(shakes fist at apollo)
(likes azepeiete's post)
Just a fist or.... A specific digit? ;)
Terracio
09-30-2013, 06:57 PM
Ive played a lot of rogues using those and they aren't overly powerful, the only thing is the shield which only once has it appeared midfight and its not something that can be controlled.
If they do more dmg its the tradeoff for having to get up close which is fine.