My current thoughts with the new updates (End Game)

[XghostzX]

So far, I see that progress is being made somewhat. Here are some things that really stick out to me:

1.) Savage Sets still have an edge. There advantage in both damage and armor is really unfair, based off of stats. Their roles should require tanking, and taking time to kill other classes because they're str focused. This will encourage more strategic play.

2.) The orb problem. Unfortunately, the orb problem has allowed no CTF matches to be relatively fun. I'd personally prefer that the orb system was removed, and we came back to the way things were.

3.) Merging. This problem has been acknowledged several times, and doesn't just refer to end gamers, but to all levels. Instead of the levels being +-5, it should be around 3-4.

35 PvP is extremely balanced and fun atm. Fights take time to do, and the stats are really balanced. That would be a good place to compare end game stats with.

Thanks for your attention...

[johnny6880]

U obviously a savage user they need to nerf that set noobs claiming to be good with it

[XghostzX]

U obviously a savage user they need to nerf that set noobs claiming to be good with it

No, I'm saying that Savage Sets are too over powered. I use INT gear, and am against the savage gear... sheesh. The community nowadays.

[Roberto077]

No, I'm saying that Savage Sets are too over powered. I use INT gear, and am against the savage gear... sheesh. The community nowadays.

I know, right? People don't read attentively anymore :(


U obviously a savage user they need to nerf that set noobs claiming to be good with it

Read.

[johnny6880]

I am sorry i miss read wrong i am an int user to "godsflame"

[Waug]

There are many unbalance problems (severe) other than just "savage is op", that devs really need to look after.

[Samopwn]

So far, I see that progress is being made somewhat. Here are some things that really stick out to me:

1.) Savage Sets still have an edge. There advantage in both damage and armor is really unfair, based off of stats. Their roles should require tanking, and taking time to kill other classes because they're str focused. This will encourage more strategic play.

2.) The orb problem. Unfortunately, the orb problem has allowed no CTF matches to be relatively fun. I'd personally prefer that the orb system was removed, and we came back to the way things were.

3.) Merging. This problem has been acknowledged several times, and doesn't just refer to end gamers, but to all levels. Instead of the levels being +-5, it should be around 3-4.

35 PvP is extremely balanced and fun atm. Fights take time to do, and the stats are really balanced. That would be a good place to compare end game stats with.

Thanks for your attention...

I agree totally . Orb and savage both are a problem.

[XghostzX]

There are many unbalance problems (severe) other than just "savage is op", that devs really need to look after.

I agree. These are just my first and prioritized thoughts. I see every class using savage and there's absolutely no diversity with gear.

[Chickenrunnn]

Based dodge from savage is more important than birds buffed dodge.. lol :)

About the Orb, it is a good system, except it lasts too long, and than it is still effective when you respawn from mage or rhino revive.

As I said in many previous thread, the orb should be disabled once you get out of your own spawn room, but you could use buffes (and maybe skills but not doing any damage?) while you have got the orb.

About the 35's pvp, it is sooooo funny xD.. Voodoo fights takes 10 min :] As old days :D

[Cavoc]

After the damage nerf, pallies are healing more than the damage I deal. Yet on my bear I have so much armor, so they are hardly doing any damage to me also. So it usually just turns into a never ending fight. Or one that is just ridiculously long and you don't really care who wins, you just want it over.

[gison]

The problem with savage sets is they're too OP.

In a couple weeks or so, let's expect every single bird and Mage to use savage.

I wish they'd stick to class specific gear.

[Extreme]

I am sorry i miss read wrong i am an int user to "godsflame"

Lol, that mage.

[CrimsonTider]

I just don't understand the "Savage is OP" talk. Is it strong? Yes. Is it powerful? Yes again. However, in my eyes, if something is "OverPowered", then it should be near invincible... which it is not. I would prefer a fight against a strength toon with my bird vs. a pure bird/mage any day. Why? Because strength gear has a glaring weakness: Low hit%. Considering that dodge is a variable and not a constant, the hit% can be debuffed quickly.

Also, I don't know how many threads I need to point this out in, but when STS created the original 3 toons, it is very clear they were to utilize their main attribute. In the case of a bear, it was meant for strength and strength gear. Considering the strength attribute itself does not add to hit% and does very little to raise base damage, it is understandable that a strength set contain high damage because you must take into consideration that a pure strength bear only has 73% hit. The damage is high because in the event a bear manages a hit, it has to do some damage. If people still do not understand this concept, play CTF as a pure strength bear using a scythe and tell me how many times you actually land a damage skill or debuff. Trust me, you will see a lot of the word "miss." Because of this issue, and the usefulness of the dexterity attribute, pallies, warbirds, and bears are a major headache when using Savage.

Now, if the base stats were raised, such as it is with the Elite Boulder, you would see a lot less pallies/warbirds, and more people playing their class the way it is intended. The solution is simple: Lower the +90 damage buff in Rage, add in around 30-35 hit% buff, and make all sets in the game like the Elite weapons. (Or at least do this at the higher levels such as 61+ twinking to end game.)

Guess I need to start saving this thought into a word document to cut and paste each time it is brought up.

[Extreme]

I just don't understand the "Savage is OP" talk. Is it strong? Yes. Is it powerful? Yes again. However, in my eyes, if something is "OverPowered", then it should be near invincible... which it is not. I would prefer a fight against a strength toon with my bird vs. a pure bird/mage any day. Why? Because strength gear has a glaring weakness: Low hit%. Considering that dodge is a variable and not a constant, the hit% can be debuffed quickly.

Also, I don't know how many threads I need to point this out in, but when STS created the original 3 toons, it is very clear they were to utilize their main attribute. In the case of a bear, it was meant for strength and strength gear. Considering the strength attribute itself does not add to hit% and does very little to raise base damage, it is understandable that a strength set contain high damage because you must take into consideration that a pure strength bear only has 73% hit. The damage is high because in the event a bear manages a hit, it has to do some damage. If people still do not understand this concept, play CTF as a pure strength bear using a scythe and tell me how many times you actually land a damage skill or debuff. Trust me, you will see a lot of the word "miss." Because of this issue, and the usefulness of the dexterity attribute, pallies, warbirds, and bears are a major headache when using Savage.

Now, if the base stats were raised, such as it is with the Elite Boulder, you would see a lot less pallies/warbirds, and more people playing their class the way it is intended. The solution is simple: Lower the +90 damage buff in Rage, add in around 30-35 hit% buff, and make all sets in the game like the Elite weapons. (Or at least do this at the higher levels such as 61+ twinking to end game.)

Guess I need to start saving this thought into a word document to cut and paste each time it is brought up.

Well said uncle, Pure str Bear is like "Miss boss".

[Sheugokin]

^ U wish u were Crim's nephew! Hahahahaha. Every wuvs crim!

[Caiahar]

For those who ignore crim and think hes a silly guy (cuard, waug) , I can give a short summary.

Savage bears are "OP" mainly because they are str/dex. The dex gives more dmg, and the hit. Int and dex give hit, but str doesn't.
Crim is saying, lower The damage on rage (it might work in endgame, I dont doubt you crim, but bear twinkers might be a bit worse) BUT also give a hit buff on rage.
The rhino has a hit buff which can give 100+ hit, so it can go full str, and do its job as tanking without worrying about hit.


Now for my opinion on orbs:
1. Orbs coming when reved by rhino or mage:
I personally think its a horrible idea, its much better without the orbs, because you cant really do much except move. Take out the orbs when you are revived.

2. Arena Orbs:
This is good and bad. Good is that if you spawn near your oppenent, you can get time to run (except for stun/freeze/root, whic we'll get back to) so he cant attack. Bad is that most players, in an FFA, they buff and go right into the match.
But being that you cant buff, youll have to wait and run, and 3 seconds is long enough for someone to get you.
Also, you can be stunned, rooted, and freezed. This ruins it. The dev said that you could move around, but if you're stunned, rooted, or freezed, you cant move. Its especially bad for full dex bird, and pure int/dex int mages.

3. Orbs in CTF:
Spawning is still problem. As gaunab said before, someone could just sit there, buffed, and kill you when your orb comes off, and you dont have time to buff. Make it so you can buff/attack ONLY in the spawn room in CTF.
When you are revived in CTF, its a problem, I said it ^there. Remove the orb completely when you get revived.

That is all.
I'm 99.9% many people will ignore this post and such, as many people have done before, but I felt the need to say it, in case a dev comes along and reads it.

[lonleybird]

For those who ignore crim and think hes a silly guy (cuard, waug) , I can give a short summary.

Savage bears are "OP" mainly because they are str/dex. The dex gives more dmg, and the hit. Int and dex give hit, but str doesn't.
Crim is saying, lower The damage on rage (it might work in endgame, I dont doubt you crim, but bear twinkers might be a bit worse) BUT also give a hit buff on rage.
The rhino has a hit buff which can give 100+ hit, so it can go full str, and do its job as tanking without worrying about hit.


Now for my opinion on orbs:
1. Orbs coming when reved by rhino or mage:
I personally think its a horrible idea, its much better without the orbs, because you cant really do much except move. Take out the orbs when you are revived.

2. Arena Orbs:
This is good and bad. Good is that if you spawn near your oppenent, you can get time to run (except for stun/freeze/root, whic we'll get back to) so he cant attack. Bad is that most players, in an FFA, they buff and go right into the match.
But being that you cant buff, youll have to wait and run, and 3 seconds is long enough for someone to get you.
Also, you can be stunned, rooted, and freezed. This ruins it. The dev said that you could move around, but if you're stunned, rooted, or freezed, you cant move. Its especially bad for full dex bird, and pure int/dex int mages.

3. Orbs in CTF:
Spawning is still problem. As gaunab said before, someone could just sit there, buffed, and kill you when your orb comes off, and you dont have time to buff. Make it so you can buff/attack ONLY in the spawn room in CTF.
When you are revived in CTF, its a problem, I said it ^there. Remove the orb completely when you get revived.

That is all.
I'm 99.9% many people will ignore this post and such, as many people have done before, but I felt the need to say it, in case a dev comes along and reads it.
Did i every say anything bout crim ? i did ctf with him yesterday and think hes gud. nd yus savage is op we have said it about 100+ times stop crying bout it.

[Cheenivie]

Bears are slightly op but cuard you seem to be forgetting you were op for 10months and bears are very beatable tho birds before the nerf were able to dodge 10-15 straight hits and then hit blind so a bear misses 5-8more and you still said bears were op and were nearly impossible to kill if he hit blind so if I were you I'd quit complaining...

[gison]

Bears are slightly op but cuard you seem to be forgetting you were op for 10months and bears are very beatable tho birds before the nerf were able to dodge 10-15 straight hits and then hit blind so a bear misses 5-8more and you still said bears were op and were nearly impossible to kill if he hit blind so if I were you I'd quit complaining...

lol. It's like Azichauaunaanabed all over again with him.

[lonleybird]

Cheen lol u were op in those months becon stomp? And its not azba all over again ive been playing game since beta. Gg

[Caiahar]

^most bears know how to use their class well already through past experience.

[angeldawn]

@Ghost I agree with all your points!! I would however like it if the orb could be fixed, ex: able to buff and opponents can't target you. But if it can't be fixed if rather it just removed.

I see Crim's point about why savage has the stats that it does but it does make other classes OP. Wasn't the point of STS lowering the stat requirements to create variety in toons and wearable gear? I don't know if raising base requirements will fix the problem. I would just prefer that if a different class wears gear not meant for them then that stats get nerfed. I'm sure this would be difficult to implement but it would allow bears the stats it needs.

@Caurd just because you played "from the beginning" it doesn't mean you always need to talk down to ppl. There are ways to get your point across by using a different tone.

[gison]

Cheen lol u were op in those months becon stomp? And its not azba all over again ive been playing game since beta. Gg

Yes, but the way you act makes it like its Azichiabed drama all over again.
-trash talking etc...

Enough of this. Back to the topic~

[XghostzX]

@Crim - That's an excellent point. I never took the stat attributes into account because they never seemed important... not even remotely important for this game, haha. But yes, it does make sense. Still though, I will hold my argument for thinking that the savage set still has an edge in terms of a bad correlation between strength and armor.

[Waug]

For those who ignore crim and think hes a silly guy (cuard, waug) , I can give a short summary

lol, I don't consider someone is silly or not in a game forums, unlike most of the peoples, I sometime don't even look left side to see who posted the comment, if the comment look odd to me I critisize.

as for example many times I said bears +90 DMG buffs should be nerfed, so no point to argue with when someone else says that. savage is op in many terms other than just making it bears op, though I would not consider a bear is op with Savage, rather for example take a bird 40 dodge with savage + 30 dodge for buff = 70 dodge, even with stacking dodge bears reach approx 80 dodge, then consider a mage with heavy DMG with drain and fire they are getting secured with savage and still their DMG is high enough.

to be honest endgame is all about op-ness now, which build and gears have advantage over any other particular build and class, just use it for example a savage bear may struggle against a decent plaher so, use a talon/ bow mostly depending on auto that high damage of talon/bow +90 dmg buff , there are many examples not only this one. Many players consistently suggest for class specific gears, when devs asked, it was in my wish list to increase the required attribute point to equip endgame gears its too low 157 ATM, this would force classes to use class specific gears, but devs hardly listen good suggestions they just kept making political decisions.

[NotFortal]

The only problem I see with savage is that if it had lowered dmg, pallies, bears and mages actually in general, perhaps even tank rhinos, would be extremely difficult to kill, because of regen and heal (mages n rhinos), it's hard to balance endgame since every spell does like 500 dmg and players have 600hp lol. Pl doesn't have very detailed pvp, so pure tank would be less than useless, if he dealt nearly no dmg, unlike for instance WoW or OaC. Like there are no cast times in pl which sucks, so u can't like interrupt heal, thus with lowered dmg, certain classes would have no chance. Sorry if it doesn't make sense, it's morning here, i may rephrase it lol.

[Roberto077]

Yes, but the way you act makes it like its Azichiabed drama all over again.
-trash talking etc...

Enough of this. Back to the topic~

Yep.

Bears need higher armor but lower dodge, and what crim said with the hit % buff rather than so much damage.

[Reunegade]

I would love a hit buff in Rage! We would see more STR bears running around doing what they were meant to do: tank.

[LvlCap]

You know what I would love? People spelling correctly and using good grammar:) It makes everything ten times easier to read and it doesn't make you sound like a 8 year old.

[MightyMicah]

So far, I see that progress is being made somewhat. Here are some things that really stick out to me:

1.) Savage Sets still have an edge. There advantage in both damage and armor is really unfair, based off of stats. Their roles should require tanking, and taking time to kill other classes because they're str focused. This will encourage more strategic play.

2.) The orb problem. Unfortunately, the orb problem has allowed no CTF matches to be relatively fun. I'd personally prefer that the orb system was removed, and we came back to the way things were.

3.) Merging. This problem has been acknowledged several times, and doesn't just refer to end gamers, but to all levels. Instead of the levels being +-5, it should be around 3-4.

35 PvP is extremely balanced and fun atm. Fights take time to do, and the stats are really balanced. That would be a good place to compare end game stats with.

Thanks for your attention...

Great feedback, bro! Are you doing 35 right now?

[Roberto077]

You know what I would love? People spelling correctly and using good grammar:) It makes everything ten times easier to read and it doesn't make you sound like a 8 year old.

You have a fragment and run-on sentence. Independent clauses must/can be separated with comma followed by a conjunction. You forgot the comma, but since this is not a place where formal writing is necessary, you do not sound like an eight year old.

[Aoeqt]

My opinion on the orb system.. I don't think it needs to be rid because when a mage revives someone in the middle of ctf map or anywhere else and they are in a big battle and are needed for help, they should be allowed to buff up, not get rooted, frozen, stunned or anything. When they spawn with the orb, they should be allowed to stay willingly or get away from the action.

The reason why I think this is better is because when a mage revives someone in battle and they don't have the orb, they don't have time to buff like birds buffing their dodge, because I myself as a mage will focus on them right away, use frosbite and firestorm and kill them instantly. Orb doesn't need to be rid of, it just needs to be fixed.

[Caiahar]

My opinion on the orb system.. I don't think it needs to be rid because when a mage revives someone in the middle of ctf map or anywhere else and they are in a big battle and are needed for help, they should be allowed to buff up, not get rooted, frozen, stunned or anything. When they spawn with the orb, they should be allowed to stay willingly or get away from the action.

The reason why I think this is better is because when a mage revives someone in battle and they don't have the orb, they don't have time to buff like birds buffing their dodge, because I myself as a mage will focus on them right away, use frosbite and firestorm and kill them instantly. Orb doesn't need to be rid of, it just needs to be fixed.

I think everyone before orbs were completely fine when they get up from being revived.
The orbs in revive arent even needed. If what you said would happen, the best team endgame CTF would maybe be a team consisting of pallies?

[Archermaster]

Lol about the 35 pvp when i was voodoo mage vs voodoo mage both 35 it took so long. never even finished the fight the other players killed each other so the game ended before i even finished the fight

[Archermaster]

honestly my opinion on orbs is that i do not like it at all. 1. it is because whats the point of invulnerablilty for spawning if u cant even use skills to kill the spawner.
2. the invulnerablilty orb should only be in the spawn room so if u would get revived by mage or rhino u cant even do anything all u can do is run around waiting for the orb to disappear then u can use buffs adn skills

[WhoIsThis]

U obviously a savage user they need to nerf that set noobs claiming to be good with it

No, I'm saying that Savage Sets are too over powered. I use INT gear, and am against the savage gear... sheesh. The community nowadays.

The general definition of overpowered in a multiplayer setting in any game is: Where a set is so dominant over all other options that skill is no longer a factor. I haven't been here in months, but even looking at the set, well, it does have it's weak points (hit), but let me put it this way, if I were in a betting pool with 2 players of roughly equal skill of the same class, betting would statistically favor the savage against all other sets.

The orb system I think is causing more issues than it is solving, so I agree that the game should remove it or give the option to the host to play without them when hosting a new game.

To be honest, the game needs a ground up revamp of the PvP system, at least at end game. It is well, right now, built mainly as a PvE type of game with PvP kind of bolted on. I firmly believe that with reform, it would be possible to make a relatively balanced PvP game while keeping PvE classes assigned to their lore roles (and each balanced at it).

[XghostzX]

The general definition of overpowered in a multiplayer setting in any game is: Where a set is so dominant over all other options that skill is no longer a factor. I haven't been here in months, but even looking at the set, well, it does have it's weak points (hit), but let me put it this way, if I were in a betting pool with 2 players of roughly equal skill of the same class, betting would statistically favor the savage against all other sets.

The orb system I think is causing more issues than it is solving, so I agree that the game should remove it or give the option to the host to play without them when hosting a new game.

To be honest, the game needs a ground up revamp of the PvP system, at least at end game. It is well, right now, built mainly as a PvE type of game with PvP kind of bolted on. I firmly believe that with reform, it would be possible to make a relatively balanced PvP game while keeping PvE classes assigned to their lore roles (and each balanced at it).

Good to see you sir, appreciate your response. It's just that STS stated (in a recent patch thread) that their engine doesn't allow them to make specific changes that we see in AL. So I agree - they should remove the orbs.

As far as a revamp for PvP, I don't see much happening. STS recently said some major balance was coming on the way, but I've yet to see it after providing lots of time on giving quality feedback. I'm disappointed; but I'm not a business. STS has it's prioritizations and I respect it, regardless.

[WhoIsThis]

The bulk of the focus will remain on Arcane Legends. On the Android platform for example, it has perhaps 5 times as many downloads as PL (5 million+ vs 1 million+). Assuming similar monetization percentages, AL generates 5x as much revenue. Strictly from a business standpoint, it would be logical to conclude that focusing primarily on AL is a rational business decision, at least unless interest in AL begins to decline, at which point a PL revival may be a way to generate better overall business revenues.