The Ultimate Solution to our PvP Woes: Equipment Rarity Room Filtering!

[Reflexivity]

First off, I’m sorry if a thread has already been posted offering a similar solution. I tried my best to search through previous threads and I found several complaining about the lack of fairness in PvP, but none offering this particular solution.

As I mentioned, many threads out there talk about the unbalance in PvP. And I agree; I find the current PvP system to be very broken. Back when mythics weren’t as common as they are now and not too many people owned them, I used to love to PvP. I love the thrill and the challenge of going up against other players with different strategies and tactics, and testing mine against theirs. However, as we all know, since the increase in the circulation of mythic items, many issues have developed with regards to fairness and balance. And with the way it has been recently, I’ve stepped away from PvP.

I am not here to slander mythic items or their users, but in order to continue onto my solution, I need to acknowledge that a problem exists, so I’m just going be honest: a non-mythic user will always be at a disadvantage compared to a full mythic user. Regardless of player skill and strategy, the fact that a fully geared mythic players can take more hits and dish out more damage gives them an edge, even if their tactics are terrible.

Now, I’ve read a lot of threads out there that like to place the blame on someone, which isn’t right. Some non-mythic users may say that mythics should be prohibited in PvP, but that isn’t right considering those people probably worked hard to acquire those items and should be allowed to enjoy their benefits. Some mythic users say that “non-mythic users just need to work harder” and devote more time/effort to the game in order to gain those items, but that isn’t fair to say either. Personally, I am a level 36 capped rogue who has been playing since the level 16 cap days. I’ve always worked hard to be successful in this game and I’ve farmed my butt off, but I’ve never managed to make over 500k in my entire time playing (laugh at me if you want, but I’m serious). I don’t own any mythic gear aside from my Slag and Leprechaun pendent (plat purchases from doing free offers), and I’ve come to accept that I probably never will obtain a mythic helm/armor/weapon/necklace/pendant. My life and schedule just don’t allow for the time necessary to play enough/merch efficiently to accumulate those items, and that’s okay. But that doesn’t mean I still don’t like to enjoy PvP. I relish being able to go on and play PvP in short 10-20 minute bursts here and there throughout the day. That gives me my gaming fix as opposed to PvE, which I find rather boring.

So in order to appease everyone so that everyone can walk away satisfied, I propose filtering PvP rooms not only by level as it currently is, but also by equipment rarity. Rooms would be divided into the categories of Common, Rare, Epic, Legendary, Mythic, Arcane, and Any. Below are what the rules would be:


The current level bracket grouping system would still be intact, allowing you to fight players a couple levels higher or lower than you, but nothing too drastic.


The Any room would be similar to how current PvP is, where any rarity equipment can be used against other players. You will be able to fight players geared similarly, higher, or lower than yourself.


For all of the rooms excluding the Any room, players can wear equipment lower than or at the rarity of the room they want to join, but not beyond it. So you can fight in rooms where people are geared higher than you, but not lower than you (the sole exception is the Any room). For example, I could wear all Epic items and play in the Epic, Legendary, or Mythic room if I wanted. But players with even one Legendary item and the rest Epic would be prohibited from entering the Epic or below room.


Pet rarity will also be taken into account. For example, if I am wearing all Epic items but am using Malison (a Legendary pet), I cannot enter the Epic room. I would be forced to either swap out Malison or enter the Legendary/Mythic/Arcane/Any room.


To prevent players from abusing the system, once you enter the room, you are bound to that equipment rarity or lower. For example, if I went into the Legendary room and wanted to switch weapons, I can switch to any weapon Legendary or below, but no Mythics or Arcanes. This applies towards pets as well. So if I am in the Legendary room, I can swap out my Malison for another pet Legendary or lower, but I wouldn’t be able to call out a pet like Slag, which is mythic.

By adopting these rules, players of all levels would be able to truly thrive and enjoy PvP, regardless of what equipment or pets they may or may not have. Imagine the possibilities. Just for fun, level 36 end-game players could gear up in all Common equipment and face other players in the same level bracket wearing similar gear. Gutsy players who want a challenge can fight against players with better equipment than themselves. It wouldn’t matter if you’re rich or poor, mythic user or non-mythic user, plat-user or not, or just somewhere in-between. No one would be forced to fight against better-geared players unless they choose to. No one would be able to totally obliterate another player in PvP because the individuals that players fight against would be similarly geared (unless a player is gutsy and walks into a higher geared room, where in that case the lower geared player made a conscious decision to do that, instead of being forced against his will). Balance and fairness would be maintained. PvP would be fun for all again!

Please devs, I hope you really consider this proposal. PvP is one of the major selling points for me in any game I play, whether it’s a game on a console, computer, or phone. Once I do all there is to do in PvE, the only real reason for me to play is the thrill of going up against other real people out there. I know a ton of people feel similar to how I do. Please make this happen, devs. The community will thank you for it, big time!

[Zeus]

Amazing idea, however, I doubt it would be implemented.

First off, what is the point of using mythics if it does not give an advantage? There's a reason why many players pay the millions that these mythics are worth. If one could just downgrade, a big portion of the demand for mythics may disappear.

Secondly, mythics have dropped so far in value that many players who are regular PvPers can now obtain them. Previously, this was not the case. A mythic set will now cost somebody approximately 10M gold. Is that really that bad for an advantage? Players used to pay 30M for this same set.

Thirdly, going against somebody 1v1, sure, mythics are definitely going to win. However, in team play? I've had many players come on my team that were non-mythic players yet we still somehow end up winning the match. Why? It's simple, our team coordination was much better. In teamplay, these large 1v1 advantages that one sees is not as apparent anymore.

Lastly, those who do not have much money but still want to PvP and think that gear is the shortcoming, well, that's why there's twinking. Lets face it, a major reason why twinking was invented in many MMOs was to allow other players have their PvP fill without having to pay millions for the best gear.

[moot]

Best idea ever. I concur.

[Reflexivity]

Amazing idea, however, I doubt it would be implemented.

First off, what is the point of using mythics if it does not give an advantage? There's a reason why many players pay the millions that these mythics are worth. If one could just downgrade, a big portion of the demand for mythics may disappear.

Secondly, mythics have dropped so far in value that many players who are regular PvPers can now obtain them. Previously, this was not the case. A mythic set will now cost somebody approximately 10M gold. Is that really that bad for an advantage? Players used to pay 30M for this same set.

Thirdly, going against somebody 1v1, sure, mythics are definitely going to win. However, in team play? I've had many players come on my team that were non-mythic players yet we still somehow end up winning the match. Why? It's simple, our team coordination was much better. In teamplay, these large 1v1 advantages that one sees is not as apparent anymore.

Lastly, those who do not have much money but still want to PvP and think that gear is the shortcoming, well, that's why there's twinking. Lets face it, a major reason why twinking was invented in many MMOs was to allow other players have their PvP fill without having to pay millions for the best gear.

1) My suggestion also takes into account the feelings of mythic users and I am not suggesting to take away your advantage (which is why I included the Any room), but merely to expand our options so that those who do not have advantages can still enjoy PvP. Let's face it, those in power will always fight to maintain their power, those who don't have any will fight to overthrow it. It's not about suppressing the poor/weak, and I don't want anyone losing out on what advantages they have going for them; I am merely trying to suggest a way to give players more options. There will always be people out there who want to be the biggest and the baddest and the most powerful. I happen to think that even if the PvP playing field were equalized, people would still crave mythics. If not for PvP, than for the PvE advantage.

2) Sure, you can say mythic prices have declined since they first came out, and that's great for those who can afford it, but some of us will probably never accumulate 10mil and it's insulting to be told by some to "quit whining, save up, lolz".

3) You talk about team play, and you're right, in a mixed team anything is possible. But how about a team of full-mythics vs a team of non-mythics? In that scenario, tactics will still be a moot point. The underlying issue of balance still would need fixing.

4) Not everyone wants to twink. This proposal will allow end-game players, such as myself, who do not have the luxury of ever owning a mythic, to enjoy using our end-game skills without having to resort to twinking, which limits skill usage and allocation.

Overall, my main message here is that balance needs to be an option, not even a neccessity. That's the whole point of why the devs strive to create balance amongst the classes of warrior, mage, and rogue. If one class was unquestionably superior to all the rest, everyone would only play that class and ignore the rest. PvP is becoming a realm where it's go Mythic or go home. But every player deserves the right to stand a chance in PvP regardless of how good or bad their gear is.

[Zeus]

1) My suggestion also takes into account the feelings of mythic users and I am not suggesting to take away your advantage (which is why I included the Any room), but merely to expand our options so that those who do not have advantages can still enjoy PvP. Let's face it, those in power will always fight to maintain their power, those who don't have any will fight to overthrow it. It's not about suppressing the poor/weak, and I don't want anyone losing out on what advantages they have going for them; I am merely trying to suggest a way to give players more options. There will always be people out there who want to be the biggest and the baddest and the most powerful. I happen to think that even if the PvP playing field were equalized, people would still crave mythics. If not for PvP, than for the PvE advantage.

2) Sure, you can say mythic prices have declined since they first came out, and that's great for those who can afford it, but some of us will probably never accumulate 10mil and it's insulting to be told by some to "quit whining, save up, lolz".

3) You talk about team play, and you're right, in a mixed team anything is possible. But how about a team of full-mythics vs a team of non-mythics? In that scenario, tactics will still be a moot point. The underlying issue of balance still would need fixing.

4) Not everyone wants to twink. This proposal will allow end-game players, such as myself, who do not have the luxury of ever owning a mythic, to enjoy using our end-game skills without having to resort to twinking, which limits skill usage and allocation.

Overall, my main message here is that balance needs to be an option, not even a neccessity. That's the whole point of why the devs strive to create balance amongst the classes of warrior, mage, and rogue. If one class was unquestionably superior to all the rest, everyone would only play that class and ignore the rest. PvP is becoming a realm where it's go Mythic or go home. But every player deserves the right to stand a chance in PvP regardless of how good or bad their gear is.

Hello,

How many players do you expect actually PvP at a given time? Honestly, there's not that many. There's probably like 30-40 people PvPing at one level, at a given time, max. Usually though, the numbers are much lower.

I hope that you realize that this suggestion would take those 30-40 players and divide them up based on the selections you chose. It's already quite a wait to get a CTF match going. How much will this problem extrapolate with this suggestion put into place? I'd rather PvP a little than not PvP at all, you know?

Secondly, giving mythic users the "Any" room will not work either. Why? Well, who in their right mind is going to want to PvP against them? Not many. Again, this goes back to my issue I pointed out. This game simply does not have a steady flow of PvPers where this suggestion wouldn't affect gameplay. I certainly do not want to be waiting 20 minutes for a game to start. 20 minutes on a mobile phone playing a demanding MMO can be 10% of your battery!

I could go on and on and end up turning this into one big debate, but the reason(s) I have stated above is a big reason why this suggestion will never be implemented. There's just simply not enough PvP players online at a given time for this suggestion to be anywhere near effective.

[Wutzgood]

Great idea. It would make pvp endgame alot more fair. It Also would make alot more people play pvp. Alot of non mythic equip people just don't play pvp because they don't have mythic gear to compete with.

[cloud17h]

Great post, 100% agree

[Reflexivity]

Hello,

How many players do you expect actually PvP at a given time? Honestly, there's not that many. There's probably like 30-40 people PvPing at one level, at a given time, max. Usually though, the numbers are much lower.

I hope that you realize that this suggestion would take those 30-40 players and divide them up based on the selections you chose. It's already quite a wait to get a CTF match going. How much will this problem extrapolate with this suggestion put into place? I'd rather PvP a little than not PvP at all, you know?

Secondly, giving mythic users the "Any" room will not work either. Why? Well, who in their right mind is going to want to PvP against them? Not many. Again, this goes back to my issue I pointed out. This game simply does not have a steady flow of PvPers where this suggestion wouldn't affect gameplay. I certainly do not want to be waiting 20 minutes for a game to start. 20 minutes on a mobile phone playing a demanding MMO can be 10% of your battery!

I could go on and on and end up turning this into one big debate, but the reason(s) I have stated above is a big reason why this suggestion will never be implemented. There's just simply not enough PvP players online at a given time for this suggestion to be anywhere near effective.

Hi Apollo,

While I acknowledge and respect your point of view, I kindly disagree with it, and that's alright. We can agree to disagree.

I think Wutzgood is onto something though with his/her statement of "It Also would make alot more people play pvp. Alot of non mythic equip people just don't play pvp because they don't have mythic gear to compete with." That's along the lines of where I'm coming from. If players wouldn't be forced to play against mythic users, more players would PvP rather than shy away from it, causing the overall PvP population to expand. This would counteract your point about dividing around 30-40 players into categories and not having enough PvPers on at once.

[Zeus]

Hi Apollo,

While I acknowledge and respect your point of view, I kindly disagree with it, and that's alright. We can agree to disagree.

I think Wutzgood is onto something though with his/her statement of "It Also would make alot more people play pvp. Alot of non mythic equip people just don't play pvp because they don't have mythic gear to compete with." That's along the lines of where I'm coming from. If players wouldn't be forced to play against mythic users, more players would PvP rather than shy away from it, causing the overall PvP population to expand. This would counteract your point about dividing around 30-40 players into categories and not having enough PvPers on at once.

It would not counteract my point. Why? Again, not enough people have mythics either. So, now you'd be asking the mythic players not to PvP with their gear because people did not want to save up for the gear.

I played non-mythic, I've also played mythic. Also, as I've stated... I've gone against full mythic teams where I am the only mythic user and the rest of my team is using crate gear/the lowest tier of elite gear. However, due to our strategies being better, we still end up winning.

Honestly, most players are not even full mythic. All you really need is a mythic weapon and you're set.

Like all MMOs, you can't really compete if you don't have the gear! <---It's a true statement.

[Vjerevica]

First off, what is the point of using mythics if it does not give an advantage?

Well, this is the part I don't understand. What is the fun (or glory if you want to put it that way) if you win the race with Ferrari over VW Golf? Wouldn't you like to compete with equally geared oponents? I've commented it before so I won't repeat it all over again.

My case is similar. Used to be in PvP all the time back in the beginings an now quited almost entirely. It is just not fun anymore. Same situation as reflex . . . I have a life outside of AL and don't have enough time (or willingness if you want) to do the farming, merching, etc. PvE is kind of boring for me too and I just don't see much point in continuing.

Idea is great. Will it be implemented? I think not. I think that elite PvP-ers are not looking for duels with equals. However, It would be great to hear their feedbeck on subject.

And lastly, I think that twinking is not really what Reflex is aming for? Most certanly it isn't for me. It is completely different aspect of game.

You have my vote for sure.

[Zeus]

Well, this is the part I don't understand. What is the fun (or glory if you want to put it that way) if you win the race with Ferrari over VW Golf? Wouldn't you like to compete with equally geared oponents? I've commented it before so I won't repeat it all over again.

My case is similar. Used to be in PvP all the time back in the beginings an now quited almost entirely. It is just not fun anymore. Same situation as reflex . . . I have a life outside of AL and don't have enough time (or willingness if you want) to do the farming, merching, etc. PvE is kind of boring for me too and I just don't see much point in continuing.

Idea is great. Will it be implemented? I think not. I think that elite PvP-ers are not looking for duels with equals. However, It would be great to hear their feedbeck on subject.

And lastly, I think that twinking is not really what Reflex is aming for? Most certanly it isn't for me. It is completely different aspect of game.

You have my vote for sure.

It's a broken system. If there was enough population of players of each gear tier to fight, I'd be fine. However, there isn't.

As a result, this suggestion is most likely never going to be implemented, as you have stated.

[kharmel]

good idea;-) BUT easily can be tweaked! As Apollo pointed out in some, we lack quantity doing pvp and filtering out would drastically lessen out more.
> I can use full mythic except I will use bling bauble of potency or full circuit of potency thus will not make me categorized as MYTHIC PVPER rather put me in "ANY"(category) wherein my stats is almost same as mythic users. There are always a way to tweak this.
> Just farm out more, if others can get mythics without getting plats, why cant others do it as well. If your goal is to get good KDR and by that means having mythics, then that individual should worked it out to get those GOAL.
> In real life, there is no segregation of people based on what they have. Those who worked hard will be rewarded, but those who stagnate, who would hire them? IMO

[Reflexivity]

Well, this is the part I don't understand. What is the fun (or glory if you want to put it that way) if you win the race with Ferrari over VW Golf? Wouldn't you like to compete with equally geared oponents? I've commented it before so I won't repeat it all over again.

My case is similar. Used to be in PvP all the time back in the beginings an now quited almost entirely. It is just not fun anymore. Same situation as reflex . . . I have a life outside of AL and don't have enough time (or willingness if you want) to do the farming, merching, etc. PvE is kind of boring for me too and I just don't see much point in continuing.

Idea is great. Will it be implemented? I think not. I think that elite PvP-ers are not looking for duels with equals. However, It would be great to hear their feedbeck on subject.

And lastly, I think that twinking is not really what Reflex is aming for? Most certanly it isn't for me. It is completely different aspect of game.

You have my vote for sure.

It's as if you're in my head, haha. You're definitely right, I'm not looking to twink. I agree with everything you said, 110%. There's nothing left for me to say, you already did. :)

[Frohnatur]

I do not understand the meaning of this thread. What is the point of this game at all, if not to get the best gear there is, and play in the most succesful way possibble?
To give the same advantage to pink players as to the myth players would erase the motivation of getting myth gear.

Im sorry to say that. But reflexs idea is undermining the whole meaning of a game like this. Instead of insisting on medeocricy to have the same chances on winning (a pvp match e.g.) as the top gears wich has the potential to destroy the drive of the game i think it is a much more success-promising idea to go for the best gear. And as apollo said, its not as hard anymore as many might think.

i never have spent a dime on this game, im playing it two or three hours a day on average and i have myth gear and success on the lb.

and another thing: with the right strategy it is possible to succeed in pvp even with only legendary gear. I did it for quite a while and there are other players to proof it, like gormeort.

[Terracio]

Id like to add that what you need most to be competitive in PVP is armor and helm. So 5M can in theory be enough. A couple of people in Leaderboard are not even full mythic just armor and helm.

[Energizeric]

The whole point of working hard to gain better gear is to have an advantage in PvP. You don't really need the best gear for PvE. Right now I'm spending every moment of my time in AL saving up for an arcane staff. If I couldn't use it to whoop those with lesser gear, then there would be no point at all to having one. Same goes for mythic items.

Sorry but this is a very bad idea.

[Alfai]

Hey guys,

This happens in just about every online game that has an economy. The term that has been coined for it is "Mudflation". This hearkens back to MUDs that were the pre-cursors to modern MMORPGs. More on wikipedia if you're interested: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mudflation

This is always going to happen. In order for new items to be interesting, they need to be "better" in some way over previous gear. So, items will always be replaced by new stuff. Always. It's just part of how such games work.

Just wanted to throw that out there.


Because if there was only 1 point of stat difference between a Mythic and the best Legendary, the Mythics wouldn't have any value. The difference has to be at least something to make it worthwhile.

Sorry matey, if you want to compete, you'll need to gear up. If not, then know that and play CTF and don't get into 1v1s.

So nope.you gotta elevate.the game is moving upwards on gears.whata rarity ia becoming common.so you have room of mhytic users and compete their skills.

I remember when mhytic is so rare and seeing someone with mhytic helm is so hard (back when theres no amu rinf or bow)..so pvp is played by pink gears who try to get the best high end pink and compete.its actually the same cyxle now except its in orange.

[Reflexivity]

The whole point of working hard to gain better gear is to have an advantage in PvP. You don't really need the best gear for PvE. Right now I'm spending every moment of my time in AL saving up for an arcane staff. If I couldn't use it to whoop those with lesser gear, then there would be no point at all to having one. Same goes for mythic items.

Sorry but this is a very bad idea.

That may be your opinion, but there are many out there who are in favor of this idea. So whether it is "good" or "bad", as you say, is a matter of preference.

As a person without mythic equipment, I am trying to at least be fair and see both sides of where people are coming from. Not only my perspective, but that of the other side as well. I am trying to find a way to stick up for mythic users, too. But it seems like all the mythic users want to do is bash and suppress those who don't have the same advantages as them, without acknowledging what the rest of us have to say. I find that mindset deplorable. People keep commenting that "mythics don't cost that much anymore" and that "you don't need a full mythic set to be competitive", but they're missing the point. It's about the principle.

If some people want to play until their minds go numb and their eyeballs fall out of their socket, that's fine. I and many others have a busy life out of this game. I don't have the time/willingness to be able to spend countless hours saving up/farming/merching for items I will hardly have the time to use. I'm fine with not having the latest and the greatest, especially since I'm a casual player and am not playing all too often. However, that doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to enjoy PvP against people I stand a chance against.

I personally don't find satisfaction in beating opponents who aren't on equal footing with myself, and then stroking my ego about it. That would be akin to a grown man bragging about smoking 5-year-old child at a game of basketball. Like Vjerevica stated, it really does seem like elite PvPers are not looking for duels with equals.

To each their own, I suppose.

[Alfai]

That may be your opinion, but there are many out there who are in favor of this idea. So whether it is "good" or "bad", as you say, is a matter of preference.

As a person without mythic equipment, I am trying to at least be fair and see both sides of where people are coming from. Not only my perspective, but that of the other side as well. I am trying to find a way to stick up for mythic users, too. But it seems like all the mythic users want to do is bash and suppress those who don't have the same advantages as them, without acknowledging what the rest of us have to say. I find that mindset deplorable. People keep commenting that "mythics don't cost that much anymore" and that "you don't need a full mythic set to be competitive", but they're missing the point. It's about the principle.

If some people want to play until their minds go numb and their eyeballs fall out of their socket, that's fine. I and many others have a busy life out of this game. I don't have the time/willingness to be able to spend countless hours saving up/farming/merching for items I will hardly have the time to use. I'm fine with not having the latest and the greatest, especially since I'm a casual player and am not playing all too often. However, that doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to enjoy PvP against people I stand a chance against.

I personally don't find satisfaction in beating opponents who aren't on equal footing with myself, and then stroking my ego about it. That would be akin to a grown man bragging about smoking 5-year-old child at a game of basketball. Like Vjerevica stated, it really does seem like elite PvPers are not looking for duels with equals.

To each their own, I suppose.

Like i said.its a cycle.only the gears are changing.

Back when pvp is dominated by pinks epic and rare users stand no chance.people trying to get the high end pink.and mhytic user were very scarce in fact they did not own pvp.i reached warmonger using bonechill.it wasnt an issue coz the gears are branded legendary and ppl have the equal chance to either farm,loot or buy and earn their gears.

Now mhytics is on the rise.more people can afford.more items in the market circulation.1 out of 5 would at least own one piece of mhytic.i earned mine and complete all at the end of season 4 and it was a long and painful journey when mhytic weekend ws announce as i had to work my *$# off to earn but double odds make othets loot it easier.

Im a wotking professional either and i agree squeezing the demand of personal life makes it lesser time to play.but i did try my best to put some hours and mk it worthwhile.nt saying others not but what we choose or what we can so should not change the game mechanism.and we have kids playing this game too who has ample of time but no access to plats.so we try to make amend and the more we squeeze in the more edge we gain.

So tk it as the new pink.my 2cents.

[faychen]

Just wanna speak it out, when I first stepped in pvp, a player told me to flag and no kill, but they killed me bfore I flag and they laughed at me. Since then I never step into pvp again.

[Zeus]

That may be your opinion, but there are many out there who are in favor of this idea. So whether it is "good" or "bad", as you say, is a matter of preference.

As a person without mythic equipment, I am trying to at least be fair and see both sides of where people are coming from. Not only my perspective, but that of the other side as well. I am trying to find a way to stick up for mythic users, too. But it seems like all the mythic users want to do is bash and suppress those who don't have the same advantages as them, without acknowledging what the rest of us have to say. I find that mindset deplorable. People keep commenting that "mythics don't cost that much anymore" and that "you don't need a full mythic set to be competitive", but they're missing the point. It's about the principle.

If some people want to play until their minds go numb and their eyeballs fall out of their socket, that's fine. I and many others have a busy life out of this game. I don't have the time/willingness to be able to spend countless hours saving up/farming/merching for items I will hardly have the time to use. I'm fine with not having the latest and the greatest, especially since I'm a casual player and am not playing all too often. However, that doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to enjoy PvP against people I stand a chance against.

I personally don't find satisfaction in beating opponents who aren't on equal footing with myself, and then stroking my ego about it. That would be akin to a grown man bragging about smoking 5-year-old child at a game of basketball. Like Vjerevica stated, it really does seem like elite PvPers are not looking for duels with equals.

To each their own, I suppose.

Please be aware that the supposed players that you think play for so long to earn these mythics honestly do not. Now, when I play, I usually try to stick to a few things so I do not waste time dilly-dallying. Heck, I'm a college student who spends a lot of his time doing other things. However, I typically get on at night and am still able to get done what I want to get done.

It took me maybe 2 weeks after I hit the L31 level cap to get a full mythic set back when it was worth 25M? If I want something that costs 10M+, if I can achieve it rather quickly.

My point was, if others are able to do it with their work lives, you can too! You're not the only with a life outside of this game. We all have our own responsibilities.

Have you heard of the phrase, "Work Hard, Play Hard"? It could be used relatively well here, IMO.

[Reflexivity]

Please be aware that the supposed players that you think play for so long to earn these mythics honestly do not. Now, when I play, I usually try to stick to a few things so I do not waste time dilly-dallying. Heck, I'm a college student who spends a lot of his time doing other things. However, I typically get on at night and am still able to get done what I want to get done.

It took me maybe 2 weeks after I hit the L31 level cap to get a full mythic set back when it was worth 25M? If I want something that costs 10M+, if I can achieve it rather quickly.

My point was, if others are able to do it with their work lives, you can too! You're not the only with a life outside of this game. We all have our own responsibilities.

Have you heard of the phrase, "Work Hard, Play Hard"? It could be used relatively well here, IMO.

I think my main point is being missed. I'm not on here to complain that I don't own mythics and that it's impossible to attain them. As you've stated, it certainly is possible to acquire them. It's great you're able to earn 25mil in 2 weeks, but take into consideration that you're probably knowledgable/skilled with regards to merching/farming/etc. Not everyone is.

Comments about working hard and being capable of earning millions are besides the point. The point is that people shouldn't have to accumulate and drop millions to be able to experience a fair and balanced (in other words, an equal) PvP environment.

[katish]

Reflex, I think that you're hoping for is unrealistic, even tho in theory it makes sense.

The game is fair and balanced in the way that it gives everyone the same opportunities to achieve the same things. Anyone can farm, anyone can merch, anyone can buy plat. But not everyone will do it so we'll always have people at a disadvantage for one reason or another. It's like in life.. everyone can go to school and get a degree... but not all people do it, for whatever reason. They will not compete for the same job on equal grounds.

If i'm a skinny, fragile person I wouldn't play basketbal.. i'd try pingpong. or maybe chess. if i did love basketbal and couldn't live without it, i'd try to find a match with other fragile skinny people instead of trying to make it into the dream team.

I have to say I agree that if you feel you cannot keep up with the gear requirements to be competitive, you should consider twinking. Then you'd have a more equal ground to compete on, at least without the money/equipment barrier.

My point here is there is an option, even if you dont like it so much.

[alexdroog]

I see twinking as a solution, too.

In 36 myth is standard. I don't have the time to farm, no luck with locked and not willing to spend more real money.

In lvl 10 and 16 u get a good set for 300-500k. And there are pros like in 36. I mean really strong rugby players, just in weaker armors...

In a nutshell: same fun, lower cost

[Wutzgood]

Personally I think pvp numbers would rise drastically if this idea was implemented. Twinking is fun for some people but most players would rather use their endgame character for pvp. Most people don't have mythic gear and just don't play pvp if they only have legendary gear

[Azepeiete]

Good idea if you make it so only the "Any" room gains you kills and score.

To me if sounds like you would rather not spend time getting gear, but still get the same benefit mythic gear users do.
This idea would trash mythic prices, reduce crate revenues, etc.

Another solution is if you leave pvp for a little while and go get some gear yourself :)

[Vjerevica]

It seems that we have two irreconcilable groups of players, professionals and casual players. Each have their arguments and there is no hope that we can reach consensus. However, I feel that main point is lost somwhere down the road. This is a game and games are supposed to be fun or the don't fulfill their purpose. I suppose that we can agree at least on that.

There were comments that there are simply not enough PvP players to divide them in smaller groups. Why is that? Judging from my experience the main reason is that there is no joy at all in PvP for casual players. Either you are pro, or you don't do PvP at all. I was in the PvP from the very beginning. I was playing when mages were really underpowered. I was playing when people were cheating by pulling pets into CTF in times where pets were not alowed. Even then I had much fun in PvP. So, I would say that I am not spoiled player who complain about every little thing that doesn't suit him. I find it rather sad that now I find no pleasure to pvp.

I assume that lack of pvp players are because many players feel the same way. As Energizeric said in one of his economy posts, casual players will leave, game will start to look empty and then pro/elite players will leave and that will be the end. I think that number of pvp-ers will drastically increase if some solution for casual players would be implemented.

I have my proposal. I will just use parts from my old post because I am too lazy to write it all over again.


Here is my proposal. Separate PvP to Elite and Common. In Common no myth, arcane gear would be alowed. Make separate leader board for Elite. In my eyes it would please everyone. Hardcore players will have their own battlefield where they wil fight best of the best. Anyway, I don't believe they enjoy victories over underpowered oponents. They will have their separate playground free of noobs, underpowered, unexperienced, etc. Winners of this will be acknowlidged as best of the best by everyone. On the other hand, common players will have their own playgound where they can compete thus making the game interesting for them as well. Even better, elite players can check their skills in common arena allso (and prove primarly to themselves that they really are the best based on skills and not only because of gear).

Replay from Ebezaanec

You make it seem as if mythic players are vastly numerous. Why should players who work hard for mythic gear be "punished" by being secluded to only a limited amount of players.

Besides... What about players with only a couple of mythics? Do they have to be stuck with people with full mythics too? Even I have an Epic ring in my set.

No offense, but the idea seems very unfair imo.


It is just general proposal. I am aware that it should be developed further.

Why punished? Do you think that duel with equaly geard players is punishment? On the contrary, I think it is reward. They will have a chance to play on highest level without disturbance of inferior players. Look at it as AL Champins League. Those "limited amount of players" are in fact the ones they really want to duel. Is there any glory if you win the race with Ferrarri over VW Polo? Would you be appretiated as great driver?

In all competitons there are ranks; 1st legue, 2nd legue, etc.

Somehow you agree with me to a certain point since you think that people who are not full myth would be stuck with full mythics meaning that they will have a lesser chance because of gear.

This proposal should be dveloped and elaborated better. The way I see it I would always want to compete within my rank. If I am Real Madrid, surely I don't want to be champion of national village football league. I want to win Champions league.

Well, I don't expect that players will agree with me. I was just commenting post from my perspective. No harm done.

But seriously, I would really like feedback from elite players. Wouldn't they love to have their own league?

I can suggest another idea. Lets make new arena called "Skill Arena". While entering each player is given to choose equipment/pets to use (of course all equipment would be of the same level). Then enter the battle and it would be only skills that make real difference. So, everything would remain the same (CTF & TDM) + one additional arena for people who want to test their skills.

Would that be acceptable?

[Vjerevica]

Good idea if you make it so only the "Any" room gains you kills and score.

To me if sounds like you would rather not spend time getting gear, but still get the same benefit mythic gear users do.
This idea would trash mythic prices, reduce crate revenues, etc.

Another solution is if you leave pvp for a little while and go get some gear yourself :)

Personally I don't care about KDR at all. I think that counting kills ruined team play in CTF.

[Samhayne]

Interesting idea.

The biggest problem I see is having enough people to play with. If you're the only one with mythics on queing for PvP you might be sitting in an empty room for a while until someone else with mythics logs in and queues for pvp.

Honestly, I don't see it being implemented.

[Reflexivity]

Interesting idea.

The biggest problem I see is having enough people to play with. If you're the only one with mythics on queing for PvP you might be sitting in an empty room for a while until someone else with mythics logs in and queues for pvp.

Honestly, I don't see it being implemented.

Thanks for the honest and considerate response, Samhayne.

It's okay with me if not everyone supports this idea. What irks me, though, is when people shoot it down and criticize it without offering any real constructive input. It's not easy to come up with an idea by yourself about how to solve a prominent issue within the community. Now, people are going to argue with me and tell me that's just the nature of the game, but honestly, there's a significant amount of people who feel similarly to how I do, so that must mean something.

Sure, it's not a perfect solution. But at least I tried to come up with something. PvP is one of the major selling points for me in any game that I play. I don't feel that being told to twink or save up is really addressing my underlying concern. I don't mind if people are better/stronger than I am. I don't want to PvP just so I can win all the time. I just wanted the option to have a more equal match and spar with people of similar capabilities/gear, which to me, makes the match more fun, whether I win or lose.

I'm okay if my idea is never implemented, but I just hoped forum members would respect and acknowledge my views, even if it differs from their own.

[Zeus]

Thanks for the honest and considerate response, Samhayne.

It's okay with me if not everyone supports this idea. What irks me, though, is when people shoot it down and criticize it without offering any real constructive input. It's not easy to come up with an idea by yourself about how to solve a prominent issue within the community. Now, people are going to argue with me and tell me that's just the nature of the game, but honestly, there's a significant amount of people who feel similarly to how I do, so that must mean something.

Sure, it's not a perfect solution. But at least I tried to come up with something. PvP is one of the major selling points for me in any game that I play. I don't feel that being told to twink or save up is really addressing my underlying concern. I don't mind if people are better/stronger than I am. I don't want to PvP just so I can win all the time. I just wanted the option to have a more equal match and spar with people of similar capabilities/gear, which to me, makes the match more fun, whether I win or lose.

I'm okay if my idea is never implemented, but I just hoped forum members would respect and acknowledge the views of others, even if it differs from their own.

We understand that you have tried. Also, I believe that forum members did respect and acknowledge your view. We also took the time to tell you why this suggestion would not work. I did not see any insulting or name-calling going on, did you?

It was a very civil debate. The only thing that I would think is borderline offensive is when you made the generalization that mythic players must have played until their eyes dry up and fall out in order to obtain the gear that they have obtained. Still, those that you insulted were civil and remained composure.

The fact of the matter is, no matter what MMO you play, if you want to go endgame PvP, you will be expected to have the best gear. You see it in MMOs like WoW and Runescape. So, what do the people do that do not have the best gears but still want to PvP? They PvP at lower levels. In AL, you have the exact same option. Also, keep in mind that L16+ twinks still have the option to fight with 4 skills. So, in reality, the only thing that would have been taken out from the equation is the mythic gears.

Just some food for thought,

Apollo

[Reflexivity]

We understand that you have tried. Also, I believe that forum members did respect and acknowledge your view. We also took the time to tell you why this suggestion would not work. I did not see any insulting or name-calling going on, did you?

It was a very civil debate. The only thing that I would think is borderline offensive is when you made the generalization that mythic players must have played until their eyes dry up and fall out in order to obtain the gear that they have obtained. Still, those that you insulted were civil and remained composure.

The fact of the matter is, no matter what MMO you play, if you want to go endgame PvP, you will be expected to have the best gear. You see it in MMOs like WoW and Runescape. So, what do the people do that do not have the best gears but still want to PvP? They PvP at lower levels. In AL, you have the exact same option. Also, keep in mind that L16+ twinks still have the option to fight with 4 skills. So, in reality, the only thing that would have been taken out from the equation is the mythic gears.

Just some food for thought,

Apollo

I sincerely thank you for your helpfulness through this entire process. I was not personally offended or insulted by anything anyone wrote. I was simply stating that I feel like people did not really see things through my perspective. As I've stated before, I'm not anti-mythic. It's great that people work hard for their gear. They deserve to use it.

I appreciate people's suggestions about directing me towards twinking, but really, I feel like that is circumventing the issue. When an end-game player with enough finances, like you or myself, makes a twink that is geared with all of the best equipment, it breaks the system for those low level players who legitimately are lvl 10-16. Especially if those players have no other alternate accounts and no significant means of funding them to have all the best gear, the way we can for our twinks, we are ruining PvP for them.

I guess I am just trying to look at the big picture here. Sure, I am not going to get my way, but I want to bring awareness that our actions as the "big wigs" at end game level are also impacting the experience of those at the opposite end of the spectrum, who are just starting out, and may not have the means to compete the way we can.

[Frohnatur]

I totally understand your point of view, reflex. Your look at the bigger picture just has some irks.

Low level players, that are legitimatly 16, have no big incentive to go pvp. They have the bigger incentive to level up, make gold and get good gear (and maybe then return to lvl 16 with a twink and excellent gear). Also, you're not one of them? So where's the problem? I dont see any legitimate lvl 16 player complaing about pvp.

Almost ALL players you find in lvl 16 or lower pvp are Twinks. Believe me. been there.

So if you love pvp just for itself, make a twink, get it geared up and go there.

If you want compete End Level Pvp, get geared up (and yes, if neccessary, get some myth gear - weapon although should suffice) and go there.

This way all your problems are solved.

See, your suggestion just would create new problems. Thatswhy it is better to "circumvent" it this way.

It lies in the nature of pvp that only the fittest survive, so there is no way around best gear, no matter wich level.

So the answer to "how do I compete without myth gear?" is, twinking below level 26 (the first myth-gear-level).

[Alfai]

Thanks for the honest and considerate response, Samhayne.

It's okay with me if not everyone supports this idea. What irks me, though, is when people shoot it down and criticize it without offering any real constructive input. It's not easy to come up with an idea by yourself about how to solve a prominent issue within the community. Now, people are going to argue with me and tell me that's just the nature of the game, but honestly, there's a significant amount of people who feel similarly to how I do, so that must mean something.

Sure, it's not a perfect solution. But at least I tried to come up with something. PvP is one of the major selling points for me in any game that I play. I don't feel that being told to twink or save up is really addressing my underlying concern. I don't mind if people are better/stronger than I am. I don't want to PvP just so I can win all the time. I just wanted the option to have a more equal match and spar with people of similar capabilities/gear, which to me, makes the match more fun, whether I win or lose.

I'm okay if my idea is never implemented, but I just hoped forum members would respect and acknowledge my views, even if it differs from their own.

Hi ref i hear ya.especially on the part where you feel disheartened on the gears diaparity and forum criticism.tbh i feel this is still civilised unlike any other threads where people simpy shoot you down.we are trying to open up the view from a more generic angle or acceptable perspective.

I was almost at the point of quitting as i never have 1mil or anywhere close to filthy rich.when i finally got some luck and savinf dor long i bought my first mhytic which was a bow at 6m that time.2 weeks mhytic event came up where i never anticipated.and the double odds made my 6m purchase like a fool.but with help pf friends i managed to farm better elites,merching and earned my set.my final piece was given as gift from a friend.fyi i never looted my set.

My point is it aint easy.whilst the game remain the approach has gone higher.i tried to remain my pink to a point where i knew i couldnt compete anymore.so i have to upgrade to be in the game.whilst accommodating to this change,the pve wnvironment also changed.to be faster you need to maximize ur gears.everything is changing to compromise the need of having better stats.

This game will stop once you have achieved all.and we are here still as we havent achieved all.be it gold,gears or battles.it keeps goinf upwards and we cant stay at the middle to enjoy its perks.if it stays the same theres no real need to play.

You will get there soon never lose hope.trust me.

[shadikiller]

Ur idea is cool..but even if there were enough players...
what then is the point of getting mythics or arcanes..!!!
y would i farm 2-5 months tryin to get a maul if i wont get any extra advantages over others..!!!
ill simply play in legendary room etc....and save my self 4 months of farming for arcane weapon..!! and i bet everyone will do so..!!
2nd: i have a rogue which is pure legendary gears..and believe or not i kill mythic warriors, mages and rogues not all for sure but alot..!!
my point is if what u suggest will be done..!! then simply i wont need to waste 1 hour of my life farming..ill just get some common gears worth 1k and own pvp..
3rd: from lvl cap 16 and u only made 500k....that means ur doing it wrong..or ur not doing at all.!!!
if u just farm locked crates in kraken mines u can get from selling crates 2M+ a month...1 elite golden chest is 100k+ so if u managed to get 500k in 7 months means budd u need to be sure how u farm..!!!
i got scammed in this game twice ...scammers left me with 50k or so..I didnt give up..i still farmed again and got my gold again...!!!
pvp is like real life..its never fair....there are rich people EX doctors etc(( hard farmers)) and people born rich ((plat players)) and there r poor people..!!
no one can just say all people should be equil..!! coz this is life u wanna drive a bmw u gotta work hard.....same for pvp..
sorry if im a bit harsh on ur idea.....but i see it as a fail..!!!

[Primeblades]

Good idea but why not just make a twinking account?

[Linkincena]

Or just quit the room

[Reflexivity]

Good idea but why not just make a twinking account?

As I wrote earlier:

I appreciate people's suggestions about directing me towards twinking, but really, I feel like that is circumventing the issue. When an end-game player with enough finances, like you or myself, makes a twink that is geared with all of the best equipment, it breaks the system for those low level players who legitimately are lvl 10-16. Especially if those players have no other alternate accounts and no significant means of funding them to have all the best gear, the way we can for our twinks, we are ruining PvP for them.

I guess I am just trying to look at the big picture here. Sure, I am not going to get my way, but I want to bring awareness that our actions as the "big wigs" at end game level are also impacting the experience of those at the opposite end of the spectrum, who are just starting out, and may not have the means to compete the way we can.

I'm not arguing with people who don't like my idea. I am just answering your question about why I am somewhat opposed to twinking.

[Reflexivity]

Ur idea is cool..but even if there were enough players...
what then is the point of getting mythics or arcanes..!!!
y would i farm 2-5 months tryin to get a maul if i wont get any extra advantages over others..!!!
ill simply play in legendary room etc....and save my self 4 months of farming for arcane weapon..!! and i bet everyone will do so..!!
2nd: i have a rogue which is pure legendary gears..and believe or not i kill mythic warriors, mages and rogues not all for sure but alot..!!
my point is if what u suggest will be done..!! then simply i wont need to waste 1 hour of my life farming..ill just get some common gears worth 1k and own pvp..
3rd: from lvl cap 16 and u only made 500k....that means ur doing it wrong..or ur not doing at all.!!!
if u just farm locked crates in kraken mines u can get from selling crates 2M+ a month...1 elite golden chest is 100k+ so if u managed to get 500k in 7 months means budd u need to be sure how u farm..!!!
i got scammed in this game twice ...scammers left me with 50k or so..I didnt give up..i still farmed again and got my gold again...!!!
pvp is like real life..its never fair....there are rich people EX doctors etc(( hard farmers)) and people born rich ((plat players)) and there r poor people..!!
no one can just say all people should be equil..!! coz this is life u wanna drive a bmw u gotta work hard.....same for pvp..
sorry if im a bit harsh on ur idea.....but i see it as a fail..!!!

It's okay if you see my idea as a "fail", however I'm just going to answer your question on why I'm not wealthy by now with the amount of time I've been playing.

I am a casual player, not a serious hardcore one. Whenever I play, it's usually 10-20 minute intervals, 1-3 times a week. In the past, I used to love spending that short amount of time PvPing. That really isn't possible for me anymore because I don't have the gear to be competitive, and in my own personal opinion, PvP just isn't fun unless it's as equal as possible. This is what spurred my idea to begin with. I just wanted a way to make things more equal, which in my eyes would make it more fun. Even if I were fully geared in all mythic/arcane items, I would not find it enjoyable to fight people not on that same scale. I, personally, would only want to fight people similarly spec'd, because for me that would be more challenging and fun.

Since I am a casual player who only plays 10-20 minutes, 1-3 times a week, my focus really isn't on accumulating large amounts of money. I'm sure it would be possible if I played more, but I'm really not all that interested in being rich and powerful. I was just to spend the short amount of time I have playing to have fun, which as I said, for me would be an equal PvP match.

I've accepted that this is an issue players will never really see eye-to-eye on. As Vjerevica perceptively noted in a previous post, players seem to be divided into casual players and professional/hardcore players. It makes sense to me that professional/hardcore players want to earn a lot of money and get the best items because to them, that is probably what brings them joy and fun-- a sense of accomplishment, if you will. For for myself, as a casual players who only signs on for a short amount of time 1-3 times a week, what would bring me the most joy and fun would be spending the short amount of time that I play having an equal PvP match.

I'm not ignoring your points and I'm not whining about my circumstances. I'm simply letting you know that, as a casual player, that is what I would consider fun. I hope this makes sense.

[Reflexivity]

Hi ref i hear ya.especially on the part where you feel disheartened on the gears diaparity and forum criticism.tbh i feel this is still civilised unlike any other threads where people simpy shoot you down.we are trying to open up the view from a more generic angle or acceptable perspective.

I was almost at the point of quitting as i never have 1mil or anywhere close to filthy rich.when i finally got some luck and savinf dor long i bought my first mhytic which was a bow at 6m that time.2 weeks mhytic event came up where i never anticipated.and the double odds made my 6m purchase like a fool.but with help pf friends i managed to farm better elites,merching and earned my set.my final piece was given as gift from a friend.fyi i never looted my set.

My point is it aint easy.whilst the game remain the approach has gone higher.i tried to remain my pink to a point where i knew i couldnt compete anymore.so i have to upgrade to be in the game.whilst accommodating to this change,the pve wnvironment also changed.to be faster you need to maximize ur gears.everything is changing to compromise the need of having better stats.

This game will stop once you have achieved all.and we are here still as we havent achieved all.be it gold,gears or battles.it keeps goinf upwards and we cant stay at the middle to enjoy its perks.if it stays the same theres no real need to play.

You will get there soon never lose hope.trust me.

Thanks for the constructive feedback and for trying to put a positive/inspirational spin on things. I totally understand what you are saying. It just seems like there are different types of players out there who have fun in different ways, and so they want different things. No one is wrong for wanting to have fun in their own way, but it's just difficult because not everyone finds the same things fun, and not everyone will be content with certain arrangements.

[Reflexivity]

I totally understand your point of view, reflex. Your look at the bigger picture just has some irks.

Low level players, that are legitimatly 16, have no big incentive to go pvp. They have the bigger incentive to level up, make gold and get good gear (and maybe then return to lvl 16 with a twink and excellent gear). Also, you're not one of them? So where's the problem? I dont see any legitimate lvl 16 player complaing about pvp.

Almost ALL players you find in lvl 16 or lower pvp are Twinks. Believe me. been there.

So if you love pvp just for itself, make a twink, get it geared up and go there.

If you want compete End Level Pvp, get geared up (and yes, if neccessary, get some myth gear - weapon although should suffice) and go there.

This way all your problems are solved.

See, your suggestion just would create new problems. Thatswhy it is better to "circumvent" it this way.

It lies in the nature of pvp that only the fittest survive, so there is no way around best gear, no matter wich level.

So the answer to "how do I compete without myth gear?" is, twinking below level 26 (the first myth-gear-level).

Hey Frohnatur, I understand where you are coming from and I appreciate the input.

Sure, I may not be a low level player with no alternate accounts and no other means for funding myself, but I still care about how the game is like for those people. After all, at one point in time we were all once in their shoes.

You're right, those legitimately low level players may not have any big incentive to PvP and they will probably benefit more from leveling up and doing PvE. But they still deserve the right to PvP if their heart desires, and if that's what they find fun and enjoyable in this game. Who are we to say they shouldn't just because they are low level/poor/badly geared?

I know you may not agree with my outlook on twinking, and that's alright. You're a cool, level-headed person, I respect your input. But I still feel that by creating twinks, we are negatively impacting the experiences of those who are legitimately low level, and they're forced to deal with those problems we create for them because they have no say in the matter.

Maybe we can just agree to disagree? XD

[Vjerevica]

I am a casual player, not a serious hardcore one. Whenever I play, it's usually 10-20 minute intervals, 1-3 times a week. In the past, I used to love spending that short amount of time PvPing. That really isn't possible for me anymore because I don't have the gear to be competitive, and in my own personal opinion, PvP just isn't fun unless it's as equal as possible.

The way I see things, the main misunderstanding is that most of players don't understand the very essence of such approach, thus all answers/advices are in same manner: play more, farm more, try harder, merch, save gold, buy mythics, etc. It's like they are not capable to step into shoes of person who just want to have fun.

It seems on first sight that majority players in AL are professionals. However, this can be wrong impression, because casual players are not known as very active forumers.

[Alfai]

The way I see things, the main misunderstanding is that most of players don't understand the very essence of such approach, thus all answers/advices are in same manner: play more, farm more, try harder, merch, save gold, buy mythics, etc. It's like they are not capable to step into shoes of person who just want to have fun.

It seems on first sight that majority players in AL are professionals. However, this can be wrong impression, because casual players are not known as very active forumers.

Unfortunately in all honesty i do get your points and i was in your shoe before.
With fun as the core essence such implementation must take into consideration all aspects,all players etc.cant do one thing to please a few.

As much as this is a hack n slash game it is not so true when you play against others.and with its rpg core format,being and rpg must lead to an objective, accomplishment,achievements and so on.else this will end up like simpler games like chess.its fun but not an everyday thing.

Do you also consider the impact on other gears possession like rare or epic?after you have owned in specific class then what.your thirst will be higher,you seek for more challenges.desire to meet new challenges keep us going.the game keep going upwards,better gears,new maps,new boss.its like asking grant us xp in brackeridge runs coz we like it,it can be run casually etc.which is not the case.

[GoodSyntax]

@Reflexivity - I totally understand your point! I, myself, don't own any mythics, and in the past few seasons have been an avid PvPer. Unfortunately, last season, and more so this season, there have been an increase in Mythic and Arcane items & pets, which exasperates the divide between rich and mainstream players.

In previous seasons, I was not only competitive, but moderately successful with high end Legendaries and Crate gear. The advantage of a Mythic player at inception, which at the time was only the helm (let's ignore the fact that the Nefarious Hooks were around, because they were so rare that you really never saw them), was small, meaning that well equipped Legendary players could be competitive. When Nordr came around, unleashing Mythic Armor, Mythic Bow, Sword & Shield and Gun, the disparity increased, but I still felt that players with higher-end Legendaries could still be competitive if you had superior tactics. I can accept that the Arcane items are substantially overpowering, given their rarity. But, since then, we have seen Mythic Rings, Mythic Amulets, more and more higher powered weapons, ultimately making this disparity in gear too much to overcome for mainstream players.

I rarely PvP anymore, though when I do, I find that I can still be successful on occasion, but only if my tactics are vastly superior to the opponent (or I get on a lucky crit streak). More so than ever, an average tactician can easily overwhelm a superior tactician if they are full Mythic and the opponent is in high-end Legendaries. I just don't like the idea that high-end gear is the priority over skill and tactics. At one point, tactics, build, pet selection and timing determined who won a match, now no matter how skilled a player is, an opponent wearing 15 million in gear will be better than you.

Upon the announcement of Mythic items, my impression was that it would provide a small advantage over Elite Legendary gear, which is certainly reasonable. Unfortunately, trying to compare Architect Quills of Brutality (the highest-end Legendary weapon) against the Mythic Twin Razors aren't really much of a comparison. It is akin to comparing the stats of a lv31 Mountain Teeth against a lv36 Architect Quill. As if a singular Mythic item didn't offer so much of a disparity, this effect is magnified for each Mythic Item equipped (Weapon, Helm, Armor, Ring, Amulet). What was once a slight advantage has eventually become a grossly overpowering divide of have's versus have not's.

Individually, each Mythic piece may offer a 5% advantage versus it's Elite Legendary counterpart, but in totality, wealthy players effectively get a 25% advantage when fully outfitted (assuming no Arcane's), which is more than good group play or skill can overcome in most situations.

I am just a bit disappointed at the current state, and have decided to more-or-less give up on PvP and focus on Elite Farming. I even respec'ed and dropped the Combat Medic skill (yeah, I know!). I simply feel that I cannot be competitive until I get most, if not all, Mythic items and that just eliminates one of my favorite distractions in the game. I just don't like that my hand has been forced in this way because of how Mythic gear has evolved to be so dominant and critical to success. I am further disappointed because I can be so successful soloing elite maps and completing challenging elites with terrific times in Legendary gear, but I am in a word, non-competitive in PvP.

[Vjerevica]

Do you also consider the impact on other gears possession like rare or epic?after you have owned in specific class then what.your thirst will be higher,you seek for more challenges.desire to meet new challenges keep us going.the game keep going upwards,better gears,new maps,new boss.its like asking grant us xp in brackeridge runs coz we like it,it can be run casually etc.which is not the case.

Big part of the problem is that all gear below legendary is worthless. Epics and rares don't have any purpose at all. Top legendries are bare minimum even for PvE. I think that STG uncarefully made some promises in the past and now we are dealing with consequences. Arcane weapon should be best for 3 seasons!?! I.e. Arcane Stuff will be best one on level 46. How much overpowered it has to be now to be still the best one on level 46? Three seasons are app. nine months. Even further, it should be better than next seasons Mythic weapon (which is supposed to be best for two seasons). How can they even fulfill that promises? There cannot be two bests at the same time.

It would be much more appropriate for Myths/Arcanes to be best for current season only. They will fulfill their purpose for pro players to always have best gear. Even better, it would give them goal for each new season and satisfy their need to always strive for better gear, meet new challenges and keep them going as you
accurately noticed. What is their motivation now if they know that they have best gear for next 6 months (there are already some posts from fully geared players that they don't have much left to do). That way Myths/Arcs wouldn't have to be so insanely overpowered to be the best.

Current situation is that because of this huge unbalance in power (caused by 2/3 seasons promise) all levels below are broken. I could deal against best weapon in season but how to deal against best weapon on level 46? What skills in a world could possibly compensate for that?

On the other hand, I am aware that hard work or platinum spends should be rewarded. It is just that currently they are rewarded at the expense of all others.

I would repeat my proposal to have common league (where no myths would be allowed) and Champions League for Pro/Elite players.
What would change for Elite players? Not much, I suppose. Even now in PvP are only Myth/Arc geared players. Majority of others already quitted or are about to quit pvp. In realty we already do have Champions League - it is just not formalized.
What would change for casual players? I guess everything. They would have a place to enjoy pvp again without being abused by professionals. If they feel that they overgrowed this common level they could have Champions League as new goal to keep them motivate. If somebody feels that his skills are so good that he can compete with big (better geared) guys he can always try. No limitations there.

The guys that make to leaderboard of Champions league will be acknowledged as best. No doubt about it and not much change in comparison to present situation.

I just try to elaborate my perspective and propose some solution that would please both sides. I fully understand the effort and commitment needed to be pro/elite player. I could even say that I admire that determination but it is completely different level of game. To paraphrase myself, if you enjoy playing football with guys on the school playground would you like that each time you find free time for game Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern, etc. are waiting for you? How many games would be necessary till you quit completely?

I really hope that I succeeded to explain my point of view. Again, I am not trying to derogate anyone's effort and achievements. I truly and honestly respect such commitment. It is just that I am not in situation to be able to do that at this point in my life, but I still love the game.

[Vjerevica]

@GoodSyntax
You've said it all. You've given accurate chronology of what happened to PvP. It is like you have described my case in detail. :hopelessness:

[Soundlesskill]

First off, I’m sorry if a thread has already been posted offering a similar solution. I tried my best to search through previous threads and I found several complaining about the lack of fairness in PvP, but none offering this particular solution.

As I mentioned, many threads out there talk about the unbalance in PvP. And I agree; I find the current PvP system to be very broken. Back when mythics weren’t as common as they are now and not too many people owned them, I used to love to PvP. I love the thrill and the challenge of going up against other players with different strategies and tactics, and testing mine against theirs. However, as we all know, since the increase in the circulation of mythic items, many issues have developed with regards to fairness and balance. And with the way it has been recently, I’ve stepped away from PvP.

I am not here to slander mythic items or their users, but in order to continue onto my solution, I need to acknowledge that a problem exists, so I’m just going be honest: a non-mythic user will always be at a disadvantage compared to a full mythic user. Regardless of player skill and strategy, the fact that a fully geared mythic players can take more hits and dish out more damage gives them an edge, even if their tactics are terrible.

Now, I’ve read a lot of threads out there that like to place the blame on someone, which isn’t right. Some non-mythic users may say that mythics should be prohibited in PvP, but that isn’t right considering those people probably worked hard to acquire those items and should be allowed to enjoy their benefits. Some mythic users say that “non-mythic users just need to work harder” and devote more time/effort to the game in order to gain those items, but that isn’t fair to say either. Personally, I am a level 36 capped rogue who has been playing since the level 16 cap days. I’ve always worked hard to be successful in this game and I’ve farmed my butt off, but I’ve never managed to make over 500k in my entire time playing (laugh at me if you want, but I’m serious). I don’t own any mythic gear aside from my Slag and Leprechaun pendent (plat purchases from doing free offers), and I’ve come to accept that I probably never will obtain a mythic helm/armor/weapon/necklace/pendant. My life and schedule just don’t allow for the time necessary to play enough/merch efficiently to accumulate those items, and that’s okay. But that doesn’t mean I still don’t like to enjoy PvP. I relish being able to go on and play PvP in short 10-20 minute bursts here and there throughout the day. That gives me my gaming fix as opposed to PvE, which I find rather boring.

So in order to appease everyone so that everyone can walk away satisfied, I propose filtering PvP rooms not only by level as it currently is, but also by equipment rarity. Rooms would be divided into the categories of Common, Rare, Epic, Legendary, Mythic, Arcane, and Any. Below are what the rules would be:


The current level bracket grouping system would still be intact, allowing you to fight players a couple levels higher or lower than you, but nothing too drastic.


The Any room would be similar to how current PvP is, where any rarity equipment can be used against other players. You will be able to fight players geared similarly, higher, or lower than yourself.


For all of the rooms excluding the Any room, players can wear equipment lower than or at the rarity of the room they want to join, but not beyond it. So you can fight in rooms where people are geared higher than you, but not lower than you (the sole exception is the Any room). For example, I could wear all Epic items and play in the Epic, Legendary, or Mythic room if I wanted. But players with even one Legendary item and the rest Epic would be prohibited from entering the Epic or below room.


Pet rarity will also be taken into account. For example, if I am wearing all Epic items but am using Malison (a Legendary pet), I cannot enter the Epic room. I would be forced to either swap out Malison or enter the Legendary/Mythic/Arcane/Any room.

To prevent players from abusing the system, once you enter the room, you are bound to that equipment rarity or lower. For example, if I went into the Legendary room and wanted to switch weapons, I can switch to any weapon Legendary or below, but no Mythics or Arcanes. This applies towards pets as well. So if I am in the Legendary room, I can swap out my Malison for another pet Legendary or lower, but I wouldn’t be able to call out a pet like Slag, which is mythic.

By adopting these rules, players of all levels would be able to truly thrive and enjoy PvP, regardless of what equipment or pets they may or may not have. Imagine the possibilities. Just for fun, level 36 end-game players could gear up in all Common equipment and face other players in the same level bracket wearing similar gear. Gutsy players who want a challenge can fight against players with better equipment than themselves. It wouldn’t matter if you’re rich or poor, mythic user or non-mythic user, plat-user or not, or just somewhere in-between. No one would be forced to fight against better-geared players unless they choose to. No one would be able to totally obliterate another player in PvP because the individuals that players fight against would be similarly geared (unless a player is gutsy and walks into a higher geared room, where in that case the lower geared player made a conscious decision to do that, instead of being forced against his will). Balance and fairness would be maintained. PvP would be fun for all again!

Please devs, I hope you really consider this proposal. PvP is one of the major selling points for me in any game I play, whether it’s a game on a console, computer, or phone. Once I do all there is to do in PvE, the only real reason for me to play is the thrill of going up against other real people out there. I know a ton of people feel similar to how I do. Please make this happen, devs. The community will thank you for it, big time!

1+ I've been there, getting continously nuked by full mythic players.

[Reflexivity]

GoodSyntax,

Thank you for so eloquently articulating the point of view of the "underdog". When a forumer and a player as well-respected as yourself is able to stand up for equality, it reassures me that I'm not crazy/misguided for wanting this and gives me hope that there are more people out there who want the same thing.

Your synopsis, interpretation, and analysis of the situation at hand rings true to my heart, and I really feel that the disparity between the haves and have-nots just keeps growing, but no one seems to really mind as long as they are winning because "that's how real life works". But this isn't real life, this is a game. We have the potential to make improvements and modifications in a game that would never be possible in real life, in order to create a better/more equal community. But it just seems like many do not care about equality.

I, too, have given up my PvP build with Combat Medic and have re-spec'd with a PvE setup. It's really such a shame because PvP was my favorite distraction in the game as well. I feel that playing without any mythic gear is asking to get owned. No amount of tactical superiority and cunning can consistently put you ahead of an entirely decked out mythic player; their stats will just compensate for them, even if they happen to be strategically inferior. How much more for a full mythic players with good tactics and strategy?

[Kuragasi]

I don't think that Reflex's idea is to far fetched at all. I can remember many of games that have had very successful PVP system with something much like this in place. Mostly the difference was they were hosted games where rules and categories were either allowed or not allowed.

It gave room for creativity and allowed players of all levels to enjoy a game. It also gave options for different games for example in TDM, you could set only win scenario was if Trulle was killed, rather than the 20 kill limit, or same in CTF only win was if flags were reached.

Other filters could be no armor, or no pets etc.

I think a system that reflex and vjerevica are proposing would do AL and pvp some good and might give players different goals to achieve.

But I also cant really see anything changing for the fact that there just aren't the numbers to justify such a complex system.

[Reflexivity]

I don't think that Reflex's idea is to far fetched at all. I can remember many of games that have had very successful PVP system with something much like this in place. Mostly the difference was they were hosted games where rules and categories were either allowed or not allowed.

It gave room for creativity and allowed players of all levels to enjoy a game. It also gave options for different games for example in TDM, you could set only win scenario was if Trulle was killed, rather than the 20 kill limit, or same in CTF only win was if flags were reached.

Other filters could be no armor, or no pets etc.

I think a system that reflex and vjerevica are proposing would do AL and pvp some good and might give players different goals to achieve.

But I also cant really see anything changing for the fact that there just aren't the numbers to justify such a complex system.

Thank you very much for your honest input, Kuragasi.

You make a valid point regarding having the numbers to implement such a system, and I know that others have considered that aspect as well, and find it be to the primary drawback, amongst other things. Perhaps, if my idea is too radical, a more subtle, alternative filtering approach could be implemented?

I think Vjerevica had a good idea with suggesting a Common league (where mythics are not allowed) and a Champion league (mythics allowed) and I would like to add on to it. Maybe to add more incentive to make players join and continue to play the Champion league, those players could be awarded special recognition/titles and corresponding weapons with special effects, which could only be used within their league?

Since those players are serious and seem to care about about their KDR, new titles and weapons could be awarded depending on various achievements. Examples for titles being awarded would be for things like X amount of overall kills, achieving X amount of one shot KO kills, stunning a certain amount of players X amount of times, killing multiple players at once X amount of times, etc.

In this manner, the serious players get to use their mythics to their hearts content, and there are still lots of prizes and rewards for them to unlock (titles/achievements/special weapons), to prevent them from getting bored. The only thing is those weapons would be bound to this Champion league and couldn't be used in the Common league and PvE setting. At the same time, the casual players could enjoy a more equalized form of PvPing without getting nuked on sight by an overwhelming amount of mythic players.

I know the number of players joining the Champion league may still be a concern for some, but with more cool things to unlock and accomplish, it gives the serious players a reason to join. Many players have stated that they have left PvP because they feel they cannot go toe-to-toe with a mythic user, but that they would be interested in coming back if things were more equal. And by not forcing casual players to go up against mythic players, I feel that a lot of those players would come back to PvP, increasing the overall amount of PvPers.

There's a quote out there that goes "if you build it, they will come."
Build this, watch the PvPers come! :biggrin:

[wlsgh15]

Ur idea is cool..but even if there were enough players...
what then is the point of getting mythics or arcanes..!!!
y would i farm 2-5 months tryin to get a maul if i wont get any extra advantages over others..!!!
ill simply play in legendary room etc....and save my self 4 months of farming for arcane weapon..!! and i bet everyone will do so..!!
2nd: i have a rogue which is pure legendary gears..and believe or not i kill mythic warriors, mages and rogues not all for sure but alot..!!
my point is if what u suggest will be done..!! then simply i wont need to waste 1 hour of my life farming..ill just get some common gears worth 1k and own pvp..
3rd: from lvl cap 16 and u only made 500k....that means ur doing it wrong..or ur not doing at all.!!!
if u just farm locked crates in kraken mines u can get from selling crates 2M+ a month...1 elite golden chest is 100k+ so if u managed to get 500k in 7 months means budd u need to be sure how u farm..!!!
i got scammed in this game twice ...scammers left me with 50k or so..I didnt give up..i still farmed again and got my gold again...!!!
pvp is like real life..its never fair....there are rich people EX doctors etc(( hard farmers)) and people born rich ((plat players)) and there r poor people..!!
no one can just say all people should be equil..!! coz this is life u wanna drive a bmw u gotta work hard.....same for pvp..
sorry if im a bit harsh on ur idea.....but i see it as a fail..!!!

I just liked your comment.
and yeah like oldies i think its right for them that get pay for how long they played for and ppl still complain about they are poor or what.
and its like more advantage but doesnt mean its unbeatable. like pockiee was non mythic but he stills owns me alot. and while i wasnt good gear i could still beat people.
you know what I farmed elite really hard in season1,2,3 then once lock crates came i also opened alot for keep my mythics or stuff even though, i didnt get perfectly mythics. now i know how to merch so i am keep trying how to make gold.
everything from whether they got big loot or not, its still their hard working. or know the way to be rich. its part of game system i believe. and i also believe oldies now know how to make gold with merch or farming or loot whatever.
and i respect ppl who started pvp from pink to mythics like shadikiller as good pvp player and also he has good manner.
woot that wasnt my point..
what i am saying is agreed this

-ramyunstyle-

[Avshow]

great idea , but this wont happen.

Plz realize that reducing the level of gear will lead to a never ending game in pvp, becoz low dmg and dps, but heal skill still works fine even under white gears

[baddiva]

agree... just take the mythics or arcane advantage outside pvp room.. they still have advantage to farm elites faster...

being owned in PVP by a high-geared chars and there's-nothing-you-can-do situation just taking away the fun of PVP from common geared chars...

anyway, what do mythic and/or arcane user think about their advantages or fun in PVP? to overpower another? is it only them who deserves fun in PVP? come on, share some fun with normal geared char...

Sent from my LG-P970 using Xparent Green Tapatalk 2

[Alfai]

Tbh back when mhytics were so rare and arcane was like very hard to spot,i personally set a goal to own these sets so that i can beat the mhytic wearer (mhytic helm user in s3).i had difficulties yet but by the time i have it all more and more people own the same thing.the competition bar was raised to that level so i felt like back to pink again.feel owning?no.feel competitive?yes.feel noob?i changed room if u knew i cant beat that person and return till i felt otherwise.conclusion?never really feel special as its back to the same thing again since im not big and consistent plat spenders.

Does that answer your query?

[Crescentwind]

Nice idea but I bet it wont be implemented. There are lots of factors involve why it shouldn't be implement..
e.g. Availability = Numbers of player playing this game.. If we filter the PVP arena then 1 game would definitely takes times to start and players will be frustrated waiting.. Let us not forget that not all of the time there are lots of player online for a certain level bracket...

Just strive hard, who knows soon you'll have mythic/arcane as well :) or instead just play as low level twink and I assure you its fun :)

[Primeblades]

Nice idea but I bet it wont be implemented. There are lots of factors involve why it shouldn't be implement..
e.g. Availability = Numbers of player playing this game.. If we filter the PVP arena then 1 game would definitely takes times to start and players will be frustrated waiting.. Let us not forget that not all of the time there are lots of player online for a certain level bracket...

Just strive hard, who knows soon you'll have mythic/arcane as well :) or instead just play as low level twink and I assure you its fun :)

If you wanna pvp without mythics or arcane weapons just twink at a level like 23 its fun and you dont have to bust your butt for money

[baddiva]

Tbh back when mhytics were so rare and arcane was like very hard to spot,i personally set a goal to own these sets so that i can beat the mhytic wearer (mhytic helm user in s3).i had difficulties yet but by the time i have it all more and more people own the same thing.the competition bar was raised to that level so i felt like back to pink again.feel owning?no.feel competitive?yes.feel noob?i changed room if u knew i cant beat that person and return till i felt otherwise.conclusion?never really feel special as its back to the same thing again since im not big and consistent plat spenders.

Does that answer your query?

agree... this is exactly the background behind the idea... to save time between changing rooms...
and, on my perspective, I think there are less interest among low class players as they begin to learn, that only heavy-killers who play PVP... ofc there are few exception.. but yeah... that's that
so i think it is great that everyone can enjoy pvp (means that having kills and to be killed) when PVE become boring...
at least, just give a try, and I predict that many players will feel more competitive on their level, and then PVP become more alive than ever.


Sent from my LG-P970 using Xparent Green Tapatalk 2

[Vjerevica]

With crafting system that is going to be implemented soon this idea is actual again.

Crafting will create even more discrepancy. In total there will be 5 gems difference between full myth vs. legendary. I guess that will make PvP exclusive place for myths and few legendary masochists. :crushed:

[FluffNStuff]

This may be the greatest PvP suggestion yet!
Essentially, the current system is based on full fledged MMO's like WoW and the OP is suggesting a system based on HALO. The difference of course is a HALO PvP is pick up and go, everyone on the same footing, bash each others brains out and then match over. And the thing is, HALO PvP is a TON OF FUN and HALO SELLS A TON OF GAMES!
The problem current players have with this is that they invested time and money into a system that included a significant portion of equipping themselves so to have that system just torn out from under them would make them justifiably angry.
So, we have a new system that would bring a ton of players into PvP, but we also have players that worked hard to become the best and denying them that would be wrong. So, what we need is a new system like suggested but one where the current top would still have the advantages they earned. My solution would be to create these new rooms where players can only play using certain level of equipment, but to designate them as 'SPARRING ROOMS'. Players could go there, have fun, bash on each other, and not worry about gear. Now when they want to actually COMPETE, that is what the Anything Goes room is for. That is where your kills and deaths actually count. That is the only place to get the AP's, and the only place to increase your ratios for your Guild.

So, what do you think, are you ready for it?

[Vjerevica]

This may be the greatest PvP suggestion yet!
Essentially, the current system is based on full fledged MMO's like WoW and the OP is suggesting a system based on HALO. The difference of course is a HALO PvP is pick up and go, everyone on the same footing, bash each others brains out and then match over. And the thing is, HALO PvP is a TON OF FUN and HALO SELLS A TON OF GAMES!
The problem current players have with this is that they invested time and money into a system that included a significant portion of equipping themselves so to have that system just torn out from under them would make them justifiably angry.
So, we have a new system that would bring a ton of players into PvP, but we also have players that worked hard to become the best and denying them that would be wrong. So, what we need is a new system like suggested but one where the current top would still have the advantages they earned. My solution would be to create these new rooms where players can only play using certain level of equipment, but to designate them as 'SPARRING ROOMS'. Players could go there, have fun, bash on each other, and not worry about gear. Now when they want to actually COMPETE, that is what the Anything Goes room is for. That is where your kills and deaths actually count. That is the only place to get the AP's, and the only place to increase your ratios for your Guild.

So, what do you think, are you ready for it?

Personally, I couldn't care less about k/d ratio or APs. So, YES! Call it training rooms or whatever . . . just bring back fun to PvP.

[baddiva]

great idea, fluffy!

Sent from my LG-P970 using Xparent Green Tapatalk 2

[Daddyblu]

Interesting idea.

The biggest problem I see is having enough people to play with. If you're the only one with mythics on queing for PvP you might be sitting in an empty room for a while until someone else with mythics logs in and queues for pvp.

Honestly, I don't see it being implemented.



true!

[Theillist1]

READ THIS! READ THIS! READ THIS!
Listen guys! Breaking adding filters to rooms about gear is down right STUPID! FIX the broken pvp system by adding simple rules and a new pvp stat window!
These rules and stats include:
Got to control both flags to caputure the flag!
Add a Win Loss record to stats for CTF
Add a flag return statistic( for when u kill enemy and return ur own flag).
Lastly, add two factions (red/blue). Permanant team.

Just by adding these simple rules you give CTF a lot of opportunity for balancing! People would have to run in packs of 2-3 so they can defend their flag and attack at the same time. People would actually kill a flag carrier w/o feeling guilty. And adding that win/loss record would really make people think twice about ganging! Cause if u gang one guy 4 others will quick cap and win the game! Say hello to some new pvp achievments too.... Flag Defender (returning your teams flag), 100/1000/10000 CTF wins. Choosing a pvp faction achievment with title of course to support your faction!

[SpiritedAway]

+1. Very good idea, and very well written.

[Vjerevica]

READ THIS! READ THIS! READ THIS!
Listen guys! Breaking adding filters to rooms about gear is down right STUPID! FIX the broken pvp system by adding simple rules and a new pvp stat window!
These rules and stats include:
Got to control both flags to caputure the flag!
Add a Win Loss record to stats for CTF
Add a flag return statistic( for when u kill enemy and return ur own flag).
Lastly, add two factions (red/blue). Permanant team.

Just by adding these simple rules you give CTF a lot of opportunity for balancing! People would have to run in packs of 2-3 so they can defend their flag and attack at the same time. People would actually kill a flag carrier w/o feeling guilty. And adding that win/loss record would really make people think twice about ganging! Cause if u gang one guy 4 others will quick cap and win the game! Say hello to some new pvp achievments too.... Flag Defender (returning your teams flag), 100/1000/10000 CTF wins. Choosing a pvp faction achievment with title of course to support your faction!

I like all of your well elaborated suggestions. They would certainly help to repair the way people behave in CTF but you don't offer any solution on main reason why this thread was posted in the first place and that is too big misbalance in myth vs. elite gear. Difference is so big now that no amount of skill can compensate. So, only solution if someone wants to join PvP, is heavy farming, merching, etc. which is not really solution if we are talking about casual players.

Big question is how to make pvp fun for non professionals (elite, or whatever you want to call it) players.

[baddiva]

easy... random teaming and limited time pvp..
so people can't choose which team they want to join, it's their choice to enter pvp room and they held responsible for the team's win or lose. this can somehow balance teams. or maybe with a restriction of no more than 2 people with same class in a team... just like the tournament rule.

limited time pvp is tools to encourage both teams to score a goal. a successful flag can extend the countdown, but if no team achieve 5 goals, the result will be tie, and no Kills recorded. but either way, death always recorded.

Sent from my LG-P970 using Xparent Green Tapatalk 2

[Kostral]

Hide the name of players + disable the join button in PVP and Voila !

that was wrote many times, no need to refund Jupiter...

[baddiva]

well I guess most pvp ers feels nothing wrong with pvp room...

[Theillist1]

I like all of your well elaborated suggestions. They would certainly help to repair the way people behave in CTF but you don't offer any solution on main reason why this thread was posted in the first place and that is too big misbalance in myth vs. elite gear. Difference is so big now that no amount of skill can compensate. So, only solution if someone wants to join PvP, is heavy farming, merching, etc. which is not really solution if we are talking about casual players.

Big question is how to make pvp fun for non professionals (elite, or whatever you want to call it) players.

By not max leveling... start your pvp adventure between levels 7-21. That's what the disable xp button is for. For casual players.

[Theillist1]

Hide the name of players + disable the join button in PVP and Voila !

that was wrote many times, no need to refund Jupiter...

Great idea

[Vjerevica]

By not max leveling... start your pvp adventure between levels 7-21. That's what the disable xp button is for. For casual players.

I don't think so. Disable XP is for twinking and that has absolutely nothing with casual players, whatsoever.

[Theillist1]

I don't think so. Disable XP is for twinking and that has absolutely nothing with casual players, whatsoever.

Your telling me that a level 36 casual player has 1000+ gold to feed their pet everytime it goes dormant. Millions to spend on amazing gear Mythic gear? Will grind endlessley to get millions to keep their toon in top performance? Thats a casual player?
7-21 IS casual pvp cause u can fully gear with 1 million gold and 240 plat. And be a top echelon player in their bracket.

[Vjerevica]

Your telling me that a level 36 casual player has 1000+ gold to feed their pet everytime it goes dormant. Millions to spend on amazing gear Mythic gear? Will grind endlessley to get millions to keep their toon in top performance? Thats a casual player?
7-21 IS casual pvp cause u can fully gear with 1 million gold and 240 plat. And be a top echelon player in their bracket.

Honestly, I don’t know what are you talking about?

I am casual player and I’m level 36. It doesn’t take that much effort to cap.

Feeding the pet? First of all, there is pet rotation if the gold is a problem. Second, 1000 gold for feeding pet is not that much. It requires app. 4000 per hour. Only, Shuyal daily quests will bring about 2500 gold in ten minutes. So earning money to feed the pet if you have one favorite is easily doable. Remember, we are talking about casual players, meaning not hours and hours of play per day.

Millions for Mythics? The whole point of the thread is how to ensure that even casual players (meaning no Myths/arcanes) can have fun in PvP. So, what endless grinding are you talking about? That is for “pro” players with lot of time on their disposal to invest in the game.

As for top legendary gear, I don’t believe it is more expensive on cap level than on twink levels. In fact, I’m pretty sure it is quite opposite.

Why is it so hard to understand that there are players who didn’t dedicate their lives to this game but just want to have fun (on their low, non elite level) in brief moments they log on.

[Zeus]

Honestly, I don’t know what are you talking about?

I am casual player and I’m level 36. It doesn’t take that much effort to cap.

Feeding the pet? First of all, there is pet rotation if the gold is a problem. Second, 1000 gold for feeding pet is not that much. It requires app. 4000 per hour. Only, Shuyal daily quests will bring about 2500 gold in ten minutes. So earning money to feed the pet if you have one favorite is easily doable. Remember, we are talking about casual players, meaning not hours and hours of play per day.

Millions for Mythics? The whole point of the thread is how to ensure that even casual players (meaning no Myths/arcanes) can have fun in PvP. So, what endless grinding are you talking about? That is for “pro” players with lot of time on their disposal to invest in the game.

As for top legendary gear, I don’t believe it is more expensive on cap level than on twink levels. In fact, I’m pretty sure it is quite opposite.

Why is it so hard to understand that there are players who didn’t dedicate their lives to this game but just want to have fun (on their low, non elite level) in brief moments they log on.

A casual player can have fun, but they just can't be competitive.

If you want to be competitive as well... time to start playing more/spending more plat. :p

[Joncheese]

Hi Reflex,

Thanks for your input and suggestions towards the problems that this game faces within PVP. Whilst i completely agree that the current system is broken, however i don't think you're idea would solve the issue..... In fact i think it would create a whole new group of problems.

By creating a room for lower geared players etc you risk the following:

1) Mythic Items dropping in price.
2) Arcane items dropping in price.
3) Legendary Items dramatically increasing in price.
4) AL Economy being ruined.
5) STS losing a vast amount of PLAT sales.
6) The loss of many end game players

Reasons are as follows:

1) Mythic weapons now only needed for PVE, as who in their right mind would buy mythics for PVP if no one is using them. Loss of gold to those that have bought them. Outcome = Many unhappy endgamers.

2) Arcane items becoming unusable, as obviously given the choice you would never come up against someone with a Kershal or Maul etc.

3) Legendary items would now become ridiculously expensive. All of the OP items at end game level would then be the new mythics.... Solving no problems at all.

4) AL Economy (after just being given a new lease of life) would start to crumble again.

5) STS would lose a HUGE amoun of PLAT sales which keeps the game going. A vast majority of PLAT is made by end gamers opening crates to get the desired mythics/arcanes. Take this away and STS face a huge problem. Mythics are there because alot of endgame players who are serious open crates to obtain them. This makes STS money. They rely on these PLAT sales to keep the game going.

6) Losing Endgame players is a bad idea. These are the main source of STS income when it comes to PLAT revenue. Lose them and IMO lost the game. How many lvl 16 players do you see spending PLAT. I see very few.

Also what about ARCANE PETS? They will be the next unfair advantage.


The bottom line is you will just see an adjustment in power. Mythics will become unusable in PVP, and Legendary Pinks would become the most expensive items in the game for this aspect. These would then be merched/hoarded by the mercher players and everyone would then be saving for Pinks rather than Mythics. Its a no win situation IMO.

Also, why should endgame players who have worked hard for their items be penalised, as that is what would happen. If it were implemented i personally would use my assets to buy the best Pink gear in game, as would all my friends. You would still face the same problem.

Apollo and the others are right, if you want to PVP at a truly equal level then make a Twink account. Though at every level there will always be someone who is more geared than you..... Why? Because they have worked and saved hard for their items.

Solution = Work harder. Play harder. Get better. You get out what you put in im affraid.


Perhaps implement a BOSS KILL PVP. Both teams fighting to kill the boss quicker..... I love this idea and there are plenty of suggesions about it on this thread.

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?123814-Pvp-room-is-getting-boring

Whilst i dont agree with your suggestion, i still appreciate where you are coming from and thank you for trying to solve the problem.

Cheers

Jon

[Theillist1]

Hi Reflex,

Thanks for your input and suggestions towards the problems that this game faces within PVP. Whilst i completely agree that the current system is broken, however i don't think you're idea would solve the issue..... In fact i think it would create a whole new group of problems.

By creating a room for lower geared players etc you risk the following:

1) Mythic Items dropping in price.
2) Arcane items dropping in price.
3) Legendary Items dramatically increasing in price.
4) AL Economy being ruined.
5) STS losing a vast amount of PLAT sales.
6) The loss of many end game players

Reasons are as follows:

1) Mythic weapons now only needed for PVE, as who in their right mind would buy mythics for PVP if no one is using them. Loss of gold to those that have bought them. Outcome = Many unhappy endgamers.

2) Arcane items becoming unusable, as obviously given the choice you would never come up against someone with a Kershal or Maul etc.

3) Legendary items would now become ridiculously expensive. All of the OP items at end game level would then be the new mythics.... Solving no problems at all.

4) AL Economy (after just being given a new lease of life) would start to crumble again.

5) STS would lose a HUGE amoun of PLAT sales which keeps the game going. A vast majority of PLAT is made by end gamers opening crates to get the desired mythics/arcanes. Take this away and STS face a huge problem. Mythics are there because alot of endgame players who are serious open crates to obtain them. This makes STS money. They rely on these PLAT sales to keep the game going.

6) Losing Endgame players is a bad idea. These are the main source of STS income when it comes to PLAT revenue. Lose them and IMO lost the game. How many lvl 16 players do you see spending PLAT. I see very few.

Also what about ARCANE PETS? They will be the next unfair advantage.


The bottom line is you will just see an adjustment in power. Mythics will become unusable in PVP, and Legendary Pinks would become the most expensive items in the game for this aspect. These would then be merched/hoarded by the mercher players and everyone would then be saving for Pinks rather than Mythics. Its a no win situation IMO.

Also, why should endgame players who have worked hard for their items be penalised, as that is what would happen. If it were implemented i personally would use my assets to buy the best Pink gear in game, as would all my friends. You would still face the same problem.

Apollo and the others are right, if you want to PVP at a truly equal level then make a Twink account. Though at every level there will always be someone who is more geared than you..... Why? Because they have worked and saved hard for their items.

Solution = Work harder. Play harder. Get better. You get out what you put in im affraid.


Perhaps implement a BOSS KILL PVP. Both teams fighting to kill the boss quicker..... I love this idea and there are plenty of suggesions about it on this thread.

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?123814-Pvp-room-is-getting-boring

Whilst i dont agree with your suggestion, i still appreciate where you are coming from and thank you for trying to solve the problem.

Cheers

Jon

Best ferdback in thread! You're absolutly correct!

[becky_xil]

Actually IMO.. the mythic, arcane,common bla bla bla equipment is not the problem here.. the KDR is the most problem of some of us.. I'm sure there will a lot endgame char will joib the pvp if the KDR only showing kill. . Not death... and this is not suggestion!! I don't care tho.. I'll keep going to get my mythic weap then I set.. all u need is multi char for klaas buff and lepre.. sry for my bad English..

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[eugene9707]

since this is brought up ...
if you think about it ... this thing makes no difference at all :)

[Socrates]

I saw a reply in this thread talking about arcane,mythic price would fall if this idea was done and in addition legendary items price would rise. I surely do not disagree but aren't you forgetting the lock grand crated. People are fulll of greed so they will still want all mythic,arcane equip and still put money to have plat. Also people do not put plat to open crates but change the plat to gold to buy staff so that means they will purchase legendary items too.But I do not at the least believe that the price of legendary itmes will go higher because consigment store has already some legendary items 1,5m or 2m.Also this thread doesn't only say for legendary room but for epic or rare rooms too so... why not epic or rare items price rise too?Yeah I know they do not have good stats but that is the point why a full mythic player spend money on items that lowers his stats.
Ty I hope I could help with my post
I agree 100% with your idea I hope it will be done !! :)

[Hiosahaf]

Let us say a new player joins the game and he enters the PvP arena. Of course he doesn't have great gear and then he meets the amazing twink guilds we have and they just destroy him. What if that player was gonna spend, say 50 dollars in this game? He won't now and he leaves the game.
So say there are x such people, STS loses 50x dollars just due to this PvP scheme.
If there were separate rooms, it would've been a lot of fun for them and they'd spend more too.
Mythic gear is the new pink, you gotta admit it. Please enter a PvP room and tell me how many mythic/arcane users you see. There are quite many who PvP.
Benefits from this?
It will increase the value of every rarity item by quite a lot (people won't liquidate em as much as they do now)
I don't really care if you call me a noob, but I want to have fun in the game when I PvP for a few mins instead of being farmed by the mauls and mythics

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[Endkey]

If everyone stops farming for mythics then the plat buyers can do the same. Go on pinks. As Jon said the plat sale will go down coz people will stop buying plats.
Mythic prices will go down and the pinks and epics u think are cheap atm will be very expensive. The pink pets u can buy easily now will reach 500k+ again..still you will have to farm for them.
Many pros who are tired of buyin plat may end up in that legendary section of the pvp and this might even get tougher for u lol
Btw good suggestion..its a new idea i have never soon before :)

[nelson131]

Big part of the problem is that all gear below legendary is worthless. Epics and rares don't have any purpose at all. Top legendries are bare minimum even for PvE. I think that STG uncarefully made some promises in the past and now we are dealing with consequences. Arcane weapon should be best for 3 seasons!?! I.e. Arcane Stuff will be best one on level 46. How much overpowered it has to be now to be still the best one on level 46? Three seasons are app. nine months. Even further, it should be better than next seasons Mythic weapon (which is supposed to be best for two seasons). How can they even fulfill that promises? There cannot be two bests at the same time.

It would be much more appropriate for Myths/Arcanes to be best for current season only. They will fulfill their purpose for pro players to always have best gear. Even better, it would give them goal for each new season and satisfy their need to always strive for better gear, meet new challenges and keep them going as you
accurately noticed. What is their motivation now if they know that they have best gear for next 6 months (there are already some posts from fully geared players that they don't have much left to do). That way Myths/Arcs wouldn't have to be so insanely overpowered to be the best.

Current situation is that because of this huge unbalance in power (caused by 2/3 seasons promise) all levels below are broken. I could deal against best weapon in season but how to deal against best weapon on level 46? What skills in a world could possibly compensate for that?

On the other hand, I am aware that hard work or platinum spends should be rewarded. It is just that currently they are rewarded at the expense of all others.

I would repeat my proposal to have common league (where no myths would be allowed) and Champions League for Pro/Elite players.
What would change for Elite players? Not much, I suppose. Even now in PvP are only Myth/Arc geared players. Majority of others already quitted or are about to quit pvp. In realty we already do have Champions League - it is just not formalized.
What would change for casual players? I guess everything. They would have a place to enjoy pvp again without being abused by professionals. If they feel that they overgrowed this common level they could have Champions League as new goal to keep them motivate. If somebody feels that his skills are so good that he can compete with big (better geared) guys he can always try. No limitations there.

The guys that make to leaderboard of Champions league will be acknowledged as best. No doubt about it and not much change in comparison to present situation.

I just try to elaborate my perspective and propose some solution that would please both sides. I fully understand the effort and commitment needed to be pro/elite player. I could even say that I admire that determination but it is completely different level of game. To paraphrase myself, if you enjoy playing football with guys on the school playground would you like that each time you find free time for game Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern, etc. are waiting for you? How many games would be necessary till you quit completely?

I really hope that I succeeded to explain my point of view. Again, I am not trying to derogate anyone's effort and achievements. I truly and honestly respect such commitment. It is just that I am not in situation to be able to do that at this point in my life, but I still love the game.

So from here is an great idea. For u mythic players who want kdr, leaderboards, ap, join the champion's league! For pro legendary players who want to try real pvp, test ur skills at the champion's league!

For us non-mythic players, who don't care about kdr, ap, leaderboards, anything. Join the commons league where no kills, no deaths count! Just a fun room!

U can then farm for mythics for champion's league, ap, leaderboards, kdr. So there won't be much of a price crash.

Well but u rich players just want to own, maul, slaughter all non-mythic players,I'm sayin that soon, only mythics will join pvp and there! U already have champions league. All we need is an commons league where we poor fellas can have some fun and where skill>gear

Now then, the elite legendary prices will rise, and ppl can farm elite legendary gear as a path to mythic gear! I think somewhere Zeus said that prices of elite legendary gear are vital to people who want to farm their way to mythic gear and I frankly agree

Maybe the mythic gear players probably won't agree, but one thing we all agree on is that PVP NEEDS FIXING!

Thankyou

When this is implemented, I'm sure more will return the pvp and without filtering system, there would be enough ppl playing. And arcane players will still have advantages against mythic players, so go for that maul/arcane staff /hook, no no srry, twin razorbacks.

And of course, a lot of tweaking will be needed, but why not bother trying? We can always come up with an better idea.
Thankyou

[nelson131]

@Reflexivity - I totally understand your point! I, myself, don't own any mythics, and in the past few seasons have been an avid PvPer. Unfortunately, last season, and more so this season, there have been an increase in Mythic and Arcane items & pets, which exasperates the divide between rich and mainstream players.

In previous seasons, I was not only competitive, but moderately successful with high end Legendaries and Crate gear. The advantage of a Mythic player at inception, which at the time was only the helm (let's ignore the fact that the Nefarious Hooks were around, because they were so rare that you really never saw them), was small, meaning that well equipped Legendary players could be competitive. When Nordr came around, unleashing Mythic Armor, Mythic Bow, Sword & Shield and Gun, the disparity increased, but I still felt that players with higher-end Legendaries could still be competitive if you had superior tactics. I can accept that the Arcane items are substantially overpowering, given their rarity. But, since then, we have seen Mythic Rings, Mythic Amulets, more and more higher powered weapons, ultimately making this disparity in gear too much to overcome for mainstream players.

I rarely PvP anymore, though when I do, I find that I can still be successful on occasion, but only if my tactics are vastly superior to the opponent (or I get on a lucky crit streak). More so than ever, an average tactician can easily overwhelm a superior tactician if they are full Mythic and the opponent is in high-end Legendaries. I just don't like the idea that high-end gear is the priority over skill and tactics. At one point, tactics, build, pet selection and timing determined who won a match, now no matter how skilled a player is, an opponent wearing 15 million in gear will be better than you.

Upon the announcement of Mythic items, my impression was that it would provide a small advantage over Elite Legendary gear, which is certainly reasonable. Unfortunately, trying to compare Architect Quills of Brutality (the highest-end Legendary weapon) against the Mythic Twin Razors aren't really much of a comparison. It is akin to comparing the stats of a lv31 Mountain Teeth against a lv36 Architect Quill. As if a singular Mythic item didn't offer so much of a disparity, this effect is magnified for each Mythic Item equipped (Weapon, Helm, Armor, Ring, Amulet). What was once a slight advantage has eventually become a grossly overpowering divide of have's versus have not's.

Individually, each Mythic piece may offer a 5% advantage versus it's Elite Legendary counterpart, but in totality, wealthy players effectively get a 25% advantage when fully outfitted (assuming no Arcane's), which is more than good group play or skill can overcome in most situations.

I am just a bit disappointed at the current state, and have decided to more-or-less give up on PvP and focus on Elite Farming. I even respec'ed and dropped the Combat Medic skill (yeah, I know!). I simply feel that I cannot be competitive until I get most, if not all, Mythic items and that just eliminates one of my favorite distractions in the game. I just don't like that my hand has been forced in this way because of how Mythic gear has evolved to be so dominant and critical to success. I am further disappointed because I can be so successful soloing elite maps and completing challenging elites with terrific times in Legendary gear, but I am in a word, non-competitive in PvP.

And this is exactly what's happening to us non-mythic players, we just want to have fun, and some of the highly skilled wants some tiny chance to be a bit competitive. Is this not possible?

Thankyou

[nelson131]

Perhaps this post will have more attention at general discussions :P

[Socrates]

Many people in this post are talking that people would stop want myhtics and arcanes because they will not have any benefits in PvP.Well there is always PvE and the elite times that as far as I know they might not be not even one in leader boards without mythic equip. Also we do not wish for a boring PvP that is not at the least competitive for non mythic people

[Hiosahaf]

Many people in this post are talking that people would stop want myhtics and arcanes because they will not have any benefits in PvP.Well there is always PvE and the elite times that as far as I know they might not be not even one in leader boards without mythic equip. Also we do not wish for a boring PvP that is not at the least competitive for non mythic people
Another issue which they pointed out was that that people who have just 1 or 2 mythic will be pitted against the full mythic people.

Stat filtering is a solution. And separate dungeons and lb could be made for them. Give the people something to work for and they will happily stay loyal to that aspect. Like I said in the other thread, I don't think I've committed a grave crime that I shan't enjoy endgame PvP


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[Socrates]

I just want to point out that people won't stop buying plat to be on lb or elite times sono worries about PvP too.

[nelson131]

Lol just use the champion's league and the fun room option. Problem solved

[Warlord0520]

First off, I’m sorry if a thread has already been posted offering a similar solution. I tried my best to search through previous threads and I found several complaining about the lack of fairness in PvP, but none offering this particular solution.

As I mentioned, many threads out there talk about the unbalance in PvP. And I agree; I find the current PvP system to be very broken. Back when mythics weren’t as common as they are now and not too many people owned them, I used to love to PvP. I love the thrill and the challenge of going up against other players with different strategies and tactics, and testing mine against theirs. However, as we all know, since the increase in the circulation of mythic items, many issues have developed with regards to fairness and balance. And with the way it has been recently, I’ve stepped away from PvP.

I am not here to slander mythic items or their users, but in order to continue onto my solution, I need to acknowledge that a problem exists, so I’m just going be honest: a non-mythic user will always be at a disadvantage compared to a full mythic user. Regardless of player skill and strategy, the fact that a fully geared mythic players can take more hits and dish out more damage gives them an edge, even if their tactics are terrible.

Now, I’ve read a lot of threads out there that like to place the blame on someone, which isn’t right. Some non-mythic users may say that mythics should be prohibited in PvP, but that isn’t right considering those people probably worked hard to acquire those items and should be allowed to enjoy their benefits. Some mythic users say that “non-mythic users just need to work harder” and devote more time/effort to the game in order to gain those items, but that isn’t fair to say either. Personally, I am a level 36 capped rogue who has been playing since the level 16 cap days. I’ve always worked hard to be successful in this game and I’ve farmed my butt off, but I’ve never managed to make over 500k in my entire time playing (laugh at me if you want, but I’m serious). I don’t own any mythic gear aside from my Slag and Leprechaun pendent (plat purchases from doing free offers), and I’ve come to accept that I probably never will obtain a mythic helm/armor/weapon/necklace/pendant. My life and schedule just don’t allow for the time necessary to play enough/merch efficiently to accumulate those items, and that’s okay. But that doesn’t mean I still don’t like to enjoy PvP. I relish being able to go on and play PvP in short 10-20 minute bursts here and there throughout the day. That gives me my gaming fix as opposed to PvE, which I find rather boring.

So in order to appease everyone so that everyone can walk away satisfied, I propose filtering PvP rooms not only by level as it currently is, but also by equipment rarity. Rooms would be divided into the categories of Common, Rare, Epic, Legendary, Mythic, Arcane, and Any. Below are what the rules would be:


The current level bracket grouping system would still be intact, allowing you to fight players a couple levels higher or lower than you, but nothing too drastic.


The Any room would be similar to how current PvP is, where any rarity equipment can be used against other players. You will be able to fight players geared similarly, higher, or lower than yourself.


For all of the rooms excluding the Any room, players can wear equipment lower than or at the rarity of the room they want to join, but not beyond it. So you can fight in rooms where people are geared higher than you, but not lower than you (the sole exception is the Any room). For example, I could wear all Epic items and play in the Epic, Legendary, or Mythic room if I wanted. But players with even one Legendary item and the rest Epic would be prohibited from entering the Epic or below room.


Pet rarity will also be taken into account. For example, if I am wearing all Epic items but am using Malison (a Legendary pet), I cannot enter the Epic room. I would be forced to either swap out Malison or enter the Legendary/Mythic/Arcane/Any room.


To prevent players from abusing the system, once you enter the room, you are bound to that equipment rarity or lower. For example, if I went into the Legendary room and wanted to switch weapons, I can switch to any weapon Legendary or below, but no Mythics or Arcanes. This applies towards pets as well. So if I am in the Legendary room, I can swap out my Malison for another pet Legendary or lower, but I wouldn’t be able to call out a pet like Slag, which is mythic.

By adopting these rules, players of all levels would be able to truly thrive and enjoy PvP, regardless of what equipment or pets they may or may not have. Imagine the possibilities. Just for fun, level 36 end-game players could gear up in all Common equipment and face other players in the same level bracket wearing similar gear. Gutsy players who want a challenge can fight against players with better equipment than themselves. It wouldn’t matter if you’re rich or poor, mythic user or non-mythic user, plat-user or not, or just somewhere in-between. No one would be forced to fight against better-geared players unless they choose to. No one would be able to totally obliterate another player in PvP because the individuals that players fight against would be similarly geared (unless a player is gutsy and walks into a higher geared room, where in that case the lower geared player made a conscious decision to do that, instead of being forced against his will). Balance and fairness would be maintained. PvP would be fun for all again!

Please devs, I hope you really consider this proposal. PvP is one of the major selling points for me in any game I play, whether it’s a game on a console, computer, or phone. Once I do all there is to do in PvE, the only real reason for me to play is the thrill of going up against other real people out there. I know a ton of people feel similar to how I do. Please make this happen, devs. The community will thank you for it, big time!

S O L U T I O N: MAKE PVP GEAR(like the ones on world of warcraft)
S O L U T I O N: MAKE PVE GEAR BETTER IN PVE< PVP GEAR BETTER IN PVP, PROBLEM SOLVED

[becky_xil]

Just make a twink..

Send using my cellphone.. yes my cellphone

[MoloToha]

I saw people in legendary gear beating people with myth/arcane gear. In every game skill>gear...

And this is not a solution. Pros will just equip epic/legendary gear, enter "Epic/Legendary" room and farm noobs there only because pros are skilled, know what skills to use, etc. It's just like in Battle Dragons - you sit at low trophies and farm resources. Here you sit at low gear and farm kills.

[Hiosahaf]

Stop posting here when you already have a thread regarding this on top -.-

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