How to Kill a Rogue: a Guide!

[Alhuntrazeck]

Hey folks,

Disclaimer: This guide is strictly for those who have trouble killing rogues in 1v1s - so yes, I'm not talking to you, arcane staff users. This guide is more geared towards the half-mythic/non-mythic users. Oh, and the build I use here isn't mine, it's Drgrimmy's with some tweaking of my own.

Now that that's out of the way...

1. There's a Thunderstorm Coming!
This is one of my most favorite builds versus those snipers.

I chose this particular title because in this build, you will hit the rogue with all the elements you see in a thunderstorm! :)

Here we go...
I. The Skill Build
If you're having trouble using fire, light, shield and heal or whatever killing rogues, then this build below is for you!

Ice: The DoT is necessary. Other than that, it depends on what you like to run with.
Curse: 5/5
Shield: I prefer 4/5 without Displacing Wave.
Lightning: 1,2 and 4 upgrades.

Passives:
Might: 5/5
Agility: 5/5
Knowledge: 5/5
Critical Shot: 5/5

If you have the spare points, invest in damage passive.

However, beware: Damage buffs don't stack. So if you're running with a pet that adds damage %, it will not stack with your passive.

Why this build is useful:

Rogues with HP below 3.5k usually will not attack while they're under curse. Fighting mages with 1 attack skill makes it a breeze to wait till the curse is over, picking up packs when it is necessary.

But now you have two of your hardest hitting attack skills. Which they won't be prepared for. With light and ice bashing them, they'll have no choice but to keep running for packs - and if the rogue has HP below 3k, there is no way they will last.

II. The Gear/Stats

In this era of mythics, you will need mythics to compete - or youll find it very hard indeed. The bare minimum of stats you must have to challenge most rogues are:

3.3k HP
470 damage
1k armor

If you don't have these stats, you'll very likely be walked over by full mythic rogues.

Gear preferred is:

Expedition Rifle of Brutality
Mythic armor & helm/Tarlok's armor & helm
Silver Hoop of Brutality/Ruby Band of Brutality
Lunar Pendant/Tarlok's Heart of Brutality

You should play around with your stats to meet and/or surpass the bare minimum I have given above. If you're lacking in strength, feel free to socket blood gems; this is the wonder of our crafting system!

Now that you've got the gear, it's time to get yourself some good pets!

III. The Pets

I like pets that add lots of STR while not decreasing your damage values too much. Malison is the best choice.
But if you have decent stats, here are pets which I love using with this build:
a. Orion - the chance to panic on AA, good happiness bonus, 10% damage boost (remember, doesn't stack with damage passive!), and debuffs on passive attack make it a great all-round pet. A good alternative to Malison.
b. Ribbit - Not really recommended for this build, but if you can pop it and then charge ice-lightning in quick succession, you'll hit pretty darn hard.
c. Colton - Again, not really recommended; its damage boost is good though.
d. Ethyl - Personal favorite. It adds 15 int and str, 10% damage and 6% crit. Its AA is, however, what you'll be using a lot...read more in the next section.
e. Grimm - If you can afford it, its THE pet to use. Refer next section.

IV. The Fighting

And finally, the fight.

When you and your opponent are assembled in the spawn room, all ready to be off, and the countdown begins (3, 2, 1...GO!) your first move will be to charge forward. In the Charge of the Light Brigade, you must pop your shield and drop lightning on the rogue. If all things work as planned, your rogue will be waiting for you to arrive, with packs dropped neatly around her. Close the distance rapidly and charge ice. The combined effort of your light and ice should be enough to make the rogue run for her first pack. Your ice will have the double benefit of sloooowing the rogue down. Now is the time to unleash curse!

i. Orion: Use its stun immediately after curse is over, but you have to make sure ice and light are ready. Then, if the rogue is stunned, unleash ice and light in quick succession. This should be enough to kill a rogue; curse is essentially a double-shield. If it doesn't though (some rogues have 4k hp D: ) you have to spam ice and lightning and auto attack. Fragile method.

ii. Ethyl: A personal favorite. While the rogue is running to her packs, use Ethyl's arcane ability - this will slow the rogue down so much it'll be unable to reach faraway packs! THIS is the time to stay out of dagger range if mythic/magma daggers and spam ice and charged lightning.

iii. Ribbit: Tap ribbit before using light-ice combo. This can be immediately after popping shield in the Charge.

iv. Grimm: As soon as shield, lightning, ice and curse has been used, use Grimm's AA. It has devastating debuffs - and THAT is when you show the rogue just how hard you can hit.

Panic pets are of course great.

An important thing to watch out for are rogues who charge SP. They can cancel your curse so be careful!

V. Pro Tips
A traditional rogue starts a fight using two ways. They are:



The PACKS way and
The BOW way.

I. The PACKS way:

91435

In this method, the rogue begins by dropping her packs. What you want to do here is run forward, delaying shield as much as you can - that is, as soon as the rogue drops the packs, pop it. This makes whatever she hits you with null and void.

Then follow the guide.

II. The BOW Way:

91436

In this method, the rogue begins with a charged bow. Now, you must pop your shield as soon as the rogue gets near enough for her bow to hit you - shorter than aimed shot's distance; it'll take practice to recognize the distance changes. Then follow the guide.

It is imperative to NOT delay shield, because a rogue's charged bow stuns and those with fast fingers follow up with an aimed and nox combo - instant death.

As you can see, both methods vary in looks, so its pretty easy to know when to use what.

Always let the rogue charge her skills first. :)

Below's a video showing how to use this tactic in a fight.


http://vimeo.com/92926233?email_id=Y2xpcF90cmFuc2NvZGVkfGU2NDdiODU2 MTc1MzcxZGNjNGM1MGEwMDRiNWUwNDg0MjU2fDI3MzExMDM2fD EzOTg0MzAyMTl8NzcwMQ%3D%3D&utm_campaign=7701&utm_medium=clip-transcode_complete-finished-20120100&utm_source=email

I'm sorry about the bad quality! I have a bad screen recording software. :p

2. Outdamaging the Damage Class
The title here is very relevant, because in this build you're going to make most of the rogue's weaknesses in a special build below.

The gear and stats remain same as above, although pets differ...

I. Pets:
i. Shadowlurk: The optimum pet for this build. 20% damage and 20% crit? Puh-leez. Them roguesies don't stand a chance.
ii. Grimm: Its my second choice in this; the debuffs on AA make finishing the rogue off easy.
iii. Ribbit
iv. Colton

'Nuff said. On to the skills...

II. The Skills
The build you're going to use here is:

Fireball: 4/5, except Scorch
Ice: As in the previous guide, whatever works for you. I choose the original upgrade, Shiver and Jagged Ice.
Lightning: 3/5, except Electrical Discharge and Shock.
Shield: 4/5, except knockback.

Passives:
INT: 5/5
STR: 5/5
DEX: 5/5
Now, if you're using Shadowlurk, get crit passive. Ribbit? Damage passive.

On to the battle!

II. The Fight
As before, you need to watch the way the rogue starts. If she starts with packs, you're going to go this way:
Shadowlurk: Use shadow's AA, charge FB, while the rogue's stunned, charge lightning, tap ice, shield, follow up with fire-ice-light combos.
Grimm: Charge FB, lightning, ice, shield, follow up with combos.
For Ribbit and Colton, do the same as Shadowlurk.

If the rogue starts with bow, do the same except while starting with shield.

3. Bomb Disposal
This section shows ya how to fight those out-of-the-box rogues with Veil.

First thing I thought of when I first fought my first veil rogue (Zeus) I thought, "Okay, so curse will suck here." Reason? Veil raises a rogue's stats by 20% armor and 15% damage - curse's debuffs will not be much use here. #2, rogues with veil typically use AS, sp, veil, packs. No nox = no crippling a rogue by making it use 2 skills alone.

Finally I came up with this build:

I. The Skills:
Ice: original upgrade, Shiver and Jagged Ice.
Lightning:3/5, except Electrical Discharge and Shock.
Shield: 4/5, except knockback.
Lifegiver: 2/5, original upgrade and mana (though you don't need to get the mana upgrade for this 1v1, you WILL need it in clashes. Don't use this upgrade if you're using this build just for this 1v1, though.

Passives:
INT: 5/5
DEX: 5/5
STR: 5/5
DMG: 5/5

II. Pets
Pets you use here are Grimm, Slag, Malison, perhaps Shadowlurk and Ribbit - though I don't recommend it, especially with 2 attack skills.

Onto the battle.

III. The Battle
Good thing about this build is the rogue'll have to use both veil and packs, giving you time to begin with ice and lightning. Playing this is relatively simple; you stay out of the veil no matter what, and spam ice and lightning. One handy trick is to use Grimm's AA just before an ice-lightning combo; the veil's effects are reduced for a short time. Keep in mind Grimm's passive procs pretty frequently, and is an added bonus.
Whenever possible, try and lure the rogue outside her veil and bombard her.
Heal at 30-40%. That's it :) You either win this, or lose this. Its a bit tricky.

Key to mastering the above guides is timing, skill and practice, practice and more practice. Know your skill's range. Know your stun time. Adapt to your opponent's moves.

That brings us to the end of this lil guide.

Hope y'all can now kill those pesky snipers! With this guide, even non-mythic mages can easily challenge mythic rogues - I have killed several using this method.

[Spyce]

Useful guide if I was at endgame..
Good job though!

[Frekken]

Got totally different builds and I can kill some decent rogues
PINK STAFF USER

[Robhawk]

One of my 1on1 Rogue strats:

Charged Fireball (Rogue stunned) -> hit Coltons arcane (+15% crit) -> light -> ice -> shield -> light, ice, fire -> normally rogue is toast. :adoration:

The important thing here is: U need to deal a lot of damage and crit! So with Colton i do around 500dmg with 31% crit on its arcane. If you dont have myth weapon u shouldnt try this.

[wvhills]

Why would u want to stun a rogue that's under curse?

[Robhawk]

Why would u want to stun a rogue that's under curse?

If u reply to me: Have a deeper look, there is no curse involved! :kiwi-fruit:

[Instanthumor]

This build is OP. My non-mythic, Lv. 29 mage with Lv. 26 gear just beat a full mythic, Lv. 31 rogue at 1v1. Impressive.

But I use Lifegiver as a fifth skill, and at beginning of 1v1, charge/activate shield, switch shield and Lifegiver, and then start battle. That gives you an extra boost.

[Alhuntrazeck]

Why would u want to stun a rogue that's under curse?
It's optional. But its always nice to have a failsafe in case you're fighting a rogue who knows how to fight curse:)

This build is OP. My non-mythic, Lv. 29 mage with Lv. 26 gear just beat a full mythic, Lv. 31 rogue at 1v1. Impressive.

But I use Lifegiver as a fifth skill, and at beginning of 1v1, charge/activate shield, switch shield and Lifegiver, and then start battle. That gives you an extra boost.

Nice one! Didn't think of this.

[wvhills]

If u reply to me: Have a deeper look, there is no curse involved! :kiwi-fruit:

it was in response to the OP. I would think you would want a rogue under curse to attack you so they can damage/kill themselves. It seems odd to cast curse then stun the rogue as you are losing seconds they could be attacking you. I don't play mage much and am trying to understand this tactic.

[Robhawk]

it was in response to the OP. I would think you would want a rogue under curse to attack you so they can damage/kill themselves. It seems odd to cast curse then stun the rogue as you are losing seconds they could be attacking you. I don't play mage much and am trying to understand this tactic.

U r right... it makes no sense tu stun a rogue and curse her before the stun.

BUT: Charged Fireball (Rogue stunned) hit Colton arcane (+15% crit) -> light -> ice -> Rogue`s movin again... If you can hear a charge or u r sure rogue just attacks hit Curse -> dead. The good rogues wont die, the avarage ones for sure. ;)

[Alfai]

Hmm.slag seems able to void most of the tactics above ;p

Nevertheless a great guide.

[Saribeau]

pfft mages can only beat rogues in their dreams !! rogues rule :) !!

u have not met or fought a good mage. ever.

[falmear]

In my opinion if you want to kill rogues fast the best combo is fire,ice,light,shield. The thing I don't like about curse is it works counter to stun and panic. And has a very long cool down. And if you think about the entire dynamic of the fight, the longer it goes to more vulnerable the mage is. So if you are holding off using curse until stun is over from a damage perspective, you maybe doing less damage. Though I have tested curse 1v1 against a rogue and it is effective. I just feel fire,ice,light is more effective. Because it puts the rogue entirely on the defensive which is a position they are not used to. And they will immediately go for their packs. The key is to slow or stop the rogue getting to their packs. With fire,light,ice you have range so you don't need to get close to the rogue so if they use pierce against you, it takes them away from their packs. Which makes stuns or slow down more effective. For me 1v1 is like chess, both sides have their opening moves. As a mage you have to decide do you want to charge shield or charge fireball. Rogue's usual first move is dropping their health packs. Usually the safest course of action is to go in with charged shield. Which is followed by charged fireball to stun them, and then lightning, followed by ice. Then move in with your pet to try to stun them with panic. If panic works its pretty much game over. If panic doesn't work then continue to fireball/ice but I go for charged lightning and if I get lucky with a crit its pretty much game over. However it depends on how many packs they get to. If they get to all 3 packs its very hard to kill a rogue. Because if they pick up all 3 packs it heals them 100%. So its like you have to kill them twice to kill them once.

I think curse is a better tool in a 5v5 fight. Because it has an AOE is 6m. So its better for CTF in my opinion. In TDM its kind of questionable how effective it is. I know some rogues like to use charged pierce to get away from me in TDM. But this is where ice comes in handy because once they pierce I have the range with ice. And once it hits them they aren't moving very fast and they are usually not near their health packs. But ultimately it comes down to playing style and I think if it works for you then use it. I have never been that good with curse so I rely on putting out as much damage as I can.

[Saribeau]

Curse is cool, but i met a twink mage yesterday with curse light heal and shield but was str build. 70 less dmg with same gear and better pet as well. i LOST. his stats were 3100 hp 120 dmg (with colton) mine 2200 hp 192 dmg (1/2 gemmed btw). both had curse at that moment but because of this match i respecced. i prefer all out force. oh yeah we were both 23 :tougue:

[Desperoto]

A rogue can get out of the curse easily, with charging his sp. Then he will throw down his packs and wait till the mage will come to him.. Without the fireball stun it's game over for the smurf

[drgrimmy]

Why would u want to stun a rogue that's under curse?

I agree, but if I have a pet with stun or panic that I want to incorporate into this build I wait until curse is over/neutralized and then I stun/panic them. This can add little but more time to finish them off.

So my basic attack rotation with a panic pet: charged shield, rush rogue while charging curse, release curse when next to rogue, then unleash hell (light, frost, regular attacks, light frost, regular attacks, etc.) until curse runs out, then slag/Clyde panic, followed by more light, frost and regular attacks.

[Instanthumor]

A rogue can get out of the curse easily, with charging his sp. Then he will throw down his packs and wait till the mage will come to him.. Without the fireball stun it's game over for the smurf

Not necessarily...

[Alfai]

A rogue can get out of the curse easily, with charging his sp. Then he will throw down his packs and wait till the mage will come to him.. Without the fireball stun it's game over for the smurf

Not quite.the best offense is to cancel their move so you got the edge of one step ahead

[zwapper]

pfft mages can only beat rogues in their dreams !! rogues rule :) !!

oh really!!! i dare you to do some 1v1 on my twink toon (zwapper) and let see if you can back up your post in real fight!!!!!!

[will0]

trying few tactics... in group .. curse is more useful, 1v1 or 1v2 usually FB / Light / Ice does the trick most time.

I am wondering if is worth to charge curse... it takes time by the time you charge in a battle u already dead .. :)

[suckyiknow]

Amazing guide, Al :)

Now you just need to work for a warrior - killing build, you naughty smurf <3

[Nesox]

trying few tactics... in group .. curse is more useful, 1v1 or 1v2 usually FB / Light / Ice does the trick most time.

I am wondering if is worth to charge curse... it takes time by the time you charge in a battle u already dead .. :)

I usually charge as most of the time. I either charge right after a fireball stun or right after I cast Shield. This will minimize damage taken while casting.

[Vystirch]

I find reading threads on how a certain class kills us (rogues) is more effective then me reading about how I would as a rouges kill other classes. Because you guys normally talk about your weaknesses quite loudly here where in rogue forums we guess about them :)

-Vys

[zwapper]

i find reading threads on how a certain class kills us (rogues) is more effective then me reading about how i would as a rouges kill other classes. Because you guys normally talk about your weaknesses quite loudly here where in rogue forums we guess about them :)

-vys

agree!!!!

[suckyiknow]

Sorry but I'm gonna bump this one up. Too many mages are weak this expansion and tthis.build should see them owning those snipers!

[Alhuntrazeck]

Update: Added a video! Once you get past the ew graphics you can see how I used this build to kill one of the best (imo) mage killers there are in endgame PvP.

P.S: I admit much of it was luck, LOL!

(And sorry for the bump :o)

[Alhuntrazeck]

Ok, just did a huge renovation of the guide with 2 more builds!

Hope you guys enjoy :)

#SmurfsFTW2014

[Serancha]

Just gotta say, the title of this thread made my day. So funny. I think it was the exclamation point ;)

[Alhuntrazeck]

Just gotta say, the title of this thread made my day. So funny. I think it was the exclamation point ;)
Die. -_-

[Hoardseeker]

Great!

[Dex Scene]

Sorry but Orion don't have panic ability.

—AshDex

[grumpy]

Sorry but Orion don't have panic ability.

—AshDex

Actually, his arcane ability does cause panic with a moderate chance. It is not listed in the description but he definitely does. It works on any mob including bosses. The chance to panic is less than Slag's but still often enough to notice.

[Attack Dog]

How to kill a sorcerer with rouge in 3 easy steps
1) throw packs and tank
2) wait for shield to go down
3) charged aim with your combo from your build

[Dex Scene]

Actually, his arcane ability does cause panic with a moderate chance. It is not listed in the description but he definitely does. It works on any mob including bosses. The chance to panic is less than Slag's but still often enough to notice.

Oh thanks for the info!
Do the panic works in Pvp aswel? I never noticed it working though and hence I opted for Clyde!

—AshDex

[grumpy]

Oh thanks for the info!
Do the panic works in Pvp aswel? I never noticed it working though and hence I opted for Clyde!

—AshDex
It should work in PvP but I havent tested it myself personally as I am a PvE player. Clyde is good too :)

[Serancha]

Die. -_-

*dies*

[Robhawk]

Hey Alhun,

nice update there!

A thing you could consider is "clock" instead of f.e. ice because packs get far away that way. ;)

I prefer a build where it doesnt matter what the rogue wants to do, either bow or packs -> i dont care! ;)

Fire, ligh, clock, shield. Pet u want to use is Grimm or Shadowlurk... ( Samael would be number 1 no question)

Start the fight with charged fireball(with DoT upgrade) & Grimm`s AA -> rogue stunned and debuffed -> lightning -> autoattack (i prefer a magma staff because of much better DPS then the rifle) -> charged shield -> charged clock(with DoT upgrade!) -> rogue wont get to packs -> autoattack -> light -> fire -> TY. When rogue is skilled and has maxed gear it might not work *lol* I killed some arcane ring rogues with that build but these were not to skilled to be honest. ;)


Im sure this tactic will work 100% for all rogues when you have gear like:

Kershal staff + myth helm + myth armor + arcane ring + lunar + Singe/Samael. I have seen a mage with 814dmg and more than 1000DPS !!! Give me that gear and i kill any rogue,i guess. ;)

edit: When you have the gear mentioned above you could also do it that way and its 100% deadly!

Fire, Light, Ice, Clock

Start the fight with charged Fireball (rogue stunned) -> light -> ice -> auto attack -> hit Samael`s AA (rogue paniced) -> auto attack -> drop charged clock on her = gg !!! You win the fight when you get the fireball stun. This could even work for warriors because the damageoutput while opponent is not able to move is insane!

The good thing for not using curse is you dont need to take care of veil/curse cancel! A rogue cant cancel Fire/light/ice and clock! :D

edit2: Id love to play vs Bless and Ctf with that gear, would be very funny! If i get the fireball stun its GG!!! :angel:

[Alhuntrazeck]

Hey Alhun,

nice update there!

A thing you could consider is "clock" instead of f.e. ice because packs get far away that way. ;)

I prefer a build where it doesnt matter what the rogue wants to do, either bow or packs -> i dont care! ;)

Fire, ligh, clock, shield. Pet u want to use is Grimm or Shadowlurk... ( Samael would be number 1 no question)

Start the fight with charged fireball & Grimm`s AA -> rogue stunned and debuffed -> lightning -> autoattack (i prefer a magma staff because of much better DPS then the rifle) -> charged shield -> charged clock -> rogue wont get to packs -> autoattack -> light -> fire -> TY. When rogue is skilled and has maxed gear it might not work *lol* I killed some arcane ring rogues with that build but these were not to skilled to be honest. ;)


Im sure this tactic will work 100% for all rogues when you have gear like:

Kershal staff + myth helm + myth armor + arcane ring + lunar + Singe/Samael. I have seen a mage with 814dmg and more than 1000DPS !!! Give me that gear and i kill any rogue,i guess. ;)

Good suggestion,

Reason I don't use clock is because the damage is pretty much negligible to most rogues - and is easily avoidable by charging shadow piercer. Rogues starting with charged bow especially have this option, if they survive your attacks its GG.

Then again, whatever works!

[Robhawk]

if they survive your attacks its GG.

With maxed gear no rogue gonna survive this damageoutput imho and when Samael`s AA panic hits the rogue wont be able to cancel clock... Then rogue has to deal with Fireball DoT,Ice Dot and clock DoT + autoattacks with 1000DPS -> NO WAY TO GET AWAY FROM THIS! ;)

Id love to play with Kershal, arcane ring and Samael!

1x charged Fireball = 1000dmg
2x light = 2800dmg (7000k on critical)
1x ice = 1300dmg
2 x autoattack = 2000dmg
1x clock = 1300dmg

Total of 8400dmg dealed without a crit!!! and without the Dot of Fire/Ice and Clock !!!

So add the DoT and 1 critical shoot we speak of something around 13000dmg dealed while the rogue didnt move! There is no way any rogue will survive this even a maxed out arcaner ring rogue with 60% dodge and good armor value will die!
Also rogues strategy doenst matter... you just have to get that opening fireball stun to win the fight... dont care about opponents tactics, just get the stun and kill!

Have a look how this works with crap gear (legendary weapon, legendary ring, no archon! and Shadowlurk was bugged at that time!!!) vs a without a doubt very skilled, maxed out rogue! :eagerness:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8SHkrgPHrA

Who`s gonna gift me a kershal, arcane ring and Samael? :eagerness:

[Alhuntrazeck]

With maxed gear no rogue gonna survive this damageoutput imho and when Samael`s AA panic hits the rogue wont be able to cancel clock... Then rogue has to deal with Fireball DoT,Ice Dot and clock DoT + autoattacks with 1000DPS -> NO WAY TO GET AWAY FROM THIS! ;)

Id love to play with Kershal, arcane ring and Samael!

1x charged Fireball = 1000dmg
2x light = 2800dmg (7000k on critical)
1x ice = 1300dmg
2 x autoattack = 2000dmg
1x clock = 1300dmg

Total of 8400dmg dealed without a crit!!! and without the Dot of Fire/Ice and Clock !!!

So add the DoT and 1 critical shoot we speak of something around 13000dmg dealed while the rogue didnt move! There is no way any rogue will survive this even a maxed out arcaner ring rogue with 60% dodge and good armor value will die!
Also rogues strategy doenst matter... you just have to get that opening fireball stun to win the fight... dont care about opponents tactics, just get the stun and kill!

Have a look how this works with crap gear (legendary weapon, legendary ring, no archon! and Shadowlurk was bugged at that time!!!) vs a without a doubt very skilled, maxed out rogue! :eagerness:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8SHkrgPHrA

Who`s gonna gift me a kershal, arcane ring and Samael? :eagerness:

You aren't factoring armor in. I've played around with an arcane staff, and the DPS says to be 700 (for me at that time) but the real damage output was nearer to 400-450.

Still a plausible build!

And gratz vs Ctf! That was a good one.

[Bangbam]

hey i play lvl 26 pvp
i like your
ice
light and curse build :)
plus slag is great
this really helped me cause i used fireball ice and light before and usually died alot

[Zeus]

How to kill a sorcerer with rouge in 3 easy steps
1) throw packs and tank
2) wait for shield to go down
3) charged aim with your combo from your build

What level is this for? At end game, that strategy will get you destroyed by even mediocre mages.

[Zeus]

Alhunt,

You're going to hate me for this but I'll post the counter to these builds. On the bright side, now that you know the counters...perhaps y'all can figure out new strategies.

How to kill stunlock sorcerer:
Typically, at this cap, these sorcerers have 3 damage skills and one shield. Thus, they're usually pretty difficult! Here's what I like to use to kill these smurfs:
• Magma Doublet of Brutality
• Mythic Helm
• Exoedition Bow of Brutality
• Mythic Ring/Arcane Ring
• Wild Amulet of Potency
• Malison, Gyrm, Samael

Now, you'll notice that this gear set up is quite different from what you normally see versus a sorcerer. Why? Well, you don't really need all that much damage versus a sorcerer to kill them. The problem is surviving, right? So get gear that's suitable to surviving without dropping your damage by insane amounts. This gear should serve just fine. Who said full mythics are a requirement? This is both cheap and affordable.

Now, Gyrm is a great great per versus mages. It completely cripples their already low crit so their nukes are about halved in terms of damage as long as you know how to use the AA correctly. I prefer to stun with bow, let the little but potent frog get within arcane ability range. When using this pet, never forget to charge razor shield at the start - followed by charged bow. If done properly, you should have just enough time to complete both sequences.

Malison best works with razor shield (20% dodge upgrade, extended time, and the movement impairment immunity upgrade). The best time to activate this is in the beginning, just before you bow stun. This, combined with razor shield should help prevent any stunlocks from occurring. Lastly, always always always make sure to charge razor shield.

Samael is the easiest to use of the three and by far the most convenient. For this, charge razor shield, followed by bow stun. When the bow stun wears off, activate Samael's AA.

Build:
• 5/5 Aimed Shot
• 2/5 Noxious Bolt (Last upgrade only) - swap Nox with razor shield when fighting sorcerers
• 5/5 Health Packs
• 4/5 Razor Shield (no bleed upgrade)
• 2/5 Shadow Piercer (Heal upgrade)
• 5/5 Int, Str, Dex
• 5/5 Crit
• 2/5 Armor

Now, with this build, there is a variety of ways to utilize it. However, the fundamental concept is that one must always start with charged razor shield. Following this, you can choose to pack or bow stun, depending on how hard the sorcerer hits. From there, use razor shield as a way to get to your packs with relative ease all the while firing aimed shots. Please note, only use piercer when you can afford to. It is not smart to use it if it puts you in a position that will put you far away from your packs.

If I plan to pierce away from my packs, I usually do charged aim and then pierce. This usually is towards the end where the sorcerer is weakened to the point where this will be the finishing combo.

I also thoroughly enjoy veil, which I have written a thread on for how to use. If that strategy appeals to players more, use that strategy.

[Madnex]

^This needs a new topic.

Also, always PvP-wise your build has two things I would correct.

First of all, having 4/5 in Razor Shield is a waste of 1 skill point. I'm glad you finally shushed and accepted razor but the 20% dodge and the movement-impairing immunity upgrades offer nothing extra if combined - you can't be stunned in the first place and you can't dodge the damage or the skill. So you can move that point to 3/5 armor passive.

Secondly, your Nox would be ineffective for non-ring rogue since the poison damage has quite an impact on rogue vs rogue fights. For normal mythic rogues, I'd suggest moving those two points from armor passive to nox (extra three seconds and extra damage per second).

Lastly, what's your critical rate? You could slightly increase your armor with critical rate's excess after, say 45 crit plateau (I think you're around 47 or something)?

[Zeus]

^This needs a new topic.

Also, always PvP-wise your build has two things I would correct.

First of all, having 4/5 in Razor Shield is a waste of 1 skill point. I'm glad you finally shushed and accepted razor but the 20% dodge and the movement-impairing immunity upgrades offer nothing extra if combined - you can't be stunned in the first place and you can't dodge the damage or the skill. So you can move that point to 3/5 armor passive.

Secondly, your Nox would be ineffective for non-ring rogue since the poison damage has quite an impact on rogue vs rogue fights. For normal mythic rogues, I'd suggest moving those two points from armor passive to nox (extra three seconds and extra damage per second).

Lastly, what's your critical rate? You could slightly increase your armor with critical rate's excess after, say 45 crit plateau (I think you're around 47 or something)?

The dodge upgrade is for dodging the auto attack of sorcerers. Since a sorcerer only has so many skills with longer cool downs than a rogue does, they use auto attack to compensate. The dodge helps a lot of these attacks miss which is important.

Your second point, you would know this better than I would. I find the poison damage useless and ineffective in PvP. These points can be better used elsewhere.

My critical rate with that set up is ~40%. This, I've found, is plenty versus a Mage. Of course, versus a rogue I would recommend higher but this will do the job against most rogues. If I wear max damage gear, I can get to around 46.6% critical rate.

[Madnex]

Nab. Your build is better suited for arcane rogues. I've had my fair share of matches as plain mythic rogue and yes, nox matters. Not as much as the bugged aimeds but still. And also the stackable DoT destroys mages - sometimes I swap pierce for it as it offers more mobility to grab the packs.

[Zeus]

Nab. Your build is better suited for arcane rogues. I've had my fair share of matches as plain mythic rogue and yes, nox matters. Not as much as the bugged aimeds but still. And also the stackable DoT destroys mages - sometimes I swap pierce for it as it offers more mobility to grab the packs.

Make a thread on it! I'll contribute my methods if one is fully geared and you can contribute your methods if one is not as fortunate with the gears.

[Robhawk]

You're going to hate me for this but I'll post the counter to these builds. On the bright side, now that you know the counters...perhaps y'all can figure out new strategies.


What do you do vs 4 attack build (Fire, light, ice, clock) like in my vid vs ctf? I still guess when Fireball hits its gg. When Fireball stun misses its gg the other way around... ;)

[Instanthumor]

I wanna write up a new "How to kill a rogue" guide :p

[Zeus]

What do you do vs 4 attack build (Fire, light, ice, clock) like in my vid vs ctf? I still guess when Fireball hits its gg. When Fireball stun misses its gg the other way around... ;)

I will one hit you. :)

No shield is gg.

[Robhawk]

I will one hit you. :)

No shield is gg.

I say equaly geared and the fireball stun hits with following Samael AA = perhaps you are dead before you hit once! :D ;)

[Instanthumor]

I say equaly geared and the fireball stun hits with following Samael AA = perhaps you are dead before you hit once! :D ;)

That will work only once.

[Robhawk]

That will work only once.

Well perhaps... but its easy to use different tactics and when the rogues thinks the 4 attack skills hit again you just use early shield with Fire and light and a very late curse... or something different with Shield, CLock, Fire, Light...

[Linkincena]

Nice Necro ^^

[Zeus]

I say equaly geared and the fireball stun hits with following Samael AA = perhaps you are dead before you hit once! :D ;)

Samael rarely stuns rogues, trust me on this.

[Kreasadriii]

I wanna write up a new "How to kill a rogue" guide :p

Can't wait to give comments :D

[Robhawk]

Samael rarely stuns rogues, trust me on this.

Really? Thats bad news ;)

[Devarogue]

Uhmm, question. DO i have to charge all skills when attacking? Like fireball need charge to stun, lightning need to charge for crit/stun. Idk some mage stuffs :)

[Robhawk]

Uhmm, question. DO i have to charge all skills when attacking? Like fireball need charge to stun, lightning need to charge for crit/stun. Idk some mage stuffs :)

It all depends on the updates you chose for your skills... Just read the description and you no if its worth to charge or not. A Fireball with stun-upgrade should be charged when you need the stun.

[Alhuntrazeck]

Uhmm, question. DO i have to charge all skills when attacking? Like fireball need charge to stun, lightning need to charge for crit/stun. Idk some mage stuffs :)

Charging mage skills are always better, but sometimes a tapped lightning is better than charged because of the additional timing taken to charge it. Playing a mage involves lots of adapting.

P.S: Charged lightning stuns. The 250% chance to crit happens even if you tap the skill.

[Alhuntrazeck]

Alhunt,

You're going to hate me for this but I'll post the counter to these builds. On the bright side, now that you know the counters...perhaps y'all can figure out new strategies.

How to kill stunlock sorcerer:
Typically, at this cap, these sorcerers have 3 damage skills and one shield. Thus, they're usually pretty difficult! Here's what I like to use to kill these smurfs:
• Magma Doublet of Brutality
• Mythic Helm
• Exoedition Bow of Brutality
• Mythic Ring/Arcane Ring
• Wild Amulet of Potency
• Malison, Gyrm, Samael

Now, you'll notice that this gear set up is quite different from what you normally see versus a sorcerer. Why? Well, you don't really need all that much damage versus a sorcerer to kill them. The problem is surviving, right? So get gear that's suitable to surviving without dropping your damage by insane amounts. This gear should serve just fine. Who said full mythics are a requirement? This is both cheap and affordable.

Now, Gyrm is a great great per versus mages. It completely cripples their already low crit so their nukes are about halved in terms of damage as long as you know how to use the AA correctly. I prefer to stun with bow, let the little but potent frog get within arcane ability range. When using this pet, never forget to charge razor shield at the start - followed by charged bow. If done properly, you should have just enough time to complete both sequences.

Malison best works with razor shield (20% dodge upgrade, extended time, and the movement impairment immunity upgrade). The best time to activate this is in the beginning, just before you bow stun. This, combined with razor shield should help prevent any stunlocks from occurring. Lastly, always always always make sure to charge razor shield.

Samael is the easiest to use of the three and by far the most convenient. For this, charge razor shield, followed by bow stun. When the bow stun wears off, activate Samael's AA.

Build:
• 5/5 Aimed Shot
• 2/5 Noxious Bolt (Last upgrade only) - swap Nox with razor shield when fighting sorcerers
• 5/5 Health Packs
• 4/5 Razor Shield (no bleed upgrade)
• 2/5 Shadow Piercer (Heal upgrade)
• 5/5 Int, Str, Dex
• 5/5 Crit
• 2/5 Armor

Now, with this build, there is a variety of ways to utilize it. However, the fundamental concept is that one must always start with charged razor shield. Following this, you can choose to pack or bow stun, depending on how hard the sorcerer hits. From there, use razor shield as a way to get to your packs with relative ease all the while firing aimed shots. Please note, only use piercer when you can afford to. It is not smart to use it if it puts you in a position that will put you far away from your packs.

If I plan to pierce away from my packs, I usually do charged aim and then pierce. This usually is towards the end where the sorcerer is weakened to the point where this will be the finishing combo.

I also thoroughly enjoy veil, which I have written a thread on for how to use. If that strategy appeals to players more, use that strategy.

It all sounds good on paper, however razor rogues are, imo, paper. The low damage of the skill and the proximity requirement removes its usability as a damage skill. Most mages will adapt and stay out of your razor range so you're basically stuck with 2 attack skills which shouldn't be enough to take down any mage with your equal (or higher) gear.

Oh and theoretically, razor damage should reflect heavily due to curse.