So, you say game is balanced?

[chorba69]

49097

I took those pics from random players. They all with full myth, even arcane. Maybe there are people with better stats but nvm.

Do you say classes are balanced for pvp?
Yeah mage has highest damage but, 1k armor? C'moon.
Next, rogues? Lets say lowest damage on paper, but with high critical chance and damage from Aimed Shot when critted.. Also, almost 350armor more than mage.
And now, warriors.. lol. (sry had to say lol).. 6500hp, 530dmg and 1800armor? C'MOOON.
Okay you can say rogues and warriors have 1300 mana but, if you're squishy, how can you survive attacks if you have to do LOTS of damage to kill something? Yeah, there are tactics to kill this and kill that but, lets be honest... Warriors kinda win this season, by alot!

And no, this is not another "buff this, nerf that" thread, just, do you think it's balanced or not?

[Instanthumor]

Those are three (biased) random individuals, and stats aren't everything.

[phillyr]

They're nit everything...but they're a lot also. I can pound on a fully geared warrior till my nana runs out, any decent tank can jug and heal his way through a barrage of lightning and ice attacks. Then a few whacks with a glaive or maul and I'm done for. If rogue can withstand my attacks till shield wears off, it's one shot one kill. I understand that mage(for the most part) has to play a teamwork role but the"upgrade" gems have all but tipped the balance away from mages. Players do more damage to us yet our armor is still insufficient.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[DagnyTaggart]

I agree completely. As far as I can tell those are all end game capped players. And yes... Pvping against any warrior with end game gear and either of the top two weapons is ridiculous.

Also how does that rogue have so much DPs... I've got everything except myth daggers and I'm not even close.

[chorba69]

Yeah true, stats arent everything. You need tactics, learn how your opponent plays etc but, it aint fun to dps dps dps dps warrior till you run out of mana while he just heals and taps 2 buttons. True, you need skill but make it for everyone same hard..
@dagny, idk how but i can confirm there are no buffs included. Base stats everywhere

[Ebezaanec]

Well, you do have to realize that Arcane/Mythic users are not common. Its not like these are common stats that EVERYONE can achieve. The minority of players who have these stats do not really unbalance PVP for the most part.

[becky_xil]

Hope u face 8k hp 6xx dmg 4xx dps 17xx armor soon.. haha.. lets twink guy

Send using my cellphone.. yes my cellphone

[falmear]

Without shield and 3.8k HP (arcane staff + samael), rogues can basically instakill me. Call it being combo'd or whatever. It happens in less then a second. So its virtually getting one shotted. While I haven't done any testing I am wondering if some of the time I am being one shotted by rogues with mythic daggers. At end game people say its about tactics and whatever. But its mostly about gear. I have arcane staff and pet and you can see my kills and deaths. It doesn't take much skill to amount kills when you have the best stuff. If you don't have the best gear you will lose its as simple as that. Fact of the matter is rogues can instakill you when your shield is down. And you have to accept this fact and take the necessary measures to avoid it. Fighting against warriors is long, tedious and gets boring. Unfortunately the way I deal with warriors is I just ignore them. Its easier to just kill rogues and mages. Yeah they can hit hard but not as hard as mages or rogues. If you play CTF then you are going to go after rogues and mages first anyways. In TDM, I go after rogues and mages first, and then go after the warrior assuming everyone else in my team survived. If warrior is not dead by the time the opponents return then I just keep killing everyone but the warrior. Also I like to keep the fighting next to trulle so he pounds on the warriors for me when I stun them with a fireball. Its rather tedious when you have like 1 warrior and the other team has like 2-3 warriors. The amount of armor, health, and healing is just so much that its very hard to kill them. Anyways it is what it is and its not ever going to change. Accept it and move on or join the enemy and become a rogue or warrior.

One last point, is the stats you show for a rogue is way too low in health. Most rogues that PvP is around 3.7-3.8k. I don't know what pet or ring they are using. Most likely archon ring. I have some screen shots of various players I can say the health is on the low side.

[Temarichan]

The classes can't be even in all form. Because they specialize in one ability (i.e. Mages=int Rogues=Dex Warrior=str), they sacrifice one other type of stat. That's what makes each class unique in their way. If they were completely even, there wouldn't be any point having different classes.

[Crowsfoot]

I agree completely. As far as I can tell those are all end game capped players. And yes... Pvping against any warrior with end game gear and either of the top two weapons is ridiculous.

Also how does that rogue have so much DPs... I've got everything except myth daggers and I'm not even close.

Hawk (Ipredator) a rogue wins 1v1 against warriors everytime I've watched (including in my fights). Just because you can't beat a warrior doesn't mean its impossible.

[chorba69]

Yeah that's one rogue. Okay there are even mages that kill warriors, or even rogues. But, how "pro" they have to be to kill a warrior? I mean, you have to be concentrated 101% percent on the duel, while warrior can smoke a cig, drink a coffee and cast HoR to heal itself, use attack skills few times, and everything is dead. Why? Because they have 2k armor, 500dmg and 6.5k health. That just isnt fair.
If STG could balance all the classes so all of them have to have 50/50 chances to win a duel, and put equal effort in battle, it would be great.
Just because it's not balanced, lots of people skip pvp and just do pve. I know lots of them saying "i'll skip pvp for this season". Doing that over and over. ž
Sad but true.

[Ebezaanec]

Yeah that's one rogue. Okay there are even mages that kill warriors, or even rogues. But, how "pro" they have to be to kill a warrior? I mean, you have to be concentrated 101% percent on the duel, while warrior can smoke a cig, drink a coffee and cast HoR to heal itself, use attack skills few times, and everything is dead. Why? Because they have 2k armor, 500dmg and 6.5k health. That just isnt fair.
If STG could balance all the classes so all of them have to have 50/50 chances to win a duel, and put equal effort in battle, it would be great.
Just because it's not balanced, lots of people skip pvp and just do pve. I know lots of them saying "i'll skip pvp for this season". Doing that over and over. ž
Sad but true.

Pls let me know when more than half of the warrior population has even close to 500 dmg and 6.5k hp this expansion.. Then we will talk. :)

[chorba69]

Pls let me know when more than half of the warrior population has even close to 500 dmg and 6.5k hp this expansion.. Then we will talk. :)

Well thats true but, how many mages are over 600dmg? Or rogues with crazy stats? There are not many of them either. I know warriors will "defend" warrior class, but yeah. And, with legendary gear, classes might be more balanced but still not like it should. But yeah, people are going for mythics, not to stay legendary forever. And when it comes to mythics and arcanes, then it's a different story.

[Sokpuppet]

Yeah that's one rogue. Okay there are even mages that kill warriors, or even rogues. But, how "pro" they have to be to kill a warrior? I mean, you have to be concentrated 101% percent on the duel, while warrior can smoke a cig, drink a coffee and cast HoR to heal itself, use attack skills few times, and everything is dead. Why? Because they have 2k armor, 500dmg and 6.5k health. That just isnt fair.
If STG could balance all the classes so all of them have to have 50/50 chances to win a duel, and put equal effort in battle, it would be great.
Just because it's not balanced, lots of people skip pvp and just do pve. I know lots of them saying "i'll skip pvp for this season". Doing that over and over. ž
Sad but true.

Warriors like that are a huge minority... You're talking about warriors running around with an arcane maul or a glaive, and there aren't as many as you seem to think...

[chorba69]

Warriors like that are a huge minority... You're talking about warriors running around with an arcane maul or a glaive, and there aren't as many as you seem to think...

Thats what I have said right now. There are not many warriors with maul. But, there are not so many mages with arcane staff, right?

[Ebezaanec]

Thats what I have said right now. There are not many warriors with maul. But, there are not so many mages with arcane staff, right?

So whats your point? Are you saying that the minority of players who can afford crazy stats will forever change and alter the very landscape of PVP? Or are you saying that players with crazy stats are difficult to kill? (And yes, they are)

[chorba69]

Well I did not want to start this thread and discuss about gear and how they get it etc.
Just wanted to discuss and see what people think about highest stats they can reach for current level cap. This is "General Discussion" anyways.
But yes, its true, players with crazy stats are difficult to kill.
I was just comparing all 3 classes and wanted to hear people's opinions about that because after I saw the stats, it's obvious that it's not so balanced.

[Desperoto]

They prolly have to give armor that adds 5.0 damage for pinks

[Roberto077]

bwahaha

[inkredible]

49097

I took those pics from random players. They all with full myth, even arcane. Maybe there are people with better stats but nvm.

Do you say classes are balanced for pvp?
Yeah mage has highest damage but, 1k armor? C'moon.
Next, rogues? Lets say lowest damage on paper, but with high critical chance and damage from Aimed Shot when critted.. Also, almost 350armor more than mage.
And now, warriors.. lol. (sry had to say lol).. 6500hp, 530dmg and 1800armor? C'MOOON.
Okay you can say rogues and warriors have 1300 mana but, if you're squishy, how can you survive attacks if you have to do LOTS of damage to kill something? Yeah, there are tactics to kill this and kill that but, lets be honest... Warriors kinda win this season, by alot!

And no, this is not another "buff this, nerf that" thread, just, do you think it's balanced or not?

Im sorry.. but are you unintelligent or you just really know nothing about classes?
First of all.. for beginners.

you took a screen shot of a warrior whos maxed out.. all super gem

and you took all other mages and rogues who doesnt even have full super gem. how? i know what it looks like

rogues not even full super gem can hit 3800 health.. 400 dmg.

SECOND of all:
WARRIORS should have ABOUT double the HP of mages and rogues.. WHY???
because mages and rogues both could hit 2k.. or close to half our health.. if you lower our health what happens??
Oh we get KOED in one combo by rogues... and thats why we also need that armor.. to protect ourselves from 2k- 3k Critical hits.
if we didnt have 1800 armor? rogues and mages will damage 3k accurately on us ...

531 damage = is damages of normal attack.. yes warriors are higher.. but understand the overall damage of both mages and rogues
are 3x MORE than warriors damage..

please before you post any of this. know what youre talking about

remember this.. what it looks like.. doesnt describe what it is

ever heard the saying
DONT JUDGE THE BOOK BY ITS COVER?
thats what youre doing here :)

[Haligali]

because mages and rogues both could hit 2k..

I can crit with lightning 2k on rogues, no way that i can do the same on a warrior.

[inkredible]

One last point, is the stats you show for a rogue is way too low in health. Most rogues that PvP is around 3.7-3.8k. I don't know what pet or ring they are using. Most likely archon ring. I have some screen shots of various players I can say the health is on the low side.

^ MY POINT


The classes can't be even in all form. Because they specialize in one ability (i.e. Mages=int Rogues=Dex Warrior=str), they sacrifice one other type of stat. That's what makes each class unique in their way. If they were completely even, there wouldn't be any point having different classes.


Well I did not want to start this thread and discuss about gear and how they get it etc.
Just wanted to discuss and see what people think about highest stats they can reach for current level cap. This is "General Discussion" anyways.
But yes, its true, players with crazy stats are difficult to kill.
I was just comparing all 3 classes and wanted to hear people's opinions about that because after I saw the stats, it's obvious that it's not so balanced.

you wanted to hear peoples opinion you got it. .. wait what are you saying thats not balanced? the stats ?
well.. obvs the stats between classes arent the same.. just like what they have mentioned
each classes are meant for one thing and another.. ofcourse youre gonna see huge differences in stats. or should i say "not balanced" stats

did you want to see everyone having 500 dmg.. 1800 armor.. 6k health?
okay fine..
delete all your rogues and mages and be warriors.. lets see how fun is that gonna be in pvp.

endless.. theres diff classes for reasons.

[inkredible]

I can crit with lightning 2k on rogues, no way that i can do the same on a warrior.

lol hali out of that whole post thats what u noticed..I was just stating my POINT ..
mages can hit 2k on rogues sure.. maybe not warrior true.. but you mages stil hit harder than we do

[chorba69]

Im sorry.. but are you unintelligent or you just really know nothing about classes?
First of all.. for beginners.

you took a screen shot of a warrior whos maxed out.. all super gem

and you took all other mages and rogues who doesnt even have full super gem. how? i know what it looks like

rogues not even full super gem can hit 3800 health.. 400 dmg.

SECOND of all:
WARRIORS should have ABOUT double the HP of mages and rogues.. WHY???
because mages and rogues both could hit 2k.. or close to half our health.. if you lower our health what happens??
Oh we get KOED in one combo by rogues... and thats why we also need that armor.. to protect ourselves from 2k- 3k Critical hits.
if we didnt have 1800 armor? rogues and mages will damage 3k accurately on us ...

531 damage = is damages of normal attack.. yes warriors are higher.. but understand the overall damage of both mages and warriors
are 3x MORE than warriors damage..

please before you post any of this. know what youre talking about

remember this.. what it looks like.. doesnt describe what it is

ever heard the saying
DONT JUDGE THE BOOK BY ITS COVER?
thats what youre doing here :)

First of all, at the beggining of the thread I said that I took pic from endgame players with great stats, not I took "best stats possible" for each class. I know there are better stats for rogue and for mage. It is just an example.
Second, you say warriors NEED that much armor and hp because they would recieve 2-3k dmg per aimed shot or lightning. Okay, you need, BUT, what about rogue and mage? Mage has 1k armor and rogue has 1.3k armor. Both with 4k hp MAX. How should they survive those 2-3k attacks? Can you tell me? You just cant say warriors are balanced with other classes because they win this season by alot. And yes, they're tanks and they should have highest hp and armor, but cmon, so high damage as a tank? Its just ridiculous.
Just, tell me please how should rogue and mage survive those 2-3k attacks because they dont have 6k hp like warrior and they have 500+ armor less than warrior. Maybe mage must charge shield for inviciblity and rogue must dodge everything? Sorry you have also 2s invinciblity so yeah. Tell me how balanced you are.

[Prahasit Prahi]

Well U have compared and shown well the stat comparison and the stats look pretty good

I wanna say only one thing and that I always follow

Stats may matter but not much as skills.....Skills of the person playing matters

Only one clear cut def....SKILLS MATTER NOT THE STATS
Thats what I follow and day by day I try to learn

[Sceazikua]

I think the most unfair problem is the mythic armors. I observed the higher stat from old mythic armors/helms in cs and I saw that the stats for warriors are way too superior with higher stat and (much) higher armor too. Mages are meant to be damage dealer, but then how come the damage from old mythic armors are worse than other classes ... Im not sure if it is more even for the new armors but in my opinion the armors always give lowest stat to mage, higher for rogue and highest for warrior with armor.
In my point, the comparision for pink rogue vs pink mage: even hp, even damage (even with the cheap bows rogues have even more damage while the gun bru is 80k just to reach kinda same damage), rogues super higher crit/dodge, slightly higher armor(about 200). Rogues' only problem is mana but thats not the worst thing ever. About skills:
-What mages have? Fireball with 5s stun and dot is cool, no need to mention. Curse - cool dot counter skill, makes rogues endangered when used nox or spam aimed. Lightning - highest damage, has 250% damage when crit(but mages have low crit :(), 25% stun 3s. Ice that slows and dot. I dont want to mention gale because it is not very good in pvp(not flagging)
-What rogues have? Aimed shot with super beasty damage while reducing armor and give even more crit, and is spamable with short cooldown too because it reduces armor and gives crit every single strike. Noxious Bolt that do dangerous dot, and it stacks too! Shadow Veil that gives armor and damage when used. Shadow Piercer that may deal good damage too.
At least thats what I am thinking, dont judge me if it was against yours! I dont want to mention healing because each of the 2 has specialities. And I know there are many threads showing how to kill rogue with mages, but how about a thread about how to kill mage with rogues? Thats never gonna happen because there is kinda no tatic in this, just spam aimed and nox like mad, stop when cursed and enjoy the text saying someone died. In my opinion, a decent rogue kills a decent mage, only good mages may kill the decent rogue and good rogue will revenge!

[Jxmaa]

Dude. First of all that HIGH damage of warrios applies on normal attacks only. Propably a ss of a war cant hit more than 800or so. A rogues aimed ir mages lighning can hit w 3k. And fyi mages have a skill called SHIELD and yes YES you can use it :) have u tried 1v1s mage vs rogue ? U wudnt even make this thread if u had...and how do warrios win this season ?

[Sceazikua]

I think the most unfair problem is the mythic armors. I observed the higher stat from old mythic armors/helms in cs and I saw that the stats for warriors are way too superior with higher stat and (much) higher armor too. Mages are meant to be damage dealer, but then how come the damage from old mythic armors are worse than other classes ... Im not sure if it is more even for the new armors but in my opinion the armors always give lowest stat to mage, higher for rogue and highest for warrior with armor.
In my point, the comparision for pink rogue vs pink mage: even hp, even damage (even with the cheap bows rogues have even more damage while the gun bru is 80k just to reach kinda same damage), rogues super higher crit/dodge, slightly higher armor(about 200). Rogues' only problem is mana but thats not the worst thing ever. About skills:
-What mages have? Fireball with 5s stun and dot is cool, no need to mention. Curse - cool dot counter skill, makes rogues endangered when used nox or spam aimed. Lightning - highest damage, has 250% damage when crit(but mages have low crit :( highest I saw was 25% while rogues doesnt have to do anything to get crit because it comes from dex-their main attribute), 25% stun 3s. Ice that slows and dot. I dont want to mention gale because it is not very good in pvp(not flagging)
-What rogues have? Aimed shot with super beasty damage while reducing armor and give even more crit when the critical shots deal 250% damage, and is spamable with short cooldown too because it reduces armor and gives crit every single strike. Noxious Bolt that do dangerous dot, and it stacks too! Shadow Veil that gives armor and damage when used. Shadow Piercer that may deal good damage too.
At least thats what I am thinking about pink rogues vs mages, so dont judge me if it was against yours! I dont want to mention healing because each of the 2 has specialities. And I know there are many threads showing how to kill rogue with mages, but how about a thread about how to kill mage with rogues? Thats never gonna happen because there is kinda no tatic in this, just spam aimed and nox like mad, stop when cursed and enjoy the text saying someone died. In my opinion, a decent rogue kills a decent mage, only good mages may kill the decent rogue and good rogue will revenge!

[Giuewek]

Oh wow more nerf this, nerf that threads a warrior's main stats are health and armour and just to obtain 500 dmg they need arcane maul anyway not that you should run across much in pvp...

[Samdegreat]

Well, you do have to realize that Arcane/Mythic users are not common. Its not like these are common stats that EVERYONE can achieve. The minority of players who have these stats do not really unbalance PVP for the most part.

Lol not common?!? Everyone u see has it tbf
Common items are not common... XD no one wears them ...

[inkredible]

First of all, at the beggining of the thread I said that I took pic from endgame players with great stats, not I took "best stats possible" for each class. I know there are better stats for rogue and for mage. It is just an example.
Second, you say warriors NEED that much armor and hp because they would recieve 2-3k dmg per aimed shot or lightning. Okay, you need, BUT, what about rogue and mage? Mage has 1k armor and rogue has 1.3k armor. Both with 4k hp MAX. How should they survive those 2-3k attacks? Can you tell me? You just cant say warriors are balanced with other classes because they win this season by alot. And yes, they're tanks and they should have highest hp and armor, but cmon, so high damage as a tank? Its just ridiculous.
Just, tell me please how should rogue and mage survive those 2-3k attacks because they dont have 6k hp like warrior and they have 500+ armor less than warrior. Maybe mage must charge shield for inviciblity and rogue must dodge everything? Sorry you have also 2s invinciblity so yeah. Tell me how balanced you are.


warriors.. cannot hit 2k 3k. are u kidding me. if u have 1800 armor (mages / rogues) then what are overall damage gonna come to?
this is why we dont like fighting warriors bec 1. we have no damage.
bro this isnt rocket science. 2s invisibility.. we cant kill u in 2s. we need to buy ourself time

what is this "high damage " tank? u have to remember 530 dmg is only normal attack which is higher than rogues n mages, true
but whats our overall dmg with maul? U WONT EVEN SEE 1k (rare) .. if u do its 1/100000

bro im a mauler i know what im talking about.
im not saying the classes are fully balanced. theyre close and no PROS are complaining now
when you see a lot of end gamers who are on leaderboards.. pro rogues pro mages complaining then theres some legit issue
..

now here you are an average player who got questions (which isnt rocket science). Im here to help you because you really do have a lot to learn

[chorba69]

warriors.. cannot hit 2k 3k. are u kidding me. if u have 1800 armor (mages / rogues) then what are overall damage gonna come to?
this is why we dont like fighting warriors bec 1. we have no damage.
bro this isnt rocket science. 2s invisibility.. we cant kill u in 2s. we need to buy ourself time

what is this "high damage " tank? u have to remember 530 dmg is only normal attack which is higher than rogues n mages, true
but whats our overall dmg with maul? U WONT EVEN SEE 1k (rare) .. if u do its 1/100000

bro im a mauler i know what im talking about.
im not saying the classes are fully balanced. theyre close and no PROS are complaining now
when you see a lot of end gamers who are on leaderboards.. pro rogues pro mages complaining then theres some legit issue
..

now here you are an average player who got questions (which isnt rocket science). Im here to help you because you really do have a lot to learn

I did not say warriors hit 2k. I said what when its rogue vs mage? Both can do great dmg and kill eachother in short time. What about when fighting a warrior? The battle would last few seconds more FOR SURE. Also, if warrior hits 1k max which happens not so often as you say, you still have more chances to win than rogue or mage does. Because, you hit 700-800lets say, they have 4k hp, thats 5hits and they are dead. If they heal, its more okay but, how is it when rogue or mage is in duel with warrior? Chances are not 50/50.

[inkredible]

I did not say warriors hit 2k. I said what when its rogue vs mage? Both can do great dmg and kill eachother in short time. What about when fighting a warrior? The battle would last few seconds more FOR SURE. Also, if warrior hits 1k max which happens not so often as you say, you still have more chances to win than rogue or mage does. Because, you hit 700-800lets say, they have 4k hp, thats 5hits and they are dead. If they heal, its more okay but, how is it when rogue or mage is in duel with warrior? Chances are not 50/50.

*sighs*
it depends on whos fighting.
Mages and rogues fight = most i seen about 50/50 - not for everyone.
you cannot have a generalize stats here because everyone plays differently.. some better than others..
and for rogues fighting warriors - rogues are hard for us to beat.. because they kill us fast.. unless ofcourse im using jugg.. it takes a bit longer
as for mages they deal huge damage also .. which could kill a tank .. with the stun lock everything.. and failed of heal.

dont forget.. rogues and mages heal

.. if youre gonna look at it like that ok.. 6k HP.. rogue hit 3k. OH OoPS DEAD TWO HITS> what now??
or 2k hits.. OOPS dead in 3 hits what now???
thats the HOR 2s invisibility is for.. thats what MAGES shield is for.. and thats what HEAL is for.


ps. misread ur post about 2k to 3k hits ( u were talking about rogues)

[yasshh]

49097

I took those pics from random players. They all with full myth, even arcane. Maybe there are people with better stats but nvm.

Do you say classes are balanced for pvp?
Yeah mage has highest damage but, 1k armor? C'moon.
Next, rogues? Lets say lowest damage on paper, but with high critical chance and damage from Aimed Shot when critted.. Also, almost 350armor more than mage.
And now, warriors.. lol. (sry had to say lol).. 6500hp, 530dmg and 1800armor? C'MOOON.
Okay you can say rogues and warriors have 1300 mana but, if you're squishy, how can you survive attacks if you have to do LOTS of damage to kill something? Yeah, there are tactics to kill this and kill that but, lets be honest... Warriors kinda win this season, by alot!

And no, this is not another "buff this, nerf that" thread, just, do you think it's balanced or not?

So ...

[chorba69]

*sighs*
it depends on whos fighting.
Mages and rogues fight = most i seen about 50/50 - not for everyone.
you cannot have a generalize stats here because everyone plays differently.. some better than others..
and for rogues fighting warriors - rogues are hard for us to beat.. because they kill us fast.. unless ofcourse im using jugg.. it takes a bit longer
as for mages they deal huge damage also .. which could kill a tank .. with the stun lock everything.. and failed of heal.

dont forget.. rogues and mages heal

.. if youre gonna look at it like that ok.. 6k HP.. rogue hit 3k. OH OoPS DEAD TWO HITS> what now??
or 2k hits.. OOPS dead in 3 hits what now???
thats the HOR 2s invisibility is for.. thats what MAGES shield is for.. and thats what HEAL is for.

I'd still say rogues have maybe a tiny advantage over mage 1v1 but nvm.
I did not forget, each class has a heal.
And also, which class has hardest time in pvp? It's a mage. Why? Well, you can see a lots of threads how to kill a rogue, how to kill a warrior. That does not happen so often when we're talking about warriors. Why? Its obvious warriors dont need 100tips, they need 5. And mage? "Lemme hide behind this corner, then when he uses this skill I will use that skill. Should I stun him now or should I heal." And a warrior? Lets be honest they dont need so many tactics like rogue or mage. High hp, high armor, great damage. Imagine a warrior being concentrated in pvp like mage is. He would be invincible

[chorba69]

So ...

:thumbsup:

[phillyr]

Gear does have a lot to do with wins and kills in pvp, I'm a total pvp noob, but I am fully mythic with runic flare, I can kill hellish mages while flagging all day, not much skill when I'm that much more powerful. When I go up against other geared players that's when skill and how we are specced comes into play. U have to fully immerse yourself into pvp and learn what u can get away with and what u can't. Try not to get angry if u happen to be farming deaths it's a learning process. There's just some players I totally cannot beat, I've learned to be ok with that and get less aggravated now while in pvp

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[Skeokateva]

Well, you do have to realize that Arcane/Mythic users are not common. Its not like these are common stats that EVERYONE can achieve. The minority of players who have these stats do not really unbalance PVP for the most part.


Yeah that's one rogue. Okay there are even mages that kill warriors, or even rogues. But, how "pro" they have to be to kill a warrior? I mean, you have to be concentrated 101% percent on the duel, while warrior can smoke a cig, drink a coffee and cast HoR to heal itself, use attack skills few times, and everything is dead. Why?

Thank you! Lmao i always imagine war casually beating my sorc as im cracking my phone screen and breaking a sweat trying to survive long enough to convince myself i put up a good fight.

And if i survive a long time they tell me im "good" or "strong" lol. So... Other classes see a decent pvp sorc as "wow they didnt instantly die in 2 sec of fighting, they're a good sorc" Smh... Its a joke right...


Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk

[inkredible]

heres my suggestion

play warrior for a week, lemme no how it goes for ya, even if u twink :)

[chorba69]

heres my suggestion

play warrior for a week, lemme no how it goes for ya, even if u twink :)

Lets twink at lv10. I'll try it hehe. Not in the mood to reach 35/36.
But yeah, please note that I did not want to start arguing, or anything like that. I just wanted to hear people's opinions but yeah it ended up like this. :)
I'd still like to hear what people think about it, maybe there are other people that play different so they have other statements.
Thanks for your replies and cheers!

[Crowsfoot]

Lets twink at lv10. I'll try it hehe. Not in the mood to reach 35/36.
But yeah, please note that I did not want to start arguing, or anything like that. I just wanted to hear people's opinions but yeah it ended up like this. :)
I'd still like to hear what people think about it, maybe there are other people that play different so they have other statements.
Thanks for your replies and cheers!
Warriors own as twinks for several reasons:

1) the Dark Watch Sword. Highest damage of any warrior pink and has a pric for 100% critical chance.

2) everyone has low damage. Warriors can stay immortal with HoR since everyone is dealing similar damage (In season one rogues, before the heal nerf, were the healling class).

- the difference is critical hits, but warriors can apply feeble.

Note: the lower your level the stronger a warrior is in PvP. My level 14 has a 40:1 kdr for tdm. I had a level 16 for awhile and couldny even get 20:1 (I was 12:1).

Additionally, warriors don't land kills as easilly as rogues. You land three kills for every one I do. It only makes sense that I would have higher survival.

[GoodSyntax]

Additionally, warriors don't land kills as easilly as rogues. You land three kills for every one I do. It only makes sense that I would have higher survival.

This, in partucular, is an important point. Rogues snipe kills all the time due to their high, single target damage and spam-able skills. I have seen many, many Sorcs wipe out entire parties more times than I can count with Fireball and Clock, but it is extremely rare when I see Warriors destroying groups.

The point is that while Warriors are extremely durable, they are so rarely the kill leader of any match that at end game, I would say it happens exactly....never. Twink levels are a different story. So, who are generally the kill leaders? Rogues and Sorcs. Rogues due to high single target damage, Sorcs, typically due to AoE skills. Where does that leave Warriors? Well, they are the class that you have a tough time killing.

In a competent party, Warriors serve as the shield. They take the brunt of the initial onslaught and are particularly good as being an opposing Rogues mana sponge (because we all know that a Rogue without mana is near-death). Maulers in particular are integral to party success because of the armor reduction proc. Sorcerers stun the opposing party, deal lots of AoE and DoT damage. Rogues are the finishers - they finish off opposing players one-by-one. Cooperation between classes is what leads to success in CTF and TDM.

As others have said, with strengths comes weaknesses:


Warriors are tough to kill, but it is hard for them to get kills. They have superior armor, hp and shielding, but their attack skills are by far the weakest in game and they tend to have relatively long skill cooldowns.
Rogues have the ability to inflict massive 1v1 damage, have the shortest skill cooldowns, highest Crit and Dodge, but have no form of shielding, effectively no AoE skills, are always mana starved and have, at best, midrange armor and health.
Sorcerers have the ability to stunlock and deal AoE damage en masse, they have shielding and the highest DMG stats, but have the lowest armor and typically low to midrange health and longish cooldowns on some of their skills.


The point is that you are taking the stats as the only factor in consideration of balance. The skills, buffs, debuffs, etc. play a huge part in the overall build and in balance in general. Looking at pure stats is kind of the same thing as judging a car purely on its rims. If all you notice are the bright, shiny, 22" chrome spinners, you may have missed the fact that they were strapped onto a 1986 Honda Civic that was mostly bondo and the rear window was just clear plastic sheeting and duct tape.

[Slappityslap]

Level a warrior, play with it a week or two and then come back. I bet you delete this thread. Like someone wise said one time, "a clueless player is clueless."

[Puntus]

warrior stats looks in this pic like he shows with proc , im full mythic with glaive and with valkin ( more str pet ) and all normal gems 6k hp , I dont think all supergems give me +500 hp , anyways , stg allways nerf warriors , prolly they dont ignore u but they should.

In my opinion rogue still the most OP class in pvp coz im warrior , but if u are a mage its normal u see warriors op , if u re a warrior its normal u see rogues op , and if u re a rogue its normal see mages op. So stop complaining my last phrase explains the pvp game its balanced , and all pro players know it, just a noob say pvp its unbalanced now.

[firechandra]

I think that warriors are getting stronger every update because rogues and sorcers have to hit fast if they want to survive and they depend on something not always "active", rogues on dodge and critical and sorcers on a lot of mana (that you can't use so effectively because of the cooldown of some skills), while warriors not only have high health but also an armor a lot higher than other 2 classes, this makes warrior able to survive a lot more and in the same time use less %mana and use skills slower doing anyway a good amount of damage. I like this phrase of chorba: "you have to be concentrated 101% percent on the duel, while warrior can smoke a cig, drink a coffee and cast HoR to heal itself, use attack skills few times" because it hits the point. I think the problem is in the armor, they should have around 150-180 armor more than rogues in my opinion , not 400 or more (telling about full mythic against full mythic or best legendary vs best legendary gears and yes I've seen warriors that have up to 2000 armor).
Rogue's gameplay style is hit hard and fast, sorcer's hit with stun or other effect, warrior's is to tank and hit slow. More we go on, more time is needed for a rogue or sorcer to kill a warrior ,for the reason said above, despite cooldown moves be always the same. We can't reduce rogue and sorcer cooldown of some moves (and people are not computers that can tap each millisecond :D) or we will have rogues that kill sorcers immediately or sorcers that stun so much that the opponent can't do nothing, so my advice is to increase both rogue and sorcer armor by 100 more or less and to decrease warrior armor of 100 (and maybe reduce cooldown of a warrior skill but not the horn). I'm saying 100 but it could be also 50-80, who knows, Sts should test. Probably warriors won't agree but I think as some people above me and others I know in the game that this season warriors have a quite big advantage in pvp (especially if there are 2 that can heal eachother) and I hope next season or update will be more balanced someway because I like a lot pvp.

[Puntus]

I think that warriors are getting stronger every update because rogues and sorcers have to hit fast if they want to survive and they depend on something not always "active", rogues on dodge and critical and sorcers on a lot of mana (that you can't use so effectively because of the cooldown of some skills), while warriors not only have high health but also an armor a lot higher than other 2 classes, this makes warrior able to survive a lot more and in the same time use less %mana and use skills slower doing anyway a good amount of damage. I like this phrase of chorba: "you have to be concentrated 101% percent on the duel, while warrior can smoke a cig, drink a coffee and cast HoR to heal itself, use attack skills few times" because it hits the point. I think the problem is in the armor, they should have around 150-180 armor more than rogues in my opinion , not 400 or more (telling about full mythic against full mythic or best legendary vs best legendary gears and yes I've seen warriors that have up to 2000 armor).
Rogue's gameplay style is hit hard and fast, sorcer's hit with stun or other effect, warrior's is to tank and hit slow. More we go on, more time is needed for a rogue or sorcer to kill a warrior ,for the reason said above, despite cooldown moves be always the same. We can't reduce rogue and sorcer cooldown of some moves (and people are not computers that can tap each millisecond :D) or we will have rogues that kill sorcers immediately or sorcers that stun so much that the opponent can't do nothing, so my advice is to increase both rogue and sorcer armor by 100 more or less and to decrease warrior armor of 100 (and maybe reduce cooldown of a warrior skill but not the horn). I'm saying 100 but it could be also 50-80, who knows, Sts should test. Probably warriors won't agree but I think as some people above me and others I know in the game that this season warriors have a quite big advantage in pvp (especially if there are 2 that can heal eachother) and I hope next season or update will be more balanced someway because I like a lot pvp.

Lmao pure noobs , if im vs full rogue I cant touch my nose, please stop complaining and try to have better gears , pets and builds.

[firechandra]

Lmao pure noobs , if im vs full rogue I cant touch my nose, please stop complaining and try to have better gears , pets and builds.
In my opinion a pure noob is who can't see and doesn't have respect of the point of view of others, I was talking about people who have the best legendary equipment and/or maybe 1 or 2 mythics not full mythics and arcane there are only a few. I'm talking about the majority of the people that like the game and play it almost everyday but don't have all the best gears and pets available.

[Crowsfoot]

Zzz, rage thread.

[ipredator]

the game is balanced atm

[chorba69]

lol people.. hello? knock knock? I've never said buff this class or nerf this class. I know each class has its pros and cons and I enjoy my class. I just wanted to hear people's opinions and what do they think about current level cap, stats, advantages and disadvantages, who's got highest chances to win in a battle etc.
But it's sad that you cant discuss about something you want on this forum. Really sad.
Thanks and close this thread.

[Zeus]

First off,

I'd like to start off by saying that I am a rogue with 14 out of 15 exceptional gems on all of my year. If you need proof of that, hit me up in game: L36 Rogue - Zeus.

Secondly, trust me, I can understand your confusion as to why the classes seem unbalanced stat-wise.

Thirdly, my stats max out at 458 damage. However, that is at the expense at a LOT of health and mana. Without mana, a rogue is considered dead. With 458 damage, what can I do? I can crit 3.3-3.9k damage on sorcerers and other rogues. However, with warriors, my damage is lower.

So, to alleviate this issue, I put 40 intelligence point into my build, boosting my mana from 1205 to 1705 and my health from the low 3k's to roughly 3.8k, depending on the pet that I am using.

Now, with this, I can still crit 3k on a sorcerer or rogue, but damage on a warrior drops to 2.5-2.7k. However, this is sufficient considering I can spam away my aimed shot.

A warrior's HoR heals a total of 700-800 per tick, total'ing out to bring him 4.8-5kish health roughly. Now...I can bring that down in 2 combos of aimed shot. If I spam my skills versus a warrior, then yes, he will drain my mana and have the advantage.

Instead, I lead with a charged aimed shot and stack each aimed shot thereafter. This leads to greater damage with each hit due to the armor reduction, crit boost, and crit multiplier. If I manage my packs wisely and charge pierce through the warrior when I can afford the high mana cost, I can beat most - if not all warriors.

For mages, it is balanced too. They have the advantage versus us due to similar damage, but high stuns. However, despite this...we can still beat them.

The truth is, all classes are balanced right now. It is all on the build that you use. However, the only thing that one could argue is NOT balanced is stacking up warriors in a FFA, due to the survivability effect extrapolating.

Other than that, class vs. class is balanced.

[Hummer]

Pick one of the following:
49228492294922749230

[Puntus]

In my opinion a pure noob is who can't see and doesn't have respect of the point of view of others, I was talking about people who have the best legendary equipment and/or maybe 1 or 2 mythics not full mythics and arcane there are only a few. I'm talking about the majority of the people that like the game and play it almost everyday but don't have all the best gears and pets available.

Then ur concept of noob its wrong , if u ll see me complaining about nerf other classes , u have my permission to say me noob seriously , also u cant claim nerf warrior , ur point and argue its the players who havent the best gear, also ur point its pretty confuse , coz for example one warrior with glaive and hellish gear ( depending on build ) , can be better than others warriors , or mage with mythic ring prolly its better than mage with lunar ( depending on build too ) , so u cant claim any nerf based in gear , maybe u have to look zeus reply and prolly u will see u have a wrong build and need to work ur build better , like zeus, hawk , ctf , demonassa and a lot of more rogues do and did. In zeus reply u have a clean example of good work build. Really tired of complains about nerf warriors...

[falmear]

Wait what...things are balanced? How did this happen in less then 3 months. Mages were suppose to make rogue's goners and warriors have near immortality.

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?115865-2013-09-12-Content-Update-(129730)&p=1263497&viewfull=1#post1263497

[Cero]

1v1 (sorc vs other class)
At the moment,
It is NOT balanced or Sorc's Chance to win is ZERO!
Anyways, i already knew and accepted that mages WILL struggle to compete 1v1 against the other Two class. On S3(what season was the last before this season???) before samael Pops froms crates, After they BUFFed Curse, After they hand out Mythic weapon at lvl31 PvP was the only time that Sorc can fight. Lets just face it sorc is the weakest class for 1v1, they can try but will struggle and fail in this season.

But if it's a 5v5, it's a different strory and this is where you can say "it is balanced". I played Sorc class from 21pvp until 31pvp and know sorc's potential in a group fight. Each class has their own upperhand. We(sorc) may not like to be called as support class but it is "probably" the best way to play Sorc.

Although, my comment may be true but it is not the end for other sorc to try 1v1 and become pro at it. I tried but i failed so maybe you(other sorcs) might succeed.

Just My 2 ....

[VanRah]

1v1 (sorc vs other class)
At the moment,
It is NOT balanced or Sorc's Chance to win is ZERO!
Anyways, i already knew and accepted that mages WILL struggle to compete 1v1 against the other Two class. On S3(what season was the last before this season???) before samael Pops froms crates, After they BUFFed Curse, After they hand out Mythic weapon at lvl31 PvP was the only time that Sorc can fight. Lets just face it sorc is the weakest class for 1v1, they can try but will struggle and fail in this season.

But if it's a 5v5, it's a different strory and this is where you can say "it is balanced". I played Sorc class from 21pvp until 31pvp and know sorc's potential in a group fight. Each class has their own upperhand. We(sorc) may not like to be called as support class but "probably" the best way to play Sorc is becoming other class' Support.

Just My 2 ....

I love ur signature, so true XD ahahahahha

[Cero]

Haha hi gwyn:)

Damn you quoted me too fast before i could edit it.

(My sig is actualy a name of an album. i took it thinking i could link it to twink pvp. Lol)

[VanRah]

I love it, I think u should not change it XD

[Puntus]

Wait what...things are balanced? How did this happen in less then 3 months. Mages were suppose to make rogue's goners and warriors have near immortality.

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?115865-2013-09-12-Content-Update-(129730)&p=1263497&viewfull=1#post1263497

Stg already nerfed warrior shield , full team of warriors arent immortality now , also mage full mythic with samael and arcane staff or mythic staff have chances to kill rogue in vs.

And u have to know : warrior > sorcerer , sorcerer> rogue , rogue > warrior
Ofc if u are a mage can feel warriors re op ,same happens with warriors against rogues or rogues against mages, game its balanced.

[DagnyTaggart]

So I've read all of this thread and I have a few observations.

1. OP has some difficulty with maxed out warrs in pvp (I do too) and decides to make a post on forums asking if anyone else has similar experiences and offers possible evidence to be discussed.

2. OP is ridiculed and called childish names

3. Thread is hijacked to mythics

4. Thread is hijacked to twinks

5. People complain because there have been similar threads

Yes, mixed in there were some actually productive posts (Zeus comes to mind) but the majority of it is garbage. If you can't reply to a players legitimate post without being childish or condescending don't reply at all. If you've already read threads like this and dont want to read this one YOU DONT HAVE TO.

Not everyone has been here since the beginning and some of us are still learning. Show some common courtesy.

[chorba69]

@DagnyTaggart exactly that, thank you :)
I wanna repeat once again, I did not make this thread about "buff this nerf that"!
I could also say, "oh look, rogue has 50% dodge, why? nerf it, make it 5%". So warriors, please, relax.
But I didnt, as I've said, I just wanted to hear what do you people think about it, how you deal with it in PvP etc.
We all know that, if you're playing one class, lets say its a warrior (warrior is just an example), you'd not be happy if they nerf it. Same goes with mages and rogues.
And also, how many mages you see around with nice pvp stats? How many? Or, forget the "nice pvp stats", how many mages are playing pvp? I'm sure and you have to admit it, there are more rogues and warriors in pvp than mages. Why? Because they have lower chances than two other classes. As I've said, lots of them say "I'll skip pvp for this season".
@Cero, exactly. I wish a warrior creates a new character, a mage, and give him full mythics. After day or two, they will say "I'll go back on my warrior". Why? Because, if your shield goes off, you're insta dead. But also, you cant deal so much dmg while shield is active to kill someone. Or, lets say you can, but it does not happen so often.

[matanofx]

No, i dont think its balanced for pvp

Mages are absolutely awesome for elite farming, with clock ice fire and shield and bunch of pots we rule the land

However in pvp... its really just too easy to kill us, i know we do more dmg on the paper but reality is that rogues actually do more dmg or i could say.. damage more quickly

Warriors are by now absolute tanks, which sounds fair but damm they can troll me, ill have to do weeks of testing and plats usage for respecs before i can battle a warrior

Now i see some people saying it is balanced but notice how those people usually play a rogue or a warrior

I wont completely respect your opinion unless you have a mage and a rogue or a mage and war (endgame) and compare

The people i know who do have both toons or all 3, they ALL agree that mages are easy targets for anyone unless theyre not guarded by a warrior and rogues are super easy to play and kill, sorry but its the truth just try to deal with it.

For more rants about this comment, have fun ill probably read some of it but again, unless you played both rogue and mage and compared the pvp effectiveness dont bother, mages are tiny blue targets who get aimed shot or sky smashed to death.

[Zeus]

Wait what...things are balanced? How did this happen in less then 3 months. Mages were suppose to make rogue's goners and warriors have near immortality.

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?115865-2013-09-12-Content-Update-(129730)&p=1263497&viewfull=1#post1263497

A lot has happened in 3 months, Falmear. It's not like that post was just yesterday. There's been months of new updates that have slowly balanced the scales.

[Spyce]

Skill level also plays a role in fighting diffrent classes.

[xXz21]

the characters don't need have the same dmg just to see the rogue dmg with 450 dmg is very diferente any warrior are going to shot 6-7k critic with any skill and u can see it.

and sure the game is very unbalance. first the warrior sucks.

[falmear]

Stg already nerfed warrior shield , full team of warriors arent immortality now , also mage full mythic with samael and arcane staff or mythic staff have chances to kill rogue in vs.

And u have to know : warrior > sorcerer , sorcerer> rogue , rogue > warrior
Ofc if u are a mage can feel warriors re op ,same happens with warriors against rogues or rogues against mages, game its balanced.

Samael was already in the game in September. He was released 7/18. Only things that's happened in this time is new mythics, warrior shield was nerfed with respect to a team of warriors (not 1v1 like suggested in the post) and crafting. Two of those three things I don't feel gives any advantage or disadvantage to any one class. So what you are saying is balance is restored by nerfing warrior shield? With the exception of warrior shield, everything has boosted the damage of every class with some increase in health (assuming crafting primary stat). But no real increase in armor. Also shortly around the time of the post I linked to mage's damage was boosted twice. So if anything what people should be saying is things are out of balance, if you believe what is said in the post I linked to. This just shows me that any change to any one class people over react.

[Sorcerie]

It could be that the 14/15 exceptional gems could have changed Zeus's mind. As with a full mythic set that's a plus 90 primary stat boost, and he's just shy of that by 3 -- someone with a near perfect set of end game gear isn't really speaking objectively anymore anyway as he represents such an extreme end of the spectrum. Before crafting he had point, but now, not so much.

[Zeus]

Samael was already in the game in September. He was released 7/18. Only things that's happened in this time is new mythics, warrior shield was nerfed with respect to a team of warriors (not 1v1 like suggested in the post) and crafting. Two of those three things I don't feel gives any advantage or disadvantage to any one class. So what you are saying is balance is restored by nerfing warrior shield? With the exception of warrior shield, everything has boosted the damage of every class with some increase in health (assuming crafting primary stat). But no real increase in armor. Also shortly around the time of the post I linked to mage's damage was boosted twice. So if anything what people should be saying is things are out of balance, if you believe what is said in the post I linked to. This just shows me that any change to any one class people over react.

You're overlooking that armor has increased and so has health. A rogue now has 3.9-4k health versus the 3k health that they used to be at. Now, when using packs... the extra health has a noticeable effect. Also, the damage nerf was put into place during this time, making it easier to survive the stun locks mage would be able to produce.

Regardless of the things that we are both overlooking, the class triangle is balanced:
• Warrior > Mage
• Mage > Rogue
• Rogue > Warrior

In PL, this was the balance that they tried to achieve and for a while, it was balanced like that. AL has that balance for now. We will see what happens further down the road.

[Haligali]

1v1 (sorc vs other class)
At the moment,
It is NOT balanced or Sorc's Chance to win is ZERO!
Anyways, i already knew and accepted that mages WILL struggle to compete 1v1 against the other Two class. On S3(what season was the last before this season???) before samael Pops froms crates, After they BUFFed Curse, After they hand out Mythic weapon at lvl31 PvP was the only time that Sorc can fight. Lets just face it sorc is the weakest class for 1v1, they can try but will struggle and fail in this season.

But if it's a 5v5, it's a different strory and this is where you can say "it is balanced". I played Sorc class from 21pvp until 31pvp and know sorc's potential in a group fight. Each class has their own upperhand. We(sorc) may not like to be called as support class but it is "probably" the best way to play Sorc.

Although, my comment may be true but it is not the end for other sorc to try 1v1 and become pro at it. I tried but i failed so maybe you(other sorcs) might succeed.

Just My 2 ....

Mage vs warrior 1-1 was more ballanced before all the sorcerer skill improvements. Its maybe because of the overall dmg nerf this season or we are forced to use different type of weapons. Staff not rly good vs a warrior, gun way more better imo.

Tapatalk-kal küldve az én Nexus 4-el

[Crowsfoot]

You're overlooking that armor has increased and so has health. A rogue now has 3.9-4k health versus the 3k health that they used to be at. Now, when using packs... the extra health has a noticeable effect. Also, the damage nerf was put into place during this time, making it easier to survive the stun locks mage would be able to produce.

Regardless of the things that we are both overlooking, the class triangle is balanced:
• Warrior > Mage
• Mage > Rogue
• Rogue > Warrior

In PL, this was the balanced that they tried to achieve and for a while, it was balanced like that. AL has that balance for now. We will see what happens further down the road.

Mages beat rogues? (curses the world) I should'nt have deleted mine.

[Zeus]

Mages beat rogues? (curses the world) I should'nt have deleted mine.

If you know how, they do quite consistently. :p

[DagnyTaggart]

I've found (with help) that with my current gear level I can spec to compete with a better geared warrior but it is contrary to my playing style and sacrifices my ability to beat most rogues / mages easily. Also it takes so long that its only useful in 1v1...

[Crowsfoot]

I've found (with help) that with my current gear level I can spec to compete with a better geared warrior but it is contrary to my playing style and sacrifices my ability to beat most rogues / mages easily. Also it takes so long that its only useful in 1v1...

I really am tempted to give rogues tips, but then they would all kill me. At the moment, I win 50%+ of my 1v1 fights against rogues when I'm PvP speced. Those that beat me, slaughter me.

[falmear]

Regardless of the things that we are both overlooking, the class triangle is balanced:
• Warrior > Mage
• Mage > Rogue
• Rogue > Warrior


If this was truly the case then all 3 classes would have similar KDRs and the most amount of kills. But they don't and everyone knows this and who has the best KDRs and the most amount of kills.

Also there has been no increase in armor only a minor increase for mages with mythic staff. However a mage with mythic staff (ungemmed) health is only around 3.3k. While a rogue with mythic daggers is around 3.6k. Before mythic gun vs mythic bow both classes had similar health but mages had 30% less armor. Now rogues have both more health and armor. Its fine for me because I have arcane staff because I have slightly more health then a rogue with mythic daggers. In my mind its not balanced across mythics. Maybe its balanced only if you consider an arcane mage. I don't call that balance.

[Zeus]

If this was truly the case then all 3 classes would have similar KDRs and the most amount of kills. But they don't and everyone knows this and who has the best KDRs and the most amount of kills.

Also there has been no increase in armor only a minor increase for mages with mythic staff. However a mage with mythic staff (ungemmed) health is only around 3.3k. While a rogue with mythic daggers is around 3.6k. Before mythic gun vs mythic bow both classes had similar health but mages had 30% less armor. Now rogues have both more health and armor. Its fine for me because I have arcane staff because I have slightly more health then a rogue with mythic daggers. In my mind its not balanced across mythics. Maybe its balanced only if you consider an arcane mage. I don't call that balance.

Falmear, it's not that black and white. We could argue all day, but it is balanced.

Also, the mythic staff to dagger comparison isn't necessarily fair. The mythic daggers have an increase in health due to the fact that they are a close range weapon. Comparing a close range weapon's stats to a ranged weapon's stats simply doesn't make sense.

The extra health on daggers is needed because in order for us to utilize our auto attack, we must be able to have time to get in close, which will take either an increase in armor or health.

[baddiva]

There's people trying hard to explain and there's the other people who playing dumb... :p

[nelson131]

first. it is balanced in end game, but not in mid lv or 20_30lv.
first.
rogue vs mage

time is the problem. it all depends on the speed of tapping ur skills. rogue taps first, aimed shot- dead sorc.

sorc taps first, long stun then use all skills- dead rogue, the recover mana and go on the next battle.

warrrior vs rogue, rogue use aimed shot, 2/3 or 1/2 of warriror health, then axe throw and windmill = stunned and dead rogue. and dodge is all about luck, (very passive) and 50% dodge and 50% crit is NOT POSSIBLE. you either get full crit or dodge or mix. rogue can kill warriors but they must be noobs or distrated or super rogues.

mage vs warrior, NOT leveled. mage can stun then attack but can't kill fast but have to not use some other skills. warriors can jump smash stun then attack then stun with windmill and kill others.

now. 5vs5

warriors-ok just take hits

rogues-ultra pathetic. always killed with no aoe and low health

mages-insane hide behine warrior and kill everything.

considering it is a mixed group.

pve
perfectly leveled.

you need all 3 classed to survive


HOWEVER, the balance may be damaged with further tweaks, buffs and nerfs

and diferent skill loadout means that you have different stenths against different classes.

[Haligali]

Falmear, it's not that black and white. We could argue all day, but it is balanced.

Also, the mythic staff to dagger comparison isn't necessarily fair. The mythic daggers have an increase in health due to the fact that they are a close range weapon. Comparing a close range weapon's stats to a ranged weapon's stats simply doesn't make sense.

The extra health on daggers is needed because in order for us to utilize our auto attack, we must be able to have time to get in close, which will take either an increase in armor or health.

The mage mythic staff is a long range weapon?

[phillyr]

U cannot seriously sit there with a straight face and tell me that a fully geared rogue with new daggers isn't the most dangerous player in pvp. It may take they're whole mana bar, but they can utterly destroy most players on the battlefield. 1v1...5v5... I see geared rogues destroying everybody

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[katish]

Falmear, it's not that black and white. We could argue all day, but it is balanced.

Also, the mythic staff to dagger comparison isn't necessarily fair. The mythic daggers have an increase in health due to the fact that they are a close range weapon. Comparing a close range weapon's stats to a ranged weapon's stats simply doesn't make sense.

The extra health on daggers is needed because in order for us to utilize our auto attack, we must be able to have time to get in close, which will take either an increase in armor or health.

It's not balanced. And I say mythic staff vs mythic daggers is a fair comparison Cuz they are both close range.

Mages still suffer the most in pvp. Idk where u get the idea mages > rogues...

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[Crowsfoot]

I love how this thread (started by a rogue) has started at calling warriors OP, and then tried (but of course failed) to call mages OP, and now we are where people are calling rogues OP.

The only truth: Mages are underpowered.

They rarely get me below 70% and maybe get me to 50% if lightning crits. But, rogues can drop me to 65% in a single shot.

[chorba69]

@Crowsfoot, just one thing. I have not started a thread at calling warriors OP nor I've said mages are OP. I've said that warriors, maybe, have lil bit more chances in pvp than other classes. That's why I've posted that screenshot along with the text.
Yes, it's true mages are really underpowered. They have highest damage on paper but their criticals (if they crit), are not high enough to kill a warrior. As you say, they do 30-50% dmg of your total health.
Also, it's impossible that mage > rogue statement is true.

And, @Zeus, Warrior > Mage, Mage > Rogue, Rogue > Warrior. If, but IF this is true, how'd it be then in pvp? Warrior will hunt mages only, mage rogues and rogue warriors? How'd it be? Lets say you're a warrior. You run around in ctf and you notice a rogue is approaching. You'll skip the rogue, and run more untill you find a mage. Then you'll stop, kill him, and continue like that? Same goes for mages and rogues.
Isnt it better that everyone can kill everyone?

[mapenjay]

the only balance in this game is on low levels, everything there is balance compared to end gaming

try to play in low levels you will see how it goes

[Zeus]

It's not balanced. And I say mythic staff vs mythic daggers is a fair comparison Cuz they are both close range.

Mages still suffer the most in pvp. Idk where u get the idea mages > rogues...

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Can a mage not kill a rogue more times than a rogue kills a mage, Meecah. Assuming they are equally geared and equally skilled? In the situations I have faced, when fighting a maxed out rogue vs a maxed out mage, this is typically the case. Of course, it also depends on the build.

A mythic staff isn't really close range, because you can still attack from afar. For a mythic dagger, you literally must be face to face with your enemy if you want to be doing damage with your weapon, thus having to endure both the auto attacks and the skill damage of an opponent.

[Zeus]

@Crowsfoot, just one thing. I have not started a thread at calling warriors OP nor I've said mages are OP. I've said that warriors, maybe, have lil bit more chances in pvp than other classes. That's why I've posted that screenshot along with the text.
Yes, it's true mages are really underpowered. They have highest damage on paper but their criticals (if they crit), are not high enough to kill a warrior. As you say, they do 30-50% dmg of your total health.
Also, it's impossible that mage > rogue statement is true.

And, @Zeus, Warrior > Mage, Mage > Rogue, Rogue > Warrior. If, but IF this is true, how'd it be then in pvp? Warrior will hunt mages only, mage rogues and rogue warriors? How'd it be? Lets say you're a warrior. You run around in ctf and you notice a rogue is approaching. You'll skip the rogue, and run more untill you find a mage. Then you'll stop, kill him, and continue like that? Same goes for mages and rogues.
Isnt it better that everyone can kill everyone?

Is it better? Yeah, but balance can be viewed in different ways. Unfortunately, there is never going to be true balance. Instead, like most MMOs, there exists a combat triangle. No matter how many threads are made, that won't change it because you literally cannot without changing a classes's fundamentals.

[katish]

I'd like it if all classes had base stat points to apply towards 3 basic stats, for example:
-dex to increase dodge n crit n maybe an attack speed modifier
- str to increase health n dps
- int to increase mana n dmg

So our armor would come from gear. Our final dmg would be dependant on how we distributed our stat points as all as the opponent's. We'd have real variety. Right now mages go all int with maybe a few points in strength. Rogues go all dex with maybe few points in int. Idk what warriors do really :) so it all comes down to gear... Because basic builds pretty much are all the same.

And perhaps in this way we'd see more variety in skill selection too.. I think having a primary stat for each class is bad for balance.

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[falmear]

Can a mage not kill a rogue more times than a rogue kills a mage, Meecah. Assuming they are equally geared and equally skilled? In the situations I have faced, when fighting a maxed out rogue vs a maxed out mage, this is typically the case. Of course, it also depends on the build.

A mythic staff isn't really close range, because you can still attack from afar. For a mythic dagger, you literally must be face to face with your enemy if you want to be doing damage with your weapon, thus having to endure both the auto attacks and the skill damage of an opponent.

Again you complete ignore the fact of which class has the best KDR and which class gets the most kills. Its definitely not mages. As I said, if it was truly balanced then all classes would have similar KDRs and number of kills. Staff is a close range weapon, you have to get a lot closer to your target then a gun. And unlike a gun you can't hit your target without pointing it in their direction. So it makes kiting less effective. So if you want to do the maximum amount of damage you to be closer and/or more stationary. So its no different then mythic daggers. Mages survival is entirely based on not being hit because our armor is so low. And shield doesn't last long enough.

As for 1v1 against a rogue it mostly comes down to how many attack skills you have. Fighting a rogue with livegiver as one of your skills is completely useless. This is why any 3 attack skills, plus shield, whether one of them is curse puts the advantage in the mages corner. The fight doesn't last long enough and the fight is more like rogue vs rogue but the mage can stun more so he can stop the rogue from doing damage. So the first 5 seconds of fighting is in the mages favor. Anything longer then 10 seconds, then its pretty much the mage is dead. If a rogue fights a mage with 2 attack skill with lifegiver and shield, the fight is entirely in the rogues favor. IMO, as a mage if you want to be successful you need to run 5 skills. Because 2 skills doesn't do enough damage and lifegiver doesn't return enough health to help you survive.

No class is OP, IMO the the way mages are designed they are under powered. But given where the game is now, its like closing the door after the horse has left the barn. Nothing will be done about this. My recommendation is if you don't like playing a mage then go play another class.

[Zeus]

I love how this thread (started by a rogue) has started at calling warriors OP, and then tried (but of course failed) to call mages OP, and now we are where people are calling rogues OP.

The only truth: Mages are underpowered.

They rarely get me below 70% and maybe get me to 50% if lightning crits. But, rogues can drop me to 65% in a single shot.

They aren't really...

I believe when developers first made the games, if I remember correctly, there was a quote of the basic combat triangle being posted:
• Rogue > Warrior
• Sorcerer > Rogue
• Warrior > Sorcerer

Back in PL, my warrior could kill mages without my health dipping below 50%, but against a bird, I had a very good chance of losing.

Does a sorcerer need a proper build to take out rogues? Sure. As Falmear says, the conventional stun/heal build isn't the way to do it.

@Falmear
Sorcerers are unfortunately meant to be squishy, so they will die a lot in the process of getting kills. Heck, when have you ever heard of a sorcerer's robes stopping a piercing arrow? The shield, while it only provides 2 seconds of invulnerability, does give a consistent amount of damage reduction.

Whenever I'm fighting, it's not uncommon to see a rogue or sorcerer get a similar amount of kills.

The class balance is as close as it'll ever get & in the past, whenever STG tries messing with it in other games via combat rebalances, it generally doesn't turn out to be balanced. It'll only tip the favors in another class.

So, I suggest we all stop beating the dead horse and appreciate both the weaknesses and advantages of each class.

[Crowsfoot]

Again you complete ignore the fact of which class has the best KDR and which class gets the most kills. Its definitely not mages. As I said, if it was truly balanced then all classes would have similar KDRs and number of kills. Staff is a close range weapon, you have to get a lot closer to your target then a gun. And unlike a gun you can't hit your target without pointing it in their direction. So it makes kiting less effective. So if you want to do the maximum amount of damage you to be closer and/or more stationary. So its no different then mythic daggers. Mages survival is entirely based on not being hit because our armor is so low. And shield doesn't last long enough.

As for 1v1 against a rogue it mostly comes down to how many attack skills you have. Fighting a rogue with livegiver as one of your skills is completely useless. This is why any 3 attack skills, plus shield, whether one of them is curse puts the advantage in the mages corner. The fight doesn't last long enough and the fight is more like rogue vs rogue but the mage can stun more so he can stop the rogue from doing damage. So the first 5 seconds of fighting is in the mages favor. Anything longer then 10 seconds, then its pretty much the mage is dead. If a rogue fights a mage with 2 attack skill with lifegiver and shield, the fight is entirely in the rogues favor. IMO, as a mage if you want to be successful you need to run 5 skills. Because 2 skills doesn't do enough damage and lifegiver doesn't return enough health to help you survive.

No class is OP, IMO the the way mages are designed they are under powered. But given where the game is now, its like closing the door after the horse has left the barn. Nothing will be done about this. My recommendation is if you don't like playing a mage then go play another class.

If everyone had similar kdrs we would all have to play the same class...

You do realize that, by nature, warriors will have the best kdrs but the lowest kill count. Rogues will have the highest kill count . And mages suffer for these reasons:

1) warriors can actually kill mages so we attack you first (60% of my kills are probably mages).

2) mages heal the mana of rogues, so we want to kill you first.

3) you have the lowest health, so its easiest to kill you first.

4) once shield runs off you die within 5 hits, so I attack all mages without a shield up.

5) mages have low dodge, so you guys get stunned a lot easier than rogues.

[VanRah]

God save the mage!

[Haligali]

A few thoughts

The balance from my point of view was better in the end of last season, we mages got the best mythic weapon, arcane warriors were less common.

Rogue vs mage, it was more like rogue>mage before the arcane shield and curse skill improvements.

I did very good vs warriors in the past, which helped me a lot: the old guns push proc&slag the ultimate sorcerer pet.


But i still can not understand: how a rogue crits me 3600 on the very first aimed shot with ~400 dmg (with over 40% base crit chance, it happens a lot), if i crit on the rogue with lightning max 2000 ~570dmg? The armor differences cannot be the reason.

[Sky_is_epicgearz]

it would be nice to give mages a lil bit more armour i guess. but if you think about, most mages in pvp have 2 offensive skills (fire ball and lightning).......and we can still do plenty damage and get kills.... but if we had armour simular to rogue why would we need a shield? we could bring in a 3rd offensive skill (maybe ice) we would do much more damge now 0.0 i think sts tried really hard to balance this out as much as possible. a good idea i think would be to make the cooldown for shield not as long.

as for warrior leave them for last :)

[Robhawk]

• Rogue > Warrior
• Sorcerer > Rogue
• Warrior > Sorcerer


Thats exactly how it is now!

I cant beat any good warrior BUT i can kill full rogues with Samael in 1on1 even beeing not full myth (also no archon!) and using legendary pets.
Rogues kill the warriors, mostly and the warriors kill the mages at all times!

In terms of 2on2 or even more its easy to say the team with more warriors wins. You dont need to enter the battlefield if enemy team consits of 4 warriors, except they totally mess up the teamplay and skilltiming.

[ClumsyCactus]

well in my opinion its like stone paper scissors. and if u dont like being a stone, then be a scissor...
in the end its about determination and skill. no class is op except the class u let your mind think is op.

[Crescentwind]

49097

I took those pics from random players. They all with full myth, even arcane. Maybe there are people with better stats but nvm.

Do you say classes are balanced for pvp?
Yeah mage has highest damage but, 1k armor? C'moon.
Next, rogues? Lets say lowest damage on paper, but with high critical chance and damage from Aimed Shot when critted.. Also, almost 350armor more than mage.
And now, warriors.. lol. (sry had to say lol).. 6500hp, 530dmg and 1800armor? C'MOOON.
Okay you can say rogues and warriors have 1300 mana but, if you're squishy, how can you survive attacks if you have to do LOTS of damage to kill something? Yeah, there are tactics to kill this and kill that but, lets be honest... Warriors kinda win this season, by alot!

And no, this is not another "buff this, nerf that" thread, just, do you think it's balanced or not?

The source you provided is not valid. You just got those stat from random people lmao.. and of course we know we can easily hide our TRUE stat as I always do every time Im out of PVP arena... but I agree with you that the game is NOT balance.. WHY?

Lvl 15 to 16 - Extremely NOT BALANCE

Lvl 20 to 21 - slightly not balance

These level bracket has ELITE GEARS and we all know that these gears are already RARE and OVER POWER, specifically for lvl 15 to 16. Meaning even if you have the money its not that easy to be fully gear or max out since the only chance you can have these gear if other player who has it is quitting the game or willing to sell it for THE BIGGER OFFER.
These elite gear cause imbalance of the game coz STS stop generating it.

If they suggest not to play on these level.. Ok so be it.. but this has only one meaning >>>> THE GAME IS NOT BALANCE'

In terms of CLASSES. The only thing I think which is not balance is for the mages skill which the HEAL. Its cooldown time and the amount it heals..

[Nesox]

How many times do you see rogues getting KOed with a single crit lightning strike, or even a light/ice combo? A fireball stun, ice, light?

Mages have a good chance at rogues but only if everything is in their favor from the start. The mage must have shield already up. Or the fight was over before it started. If you take only 1v1 dual stats, mages tend to come out slightly higher in kdr, agreed. If you add in all the times that we get suckered before we can put shield up or while waiting for shield and heal to cool down that value declines. Yes, I am still talking 1v1 not secondary attack. In pure tdm 1v1, even if a mage wins, a rogue can spawn, cross the map and kill me before Shield and Lifegiver are cooled off. This can often result in an even kdr even if I win 100% of the initial battles, which I don’t.

From warriors a quick Smash/Windmill combo will wipe us out post haste as well. I am almost full mythic and my loss rate to warriors is faaaaarrrr greater than my win ratio against rogues. So to make the Warrior>Mage>Rogue=Balance argument valid the average Mage>Rogue kill rate should be equally dominant as the Warrior>Mage or the Rogue>Warrior. This is definitely not the case.

All arguments of skill, gear, and tactics aside, if STS were to average the kdr of the top 500 in each class, I would be willing to bet that you will see some sizable discrepancies. If they can show me hard stats that the average kdr is “equal” I will eat crow and stop complaining…

[Nesox]

A mythic staff isn't really close range, because you can still attack from afar. For a mythic dagger, you literally must be face to face with your enemy if you want to be doing damage with your weapon, thus having to endure both the auto attacks and the skill damage of an opponent.

If I am fighting a bow user, using my staff, the staff is feels very much "close range." Using a shotgun against a sniper doesn't exactly make for an effective ranged attack.

If I am fighting a daggers user the fight is entirely point blank range so the staff range is irrelevant anyway. Bringing a shotgun to a knife fight doesn't a ranged fight make.

[Yunfehn]

Level 21-23 pvp is pretty balance. Just saying. Try it! And good luck :3


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[Clefairy]

I agree completely. As far as I can tell those are all end game capped players. And yes... Pvping against any warrior with end game gear and either of the top two weapons is ridiculous.

Also how does that rogue have so much DPs... I've got everything except myth daggers and I'm not even close.

Guildie of mine has over 700 DPS full mythic and omg her daggers so delicious!

[falmear]

If I am fighting a bow user, using my staff, the staff is feels very much "close range." Using a shotgun against a sniper doesn't exactly make for an effective ranged attack.

If I am fighting a daggers user the fight is entirely point blank range so the staff range is irrelevant anyway. Bringing a shotgun to a knife fight doesn't a ranged fight make.

If warrior uses skyward smash or rogue uses pierce against you how is it not a close range weapon? Using the staff you have to be inside skyward smash or pierce range. There is no leg to stand on why mythic rogue has more health then mythic mage. When the mythic rogue has 30% more armor. Its already insta death for me when my shield is down and I have arcane staff. Our health was nerfed this season and this is the most outrageous part in my opinion. Last season we had equal health and now this season we are at a serious disadvantage.

[phillyr]

I don't know much about the background stats of the rogue skills, but someone else made this point, why does their crit aimed shot for over 3k dmg and crit lightning slightly over 2k dmg when lightning dies way more base damage+250% extra dmg when crit hits? Jus curious

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[phillyr]

Does* not dies...stupid Swype

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[Serancha]

Im sorry.. but are you unintelligent or you just really know nothing about classes?
First of all.. for beginners.

you took a screen shot of a warrior whos maxed out.. all super gem

and you took all other mages and rogues who doesnt even have full super gem. how? i know what it looks like

rogues not even full super gem can hit 3800 health.. 400 dmg.



Hate to burst your bubble here Inky my love. I don't know this poster, but they are not unintelligent, nor are they ignorant about the classes.

The rogue in that screenshot undoubtedly has super gems. You might say that you know what it looks like, but here's the proof.

This screenshot is my rogue with NO super gems. Only mythic gear with normal dex gems in all - except the fang which has a dex/int gem in it. Note the damage isn't even close to 450 like the rogue in the example.

This also shows that with supers, it would be EASY to clear 3800 health with 400 damage, using Malison.


49824

[Clefairy]

Can you name your gear? I just hit 36 and figuring out what to shoot for thanks (:

[Soundlesskill]

Mages are OP..

[Striderevil]

I started this game with a mage and still play it but after trying a warrior the difference is huge. Reasonably, they (mages) are undoubtedly the most squishy of all classes. Sure its real nice that they can clear mobs, but mobs dont drop gear worth talking about. I've given up on pvp for the fact that even a fully mythic loaded mage will get killed most times by a Rogue with a bow miles away or smashed by a war. Since many claim the class is balanced lets talk about Pve and bossing.

An average fully loaded legendary mage will on most times get one shot crit. dead by bosses or wont live long enough to finish bosses once they get into end hp rage modes (not enranged). They are not fast enough to run away, without a pet or wind skill and do not have enough armor to withstand a hit, get stunned or frozen or pulled in by bosses like Grimmr since they have no skill to counter movement impeding effects like wars jugger., and most of all for a char sooo squishy you would think they would get decent range to escape attacks but sadly they fall within all ranges of all boss attacks. But bosses like frostir even standing outside their redzone is not enough because they still get crit killed. Use timestop with root and all bosses will walk out of it while most ranger type chars will shot at mages as the mage has to come within their attack range to make an effective hit.

Look at the market place and you will find Rogue items the cheapest and within good reason. Ask your guild to help out and 6/10 times they will suggest taking a rogue and the rest of the times a war can manage if he is skilled enough to support a mage with healing. Most times wars don't even bother healing because they don't lose Hp as fast and if a mage themselves don't want to lose mana will have to constantly spam heal anyways to make sure they have always a good mana supply which also provides a reasonable amount of HP to wars. Cause a mage without mana is dead. Mana regen rate for a mage is pathetic so spam charged heal or die. With a war I run with Haze and never run out of mana. I don't know if the same runs true for rogues but a flapjack or haze should ensure an endless supply of mana. The mana regens ridiculously fast for war that I have no need for a mage and also the skills don't use as much mana. I have juggernaut so never have to worry about stun or any other movement impairment. Probably why mage stun may have no effect on wars in pvp.

A legendary geared war or rogue can boss easily, agreed that it takes longer for the war but its still possible to go up against most other than an enraged ina'nesh. Mage have to be mythic before they can even dream about going up against anything more than bosses at paradise pier level.

Mages are sorely under-powered on average. They get terrible loot unless they are in a good group and are mostly at the mercy of the group they are in. If they happen to team up with the same level but poorly speced war or rogue they will be as good as dead regardless of gear. With new rules that only allow for bael 2 to spawn after a boss kill again their drop opportunities are limited while their gear costs are really high in market place. Look at arena.

Seriously if the devs want to balance the classes on average then give mages

- more range for their skill attacks or/and
- Combine mage heal and shield skill like wars so either another attack skill can be added or add an extra skill slot since after all we are sorcerers.
- Allow stun skill to work on bosses as pets like slag have the ability to panic or stun. At least there will be some chance for mages then.

This is the easiest way to balance classes without nerfing or op any other characteristic. The mage char is fundamentally flawed.

Now compare the armor and hp value of wars to bosses while rogue crit attacks and range are again boss like and you can see why a mage finds it difficult to go up against these classes. If its nearly impossible for an average mage with top level legendary gear to solo bosses in nordr and shuyal, how can you expect as much success in pvp?

Most are right that the majority of chars in the game are not mythic, but how many non-mythic chars are there in pvp? Most especially at high levels are at end game level.

Mages can be stunned, frozen, panicked despite shielding. They need to be within range of most characters to attack which in turn leaves them open to being attacked themselves. A Rogue at range can crit shot a mage from a safe distance before the mage even realizes whats going on.

[phillyr]

Mages are OP..

LOL

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[Zeus]

Just so we settle this whole debate, this is a fully exceptional rogue at max damage, which, as you can see is clearly not suitable for PvP:

51235

[phillyr]

Dagger rogue with exceptional gems not suited for pvp?...

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[falmear]

Dagger rogue with exceptional gems not suited for pvp?...

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This can be summed up by remove 5/5 from str passive and use archon instead of mythic ring. This is like -600 health. This is the same with mage. So nothing to see here.

[phillyr]

Everyone knows rogues are boss of 1v1 pvp battles, I've seen dagger rogue kill maul and glaive warriors 2 out of every 3 battles

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[kinzmet]

3 to 5 warriors on pvp teaming up are unkillable. Warrior class people defend there class saying "mages and rogues have 3x damage more damage than us". But this is PVP were talking about the "twice-the-health-and-armor-because-they-are-dishing-3k-damage" thing is on a 1v1, 2 fully geared war can take 3 rogues or 3 mages. I think what chorba69 wan'ts to say showing those stats is "If health and armor of war class are high then at least lessen there damage". BTW in rogues the only 3k thing that it can dish is aimshot which cools down after 2 seconds where the warriors already heal (they have 3 heal skill). And mages could only rely on there skills on timing for stun-lock-combo which is very had to do especialy when ping is fluctuating, and once they miss a timing on stun-lock (without a shield) they are done for against a war. He is not JUDGING THE BOOK BY ITS COVER, he is simply saying his opinion. :)

[Zeus]

Dagger rogue with exceptional gems not suited for pvp?...

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The low health & low mana will have you run out of both quite quickly against anyone decently geared.

@Falmear I think I still had 5/5 str in that picture, not sure though.

[Energizeric]

I guess I'm late to this conversation, but there is definitely something different this season compared to last season. Warriors are way more difficult to kill this season than last season. I'm full mythic, and a warrior with non-mythic can put up a really good fight against me. A warrior with a glaive can beat me easy every single time.

The other day a warrior friend of mine was just toying with me, and I was attacking him with everything I had, and instead of fighting back he just stood there and took the punishment only using HOR to heal himself. It took at least a couple of minutes and dozens of lightning strikes and fireballs to take him down. Then we reversed it, and he hit me with his glaive, and all it took was 3-4 hits with the glaive (with my shield up) for him to kill me.

Last season I was able to beat many warriors, even those with arcane maul on occasion. Now the only warriors I can beat are noobs who use cheap crate gear. Something having to do with balance has definitely changed. I think it may have to do with gems and upgrades as I posted in another thread recently, but I cannot be certain. It seems that warriors benefit more from gems than other classes do, as STR added for warriors gives them both health and damage increase, while mages and rogues must choose one or the other.

[Anarchist]

I think it may have to do with gems and upgrades as I posted in another thread recently, but I cannot be certain. It seems that warriors benefit more from gems than other classes do, as STR added for warriors gives them both health and damage increase, while mages and rogues must choose one or the other.

I also add that if the damage goes
up for everyone and the defence remains the same the class that benefits is the one with the highest defence.
What Energizeric said is true a maxed out rogue or mage has chance only with crap geared wars.
Even among twinks!
When i twink with my maxed out lvl15 rogue and meet a war with a dark watch sword i just skip the fight cause i know i am doomed and have no chance what so ever.
With my mage twink it's even worse every other class with a decent gear kills me.

[falmear]

1v1 with arcane staff + samael its almost zero chance to kill a warrior with glaive/bonesaw or maul. You don't do enough damage with 2 attack skills and you die too fast if you don't use heal + shield. Lifegiver doesn't recover enough health. And if maul warrior procs and stuns you its game over. If my arcane staff procs, it has no effect on the outcome of the fight. Forget about even using charged staff attack which is absolutely useless. Also this problem existed before upgrades were released. You can confirm this seeing this link dated 11/6 here:

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?123003-PvP-tips-against-warrior

This predates when upgrades were released but I think the problem has been made worse by upgrades. Also between then and now, there are a lot more mauls and glaive/bonesaws now.

[phillyr]

I never liked the idea of crafting from the get go, even if they bring in new gems to up defense, warriors will not need them...and we lose power for survivability...so they can kill us in five hits instead of four

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