OFFICIAL Combat Re-Balance Feedback Thread

[Protank]

Ok i cant take a break from this game. Its really a geat game and dev team is really the best out there. So from now on ill only post about combat rebalance feedback. I promise.

Iron blood really needs to go back to 32-34 cooldown/recast time or whatever it was pre-nurf. Tanks/ursans need to tank. I can recast rage in 32 seconds and this is to deal more dmg/crit. So it would only make sence being a ursan, to recast blood when i cast all my agro pulling skills (taunt, becon and all dmg skills).

[xxteargodxx]

Okay after playing some more, I'm unsatisfied with the game changes..The game is just too slow paced for me or at least it really...REALLY feels slow paced. The changes to balance the combat system is awesome that is definitely a step in the right direction to balancing the game. However to do that you do not need to slow down the game in my opinion.

I'm going to be taking a break from this game, it was fun playing for a few weeks while it lasted. To the Developers, good luck I hope you get things straightened out and I wish you the best of luck in your game.

[dirtball]

Did from Crush the Keeper to Overlord straight thru with a good team last night in 2 hours. Made tons of money, used 150 pots or so, got some purps and 2 pinks, and only died 6 or 7 times. Considering everything was new that's pretty good. Level 46 tank with Djinn spear of Thoth was doing plenty of damage when counting in skills, which I was firing off every few seconds. Never ran out of mana. At this point if you don't or can't adapt to the changes you're in trouble.

[Lesrider]

Lol so it seems that the perfect team now is 2 Mage, 1 pally, 2 birds. With a more balanced team that included bears, bosses took much longer to kill. But we did like 8 rounds with no bears and all the mobs and bosses went down so fast. Guess I'm back to being a Mage again and my bear is going back into hibernation. Mages can tank, so really no use for a bear that has to chase enemies around.

Funny that you guys were going for balance (what you almost had before
-- 2 bear, 2 bird, 1 Mage used to be a great setup), but ended up killing an entire class. I guess it doesn't bother me much since I have one of each and every time one gets nerfed I'll just use a different one. But I do fell sorry for all the players who only focused on a bear.

We got some good loot, too, tonight (I'm sure some will still consider it cheating -- you know who you are).

So while I am having fun again destroying mobs with my mage, it seems ridiculously easy. No strategy needed.

That's my initial reaction to today's update. Keep in mind, I thought of holding this back because I knoe you guys will probably nerf the mages now. And then it'll be back to taking 30 min to kill keeper...

[Inching]

what i want to see is 5 level 50 mages all with Keeper staffs.... I did a run with 2 other lvl 50 mages with keeper staffs... OMG it was like cutting butter with a hot knife..... If I can get together all 5 of us with keepers... that would rock~!!!

Also in PvP... 5 whatevers vs 5 Mages with Keepers....

[Lesrider]

what i want to see is 5 level 50 mages all with Keeper staffs.... I did a run with 2 other lvl 50 mages with keeper staffs... OMG it was like cutting butter with a hot knife..... If I can get together all 5 of us with keepers... that would rock~!!!

Also in PvP... 5 whatevers vs 5 Mages with Keepers....

Invite me next time. I have a keeper's staff. Didn't even really need to use it, though, because the wand was doing just fine.

[Inching]

Invite me next time. I have a keeper's staff. Didn't even really need to use it, though, because the wand was doing just fine.

keeper at 230 damage unbuffed and 250 buffed.... the equation is:

[(250 X 5) + (AOE X 5) + (Hot Flash combo X 5) + (Spam Heals X 5) = Carnige in record time

[Lesrider]

keeper at 230 damage unbuffed and 250 buffed.... the equation is:

[(250 X 5) + (AOE X 5) + (Hot Flash combo X 5) + (Spam Heals X 5) = Carnige in record time

Lol sure, I'm sold. Let's try it out before mages get Nerfed. I'm done for the night, though, so will have to be tomorrow.

[Kalielle]

I think the recharge time for bird mediation should be decreased to match the recharge times of other sills, and to sustain the mana needed for the new recharge times. I played a lot today on my level 47 (now 50) bird in the keeper map and I was always out of mana and using pots. I was wearing a level 50 Isis, one level 50 Thoth, and variuos purple/green level 47-49 ao3 bows. I am a full dex build and I admit I have only one point in meditation. Still, it doesn't seem that at my level and wearing decent gear I should have been always completely out of mana, as I was. And it also felt inconsistent to look at my sklls and always see meditation not charged, when all the other skills were. Makes no sense that health regen skill should recharge much faster when for that we have mage heals to supvplement it, whereas for meditation there's no substitute and I assume you do expect birds to be using skills all the time (and that means mana), especially now that weapons were nerfed. Its not that I'm concerned about the cost of pots, especially now with the new gold and weapon rates, but it just doesn't feel very strategic to be drinking mana all the time. It feels like I must be doing something wrong. Spamming meditation instead of mana pots would make more sense to me.

[TwinkTastical]

K, today i gave it a chance... Heres my POSITIVE FEEDBACK

Elves heal way too much, with these new weapon speeds, my damage per 6 seconds "heal cooldown" was totally negated by the next heal... elves at lv19 are literally, impossible to kill. Freeze also lasts wayyy to long

Auto attack button is messed up, doesnt work, stops mid attack.

Daggers need a bit more speed... or damage.

Nightmare proc doesnt work.

Thx, hope you guys consider these, tried not to be negative.

[duhchi]

Any advice for stats for a tank bear after the update? Should I put any into dex? NM I think I got it now.

[mugen]

devs thanks for the increased gold and trash drops i need the gold ! lol but i think the wepon speeds could be increased a little. i feel like im not doin any thing while in the fight. but other wise i like the re balance. it makes us have to use team work again. thats allways good. 4-5 stars
afterthought the attack button dosent work allways a fix please ? thx

[Torrentula81]

I'm taking a week long break to see if things get better. Getting borring just button mashing beccause my weapon is there for looks. Armor attributes accross pieces are essentially the same thing. Oooh, I get to choose from 1ms 2hs or 2ms 1hs. Doesn't even matter at the meager boost is gives. Wy have 5 different sets where they are all 1 point different. Why? Yay I got 5 more stat points for lvling up. Means I get 1 more dps for all my hard work. Thats it. No hit or crit, dodge, just 1 whole dps for my 5 points. My armor from 10 lvls ago is essentially the exact same thing available now minus 2 armor. Otherwise, identical. My skills arent getting any stronger as I lvl but enemies sure are. So with all this you have RUINED the whole point of leveling.

Top that off im just like every other bird nomatter what armor im wearing or skills I've chosen. Mmo's are about creating chatecter. Not playing one like a story where its predetermined what I'll be.

You dropped the ball and refuse to revert. Could you just seriously think about what you have done only then fix things. Not fix as we go. Come up with a plan and tell us what it is. Not hunt and peck patch here and there and just see what it will be like a month from now. Let us know what is your plan so I choose to quit or keep playing. I feel this is one sided. Your asking whats wrong, not what is your opinion maybe we will try a different approach.

You havent asked lets vote. Keep going this dirrection or,try something new.

[SpeedWeed]

those complaining about weapon speeds is kinda funny.

a slower swing doesn't mean u do less damage.

note: damage reduction is still damage - armor = actual damage.

the dps shown does not equate to the actual numbers due to the way armor works.

they're still in the process of reworking the system. I think mobs are fine. But the bosses and mini bosses in AO3 need some nerfing.

Our high hp can negate the lack of utter lack of dodge and lower armor. But we need the enchantresses in our group to heal. Which means we really need our mages to heal on a regular basis now to survive. Restore skill for bird and bear needs to be reworked to restore a 10-15%+ (the amount of str) we need it to survive.

[Inching]

Stop with the negative feedback, no one knows u personally and no one is our friends here... when enough players quit and the revenue drops.. it will go back to normal. walk the walk and dont just talk the talk.

Nothing anyone of us can do except to stop paying which is the biggest hit we will do and then I guarentee we will get the reversion back or some sort of fix to please the community.

Giving feedback is fine but I dont see the need to go all personal and offensive to the Devs or anyone... as I said, stop paying and they will fix it. You can continue to play if you wish but any expansion or anything they add we dont pay, ... trust me, you will get what you want... I swear 80% of this feedback thread is not feedback but jsut ranting... present company included so we all need to stop. No need to hurt anyone's feelings or tell the Devs how they didnt think it through... for the last time, jsut stop paying, it will be fixed.

Lastly, Silence is golden… if ur so mad that u are considering to stop then stop posting. Nothing more damaging then pure zero feedback and revenue stops.

[Protank]

Ya i just played pve for 3 hours straight. Im trying to stay positive. I really am. I just really wish this update didnt happen. I didnt think the game was broke. Ya sure some things were not perfect but it wasnt broke. Now i feel its broke. I did ao3 runs and nightmare runs on my bear mostly. My bear is nurfed so bad i dont see the point of having the class anymore, seems useless, mage was way overpowered and well bird, well geez idk. I just feel like im tap mashing my skills and i keep dieing on my bear if mage isnt spaming heals. I never died on my bear at nightmares unless i got really careless and now im like mush in there. Im really bummed out. Devs plz fix this.
So my feedback is revert. Revert and just tweek a few things.
Also why the need to change all the loot? To make better loot for lvl100s? Just has never happend b4 on any other mmo that i know of and i just dont think it was nesseary. Plz plz plz make my ursan a tank again. I dont care if i cant deal dmg. Just let me tank again. Revert imo.

I pvp'd on my bear twinks and i still had fun on them.

[Lebowski]

So i respeced my bird the other day after this major update. Trying to balance out DEX and STR. Ended up having more str than dex so I made a war with some leftover gear I have. So far I am really liking the build. I am lasting a ton longer in AO3 than I ever did. No more 1hit from snipers is great too. I am really liking this for now

[giayuan]

really no comment -______-
isis now gives more mp regen..and not a lot either...by like one
im confused now

[maneut]

Ya i just played pve for 3 hours straight. Im trying to stay positive. I really am. I just really wish this update didnt happen. I didnt think the game was broke. Ya sure some things were not perfect but it wasnt broke. Now i feel its broke. I did ao3 runs and nightmare runs on my bear mostly. My bear is nurfed so bad i dont see the point of having the class anymore, seems useless, mage was way overpowered and well bird, well geez idk. I just feel like im tap mashing my skills and i keep dieing on my bear if mage isnt spaming heals. I never died on my bear at nightmares unless i got really careless and now im like mush in there. Im really bummed out. Devs plz fix this.
So my feedback is revert. Revert and just tweek a few things.
Also why the need to change all the loot? To make better loot for lvl100s? Just has never happend b4 on any other mmo that i know of and i just dont think it was nesseary. Plz plz plz make my ursan a tank again. I dont care if i cant deal dmg. Just let me tank again. Revert imo.

I pvp'd on my bear twinks and i still had fun on them.

Hmm.. you must have been playing your bear wrongly, just to prove that bears wasn't so bad after the patch. I log in my INT bear and survived an entire Victory Lap with a bunch of pickups with less than 5 deaths.. also I only had 60 armor on my INT bear :) and I'm using a keeper staff so I generate a fair amount of hate. Just have to time the evade and iron blood properly now, and know when to stomp, beckon etc.

[Dip]

On items,

Thoth should be 3 mana zero hp regen... Isis should be opposite..

Osiris conq and hours should hv none....else this makes Isis and Thoth useless in game..

It's so easy now that ao3 became ao2 and you don't even need a mynas gen noob to figure it out....

Make it harder by 30% .

[Rashkar]

K wow,

Literally played for about 7 hours or so today. Lvled a bird from 35-40 and
Ran victory lap about 20 times. Time to stop complaining everyone. It seemed really balanced and both my bird and my bear were REALLY fun to play and nothitnmwas
Overly hard or easy.

Only suggestion I have left is to finish tweaking the wpns so that some highervl ones don't end up being worse such as in thE case of most two hand weapons including some ballistas and bows/guns.

Also i feel that threat is really hard to keep with a bear so I propose this:
- add in a high aggro generating combo (similar to cruel shot and terror) that a bear can perform on his own. My suggestion would be taunt and then hellscream or vice
Versa. This would allow bears to generate some more aggro and keep the
Bosses from running around the room half a fight as the mages and birds
Kit them lol.

Other than that from experience and from watching others
All day today, seems like classes are all doing their jobs well aside from the aggro thing for bears

Ps: hope this msg doesn't look messed up,'typed it on iphone

[Ellyidol]

K wow,

Literally played for about 7 hours or so today. Lvled a bird from 35-40 and
Ran victory lap about 20 times. Time to stop complaining everyone. It seemed really balanced and both my bird and my bear were REALLY fun to play and nothitnmwas
Overly hard or easy.

Only suggestion I have left is to finish tweaking the wpns so that some highervl ones don't end up being worse such as in thE case of most two hand weapons including some ballistas and bows/guns.

Also i feel that threat is really hard to keep with a bear so I propose this:
- add in a high aggro generating combo (similar to cruel shot and terror) that a bear can perform on his own. My suggestion would be taunt and then hellscream or vice
Versa. This would allow bears to generate some more aggro and keep the
Bosses from running around the room half a fight as the mages and birds
Kit them lol.

Other than that from experience and from watching others
All day today, seems like classes are all doing their jobs well aside from the aggro thing for bears

Ps: hope this msg doesn't look messed up,'typed it on iphone

Totally agree on bear aggro. This would make them feel less "useless", even if they are far from it, and would keep people from complaining why mages/birds are so soft or they are dying too fast, when the tanks would be able to do their job well.

[Designalt]

I've been playing this game for a long time now, my opinion of the update is possative, my bear is far better now then before, the game does not seem so reliant on pots and I can tank like a mofo I'm 50 in full rift and it works well, I can't speak for lower levels or equip but in my current state the game feels better more like pre ao3 which messed the game up hugely IMO the best the game ever was, was when swamps first came out it felt more like you needed tactics and a ballenced team it's getter more like that now, so kudos to the devs. My only gripe with the game is drop rates and the stupid new shop menu scolling does not work well!

[Ellyidol]

I have one more suggestion to the mage class, well all classes in general but mage specifically. Its the healing/restoring spells. Right now I heal 111-239 at 296 Int. I was with a dex bird earlier with 550 HP (with my buff, and full dex) and it heals him for about 1/4 of his HP, if not a bit more. It seemed decent when it caps at 200ish heal, but very low with anything below 150. Pots even out heal it I believe. It then got me to testing it to a bear that had 700ish HP (full rift, but not full Str). The healing didn't do as well as I hoped despite the full int. Same with hp/mana restore skills of birds/bears, they still do a specific figure even after the increase in hp/mana pool, which makes them really really insignificant.

Suggestion is, for the heal of mages and restore of mana/health skills of bears/archers to be put as percentage points instead of actual figures. It'd have a more consistent heal and would scale accordingly to health. This aligns with the current rebalance to make headroom for future better gear, percentage points would deal with the heal remaining constant in the future even when health pools reach thousands if ever. Same thing with the restore mana/health skills of bears/archers. :)

I was thinking of figures. I'm not too certain with this, but potions heal 25% of hp/mana? Since when I die and revive with half hp/mp, I usually need two pots of each to fill me up again. So for the heal of mages, I suggest about 30-35% heal to make it a little, but not too much, more superior than pots. And as for the restore skills of the other classes, maybe at about 20%.

[Fyrce]

I will not be able to play extensively until probably this weekend, maybe Sunday. However, I managed to log in my L13 dex bear and my L19 STR bird and there were no problems with either of them finishing up some quests and doing some fighting. My dex bear did have to rescue a str bear a few times because for some reason the str bear kept trying to die. However, a few stomps and stuns and the str bear started to follow along. After that, we killed trolls very well. I used some mana pots, hardly any hp pots. We actually were in full groups, but again, at this level, hardly anyone uses their skills. The other birds just blast shot, if anything at all. Mages sometimes heal, when the stars are aligned or something.

I'm starting to think it's interesting to watch the weapon attacks go off. I'm experimenting with various weapons but that's not too awful or anything. I do think that rarity ought to indicate desirability/effectiveness/whatever-you-want-to-call-it. I also think maybe all the EQ just grant a few too many attribute/stat boosts. 5 or 6 stat changes for pinks? or was it more? That seems like a lot. And then what will you do for level 100 EQ? So I would hope that rebalancing EQ means a new EQ stats table as well for each level and each rarity and that stats boosts become rarer and therefore more needed. Of course, there should still be a bonus for elite items.

As an aside: I mostly group and play in groups. I can solo at home, without logging on. I mostly log on to socialize and play (nicely) with others. I have no idea whether that makes a difference in whether people like the update or not.

[supremo502]

Just lower the speed of the range weapons and I'll be good, 2.7 crossbows are too slow!! or give add a rapid fire on "Focus" spell

[Riccits]

Lol so it seems that the perfect team now is 2 Mage, 1 pally, 2 birds. With a more balanced team that included bears, bosses took much longer to kill. But we did like 8 rounds with no bears and all the mobs and bosses went down so fast. Guess I'm back to being a Mage again and my bear is going back into hibernation. Mages can tank, so really no use for a bear that has to chase enemies around.

Funny that you guys were going for balance (what you almost had before
-- 2 bear, 2 bird, 1 Mage used to be a great setup), but ended up killing an entire class. I guess it doesn't bother me much since I have one of each and every time one gets nerfed I'll just use a different one. But I do fell sorry for all the players who only focused on a bear.

We got some good loot, too, tonight (I'm sure some will still consider it cheating -- you know who you are).

So while I am having fun again destroying mobs with my mage, it seems ridiculously easy. No strategy needed.

That's my initial reaction to today's update. Keep in mind, I thought of holding this back because I knoe you guys will probably nerf the mages now. And then it'll be back to taking 30 min to kill keeper...

yep with the right team (wich includes stille a MB :)) kepper is death before he gots shield up LOL, mages can hold agro now... no pot needed for tanking..
yellows are now like mobs in balefort, with the combo ice+fire blast they loose halth of theyr health.. clearing with some mages is faster then ever!
love my mage now :)

[derricks2]

Devs,

Here is my constructive feedback.

I played a couple hours today at levels 11-14. Here are my findings:

Caster > Birds in AOE DPS for sure. however....
Caster > Birds in single target DPS too.

My auto attack hits for 20ish to 30 ish with crits up to 65ish. I have focus @ 5 and blast shot @ 5. I am full dex. My Blast Shot at 5 does like 74 to 107 leaving max crit around 214 for that spell.

During my runs everyone in the game was usually between 10-15 and it seemed consistent that caster use that lightning spell that does great dmg with great range for AOE. This is fine by me, but for single target mobs I frequently would see hits crit for 330+ dmg(that were done by casters it seems). I was not able to pull agro off the casters and my 30dmg normal hits and 80-100(180-200crits) dmg blasts were not competing with the 150-300+ dmg that I see above larger mobs heads.

The way I see it is casters have a ton of utility with ability to heal group, rezz group, has best aoe. Casters are a "area" based character and should be #1 in AOE dps, but they also are valuable because of what they do for the rest of the group.

Birds on the other hand, outside of a couple short debuffs, are dps.. thats it. Birds should be way better at single target DPS the way casters are better at AOE. This does not seem to be the case.

This is just perception. A suggestion for something pretty simple to add would be a dmg parser. I know with EQ, EQ2 and WOW that dmg parsing is big. It helps for feedback to you, it helps to know where you stand vs other people in your group etc..your could add a screen, keep the stats server side, and display stats for each player that entered that game. Lowest hit, Highest non-crit, Highest crit, Total damage, average dmg per hit, Overall DPS, total kills etc... for each person. Then I can have actual stats to give you(eg Caster XXXX crit at 350dmg max at lvl 12 and had 13dps higher than me for the game.. etc). Also I can use this to improve how I play the game from now on. Just a thought.

Conclusion, I think that bird single target dps needs improved. It may be different at 50 with pinked out gear, but at 11-14 with basic drop/bought gear, mages out damage birds in both AOE and single target ATM. Lowering base speed back down 50% on bows would fix that. Keep the dmg down but increase the speed. This way only auto attack damage is effected and auto attack is only ever single target. Just a suggestion.

[Protank]

Hmm.. you must have been playing your bear wrongly, just to prove that bears wasn't so bad after the patch. I log in my INT bear and survived an entire Victory Lap with a bunch of pickups with less than 5 deaths.. also I only had 60 armor on my INT bear :) and I'm using a keeper staff so I generate a fair amount of hate. Just have to time the evade and iron blood properly now, and know when to stomp, beckon etc.

Ok your comparing a int bear to a strength bear.

[Derajdefyre]

I hit level 20 last night and I had a really great time. With a balanced group who uses their skills things die fast and don't do much (if any) damage. I also started focusing more on my defensive skills which allowed me to be much more of a tank. I had to spend platinum on respecs to test out the different skills, which I think is not really fair considering all the changes. I really thought that we would be allowed to respec skills as well as statistics.

The optimal skill builds while leveling up have greatly changed. Before it was best to max out a few skills, now it is best to have as many damage dealing skills as possible while maxing buffs/debuffs. The downside is that if people are not using debuffs constantly it spells certain doom. Then again, I guess if you haven't learned how to play the game by level 15 then you shouldn't move on until you have. Now that I have at least a single point in all my offensive skills I do not feel like I attack too slowly. I do, however, keenly notice the fact that I recently traded 2M/s armor for 2H/s armor. I might need to change back!

I have noticed that the majority of complaints seem to come from people who think that any class should be able to be speced to fill the role of any other class. I personally do not agree with this. From your vision of making a game with "meaningful class based combat" I am guessing you agree. The shop interface that categorizes all swords and heavy armor under "warrior" also suggests you agree. If you want to allow a bear to spec towards intelligence and use caster items, why not categorize those items under "intelligence" instead? If you want people to focus on what their class is supposed to be, simply don't allow them to wear items that belong to other classes. Then again, you are making money off of people who waffle over statistic specializations so business wise that would have a negative impact.

I am slowly leaving the realm of well thought out feedback and entering the realm of rambling, so I'll stop for now.

[Datecrepe]

K wow,

Literally played for about 7 hours or so today. Lvled a bird from 35-40 and
Ran victory lap about 20 times. Time to stop complaining everyone. It seemed really balanced and both my bird and my bear were REALLY fun to play and nothitnmwas
Overly hard or easy.

Only suggestion I have left is to finish tweaking the wpns so that some highervl ones don't end up being worse such as in thE case of most two hand weapons including some ballistas and bows/guns.

Also i feel that threat is really hard to keep with a bear so I propose this:
- add in a high aggro generating combo (similar to cruel shot and terror) that a bear can perform on his own. My suggestion would be taunt and then hellscream or vice
Versa. This would allow bears to generate some more aggro and keep the
Bosses from running around the room half a fight as the mages and birds
Kit them lol.



+1 I like the idea of making Taunt part of a bear hate generating combo.

[brodby]

I pretty much never contribute to these types of things, but felt really compelled to offer some feedback. I am a super casual player and always had a really tough time with AO3. Pre-update I would always get booted from games with my lvl 48/49 characters (not pissed, just a fact), or try to run the level with a sub-par group of random people. It took me quite a while to clear all the levels b/c the group would always fail massively at the bosses (esp keeper and overlord) and then just fall apart. I think the only reason I EVER cleared AO3 was b/c a super good player let a few of us mediocre players ride his coattails (jjangmah if memory serves, thanks!)

After the update, random groups get bogged down less in mobs, and at least have a shot at killing the boss. Especially if you work together. Honestly, I have a lot more fun playing AO3 now than I ever did before. Seriously, besides some minor complaints about equipment, I think this update is really pretty cool. Nice work!

[CanonicalKoi]

After a few days of playing with it, I don't mind the changes much. The slower fire rate on my bow isn't swell, but I'll deal. There seem to be a few glitchy areas--one I already posted in the Bugs thread, the other I'll add in a few. Other than that, the increased drop of green rares is more of a pain than anything. They're not really sellable items, you can only give so many away in a day and not that many people want them. Those newbies that do want them, can't use them and soon discover there's lots better stuff available. About the only change I'd like to see (to go along with the update) is to raise the number of items you can have in your inventory and still join someone. It seems weird to be able to have be able to increase your inventory, have increased drop rates and still have that 100 item cap to join. :/

[Lesrider]

Liquidate greens before you leave the game so you can join the next one. There really is no point in holding onto them.

[CanonicalKoi]

Liquidate greens before you leave the game so you can join the next one. There really is no point in holding onto them.

I try, but holy crap, there's a lot of them. :D

[Lesrider]

We all kinda asked for that so we wouldn't be losing money in ao3. There used to be so few drops that it wouldn't even make up for the health pots used. But now they Nerfed the enemies AND gave us more loot, so coming up ahead here.

It is a bit frustrating if the next game is made too quickly. I try to tell the host to wait a minute before making but they don't always listen.

[Steverd]

OK, played my level 45 Mage last night in "Crush the Keeper" For about two hours and
I must admit, it was actually very fun. Especially if you have more than one Mage. I was able to level up
pretty fast.

Although I like playing my Bear instead, which is just still too slow and too weak and now too boring.
Please add some strength, back to the Bears.

Steverd

[dirtball]

OK, played my level 45 Mage last night in "Crush the Keeper" For about two hours and
I must admit, it was actually very fun. Especially if you have more than one Mage. I was able to level up
pretty fast.

Although I like playing my Bear instead, which is just still too slow and too weak and now too boring.
Please add some strength, back to the Bears.

Steverd

I wish I couls agree, but my lvl 49 mage, who I gave up on a while back due to one shots, is simply way too powerful now. Just button mashing as we go thru. Team with 1 bear, 1 archer, and 3 mages took out everything no problem. Keeper presented little challenge as we simply stood there and took his blows without much problem. Took 4 minutes to kill him. Maybe had 3-4 deaths but with 3 mages that was no issue. I have begun to enjoy actually needing pulling skills with my bear. This update took the problems with mages in the opposite direction. They now are the leaders in a group.

[Halfstar]

I hate this!!!!!!!!!!!
50% armor down? WTF im quiting if this isen't fixxed

[Halfstar]

Come on! at leas speed this up!! boring now

[Halfstar]

Kills still seem too quick though.
WTF whats wrong with you
(coudnt find out how too comment on somones post

[SamTheDog]

Haven't played with my main tank much, just don't care for the PUG's I've been running into in AO3. I've played my lv 33 alt tank a lot in the swamps and these are my thoughts...
1. Even solo or with another tank, I still do pretty well on trash mobs. Balancing made me change tactics slightly, but I barely touched pots. With a full group, it was a breeze. "Sigh", the swamps are no longer the challange they used to be.

2. Wow, mages rock. Me and 3 mages ran the swamps without a death. Any of us. And I got the feeling that the 3 of them could have done it without any help. Crocs were falling over dead as soon as they were in range. With beckon and stomp nerfed, the mage is almost as good a tank as the tank.

3. It used to be isis = health, toth = mana, now both = a little of both. As a tank, I really miss the extra health I used to have. I've gotten over it, but I do miss it.

On the whole, my mage will reap the benefits of the current balancing act, and I could take it or leave it for my tank.

[Halfstar]

Thank u so much eaxactly. Fix this my tank all STR lvl47 dies in AO2 trash mobs. i know lvl47 but still!?

[Lesrider]

The crocs aren't the only one's who die easily mow. All of ao3 is a joke with a few mages (haven't tested out my other two chars yet bc I didn't really see a point if my Mage does such a good job). I think they took the challenge out of the game, especially ao3. No strategy required anymore -- just go in and mash buttons. A group of three mages and two birds were even able to attack sniper, lorekeeper and the third mini boss (name slips my mind at the moment) with rarely a death. Used to be even bears would have trouble with the Snipers. Now they pose no threat.

It Might be fun like this for a little while, blasting through the whole victory lap in a few minutes. But it will likely get boring soon. Needs more depth.

[CanonicalKoi]

We all kinda asked for that so we wouldn't be losing money in ao3.

Sigh. True, that. Be careful what you wish for, I guess. ;)

[Rashkar]

what was the most recent change?

[Dip]

no mroe free respecs

[Lesrider]

Oh man... I thought they'd last longer -- didn't use any. So does this mean the changes/nerfs are done? Wouldn't be fair to change them again without the free Respecs.

Does this mean the 'test period' is over and you guys are happy with the outcome? I'm a bit surprised if that's the case. Guess I'll just enjoy my god-like Mage.

[krazii]

The crocs aren't the only one's who die easily mow. All of ao3 is a joke with a few mages (haven't tested out my other two chars yet bc I didn't really see a point if my Mage does such a good job). I think they took the challenge out of the game, especially ao3. No strategy required anymore -- just go in and mash buttons. A group of three mages and two birds were even able to attack sniper, lorekeeper and the third mini boss (name slips my mind at the moment) with rarely a death. Used to be even bears would have trouble with the Snipers. Now they pose no threat.

It Might be fun like this for a little while, blasting through the whole victory lap in a few minutes. But it will likely get boring soon. Needs more depth.

Exactly, game is for casual gamer now, no strategy required, run through zone, blast away, kill everything, no tank required.

[Ellyidol]

Exactly, game is for casual gamer now, no strategy required, run through zone, blast away, kill everything, no tank required.

Yeah tanks are less of use, but they still are pretty good. They speed up the game heaps and take away having to die most of the time especially from mages. Would always prefer at least one in group.

[TwinkTastical]

Exactly, game is for casual gamer now, no strategy required, run through zone, blast away, kill everything, no tank required.

Does this mean... devs are gonna make us time limits!?!?!! -is scared-

[Ellyidol]

Does this mean... devs are gonna make us time limits!?!?!! -is scared-

I don't think so :P If ever, its going to be long enough for a group of lower levelled, lower geared people to complete, so definitely long enough for capped and well geared. Maybe an elite dungeon with time limits! :O

[Gryndeon]

Played my level 50 mage and bear after the new update.

All I can say is.... The bear is back, baby! My bear was getting ready for a long winter alone in a cave somewhere, but today I dusted him out and had fun playing him again.

It's so nice to have my beckon back. I still have trouble keeping aggro when the mages and birds run around with the boss chasing them, but that's not much different from before all the tweaking started.

The mobs (at least in Victory Lap) take longer to kill solo, but combos seem to fix that. This definitely encourages more teamwork. Haven't tried the other maps except Crush the Keeper. There I found that my mage can still tank the mobs with the poor bear lagging behind. I know what it was like to try to beckon the mob into the corner, only to find all the mummies dead and the mages halfway through the map already.

I think that maybe the mobs need to be hardened up a little bit. The original Keeper mobs really got the teams working together because they were more difficult to kill. The current ones, not so much. Haven't tried the new Captive Audience, but playing yesterday with 4 level 50 mages, we pretty much just split up to kill the mobs and met up where T'Paxx was. They were that easy. Might just as well bring back the rush because this is just a slower, grindier version of it.

Back to Victory Lap, the pace of the game is also better. The weapon speed (scimitar) doesn't quite feel like wading through molasses anymore. Will try a few more runs tonight, but my tank is definitely no longer sulking.

Oh. And thanks, devs. I know we gave you guys a hard time. But we only do it because we care. ;)

[derricks2]

Devs more bird feedback:

Leveled a couple more times today. Same thing.. I cant pull agro off mages who are only AOEing. This means that their AOE dmg > Bird single target damage. I can dump skill/auto attacks and not pull boss/individual mobs off mages spamming AOE.

Again this is the 15-17 level range. Dex bird. 5 focus, 5 blast shot, 5 med.

I realize we shouldnt be able to keep up on a group of mobs with casters, but on a boss, our DPS SHOULD be able to pull off a mage(not a tank with taunts) who is just DPSing. Now, after several games I still cannot. I do decent damage do MOBS and can solo them with a full game even, but mages aoe dps is still higher than bird single target dps.

On bosses that take a bit to kill, a bird should have the DPS advantage easy. Archers = strong single target, weak vs group, casters(should be)= strong vs group, weaker vs single target(especially since they get heals and rezzes too).

Please re-evaluate bird Single target dps. As it is I cannot really see any point in even having a bird in a group. Strongest group would likely be a combo of casters and bears(to tank)as casters do overall more dps and the heal/rez/dmg out weighs any debuff birds have(again at my level). Raising auto attack damage, or reducing bow speeds back would riase only out single target dps a little. Just a thought.


P.s. makes you wonder if the devs actually see your post. I know they cant respond to every person who trys to give good feedback, but sometimes it feels like with 30+ pages your posts may just get "skimmed through" /shrug Keep up the good work and fix the game devs!

[Justg]

We read every one... thanks for the great feedback and please keep it coming!

[icantgetkills]

We read every one... thanks for the great feedback and please keep it coming!

There's 300+ replies how much feed back do u want :P

[Justg]

Always more :)

[Ellyidol]

@^

I agree with how birds should have higher DPS on a single target vs the crowd DPS of a mage. They should probably get higher spike damage skills? Or just generate more hate. But I think more than mage/bird aggro, that tanks should be able to get the aggro most of all. Right now it goes Mage - Bird - Bear in terms of aggro.

Also, on a different note, I have a thought on the new ease of Ao3. I totally understand and agree with it since it closes the gap between geared and capped players vs new emerging ones. This makes it easier for the lower levels and such to "catch up".

I suggest an elite dungeon targeted for the capped players. This dungeon should be hard enough for only the cap/geared players to do, and have some unique drops available only from it. Furthermore, these unique items from the campaign, should be binded to player. If its gonna be trade-able, it makes the Ao3 campaign useless since everyone will then be aiming to buy the new elite dungeon loot instead of actually doing the dungeon, then creating a gap again between the rich and the poor. If binding cannot be done, very rare drops of these items would also suffice. :)

Other than that, I'm VERY happy with the rebalance. 9.99/10 for me. Until another balance or update comes, thats my review (together with previous posts ofc). :)

[noobmigo]

Yeh, birds need more agro. Make it real and have 'em taste like chicken. Then all the enemies will come and kill us. (the birds) Give us agro!!!

[noobmigo]

well, in terms of pulling a mob of a mage.

[Rashkar]

Gear that binds:
-for this to work u gotta implement a system that allows divying up of loot that isn't random then so that each class gets their respective gear when it drops otherwise people are gonna be gettin stupid amounts of random gear that they can't use or sell. I don't think binding gear works on this game, it isn't wow. The game isn't soffisticated enough for this.

[Ellyidol]

Gear that binds:
-for this to work u gotta implement a system that allows divying up of loot that isn't random then so that each class gets their respective gear when it drops otherwise people are gonna be gettin stupid amounts of random gear that they can't use or sell. I don't think binding gear works on this game, it isn't wow. The game isn't soffisticated enough for this.

Touche. Didn't think of that. Not really aiming to make the game more complex, just a method of avoiding of making Ao3 "useless" or less sought after if a new elite dungeon is made. :)

[noobmigo]

I also noticed something. The mages, with full BOV, had MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more crit than a bird. you tell me, is a mage meant to have crit? maybe? Now, you explain to me why amazing awesome sniping archer has 1/3 of the crit of a mage that already deals enough dmg.

[Rashkar]

Anyways I wouldn't change much more for now.... The game rox even more than before and I don't even play Mage. (which are arguably the only thing left a BIT unbalanced)

[Ellyidol]

Anyways I wouldn't change much more for now.... The game rox even more than before and I don't even play Mage. (which are arguably the only thing left a BIT unbalanced)

Fully agree. I'm hoping this satisfied state stays though, we all know how fast the community changes opinion :P

[jonboy]

Hey maybe they can even take their flame retardant suits off as well.

[noobmigo]

PLUS!!!!!!!!!!! I don't see how people are complaining about if they didn't cut crit, there would be humongously big crit. Even if they didn't 'balance' it, the armor should go up. so, the armor will negate a lot of dmg added by crit, thus negating the effect of crit. i'm more of thinking about just, maybe, turning everything back to normal, and speed up the weps a teensy bit, and just tuning up the elves to the bear/archer lvl, so we don't have to go through all this tipsy turvy economical stuff and refinding a new build . I agree with people that the old destiny,fate,etc. are now amazing, and the really expensive amazing stuff now is down to the lvl of the old, suckish, items. So, my main point is to just tune up the ELVES, and keep everything else same.

[jonboy]

Elly, have the bosses drop a token/s, that you can take to an npc to purchase the epic item/s, make the tokens bindable on drop, you can even make it that you need x amount of tokens to get the gear, do the same thing with pvp, called them Aterra medalions of lore.

[derricks2]

Yeh, birds need more agro. Make it real and have 'em taste like chicken. Then all the enemies will come and kill us. (the birds) Give us agro!!!

Maybe you missed my point...

The point of saying "I cant pull agro off a caster" means between a caster and a bird, whoever has done the most damage to it will have the agro. If I can't pull the agro off the caster, I am NOT doing more damage to it than the caster.

I dont meant I WANT more agro, I just mean that if a caste and a bird of equal level/gear are the only 2 in the game, and we are on a boss by itself, the boss should be agro on the bird the whole time because agro will be determined by most damage dealt to it. As of now, the bosses always chase the casters which means they are out DPSing on single target as well as AOE.

To clarify, I dont WANT more agro, but in principle, I SHOULD be able to all out DPS and TAKE agro if I so choose to.

[Lesrider]

I'm enjoying my Mage again, but I have to say I feel bad for all the castrated bosses. They hardly put up a fight anymore. I remember even Plothozz could cause some problems if we didn't have proper teamwork and pinned him against a wall. Now the poor guy can be thrown about every which way and still die quick and easily.

And keeper, jeez, he's like a little puppy now.

I dunno why you Nerfed everything at once. If you wanted to make the bosses easier to kill, then there was no reason to make all the elite equipment equal to the common pinks. Bc now everyone can kill the bosses more easily and have more chances at the loot. I think you guys may have gone overboard by changing everything at once instead of trying one thing at a time (ie. Leave the equipment alone until you're done messing with all the classes and enemies). It's better than yesterday, when my Mage was a god. At least today I died a couple of times if I rushed into a mob too quickly.

I dunno, I kinda miss the challenging bosses. I liked that each one required a certain strategy that had to be mastered. Now they're all pretty much the same. Even Gurg doesn't seem to require orbs as often now.

Kinda silly that we sorta had an elite dungeon with Victory Lap but it got Nerfed. Does that mean you plan to make a separate elite dungeon and charge 20 plat for it? Hope not.

[Lesrider]

Actually, come to think of it, you guys claimed that ao3 was so awesome and worth the 20 plat. I really don't think we should have to pay for a harder dungeon now that you Nerfed the one we already paid for. How 'bout this: revert the victory lap bosses back to the way they were and give them some better loot that doesn't drop in the earlier levels. And fine, make them non-tradable so people won't just sell them. But I think the old victory lap challenges should still be available for those who want them, without having to pay extra for them. And give a bit of an incentive for choosing to play the harder bosses over the easy ones. Might this be a possibility?

[Ellyidol]

Elly, have the bosses drop a token/s, that you can take to an npc to purchase the epic item/s, make the tokens bindable on drop, you can even make it that you need x amount of tokens to get the gear, do the same thing with pvp, called them Aterra medalions of lore.

I like. Adds more reason and purpose to PvP. They can make those tokens like plat tokens, stackable and visible in the inventory menu. :)

[Rashkar]

Elly, have the bosses drop a token/s, that you can take to an npc to purchase the epic item/s, make the tokens bindable on drop, you can even make it that you need x amount of tokens to get the gear, do the same thing with pvp, called them Aterra medalions of lore.

This is an incredible idea for future endgame content.

+1

[Rashkar]

Lol there's always gonna be new content released. Ao3 is gonna be the equivalent of balefort castle in no time.... And obviously it's gonna cost 20 plat that's how the game works lol.

[Lesrider]

Lol there's always gonna be new content released. Ao3 is gonna be the equivalent of balefort castle in no time.... And obviously it's gonna cost 20 plat that's how the game works lol.

Sigh. I meant they shouldn't charge us 20 plat for an elite lvl 50 dungeon, since they just Nerfed the one we already paid for. Obviously they'll charge for the next map to lvl 55.

[Rashkar]

Sigh. I meant they shouldn't charge us 20 plat for an elite lvl 50 dungeon, since they just Nerfed the one we already paid for. Obviously they'll charge for the next map to lvl 55.

o crap...

sorry i misunderstood :P

[Lesrider]

No worries.... Just hope the devs understand me.

[Protank]

Last update helped. I cleared victory lap twice on ursan. With good grp. My tank was tanking, mages were spam'n heals and aoe dmg skills and bird did his thing. Wasnt alot of deaths for any one really. Was preatty ez. I only had to spam some hp pots on overlord. Would be nice if blood lasted a lil longer. Keep the updates coming. Im starting to see the light.

[jonboy]

Ok I've enjoyed these updates so much ive gone back to Int Mage, lots of fun.

[Protank]

Pvp seems alot more balanced then yesterday. Keep up the good work guys!

[Jsaieagle]

Pvp seems alot more balanced then yesterday. Keep up the good work guys!

Yes, no one really own! Depends on your fingers... lol

Good works dev!

[Designalt]

Played around a bit more in pve on my bear, it's all working great, only thing would be to make more hard cash drop rather then 101 trash items having to sell 200 items every few rounds is repetitive and messy. I also noticed the shop scrolling seems to work a lot better so thanks for that. Now you awesome bunch of devs please give us elite dungeon for ao, items won in pvp, and pets, my Christmas will be very merry :)

[bladesword]

you made the update so the fast fingers can rock..

[skimmey]

you made the update so the fast fingers can rock..

what do you mean with that ?^^

can you attack faster when you put auto attack off?

[Fyrce]

I got to do some more playing and over all, particularly with the recent update, I feel good about the direction of the game.

I finally leveled my lazy-hung-around-at-90%-to-level-50 bear, cleared Keeper and Captive Audience levels and had fun. I'm not sure it's better than before. It might be because the dungeons are easier to clear now; MUCH easier. Mummies, aliens died fast.

The bear might have gotten hit a bit more, but I'm not positive about that. I actually suspect in general, that he is getting hit less. Overall, I would say pot usage was WAY down, money gathering much better (net gain, instead of net loss after pot replacement). I would say Keeper was easier; he seemed almost like a normal boss. Mynas is WAY easier, both in level 2 and Victory. Hardly any deaths and we just damaged him to death. Hell, he chased my bear a few times while I was gathering the group: He popped in after the group had left because he wasn't there and while bear was trying out level 50 EQ and whacked bear a few times. Before the update(s), that would have meant bear FLAT! This time, I'm not even sure if bear had to pot. He just stomped and walked off and waited for the group to pop back. He got chased a few times, because Mynas came out further than I remembered, so bear got caught a few times, but no issues at all.

Gurgox seemed same, maybe a bit harder, but hard to tell. He can be hard even before if birdies aren't doing lots of damage and these two we had in that group did not seem like they did much debuffing, even when asked. The other bear did not help much with debuff, etc. Yellow aliens were barely an issue compared to before. There was some deaths when we ended up with too many of them but no group wipes. Oh, I was in one group that tried killing Gurgox and failed, but that group never got into damage dealing and preferred to just kite the guy about until everybody died. Go figure.

I thought survivability on the bear, as well as the bird and mage, was excellent. Oh, also did some Victory Lap runs. Did not pop anything interesting but the runs were not very stressful at all. And clearing the middle was MUCH easier.

I have also run my level 50 mage about, my level 50 bird about, my level 34 dex mage about, my level 19 str bird about, and got a bit of xp for one of my level 13s (dex bear). Everything seemed ok, quite fun actually. Might have been a bit harder on the str bird; not quite decided on him since he's a bit delicate for melee.

Overall, I would say the game is more playable. A level 30s group plowed through Bye Bayou and Boss Brawl, even careening into the 3 bosses together, right after killing goat guy, and then ran right into Frogmar. No deaths...hmm...maybe one mage died but not positive. It was fast. I'm not sure if that's good or bad Sometimes it's good to struggle and I wonder whether the new level teens and tweens and thirties are learning bad habits because they don't die as easily. It sure is fun to run through an area even as a low level though.

I did notice my level 20 pumpkin clunker was REALLY clunky. I think it's got a speed of 4.0. Pumpkins must be heavy. And in the swamp group, the bear (not me; another player) barely got in a hit. I'm not sure if he got to hit at all: the mages and birds were killing so fast. Oh, and where I used to see lots of 2-handed sword wielding lowbie bears, I think I maybe saw one. I'm guessing 2-handed's are really slow also. Maybe slow hitters ought to be more accurate and crit better...? It's very hard to dodge a giant wall falling on you Or a giant pumpkin. And they would hurt... a lot.

I even went and tried out Balefort with my mid-level dex mage just to see if she would die like the level 50 bear who posted. No such luck. LOL. Don't think I died once. Pity really. I even stood around a bit but for some reason I guess my health regen was higher than what they were hitting me for. LOL. And I'm a healer, too! My healing skills are rusting! Which reminds me: I was trying to heal a bear... and heal... and heal... and heal... I think it took like 4 heals to get him back to health and he was maybe 1/2 my level... Um... Maybe it's because I've only recently started to pump up this mage's int? Oh, since I did not get to play until pretty much Friday night, I did not do any respec'ing, etc, because what would I respec to, when I have no idea how things had changed? So now I'm thinking maybe I want to play with INT on that mage but... the free respecs are gone...? Aren't there lots of players who can really play only on weekends?

In conclusion, I like the rebalance though a few things might need tweaking. Or I might have to get used to them. It'd be nice to get the free respecs for longer because some of us have only started playing with the "new" game. And heal needs work. And slower weapons need something or no one will use them.

(And I haven't read through this entire thread yet, so if I repeat everyone's comments, please forgive me already. Thanks!)

[derricks2]

One other thing I would like to mention..

I am not sure how it was before the patch, but I think that damages on magical weapons and armor on magic armor.

For instance a Grey Platinum bow may do 25 - 37 dmg. A pink platinum bow will also do 25-37 damage, but just have a few mods like +dex and regens etc...

I would think epic grade gear would do more damage than the piece of crap laying alone the side of the road. This is in conjunction with the fact that (atleast for bows) all bows of a certain level do the same damage. So basically any level XX char is going to be using a weapon that is doing the exact same damage as any other level XX char of the same class. They may have a pink weapon and more regens and a couple more crit and hit chance, but our actual weapon damage is the same...

I kind of think that the damage of a weapon should improve as the magical level goes up. If a level grey XX platinum bow does 25-37 damage(im making all these numbers up) then a white XX platinum bow should do 26-38. A orange XX platinum bow 26-38. A green XX platinum bow 27-39. Purple 28-40. Pink you can jump even a little more since they are rare... like 30-42.

On a higher level like lvl 50(vs the lvl 20 stuff I am talking about) you can increase the invertals a little more to compensate for the higher base damage of weapons and armor values or armor.

This makes a rare item innately more useful, even if the stats suck a green bow is "better" than a grey or white bow.. as it should be...

Does this make sense? Agree or disagree?

[skimmey]

@^

I agree with how birds should have higher DPS on a single target vs the crowd DPS of a mage. They should probably get higher spike damage skills? Or just generate more hate. But I think more than mage/bird aggro, that tanks should be able to get the aggro most of all. Right now it goes Mage - Bird - Bear in terms of aggro.

Also, on a different note, I have a thought on the new ease of Ao3. I totally understand and agree with it since it closes the gap between geared and capped players vs new emerging ones. This makes it easier for the lower levels and such to "catch up".

I suggest an elite dungeon targeted for the capped players. This dungeon should be hard enough for only the cap/geared players to do, and have some unique drops available only from it. Furthermore, these unique items from the campaign, should be binded to player. If its gonna be trade-able, it makes the Ao3 campaign useless since everyone will then be aiming to buy the new elite dungeon loot instead of actually doing the dungeon, then creating a gap again between the rich and the poor. If binding cannot be done, very rare drops of these items would also suffice. :)

Other than that, I'm VERY happy with the rebalance. 9.99/10 for me. Until another balance or update comes, thats my review (together with previous posts ofc). :)
yea i like that idea especially with the binding items :)

[derricks2]

Devs,

I am a long time MMO player and I just recently picked this game up. I am more than happy to give you all all the feedback you can handle, but that also requires some feedback from you all.

I looked in the "in development" area and I see nothing, suggestions.. nothing, updates... nothing... even in this thread... nothing.

I dont mean you never respond, I mean to give you all good feedback, we need to know what you all are thinking too. If you are working on tweaking damage for some classes we can provide more details, if your not then say that so I can get data on something you are working on.

Does this make sense? This lets people know 1) you see what they are saying here and its being taken into consideration 2) if peoples suggestions are not being considered for future publish, and they think that their issues need attention, they can then go gather more data on their issue. Even outline in the post things that you need more data on.. something simple

Currently being worked on
XXXX (being addressed)
XXXX (being addressed)
XXXX (being addressed)
XXXX (being addressed)

YYY (being tested)
YYY (being tested)
YYY (being tested)

ZZZ (need more feedback please)
ZZZ (need more feedback please)

WWW (issues is condiered to be working as intended)
WWW (issues is condiered to be working as intended)

This lets people know they dont need to post on W, X or Y, because you are aware of and are working on those issues or have looked into the issue and don't consider it to be a issue. People concerned with Z can then go out and get even more specific data for you as they know the data you have is insufficient and you need more data on that specific issue before it can be addressed.

Is this something that you think can be done? You dont have to be specific with HOW your addressing the issues, just the things your working on and things that your not considering that people are talking about, and things that you need more info for. I just feel like while playing we can be looking for things as we play IF we knew what you needed data for.

[johnholley]

I have been reflecting and the rebalance is still unworkable for many. Why you might ask? Going through A03, I have yet to see a boss taken down by a group that hasn't included 1, or probably 2, lvl 50 folk. I have been there several times now with with groups (5-6) of of lvl 46+ characters and after 20-30 minutes we have still not taken down someone like the Keeper.

It would appear to me that if AO3 was like it is now, before there were any lvl 50 characters with all their nice equipment sets, no one would would have got through AO3!

So the question I have, is who has, with a group of non-level 50 characters, made it through Crush the Keeper? Is it possible?

If you can't get through a lower level part of AO3 without level 50 characters then the game is not balanced!

[Lesrider]

Omg seriously? All the bosses have been neutered. The keeper used to be a pitpull, now he's a toy poodle. People got through it before all the bosses were Nerfed, so they should definitely be able to do it now.
And I don't think it's so bad for a team of lvl 46's to need help from 1 or 2 lvl 50's to beat the hardest bosses in the game. It also takes practice (or at least it used to) to learn the bosses' weaknesses and get the teamwork just right.

God, if they make it any easier they might as well just forget about the bosses and put the loot under a Christmas tree for everyone to take.


I have been reflecting and the rebalance is still unworkable for many. Why you might ask? Going through A03, I have yet to see a boss taken down by a group that hasn't included 1, or probably 2, lvl 50 folk. I have been there several times now with with groups (5-6) of of lvl 46+ characters and after 20-30 minutes we have still not taken down someone like the Keeper.

It would appear to me that if AO3 was like it is now, before there were any lvl 50 characters with all their nice equipment sets, no one would would have got through AO3!

So the question I have, is who has, with a group of non-level 50 characters, made it through Crush the Keeper? Is it possible?

If you can't get through a lower level part of AO3 without level 50 characters then the game is not balanced!

[Ellyidol]

I have been reflecting and the rebalance is still unworkable for many. Why you might ask? Going through A03, I have yet to see a boss taken down by a group that hasn't included 1, or probably 2, lvl 50 folk. I have been there several times now with with groups (5-6) of of lvl 46+ characters and after 20-30 minutes we have still not taken down someone like the Keeper.

It would appear to me that if AO3 was like it is now, before there were any lvl 50 characters with all their nice equipment sets, no one would would have got through AO3!

So the question I have, is who has, with a group of non-level 50 characters, made it through Crush the Keeper? Is it possible?

If you can't get through a lower level part of AO3 without level 50 characters then the game is not balanced!

Bosses were even harder before the update and we were able to get through the levels. Its like your asking how we got through Ao3 when it just came out, and obviously most people did with no 50 gear or even level 50 yet.

[maneut]

I have been reflecting and the rebalance is still unworkable for many. Why you might ask? Going through A03, I have yet to see a boss taken down by a group that hasn't included 1, or probably 2, lvl 50 folk. I have been there several times now with with groups (5-6) of of lvl 46+ characters and after 20-30 minutes we have still not taken down someone like the Keeper.

It would appear to me that if AO3 was like it is now, before there were any lvl 50 characters with all their nice equipment sets, no one would would have got through AO3!

So the question I have, is who has, with a group of non-level 50 characters, made it through Crush the Keeper? Is it possible?

If you can't get through a lower level part of AO3 without level 50 characters then the game is not balanced!

It may means that the people you are with may not be playing their characters correctly? The bosses are so much easier now.. regarding keeper.. my tips for you :)
1. clear all minions
2. when his shield is up, use normal attacks.
3. When his shield goes down, spam all your combos and damage spells/skills.

Good luck! :)

[Ellyidol]

And just run around when his shield is up. There's really no use tanking him or damaging him when he doesn't take any at all. :P

[CanonicalKoi]

Or, stick whoever has aggro on the bridge with the Keeper on the other side of a gap. Since neither he or we can shoot over the voids, the person with aggro lock doesn't have to spam pots and nobody has to run all over.

[Eaglety]

lol sorry to change the topic in the conversation.

My biggest complaint on the update is it made the game boring. I really have no clue about numbers or anything admitedly, but I do know the firing rates (DPS?) is too low IMHO. I know I have one crossbow that has a 2.7 second delay, this makes the fights too slow and boring :/ Honestly I haven't played since the update because of this.

[Protank]

Cinco and devs. Needs minor tweeking (need to buff bears and debuff mages a lil imo) but New gameplay is a blast. Im having fun on low and high lvl toons. And Thats what this game has always been about, having fun! So keep up the good work guys. Updates and patches rule the world and always are for the good of the game imo.
Check out this pic. 5000+ players on. Everyday i look its going up.
Facebook 10000+ likes. Grats guys!
http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa471/Farmingmule/5ed8cfb5.jpg

[Ellyidol]

@Devs

Is there any chance you could confirm or forewarn us if the last update was the final one or if we should expect more? Personally I've been holding off with selling/buying until updates settle. By final I mean major adjustments to classes and gear. Wondering if this was possible :)

[Fyrce]

I agree with the others that the current AO3 bosses seem easier or at least there are MUCH MUCH fewer deaths than before. There is also much fewer deaths in the hallways. Much much fewer group wipes.

As for bosses being hard now, at one point people started Ao3 at level 45. The first time I arrived at Victory Lap with a group, after clearing ALL other levels, the highest level of us was 47. I might also add we all started at level 45, at a much harder Close Encounters than people are facing today. First, it was a new area; we can't resist going to something like that. 2nd, I for one did not remember thatthe level cap removal meant we could stat-up in Ao2 first; we just all went immediately to the new sandbox. And for me, at least, it was the most deaths I've ever accumulated. My bird went from something like 100-200 deaths to 800 (ok, over like a week, but really :). Whoopee! And it was fun! OMG, I don't think we picked ourselves up and ran back more enthusiastically. The wimps that quit after a death or two today really make me snicker.

And we had no good gear. We might have popped one or two L50 Ao2 items, but I don't think we saw any of the new stuff that day. I also remember everyone's goal that day: to learn Ao3 since everything was new, which meant if we got defeated we tried to figure out if there was a better way, etc. We figure there HAD to be a way to defeat a boss besides pure damage and sure enough, a bit of strategy helped. And we were just discovering the elixirs and I KNOW our usage of them is much better now than it was before. Plus, now there are guides and people to tell you the strategy. Back then, we figured it out on the run. And I do mean run. Or maybe it was die :) And it was a lot of fun. Hard as heck but fun.

The first day my mage was in a group of mages when a bear finally showed up and told us their bear groups had been wondering where all the mages were. That was pretty funny. I think he found us in Captive Audience, though it might have been Intergalactic Combat. It was awhile ago. LOL.

So please try to remember that Ao3 was, at one time, conquered by non-level-50s, with so-called "junk" gear. And that they've nerfed it. If you are having trouble with Ao3, I'm sorry but it's you -- either your build, your playing style or both. You'll have more fun if you try to figure that part out.

[Lesrider]

I remember we were having trouble with Gurgox till some archer came in and told us how to do it. Basically my Mage and the archer did the only attacking and another Mage revved. Went down easy. And then we cleared through the fourth stage all in that same night. Man that was a long night.

But seriously, all the bosses are too easy now. I miss the challenge of the old ones.

[Cazil]

Seriously this respec needs a respec, warriors got totally screwed. Warriors are taking all the hits... now lower armor and stupid long speeds. Might be the end of the game for me.

[Ellyidol]

Seriously this respec needs a respec, warriors got totally screwed. Warriors are taking all the hits... now lower armor and stupid long speeds. Might be the end of the game for me.

Aren't those what bears/warriors are for? Tanking..

[johnholley]

It may means that the people you are with may not be playing their characters correctly? The bosses are so much easier now.. regarding keeper.. my tips for you :)
1. clear all minions
2. when his shield is up, use normal attacks.
3. When his shield goes down, spam all your combos and damage spells/skills.

Good luck! :)

Getting through Crush the Keeper relies on a glitch in the AI, in that the Keeper will stay locked on a character and not move... <shrug>... and it becomes straight forward.

Maybe a better example is the Galactic Overlord. It's interesting to see how little This Ends Now is played. Now I am not worried about how it was, it is how it is now. Would be really interested in seeing if any groups without level 50 chars and their gear have made it post the rebalance? Why? I have played hours with parties and made no progress. I may be playing with the wrong groups but I am seeing a lot of folk give up as they cant commit the time it takes to get through. The strategy is clear, but the ability to enough damage quickly is the challenge. It just turns the whole thing into a drag...so no wonder no one seems to play that level.

[Rashkar]

Lol even in full gear everyone but a full rift needs to use an armor potion and then overlord is cake, this is a terrible example....

Stop crying the entire game is easy as ever.... Especially with mages being ableto drop anything in their path like a hot knife through butter. Stop crying, roll a Mage and Ull laugh through all encounters, they are officially op now, especially with the neutered bosses.

[Inching]

Lol even in full gear everyone but a full rift needs to use an armor potion and then overlord is cake, this is a terrible example....

Stop crying the entire game is easy as ever.... Especially with mages being ableto drop anything in their path like a hot knife through butter. Stop crying, roll a Mage and Ull laugh through all encounters, they are officially op now, especially with the neutered bosses.

Ran with 5 mages last night and finished crush the keeper in like 10mins.... not 1 died in keeper fight... then ran victory map and took 20 mins or so to finish every boss including OL.... yes we had no tank or bird .... Mages are really powerful now.... we had 3 lvl 50s and 2 lvl 49s with 2 Keeper staffs in the group...

Roll a mage, its fun now

[Gaabob]

At the very beginning of the stat update a team of mages could wipe keeper in one half of the time it takes for his first shield to spawn, then devs did a tiny nerf and it's a little slower. Right now no boss takes any real strategy with a team of half decent well equipped characters imo. Just keeper in getting him killed within the first shield spawn, otherwise bash-kill works.