Gold to Cost Ratio

[largecommand]

So a lot of people ask/beg me for gold when I'm sitting in town, or ask me how are you rich, or how can I be rich. And I feel bad for these new players, so sometimes I would gift them sets I don't use, I.E Shivering set, Crystalline Sets to them for them to use/ get a boost in the game.
Some of them are even nice enough to gift it back later.

But when I come to think of why these new players are so poor, or are just stuck. I boiled it down to one thing. The Gold to Cost ratio.

The amount of gold that is dropping is so low, new players can't even afford simple gear to keep leveling, let alone the top gear at that level. Not just the gold drop, but the quest payouts are extremely low. Average quests reward what? 300 gold? 500 gold? (Correct me if I'm wrong). Like what am I going to do with 500 gold?

I came across someone asking me how do I make adequate money in PL, I said there's a lot of ways, but when I asked him why he doesn't have Iceberg Gear on ( he's a level 30 bear). He replyed I don't have any gold, and the price is too high. And the price for an iceberg set is what? 30k?

Now to take this to the next step, I invited my sister to play PL, ( first time nub) and she was hooked onto it. Now, she told me she was hooked on when she was level 15. I didn't teach or tell her anything, how to make money, quests, elixers nothing, she was on her own, for now that is.

Later on when she was around level 35, I logged into her account I saw her wearing some crap gear. She wasn't even wearing a purple item, it was all "rare" items. And the amount of gold she had? 17k after liquidating. And she had a good amount of the quests done. So I gave her Voodoo/Halloween Mix set, because It is the best set at that level for a mage, she's a mage btw.

So I checked in later that month again on her account at level 48, this time she had a nice 85k, but she didn't get it from gold drops and liquidating. She sold the Halloween/Voodoo set, and bought some good pinks, but pinks are extremely cheap at 45.

Once she was level 53 she had 50k left and some cheap sewer items on. Now keep in mind I told her not to pvp, main reason I knew she would do bad, but new players would be curious right? How can new players even come close to being good in pvp without adequate gear/weapons, and it just keeps getting expensive the higher you get.

I'm not requesting STG to do anything really. This isn't a complaint to them.

I just want to hear what YOU the people have to say.

Thank you:)

[Depury]

Omg agreed. These crazy people in cs r trying to sell this stuff for endless amounts of money. I can't call myself poor with usually 200k-300k, but compared to all the merches, I'm probably one of the poorest full-time pvpers in the game. Anyway, how can a new person even enjoy the game if they have to pay butt-loads of money for one piece of equipment that will probably be weaker than the next sets in 5 lvls. Then, sts wants us to spend 700 platinum on 250k? C'mon guys. On sl, all of the gear is fairly priced. Cs is still op as always, but it's nowhere near as ridiculous as this. I hope you rich people realize, it's way harder to start pl now than 2-3 years ago. Bring your prices down. Stop being so selfish. Most of you rich people probably have 2-3 chars filled to the cap with gold, anyway.

(P.S., I don't need your flames. I'm hot enough already ;) )

[DocDoBig]

Omg agreed. These crazy people in cs r trying to sell this stuff for endless amounts of money. I can't call myself poor with usually 200k-300k, but compared to all the merches, I'm probably one of the poorest full-time pvpers in the game. Anyway, how can a new person even enjoy the game if they have to pay butt-loads of money for one piece of equipment that will probably be weaker than the next sets in 5 lvls. Then, sts wants us to spend 700 platinum on 250k? C'mon guys. On sl, all of the gear is fairly priced. Cs is still op as always, but it's nowhere near as ridiculous as this. I hope you rich people realize, it's way harder to start pl now than 2-3 years ago. Bring your prices down. Stop being so selfish. Most of you rich people probably have 2-3 chars filled to the cap with gold, anyway.

(P.S., I don't need your flames. I'm hot enough already ;) )

I don't remember how it was easier for me as it was for the new players today, I even believe some stuff went the price down.
I could actually tell the same story as largecommand, just the date when that happened was in 2011.

[largecommand]

Omg agreed. These crazy people in cs r trying to sell this stuff for endless amounts of money. I can't call myself poor with usually 200k-300k, but compared to all the merches, I'm probably one of the poorest full-time pvpers in the game. Anyway, how can a new person even enjoy the game if they have to pay butt-loads of money for one piece of equipment that will probably be weaker than the next sets in 5 lvls. Then, sts wants us to spend 700 platinum on 250k? C'mon guys. On sl, all of the gear is fairly priced. Cs is still op as always, but it's nowhere near as ridiculous as this. I hope you rich people realize, it's way harder to start pl now than 2-3 years ago. Bring your prices down. Stop being so selfish. Most of you rich people probably have 2-3 chars filled to the cap with gold, anyway.

(P.S., I don't need your flames. I'm hot enough already ;) )

That ps lol

But seriously, if StG wants more people to play pL they need to lean the game a bit towards gold based. In the past year I've seen MMO's go from players spending little $ and actually be successful in the game and tons of people play,to spending alot of $$$$$ and not alot of people playing or people not losing intrest but because the game became unplayable w/o spending money. The makers think they are giving out way to good of a deal so they lean the game towards $$$ based.

Why fix a car that's not broken?

[largecommand]

Omg agreed. These crazy people in cs r trying to sell this stuff for endless amounts of money. I can't call myself poor with usually 200k-300k, but compared to all the merches, I'm probably one of the poorest full-time pvpers in the game. Anyway, how can a new person even enjoy the game if they have to pay butt-loads of money for one piece of equipment that will probably be weaker than the next sets in 5 lvls. Then, sts wants us to spend 700 platinum on 250k? C'mon guys. On sl, all of the gear is fairly priced. Cs is still op as always, but it's nowhere near as ridiculous as this. I hope you rich people realize, it's way harder to start pl now than 2-3 years ago. Bring your prices down. Stop being so selfish. Most of you rich people probably have 2-3 chars filled to the cap with gold, anyway.

(P.S., I don't need your flames. I'm hot enough already ;) )

I don't remember how it was easier for me as it was for the new players today, I even believe some stuff went the price down.
I could actually tell the same story as largecommand, just the date when that happened was in 2011.

I agree it was harder back then as well, but back then A LOT of people played PL and money wasn't a issue for STG because PL blew up so much. But now players are being discouraged and soon lead them to quitting PL because the lack of money or gold.

[Chopper]

Without a good gold sink in the game, the gold just accumulates and people who get lucky drops end up with the most money disproportionately. When items go over the gold cap, the system is not built to address those kinds of prices.

It would never happen, but maybe charging gold for plat items like thrasher elixirs or Dragon pets (like 5-9M) would clear out some of the excess gold inflating the economy. Of course, taking away platinum revenue is not an idea that will ever be approved by the Devs.

[LEVEL ONE]

I don't remember how it was easier for me as it was for the new players today, I even believe some stuff went the price down.
I could actually tell the same story as largecommand, just the date when that happened was in 2011.

I would disagree, and Im talking out of my own experience... I started a couple of times from scratch (for some reason), and it definitely is harder to start now than it was back in 2010, for example.

[Suentous PO]

To me it seems a fact, the longer you play the easier it is to get "rich" nothing wrong with that. In some cases it's easier to get by than when I started, for instance I sweated to get a void bow during AO, now i might liquidate them. What used to be cap gear is now affordable in a lot of cases.

Also, I'm not policing but how many times did you mention sharing acc here?!?! You should know how that ends up, at least edit this.

[largecommand]

To me it seems a fact, the longer you play the easier it is to get "rich" nothing wrong with that. In some cases it's easier to get by than when I started, for instance I sweated to get a void bow during AO, now i might liquidate them. What used to be cap gear is now affordable in a lot of cases.

Also, I'm not policing but how many times did you mention sharing acc here?!?! You should know how that ends up, at least edit this.

I mentioned it many times, it's my sisters account. She lives with me and is younger than me. I see no harm in me knowing her account info. She doesn't know my account information because one day I fear she'll accidentally do something. And besides I wouldn't scam my own sister...impose a tax on her account tho is a diffrent story;)

[Suentous PO]

It doesn't say don't share info unless its family, but I have no vested interest just mentioning because older players set a precedence.

[largecommand]

It doesn't say don't share info unless its family, but I have no vested interest just mentioning because older players set a precedence.

Then my little experiment couldn't be done so I can know first hand how new players these days play.

[Suentous PO]

Back on topic doe, as an experiment I used one alt acc that I only gave access to nativx offers and with limited toons none of which were end gamers made a couple mil in one month off this Winterfest and lil farm/merchin. Granted I'm older and know a few tricks, but that's what I mean, experience pays. New folks can do ok depending on what they're aiming for.
If it were possible for a brand new player to hook up with the best gear I'd be less interested in playing.

[Slcinuup]

The low gold might because of the low amount of xp needed to level, upon each cap the experience of each level is lowered making players do less runs (less gold) and more leveling (more gear needed). Also that massive xp change at fang cap making it need way less xp needed could also be a reason for less gold with more levels.

[Cheenivie]

I remember when 200k for a void set was a lot. My friend and I always ran AO and liquidated our items until we reached our 200k to buy the set!

[XghostzX]

I completely agree with the quests not giving more significant rewards. Some quests in PL are fairly quick - those deserve small amounts of gold as rewards. However, I think more quest should have a bigger payout with the high amounts of gold needed to buy gear because STS has been a bit reluctant to do any gold sinks. But...

My only thought is that players would make characters, do the quests, then delete those characters and remake new ones for endless gold; thus, we're being counter productive and avoiding this gold problem (by putting more gold into the economy).

So if this were to be, the quests should not be giving relatively large gold payouts until, say, 30ish? I remember once I hit level 30 that's when leveling got trickier.

[BroadCastle]

Hello buddies,

such an interresting toppict was born here, thanks Command. This is such a matter I take care about for a pretty long time already. Especially last six months, I pay pretty big attention on low lvl players I meet around in townes, or I sometimes visit some PVE games in balefort-ish dungeons to meet some of them. Thats the good way how to filter those really brand new players who joined PL recently from some low lvl alts of high level players (who are sometimes trying to pretend newbie to get something, sadly). Basically, what Command mentioned I consider very trure.

Meeting those newbies, I try to talk with them, asking how are they doing in game etc. Pretty often I can find someone, who is not just some little kid, or someone who doesn't really care about the game, just trying it out. Alot of those pretty concentrated players (mostly between L15-30) were telling me, that they pretty enjoy the game but cant imagine how to ever buy some better equip. Unless they are super tallented merchants, who can start with 10k and multiply that really fast, their only chance, except begging, is reaching at least level 55 to get in the locations, where the chance for some cinsiderable drop is not that low. But still, even hardcore farmers are hard to get alot of drops todays, so how could random runner be successfull? In most of cases, Im trying to help those guys by gold and equip donations like Command said. I found out they mostly needs 100k at least, not to be just cosmetic gift. I was considering if to mention this, because this definitely may sound like showing off. But whatever, I wanted to say that, maybe I encourage some ohers of us, who arent hard to make such a gift by the time. Some newbier are really worth it, and when you feel their grattitude, its better than anything you can buy in game :)

Anyway, it's really kinda sad this matter. Basically, the threshold to become rich enough, to be able to buy some sets and to get some ensurance gold base, is getting some of those million drops, like mystery dragons or good blacksmoke pieces. Many poor players even on level like 60-65 desire for getting those and trying pretty hard, but we all know, that only succesful farming groups are those mostly end game level combo parties, and those are used to boot players we are talking about almost everytime they try to join. I still remember that feeling, and its very discouraging.

I really like the idea making quest rewards higher. Making them like around 10k or more would be really helpfull for those who start in game. But also, it would need to make those quests not that easy to pass, because todays quest would be very easily exploitable by some wise guys. I can easily imagine farmers remaking toons over and over just to make quests in forest haven to earn pretty good golds.

The other possibleity might be rewards for some amount of quests done. Not that easily to misuse, but still may be helpful. Also rewards for reaching higher level would be possible. If there is 100k reward for reaching for example lvl 50, what do you think about this?

I bet you all have much more and better ideas how to make PL better for new players. I would not mind to make some suggestion to devs, if there are more of us who agree on this matter.

But at least, Id like to point everyone, not to ignore noobs and their questions, unless they are some silly beggers. Try to be open minded. Sometimes you can meet some really good further friends, even within this sort of new players. (dam, Im sure I sound like some sapient preacher :D)

regards :)

______________

Lol, i was writing this such a long while, that gnost was able to put his post in advance and now i seem to be repeating alot of what he said first. Sorry about that.

[DocDoBig]

I would disagree, and Im talking out of my own experience... I started a couple of times from scratch (for some reason), and it definitely is harder to start now than it was back in 2010, for example.

Well, it's just the fact which bugs me that people believe it was way easier back then, actually the game itself stayed the same (the starting campaign mobs for sure are the same as they were 3 years ago - when not even easier now when I look into the Timeline and how many Nerfs the mobs had),

Ihave no explicit examples about "wow look this and that item price was waaay lower/higher back then due it's not really my matter but I clearly remember how I actually played all days just to level up, do these darn quests and maybe believe in my luck for a fortune drop and then get up my stuff.

Do you remember PL's 2nd Birthday how ALL maps (except pvp) became free? Actually (In my eyes) the players nowadays have a lot easier Pixel Life than back when you had to pay plat (No im no oldie who payed maps to level further than 13 in 2010) to actually obtain the quests and get a bit fortune and some quests done.

I was always happy when I succesfully unlocked a new campaign with it's maps and with these quests, but that's not really the point.

I totally agree, the gold drops from quests should get one or two digits more instead to have one of these "wow 25 gold from the quest? *sarcastic*-wooohoooooooooo"-moments.

I think the reason why so many newisher players believe that it was easier is the huge amount of rich (looking) players standing in town, now everyone with a savage set is automatically a richy rich person and a person you can ask for money with no ifs or buts.

Don't get me wrong, I have no problem if people have to show of with their items, for me it's just pixels afterall.


I once have read an interesting post by someone which was something like that:

"The more players join plus the longer these player play, the more gold comes into the economy and therefore everything might become even more expensive"

For me it makes totally sense, if you think about it, you actually make more income of "total PL gold" than loss.
(The only loss i can think of are potions/elixirs and cs-fees) while the huge possibilites of earning money are going from slaying a mob to getting awarded by quests.


After all it's just my honest opinion, people should just enjoy THEIR Pixel Life and shouldn't care about others wealth.

Yes, I agree, quests should give a higher amount of gold reward but I doubt this will fix anything imo.





P.S.: Ily l1

[TEOKILLO]

Multiply all quest gold rewards by 10! Its still only like 3k at the most, and at least if you do many quests you'd have the chance to buy some twink gear

[Int]

New players can't expect to get lots of gold right away. They are still new so they have to adjust to the game and how they can earn gold once they reach a higher lvl. When reaching lvl 33, u can run at alien oasis which gives good gold and loot to liquidate. I find myself making lots of gold from alien oasis

[Superduper]

I quit playing PL and had 25 mil in gold and crafted/dragon sets. I still wasn't rich compared to a lot.

[Superduper]

New players can't expect to get lots of gold right away. They are still new so they have to adjust to the game and how they can earn gold once they reach a higher lvl. When reaching lvl 33, u can run at alien oasis which gives good gold and loot to liquidate. I find myself making lots of gold from alien oasis

Back in the day AO3 keeper runs would give 2-3k in liquidation per run. I am not sure what it is now though.

[LEVEL ONE]

When I said "easier" I meant only in terms of gaining gold and obtaining pink items, not the whole leveling up system.

You've got no idea how many new players I made quit after answering them how much gold certain PVP items cost for lvl 10-20. I think all those discontinued items are ruining the already ruined economy. There were no items back then which would cost 1M...

P.S. lmk Doc

[Extreme]

Hey Large,

Very wise your post was, I agree to this suggestion I feel this sometimes, when I'm in towne I often get the "Begging" pm for gold too, when I asked it is the same questions too. Giving more golds in quests is a brilliant idea, but if I could suggest, maybe 1 per account if you get 10k pay outs?

Sometimes the people who get "begged" gets very annoyed resulting the new players to beg and beg more, I'm pretty sure 100k is nothing for you guys with 3 n more gold caps. I stopped giving my gold away to "new players" is when once I gave some gold to one player and when he reached endgame, he just trash talk and yeah you know. Like others have said, we need a gold sink, there is so many people wit 3 or more gold cap, we should atleast make cs just a slight different from the actually prices, maybe just the lower lvl ones? Thats just my opinion on whatcha sayin..

Ex.

[Reunegade]

When I said "easier" I meant only in terms of gaining gold and obtaining pink items, not the whole leveling up system.

You've got no idea how many new players I made quit after answering them how much gold certain PVP items cost for lvl 10-20. I think all those discontinued items are ruining the already ruined economy. There were no items back then which would cost 1M...

P.S. lmk Doc
Well, Zuraz Shock Lance did reach 1m at one point during 45 cap I think.

[Superduper]

Well, Zuraz Shock Lance did reach 1m at one point during 45 cap I think.

The good ol' shock lance.

[LEVEL ONE]

Well, Zuraz Shock Lance did reach 1m at one point during 45 cap I think.
Everything is overpriced when it releases... Its cost got divided by 2 in the same week.

[Fusionstrike]

The root of the problem is definitely a lack of a gold sink. People who have been here for 3 or more years have money just piled up to the rafters with nothing to spend it on. Sure, not everyone who's been around that long actually has truckloads of gold, but enough do that top-tier gear is very expensive. And those with money who PvP at twink levels drive the market for top gear throughout all levels, so it's not just a problem with endgame gear prices.

The other thing to note is that PL is really two different games. From levels 1 through about 60, a player can advance through PvE without top-of-the-line gear. I've run many characters all the way up to level cap, and I never had to spend on gear to be effective in pre-60 levels. You can basically just strap on whatever drops you luck into and still be effective enough to advance. But once you get to 60 (i.e. fang and beyond) the game takes a major turn in difficulty. Just staying alive against the souped-up 60+ mobs is difficult enough in excellent gear, let alone whatever you can scrounge up if you're too poor to buy top-tier items. This is where the rich-poor gap really creates problems.

So, the real challenge is for a new player to make enough money to be viable by the time they hit 60. If you just run a character up with no elixirs to speed along and don't spend on any gear along the way, you could expect to have a decent 6-digit sum off of what you earn along the way. It wouldn't be unusual to have about 200-300k even without getting any high-priced drops to sell (and really the only drops you could make good money on before Fang are in Nuri, where it's not unimaginable you could get lucky to get some steels or something). Now that's not going to get you any premier items, but it's enough to buy some second-tier stuff, which is enough to stay alive and try to farm out a good drop to earn money from. And of course a player could always get a daily blessing combo, which comes with the all-important luck boost to help get some purple drops or even a big score drop to sell.

All in all, I would say that although it's not easy to get a decent amount of money together as a new player in PL, it's not impossible. Just playing along through the first half of the game will yield some working cash, and being smart with that money along with some farming of items and/or gold can raise a player out of poverty pretty reliably. It does mean investing the time to either farm gold directly or hit the jackpot on a lucky drop, but having to work up the ladder to compete at the high end isn't a bad thing in my view. After all, without that as a long-term goal, I'm not sure what players would actually do in PL to hold their interest.

[Burningdex]

wow always out of thanks when i see a good thread >.> i have been playing for awhile 3ish years and i have NEVER had more then 500k in gold at one time the only reason i still pvp is because i have made good friends who are willing to help out with gear

(scary,, pl*ayer, bigboo countless more) but really we need quests to give more as 10 gold really.... as how are new players supposed to buy an artisan
leather even i can barely afford that

[Schnitzel]

My idea on this:

There should be a few NPCs in Forest haven (and some other townes who's lvl range goes up to i don't know..say lvl35) that sell fairly good gear at low enough prices.
These NPCs will only sell to new people who made their account and character within a certain amount of days.
The items the NPCs sell are fairly cheap (20-200gold probably) these items are good enough to help that character survive, and do some fair damage. These items cannot be traded with other players. however, they can be traded through stash to their other alts that if the player chooses, can create and use later on.

Some of these special items can be obtained from fairly simple quests (ex: kill MeatHead 1-10 times) to get this Helm/armor/weapon and/or shield

After the set amount of days the account can be called "new" is up, the NPCs just give out daily quests that give crafting materials and gold the players can take to the FH blacksmith and craft gear.

I know this idea probably is not perfect..its just a suggestion..

[XghostzX]

The root of the problem is definitely a lack of a gold sink. People who have been here for 3 or more years have money just piled up to the rafters with nothing to spend it on. Sure, not everyone who's been around that long actually has truckloads of gold, but enough do that top-tier gear is very expensive. And those with money who PvP at twink levels drive the market for top gear throughout all levels, so it's not just a problem with endgame gear prices.

The other thing to note is that PL is really two different games. From levels 1 through about 60, a player can advance through PvE without top-of-the-line gear. I've run many characters all the way up to level cap, and I never had to spend on gear to be effective in pre-60 levels. You can basically just strap on whatever drops you luck into and still be effective enough to advance. But once you get to 60 (i.e. fang and beyond) the game takes a major turn in difficulty. Just staying alive against the souped-up 60+ mobs is difficult enough in excellent gear, let alone whatever you can scrounge up if you're too poor to buy top-tier items. This is where the rich-poor gap really creates problems.

So, the real challenge is for a new player to make enough money to be viable by the time they hit 60. If you just run a character up with no elixirs to speed along and don't spend on any gear along the way, you could expect to have a decent 6-digit sum off of what you earn along the way. It wouldn't be unusual to have about 200-300k even without getting any high-priced drops to sell (and really the only drops you could make good money on before Fang are in Nuri, where it's not unimaginable you could get lucky to get some steels or something). Now that's not going to get you any premier items, but it's enough to buy some second-tier stuff, which is enough to stay alive and try to farm out a good drop to earn money from. And of course a player could always get a daily blessing combo, which comes with the all-important luck boost to help get some purple drops or even a big score drop to sell.

All in all, I would say that although it's not easy to get a decent amount of money together as a new player in PL, it's not impossible. Just playing along through the first half of the game will yield some working cash, and being smart with that money along with some farming of items and/or gold can raise a player out of poverty pretty reliably. It does mean investing the time to either farm gold directly or hit the jackpot on a lucky drop, but having to work up the ladder to compete at the high end isn't a bad thing in my view. After all, without that as a long-term goal, I'm not sure what players would actually do in PL to hold their interest.

The rich-poor gap between campaigns was a good point made.

Let me take Order and Chaos as a good example of gear and gold.

First off, the level cap is currently 70. By level 60, the amount of XP you need to level up is increased (from level 58-59) by about 10x... it could take a hella lot of time grind and do quests. From 60-61 requires about 1mill XP and to put it into perspective, you could grind for about an hour and receive only 30k XP at most. But there's an easier way to level - that's through dungeons which grant 250k xp per completed run. But in order to do these runs, you need to team up with other players of different classes. The catch? You need decent gear. So how can you get decent gear? Gold isn't that easy to get in Order and Chaos. If I were to buy "decent" gear for dungeoning through the auction house, I'd have very little leftover gold (everything is overpriced in the auction house).

At level 60, they offer quests where you literally do 20-30 different quests that reward you with gear that you need. So you get a little gold and XP along the way... but what they really set you up with is gear for leveling up with the dungeons.

Switching gears to Pocket Legends: this is what needs to be done. By the time level 60 is achieved, quests for gear needs to be in place. Unfortunately STS is never diverse with it's gear (ex. I'd like to see INT gear separated into healing and damage gear, but it's all one bundle which makes PL a lack of diversity). Regardless, there should be quests to get gear that aren't the most elite gear, but good enough to help you get through with a team.

The most elite gear in Order and Chaos cannot be bought with gold nor traded with other players. They have a unique system; when dungeoning, you obtain items after bosses. Once you pick up those items, regardless of what class they're for, they are "bound" to your character. Meaning you can't sell them for gold in the auction house or trade them (you can liquidate them for very small amounts of gold). The only items you can put in the auction house and trade with other players are items farmed through the world map and random mobs (which there are many good drops aside from dungeons.. but dungeons have the best of the best gear).

My point? All this gear is obtained through dungeoning, and in PL's case should be obtained through difficult quests. Now, that doesn't mean every single item is bound in Order and Chaos but you get the idea. Everyone has an equal chance of getting the gear. This would get rid of the gold issue, and you could spend gold on other things.

[Roberto077]

I quit playing PL and had 25 mil in gold and crafted/dragon sets. I still wasn't rich compared to a lot.

That's 5x the gold I have atm

You're rich, not as rich as some, but to everyone, that amount should be considered rich.

[Suentous PO]

Keep in mind if something has a high pay out in low lev then that would also devalue gold over all and cause more of the same problem.

[WeLoveJesus]

The only reason I have a LVL 76 savage bear is due to: Blacknwild giving me a sm glyph set and 200k when I was a noob 56 with crap gear, and my <3 really good friend Deadlydescent helping and loaning/giving me 3 mil along the course of my PL journey. (He loaned 2 mil, gave like 1 mil worth in stuff). So... It is really hard for players without plat (for farming, earned about 2 mil in Mini dungeon) to be rich or even afford decent gear.. By the way I've been playing PL since September 2012 and before I met Deadlydescent in about July 2013, I had a purple fbow (won from a contest) and 150k (75k was won from the same contest). So it's really impossible for players w/o plat or REALLY nice friends to get even decent gear. Even now, I have 200 gold (not a typo) because well... I just paid off my loans and no money or no plat. When players start getting like 56-ish, the price for stuff goes WAY up. I mean, who can buy glyph? That only has money from liquidation and quests? Besides 60 big top, mimicry, and Nuri, NOBODY. This and the fact that there are so many dishonest beggars (many ppl find begging easier than grinding), I think, are contributing to the downward spiral of the PL community. Also I think that STG has been so trigger happy with the ban-gun hasn't really helped. If ya look at it, so many experienced players willing to give back to the community have gotten banned.

KK long rant, sry.

[WeLoveJesus]

Also (double post sry) We should find a way to keep inflation in check. Right now, the only way gold gets removed is through cs and when rich players (ie. Wammm) get banned. But does that counteract the gold released by item drops and harvested each day? No. This economy is definitely inflaying, and we know that. SM sets used to cost 500-700k. Now they're 900-1 mil... I could give more examples too... Fix this pls.

[largecommand]

Keep in mind if something has a high pay out in low lev then that would also devalue gold over all and cause more of the same problem.

I have already made a suggestion, low level up to 50, has a max payout of 5-6k. That's the harder ones too, the easy ones like Go meet this NPC in this towne should have a less payout. But quests like kill red dragon 76 times needs a substantial payout increase.

[VVake]

Also (double post sry) We should find a way to keep inflation in check. Right now, the only way gold gets removed is through cs and when rich players (ie. Wammm) get banned. But does that counteract the gold released by item drops and harvested each day? No. This economy is definitely inflaying, and we know that. SM sets used to cost 500-700k. Now they're 900-1 mil... I could give more examples too... Fix this pls.
Thats just how economies work. And there are plenty more ways gold is removed then just that.

[largecommand]

Also (double post sry) We should find a way to keep inflation in check. Right now, the only way gold gets removed is through cs and when rich players (ie. Wammm) get banned. But does that counteract the gold released by item drops and harvested each day? No. This economy is definitely inflaying, and we know that. SM sets used to cost 500-700k. Now they're 900-1 mil... I could give more examples too... Fix this pls.

Actually if your talking about level 56 glyphs, they were worth 13m+, Obe went for 20! But when StG increased drop rates it threw the price down.

[Fusionstrike]

Also (double post sry) We should find a way to keep inflation in check. Right now, the only way gold gets removed is through cs and when rich players (ie. Wammm) get banned. But does that counteract the gold released by item drops and harvested each day? No. This economy is definitely inflaying, and we know that. SM sets used to cost 500-700k. Now they're 900-1 mil... I could give more examples too... Fix this pls.

I just wanted to point out that gold is NOT removed by CS sales. They simply shift gold from one player to another, so it's still in circulation. Unless you were referring to the listing fee, which does remove a (relatively small) amount of gold from the game. The only other ways that money actually leaves the game is by buying potions, some weak elixirs and gear from NPC vendors, all of which are nowhere near enough to match the influx of gold. PL has a rampantly-inflationary economy.

[Elitephonix]

I read the thread as gold to costa Rico.

[Elitephonix]

Actually if your talking about level 56 glyphs, they were worth 13m+, Obe went for 20! But when StG increased drop rates it threw the price down.

You would know. *cough * * cough *

[Suentous PO]

I have already made a suggestion, low level up to 50, has a max payout of 5-6k. That's the harder ones too, the easy ones like Go meet this NPC in this towne should have a less payout. But quests like kill red dragon 76 times needs a substantial payout increase.

I was mostly referring to the quests should pay 10x comment, but a quest like kill red dragon does have a substantial pay out when you get a good drop.

One thing new players might not get right away is that if you only pvp you will stay poor. Real farming and merching is what makes you rich.

All in all this turned out to be an interesting thread, thx!

[WeLoveJesus]

I just wanted to point out that gold is NOT removed by CS sales. They simply shift gold from one player to another, so it's still in circulation. Unless you were referring to the listing fee, which does remove a (relatively small) amount of gold from the game. The only other ways that money actually leaves the game is by buying potions, some weak elixirs and gear from NPC vendors, all of which are nowhere near enough to match the influx of gold. PL has a rampantly-inflationary economy.

Yes, I was referring to the listing fee. And well said.

[IGN Storm]

IMO the ratio is fine where it is. You can't expect to get the top tier gear for only half an hour worth of quests.

[XghostzX]

IMO the ratio is fine where it is. You can't expect to get the top tier gear for only half an hour worth of quests.

The ratio is definitely not fine for any new players. Pocket Legends is a light MMO, therefore gaining the gear you need whether it's questing or racking up gold should not be that difficult, but somehow PL's economy made that possible. In my opinion, there are two things going wrong for STS:

1. The gap between the rich and poor is what the true problem is. As stated early, once you hit level 60, you quickly realize the impact of this gap.

2. The economy is never regulated and no gold sinks are occurring. Not for STS' sake; I know they couldn't care less about PL's economy but they'll definitely take it into account as a learning mistake for future games they develop.

In Order and Chaos, they regulated the economy (gold sinks) by implementing mounts into the game. Not only did you need to waste tons of gold for a cool "starter" mount, but you needed to purchase mount-riding permits! Lmao... genius. Plus, there are mounts that free roam the world and can be caught by using certain tools and spells that can be bought for real money through the in-app store. Double genius. But all in all, this was a great way to regulate the economy and they do far more things in addition. Now of course, Pocket Legends is not a heavy MMORPG like Order and Chaos, but with PL still being an MMORPG, such actions need to be taken. Any MMORPG, no matter how big or small, should stabilize the gold circulation. Otherwise it's just one big failing MMO.

And honestly, I'm sick of all these end game sets being so expensive. Yeah whatever, I'm relatively "poor" haha, I have like 50k not including the sets I have for two characters. You can't make gold without spending money on elixirs for all this luck-crap and stat boosts hoping to get a decent drop. Sorry STS, I have nothing against that as you are a business after all, but you sucked me into this during PL's "golden age" which I won't fall for again. It is a bit ironic how betting is not encouraged for PvP (which would be my method of making gold in game, I hate farming) when the entire system is a gamble. I know they won't acknowledge this, but again - they're a business. Brilliant.

Hopefully something is taken out of this.

[IGN Storm]

The ratio is definitely not fine for any new players. Pocket Legends is a light MMO, therefore gaining the gear you need whether it's questing or racking up gold should not be that difficult, but somehow PL's economy made that possible. In my opinion, there is two things going wrong for STS:

1. The gap between the rich and poor is what the true problem is. As stated early, once you hit level 60, you quickly realize the impact of this gap.

2. The economy is never regulated and no gold sinks are occurring. Not for STS' sake; I know they couldn't care less about PL's economy but they'll definitely take it into account as a learning mistake for future games they develop.

In Order and Chaos, they regulated the economy (gold sinks) by implementing mounts into the game. Not only did you need to waste tons of gold for a cool "starter" mount, but you needed to purchase mount-riding permits! Lmao... genius. Plus, there are mounts that free roam the world and can be caught by using certain tools and spells that can be bought for real money through the in-app store. Double genius. But all in all, this was a great way to regulate the economy and they do far more things in addition. Now of course, Pocket Legends is not a heavy MMORPG like Order and Chaos, but with PL still being an MMORPG, such actions need to be taken. Any MMORPG, no matter how big or small, should stabilize the gold circulation.

And honestly, I'm sick of all these end game sets being so expensive. You can't make gold without spending money on elixirs for all this luck-crap and stat boosts hoping to get a decent drop. Sorry STS, I have nothing against that as you are a business after all, but you sucked me into this during PL's "golden age" which I won't fall for again. :P

Hopefully something is taken out of this.

When I said ratio, I was refering to the payout of the quests. A 2minute quest(Kill 15 crocodiles, kill 20 yetis, etc) shouldn't award the player with so much money that it allows them to buy the best gear. Pinks are LEGENDARY for a reason. If all it took to buy a Savage set is killing a few bosses and npcs, then STS will have to release even more updates to keep us content, which we all know is highly unlikely.

Endgame sets are expensive? Yes definitely. But that is not entirely to blame on the lack of gold sinks. Being the most powerful gear so far, it makes sense it should cost the most(Aside from discontinued items). Savage is expensive but Fiery is pretty cheap, obviously due to the stat differences. If STS were to boost Fiery sufficiently, then Savage will drop in price while bringing Fiery up. Another reason why BSM sets are so expensive it because there is only one "type" of each item. During all the previous caps, there were 2 Legendary items for every one of the 3 attributes. A person using "Of the Dead" gear is at a disadvantage when facing someone with full Orlok, but they still have a decent chance of winning. During the BSM cap, STS slacked off and only made the 3 "type" of gear: Flying Beastly and Sharp. Being the only gear that you can use to have a good chance at Endgame, they are naturally more expensive. The Rockin Retro Contest serves to fill in the caps, and make Endgame gear cheaper. The new helms and weapons release some of the pressure to buy the Best gear and allows you to "suffice". Still no armour/shield is released so prices are still a tad bit high. Once the new level cap comes, the BSM pinks will crash, maybe only a bit more expensive than a new players budget.

Gold-Sink needed? Also a yes. No arguement here.

Counterproposal: Instead of having quests having high payouts, make Purple/Epic gear as the rewards. This will allow new players to pull through without too much hardship while allowing the rich to maintain thier superiourity. Pvp wise, Epic/Purple gear should have a 25-40% chance of winning against the much more expensive pink gear.

[Hawkbby]

How bout dis, we all convert to dis. Everything sells for 1k more than liquidation k!? In cs, sell for 2k more when you select 3 days. K.

[Everyone'sFavMage]

Ok, first off, really great thread. Nice read. Now, my favorite answers to this debate.
I don't remember how it was easier for me as it was for the new players today, I even believe some stuff went the price down.
I could actually tell the same story as largecommand, just the date when that happened was in 2011.
I've always thought to myself, if I was going to start over, would I get discouraged and give up? So I tried it. About march of 2013 I started a fresh toon. I didn't use stash with it. And I didn't give anything to it. I leveled it up to 66 with no elixirs. I made about 300-400k from drops and liquidations. This was enough to buy a crafted sang set. So to answer my own question. Would I start over? Yes. Because it's far easier now, then it was in 2010-2011. Back then I remember the lvl 30 items, brain freeze, shivering, iceberg, were farmed by everyone. That was a good source of income. Farming them wasn't hard. But they costed about 20-30k a piece. Good fast way to earn money. Now, they are 3-10k a piece. This is because of inflation. Gold cannot be added to the game through drops-quests-ect without expecting inflation.

The root of the problem is definitely a lack of a gold sink. People who have been here for 3 or more years have money just piled up to the rafters with nothing to spend it on. Sure, not everyone who's been around that long actually has truckloads of gold, but enough do that top-tier gear is very expensive. And those with money who PvP at twink levels drive the market for top gear throughout all levels, so it's not just a problem with endgame gear prices.

The other thing to note is that PL is really two different games. From levels 1 through about 60, a player can advance through PvE without top-of-the-line gear. I've run many characters all the way up to level cap, and I never had to spend on gear to be effective in pre-60 levels. You can basically just strap on whatever drops you luck into and still be effective enough to advance. But once you get to 60 (i.e. fang and beyond) the game takes a major turn in difficulty. Just staying alive against the souped-up 60+ mobs is difficult enough in excellent gear, let alone whatever you can scrounge up if you're too poor to buy top-tier items. This is where the rich-poor gap really creates problems.

So, the real challenge is for a new player to make enough money to be viable by the time they hit 60. If you just run a character up with no elixirs to speed along and don't spend on any gear along the way, you could expect to have a decent 6-digit sum off of what you earn along the way. It wouldn't be unusual to have about 200-300k even without getting any high-priced drops to sell (and really the only drops you could make good money on before Fang are in Nuri, where it's not unimaginable you could get lucky to get some steels or something). Now that's not going to get you any premier items, but it's enough to buy some second-tier stuff, which is enough to stay alive and try to farm out a good drop to earn money from. And of course a player could always get a daily blessing combo, which comes with the all-important luck boost to help get some purple drops or even a big score drop to sell.

All in all, I would say that although it's not easy to get a decent amount of money together as a new player in PL, it's not impossible. Just playing along through the first half of the game will yield some working cash, and being smart with that money along with some farming of items and/or gold can raise a player out of poverty pretty reliably. It does mean investing the time to either farm gold directly or hit the jackpot on a lucky drop, but having to work up the ladder to compete at the high end isn't a bad thing in my view. After all, without that as a long-term goal, I'm not sure what players would actually do in PL to hold their interest.
Agreed with pretty much everything. Great comment.

The rich-poor gap between campaigns was a good point made.

Let me take Order and Chaos as a good example of gear and gold.

First off, the level cap is currently 70. By level 60, the amount of XP you need to level up is increased (from level 58-59) by about 10x... it could take a hella lot of time grind and do quests. From 60-61 requires about 1mill XP and to put it into perspective, you could grind for about an hour and receive only 30k XP at most. But there's an easier way to level - that's through dungeons which grant 250k xp per completed run. But in order to do these runs, you need to team up with other players of different classes. The catch? You need decent gear. So how can you get decent gear? Gold isn't that easy to get in Order and Chaos. If I were to buy "decent" gear for dungeoning through the auction house, I'd have very little leftover gold (everything is overpriced in the auction house).

At level 60, they offer quests where you literally do 20-30 different quests that reward you with gear that you need. So you get a little gold and XP along the way... but what they really set you up with is gear for leveling up with the dungeons.

Switching gears to Pocket Legends: this is what needs to be done. By the time level 60 is achieved, quests for gear needs to be in place. Unfortunately STS is never diverse with it's gear (ex. I'd like to see INT gear separated into healing and damage gear, but it's all one bundle which makes PL a lack of diversity). Regardless, there should be quests to get gear that aren't the most elite gear, but good enough to help you get through with a team.

The most elite gear in Order and Chaos cannot be bought with gold nor traded with other players. They have a unique system; when dungeoning, you obtain items after bosses. Once you pick up those items, regardless of what class they're for, they are "bound" to your character. Meaning you can't sell them for gold in the auction house or trade them (you can liquidate them for very small amounts of gold). The only items you can put in the auction house and trade with other players are items farmed through the world map and random mobs (which there are many good drops aside from dungeons.. but dungeons have the best of the best gear).

My point? All this gear is obtained through dungeoning, and in PL's case should be obtained through difficult quests. Now, that doesn't mean every single item is bound in Order and Chaos but you get the idea. Everyone has an equal chance of getting the gear. This would get rid of the gold issue, and you could spend gold on other things.
I agree with the massive change at lvl 60. Everything gets tuffer. Instantly.

Also I think that STG has been so trigger happy with the ban-gun hasn't really helped. If ya look at it, so many experienced players willing to give back to the community have gotten banned.
This sentence is so true. I've seen some really awesome amazing players, who contributed tons to the community and genuially care about this game get banned for the absolute stupidest of reasons.

IMO the ratio is fine where it is. You can't expect to get the top tier gear for only half an hour worth of quests.
Exactly.

The ratio is definitely not fine for any new players. Pocket Legends is a light MMO, therefore gaining the gear you need whether it's questing or racking up gold should not be that difficult, but somehow PL's economy made that possible. In my opinion, there are two things going wrong for STS:

1. The gap between the rich and poor is what the true problem is. As stated early, once you hit level 60, you quickly realize the impact of this gap.

2. The economy is never regulated and no gold sinks are occurring. Not for STS' sake; I know they couldn't care less about PL's economy but they'll definitely take it into account as a learning mistake for future games they develop.

In Order and Chaos, they regulated the economy (gold sinks) by implementing mounts into the game. Not only did you need to waste tons of gold for a cool "starter" mount, but you needed to purchase mount-riding permits! Lmao... genius. Plus, there are mounts that free roam the world and can be caught by using certain tools and spells that can be bought for real money through the in-app store. Double genius. But all in all, this was a great way to regulate the economy and they do far more things in addition. Now of course, Pocket Legends is not a heavy MMORPG like Order and Chaos, but with PL still being an MMORPG, such actions need to be taken. Any MMORPG, no matter how big or small, should stabilize the gold circulation. Otherwise it's just one big failing MMO.

And honestly, I'm sick of all these end game sets being so expensive. Yeah whatever, I'm relatively "poor" haha, I have like 50k not including the sets I have for two characters. You can't make gold without spending money on elixirs for all this luck-crap and stat boosts hoping to get a decent drop. Sorry STS, I have nothing against that as you are a business after all, but you sucked me into this during PL's "golden age" which I won't fall for again. It is a bit ironic how betting is not encouraged for PvP (which would be my method of making gold in game, I hate farming) when the entire system is a gamble. I know they won't acknowledge this, but again - they're a business. Brilliant.

Hopefully something is taken out of this.
I'm sorry William but this sentence is not true. As proof. Some of you may know I got a device ban around April of 2013 and got a new ipad oct 1st. I came back, and my account was wiped clean, because I had given everything away when I was banned. But I thought, I might try to give this another go. A few friends gave me 3mill. Just 3mill. From that, I've made over 60-70mill in just a few months. And no I don't farm it. I merch. If you are a knowledgable human being you can learn the market very quickly on this game. It's not rocket science. As an exercise in November I started a lvl 5 character gave him 10k and saw what I could get with 10k in a month, I made 550k in a month with just that toon and 10k. So for newer players who think it's impossible to get started, I agree it may seem that way at first but it's far from impossible. It does take time. And it does take some trial and error with merching. But if you are serious about the game you stick with it like all of us have.

When I said ratio, I was refering to the payout of the quests. A 2minute quest(Kill 15 crocodiles, kill 20 yetis, etc) shouldn't award the player with so much money that it allows them to buy the best gear. Pinks are LEGENDARY for a reason. If all it took to buy a Savage set is killing a few bosses and npcs, then STS will have to release even more updates to keep us content, which we all know is highly unlikely.

Endgame sets are expensive? Yes definitely. But that is not entirely to blame on the lack of gold sinks. Being the most powerful gear so far, it makes sense it should cost the most(Aside from discontinued items). Savage is expensive but Fiery is pretty cheap, obviously due to the stat differences. If STS were to boost Fiery sufficiently, then Savage will drop in price while bringing Fiery up. Another reason why BSM sets are so expensive it because there is only one "type" of each item. During all the previous caps, there were 2 Legendary items for every one of the 3 attributes. A person using "Of the Dead" gear is at a disadvantage when facing someone with full Orlok, but they still have a decent chance of winning. During the BSM cap, STS slacked off and only made the 3 "type" of gear: Flying Beastly and Sharp. Being the only gear that you can use to have a good chance at Endgame, they are naturally more expensive. The Rockin Retro Contest serves to fill in the caps, and make Endgame gear cheaper. The new helms and weapons release some of the pressure to buy the Best gear and allows you to "suffice". Still no armour/shield is released so prices are still a tad bit high. Once the new level cap comes, the BSM pinks will crash, maybe only a bit more expensive than a new players budget.

Gold-Sink needed? Also a yes. No arguement here.

Counterproposal: Instead of having quests having high payouts, make Purple/Epic gear as the rewards. This will allow new players to pull through without too much hardship while allowing the rich to maintain thier superiourity. Pvp wise, Epic/Purple gear should have a 25-40% chance of winning against the much more expensive pink gear.
Excellent point about the 2 types of pinks from every other cap. This was a huge deal when bsm came out, it didn't provide what I call "off brand" pinks/sets. Which made this cap a much much harder one for any newer player who didn't have the money to just dish out for a set.

[XghostzX]

Mage - Merching is not the go-to way of making gold for newer players though. And to be perfectly honest, it shouldn't have to be. It's seems extremely boring and unproductive sitting in the CS for hours on end sometimes just waiting for that right moment to make a quick profit. That seems a little more "real life" to me, in fact.

But everyone has different opinions. Most people enjoy merching, I think it's one of the stupidest things in game :P

[Extreme]

Long Posts everywhere O.o

[IGN Storm]

Mage - Merching is not the go-to way of making gold for newer players though. And to be perfectly honest, it shouldn't have to be. It's seems extremely boring and unproductive sitting in the CS for hours on end sometimes just waiting for that right moment to make a quick profit. That seems a little more "real life" to me, in fact.

But everyone has different opinions. Most people enjoy merching, I think it's one of the stupidest things in game :P

Boring? Yes. Unproductive? No. Of the 14.5 mil I earned, 500k was from farming, 1.5mil from farming with plat, and 12.5 was all from merching. Keep in mind I had only 150k when I first started. Buy/sell frozen nightmare pinks, something new players should be able to merch. All they have to know is the concept of merching. And that doesnt mean you have to sit in CS 24/7. Just check CS oncevery hour or so . The rest of the time can be spent pvping/farming.

[Lutscherrrr]

You complain about new players not having enough gold for pink gear.
I didn't have any pink gear until L50, but well pink gear is best gear and seriously isn't meant to be for every new player who just started playing for 2 hours.

[largecommand]

Look, the point I'm trying to get across is not the point we are trying to make it. Granted yes it shouldn't be super easy for new players to succeed in the game. Back then it was hard for us, it was meant to be hard. Back then if pl lost a few players because it was difficult to level, it was no big deal, because of the increasing amount of players....

Now it's a diffrent story, with pl dieing, if few players quit today it will affect us diffrently then in 2010-2011.

And I never proposed we increase the quest payouts enough so you only do a couple and you have the best gear.

Payouts should depend on difficulty of quest. But max should be 5k on those quests like gather (0/20) yeti fur. It's not worth 250gold and a quest completed number.

[Fusionstrike]

Counterproposal: Instead of having quests having high payouts, make Purple/Epic gear as the rewards. This will allow new players to pull through without too much hardship while allowing the rich to maintain thier superiourity. Pvp wise, Epic/Purple gear should have a 25-40% chance of winning against the much more expensive pink gear.

This is really the way to go. There are quests along the way that do exactly this, but they're not in every area and aren't always that good of gear. STS could go through and make sure there is viable gear (e.g. purples) to be earned at regular intervals. In some cases, it may have to be longer, more involved quests to be able to give away good enough gear for new players to survive. Cyber was a good example of this, but is pretty long and involved and has excellent gear as its reward, so it's probably overkill. But spacing out some good purples with a decent but not crushing amount of work to earn would ensure that anyone who wants to put in the work can get a decent set from which to advance/farm/pvp/etc. And the items should be untradeable so they don't create inflation, just like cyber set.

This way, a new player could always opt to work via quests instead of building up cash to buy sets. It would be faster and wouldn't result in the absolute best gear, but would be enough to be productive. And then they could always use that to go the extra mile to farm/merch/etc for the top gear if they choose.

[Depury]

In al, you can sell plat items in cs... Y not pl? It would be much more convenient. Noobs could at least have sweg when they get farmed ;)

[Romaniankidd91]

you would not survive in SL :(


IGN: Romaniankidd.51,Romkillz.41,Romnubsy.20,Poopscoop. 51,Skillzaishere.50,Romdiculous.15

[iiirootzz]

Sellable vanities k thanks