possible sollution to balance the 3 classes in pvp w/o affecting pve

[uunknownn]

warrior--nerf their armors by 5%-10% since they have many skills to survive and they have a good dmg right now.when entering pvp only!
rogues--lessen the mana usage..sts nerfed the crit for rogue why not nerf the warrior a lil?
mage--give them 3 sec invulnerability instead of 2 sec.

-pls comment and add suggestions

[uunknownn]

we all know many players is a fun of pvp when they bored in pve so pls sts give a lil attention to pvp section.ty

[Crowsfoot]

LOL, are you kidding? Rogues are the most OP right now. No warrior should beat a maxed rogue 1v1 and rogues can freaking one hit mages. I have multiple friends who play all three classes NEVER have I heard rogues should have lower mana consumption nor warriors should have their armor nerfed.

What I have heard:
-All classes get a damage nerf
-Mages get an armor buff
-Rogues get a crit nerf

[Bless]

LOL, are you kidding? Rogues are the most OP right now. No warrior should beat a maxed rogue 1v1 and rogues can freaking one hit mages. I have multiple friends who play all three classes NEVER have I heard rogues should have lower mana consumption nor warriors should have their armor nerfed.

What I have heard:
-All classes get a damage nerf
-Mages get an armor buff
-Rogues get a crit nerf

Rogues are fine. Rogues dont need nerfs, its bad enough our dodge is useless.
Mages may need a armor (gear armor) boost - not a skill or damage buff
Tanks are fine - maybe a lil nerf of the magmatic claymore, a normal combo combined with the frequent proc does unusually high damage (even faster than a mage does to me sometimes).


No major buff/nerfs needed, play your class right.

Edit: Its not the classes that are the problem, its the abuse. Macros, skill swapping mid fight* and pet spam (e.g. valkin spam in a 1v1) are the root of the problem.

* Especially skill swapping because it is giving an unfair advantage.

[Crowsfoot]

Rogues are fine. Rogues dont need nerfs, its bad enough our dodge is useless.
Mages may need a armor (gear armor) boost - not a skill or damage buff
Tanks are fine - maybe a lil nerf of the magmatic claymore, a normal combo combined with the frequent proc does unusually high damage (even faster than a mage does to me sometimes).


No major buff/nerfs needed, play your class right.

Edit: Its not the classes that are the problem, its the abuse. Macros, skill swapping mid fight* and pet spam (e.g. valkin spam in a 1v1) are the root of the problem.

* Especially skill swapping because it is giving an unfair advantage.
How is skill swapping unfair? It doesn't bypass cool downs and doesn't allow a higher number of skills mapped at a time.

Pet spamming DOES bypass the cool down and therefore gives an unfair advantage (especially to players with mana issues).

At rogues though, I have a friend with maxed mage gear (mythics, arcane staff, sammael, the works) and he is one hit by rogues if they have a ring, crit, and he doesn't have shield up. That is OP. Its one situation, but its a situation that should be fixed.

[Bless]

@crow Its unfair because it uses more than the intended skills on the UI - heck even STG hosted pvp contests state "only 4 skills allowed", why? Because not every class can swap skills. Rogues are the squishiest class, if you exclude a non-shielded mage, because we have no buffs except for veil, which is inefficient to use in a 1v1. In short, we would die very fast when we skill swap if we do not run for our packs.

In the end we can argue all day but my argument is correct, using 4+ skills gives an unfair advantage - thus making the opposing class OP.

[Bless]

Also, I'm sick of these recent "nerf this buff this" threads regarding skills because STG will make changes to the skill system, we dont know how it'll affect balance. Wait and see?!

[ClumsyCactus]

How is skill swapping unfair? It doesn't bypass cool downs and doesn't allow a higher number of skills mapped at a time.

Pet spamming DOES bypass the cool down and therefore gives an unfair advantage (especially to players with mana issues).

At rogues though, I have a friend with maxed mage gear (mythics, arcane staff, sammael, the works) and he is one hit by rogues if they have a ring, crit, and he doesn't have shield up. That is OP. Its one situation, but its a situation that should be fixed.
But i have literally never defeated a really strong mage in pvp... They stun me, and in Done because of my Low health. Its the one Who attacks first Who wins... And also, dont take my post too serious, because i started engame pvp yesterday.

[falmear]

Rogues are fine. Rogues dont need nerfs, its bad enough our dodge is useless.


So is hit chance reduction. Fireball has scorch upgrade which is 25% reduce chance to hit, but this basically does nothing in PvP from my testing. Not going to stop aimed shot. At best I think it just will make auto attack miss. So its not just dodge. If you want dodge working, then you also need to make hit chance reduction and make it comparable to dodge. Because its always stuck at 25% regardless if mage is level 2 or level 41.

[Bless]

Rogues are fine. Rogues dont need nerfs, its bad enough our dodge is useless.


So is hit chance reduction. Fireball has scorch upgrade which is 25% reduce chance to hit, but this basically does nothing in PvP from my testing. Not going to stop aimed shot. At best I think it just will make auto attack miss. So its not just dodge. If you want dodge working, then you also need to make hit chance reduction and make it comparable to dodge. Because its always stuck at 25% regardless if mage is level 2 or level 41.
Your point is valid but dodge would easily have a higher impact as rogues can reach over 75% dodge with malison buff and razer shield.

And because the dodge-in-pvp will not happen, we both come to an agreement that rogues do not need to be nerfed, crit wise, because a rogue's specialty is crit, dodge and damage. Dodge is instantly eliminated in pvp, so nerfing crit means another major stat has been nerfed.

To be honest, the classes are pretty much fine, its either the super OP or the super UP (gear differences) guys who say pvp is unbalanced.

[Crowsfoot]

@crow Its unfair because it uses more than the intended skills on the UI - heck even STG hosted pvp contests state "only 4 skills allowed", why? Because not every class can swap skills. Rogues are the squishiest class, if you exclude a non-shielded mage, because we have no buffs except for veil, which is inefficient to use in a 1v1. In short, we would die very fast when we skill swap if we do not run for our packs.

In the end we can argue all day but my argument is correct, using 4+ skills gives an unfair advantage - thus making the opposing class OP.
Show me the link where they said skill swapping wasn't alowd. Any stun pet gives you the opportunity to skill swap, so don't give me that "rogues can't skill swap" routine. The truth is that rogues don't have any powerhouse skills like VB or Jugg that come with long cool downs. Most rogue skills have a short cool down and therefore their is no distinct advantage to skill swapping.

The only reason skill swapping is frowned upon by other players is because it is almost exclusively used by warriors. Rogues kite, am I going to make a rule against it and label any rogue who kites a cheater? No, I'm going to spec axe and pull you in for a nice hug.

[Crowsfoot]

Your point is valid but dodge would easily have a higher impact as rogues can reach over 75% dodge with malison buff and razer shield.

And because the dodge-in-pvp will not happen, we both come to an agreement that rogues do not need to be nerfed, crit wise, because a rogue's specialty is crit, dodge and damage. Dodge is instantly eliminated in pvp, so nerfing crit means another major stat has been nerfed.

To be honest, the classes are pretty much fine, its either the super OP or the super UP (gear differences) guys who say pvp is unbalanced.
Fix dodge and nerf crit, fine by me. Just don't let rogues one hit and I'm happy. The one thing to remember is that 100% dodge isn't 100% the dodge rate is curved to avoid immortality. How far it should be dimminsihed is open for discussion.

[Crowsfoot]

But i have literally never defeated a really strong mage in pvp... They stun me, and in Done because of my Low health. Its the one Who attacks first Who wins... And also, dont take my post too serious, because i started engame pvp yesterday.
Great rhetoric.

[Anarchist]

Seriously, another pvp thread?

[Bless]

@crow Its unfair because it uses more than the intended skills on the UI - heck even STG hosted pvp contests state "only 4 skills allowed", why? Because not every class can swap skills. Rogues are the squishiest class, if you exclude a non-shielded mage, because we have no buffs except for veil, which is inefficient to use in a 1v1. In short, we would die very fast when we skill swap if we do not run for our packs.

In the end we can argue all day but my argument is correct, using 4+ skills gives an unfair advantage - thus making the opposing class OP.
Show me the link where they said skill swapping wasn't alowd. Any stun pet gives you the opportunity to skill swap, so don't give me that "rogues can't skill swap" routine. The truth is that rogues don't have any powerhouse skills like VB or Jugg that come with long cool downs. Most rogue skills have a short cool down and therefore their is no distinct advantage to skill swapping.

The only reason skill swapping is frowned upon by other players is because it is almost exclusively used by warriors. Rogues kite, am I going to make a rule against it and label any rogue who kites a cheater? No, I'm going to spec axe and pull you in for a nice hug.

I never said it isnt allowed, it is just frowned upon, even by devs, look at the legend of the week threads for your proof. But it does give an unfair advantage, does it not? Not everybody can swap skills (esp rogues), regardless of the situation. Using 5 skills as a rogue is pretty op, with veil or razer. Also the powerhouse skills as you mention, have their disadvantages - VB or Jugg are purely defensive therefore they are not all supposed to be used at once. Skill swapping allows tanks to use 3 attack skills as well the 2 defense skills, in my eyes that's unintended - pretty op.

The kiting thing you are talking about is strategy. The piercer dashes was built into gameplay, with a clear intention: kite. But skill swapping is not built into gameplay, otherwise there'd be 5 skill slots.

Also, you actually think sts would allow dodgeable skills in pvp (replaced by a crit nerf)? After what happened to PL pvp? Hah! Imo its absurd even thinking about it.

[Zeus]

LOL, are you kidding? Rogues are the most OP right now. No warrior should beat a maxed rogue 1v1 and rogues can freaking one hit mages. I have multiple friends who play all three classes NEVER have I heard rogues should have lower mana consumption nor warriors should have their armor nerfed.

What I have heard:
-All classes get a damage nerf
-Mages get an armor buff
-Rogues get a crit nerf

Well, in that scenario rogues get no benefits at all, so it would effectively switch the scales? O_O

Rogue vs. Mage is pretty even right now if you know what you're doing.

The main issue is mage vs warrior.

[Madnex]

Well, in that scenario rogues get no benefits at all, so it would effectively switch the scales? O_O

Rogue vs. Mage is pretty even right now if you know what you're doing.

The main issue is mage vs warrior.
Exactly. Skill swapping is frowned upon simply because it was not intended. They didn't design the skills to be used in that way and therefore there is no balance in a fight between a skill swapper and a normal player.

Warriors who use five or six skills are overpowered. Having two skills that can keep your target feeble while veng keeps your mana up should not have been possible without sacrificing damage output (versus rogues whose strong point is high critical rate). The same thing goes for jugg; being immune to stuns and almost invincible below 25% (sorcs and DoT are synonymous) should come at a greater cost than a two second pause.

The only way that this works out is because high end gear is OP, sorcs have resorted to five skills that prolongs the fights enough to be considered "fair" and finally, Aimed Shot being bugged. In addition, invulnerability shield and 80% heal seems like another thing that overcompensates what used to be a warrior's low damage output.

The situation is pretty unbalanced at the moment from many viewpoints but I will personally wait to see how the skill system changes will affect it. Suggestions to fix its current state seem unneeded and justly unnoticeable.