End Game Balance Discussion

[Samhayne]

Looking for good input on possible balance changes for end game pvp.

Thanks!

[Soulsearch]

Bring back bird's and mage's buff's up and nerf savage please!

[Nihiliste]

Well, for one, level 9 skills should be lowered back to level 7. Also, there have been a couple of very good threads discussing balancing which some our forumers can link you to!

[quantionus]

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?152289-This-has-gotten-outahand/page3

i didnt read the whole thread but i guess there should be something useful

[Samhayne]

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?152289-This-has-gotten-outahand/page3

i didnt read the whole thread but i guess there should be something useful

Not much useful in that thread, thanks tho!

[FortalWao]

I don't see why lowering the overall dmg and dodge and increasing armor wouldn't work... Also bring skills back to 7

[Caiahar]

This thread here:
http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?132705-Time-For-A-New-Era-Help-in-the-quest-to-restore-PVP&highlight=balance

Many forumers contributed to that thread.

[Ssneakykills]

Take a look at these Sam

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?143176-A-modest-proposal-for-gear-stats-etc-for-End-Game&highlight=Tank

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?132705-Time-For-A-New-Era-Help-in-the-quest-to-restore-PVP

^^ very good one from my old friend

[Samhayne]

Thanks guys :)

[asadriob]

Why not low lvl too?

[Ssneakykills]

If you want more threads I could sure find some

[Impact]

Why not low lvl too?
Yep, bears r overpowered....
To create fair play for all lvls of pvp,how bout nerfing bears and plat pack OR unnerf dmg and buff nerf for lvls under 65 or something while ur at it.
As for endgame, nerf savage for sure and its op stats and dmg.

[Sus]

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?122775-Game-mechanics-and-equipment-a-thread-to-reform-PL-and-re-establish-class-balance beast thread here

[Bous]

Nerf bear hell scream and savage
Bear are up close combat at shouldn't be able to stun at 12m I understand beckon but birds and mages should have a chance to kite.

Also restoring the old buffs/skill damage. Every cap since the beginning was based on the high crit and damage buffs and all of a sudden they get nerfed because only at l76 it's overpowered. Pretty much ruined every other level since mages can easily kite heal and gg

[Impact]

Nerf bear hell scream and savage
Bear are up close combat at shouldn't be able to stun at 12m I understand beckon but birds and mages should have a chance to kite.

Also restoring the old buffs/skill damage. Every cap since the beginning was based on the high crit and damage buffs and all of a sudden they get nerfed because only at l76 it's overpowered. Pretty much ruined every other level since mages can easily kite heal and gg
Not if a bears auto does 100 dmg....

[largecommand]

The basic problem isn't bears, it's the set they wield, Savage, plat packs, etc. I'd say undoing damage nerf would help.

[Rescind]

maybe the bear's crushing blow. at low lvls, 6cb takes more damage away than the buffs give. and maybe nerf rage buff on bears since it gives 60 damage which is significantly higher compared to other class buffs.

[Cavoc]

Bring back bird's and mage's buff's up and nerf savage please!

This would make birds once again overpowered. And if savage is nerfed, then they would be even more overpowered than before.


The basic problem isn't bears, it's the set they wield, Savage, plat packs, etc. I'd say undoing damage nerf would help.

Bears are overpowered throughout many level ranges. Granted, this thread is focused on endgame, but bears need a nerf overall.


------

For my input-
birds are absolutely fine how they are.
Int mages are very underpowered.
Bears are an overpowered class in both swift and savage.

I agree that skill levels should be lowered to a 7 maximum.

[cryforop]

Thanks guys :)


imo, there is no need to nerf str set! good birds can actually nuke a pally or a bear in 3 skills. i don't understand why they just don't improve their skills instead.
if you guys nerf str sets, i am sure all bears, pallies will cry and it's just a cycle, no point to do it.

[Burningdex]

um.. no damage decrease

and savage needs to go bai bai

check sewer stats for more un op and more balance

[XghostzX]

Not going to say it again - Savage STR set. Bears are incredibly OP and it's not fun.

-Savage nerf... it's supposed to focus on tanking not damage and OP crits
-Reducing dodge... players rely way too much on it nowadays - it should be purely for birds (but even then I believe it should be lowered a bit).
-Reducing overall damage from players... I blame it partially on the lack of health/armor and the 9 skill points...

[Burningdex]

passives sam ik ht would take effort but tht would keep players happy for a long long time

[Burstnuke]

I say take off damage nerf so birds can be good at all lvls then afterwards Nerf swift a bit so Dex bears and pure birds arent as Op. This will help birds at every pvp lvl be more equal with other classes again.

[smokester]

well can you, the devs, test out some of these suggestions in pvp if you guys have time? i think that would be the most efficient way instead of us here estimating/guessing what would balance out pvp

[cryforop]

well can you, the devs, test out some of these suggestions in pvp if you guys have time? i think that would be the most efficient way instead of us here estimating/guessing what would balance out pvp

agree, it is much better! but tbh, stg has balanced once last year, and look what comes after, dex birds and int mages came out for crying savage sets too op, bears too op.
why don't they just improve themselves, there are many good dex birds which owning bears at end game, just not those who crying here.
i am sure after the new "balancing", beads and str class will complain for op, it just won't stop, so what is the point of changing the situation? why not enjoy what we have in game now?

[Ssneakykills]

agree, it is much better! but tbh, stg has balanced once last year, and look what comes after, dex birds and int mages came out for crying savage sets too op, bears too op.
why don't they just improve themselves, there are many good dex birds which owning bears at end game, just not those who crying here.
i am sure after the new "balancing", beads and str class will complain for op, it just won't stop, so what is the point of changing the situation? why not enjoy what we have in game now?

Can tell you only use savage.. Yawn. No one complained at 50-61 and so on when it was more balanced so

[FFA]

Make str have less damage,armor,dodge, and health. Make int have more armor, And a little less damage. And dex have a little less damage.

[synfullmagic_23110]

Intresting

♥

[Impact]

well can you, the devs, test out some of these suggestions in pvp if you guys have time? i think that would be the most efficient way instead of us here estimating/guessing what would balance out pvp

agree, it is much better! but tbh, stg has balanced once last year, and look what comes after, dex birds and int mages came out for crying savage sets too op, bears too op.
why don't they just improve themselves, there are many good dex birds which owning bears at end game, just not those who crying here.
i am sure after the new "balancing", beads and str class will complain for op, it just won't stop, so what is the point of changing the situation? why not enjoy what we have in game now?
I bet ur a bear

[Laar]

Make str have less damage,armor,dodge, and health. Make int have more armor, And a little less damage. And dex have a little less damage.
No, I think int in endgame is fine. I think dex needs a bit less damage, then int mages stands more of a chance against dex birds.

[Extreme]

Hello Sam,

I would really like to thank you for taking your time to listen to us, finally you listened. As for which class to nerf, I guess all people above have said what I wanted to say, "Bears are very op" and "Nerf savage sets." I just would like a confirmation whether balance is soon or not, once again Thank you.

~Soul

[cryforop]

I bet ur a bear

sorry i am a full int mage

[cryforop]

No, I think int in endgame is fine. I think dex needs a bit less damage, then int mages stands more of a chance against dex birds.

dex birds (i mean good birds) are actually op, *cough.. cold*
they can take out a bear in 3-4 skills, and don't forget the real op skill blindshot which really makes you blind and miss all spells.

[Sheugokin]

I really am happy that Sam is trying really hard. For me these would be awesome:


Evaluate Mage's Fiery set (Increase armor and health at least)

Birds are decent, but maybe a little more dodge? People might disagree on this one

Bears need a nerf on the slashes and combo.

Foxes need an escape buff other than evasion. ( to get out stuns) Fix the rapid bite thing about leaping in. When updating the rapid bite, the fox doesn't leap in.

Rhinos need a bit more damage cause it is impossible to beat a full buffed savage bear with a rhino.

Savage needs A HUGE NERF!

[Crashy]

Bird fights are purely about dodge, luck and the rings they have. Any bird using elite bow sets seem more tanky than a bear. This sometimes makes it impossible to kill birds with other classes.

For instance, bears can't really kill birds if they hit blind shot making it almost impossible to beat birds as a bear. I just see 15-20 skills all dodged.

Mages are a complete fail this cap as they simply get killed with 2 hits from a bird and get rekt by bears with the high damage on savage.

Currently pvp in this cap seems almost completely about luck and the rings.

Idk.... I just think we're over exaggeration how op savage set really is and how birds need more dodge when swift could use some nerfing as well.

***Maybe a quest for elite rings would also help balance pvp.
Or even better, getting rid of the rings in pvp altogether.

[cryforop]

Bird fights are purely about dodge, luck and the rings they have. Any bird using elite bow sets seem more tanky than a bear. This sometimes makes it impossible to kill birds with other classes.

For instance, bears can't really kill birds if they hit blind shot making it almost impossible to beat birds as a bear. I just see 15-20 skills all dodged.

Mages are a complete fail this cap as they simply get killed with 2 hits from a bird and get rekt by bears with the high damage on savage.

Currently pvp in this cap seems almost completely about luck and the rings.


Maybe a quest for elite rings would also help balance pvp.
Or even better, getting rid of the rings in pvp altogether.

totally agree! imo, birds need a nerf!!!

[Extreme]

Bird fights are purely about dodge, luck and the rings they have. Any bird using elite bow sets seem more tanky than a bear. This sometimes makes it impossible to kill birds with other classes.

For instance, bears can't really kill birds if they hit blind shot making it almost impossible to beat birds as a bear. I just see 15-20 skills all dodged.

Mages are a complete fail this cap as they simply get killed with 2 hits from a bird and get rekt by bears with the high damage on savage.

Currently pvp in this cap seems almost completely about luck and the rings.

Idk.... I just think we're over exaggeration how op savage set really is and how birds need more dodge when swift could use some nerfing as well.

***Maybe a quest for elite rings would also help balance pvp.
Or even better, getting rid of the rings in pvp altogether.

This, this is what most bears think, not pointing at you, Andrew. I've played bear for awhile also, its not impossible to beat a bird when they hit blind, its probably the same percentage as when a bear beckons then Hell screams a bird.

Just to balance all class reduce skill points back to 7 rather than 9.

[Caiahar]

Bird fights are purely about dodge, luck and the rings they have. Any bird using elite bow sets seem more tanky than a bear. This sometimes makes it impossible to kill birds with other classes.

For instance, bears can't really kill birds if they hit blind shot making it almost impossible to beat birds as a bear. I just see 15-20 skills all dodged.

Mages are a complete fail this cap as they simply get killed with 2 hits from a bird and get rekt by bears with the high damage on savage.

Currently pvp in this cap seems almost completely about luck and the rings.

Idk.... I just think we're over exaggeration how op savage set really is and how birds need more dodge when swift could use some nerfing as well.

***Maybe a quest for elite rings would also help balance pvp.
Or even better, getting rid of the rings in pvp altogether.

Swift just needs a little dmg nerf,blind is what helps bird beat bears.
I onlt have swift talon set though :/
@cryforop: If you say pvp is fine right now, then youre wrong. And why do you care if savage is nerfed? Because you cant use an op set anymore? Are you the one that will be "crying" if savage is nerfed? There are many good birds and int mages, but even the good ones can get owned by savage, so you cant exactly improve yourself in a snap of a finger. That balance last year wasn't even a balance much for endgame. Birds dodge buff is lower, and theres dmg nerf (which I don't like) and the only people actually "crying" if savage is nerfed are ones who got too used to savage.

[Crashy]

Bird fights are purely about dodge, luck and the rings they have. Any bird using elite bow sets seem more tanky than a bear. This sometimes makes it impossible to kill birds with other classes.

For instance, bears can't really kill birds if they hit blind shot making it almost impossible to beat birds as a bear. I just see 15-20 skills all dodged.

Mages are a complete fail this cap as they simply get killed with 2 hits from a bird and get rekt by bears with the high damage on savage.

Currently pvp in this cap seems almost completely about luck and the rings.

Idk.... I just think we're over exaggeration how op savage set really is and how birds need more dodge when swift could use some nerfing as well.

***Maybe a quest for elite rings would also help balance pvp.
Or even better, getting rid of the rings in pvp altogether.

This, this is what most bears think, not pointing at you, Andrew. I've played bear for awhile also, its not impossible to beat a bird when they hit blind, its probably the same percentage as when a bear beckons then Hell screams a bird.

Just to balance all class reduce skill points back to 7 rather than 9.





Just mentioning what bears think compared to all the birds thinking savage is op and how birds need more dodge.
But don't get me wrong savage does need nerfing, and so does swift.

[cryforop]

Swift just needs a little dmg nerf,blind is what helps bird beat bears.
I onlt have swift talon set though :/
@cryforop: If you say pvp is fine right now, then youre wrong. And why do you care if savage is nerfed? Because you cant use an op set anymore? Are you the one that will be "crying" if savage is nerfed? There are many good birds and int mages, but even the good ones can get owned by savage, so you cant exactly improve yourself in a snap of a finger. That balance last year wasn't even a balance much for endgame. Birds dodge buff is lower, and theres dmg nerf (which I don't like) and the only people actually "crying" if savage is nerfed are ones who got too used to savage.

sorry, i may disappoint you, i am a full int mage lol
i don't cry like your pro guild lol

[Extreme]

Just mentioning what bears think compared to all the birds thinking savage is op and how birds need more dodge.
But don't get me wrong savage does need nerfing, and so does swift.

Yeah, its cool, birds are just right at this stage I'd say.

[cryforop]

Swift just needs a little dmg nerf,blind is what helps bird beat bears.
I onlt have swift talon set though :/
@cryforop: If you say pvp is fine right now, then youre wrong. And why do you care if savage is nerfed? Because you cant use an op set anymore? Are you the one that will be "crying" if savage is nerfed? There are many good birds and int mages, but even the good ones can get owned by savage, so you cant exactly improve yourself in a snap of a finger. That balance last year wasn't even a balance much for endgame. Birds dodge buff is lower, and theres dmg nerf (which I don't like) and the only people actually "crying" if savage is nerfed are ones who got too used to savage.

i am sorry that i may disappoint you, i am a full int mage lol
and i don't cry for op

[SillyJuan]

Nerf bears not savage, add a bit of armor to fiery set. And nerf some plat packs. 7 instead if 9 max attribute points would be nice. Also bring back black dragon sets :D or make prestige levels!

[XghostzX]

Hello Sam,

I would really like to thank you for taking your time to listen to us, finally you listened.

~Soul

Lol easy there, I like Sam he's a cool and dedicated guy but STS doesn't generally follow through with their plans unless it is AL.

[Caiahar]

i am sorry that i may disappoint you, i am a full int mage lol
and i don't cry for op
Then why would you say savage is fine as it is now? Why would you care? After all, if savage gets nerfed, wouldn't it be easier for you?
I also don't have a guild. So don't try that.

[MightyMicah]

Lol easy there, I like Sam he's a cool and dedicated guy but STS doesn't generally follow through with their plans unless it is AL.

My thoughts exactly.

[Sheugokin]

i am sorry that i may disappoint you, i am a full int mage lol
and i don't cry for op

Your name suggests otherwise....

[angeldawn]

Sam

Thanks for trying to work more on the balance.

I think some of the quicker fixes for your team may be

Nerf Savage: savage is meant to be a tanks gear. It should not have the high damage output. A scythe has more damage than a wand. I also think the mana regen should be reduced. A bear shouldn't be able to spam skills without worrying about mana drain. This would also help reduce the OPness of pallies.

Hit %: Needs to be nerfed for many if not all classes. Toons shouldn't have close to 200% hit. Nothing over 100% makes a difference. Additionally, when hit with a hit debuff from a Mage the hit % can still be about 90%+ hit. (What's the point?)

If you nerf the Hit % then the hit debuffs will also need to be nerfed to the appropriate scale or debuffs will be OP.


Fiery Buff: Fiery sets need a health or armor buff. Armor is currently lower from previous cap sets. Will help prevent being two shot.

Birds may also need a health or armor buff to prevent the 2 shots. (I'm just not as familiar with birds)


If you would like supporting numbers for any of these please feel free to ask and I will provide them.

Edit:
I don't not think changing skill to 7 is an answer. 9 is needed for PVE and we can't completely think only of PVP.

[Sheugokin]

Sam

Thanks for trying to work more on the balance.

I think some of the quicker fixes for your team may be

Nerf Savage: savage is meant to be a tanks gear. It should not have the high damage output. A scythe has more damage than a wand. I also think the mana regen should be reduced. A bear shouldn't be able to spam skills without worrying about mana drain. This would also help reduce the OPness of pallies.

Hit %: Needs to be nerfed for many if not all classes. Toons shouldn't have close to 200% hit. Nothing over 100% makes a difference. Additionally, when hit with a hit debuff from a Mage the hit % can still be about 90%+ hit. (What's the point?)

If you nerf the Hit % then the hit debuffs will also need to be nerfed to the appropriate scale or debuffs will be OP.


Fiery Buff: Fiery sets need a health or armor buff. Armor is currently lower from previous cap sets. Will help prevent being two shot.

Birds may also need a health or armor buff to prevent the 2 shots. (I'm just not as familiar with birds)


If you would like supporting numbers for any of these please feel free to ask and I will provide them.

Edit:
I don't not think changing skill to 7 is an answer. 9 is needed for PVE and we can't completely think only of PVP.



The expert has came!!! <3

[HolyLegend]

I'd very much enjoy rhino buffs. It's my favorite class and I barely play it due to the underwhelming results.

[Sheugokin]

I agree with you HolyLegend. I love its laugh more though.

[Caiahar]

I agree with you HolyLegend. I love its laugh more though.
And its cry emote xD
But seriously, I did put suggestions for rhino in the thread I linked to.

[Rescind]

Why is pvp balances only for endgame? :'(

[XghostzX]

Sam

Thanks for trying to work more on the balance.

I think some of the quicker fixes for your team may be

Nerf Savage: savage is meant to be a tanks gear. It should not have the high damage output. A scythe has more damage than a wand. I also think the mana regen should be reduced. A bear shouldn't be able to spam skills without worrying about mana drain. This would also help reduce the OPness of pallies.

Hit %: Needs to be nerfed for many if not all classes. Toons shouldn't have close to 200% hit. Nothing over 100% makes a difference. Additionally, when hit with a hit debuff from a Mage the hit % can still be about 90%+ hit. (What's the point?)

If you nerf the Hit % then the hit debuffs will also need to be nerfed to the appropriate scale or debuffs will be OP.


Fiery Buff: Fiery sets need a health or armor buff. Armor is currently lower from previous cap sets. Will help prevent being two shot.

Birds may also need a health or armor buff to prevent the 2 shots. (I'm just not as familiar with birds)


If you would like supporting numbers for any of these please feel free to ask and I will provide them.

Edit:
I don't not think changing skill to 7 is an answer. 9 is needed for PVE and we can't completely think only of PVP.

This.


I'm a big fan of what Angel set about Mana Regen, and I kind of left it out of the picture. If PvP/PvE consisted of using your skills wisely, players wouldn't be spamming their skills with nonsense - it forces strategizing. Having a 35 twink, I deserve to not have any mana after using my mana shield BECAUSE my mana has been drained... I wanted to the benefits of staying alive just a few seconds longer - that trade-off is very vital.

[Bous]

i am sorry that i may disappoint you, i am a full int mage lol
and i don't cry for op
http://i1288.photobucket.com/albums/b490/thebous/F7EC132F-A333-410C-BCE8-C086FCF3D8BC_zpsrd6zfgas.jpg (http://s1288.photobucket.com/user/thebous/media/F7EC132F-A333-410C-BCE8-C086FCF3D8BC_zpsrd6zfgas.jpg.html)
Seems legit

[Fighter]

Why is pvp balances only for endgame? :'(

I agree.

And I agree with everyone but Sam, dont think only end game. Hundreds of people are playing at lv10-71. Endgame birds' buffs got nerfed but it also killed the low level birds with forgotten bow nerf. I dont know If Sts is watching low level pvp.. A level 10 rhino can beat a level 20 bird. Forgotten bow nerf was true but it ruined the birds. All low level characters must be checked again. If A company makes a game, should take care of everything.

You are doing right but If you want to do nice things for this game, please Listen to each player and care them.

(What about a new expansion for pocket legends? :) )

[for the lulz]

mages drains lol , too op . and ofc savage sets need to be nerfed . Maybe even bears hs , but yea overall the bear class is wildly overpowered

[for the lulz]

dex birds (i mean good birds) are actually op, *cough.. cold*
they can take out a bear in 3-4 skills, and don't forget the real op skill blindshot which really makes you blind and miss all spells.

anyone wud be op with 3pc , crafted black and teh perfect build for birds . Imo birds have suffered the most from the previous nerf , mages have gone savage , the bears are now op af . Something shud be done about the birds to stand a better chance .

[Burningdex]

passives???

[cryforop]

Then why would you say savage is fine as it is now? Why would you care? After all, if savage gets nerfed, wouldn't it be easier for you?
I also don't have a guild. So don't try that.

oh, you still not qualified to join unity!? o.O"

btw, it's easier for me if str set and bears are nerfed but i like to play in a fair way. i don't like these kinds of advantages

[Ks_Leon]

Hello Sam.First of all before we think about PvP lets we see about PvE.When savage been nerf,many PvE player will mad,sad because their become squishy.So in PvP,do you can use something like plague or ward that give negative stats example -12 dodge -40 damage for savage scythe and armor.Then increase the hp on savage set.plus reduce hs on PvP but not in PvE.Make the attribute become main connected to skill like if you are dex bear,the dodge buff like evade and taunt reduce to 16 or taunt stack to 14(its an example).Thats what i thinks.Sorry for bad english.:)

[FortalWao]

well can you, the devs, test out some of these suggestions in pvp if you guys have time? i think that would be the most efficient way instead of us here estimating/guessing what would balance out pvp

agree, it is much better! but tbh, stg has balanced once last year, and look what comes after, dex birds and int mages came out for crying savage sets too op, bears too op.
why don't they just improve themselves, there are many good dex birds which owning bears at end game, just not those who crying here.
i am sure after the new "balancing", beads and str class will complain for op, it just won't stop, so what is the point of changing the situation? why not enjoy what we have in game now?
You're a PvE dude who likely joined PL in 2013. Obviously if the entire community says that it is luck based there isn't much to improve. Sure, sometimes you can nuke a bear because you get lucky, but skill ain't gonna help you much if they dodge your blind and just kill you with beckon stomp. Also I'm willing to fight any of your endgame characters if you see it like that.

[cryforop]

You're a PvE dude who likely joined PL in 2013.

yes i am, so can i express my opinions here? i think new players are welcome to game and forum, isn't it? btw, for most of the time i pve but i do pvp too.


Obviously if the entire community says that it is luck based there isn't much to improve. Sure, sometimes you can nuke a bear because you get lucky, but skill ain't gonna help you much if they dodge your blind and just kill you with beckon stomp. Also I'm willing to fight any of your endgame characters if you see it like that.

not the entire community, just two groups, *cough cough*
if you miss blind, you still have repulse, if you miss repulse, you still have roots.


Also I'm willing to fight any of your endgame characters if you see it like that.

what do you mean? if i am not with you then i have to fight you? if you want to look what am i saying, go try with some good birds like cold and you will know the main problem is... skills, not sts

[Sus]

Oh and another good solution for something, make a quest to kill 100k extra mobs for 2 piece ring and 200k extra mobs in BSM for 3 piece ring if you've already capped. This makes for players to get a ring which makes for less differences between players. And you will get alot of money from platinum for elixers from all kinds of players throughout time.

[Hook]

The class damage nerfs should be taken away. Ruined low lv PvP for Birds, Mages, & Foxes.

As far as endgame. What everyone said. Savage set is very OP.

[cryforop]

Oh and another good solution for something, make a quest to kill 100k extra mobs for 2 piece ring and 200k extra mobs in BSM for 3 piece ring if you've already capped. This makes for players to get a ring which makes for less differences between players. And you will get alot of money from platinum for elixers from all kinds of players throughout time.

this is a very good idea but ppl are actually request to:
1/ nerf savage set
2/ nerf bears
so their birds, mages can be op once again
actually, they just want to make things back to the time before the 2013 nerf lol

[Ssneakykills]

Oh and another good solution for something, make a quest to kill 100k extra mobs for 2 piece ring and 200k extra mobs in BSM for 3 piece ring if you've already capped. This makes for players to get a ring which makes for less differences between players. And you will get alot of money from platinum for elixers from all kinds of players throughout time.

Bearr would never get a ring or rhinos either due to their lower damage compared to other classes but if you changed kills to xp then it's a great idea

[Sus]

Bearr would never get a ring or rhinos either due to their lower damage compared to other classes but if you changed kills to xp then it's a great idea

Yes I meant something like the cyber totems quest. Each and every mob in BSM raises one of those (totems) if u are close enough.

[Rot]

imo, let the bears stay tanky, just lower their 9 rage

and.... pls no discrimination against the bears, they cute

[Waug]

I don't think sam still reading, anyway

Un-nerf everything and make it as it was when bsm were release.

now 1) compress - hit%, crit, dodge, health regean, mana regean by 1.5 fold atleast globaly for pvp only.

example lets assume b4 compress one birds dodge was 50, one bears was 80 and one mages dodge was 20 now after compress dodge by 1.5 fold from everything birds dodge would be 33, bears 53 and mages 13 similary hit%, crit, mana regean and health regean. means whoever however getting 1.5 cmpressed dodge, crit, hit etc overall.

2) Scale armor with dmg, simply means add more armor in every gear proportionetly and lvl wise means l75 sets get more armor than what l70 set gets.

90% problem solved

and it would be parmanent solution not temporary.

well I didn't well explain it but whoever know the core mechanism sould catch it.

[cryforop]

I don't think sam still reading, anyway

Un-nerf everything and make it as it was when bsm were release.

now 1) compress - hit%, crit, dodge, health regean, mana regean by 1.5 fold atleast globaly for pvp only.

example lets assume b4 compress one birds dodge was 50, one bears was 80 and one mages dodge was 20 now after compress dodge by 1.5 fold from everything birds dodge would be 33, bears 53 and mages 13 similary hit%, crit, mana regean and health regean. means whoever however getting 1.5 cmpressed dodge, crit, hit etc overall.

2) Scale armor with dmg, simply means add more armor in every gear proportionetly and lvl wise means l75 sets get more armor than what l70 set gets.

90% problem solved

and it would be parmanent solution not temporary.

well I didn't well explain it but whoever know the core mechanism sould catch it.


that's exactly what people try to have, they just want birds un-nerf

87318

[Waug]

so tell me suddenly what birds got they need to nerf birds significantly? I did not say it was unnecessary, it was necessary.

because its the whole problem lies within in depth where basic parameters such as dofge hit crit etc gone unbalanced and got a level that they were not made for when game was made.

unfortunately I think ur incapable of understanding such in depth things and stay with cheap things like pallies, bears rnot op but birds int mages are, good luck.

[cryforop]

so tell me suddenly what birds got they need to nerf birds significantly? I did not say it was unnecessary, it was necessary.

because its the whole problem lies within in depth where basic parameters such as dofge hit crit etc gone unbalanced and got a level that they were not made for when game was made.

unfortunately I think ur incapable of understanding such in depth things and stay with cheap things like pallies, bears rnot op but birds int mages are, good luck.

i didn't say dex birds and int mages are op,
i think the game now is balanced, good dex birds and good int mages can nuke in 3-4 skills,
i think there is no need to change anything.

many players don't use forum, i'm sure there are many players in game would agree with me, here, the forum is hijacked by a group of dex birds and int mages. any str class who spoke here would got attacked and bullied *cough quantionus cough*

[Extreme]

Lol easy there, I like Sam he's a cool and dedicated guy but STS doesn't generally follow through with their plans unless it is AL.

Didn't mean it that way, but Ily sam.

[Waug]

sorry ur runied by opness ^ though I hv beaten every simgle pally or bear I would love to fight 5 lvl higher player in a balanced situation than fighting same lvl bear or pally. I kept beating 5lvl higher in many low levels that doesn't mean +5 lvl higher rnot op.

also I explained many many times y, I hv no intention to type all that again.

[cryforop]

sorry ur runied by opness ^ though I hv beaten every simgle pally or mage I would love to fight 5 lvl higher player in a balanced situation than fighting same lvl bear or pally.

also I explained many many times y, I hv no intention to type all that again.

yes, u can own every single bears or str classes in game, i agree with this.

those who can't win str classes should learn from you instead of asking stg to nerf this and that.

last year, people saying birds are op, crying on forum and stg made a nerf on birds. now they cry again and ask for a un nerf for birds. if stg really follow their orders... wth!?

[Waug]

have u heard the story where someone was balancing fruits for two persons, and whenever one part was bit bigger he eat a bit than other part seem bigger then he eat a bit from it, it continued and last nothing left.

its not the question of un-nerfing anything its a solution to balace things properly and parmamently.

Look, whenever new cap comes devs try to add stats proportionately other than the armor scaling nothing is wrong in it, so what happened specially in last few caps, few got suddenly op significantly fault lies within game mechanics not birds got extra dodge and got op.

its the solution to repair the mechanism then no need to nerf any specific class, that y I said unnerf everything.

[cryforop]

have u heard the story where someone was balancing fruits for two persons, and whenever one part was bit bigger he eat a bit than other part seem bigger then he eat a bit from it, it continued and last nothing left.

its not the question of un-nerfing anything its a solution to balace things properly and parmamently.

Look, whenever new cap comes devs try to add stats proportionately other than the armor scaling nothing is wrong in it, so what happened specially in last few caps, few got suddenly op significantly fault lies within game mechanics not birds got extra dodge and got op.

its the solution to repair the mechanism then no need to nerf any specific class, that y I said unnerf everything.

unnerf birds sounds better than nerfing both savage and bears, but if unnerf is working, why did stg nerf the birds last year? if they unnerf it, what if people cry again? you know, the new trend... pfffff

[Impact]

Guys forget it they ditched this thread....

[Timelife]

My Suggestions:
Nerf damage of savage scyth.
Either increase the evasion dodge skill of the archers, or add some dodge to the swift bow sets.
Fiery needs a boost, during L71 cap goddess, crusher and phantom were a good balance imo, just the op classes made this level unbalanced, by saying this i mean the following, fiery should have more more armour (260-270?) this way people that Always have used an int mage, will be able to do on their best again, also a little dodge wouldn't be bad (15 base dodge?)

also when you are using a warrior and you fight the same class, this should take skill, and not depending on who hits hellscream of crushing blow first by Lucky dodge or hits.

and at last, the valiant glory ring boosted with a dragon ring makes it slightly harder, yet unfair to fight someone who doesn't have these, ofcourse it's a reward for capping, i'm not telling to nerf these stats, or removing them, even if you did remove the stats of these rings, i would still say to keep the "sparkle bonus" of a ring, maybe it's an idea to forge the valiant glory rings (wich doesn't give stats) with any kind of other ring, so the stats would be fair for anyone while you still have those sexy sparkles on your twink... or maybe reconsider the opputunity for people to obtain a 3 pc ring, by doing elite quests or completing all quests?

that's how i think we can make endgame fun again and very balanced, think it over.

Greetings!

[Waug]

unnerf birds sounds better than nerfing both savage and bears, but if unnerf is working, why did stg nerf the birds last year? if they unnerf it, what if people cry again? you know, the new trend... pfffff

y u can't think above nerf and unnerf its not my subjuct in main post here.

let me simply, assume someone got op due to mechanical fault, than u nerfed it, now if u gonna eliminate/repair that fault then wouldn't be double nerf? one manual nerf + one due to repair.

[cryforop]

y u can't think above nerf and unnerf its not my subjuct in main post here.

let me simply, assume someone got op due to mechanical fault, than u nerfed it, now if u gonna eliminate/repair that fault then wouldn't be double nerf? one manual nerf + one due to repair.

i got your point but i will choose keep the stat now, why changing it? it is what it is.

[Waug]

^ its what ruined pvp

[cryforop]

^ its what ruined pvp

before the nerf last year, people said pvp was unbalanced too. what's the difference? people just complain, there is no way out. so why changing any thing, so listening to those people? they are customers of stg, i am a customer of stg too.

[cryforop]

if the "change" can fix every thing, i will be very happy to see it, if it is not, why doing a favour to "a certain group" of players?

[Caiahar]

before the nerf last year, people said pvp was unbalanced too. what's the difference? people just complain, there is no way out. so why changing any thing, so listening to those people? they are customers of stg, i am a customer of stg too.

Because last year almost no one actually asked for the dmg, bird, and mage nerf.
And please don't bring Unity into this....

[cryforop]

Because last year almost no one actually asked for the dmg, bird, and mage nerf.
And please don't bring Unity into this....

you are bringing unity in, i didn't name it out
gj shadowstar

btw, this thread is not discussing unity so... peace

[Caiahar]

you are bringing unity in, i didn't name it out
gj shadowstar

btw, this thread is not discussing unity so... peace


oh, you still not qualified to join unity!? o.O"

btw, it's easier for me if str set and bears are nerfed but i like to play in a fair way. i don't like these kinds of advantages
Yes

[SillyJuan]

I don't think sam still reading, anyway

Un-nerf everything and make it as it was when bsm were release.

now 1) compress - hit%, crit, dodge, health regean, mana regean by 1.5 fold atleast globaly for pvp only.

example lets assume b4 compress one birds dodge was 50, one bears was 80 and one mages dodge was 20 now after compress dodge by 1.5 fold from everything birds dodge would be 33, bears 53 and mages 13 similary hit%, crit, mana regean and health regean. means whoever however getting 1.5 cmpressed dodge, crit, hit etc overall.

2) Scale armor with dmg, simply means add more armor in every gear proportionetly and lvl wise means l75 sets get more armor than what l70 set gets.

90% problem solved

and it would be parmanent solution not temporary.

well I didn't well explain it but whoever know the core mechanism sould catch it.

Lol!

[Impact]

How to fix:
Remove the useless nerfs for lvls under 65 ONLY, nerf savages dmg and crit, make dex less op at endgame, boost int armour. And boost fox and rhino, there everyone besides "pro" beckon stomp bears are unhappy

[Fighter]

The class damage nerfs should be taken away. Ruined low lv PvP for Birds, Mages, & Foxes.

As far as endgame. What everyone said. Savage set is very OP.

this.

I think forgotten bow need to be buffed again because there is not much damage difference between 10 and 20. +20-40 damage boost could be better. Same about halloween stuffs. Then damage buff skills should be nerfed. Rhinos', bears's etc..

Pvp is not only endgame or +56 level. Please think the other levels. Some nerfs ruined low level birds. A bird has no way for own a rhino at same level. I would recommend it again.

This thread is nice but pvp is not only endgame. I say again, hundreds of players are playing at 10-71 pvp.

[Fighter]

How to fix:
Remove the useless nerfs for lvls under 65 ONLY, nerf savages dmg and crit, make dex less op at endgame, boost int armour. And boost fox and rhino, there everyone besides "pro" beckon stomp bears are unhappy

and nerf savage's dodge too. 3pc savage birds always dodge the hits and never miss his hits. everything is wrong low level.

[Kanital]

Savage needs a crit chance nerf or damage nerf, also the bear hs, and aoe spell 12m that removes 80hit compared to birds that removes 60hit + damage is pretty op, egg should give stats along to the class also, like you guys did for crown during the 56 cap, it should only be a little better armor or/and damage than the original wing, not boost them of a better version of savage sheild. The talon set should also not give more dodge as set bonus (IMO). You should also rethink fiery, maybe less damage and more armor.

[Kanital]

you could also rethink the crit damage along to class also? would be simple way to do it

[Lexlyde]

Not going to say it again - Savage STR set. Bears are incredibly OP and it's not fun.

-Savage nerf... it's supposed to focus on tanking not damage and OP crits
-Reducing dodge... players rely way too much on it nowadays - it should be purely for birds (but even then I believe it should be lowered a bit).
-Reducing overall damage from players... I blame it partially on the lack of health/armor and the 9 skill points...
This would affect twinks way too much, ok endgame sucks, but some twink lvl are balanced so pls think about twinks too.

[Gracious]

The class damage nerfs should be taken away. Ruined low lv PvP for Birds, Mages, & Foxes.

As far as endgame. What everyone said. Savage set is very OP.

this.

I think forgotten bow need to be buffed again because there is not much damage difference between 10 and 20. +20-40 damage boost could be better. Same about halloween stuffs. Then damage buff skills should be nerfed. Rhinos', bears's etc..

Pvp is not only endgame or +56 level. Please think the other levels. Some nerfs ruined low level birds. A bird has no way for own a rhino at same level. I would recommend it again.

This thread is nice but pvp is not only endgame. I say again, hundreds of players are playing at 10-71 pvp. what does buffing up a particular and still OP weapon have to do with class balance? Elaborate please. (I only read as far as "make op f bows more op")

[Burstnuke]

this.

I think forgotten bow need to be buffed again because there is not much damage difference between 10 and 20. +20-40 damage boost could be better. Same about halloween stuffs. Then damage buff skills should be nerfed. Rhinos', bears's etc..

Pvp is not only endgame or +56 level. Please think the other levels. Some nerfs ruined low level birds. A bird has no way for own a rhino at same level. I would recommend it again.

This thread is nice but pvp is not only endgame. I say again, hundreds of players are playing at 10-71 pvp.

No forgotten bow is what ruined low lvl pvp at first.

[MightyMicah]

I haven't said much because I'm no balance master but I know a couple things for certain.
1. Do NOT revert the nerf on forgotten/Halloween weapons. That will make this game even more a disaster than it already is when it comes to balance and economy. If anything, buff the current farmable weapons to the level fbows/Halloween were once at. However, I would say don't even do that.
2. Do NOT revert the class nerfs. Many are complaining but I remember pre forg and pre class nerf and it was less balanced across the board than it is now.

We want forward progress! Don't take us backwards.

[Zeus]

Here are my thoughts:

Savage:
I wouldn't nerf the armor or dodge of this set, as it is a bear's bread and butter. Players aren't thinking what the effect will be if they nerf the very vital stats that a bear has to rely on. So, if not nerf the armor or dodge, what to nerf? Well, bears are supposed to be survivable, along with anything that wears a savage set so nerfing the armor and dodge as stated before simply is not viable. However, damage is quite high with the savage set, so I would suggest to nerf that as a combination of high armor + dodge + damage is a give all with not many countermeasures to keep the balance.

Skills:
The buff skills were nerfed, which is fine. However, I do not think that drawing the skills back to L7 is a good idea either. Players are just thinking what worked before things went haywire in terms of balance. So, what I would suggest nerfing is the debuffs. Debuffs, along with buffs, should not make or break a fight. Rather, they should just improve your chances of winning. As of right now, debuffs are overpowered. Attack skills have even grown debuffs, so what to do? I would cut all the debuffs by 30-50%, this way a successful hell scream, crushing blow, or blind shot does not determine the fate of the match. However, I do think the 12mm range of Hell Scream should remain. Why? With everything having such high damage, bears do require a way to catch up...especially if we are nerfing debuffs.

Damage:
If you are nerfing debuffs, damage might have to be slightly scaled back. I am not saying a full scale back, but I am saying just enough to allow debuffs to continue to be viable in a skill set but not powerful enough to determine the outcome of a fight.

[Sheugokin]

Here are my thoughts:

Savage:
I wouldn't nerf the armor or dodge of this set, as it is a bear's bread and butter. Players aren't thinking what the effect will be if they nerf the very vital stats that a bear has to rely on. So, if not nerf the armor or dodge, what to nerf? Well, bears are supposed to be survivable, along with anything that wears a savage set so nerfing the armor and dodge as stated before simply is not viable. However, damage is quite high with the savage set, so I would suggest to nerf that as a combination of high armor + dodge + damage is a give all with not many countermeasures to keep the balance.

Skills:
The buff skills were nerfed, which is fine. However, I do not think that drawing the skills back to L7 is a good idea either. Players are just thinking what worked before things went haywire in terms of balance. So, what I would suggest nerfing is the debuffs. Debuffs, along with buffs, should not make or break a fight. Rather, they should just improve your chances of winning. As of right now, debuffs are overpowered. Attack skills have even grown debuffs, so what to do? I would cut all the debuffs by 30-50%, this way a successful hell scream or crushing blow does not determine the fate of the match. However, I do think the 12mm range of Hell Scream should remain. Why? With everything having such high damage, bears do require a way to catch up...especially if we are nerfing debuffs.

Damage:
If you are nerfing debuffs, damage might have to be slightly scaled back. I am not saying a full scale back, but I am saying just enough to allow debuffs to continue to be viable in a skill set but not powerful enough to determine the outcome of a fight.


You comin' back if nerf comes?

[Zeus]

You comin' back if nerf comes?

I'll definitely play to check it out, that's for sure. Wether I stay or not honestly depends on how nostalgic the game is to me. If I do come back though, my interest will not last all that long.

On a side note, the suggestions I posted should do the following:
• Cause paladins to not have that much of an advantage when donning the savage set.
• Give int mages a chance in PvP, once again, and have a chance to beat paladins.
• Bring down the damage of a skilled bear so that it has enough to kill a skilled int mage, paladin, or warbird but it will highly struggle against a bird (which is what a bear should be weak at, according to STG's original combat triangle)

Birds, well, they were already nerfed pretty hard in the last great nerf. So, the only thing they really need is a nerf of blinding shot, along with all other debuffs. When a blind shot lands on a bear or mage, almost no hits are able to land. That's hardly fair. Blinding shot should lower hit just enough to have a noticeable effect but not to the point where you only see "MISS" displaying above your character's head.

[FFA]

I'm calling it now, int will be op. :) just a guess

[Fighter]

No forgotten bow is what ruined low lvl pvp at first.

Not anymore. Str packs are ruining low level now. You will see that If you even play at low level pvp nowadays. Rhinos and mages. Str packs make them op. Str packs are op then fbows and hween stuffs. Plat packs cant be nerfed but items can be. This is same with endgame sets. They can nerf the skills but pl is not a pvp game, they should think pve too. in my mind, all buffs should be same like previous and items-sets' properties should be changed.

[Fighter]

what does buffing up a particular and still OP weapon have to do with class balance? Elaborate please. (I only read as far as "make op f bows more op")

which class is op with a forgotten bow? 22-27 mages? Bears beat them with true skill build. 22-27 bears? Pro kite and talon beat them. but at -20 pvp, fbow has 120 dps but plat pack hammer has 200 dps. Why there is no balance? (I dont mean fbow's dps should be same with hammer's. The balance would be same. Likes endgame balance.) Actually everything is wrong at low level. -20 foxes and birds are unnecessary then (especially birds). The previous nerfs just ruined lv16-31 birds.

My lv20 bird owned a few lv30s before previous nerf. But nowadays A lv10 rhino can own a lv20 bird easily. I'm not kidding. Not somethings, everything is wrong at low level. I always can change my mind maybe my mind was wrong but I know, Low level pvp really really should be changed. This is a chance for change somethings.

[Impact]

No forgotten bow is what ruined low lvl pvp at first.

Not anymore. Str packs are ruining low level now. You will see that If you even play at low level pvp nowadays. Rhinos and mages. Str packs make them op. Str packs are op then fbows and hween stuffs. Plat packs cant be nerfed but items can be. This is same with endgame sets. They can nerf the skills but pl is not a pvp game, they should think pve too. in my mind, all buffs should be same like previous and items-sets' properties should be changed.
Forg 60 rage bears arent op at all? With 600 hp?

[KingFu]

I post latahr

[Gracious]

what does buffing up a particular and still OP weapon have to do with class balance? Elaborate please. (I only read as far as "make op f bows more op")

which class is op with a forgotten bow? 22-27 mages? Bears beat them with true skill build. 22-27 bears? Pro kite and talon beat them. but at -20 pvp, fbow has 120 dps but plat pack hammer has 200 dps. Why there is no balance? (I dont mean fbow's dps should be same with hammer's. The balance would be same. Likes endgame balance.) Actually everything is wrong at low level. -20 foxes and birds are unnecessary then (especially birds). The previous nerfs just ruined lv16-31 birds.

My lv20 bird owned a few lv30s before previous nerf. But nowadays A lv10 rhino can own a lv20 bird easily. I'm not kidding. Not somethings, everything is wrong at low level. I always can change my mind maybe my mind was wrong but I know, Low level pvp really really should be changed. This is a chance for change somethings. while I agree that plat packs are op, comparing plat pack to f bow, f bow users will win. Plat packs have insane damage and insane armor. A level 20 4item plat pack is equal to, if not, has more armor and damage than level 30 frozen campaign items such as shivering and frozen, but users suffer horrible mana regeneration and hit %. Whereas an f bow user can maintain very high damage, hit%, and range against a plat pack user on top of which the f bows blind proc making plat packers low hit % even more so. Both are very overpowered but the forgotten bow is more over powered in comparison in the lower level PvP bracket.

[Waug]

I'm calling it now, int will be op. :) just a guess

Int WILL BE op. Cuz while everyone talks about int mages being so underpowered, but mages r underpowered in terms of armor but has OP DMG, so getting more armor without dmg balance and specially without other specific classes armor adding, it would b.

[Crashy]

Could we please try to stay on topic?
This is a END GAME balance discussion.
Other than that, keep up the nice work:D

[JTZ]

I don't play endgame so my only opinions are mostly about levels 10-20. Something that was ruined from the last nerf were mage fights, they used to be really quick and you could actually nuke, now it's more about whoever can land the most combos or can spam lightning the most. It most often ends up in a mana fight and whoever can regen fastest usually wins. It makes int mages with 40 armor and 10 mana regen pretty op in mage fights, they can just tank and run the usual dex mage's mana and kill them that way. Before the original fbow nerf mages could easily kill each other in just a couple of combos and could even kill a bear fast but now fights for mages take forever and are just boring. So in the pvp balance I want mages to have more damage in lower levels. And a nerf on 20 str plat packs would be nice too...

[synfullmagic_23110]

I think 10-20 has very little chance to get fixed

♥

[quantionus]

all classes hp and damage should be decreased according to their classes so the fights will take long and bird vs bird fights wont be about luck and so on..

[Caiahar]

all classes hp and damage should be decreased according to their classes so the fights will take long and bird vs bird fights wont be about luck and so on..

HP? No way.

All for one, and one for all.

[Schnitzel]

all classes hp and damage should be decreased according to their classes so the fights will take long and bird vs bird fights wont be about luck and so on..

OR
we could decrease damage of savage sets

OR increase health for birds and non bear classes so bears can't beckon stomp and kill

[Everyone'sFavMage]

I post latahr
Same

[XghostzX]

Some pretty good suggestions here!

[Renegade]

Some have already mentioned this but they need to alter all of the sets a bit. Kinda like the sewer sets. They all have certain trade-offs.

The custom set has great crit and damage but very low dodge and armor. Swift should be like that. As for savage, if you're going to have a shield, you should be getting high defensive stats but not high offensive stats.

Same with the wand set. I would like to start seeing staff mages again.

[quantionus]

HP? No way.

All for one, and one for all.

aw my bad sorry i was just gonna right the opposite , increase hp decrease damage

[MightyMicah]

aw my bad sorry i was just gonna right the opposite , increase hp decrease damage

I agree. One of the biggest hindrances to forward progression is the fact that you don't get any additional hp/mana for every level up. To compensate, they've added crazy amounts of critical and hit and dodge and damage.

[quantionus]

if they decrease the damage , crit and increase the hp then fights wont be based on luck. Bear vs bear is pretty much whoever hits hs or cb. Bird vs bird is whoever dodges more ,mostly 3 skills to finish a fight, mage vs mage is probably about whoever dodges. So if they arrange hp , damage , crit then the fights will no longer be about the luck factor. I suppose it is the most effective way of getting rid of that 'LUCK' factor.

[Cavoc]

if they decrease the damage , crit and increase the hp then fights wont be based on luck. Bear vs bear is pretty much whoever hits hs or cb. Bird vs bird is whoever dodges more ,mostly 3 skills to finish a fight, mage vs mage is probably about whoever dodges. So if they arrange hp , damage , crit then the fights will no longer be about the luck factor. I suppose it is the most effective way of getting rid of that 'LUCK' factor.

I agree with this. But I also think they should decrease dodge.

[Impact]

Guys dis idea is ditched as u can see...

[Bous]

Bring back old damage skills, the new l76 sets make endgame Overpowered.

[Caiahar]

Okay, make everything oyster based, everything will be alright.

[quantionus]

I agree with this. But I also think they should decrease dodge.

idc about dodge actually as long as fights last longer than they do now

[Ubernewber]

If we look at the overall picture here endgame isn't the only unbalanced level. I used to see birds quite a bit 50- now they are a rarity because they can't manage to stick around with the Mage who does the same damage output with an effective heal or the bear with massive debuffs

[quantionus]

If we look at the overall picture here endgame isn't the only unbalanced level. I used to see birds quite a bit 50- now they are a rarity because they can't manage to stick around with the Mage who does the same damage output with an effective heal or the bear with massive debuffs

but the thread says 'END GAME' ... sigh

[Burningdex]

devs havent replied in 6 pages?

[Laar]

devs havent replied in 6 pages?
Maybe they gave up on us

[Rescind]

but the thread says 'END GAME' ... sigh

I don't understand why it only has to be for endgame. It should be a general thing for all lvls
I'm sure if you add up every PVP player from 1-71, it would outnumber those who play endgame.

[Ubernewber]

but the thread says 'END GAME' ... sigh

But no one cares about endgame, it will never be fixed anyway :upset:

[Ssneakykills]

Sam has read through the links we posted on first page already theirs no need for him to comment further at this point I guess

[NotYoCookiez]

Nerf INT MAGEs

[Caiahar]

Nerf INT MAGEs

Nerf Cookies!


All for one, and one for all.

[Speedynuke]

SAMHAYNE PLEASE show us that you haven't ditched this thread

[FortalWao]

You're a PvE dude who likely joined PL in 2013.

yes i am, so can i express my opinions here? i think new players are welcome to game and forum, isn't it? btw, for most of the time i pve but i do pvp too.


Obviously if the entire community says that it is luck based there isn't much to improve. Sure, sometimes you can nuke a bear because you get lucky, but skill ain't gonna help you much if they dodge your blind and just kill you with beckon stomp. Also I'm willing to fight any of your endgame characters if you see it like that.

not the entire community, just two groups, *cough cough*
if you miss blind, you still have repulse, if you miss repulse, you still have roots.


Also I'm willing to fight any of your endgame characters if you see it like that.

what do you mean? if i am not with you then i have to fight you? if you want to look what am i saying, go try with some good birds like cold and you will know the main problem is... skills, not sts
Well if you don't do PvP, don't commend on threads regarding PvP. If you think it's about skills, go ahead and fight my savage bear if in your eyes I'm an unskilled player (because you said unskilled people complain because they can't win). As regarding bird vs bear fights, if he dodges blind he will likely hit beckon and then your HP is so low he just needs to hit a single auto/stomp/slash... So yeah, back it up, fight me.

[ucapes]

Just have fun guyz :D

[quantionus]

I don't understand why it only has to be for endgame. It should be a general thing for all lvls
I'm sure if you add up every PVP player from 1-71, it would outnumber those who play endgame.

lmfao why are you telling to me , the devs wanted to balance the endgame , u made me laugh

[FFA]

I had a little hope at one point that there was gonna be a nerf...

[MightyMicah]

I had a little hope at one point that there was gonna be a nerf...

I still have that hope.

[Sheugokin]

I pretty sure that now Sam brought up this discussion that he will do something about it. It would be a waste of time for him to post this if he wasn't gonna do anything.

[Sus]

I pretty sure that now Sam brought up this discussion that he will do something about it. It would be a waste of time for him to post this if he wasn't gonna do anything.

Actually it doesn't work like that, there is a possibility Sam made this thread, and replied the first few times to keep us quiet. We have been wanting a rebalance for a while, and we have been making threads for it on forums. It saves him alot of time considering there won't be these threads anymore. But I can assure you that STS isn't working at it soon for 99.9%.

[Cavoc]

Guys this thread was make less than 2 weeks ago. If they are going to rebalance, they/he has to gather the information and work on it. Don't expect a rebalance as soon as he posts a discussion thread about it. We've waited this long. I think we can wait a little while more before assuming he just ditched this idea.

[MightyMicah]

Guys this thread was make less than 2 weeks ago. If they are going to rebalance, they/he has to gather the information and work on it. Don't expect a rebalance as soon as he posts a discussion thread about it. We've waited this long. I think we can wait a little while more before assuming he just ditched this idea.

This. And believe it or not, despite the millions of threads asking for balance, none of them give STS the knowledge they need to balance things. I feel like they barely play the game, themselves, (if at all?) so what they need is a very in depth and detailed description of what is unbalanced and why. 99% of all of the threads made consisted of nothing but complaining or simply saying, "x is op, nerf it!"

[Samhayne]

This. And believe it or not, despite the millions of threads asking for balance, none of them give STS the knowledge they need to balance things. I feel like they barely play the game, themselves, (if at all?) so what they need is a very in depth and detailed description of what is unbalanced and why. 99% of all of the threads made consisted of nothing but complaining or simply saying, "x is op, nerf it!"

Yeah, that's the problem. It's not done simply, balance is totally subjective and doing a ton of playtesting is very time consuming.

[MightyMicah]

Yeah, that's the problem. It's not done simply, balance is totally subjective and doing a ton of playtesting is very time consuming.

I'll see if I can write up a thread later today or this weekend that goes a little bit in depth on what the issues are. I don't really end game much but I'm pretty sure I understand what's wrong from talking with friends of mind. And I've played most other levels of pvp as well so I'll see what I can come up with.

[Waug]

@sam, take an example thread

www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?148663-STR-vs-non-STR-(DEVS-Please-take-a-look)

problem is ppls play the game does not mean everyone understand the in deapth problems but devs understand the mechanism, definitely they can understand what logic (raised by players) is true and what not if devs just focused on something that someone reputed player said then this is not gonna work and that's the mistake they made last time.

[Caiahar]

I can contribute a bit hopefully, as to making in depth explanation on rhinos on what should be boosted and what not

[XghostzX]

Sooo how about that balance...

[synfullmagic_23110]

Lul I herd they were planning a new cap for al already

♥

[Crashy]

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?155324-Balancing-The-Current-Meta&highlight=balance

[Booked]

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?132705-Time-For-A-New-Era-Help-in-the-quest-to-restore-PVP&highlight=imxoriginal

Sincerily i think that threat is one thats explain which set needs or miss what, also what does each character miss and stuff, i was lazy to see if any other put it but here it is again if someone already did.

[anahadaz]

Looking for good input on possible balance changes for end game pvp.

Thanks!

Sam I don't know if you still read this thread but you HAVE to nerf savage and swift sets, I'm a 75 mage using fiery set and I am always killed immediately by archers and bears, so is every other fiery mage, there is a HUGE imbalance! Either you nerf birds and bears, or you buff fiery set or mages stats because it just isnt fair..

[Etarbitrev]

dex birds (i mean good birds) are actually op, *cough.. cold*
they can take out a bear in 3-4 skills, and don't forget the real op skill blindshot which really makes you blind and miss all spells.
Oh sorry. We don't all have 3pce, egg, black drag and human face. So, before you comment on others try to get "good" yourself on a dex bird without these advantages, then talk here.

[XghostzX]

bump

[Sheugokin]

Lol.........did this thread accomplish much?

[Legallyblonde]

So I thought of an Idea for to help solve some issues regarding the current PvP system. The first idea is to separate players based on gear. Yes, PvP Filters that divide players entering a PvP lobby into Three seperate categories.

Arcane:Players entering a PvP lobby equipped with an Arcane item or acquainted by an Arcane pet will be placed into a lobby with other players with such items. Since most PvP oriented guilds house players touting the best equipment in the game Arcane Lobbies will keep their itch for high lvl competition satisfied.

Mythic:Players entering a PvP lobby with any Mythic items and or pets will be placed here. Considering this applies to many end game players this type of lobby offers a more casual yet still competitive atmosphere.

Legendary:Players entering this Lobby with Legendary items, pets, and rarities of below will be placed here. This lobby offers the most softcore pvp for players and allows casual players a place to play pvp in a comfortable environment.

With these filters you're probably wondering.How does this effect twinks and low lvl pvp? The answer to that is simple. Considering most twinks commonly use Mythic and Arcane pets this helps integrate Twinks into more competitive environments and keeps them seperated from low lvl players testing out pvp or just playing it for fun.

Other Notes
•During PvP matches players can not switch gear. You should plan what you want to use during the match before hand.
•You can not switch pets during PvP matches, I know pets use energy during matches. Oh well, you can simply press the feed button and continue the good fight! (A tiny, yet appreciable gold sink.)
•Spawn blocking is no more! Each room in CtF has three spawn points and now the entire top ridge of Trulle's Forest is a spawn point. Players can spawn anywhere from the top!

What do you guys think?

[xcainnblecterx]

This has been suggested before but yours is definitely more detailed. A couple problems i see
1.) It doesn't stop the new wave of lesser geared community that would pop up from being as bad as the current.
2.) A mythic pet is usually bought with platinum therefore the player with mythic pet may not even have mythic gear.
Thats all i can think of now but i do still like this idea

[Arpluvial]

Legallyblonde, xcainnblecterx, I have moved your posts here since this is the official thread Samhayne posted asking for feedback.

[Legallyblonde]

This has been suggested before but yours is definitely more detailed. A couple problems i see
1.) It doesn't stop the new wave of lesser geared community that would pop up from being as bad as the current.
2.) A mythic pet is usually bought with platinum therefore the player with mythic pet may not even have mythic gear.
Thats all i can think of now but i do still like this idea

I quite don't understand what you mean by 1.) but to answer 2.) A mythic pet is purchased with plats yes, but if the player CHOOSES to enter a PvP lobby with said pet or not is up to them.

[Hahahahabirdy]

Legallyblonde, xcainnblecterx, I have moved your posts here since this is the official thread Samhayne posted asking for feedback.

This is the thread asking for feedback on endgame in PL, not AL.
You already have the developers, don't take our thread too! :,(

[Perf]

Lmao guys forget about a good balance...

[Faliziaga]

Bad omen? :vshock:

[Armourslash]

I'm not that good at 76 pvp because of the amount of 75-76 birds that rush me then I rush them back soon later they leave and join on their elite ring bear and rush me, sick and tired of it, make it only available to use in pve because elite ring bears are ruining pvp.

[Caiahar]

Is our thread really being taken?

[fourleaf]

Is this still going to happen?

Every 5 levels your character could gain 10(x) health
X=
Bears = 1.5
Rhinos = 1.2
Foxes = 1
Birds = .7
Mages = .5

Restore old crit buffs
Lower bears dmg buff to 45 dmg

Change hit debuffs from maxing at 60% so they become and hit and crit debuff of about 30%
Also give fox and rhinos more substantial aoe attacks and hit debuffs

Lower fiery hit% to about 120% on a pure in mage, and buff the armor around 30 points on the wand set 20 pts on the staff sets

Change dodge to affect only damage from auto attack

Negative regen should actually drain health

[SayCreed]

Legallyblonde, xcainnblecterx, I have moved your posts here since this is the official thread Samhayne posted asking for feedback.

This is PL Forums not AL's.


I bet 69g that they will listen to ALs feedback and Ignore This

[Perf]

Is this still going to happen?



No it's not.:grumpy:

[synfullmagic_23110]

Legallyblonde, xcainnblecterx, I have moved your posts here since this is the official thread Samhayne posted asking for feedback.

Wow.....its in pl forum for a reason

♥

[Laar]

Legallyblonde, xcainnblecterx, I have moved your posts here since this is the official thread Samhayne posted asking for feedback.

Wow.....its in pl forum for a reason

♥
For AL to invade yey

[XghostzX]

Literally don't understand why this game can't be balanced. Been way too long.

[SayCreed]

For AL to invade yey

Yah.


Pl forum is gonna get deleted and we gotta be homeless in Al FORUM

[FFA]

Guess it's not happening? So #LongLiveOPSavage?

[Laar]

For AL to invade yey

Yah.


Pl forum is gonna get deleted and we gotta be homeless in Al FORUM
Ur an AL nub anyway so yah

[stopcrying]

Nerf savage..not that hard

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[FFA]

Nerf savage..not that hard

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Only took a week for swift, idk why savage is taking longer.

[Ssneakykills]

Al has just got a massive client update and it caused some bugs so it's delayed the next event and event after that so the whole sts team is working on this so I know for a fact we won't get this balance for at least 3 months

[Sheugokin]

^

Fa reel. This is complete waste of time then.

[Perf]

Al has just got a massive client update and it caused some bugs so it's delayed the next event and event after that so the whole sts team is working on this so I know for a fact we won't get this balance for at least 3 months

We will never get it.

[XghostzX]

This update's never happening lol what happened to PL

[Trenton]

This update's never happening lol what happened to PL

AL happened

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

[HarryBear]

This is a PL thread.. Not AL.

[Laar]

This update's never happening lol what happened to PL

AL happened

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk
Lol

[merchtime]

I like how the devs don't even answer :(

Ign:studied

[fourleaf]

I say they just make one forest fight map with 5x dmg applied and zero dodge
Like the first Mother's Day event and part of Forgotten Event
Dat was so fun