Bulwark Analysis

[Crowsfoot]

<Ehh, Spell checking later. just posting so I stop getting PMs>

The main focus of this thread will be the procs of the Bulwark. Please do not spam comments such as "Yeah, buff the damage" or "damage is only for PvP." If you do so, I will assume you failed to read even the first two line of this thread and therefore I will ignore your comment.

This said, here are the stats of the avatar used for the testing.

97005

I do not have screen shots of the numerous other players who have helped with the proc testing, but I would like to throw thanks out to ER as a whole for allowing me to randomly pull member into elite maps to watch me proc. (I may adjust this later when I can look up exact names. I won't post names for now out of fear of misspelling)

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The Spirit Proc:

The Spirit Proc occurs randomly as the user of the Bulwark takes damage. The proc causes the user of the Bulwark to gain a glowing patch below their feet.

The proc adds +10 Str and +250 armor for 5 seconds and self heals the target 8 times over a period of 10 seconds. After 5 seconds of being active, the armor and StR buff move on to the nearest ally as well as starting that player's self heal.

The self heal returns roughly 5% (+/-2%) of the affected Avatar's HP per tic. The HP returned by the first 4 tics are usually more than the last 4 due to the initial Str buff. The HP return differs for each avatar. A mage's self heal will be based off their personal HP stat NOT the Bulwark user's HP. Therefore you will receive a total of 40% of your max HP returned per proc.

Initial proc with stat buff:
97004

HP return after stat buff wears off:
97006


The total HP return of this effect, for me, is about 2500 by the time all 8 tics of the self heal.

This can be compared to HoR which causes 6 self heals of about 780 with this gear. That's a total of 4680 HP returned. That is about 87% more HP returned than the spirit proc on top of HoR returning the HP faster and effecting all party members at the same time. HoR also heals all allies based off the caster's stats instead of the individual player's HP. Therefore, non ta ks benefit more from HoR's system of healing. HoR also creates a shield that stops all damage intake for just under 3 seconds.

One tic of HoR:
97008

A single potion returns about 30% of the user's HP. In this way, HoR is equal to almost two and a half potions. The Bulwark's spirit i proc is equal to about one and a quarter potions.

One potion:
97009


I would now like to compare the Bulwark's spirit proc to Pavise's proc. The Pavise's proc causes any mob to attack the user during the proc to be stunned. This is a life saver in elite and allows the party to regroup and better align skill rotations without the distraction of potion spamming for about 3 seconds.

The Bulwark proc is not enough to keep a player alive besides for the initial +250 armor buff that makes it easier to survive without guaranteeing it as a stun or total shield (like HoR) causes. The long span of time of which the self heal works (8 tics over 10 seconds) it will not keep you alive or aid much during potion spamming.


Pros of the Spirit Proc:
- The armor proc is a constant number of 250 armor. Thus, it benefits from percentage armor buffs like passive armor and veils instead of conflicting with them.

Cons of the Spirit Proc:
-The over time heal is very low.
-The over time heal relies on each individual's HP instead of the tank's.
-The procs duration from start to finish is 25 seconds. That creates a 25 second window each time in which it cannot proc again even though it affects each party member for only 10 seconds at a time.
-The +10 Str is almost unnoticeable.
-The best part of the proc lasts 5 seconds.


The Spirit Proc sounds really cool on paper, but it is disappointing in practice.


Suggested Changes:

Idea 1) Invigorating Spirit:
-A nova occurs on proc. Allies in range recieve the benefit of the proc.
-Return about 20% of the Bulwark user's HP to allies in range.
-Allies in range are buffed by 250 armor for 5 seconds.

Idea 2) Thick Bark
-No heal
-Buff party armor by 250 for 8 seconds.

Idea 3) Stump the Enemy
-Self buff only.
- increase armor by 250 (or more) for 10 seconds, and maybe self heal. Heal is not required.
-Taunt surrounding enemies.

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The Reflect Proc:

The Reflect Proc will be applied to any target hit by a charged basic attack from the Bulwark. It lasts only a few seconds and applies a -15% hit chance debuff (as confirmed by Carapace). Mobs afflicted by the Reflect Proc will have a partical effect around their feet.

To dismiss previous rumors: This proc does NOT reduce armor and this proc does NOT taunt.

The reflect damage is calculated as about half the users raw damage stat (confirmed by Carapace except for how much if the user's damage stat which was later derived). There is give and take but it should be around half.

In Elite Tindirin maps, the damage dealt from an uncharged basic attack is greater than that of reflect damage. An uncharged basic attack can be used once every second but a charged attack can be used once every 2 seconds. Therefore, there is no gain in damage output gained from charging the Bulwark. In fact, you will deal lower damage charging the Bulwark because most mobs attack slower than once per second. Beyond this, charging the Bulwark's basic attack has a chance to stun mobs, wasting the reflect period and always lowers their hit chance.

Basic attack hit on an Elite Tindirin mob (right number):
97011

Reflect damage on an Elite Tindirin mob:
97012


Pros of the Reflect proc:
-N/A

Cons of the Reflect proc:
-It is calculated using the raw damage stat of a low damage weapon
-It reduces the mobs hit chance while they receive damage by landing hits.
-Mobs can be stunned by charging the bulwark, wasting both the hit chance reduction and the reflect.
-The hit chance reduction is likely has no impact on targets inflicted with the -25% hit chance of fire ball.
-The long charge time is unreasonable when you have to focus on potions.
-the short duration means that boss can be hit with the proc and fail to attack once while it is active.
-You deal more damage by not charging the weapon.


I will admit, I was taken away by this fancy proc at first. The more I tested it, the less impressed I was. I remember claiming it was the better of the Bulwark's two procs. It isn't. The +250 armor proc of the Bulwark is it's best proc. It is also the rarest and shortest lasting proc.


Suggested Changes:

Crucial Change: Don't make it a charge proc.
-Chance to proc by dealing damage.

Idea 1) Pierce
-Throw out the proc entirely and replace it with pierce, chance to deal damage based on armor (Pierce only applies to one attack at a time. It is similar to critical hits in this manner).

Idea 2) A Better Curse
-Base damage reflected off a more warrior friendly stat like HP or armor.
Or
-Base damage reflected off damage intake.

Idea 3) Why fix it? Charge procs are always a failure and the most popular weapons usually have one proc. Just throw this proc out entirely and focus on making the main proc effective.

Or

Idea 4) Leaves Them Alone
-Still a charge proc (zzz) but the charge time is to be shortened.
-Mobs receive a damage debuff.
-Mobs are taunted by charged attacks.

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Don't let the following take away from the main purpose of this thread, the Bulwark's Procs. This just shows that the stats of the Bulwark as compared to a Conqueror's Wall as has been referenced many times without a screen shot.

97025

Above shows the large DPS difference between the Bulwark and a Conqueror's Wall of Potency. Both have +9 Str in gems.

[Serancha]

Nice evaluation.

So as figured, a healing proc is useless in PvE where you are constantly spamming pots anyways. HoR is only really used for shielding the team, not for the health regen it provides. The proc, being a proc, gives you the 250 armor for 5 seconds, but the chances of that happening when you actually need it are very slim.

Reducing hit chance of mobs while they are supposed to be getting damaged by hitting you? Brilliant. (insert sarcasm here)

The proc doesn't stack so can only happen every 25 seconds, minimum? What the hell?

The weapon, has appallingly low damage, equivilant to a crate item worth 3000 gold. Sure it gives you more armor / hp (the amount varies somewhat depending on the other gear you have equipped / gems etc) but the benefits are not in any way enough to rate mythic quality. They certainly don't make it worth it for anyone running with a warrior using this gear.

Damage this bad means much longer runs causing the entire party taking more damage in the span of the run. (Lower damage / longer to kill / mobs live longer so get more hits in). So even though the warrior may save on pots and take less damage, the rest of the team is going to spend a whole lot more on pots (add on another 150-200 mana pots per rogue since they're carrying a damageless tank), and likely die more, especially since the proc doesn't even taunt. Useless.

The healing proc would be of some benefit in PvP, except the weapon is useless for that area due to said lack of damage.

So how exactly is this weapon mythic?

[Crowsfoot]

Nice evaluation.

So as figured, a healing proc is useless in PvE where you are constantly spamming pots anyways. HoR is only really used for shielding the team, not for the health regen it provides. The proc, being a proc, gives you the 250 armor for 5 seconds, but the chances of that happening when you actually need it are very slim.

Reducing hit chance of mobs while they are supposed to be getting damaged by hitting you? Brilliant. (insert sarcasm here)

The proc doesn't stack so can only happen every 25 seconds, minimum? What the hell?

The weapon, has appallingly low damage, equivilant to a crate item worth 3000 gold. Sure it gives you more armor / hp (the amount varies somewhat depending on the other gear you have equipped / gems etc) but the benefits are not in any way enough to rate mythic quality. They certainly don't make it worth it for anyone running with a warrior using this gear.

Damage this bad means much longer runs causing the entire party taking more damage in the span of the run. (Lower damage / longer to kill / mobs live longer so get more hits in). So even though the warrior may save on pots and take less damage, the rest of the team is going to spend a whole lot more on pots (add on another 150-200 mana pots per rogue since they're carrying a damageless tank), and likely die more, especially since the proc doesn't even taunt. Useless.

The healing proc would be of some benefit in PvP, except the weapon is useless for that area due to said lack of damage.

So how exactly is this weapon mythic? Warrior isn't even my main character and I find this insulting to the entire class.
Yes, the Charge proc seemed to have conflicting effects, and the best proc was limited by the second worst. The heal is only the second worst because it might help rogues KS you in PvP.

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My suggestion to fix the Bulwark assuming any change is possible:

1) Add at least +30 DPS; Preferably +50 DPS and +20 Damage, but I won't be picky at this point. Let's make the Bulwark better than a Conqueror's Wall and go from there.

2) Drop the self heal to 20% (down from 40%) of the tank's raw HP (roughly 1200) and return it all at once simultaneously with the +250 armor proc. It will be a nova like effect which only hits allies in range. The proc duration is shortened to 5 seconds and focuses on the most useful part. Remove the +10 Str buff as well, because it serves no purpose.

3) Remove the charge proc and add a Pierce proc. The Pierce proc is a favorite of the Glaive; it makes random attacks, both basic attacks and skills, deal damage based on armor. It is random, similar to critical hits in that manner.

[Serancha]

Damage should be substantially higher than the conqueror wall. I would suggest at least halfway between what it is now and the magmatic of assault. This is a mythic weapon after all.

The damage / dps ratio is what affects charge time. They did state this weapon has a larger charge time because of it's "super awesome" proc. (lol), so this would explain why its dps is lower than the wall for the same damage. Increasing the basic damage would increase the dps at the same time, however, that ratio would possibly only change if they decide to shorten the charge time. Since the weapon isn't worth charging, I don't think shortening it would be a problem.

[Crowsfoot]

Damage should be substantially higher than the conqueror wall. I would suggest at least halfway between what it is now and the magmatic of assault. This is a mythic weapon after all.

The damage / dps ratio is what affects charge time. They did state this weapon has a larger charge time because of it's "super awesome" proc. (lol), so this would explain why its dps is lower than the wall for the same damage. Increasing the basic damage would increase the dps at the same time, however, that ratio would possibly only change if they decide to shorten the charge time. Since the weapon isn't worth charging, I don't think shortening it would be a problem.
97026

That would be about +26 DPS and +35 Damage.

I am still waiting to borrow a glaive for another comparison, so I don't know if I support that large of a stat buff. However, it is Mythic.

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Back to procs where I would like to focus until I know what I need. Throw the charge proc out. It either needs a huge buff or they can just replace it. I almost never charge weapons to begin with.

The charge proc on the arcane staff was a disaster. Let's cut our losses now and improve the main proc. If a sub proc is to be added for extra damage output, make it pierce. This is a high armor weapon that would greatly benefit from pierce.

[Serancha]

Totally agree with the proc thing. They got rid of charge proc for 90% of weapons after season 3. There's no reason they should be using it at all, especially on mythic or arcane weapons, since it's an obvious fail.

[Waheedski]

Based on the above analysis by Crow, the cons totally outweigh the pros. I mean the best proc is +250 armour ??? Ironbite can buff your armour +225!

This mythic bulwark should've laid the conquerer wall weapon and mythic pavise to rest and be the ultimate tanking weapon. Based on the above analysis and how, many warriors are slating this weapon, It is not worthy to be called a mythic warrior weapon especially when something like a cheap sword and shield weapon can give it a good run for it's money - get that, some good gears and a tanking pet and your good to go in elites.

I was really looking forward to the mythic bulwark. I may still buy it if it becomes dirt cheap like a a mill or two.

[Crowsfoot]

Based on the above analysis by Crow, the cons totally outweigh the pros. I mean the best proc is +250 armour ??? Ironbite can buff your armour +225!

This mythic bulwark should've laid the conquerer wall weapon and mythic pavise to rest and be the ultimate tanking weapon. Based on the above analysis and how, many warriors are slating this weapon, It is not worthy to be called a mythic warrior weapon especially when something like a cheap sword and shield weapon can give it a good run for it's money - get that, some good gears and a tanking pet and your good to go in elites.

I was really looking forward to the mythic bulwark. I may still buy it [when] it becomes dirt cheap like a a mill or two.
Fixed

[Waheedski]

fixed

lol ocd ftw :)

[cctv]

Maybe make the dmg reflected equal to half of the dmg taken, then this weapon would be great in pvp against rogue and in elite against high dmg mobs

[Crowsfoot]

Maybe make the dmg reflected equal to half of the dmg taken, then this weapon would be great in pvp against rogue and in elite against high dmg mobs
A rogue crits you 4k and kills themself. OP, won't happen. Basing the reflect off damage intake was my original idea but it is based off mage curse according to Carapace. It may be easier to just throw it out.

Plus: charge procs are terrible so I would like the charge aspect removed no matter what.

[cctv]

A rogue crits you 4k and kills themself. OP, won't happen. Basing the reflect off damage intake was my original idea but it is based off mage curse according to Carapace. It may be easier to just throw it out.

Plus: charge procs are terrible so I would like the charge aspect removed no matter what.

Or reduce 20% of the incoming dmg and reflect them to the enemy around you, this is a lvl41 mythic weapon and it should be as good as rogue's new mythic bow

[Crowsfoot]

A rogue crits you 4k and kills themself. OP, won't happen. Basing the reflect off damage intake was my original idea but it is based off mage curse according to Carapace. It may be easier to just throw it out.

Plus: charge procs are terrible so I would like the charge aspect removed no matter what.


Or reduce 20% of the incoming dmg and reflect them to the enemy around you, this is a lvl41 mythic weapon and it should be as good as rogue's new mythic bow
1) that's still OP.

2) you skipped a part.

[Madnex]

Or reduce 20% of the incoming dmg and reflect them to the enemy around you, this is a lvl41 mythic weapon and it should be as good as rogue's new mythic bow
No it shouldn't, actually. You can't compare a damage weapon with a tanking weapon. Not saying Bulwark doesn't need a DPS buff because it does (and also proc refinements).

Good job on the analysis crow, looking forward to fixes. :)

[Madnex]

PS: Fireball's hit % reduce is 25%.

[Crowsfoot]

No it shouldn't, actually. You can't compare a damage weapon with a tanking weapon. Not saying Bulwark doesn't need a DPS buff because it does (and also proc refinements).

Good job on the analysis crow, looking forward to fixes. :)
The issue is that reflect is based off of raw damage. It is difficult to go back and change the main factor to armor, damage intake, or other factor. Best to just throw it away and replace it in my opinion. The point of the reflect proc is to deal more damage. Pierce will do that without being another ship wreck charge proc.

PS: The Bulwark is a low damage weapon with a proc based on raw damage. Fantastic :/

[Energizeric]

Seems like the proc could use some fixing, but the stats seem very good to me, and much better than the Conquerer's Wall. Just look at the armor and health differences, and even your damage is slightly higher. DPS is probably the least important stat as it does not affect skill damage. Also, mythics have an extra gem slot, which means you can have an extra +6 STR over the Conquerer's Wall with perfect gems, which would give you another 60 health and a couple of extra damage points.

Clearly this is a tanking weapon and probably not very appropriate for PvP, so comparing it to the claymore is like comparing a sorcerer gun to a staff. Yes, the gun will be better in PvP, but not in PvE.

[Benworushi]

dam. i think charge should proc -20%armor, -15%hit its really useless, or -50%hit its ok. .
i and my frd tried this weapon, its worsttank weapon, no one replaced.
maybe bulwark proc is awesome, just bcoz we are too stupid。。。o(￣ヘ￣o)

[Haligali]

A rogue crits you 4k and kills themself. OP, won't happen. Basing the reflect off damage intake was my original idea but it is based off mage curse according to Carapace. It may be easier to just throw it out.

Plus: charge procs are terrible so I would like the charge aspect removed no matter what.

Sorcerer curse is total useless in pve, it a fail if a pve style weapon based on it.

[Crowsfoot]

Sorcerer curse is total useless in pve, it a fail if a pve style weapon based on it.
I didn't think of this but you are absolutely right. Why would we want a Nerfed version that only lasts 1.5 seconds if it is a failure in its prime?

[Crowsfoot]

Seems like the proc could use some fixing, but the stats seem very good to me, and much better than the Conquerer's Wall. Just look at the armor and health differences, and even your damage is slightly higher. DPS is probably the least important stat as it does not affect skill damage. Also, mythics have an extra gem slot, which means you can have an extra +6 STR over the Conquerer's Wall with perfect gems, which would give you another 60 health and a couple of extra damage points.

Clearly this is a tanking weapon and probably not very appropriate for PvP, so comparing it to the claymore is like comparing a sorcerer gun to a staff. Yes, the gun will be better in PvP, but not in PvE.
Please redirect your thoughts toward the proc. I have said multiple times that I am not ready for a stat discussion. Since I do not know my own position. This thread is meant to discuss the procs.

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You note that the skills need some refinement. What changes can you brain storm?

[Energizeric]

Sorcerer curse is total useless in pve, it a fail if a pve style weapon based on it.

The reason for that is because sorcerers do not want to get hit by the mobs and usually keep their distance. But warriors do stay on the front line and take the hits of the mobs and taunt them. So I would think a curse type proc would work well if it was structured right.

[Madnex]

It doesn't really matter who gets hit, Curse's reflect activates each time the target attacks. Curse is a somewhat viable option on certain bosses and mobs like serpents actually.

[Kakashis]

Hmm I guess this weapon needs some proc buffs. It's not even shining in its prime days! The stun from the pavise is very hard to beat.

[Crowsfoot]

The reason for that is because sorcerers do not want to get hit by the mobs and usually keep their distance. But warriors do stay on the front line and take the hits of the mobs and taunt them. So I would think a curse type proc would work well if it was structured right.


It doesn't really matter who gets hit, Curse's reflect activates each time the target attacks. Curse is a somewhat viable option on certain bosses and mobs like serpents actually.
Its based off half of the tank's raw damage. It also only lasts 1.5 seconds.

Why is a low damage weapon having a proc based on raw damage? The glaive had a proc base doff armor as a high armor and high DPS hybrid. The resulting proc was higher damage output than when calculated through damage or DPS (respective to skill or basic attacks).

The reflect proc has no draw for me. You won't have time to charge the stupid thing if there are fast attacking mobs like snakes unless you do small pulls. Why would a party purposefully do small pulls? The charge portion is an utmost fail. If it was a random proc from dealing damage it may have potential, but I don't see that being implemented.

PS: a lot of focus is in the reflect proc? Anyone have a counter idea to my suggested refinement?

[cctv]

No it shouldn't, actually. You can't compare a damage weapon with a tanking weapon. Not saying Bulwark doesn't need a DPS buff because it does (and also proc refinements).

Good job on the analysis crow, looking forward to fixes. :)

Rogue weapon adds 90dmg and warrior weapon adds 100armor. No one can say they are giving the same advantage. 90dmg should be equal to 400 armor.

[Crowsfoot]

Rogue weapon adds 90dmg and warrior weapon adds 100armor. No one can say they are giving the same advantage. 90dmg should be equal to 400 armor.
Oh wow, look. The thread is about procs. The stats arent enough to justify weak procs (period).

If you want discuss buffing purely the stats of the Bulwark instead of refining the procs, please post your own thread. I have one in the works but I am not ready since I am lacking screen shots of 2 major stat comparisons which will help me shape my own opinion.

[Serancha]

How can they market this as a "tanking" weapon, when it has no taunt? Being slow with low damage means every rogue and mage in Arlor is going to be stealing the aggro, and warriors with this weapon will find it difficult to impossible to maintain it.

At the very very least, this should have a powerful taunt proc, and not a charge-to-proc which is useless, especially for taunting. It needs to be frequent and powerful to make up for the lacks we see in the rest of the features here. Taunt proc that triggers on skill use would be a large benefit.

[Newcomx]

I prefer my pavise rather than bulwark, because when I'm in a party with bulwark user fighting Helena, he died often and I'm never die... I'm changing my mind not to buy bulwark

[Crowsfoot]

How can they market this as a "tanking" weapon, when it has no taunt? Being slow with low damage means every rogue and mage in Arlor is going to be stealing the aggro, and warriors with this weapon will find it difficult to impossible to maintain it.

At the very very least, this should have a powerful taunt proc, and not a charge-to-proc which is useless, especially for taunting. It needs to be frequent and powerful to make up for the lacks we see in the rest of the features here. Taunt proc that triggers on skill use would be a large benefit.
To hold aggro on Helena I have to use my myth set. Let's just compare my current tanking loadout to my old one which used a Conqueror's Wall.

New:
97277

Old:
97278

+242 HP
+31.5 Damage
+11.8 DPS
-13 armor

Stats are with Samael equipped.

If I use Druid Potency I lose HP, Damage, and DPS to gain 100 armor.

---

The procs being almost useless doesn't help me rest easy in my investment.

---
---

Back to procs. Do you have any suggested changes Sera, or anyone?

[karrdath]

Great overview crow. Hoping for some change also

[Anarchist]

Seems like the proc could use some fixing, but the stats seem very good to me, and much better than the Conquerer's Wall. Just look at the armor and health differences, and even your damage is slightly higher. DPS is probably the least important stat as it does not affect skill damage. Also, mythics have an extra gem slot, which means you can have an extra +6 STR over the Conquerer's Wall with perfect gems, which would give you another 60 health and a couple of extra damage points.

Clearly this is a tanking weapon and probably not very appropriate for PvP, so comparing it to the claymore is like comparing a sorcerer gun to a staff. Yes, the gun will be better in PvP, but not in PvE.

I swear mate it sounds like you are trolling lol....





Imo the additional heal proc should be moved to normal hits and buffed to horn standards. Something consistent and frequent.

Ps: Good job Crow :)/

[Serancha]

To hold aggro on Helena I have to use my myth set. Let's just compare my current tanking loadout to my old one which used a Conqueror's Wall.

+242 HP
+31.5 Damage
+11.8 DPS
-13 armor

Stats are with Samael equipped.

If I use Druid Potency I lose HP, Damage, and DPS to gain 100 armor.

---

The procs being almost useless doesn't help me rest easy in my investment.

---
---

Back to procs. Do you have any suggested changes Sera, or anyone?

What else is different in these two setups? The bulwark doesn't give 34 more damage over the wall on its own. (I know it's irrelevant but I am just curious).

As far as proc goes, we agree it needs to be uncharged. Preferably proc on skill attacks (Kalizza says weapons in the past have procced on skill, which I was actually not aware of), and add a proper taunt to the weapon to make it more practical for a tank. I have no suggestions for the current procs, since to my mind they are contradictory to each other, and kind of illogical in design. Just my opinion though.

[Crowsfoot]

What else is different in these two setups? The bulwark doesn't give 34 more damage over the wall on its own. (I know it's irrelevant but I am just curious).

As far as proc goes, we agree it needs to be uncharged. Preferably proc on skill attacks (Kalizza says weapons in the past have procced on skill, which I was actually not aware of), and add a proper taunt to the weapon to make it more practical for a tank. I have no suggestions for the current procs, since to my mind they are contradictory to each other, and kind of illogical in design. Just my opinion though.
I use mythic armor with the Bulwark instead of a Druid Will plate.

That adds more Damage/DPS than I lose but my armor is lower than the conqueror's wall set up.

I typically use Samael in elite so I have him equipped which some what exaggerates the Damage and DPS gap. I can post a pet free screenie when I get home later tonite.

---

I have spoilers that describe possible adaptations to the proc. You may want to take a look at those. I agree that the procs contradict themselves in many ways, hence my drive to brainstorm fixes. Stats or no stats, a mythic weapon needs a strong proc.

[Haligali]

I tried a few times running elite with curse, it is useless. 90% of the time it did nothing, since mobs are stunned/rooted/frozen, warrior shields you with horn, arcane shield active, dodge mobs attack, etc

[Madnex]

I tried a few times running elite with curse, it is useless. 90% of the time it did nothing, since mobs are stunned/rooted/frozen, warrior shields you with horn, arcane shield active, dodge mobs attack, etc
Again, damage reflect should happen if their attack doesn't miss no matter the end damage to caster (zero in case shielded). Test it in PvP, if you're under curse you will take reflect damage even if you shoot the wall. It was alright when I tested on serpent mobs, maybe better than frost bolt on non-freezable enemies in general (apart from bosses). Main issue is the the triple cooldown so overall yes, a PvE build shouldn't have it. But, it's viable to replace lighting/frost bolt if a PvP-specialized sorc goes for elites. :)

[Crowsfoot]

Again, damage reflect should happen if their attack doesn't miss no matter the end damage to caster (zero in case shielded). Test it in PvP, if you're under curse you will take reflect damage even if you shoot the wall. It was alright when I tested on serpent mobs, maybe better than frost bolt on non-freezable enemies in general (apart from bosses). Main issue is the the triple cooldown so overall yes, a PvE build shouldn't have it. But, it's viable to replace lighting/frost bolt if a PvP-specialized sorc goes for elites. :)

I didn't see mobs taking damage when the "miss symbol" or dodge apeared.

Certainly worth a retest.

[Saribeau]

ok. imma get to the point.
no charge proc
make armor proc last 8 sec and spread thru to the party
get rid of self heal

Nice evaluation too.

@sts I prefer pavise. a lvl 31 weapon. lol great new myth u have here.

[Crowsfoot]

ok. imma get to the point.
no charge proc
make armor proc last 8 sec and spread thru to the party
get rid of self heal

Nice evaluation too.

@sts I prefer pavise. a lvl 31 weapon. lol great new myth u have here.
So one proc that is +250 armor to the party for 8 seconds?

I'd like to see a secondary proc if his would be the case. None the less, suggestion added to the list.

[utpal]

thats sad bulwark is such useless mythic.
imo,

CHARGED proc should give a shield for "z" sec which decreases x% of dmg intake and stun/dmg enemies within radius/heal user when taking dmg.
but it should need 3+ sec to charge it.
(war is like paladin, and it should hav paladin abilities :D )

And,
normal attack should always debuff dmg. and hav a chance to deal 3x dmg. (since it has low dps and low armour)

Besides, we need serious buff to this bulwark,
we can see rogue has 90+ dmg to it pink counterpart, while war has got no serious buff,
Devs are making rogue domination world.

should change this game to rogue legend. (m angry since bulwark not fixed still)

[Crowsfoot]

thats sad bulwark is such useless mythic.
imo,

CHARGED proc should give a shield for "z" sec which decreases x% of dmg intake and stun/dmg enemies within radius/heal user when taking dmg.
but it should need 3+ sec to charge it.
(war is like paladin, and it should hav paladin abilities :D )

And,
normal attack should always debuff dmg. and hav a chance to deal 3x dmg. (since it has low dps and low armour)

Besides, we need serious buff to this bulwark,
we can see rogue has 90+ dmg to it pink counterpart, while war has got no serious buff,
Devs are making rogue domination world.

should change this game to rogue legend. (m angry since bulwark not fixed still)
Charge time is based on Damage to DPS ratio. You would have to drop the DPS by about 100+ to make it take 7 seconds, I assume.

The second suggestion is pierce + a damage debuff.

I disagree on your reasoning, but agree the Bulwark needs a buff/refinement.

[notfaded1]

Shorten the charge, add dmg debuff and make it have a super almost constant taunt? I'm a rogue and no expert on war for sure but if this is a defensive weapon for party and it's lvl 41 mythic it should be good one.

I'm not sure how with would affect pvp but if some is too OP then just reduce some for pvp map. I get frustrated that pve has to be handicapped by pvp.

[Crowsfoot]

Shorten the charge, add dmg debuff and make it have a super almost constant taunt? I'm a rogue and no expert on war for sure but if this is a defensive weapon for party and it's lvl 41 mythic it should be good one.

I'm not sure how with would affect pvp but if some is too OP then just reduce some for pvp map. I get frustrated that pve has to be handicapped by pvp.
I dislike the part of it being a charge proc, but like the taunt and damage debuff.

Suggestion added to the list.

[Thrucho]

Yeah make the Bulwark's damage and dps greater than the conquerer of assault jk lol.. The 4 Ideas are great hope STS listens to you

[Crowsfoot]

Yeah make the Bulwark's damage and dps greater than the conquerer of assault jk lol.. The 4 Ideas are great hope STS listens to you
I think there are some solid suggestions up there. Of those listed I like the following (ordered most to least desirable) for each proc change:

Spirit proc: 1, 3, 2

Reflect proc: 1, 3, 4, 2

Both of the "Idea 1s" were admittedly my own, but I still prefer them. It is a close call for "Idea 3" for the spirit proc. I do like the taunt part a lot.

[utpal]

didn't saw the spoiler as it didnt came in my browser .
ur ideas r cool too. and resembles with my ideas.

and which part u disagreed my reasoning?
did u see tht rogue getting insane dmg boost?

and bulwark is lackluster in the main areas:
armour, dps, and both the procs.

[Jirikjurasek]

Few notes for pure elite situations

I can see heal 9 times, maybe there is one heal in the start of proc (so total of 10 heal, but I´m not sure). Not 8. But its not so important
the main thing I want to share is two images

Comparison with OLD possibility of Conquerer´s Wall of Potency with NEW possibility of Bulwark
97709

second images shows situation,when I stand in Veil (I always stay in elites) and Bulwark proc
97711

charget attack do the same thing what Vengeful Blood with Conquerer´s Wall: Mana regen and small dmg

Someone said that warr can´t reach 7k HP, he can and very easy with new gem, which IS the best for tanking

Bulwark isnt weak for tanking, however, buff him and it will be just better :-)

[Crowsfoot]

Few notes for pure elite situations

I can see heal 9 times, maybe there is one heal in the start of proc (so total of 10 heal, but I´m not sure). Not 8. But its not so important
the main thing I want to share is two images

Comparison with OLD possibility of Conquerer´s Wall of Potency with NEW possibility of Bulwark
97709

second images shows situation,when I stand in Veil (I always stay in elites) and Bulwark proc
97711

charget attack do the same thing what Vengeful Blood with Conquerer´s Wall: Mana regen and small dmg

Someone said that warr can´t reach 7k HP, he can and very easy with new gem, which IS the best for tanking

Bulwark isnt weak for tanking, however, buff him and it will be just better :-)
I will gladly show you how to isolate the proc so you van count to 8.

The charge proc has nothing to do with VB nor any similarity. Carapace, a Dev, confirmed that the Bulwark's charge proc does the following: -15% chance to hit, and reflect damage based on the Bulwark user's raw damage stat for 1.5 seconds.

Please don't start rumors, in regards to the charge proc.

The spirit proc was entirely my own testing and I will accept changes that are supported with evidence. As always, we are in the same guild so call me any time for a test.

[phillyr]

How can they market this as a "tanking" weapon, when it has no taunt? Being slow with low damage means every rogue and mage in Arlor is going to be stealing the aggro, and warriors with this weapon will find it difficult to impossible to maintain it.

At the very very least, this should have a powerful taunt proc, and not a charge-to-proc which is useless, especially for taunting. It needs to be frequent and powerful to make up for the lacks we see in the rest of the features here. Taunt proc that triggers on skill use would be a large benefit.
This would be beneficial. I cant tell u how many times my old archi blade has brought back straying mobs

[Jirikjurasek]

I will gladly show you how to isolate the proc so you van count to 8.

The charge proc has nothing to do with VB nor any similarity. Carapace, a Dev, confirmed that the Bulwark's charge proc does the following: -15% chance to hit, and reflect damage based on the Bulwark user's raw damage stat for 1.5 seconds.

Please don't start rumors, in regards to the charge proc.

The spirit proc was entirely my own testing and I will accept changes that are supported with evidence. As always, we are in the same guild so call me any time for a test.


Tested few minutes ago, final count of 9 healing ticks

for charget attack, there is one picture, see the blue numbers over my head (+20+20)
97726

testing together will be perfect. I will be on holiday till 20th July, so we can do that after I come back ;-)

[Crowsfoot]

Realistically, I'm listening to the Dev at the end of the day.

97745

Crapace's first post in the thread complaining about the Bulwark's basic attack.

[Saribeau]

Realistically, I'm listening to the Dev at the end of the day.

97745

Crapace's first post in the thread complaining about the Bulwark's basic attack.

look! I said thanks lol @ myself :D

[kiffnshey]

Yes, the Charge proc seemed to have conflicting effects, and the best proc was limited by the second worst. The heal is only the second worst because it might help rogues KS you in PvP.

---

My suggestion to fix the Bulwark assuming any change is possible:

1) Add at least +30 DPS; Preferably +50 DPS and +20 Damage, but I won't be picky at this point. Let's make the Bulwark better than a Conqueror's Wall and go from there.

2) Drop the self heal to 20% (down from 40%) of the tank's raw HP (roughly 1200) and return it all at once simultaneously with the +250 armor proc. It will be a nova like effect which only hits allies in range. The proc duration is shortened to 5 seconds and focuses on the most useful part. Remove the +10 Str buff as well, because it serves no purpose.

3) Remove the charge proc and add a Pierce proc. The Pierce proc is a favorite of the Glaive; it makes random attacks, both basic attacks and skills, deal damage based on armor. It is random, similar to critical hits in that manner.

Yes i agreed with you bulwark need to be fix back 3 suggestion to fix more than enough this is MYTHIC WEAPON not legandary.

[Crowsfoot]

Spoilers removed, subtitles for suggested changes are now color coded, and order of reflect proc's suggested changes has been reordered to avoid a double exclusion.

Note that the Spirit proc has 3 suggested options for changes and the Reflect proc has 4 suggested options for changes. Ideally, one of each is chosen.

[Stefan Bauer]

Seems like this is just going to be passed :( nothing's seems to be happening