More Shadow Cave Changes Coming

[Cinco]

Here's a little heads' up on upcoming changes to the elite Shadow Cave based on your feedback...

1 - The One-Way Path Problem - You will now be required to complete 'Victory Lap' before the 'Shadow Cave' teleporter has a chance of spawning.
2 - Teleporter Spawn Rarity - I made the 'Shadow Cave' teleporter more likely to spawn (since now you have to clear VL ;)
3 - Bosses - Making the bosses not spawn sometimes was a very bad choice. The elite 'Shadow Cave' isn't fun without them, so now they're back.
4 - Drop Rates - Boss Monsters keep their drop rates (offering pink items more rarely than AO3 bosses do). Just mentioning 'cause you might be wondering :)
5 - More Multi-Boss Encounters / Tougher Bosses - I really enjoyed fighting pairs of Shadow D'Jinn. So I added several additional encounters with groups of bosses that are a bit more challenging.

Since there are more bosses it follows that there will be a higher chance of getting boss loot. Not a much higher chance, but a *somewhat* higher chance. Tested all night and it feels pretty fair given the effort of taking down the groups of elite bosses.

Access to the 'Shadow Portal' feels a lot more rare than it did when you just had to wipe out T'Paxx... now that you have to clear VL. However, I feel that it balances out the abundance of boss content in the 'Shadow Caves.'
(You'll see for yourself soon...)

Hope you enjoy it!

- Cinco

[Kossi]

phar,, buy it out lol

[Chubbsy]

Sweet, just make it hard as heck. Tougher boss encounters keep it interesting :)

[Kossi]

should i buy out?

pros- clear vl spawn portal chance
cons- more bosses, harder sub-bosses

[Echelong]

Wow nice thanks.

One question though? will the portal only open in Tpaxx ir any boss in VL after clearing it?

PS you lied to me I was right that time. :-(


You're smelling something else...

Drop rates are okay, imo.

- Cinco

[Chubbsy]

Oh, also, could you consider giving shadow cave trash mobs trash loot? I'd really like to get some gold mid run in case I pot for bosses

[Lesrider]

Oops just sent you a pm, Cinco, before seeing this. I still think my idea could work with it, tho :)

[Formora]

Why would you buy out the market? There will be 100% boss spawn and higher drop rate. Just gotta clear Vl first which isn't very hard.

[Cinco]

Wow nice thanks.

One question though? will the portal only open in Tpaxx ir any boss in VL after clearing it?

PS you lied to me I was right that time. :-(

The portal will appear in the main 'Teleport Hub' room (the one you use to go to all of the separate boss encounter areas).

And yes... I lied :) (Sometimes I lie in the chat room, too.)

- Cinco

[Kossi]

Why would you buy out the market? There will be 100% boss spawn and higher drop rate. Just gotta clear Vl first which isn't very hard.

higher drop rate? where?

[Kossi]

The portal will appear in the main 'Teleport Hub' room (the one you use to go to all of the separate boss encounter areas).

And yes... I lied :) (Sometimes I lie in the chat room, too.)

- Cinco
like you told me this was going to be out before new years..

[Echelong]

The portal will appear in the main 'Teleport Hub' room (the one you use to go to all of the separate boss encounter areas).

And yes... I lied :) (Sometimes I lie in the chat room, too.)

- Cinco

lol Thanks. This will help clear some confusion with where it would spawn.

PS Your mom should have thought you that lying is bad lol /jk of course but still bad even if it is a white lie though

[Cinco]

like you told me this was going to be out before new years..

Yes - another one of my many lies! XD

(I have additional lies scheduled to release prior to the 1.7 update... heads' up :))

- Cinco

[Lesrider]

If VL has to be cleared, I think something needs to be fixed with the hosting issues in the caves. Keep the same host as in VL and perhaps if the host has to leave, the second person to have joined becomes new host?

And I may get a lot of hate mail for this one -- but if all of VL has to be cleared, I think something needs to be done to keep people from just popping in after it's cleared. Maybe only allow invitees to do so, once the original team is in the shadow caves? (so people aren't stuck with a 4-man team when someone disconnects). I dunno, not sure what can be coded in. But if you really want people to work to get to the cave, they shouldn't be allowed to enter cleared VL games.

Edit: I don't think shadow cave games should show up in the "join" list -- they should all be considered locked games and people have to invite friends if they need an extra person. That would also help the random pop-ins of unwanted guests, even if there is no host. I just think if a team is going through all this effort, they have a right to keep it a closed game.

[Kossi]

Yes - another one of my many lies! XD

(I have additional lies scheduled to release prior to the 1.7 update... heads' up :))

- Cinco
cinco.. just wondering for no specific reason.. would YOU buy out the CS?

[Echelong]

Yes - another one of my many lies! XD

(I have additional lies scheduled to release prior to the 1.7 update... heads' up :))

- Cinco

o noes.... Hope you didn't lie about the guilds cause then this forum is going to be a complete chaos of whiners.

[Echelong]

If VL has to be cleared, I think something needs to be fixed with the hosting issues in the caves. Keep the same host as in VL and perhaps if the host has to leave, the second person to have joined becomes new host?

And I may get a lot of hate mail for this one -- but if all of VL has to be cleared, I think something needs to be done to keep people from just popping in after it's cleared. Maybe only allow invitees to do so, once the original team is in the shadow caves? (so people aren't stuck with a 4-man team when someone disconnects). I dunno, not sure what can be coded in. But if you really want people to work to get to the cave, they shouldn't be allowed to enter cleared VL games.

+1 I love that idea then no lvl 1s would ruin the run for us.

[Arterra]

sweet!! i can farm overlord again!

[BlasterBird]

I like this, kind of a compromise. More bosses- less drops. Clear vl- shadow portal. Different boss teams- more drops. good boy cinco!


also, 100th post :)

[Echelong]

sweet!! i can farm overlord again!

Yes we should make a group for tonight.

PS: One "last" question for you Cinco - Do you have to clear the bosses only or all VL? You know we love rushing to the bosses. (I really hope its the bosses only)

[Kossi]

i still dont see myself farming caves..maybe VL once in awhile..

but pvp is the only reason why i play pl, and cinco..rewards are more important than lvl cap rise.

[Lesrider]

i still dont see myself farming caves..maybe VL once in awhile..

but pvp is the only reason why i play pl, and cinco..rewards are more important than lvl cap rise.

I think he agrees. He's mentioned several times he's not sure he wants to raise the level cap.
Of course, that could have been another one of his many lies ;)

[CowboyJim]

Like it all except for having to clear VL for a "chance portal spawn" Makes the caves "unreachable" for casual players or players that only spend a couple hours a day playing. Realize it is great for the "hardcore" guys that have the time to clear VL....so, glad I got my loot when I did as I won't be able to get into the caves except maybe on the weekend....and please let some of the trash mobs drop stuff to offset pot purchases as Chubbsy suggested. Thanks.

edit And I totally agree with Les about locking the Cave games or letting the second player inherit the game if the originator leaves. Had too many runs ruined by level 25 guys in a level 50 dungeon that wouldn't leave and couldn't be booted.

[Arterra]

i still dont see myself farming caves..maybe VL once in awhile..

but pvp is the only reason why i play pl, and cinco..rewards are more important than lvl cap rise.

meh cap raise is still worth it. means a whole new board to base updates and content on. and more pvp maps. I like the cave-like one a lot, but meh, could use something smaller and curvy

[Physiologic]

Yeah, I wondered why there was never more emphasis on hosting capabilities - either passing on host if host disconnects or giving players ability to pass host to one another. Very useful for raids in mmos.

[Arterra]

Like it all except for having to clear VL for a "chance portal spawn" Makes the caves "unreachable" for casual players or players that only spend a couple hours a day playing. Realize it is great for the "hardcore" guys that have the time to clear VL....so, glad I got my loot when I did as I won't be able to get into the caves except maybe on the weekend....and please let some of the trash mobs drop stuff to offset pot purchases as Chubbsy suggested. Thanks.

these are elite content caves. in themselves they take time. these are basically made with hardcore in mind.

[Lesrider]

Like it all except for having to clear VL for a "chance portal spawn" Makes the caves "unreachable" for casual players or players that only spend a couple hours a day playing. Realize it is great for the "hardcore" guys that have the time to clear VL....so, glad I got my loot when I did as I won't be able to get into the caves except maybe on the weekend....and please let some of the trash mobs drop stuff to offset pot purchases as Chubbsy suggested. Thanks.

He didn't say yet whether all mobs have to be cleared or just bosses. If it's bosses, it really doesn't take that long -- compared to the time you'll spend getting through all the caves.
If you have the time to go through the caves (I don't personally see myself doing this too often), then you should have the few extra minutes to go through VL.

[Arterra]

He didn't say yet whether all mobs have to be cleared or just bosses. If it's bosses, it really doesn't take that long -- compared to the time you'll spend getting through all the caves.
If you have the time to go through the caves (I don't personally see myself doing this too often), then you should have the few extra minutes to go through VL.

im willing to bet it's mobs too. we'll just have to find the magic number if it is not all of them

[krazii]

Thanks Cinco, great changes!

Les, the games need to remain open in case someone needs to leave and be replaced. Sometimes you don't have someone to invite so anybody joining is great, also it helps you meet new people. Please leave it open and joinable.

[Lesrider]

Thanks Cinco, great changes!

Les, the games need to remain open in case someone needs to leave and be replaced. Sometimes you don't have someone to invite so anybody joining is great, also it helps you meet new people. Please leave it open and joinable.

Hmm if it's going to be this hard to get in, I don't think 4 people with friends lists should have trouble finding someone who wants in. Just like the first night -- everyone was inviting friends to Caves iv, v. If it's impossible to join randomly, friends will be more likely to take advantage of an invite.

[Echelong]

Thanks Cinco, great changes!

Les, the games need to remain open in case someone needs to leave and be replaced. Sometimes you don't have someone to invite so anybody joining is great, also it helps you meet new people. Please leave it open and joinable.

The hosting needs to be changed. On one run we had a lvl20 on the caves not wanting to leave and since there was no host all we did was leave. Also on the caves you need at least 1 tank for some of the bosses and when you have a party full of int mages (maybe a pally or two) you can't pass and no one wants to leave.

IMO Hosting needs to be address. Giving host to the next person that joined is good enough.

[Ellyidol]

Sounds very good. Almost all problems are gonna be dealt with, and pretty quick too!

Just a concern like Les', I don't think its a good idea to "leave" the portal in a VL map. I've seen the same guy hosting Cave 1-5 on the same character, at the same time. This could mean he completed VL with an alt on it, and kept the alt in the map and just rejoin through friend list so he has constant access to portal. (Sorry, just a valid issue if the point of completing VL is to spawn the portal). Idk how this can be done, but one I could think of is that everyone in that map (assuming you get the chance to "spawn" the portal) gets instantly teleported to the caves instead. This way the existing VL game is over, and no exploit.


Also, still one of the points of Les, is to remove the maps from the Join Game function. You can join through friend list or manually enter the portal is good IMO. Kinda defeats the whole purpose again of clearing VL when you can just join one, assuming there will be a free one.

Same point again with the host issue on cave maps.

Oh, and I think someone confused reading Cinco's post about the drop rates making them "higher", with multi-bosses the drop rate doesn't get higher per se (from 5%-10%) but instead it goes 5% roll two times. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Overall, gonna love this update! More play time for me :)

[krazii]

Yes - another one of my many lies! XD

(I have additional lies scheduled to release prior to the 1.7 update... heads' up :))

- Cinco

Out with it, not the "additional lies" but with some info on where your heading with 1.7, cmon a few snipets to satisfy our hunger!

[Arterra]

lol u be killing the exploit! been saving it since Halloween dungeon... meh never got to use it

[Riccits]

Hmm if it's going to be this hard to get in, I don't think 4 people with friends lists should have trouble finding someone who wants in. Just like the first night -- everyone was inviting friends to Caves iv, v. If it's impossible to join randomly, friends will be more likely to take advantage of an invite.

sincerly... i never saw the teleporter in VL LOL i always joined cave sessions....
and the owner of more cave instances was often 1 guy only.. when someone found teleporter in vl, u just need to invite to that level to could open a cave game..
(am i right..? ;) )

btw:
thx cinco that u listend us!
changes arent bad, but drop rate lower than VL.... i was often some day without a loot in VL and there u kill a boss every 3min... here u need more time for 1 boss... still hard thought..
ill may test out today later :)

AND YES there should always be a hoster! many low levels try to join partys and cant be booted... u cant do anything...

[thugimmortal]

I like it cinco
but what if the last boss on stage 5 had a 100% drop rate on one of the elite items. BUT to stop people just joining lvl 5 to get the pink it should only drop for those who worked through the first 4 stages i would give back hope of at least getting one pink for all the hard work and gold used on pots and elixers

[Lesrider]

Oh and my idea about only letting people join active caves games through friends list --- this would encourage people to actually MAKE friends by being team players and allaround cool people who don't act like jerks. Basically be someone people will want to be friends with and invite to an elite game.

[Ptoast]

Having the ability to set a minimum character level would stop lower levels from joining. That way people could still join a shadow cave game in progress. I also agree about the hosting issue. If the host leaves, someone else needs to become host. Maybe a system were a host can designate the next host or the game can make the 2nd person to have joined host privileges. I would also like to see the mobs have trash loot, so that a person can go into the caves and not blow all of their money on pots and elixers.

[Arterra]

lv 1 and 4 people are no the only problem. i had a lv47 and 48 destroying the team for us, refusing to leave. the 47 didnt even participate in fighting half the time.

[Riccits]

lv 1 and 4 people are no the only problem. i had a lv47 and 48 destroying the team for us, refusing to leave. the 47 didnt even participate in fighting half the time.

i could scream there.... i feel with u....

we had once a lvl 20 in and had to beat witch in four... without bears... ugh...

[Lesrider]

Having the ability to set a minimum character level would stop lower levels from joining. That way people could still join a shadow cave game in progress. I also agree about the hosting issue. If the host leaves, someone else needs to become host. Maybe a system were a host can designate the next host or the game can make the 2nd person to have joined host privileges. I would also like to see the mobs have trash loot, so that a person cam go into the caves and not blow all of their money on pots and elixers.

It still doesn't solve the problem of people staring at the "join game" screen until a spot opens up in one of the games. Doesnt matter what level they are, I would consider this leeching -- leeching off someone else's work to get into the cave. If the devs really want people to work to get in there, they should do away with the caves showing up on the "join game" screen. Any open slots should be filled in by invited friends.

Edit: at the very least, this might take a bit more planning, making sure you have a few friends available before starting the game.
Also, something would of course have to be done to prevent people from getting locked out of the game if the get disconnected. Fixing the host problem would be one way to deal with that -- so they know their friends can hold the spot for them if they get lagged out.

[Echelong]

lv 1 and 4 people are no the only problem. i had a lv47 and 48 destroying the team for us, refusing to leave. the 47 didnt even participate in fighting half the time.

Yes caves are hard for a level lower than 50 because of gear and not skills. Lets hope devs change how the hosting works.

[sabermage]

Having the ability to set a minimum character level would stop lower levels from joining. That way people could still join a shadow cave game in progress. I also agree about the hosting issue. If the host leaves, someone else needs to become host. Maybe a system were a host can designate the next host or the game can make the 2nd person to have joined host privileges. I would also like to see the mobs have trash loot, so that a person can go into the caves and not blow all of their money on pots and elixers.

This is an excellent idea. Setting the minimum level when creating a game. Of course the information would have to pass onto the Shadow Caves too.

I would also suggest that when Victory Lap is cleared, instead of just getting the message to go to town, add the "Go to Shadow Caves" to be shown instead of having to check for a portal.

[Phaded]

It still doesn't solve the problem of people staring at the "join game" screen until a spot opens up in one of the games. Doesnt matter what level they are, I would consider this leeching -- leeching off someone else's work to get into the cave. If the devs really want people to work to get in there, they should do away with the caves showing up on the "join game" screen. Any open slots should be filled in by invited friends.

Edit: at the very least, this might take a bit more planning, making sure you have a few friends available before starting the game.
Also, something would of course have to be done to prevent people from getting locked out of the game if the get disconnected. Fixing the host problem would be one way to deal with that -- so they know their friends can hold the spot for them if they get lagged out.

If this was a desktop mmo I'd agree with you. But it is a mobile game and average time spent in game is probably less than an hour for most people, not the hardcore with nothing else to do.

[relayer]

IMO- If we have to clear VL the portal should always pop at the end, not randomly.

Drop rates could be increased slightly.... to the same as AO3 bosses. Now, you have to put together a good group that is going to stick it out for hours..not easy to do in PL. If we have to dedicate hours to clearing someone in the group should get a pink. Otherwise its just frustrating. I do like the idea of if you clear all 5 levels..at the end the group is rewarded with pinks.

Totally agree with the frustrations of a lower level joining and refusing to leave. Our group ended up leaving the caves because of this. Hopefully 1.7 has something to address hosting issues, level caps, etc.

[Ptoast]

It still doesn't solve the problem of people staring at the "join game" screen until a spot opens up in one of the games. Doesnt matter what level they are, I would consider this leeching -- leeching off someone else's work to get into the cave. If the devs really want people to work to get in there, they should do away with the caves showing up on the "join game" screen. Any open slots should be filled in by invited friends.
I can understand this. It is an elite dungeon, after all. My opinion is slightly biased towards the casual gamer who may not have the time to clear VL and then do the caves. Myself, for example, I don't have alot of time during the week to play but on the weekends, the door is wide open. So my only experience of the caves has been when I was able to join a game in progress. Don't get me wrong, though, I did try to get a portal from Tpaxx a few times.

[ProSophist]

Great effort to fix things up. I like the fact that at least devs still admit their mistakes.

As for the people worrying about low levels joining shadow cave when someone leaves, I think this may be a good time to implement the level 50 limit on dungeons, even just for shadow caves for now.

[Refriedchicken]

I'm PHYSCED. :D

This means more farming, less people leaving after a single boss, and a better chance to make money per trip.

If you have to kill Des, King, OL, Gurg, Keeper, Tpax, you have a good shot of getting a drop in Victory Lap, then the drops in Shadow Caves.

Sounds great.

[Refriedchicken]

IMO- If we have to clear VL the portal should always pop at the end, not randomly.

Drop rates could be increased slightly.... to the same as AO3 bosses. Now, you have to put together a good group that is going to stick it out for hours..not easy to do in PL. If we have to dedicate hours to clearing someone in the group should get a pink. Otherwise its just frustrating. I do like the idea of if you clear all 5 levels..at the end the group is rewarded with pinks.

Totally agree with the frustrations of a lower level joining and refusing to leave. Our group ended up leaving the caves because of this. Hopefully 1.7 has something to address hosting issues, level caps, etc.

Yeah, I agree with the hosting/etc problems, they should really force the leadership on SOMEONE.

I'm tired of level 30s-40s joining, and killing the run.

[Lesrider]

I can understand this. It is an elite dungeon, after all. My opinion is slightly biased towards the casual gamer who may not have the time to clear VL and then do the caves. Myself, for example, I don't have alot of time during the week to play but on the weekends, the door is wide open. So my only experience of the caves has been when I was able to join a game in progress. Don't get me wrong, though, I did try to get a portal from Tpaxx a few times.

It's not like this game doesn't offer other areas for casual gamers. It's called "elite" -- I'm not even sure I'll go through this thing all that much.
But if the devs are adding roadblocks to get into the dungeon, why keep open the option of joining open games? That means only some people have to spend THEIR time getting tothe caves, while others just pop in whenever they please?

Consistency is the key.

[krazii]

I think adding the boot option will help with your issue Les. I also think you need to be more realistic, this is a casual game (even though u play hardcore). I for one, would like to be able to join a group of friends or even those I don't know for a quick cave level. Especially when I only have a little bit of time. Devs, please leave it open to joining and just make sure somebody has the option to boot. I also like the idea of setting a minimum level for games, would be great.

[Lesrider]

I wasn't saying you can't join friends. But I think you should ONLY be able to join friends. Not any open games. Remember, there's no way to create a locked shadows game, so the people spending their time to get in there (it is a large cave) shouldn't have to deal with random, unwanted pop-ins. That's all I'm saying. If your friends want you in their game, then by all means -- join them.

But if everyone likes getting strangers popping into their game who do or don't pull their own weight, don't complain about it when you have a leecher (and lvl 50s can be leeches too).

[drewcapu]

1. Will Boss 4 & 5 eventually become as hard, or harder, than Boss 3? Or are those where you're putting all the extra D'Jinns? :D

2. The night before the nerf, I remember joining a run that had a L47 and a person who was afk a bunch. Needless to say the group gave up at some point. A bunch of others came in and out until finally it looked like a group that was serious. To my surprise, I noticed that I had Boot priveleges at some point. So perhaps there is already some kind of host inheritance going on?

[FluffNStuff]

Are you adding different loot tables to the Djins, or will they still be Lore Keepers?

[GoofyYno]

I'd add to the chorus of applause for the developers listening and correcting issues. Good Job!

I very much agree that an elite dungeon like this should have a lvl 50 criteria to join. I'd prefer this to the booting of players.

I wonder how many people are going to spend the time clearing VL then shadows if the drop rate of pinks is less than VL. Granted there are more bosses, but unless there is a reasonable chance to get an elite item, that's a lot of time invested.

[Arterra]

Are you adding different loot tables to the Djins, or will they still be Lore Keepers?

that is a problem indeed...

[Fyrce]

Problem is when your low level inherits the boot ... I think there is already a boot inherit mechanism. Maybe it should go to the highest level person in group. I don't know but there were times in AO2 when it was the low level that inherited the boot...

I too want to see joining left open, but allow booting and min level (should be 50 in caves until level cap is raised, but if possible to implement, might let 1st host determine min. level of game). I've seen too many games where we need more new people because someone has to leave, battery dies, etc. Real life intrudes. That's the way it is. There's no reason someone cannot play with their buddies just because they do not have hours to spend in PL. There were several times I joined a mostly empty-of-players game and it ended up being a game of my friends. That would not have been possible if I had not been able to start playing in the first place. I've also helped clear out dungeons and had to leave before reaching the boss (dinner, lunch, phone, blah blah). It's good to know the group just has to keep going and someone will likely join.

Just a thought.

Also I have no clue whether Cinco deliberately lie, but I think sometimes the gaming community just surprises them with how fast they get an area and what happens to the rest of the game. Sometimes things just don't happen as planned, I think. But again, that is life. You adjust; things change.

[Kalielle]

Les, if the original VL game is locked, then the caves will also be locked so that only friends can join. So if you want only friends to join, just lock the VL game.

It would be great if the host could lock and unlock the game mid-game. That way if you start with a group of friends you could lock so you don't have to boot unlucky randoms who stumble into your game, but if later your friends leave you can open it up.

My observation on host inheritance is that if the host of a game leaves a game before the map is cleared, then for the next game the new host will be the person who first clicks Next Level. But if the host of the lower game is in the game when the Next Level screen appears, then he will be host for the next level even if he never joins it. Not 100% sure but that's what I observed.

[Baked-Potato]

I agree with Les. I though it should've been that way from day one. Especially now since you have to work to get into the caves, you shouldn't be allowed to join an open game. Only friends from invites. I've ran into a lot of people with full sets, and bragging about more and then saying they never even seen the portal. I understand that there's the casual players that don't really have a lot of time, but there's a lot more leechers IMO. How would you feel if your group cleared VL, a couple of Shadow maps then someone had to go, and a random popped in and happened to get a pink?

[drewcapu]

My observation on host inheritance is that if the host of a game leaves a game before the map is cleared, then for the next game the new host will be the person who first clicks Next Level. But if the host of the lower game is in the game when the Next Level screen appears, then he will be host for the next level even if he never joins it. Not 100% sure but that's what I observed.

Hmm... I think that may be pretty close. IIRC, on the run I was talking about, I came in on Cave 4. I'm *always* quick about clicking Next Level ;)

Also, on the Join screen, I think the game name will probably just have the same (host) name even if the host doesn't join that Next game.

[TwinkTastical]

Haha this is sweet, trashy gear is now even harder to get than good gear =D Idk bout you guys, but im sticking to ao3.

[Ladylove]

Haha this is sweet, trashy gear is now even harder to get than good gear =D Idk bout you guys, but im sticking to ao3.

Yeah, but the new stuff is sellin' like hot cakes.

[Snakespeare]

Well, it seems like it is meant for other people than me. I hope there will be new content for people who can't commit to a 4+ hour game. I am more than willing to pay 20 plat per campaign for good new content for the casual player or the moderately-moneyed player. I get about an hour on the bus going to work and an hour on the bus going home.

Maybe someday I will get to see what this update is like. I'm sure it must be cool.

Can you replace the items that were given in the 100% drops with AO2 whites? It doesn't seem fair that the looters are now gazillionaires. LOL! (Please, it's a joke!)

[Echelong]

Well, it seems like it is meant for other people than me. I hope there will be new content for people who can't commit to a 4+ hour game. I am more than willing to pay 20 plat per campaign for good new content for the casual player or the moderately-moneyed player. I get about an hour on the bus going to work and an hour on the bus going home.

Maybe someday I will get to see what this update is like. I'm sure it must be cool.

Can you replace the items that were given in the 100% drops with AO2 whites? It doesn't seem fair that the looters are now gazillionaires. LOL! (Please, it's a joke!)

If you have AO campaign this is a free area. Even if you are casual you can have one day of the week to play it.

[TwinkTastical]

Yeah, but the new stuff is sellin' like hot cakes.

So are rift sets =D =D =D =D =D =D =D

[screamer]

Edit: I don't think shadow cave games should show up in the "join" list -- they should all be considered locked games and people have to invite friends if they need an extra person. That would also help the random pop-ins of unwanted guests, even if there is no host. I just think if a team is going through all this effort, they have a right to keep it a closed game.

Love this idea. Nothing worse than a camper level 31 farmer ruining your game.

[derricks2]

makes you wonder if they did it on purpose? Make the gear easy to get to get some of it in circulation, then reduce drop rate and make mobs harder. Not that its a bad idea.. but you'd think with drop rates as they are in AO3 that they'd know about how much to make them drop to be fair. Hrmmm. Sneaky

Is their any Lvl 50 content coming for people who have the best armors?? Like some achievement system or some sort of gradual, ongoing character advancement for character distinction?

[Lesrider]

Les, if the original VL game is locked, then the caves will also be locked so that only friends can join. So if you want only friends to join, just lock the VL game.

Are you sure about this?

I still stand by my original suggestion -- if they're going to purposely make it hard to get in there, the shadow caves games should not show up on the "join game" screen. Why give someone the opportunity to pop into different games just to kill the boss, then leave and pop into another one?

[Kalielle]

Maybe someday I will get to see what this update is like. I'm sure it must be cool.

That's a little how I feel right now, having just cleared VL 3 times with my friends and getting 1 shadow and 2 barrels. Clearing VL the first time was actually kind of fun. The second time, whatever. By the third run, it was just tedious, since I have already been practically living in that map ever since AO3 came out. Meanwhile, a friend had to go to work, 2 left for dinner and I have to take a break for lunch. I will definitely come back to it later, but even for someone who practically spends all day in PL like me, the time commitment does seem a bit much.

Any chance we could get a certain portal spawn at the end of VL, now that we have to clear the map? And before people say I just want things easy etc etc - it's not that. Make the new content as difficult as you like, you won't hear me complaining - but please, just let us get to it! Why force us to play over and over again a map we are bored of, just to get to the map we really want to play?

Incidentally, this would also somewhat solve the problem of people constantly searching for games in the join screen or having to stay in a game with no host, since it's not such a big deal to clear VL once to get the portal.

[Norbert]

Any chance we could get a certain portal spawn at the end of VL, now that we have to clear the map? And before people say I just want things easy etc etc - it's not that. Make the new content as difficult as you like, you won't hear me complaining - but please, just let us get to it! Why force us to play over and over again a map we are bored of, just to get to the map we really want to play?

Incidentally, this would also somewhat solve the problem of people constantly searching for games in the join screen or having to stay in a game with no host, since it's not such a big deal to clear VL once to get the portal.

I agree, this would be great. I actually like the idea to clear VL and then get the 'go to shadow caves' option instead of the portal. What would remove the exploit, but still make it reasonable to get to the caves.

I'd still like to know if you have to clear all the mobs or just the bosses in VL. Anyone know? We did one run and cleared everything, but no portal, so not very conclusive. If anyone clears bosses only and finds the portal, let us know!

[Lesrider]

We tried clearing only bosses, but nothing showed up. Then we went back and cleared all mobs (but one was left in the desert lol) and a shadow prisoner showed up in the main entrance. So I'm assuming you have to clear almost the whole board, but still no guarantee of the portal. But if you see the shadow prisoner, you know not to bother looking anymore for the portal.

[Echelong]

We tried clearing only bosses, but nothing showed up. Then we went back and cleared all mobs (but one was left in the desert lol) and a shadow prisoner showed up in the main entrance. So I'm assuming you have to clear almost the whole board, but still no guarantee of the portal. But if you see the shadow prisoner, you know not to bother looking anymore for the portal.

Thanks for the info and it cleared doubts about it. This also means no more rushing on VL which is sad. Still this also means farming more rift, void and Cosmos.

[Lesrider]

Well you could still rush, it just won't get you to the caves.
I wonder if this will start a whole other problem with people looking for rushed VL maps to clear the last few mobs and hope for a portal?

[Echelong]

Well you could still rush, it just won't get you to the caves.
I wonder if this will start a whole other problem with people looking for rushed VL maps to clear the last few mobs and hope for a portal?

yeah well whats the point of rushing if you want the portal? This is going to stop rushing VL. Its the only way to farm both areas.

[Lesrider]

yeah well whats the point of rushing if you want the portal? This is going to stop rushing VL. Its the only way to farm both areas.

Well unless they inplement some way to save your progress in the caves (like in drew's thread), I think a lot of people will still be skipping the caves and just doing VL. I know I personally don't like having to stay in-game for hours with no way to leave without losing your place in the 6-level map.

[FluffNStuff]

Well you could still rush, it just won't get you to the caves.
I wonder if this will start a whole other problem with people looking for rushed VL maps to clear the last few mobs and hope for a portal?

Not sure how this is a problem. I join post Shadow Boxing Games for an faster shot at TPaxx. Only issue is your party does not have 'boot control'.

[Lesrider]

Not sure how this is a problem. I join post Shadow Boxing Games for an faster shot at TPaxx. Only issue is your party does not have 'boot control'.

I dunno, that never bothered me. But it just doesn't seem the same when what you're going after is an entrance to an entire map, and not just a single boss.

Edit: I guess it's because anyone can create a Captive Audience game, but you can't just create a Caves game.

[FluffNStuff]

I dunno, that never bothered me. But it just doesn't seem the same when what you're going after is an entrance to an entire map, and not just a single boss.

Edit: I guess it's because anyone can create a Captive Audience game, but you can't just create a Caves game.

Most likely only gonna mean you can skip the Keeper and ~maybe~ Gurgox, since those are the only bosses the 'shadow questers' do. Find it unlikely a group that is farming all bosses is gonna just leave and not see if the portal opens.

[Lesrider]

Most likely only gonna mean you can skip the Keeper and ~maybe~ Gurgox, since those are the only bosses the 'shadow questers' do. Find it unlikely a group that is farming all bosses is gonna just leave and not see if the portal opens.

I guess it depends where they go from here. If they listen to people and make the portal always appear, then there'll be no reason to check. People will only clear all mobs if they actually want to get into the caves at that moment.

Eh I guess it doesn't make much of a difference. I was just thinking out loud lol.

[Kalielle]

Are you sure about this?


Yes, I'm pretty sure a locked VL game leads to locked caves. At least that's what happened to our group the past 2 days when we farmed caves non-stop.


I know I personally don't like having to stay in-game for hours with no way to leave without losing your place in the 6-level map.

So glad I'm not the only one who feels this way!

An easy solution would be to - dare I say it - just let us host the maps? A random rare portal made sense when the loot was all pinks. Now that the drops are rare, what if we just skipped the whole portal thing? It would certainly solve all the leeching/missing host/no way to save progress/etc problems.

I'm really excited about the new content, and I just wish we'd be able to play it without all this hassle, and play only a little at a time if that's all our schedule allows - which is what I love about PL in the first place.

[Pharcyde]

phar,, buy it out lol

Rofl thanks for makin my day!

[Fyrce]

People do do lots of work and leave all the time. I see it in groups and when we were 1st looking for the Cave portal, I cleared 1/2 of VL, then had to leave. Later I cleared all of it, killed a couple shadow prisoners and had to leave. I think if you can't join Caves games or invite in, the Caves will mostly be empty.

How many people popped the portal and did the entire Caves series top to bottom in one session? I managed to do it once, but not since. And I got lucky on the portal. First game after I logged in and the group was excellent. That's not going to happen often.

I love that you have to clear VL (finally!). It'd be nice to see portal appear more often. I don't know whether drop rate needs to be better than Ao3 drops. I think Ao3 VL drop rates were pretty good already. At least in my experience, you don't have to run too long before a good drop. The caves are longer though... I'm guessing this is something to observe as people play it.

[Lesrider]

Even with hosting, if there's no way to save your progress, you're just gonna keep doing the first levels over and over and never get to the last ones.
I agree it should still go in order and not let people skip to whatever level they want. But a way to save progress would be wonderful.

[Lesrider]

People do do lots of work and leave all the time. I see it in groups and when we were 1st looking for the Cave portal, I cleared 1/2 of VL, then had to leave. Later I cleared all of it, killed a couple shadow prisoners and had to leave. I think if you can't join Caves games or invite in, the Caves will mostly be empty.

How many people popped the portal and did the entire Caves series top to bottom in one session? I managed to do it once, but not since. And I got lucky on the portal. First game after I logged in and the group was excellent. That's not going to happen often.

I love that you have to clear VL (finally!). It'd be nice to see portal appear more often. I don't know whether drop rate needs to be better than Ao3 drops. I think Ao3 VL drop rates were pretty good already. At least in my experience, you don't have to run too long before a good drop. The caves are longer though... I'm guessing this is something to observe as people play it.

Read Drew's thread under Suggestions. I think it would solve almost all the problems.

[Pharcyde]

Fyrce does have a good point. Also you can join shadow games in the join game section. I have mooched many free bosses that way :p.

[Lesrider]

Fyrce does have a good point. Also you can join shadow games in the join game section. I have mooched many free bosses that way :p.

Just proved my point why they shouldn't be on the "join game" list ;)

[Pharcyde]

Just proved my point why they shouldn't be on the "join game" list ;)

lol nothing like joining a game 20 monsters away from the boss that drops armors. :D It makes me feel warm inside.

[Fyrce]

I have also been invited in to help clear a boss (witch, several times). Also Anubis (no clue why here). I've also seen groups break up at the boss (mostly witch LOL) and it takes awhile to form another group. It'd be lots harder if it was just all invites.

[Moogerfooger]

Are you sure about this?

I still stand by my original suggestion -- if they're going to purposely make it hard to get in there, the shadow caves games should not show up on the "join game" screen. Why give someone the opportunity to pop into different games just to kill the boss, then leave and pop into another one?

Totally agree. Hopefully they will address this.

[Kalielle]

Read Drew's thread under Suggestions. I think it would solve almost all the problems.

I did and it's a neat idea, but it seems like a lot of extra work for the devs, whereas allowing us to host any of the levels would be as easy as flicking a switch.

Why is it so important anyway to force people to play all the maps in order? What's wrong with just letting them play whichever levels they need for the gear they're missing? I think people will still farm all maps, just like in VL groups farm different bosses depending on what gear the people in the party need (or at least that's what my group does).

[Lesrider]

I did and it's a neat idea, but it seems like a lot of extra work for the devs, whereas allowing us to host any of the levels would be as easy as flicking a switch.

Why is it so important anyway to force people to play all the maps in order? What's wrong with just letting them play whichever levels they need for the gear they're missing? I think people will still farm all maps, just like in VL groups farm different bosses depending on what gear the people in the party need (or at least that's what my group does).

Well, from the way it was designed, it seems like Cinco wants it to be played in order (except for the option to join games). I guess it's up to him if he decides that he no longer wants it that way. But from his other thread, it seems he doesn't want it to be like another ao3, where anyone can create any game they want. Seems like he was trying to go for something different than what we're used to. And im glad he's looking for new ways to shake up the game. The checkpoints would simply allow both hardcore gamers and casual gamers to enjoy the new content.

[Kujen]

The don't need to take away the ability to join it from the "join game screen". They just need to ensure that someone has hosting powers and the ability to boot if necessary. If someone joins right before the boss and you feel it's unfair, boot them. The main problem I've been seeing is when the host leaves and nobody has the ability to boot lower levels and leeches. I think right now if a host leaves, the host powers only transfer when you "go to next level", nobody can become host during the middle of a map. They should make it where it can.

Also, I think when you create a private victory lap game it stays private when you move to the next level, the caves. Public games should always have the ability to join. In private games though...if you still have people you don't want joining it would be because they're on your friends list or a friend of a friend. But that's a whole other topic, like I've mentioned before...it would be nice if there were host options like "lock to friends only (not friends of friends)" or "invitation only" or "password required". And these options should stay in place when you move from one level to the next. So you'd set that when you create a victory lap game, and it would carry on into the shadow caves.

[[Lt] Shiny]

That's cool. XD

[Fyrce]

Remember when to do Nightmares, you had to start at level 1 and play it through each time? And you had to unlock levels? And you couldn't host individual levels? I have no clue how that experiment went, but they opened up level hosting pretty quickly, so I can guess. I'm also guessing some of the choices in Shadows Caves came from their experience on Frozen Nightmares.

I'd say leave it as it now or a slightly more frequent portal spawn. And set bonuses would really get people to clear VL :) in which case, , you probably won't need the more frequent portal spawn. When there's stuff people want, they can really go after it!

[SilverDog]

I hope this update is better then yesterdays... Thought it was really crummy that the portal was rare (Tried 25x before one showed up). When I finally got in, I was pissed to find out that most of the bosses where not around. And Even more pissed that all that was being dropped was the same as a typical Mummy/D'jinn in AO3. And with how much coins got spent on health potions and Elixirs... And to make it worse, the D'jinns got harder (in IV and V, it was a joke) with nothing being dropped.... Made the Shadow Cave not really worth playing since it was costing so much in coins... In the long run, it's much cheaper to buy the gear in the market then it is to go and get it yourself. It doesnt seem fair that for a while people got to loot like mad there and for those of us that where not able to play the game during this time (or was a high enough level to make it in), we get the crap-dipped short stick of the deal. (pardon my language). I wont be able to play until later tonight, possibly even tomorrow.. so I hope this new update that SpaceTime as put out is better. (I'm not going to spend real money, or even get spacetime more money from the tapjoy until I feel it's fair again. I hope it's soon or I may have to start giving it a low rating and no longer vote for pocketlegends)

[Balgreta]

ok from a fun point of view, we had 2 shadow witch's on the 3rd map.. in seperate areas at the end. one shadow witch also had a shadow prince and a shadow genie (i think genie) with her and one was solo with a few mobs.

we spent near 20k on pots, countless deaths but they all died in end... yeah it was fun because it was so hard, yeah it was super super annoying and pointless that we had to use over 25 hp pots or more each per boss (i was only mage) and yeah it was even more annoying not one of the 4 boss's we had on the 3rd map dropped anything more than yellow loot !!

btw first two maps didn't drop any pinks either.

So, we are almost there, the challenge is awesome, but the loot is dire - i personally wont be going back in there the way i feel at the moment - sure the hardness was cool but i do also want some reward for killing 3 boss's at the same time and another clone of the hardest boss in game by herself for no reward, it was a kick in the teeth for the 20k of pots that each player bought while we figured out teh kill order.

not to mention the 10man hrs invested into a game that is meant to be able to be done when you have a spare half hour. If i wanted long raids i would just play mmo's on a pc and enjoy better graphics tactics and rewards!!

[Timmeee]

Lol lol lol lol lol

[StompArtist]

Here's a little heads' up on upcoming changes to the elite Shadow Cave based on your feedback...

1 - The One-Way Path Problem - You will now be required to complete 'Victory Lap' before the 'Shadow Cave' teleporter has a chance of spawning.
2 - Teleporter Spawn Rarity - I made the 'Shadow Cave' teleporter more likely to spawn (since now you have to clear VL ;)
3 - Bosses - Making the bosses not spawn sometimes was a very bad choice. The elite 'Shadow Cave' isn't fun without them, so now they're back.
4 - Drop Rates - Boss Monsters keep their drop rates (offering pink items more rarely than AO3 bosses do). Just mentioning 'cause you might be wondering :)
5 - More Multi-Boss Encounters / Tougher Bosses - I really enjoyed fighting pairs of Shadow D'Jinn. So I added several additional encounters with groups of bosses that are a bit more challenging.

Since there are more bosses it follows that there will be a higher chance of getting boss loot. Not a much higher chance, but a *somewhat* higher chance. Tested all night and it feels pretty fair given the effort of taking down the groups of elite bosses.

Access to the 'Shadow Portal' feels a lot more rare than it did when you just had to wipe out T'Paxx... now that you have to clear VL. However, I feel that it balances out the abundance of boss content in the 'Shadow Caves.'
(You'll see for yourself soon...)

Hope you enjoy it!

- Cinco

Can you rename the level from "shadow caves" to "ever changing caves of message board opinions"? lol The caves look great and it's a good job just a bit of implementation hiccups...Now a bit too time intensive to get to. :D

[Moogerfooger]

Amen! I love the challenge of the new update....but after dropping 40k in pots to clear all 5 levels, to get nothing better than a green drop in our entire party the entire way through...really? Why am I going to bother? A gray Menhit Shield for beating a boss? Really? Back to VL for me.

Good = Challenge level; harder to get to theoretically; better overall than initial patch
Bad = Tragically bad loot. I mean, Plasma Pyramid's loot is better if you want to look at it that way.



we spent near 20k on pots, countless deaths but they all died in end... yeah it was fun because it was so hard, yeah it was super super annoying and pointless that we had to use over 25 hp pots or more each per boss (i was only mage) and yeah it was even more annoying not one of the 4 boss's we had on the 3rd map dropped anything more than yellow loot !!

btw first two maps didn't drop any pinks either.

So, we are almost there, the challenge is awesome, but the loot is dire - i personally wont be going back in there the way i feel at the moment - sure the hardness was cool but i do also want some reward for killing 3 boss's at the same time and another clone of the hardest boss in game by herself for no reward, it was a kick in the teeth for the 20k of pots that each player bought while we figured out teh kill order.

not to mention the 10man hrs invested into a game that is meant to be able to be done when you have a spare half hour. If i wanted long raids i would just play mmo's on a pc and enjoy better graphics tactics and rewards!!

[noobmigo]

ARe the prices going up now? Bcuz last i check, they were cheap as crap

[KingFu]

THEY'Re ADDING A VYXNAAR TO SPAWN VERY VERY VERY RARELY ON THE LAST STAGE. MOST LIKELY A SHADOWVYXNAAR. HE'Ll DROP A LVL 50 VYX HELM WITH PRO STATS! CINCO SAID IN THE CHAT BOX!! CAN't WAIT!!!:p

[Moogerfooger]

CINCO SAID IN THE CHAT BOX!! CAN't WAIT!!!:p

Yeah, and Cinco also admitted to lying in posts as well to keep us on our toes :)

[ProSophist]

And yes... I lied :) (Sometimes I lie in the chat room, too.)

- Cinco

Sorry Mystic.

[Estraz]

Yay, higher drop rate for the win.

[Ellyidol]

Loved the new map and update. Best fun I've had in ages! Can't wait for more.

[Moogerfooger]

Yay, higher drop rate for the win.

What higher drop rate??? Ran through all five caves and not a single person got better than a green.

[Ellyidol]

What higher drop rate??? Ran through all five caves and not a single person got better than a green.

Not technically higher, but more chance of getting a drop.

NOT from 5% to 10% but 5% chance, twice. Again if I'm not mistaken. Since there are more bosses now I understand it that way. (Numbers are for example only, I have no idea what drop rates are)

[Pharcyde]

A shadow Vyxnaar helm?... Aww I was really really hoping for unique rare weapons like a shadow whip where the whip part was made out of shadow mist. That or like a shadow bow that has sharp spikes on the ends of it so it can be used as a melee weapon up close for high critical. Or like a shadow soul that just spins around a Enchantress's arm in the place of a doll/eye.
Burning Whip of Soul's
Pecked Soul Stealer
Lost Spirit of the Shadow

[wamphryi]

5 - More Multi-Boss Encounters / Tougher Bosses - I really enjoyed fighting pairs of Shadow D'Jinn. So I added several additional encounters with groups of bosses that are a bit more challenging.
- Cinco

Gotta say...the room we just spent ton of time going thru that had 2 D'Jinn and 3 bosses (witch, prince, demon) in ONE room was NASTY!

[Riccits]

the first guy which got a pink plz post thx

[Oldgveteran]

If VL has to be cleared, I think something needs to be fixed with the hosting issues in the caves. Keep the same host as in VL and perhaps if the host has to leave, the second person to have joined becomes new host?

And I may get a lot of hate mail for this one -- but if all of VL has to be cleared, I think something needs to be done to keep people from just popping in after it's cleared. Maybe only allow invitees to do so, once the original team is in the shadow caves? (so people aren't stuck with a 4-man team when someone disconnects). I dunno, not sure what can be coded in. But if you really want people to work to get to the cave, they shouldn't be allowed to enter cleared VL games.

Edit: I don't think shadow cave games should show up in the "join" list -- they should all be considered locked games and people have to invite friends if they need an extra person. That would also help the random pop-ins of unwanted guests, even if there is no host. I just think if a team is going through all this effort, they have a right to keep it a closed game.

Good post, I agree with your ideas / tweaks 95% of time though. Alot of others nailed some good points too.

On a separate note

People feel the length of maps + pot money is not paying off just to earn same gear that many got for free ( in essence)

I remember my earlier days seeing people decked out in void or rift n thinking "wow that's impressive he/she must have worked hard for that!!!".. Which in turn motivated me and gave me a set of goals to look forward to accomplishing,
However due to the accident ( or inside job =P )All the gear has already been seen and doesnt seem to represent any "elitism" if you will.. Kind of killed the caves for me. I really only felt one night of excitement on that map, which is a bummer because I had never seen so many people online on my buddy list as that night, after they ALL earned their sets that night they logged and haven't seen most of them since...

But what's done is done, I think a simple solution such as adding a few more items to the drop list would make a HUGE difference. Idk about everybody else but if there were possibly something like 3 more brand new weapons to fit in with sets I would go cave freaking cave happy and I know plenty of people who would join me!

This to me would make not only potting but remaking this map worthwhile, A whole new profit margin!! Done the right way!!

Just an idea!!!

[Riccits]

yep that would be a good idea since we all have the elite gear.. so it would be really a reasn to play again....
i wont play again so....

[Ritualist]

I think a simple solution such as adding a few more items to the drop list would make a HUGE difference. Idk about everybody else but if there were possibly something like 3 more brand new weapons to fit in with sets I would go cave freaking cave happy and I know plenty of people who would join me!

I second that.

... and dont forget to add a set bonus, but instead of sparkles make us look like shadows!

[Echelong]

My idea is that since this is the first true elite dungeon for high levels and it is hard to get in clearing VL takes a lot longer than rushing to the bosses which is what many of us did (clearing all VL feels noobish now). And after you clear it and you get the portal (if you get lucky) Bosses should have a better spawn rate maybe 1 pink per kill or have a higher chance. This is not supposed to be WoW where you need 4+ hours of play to complete a dungeon since this is a mobile game imo.

Also give us more gold from mobs and more trash items for make up for pots.

Also Hate set is worse than rift this doesn't go at par with the other two sets. Both other sets are better than their counterparts and hate is the only one that stands behind. Unless the bonus is super big it wont be worth it.

I do love the dungeon it is challenging but not worth the money spent on it at least for now.

[CowboyJim]

I played caves after the update last night with Cereal and some others. Wow. Very Challenging. When host had to leave in cave 5 for "life happens" reasons, we were almost at the end where there were three rooms containing multiple bosses...level 2 (yes, 2) popped in and wouldn't leave. We asked very, very nicely and he wouldn't leave. So we waited, finally couple more guys left. More guys joined but since lvl 2 wouldn't leave, they left. No one wanted to fight witches, etc. with only 4. Everyone reported this guy but he said " I don't care, report me, I'm not doing anything wrong.....OMG Finally, me and some others that joined went in and killed Anubis....leech leveled and got a green drop......then everyone left (except the 3 lvl) because no one wanted to take on witches short handed.......DEVS, please, please fix this..........I play this game (and yes, I know it's just a game) for fun and relaxation but this type of thing is SO ANNOYING that it takes all the fun out...........Thanks.

[Lesrider]

Cowboy, I'm curious -- did your game in VL start off locked?
I only played the one game the night the caves were introduced, so can't really tell if hosting a locked game would keep these guys out from the caves.

I and others have given several suggestions to prevent things like this -- hopefully the devs will do something. IMO, even a lvl 50 shouldn't be able to leech/mooch off of people.


I played caves after the update last night with Cereal and some others. Wow. Very Challenging. When host had to leave in cave 5 for "life happens" reasons, we were almost at the end where there were three rooms containing multiple bosses...level 2 (yes, 2) popped in and wouldn't leave. We asked very, very nicely and he wouldn't leave. So we waited, finally couple more guys left. More guys joined but since lvl 2 wouldn't leave, they left. No one wanted to fight witches, etc. with only 4. Everyone reported this guy but he said " I don't care, report me, I'm not doing anything wrong.....OMG Finally, me and some others that joined went in and killed Anubis....leech leveled and got a green drop......then everyone left (except the 3 lvl) because no one wanted to take on witches short handed.......DEVS, please, please fix this..........I play this game (and yes, I know it's just a game) for fun and relaxation but this type of thing is SO ANNOYING that it takes all the fun out...........Thanks.

[browndanielusn]

I'm loving the low drop rates and three bosses in one room pops. Gives me a challenge and something to farm instead of guaranteed drops. My only gripe is what everyone else is saying, not being able to boot people when hosts leave. From a programming stand point, this shouldn't be too hard to implement. Basically a time stamp on party members, when max member leaves, jump to next on change of party. Hopefully the devs do this, because until then I'm just gonna party hop and hope for the best like everyone else. BTW, I was one of the peeps that jumped into that level 5 party with the 2 that wouldn't leave, then jumped out like everyone else.

[SilverDog]

I hope this update is better then yesterdays... Thought it was really crummy that the portal was rare (Tried 25x before one showed up). When I finally got in, I was pissed to find out that most of the bosses where not around. And Even more pissed that all that was being dropped was the same as a typical Mummy/D'jinn in AO3. And with how much coins got spent on health potions and Elixirs... And to make it worse, the D'jinns got harder (in IV and V, it was a joke) with nothing being dropped.... Made the Shadow Cave not really worth playing since it was costing so much in coins... In the long run, it's much cheaper to buy the gear in the market then it is to go and get it yourself. It doesnt seem fair that for a while people got to loot like mad there and for those of us that where not able to play the game during this time (or was a high enough level to make it in), we get the crap-dipped short stick of the deal. (pardon my language). I wont be able to play until later tonight, possibly even tomorrow.. so I hope this new update that SpaceTime as put out is better. (I'm not going to spend real money, or even get spacetime more money from the tapjoy until I feel it's fair again. I hope it's soon or I may have to start giving it a low rating and no longer vote for pocketlegends)

Well, I played (last night.. so if there has been an update since, I havent done it)....
I am vary thankfull to the friends of mine that gave me the two death items I have... I am still yet to see the items drop, and still feel cheated that there are people out there that have a bunch of the gear and people who started after them get crap. Not to mention the amount of potions and/or elixers it takes to go through all 5 stages.

I think you should make the gear drop like it did in the past, and write off the 'rareness' of it as a lesson learned and work to make a new elite campaign that is hard with rare drops from the get-go. (and maybe a raise in the level cap to go with that). Thats probably going to be the only way to make all happy again.

[testerx]

ok from a fun point of view, we had 2 shadow witch's on the 3rd map.. in seperate areas at the end. one shadow witch also had a shadow prince and a shadow genie (i think genie) with her and one was solo with a few mobs.

we spent near 20k on pots, countless deaths but they all died in end... yeah it was fun because it was so hard, yeah it was super super annoying and pointless that we had to use over 25 hp pots or more each per boss (i was only mage) and yeah it was even more annoying not one of the 4 boss's we had on the 3rd map dropped anything more than yellow loot !!

btw first two maps didn't drop any pinks either.

So, we are almost there, the challenge is awesome, but the loot is dire - i personally wont be going back in there the way i feel at the moment - sure the hardness was cool but i do also want some reward for killing 3 boss's at the same time and another clone of the hardest boss in game by herself for no reward, it was a kick in the teeth for the 20k of pots that each player bought while we figured out teh kill order.

not to mention the 10man hrs invested into a game that is meant to be able to be done when you have a spare half hour. If i wanted long raids i would just play mmo's on a pc and enjoy better graphics tactics and rewards!!

Agree 100% I did the same last night, and had a good few hours of play. In the end i bought the items,, after spending 50k in pots, countless hp and mana tank and dmg. ones. The reward, time and energy it was simply not worth it.

And don't even get me started on ppl who made hundreds and millions, who of course, want to keep the drop rate low. Yeah, I understand you, but this is ridiculous. There is a post of a guy who's done 45 runs and got lucky with a drop. Well me and my party, some with luck pots done the same. NOT A SINGLE PINK DROP for ANYONE. In 30+ long runs.

Fun, fun, fun.

The only plus sides are the challenge, but a challenge is worth nothing without a reward. For a challenge I'll play with no armor on some levels, hehe.

First, some of us who work really hard for equipment, rift, cyber, etc. had to see shadow items on almost every 50. Then they were practically gone, and the prices went up. I feel the devs went from one extreme to the other. First too many then too few (well, none)

I suggest a guarantee pink drop, to keep the party together, i see more green loot already appears, that's fine, to balance the money spent.

As others have said, this is a mobile mmo, if I wanted 4 hours runs ill play wow.(at least u get a drop there) But 4 hours runs, hoping the party sticks together, getting bankrupt in the process, and getting virtually no drops is not fun anymore.

Thank you.

[spacehamster]

Played last night and liked the new changes. Got the portal on the third clear of VL; before clearing Mynas area if that matters to anyone. The Witch+Pince/Lord+Demon+Djins at the same time was quite a challenge (evil devs!) but found myself laughing more during play and saw many more of the "nice pull!"-"great teamwork!" comments.

Played about 4hrs with same party, until creator lost his connect on cave 5. Had a lvl 11 show up and refuse to leave. With a little creative work by my teammates, we finally got him out. One left but coordinated so that the original creator rejoined and could boot the 11. Then we were back in buisness; original party complete. Played a while more, but alas it was 2am and we still had 26 enemies to go. Maybe one of these nights i'll actually finish the caves :)

I love the challenge and necessity of different classes working together. Wouldn't mind a higher chance at pinks, but that's not what I'm going after. I like the game for playing and am happy with rare drops; kinda makes it more special when someone does get it. (Yes I did play first night, no I don't have complete sets).

^Lots of words, I know; sorry. Long story short, good job devs and thank you.

[Phoenixking]

Do u have to beat OL?

[spacehamster]

Do u have to beat OL?

Really not sure, he's usually one of the first that we clear. Mynas was the last area for us and the portal showed up before we went in.