Nerf Bulwark please

[Instanthumor]

As I promised someone earlier, I'm gunna write this little thread. Not 100% sure what it does, but all I know is that there's a little Curse thing (if I'm not mistaken, from a charged dps attack) that hurts A LOT and it's OP. Please nerf, ty. I thought this weapon's purpose was supposed to be a tanking weapon, but noooooooo, a non-arcane ring, no samael warrior w/ Bulwark does 5 times more damage than a max geared warrior. Yes, I am crying.

[Instanthumor]

Whatever you do, do not drop a charged (dot) clock on a bulwark war. Your HP will drop faster than you can say wth.

I was using my normal vs warrior build (no DoT whatsoever, which triggers the curse) and was like lolwut

[Instanthumor]

I know it hurts. It's the new mythic weapon though so at some point the bonesaw, glaive and maul need to go bye bye. Look at mage only has one good weapon...gun. Same with rogue. I feel your pain though cuz it just got harder to be a mage.

Today, I entered a pvp room... Saw my friend Freakout kill a bulwark tank... And it took him over FIVE combos to finally kill the tank. There's nothing wrong with that, a tank that's using a tank weapon should tank, but giving a warrior the skill Curse is out of the question. A warrior can beat a mage using NO SKILLS and just charge dps.

I tried using Gale, to get out of reach of the warrior's melee range was the major objective, but they'll get you eventually... And when they do... Small kine gg

[Instanthumor]

#MageProblems2014

[Haligali]

Its doing the exact same as the mage curse skill, however mage curse skill got a long cooldown. Makes us mages more useless in pvp.

Rogues got last season arcane shield, warriors now curse like hell, next season warriors will have timeshift rogues will have fireball. Ok gives us juggernaut and aimed shot please.

[Instanthumor]

Its doing the exact same as the mage curse skill, however mage curse skill got a long cooldown. Makes us mages more useless in pvp.

Rogues got last season arcane shield, warriors now curse like hell, next season warriors will have timeshift rogues will have fireball. Ok gives us juggernaut and aimed shot please.

Not only is the cooldown time 10x shorter, Bulwark's Curse does MORE damage than a mage's Curse... Like, da fook?

[SacredKnight]

Warriors PvP with Bulwark? o.o

[Killfreeak]

I agree totally with this. As i am the OP tank that creamed instant, i understand his pain. Especially when i demolished him right after watching him kill a tank with not only samael, but an arcane maul, arcane ring and full super gears. I have archon ring, grimm, and BULWARK. Yes that is all i need, cos the curse is stronger then the mages. A mage takes as much damage as they deal, and that means having an elon rifle will kill themselves, cos my jugg + proc means i take as much dmg as i want and deal 3k dmg in 0.0000001242 seconds. But perhaps the problem isnt that tanks are becoming OP, because quite frankly, a lvl41 mythic weapon should be better then a lv36 mythic. Perhaps buffing mages in some way, perhaps creating some sort of invulnerabilty to such abilities when using a certain ability? Rogues and tanks are finally balanced in pvp, mages not so much.

[Killfreeak]

I also think mages should get movement invulnerability too. They are supposed to be the stunlock class, yet all other classes have stun immunity which destroys the purpose of mages... Not to mention that they are also the most vulnerable class to stunlock (which now all other classes are capable of) because they are at the disadvantage of no stun immunity. It may mean nerfing mage weapons, but buffing their skills but i think its the best solution to balancing pvp

[Killfreeak]

Perhaps the nerfing of the bulwark could be: once a person has been effected by the bulwark, they are granted immunity to the curse ability for 6 seconds... ? Just an idea

[Instanthumor]

Posts 11-13 ingenious, all coming from a Bulwark user. Praise the lord.

[Killfreeak]

Lmfao

[Haligali]

Warriors PvP with Bulwark? o.o

Thats right.

[Xeusx]

Next level cap, mythic glaive will be back and make warriors become DPSReaper.

[Volt]

U pmed me in game but I was busy. So I feel it's appropriate to pm you here. I'll think about leveling to 16 and thanks for the offer of letting me use ur weapon

[xbadulaserosx]

Oh pls no more nerfing... lol I think the weapon is just fine, just look for an alternative killing style when u face an bulwark tank as a mage in pvp, we never win it all and its a good challenge though. So its alright. Dont nerf the humble shield sword a.k.a bulwark.

[matanofx]

Tanks already destroy mages who arent built to kill tanks

As a mage you have a choice, be hybrid build, be vs build, bs vs rogue build, be vs war build... Other classes dont have to play so much with skills to be vs someone in particular

As a hybrid mage, most warriors already can troll me unless its a clash, that curse is really the last thing i needed to encounter in pvp, mages need a buff, warriors do almost as much dmg as i do but super armor hp and jug, rogues the same story they use knife thingy and i cant stun... fix it sts

[SacredKnight]

I remember at the beginning of the Bulwark people were saying "It's too weak!" and STS replied " It's a support weapon ".

Nek Minit.

Bulwark gets buffed and becomes a OP tanking and PvP weapon .-.

[Haligali]

Oh pls no more nerfing... lol I think the weapon is just fine, just look for an alternative killing style when u face an bulwark tank as a mage in pvp, we never win it all and its a good challenge though. So its alright. Dont nerf the humble shield sword a.k.a bulwark.

So you are ok giving warriors a stronger curse than the mage curse with all subskills, plus it reduces crit -10% with basically 0 sec cooldown?

[Haligali]

My suggestion: dont nerf or whatever, just remove the curse, the op healing is more than enough proc on bulwark. Its a total fail design, giving a tanking pve weapon the most powerful pvp skill, which got a long cooldown for a reason. Curse is useless in pve.

[Pedgon]

As I promised someone earlier, I'm gunna write this little thread. Not 100% sure what it does, but all I know is that there's a little Curse thing (if I'm not mistaken, from a charged dps attack) that hurts A LOT and it's OP. Please nerf, ty. I thought this weapon's purpose was supposed to be a tanking weapon, but noooooooo, a non-arcane ring, no samael warrior w/ Bulwark does 5 times more damage than a max geared warrior. Yes, I am crying.

ahah cry more dude!!:sorrow: you ask to nerf bulwark but wht about those RIDICULOUS buffs on Shady & Surge???..an already super OP pet??? -.-

[Anarchist]

Nerf Nerfs.

[Bmwmsix]

Someone nerf nerf the crybabies here please or feed them pink ponies *.*

[xbadulaserosx]

My suggestion: dont nerf or whatever, just remove the curse, the op healing is more than enough proc on bulwark. Its a total fail design, giving a tanking pve weapon the most powerful pvp skill, which got a long cooldown for a reason. Curse is useless in pve.

Well you have a point my friend with the curse is useless in pve, but its gives a diff dimension for a tank to use it in pvp, yes the curse of bulwark hurts in pvp I guess, but thats what im saying, just find a diff combo to counter a curse tank proc weapon. I mean I dnt know mage combo, but im sure theres something u guys can counter for it? Thanks for the reply hali.

[Bmwmsix]

Someone nerf nerf the crybabies here please or feed them pink ponies *.*

[Dex Scene]

Curse should be only mage stuffs

[Pedgon]

My suggestion: dont nerf or whatever, just remove the curse, the op healing is more than enough proc on bulwark. Its a total fail design, giving a tanking pve weapon the most powerful pvp skill, which got a long cooldown for a reason. Curse is useless in pve.

hali bro, u are still missing the point..NO tank wants "tanking weapon" its just useless both in pve or pve!! And removing curse..oh well..bulwark would be same crap that was before..just with better stats and heal!

And we're all saying "curse" but actually this isnt curse, like the one from mages! This reverse damage works based on damage from your stats..always around same damage! max i saw was 450 crit thick with vengeful blood on..but rare!

[Pedgon]

Well you have a point my friend with the curse is useless in pve, but its gives a diff dimension for a tank to use it in pvp, yes the curse of bulwark hurts in pvp I guess, but thats what im saying, just find a diff combo to counter a curse tank proc weapon. I mean I dnt know mage combo, but im sure theres something u guys can counter for it? Thanks for the reply hali.

Bulwark's curse isnt good on elite or arena, but on normal pve is actually good..km3 or wt4..its pretty awesome imo!

[Hectororius]

Was Waiting for this Thread.

I'd rather mages get the proper buffs they deserve in PvP over nerfing other classes or weapons. and not just at end game either.

Its pretty apparent that STS already makes adjustments to the classes so they play "more fair" in PvP, why can't they adjust mages so they are better able to have a fair fight.

I'm actually quite happy to see a weapon that was considered PvE only be viable in PvP as well. Its adds greatly to the variety in PvP and not everyone has to rely on the same builds/weapons/gears/pets to compete.

[Haligali]

hali bro, u are still missing the point..NO tank wants "tanking weapon" its just useless both in pve or pve!! And removing curse..oh well..bulwark would be same crap that was before..just with better stats and heal!

And we're all saying "curse" but actually this isnt curse, like the one from mages! This reverse damage works based on damage from your stats..always around same damage! max i saw was 450 crit thick with vengeful blood on..but rare!

Belive it or not, mage curse works in the same way:


Curse takes the targets damage, not the damage output of the ability that he just used, but his damage (base damage plus stat increases from equipment etc), multiplies that by another number, depending on if you charged the ability, what upgrades you have etc and then every time the enemy that's cursed uses any ability (including base attack), he takes that number in damage. It also ignores armor.

Since it scales with the enemies damage, it should definitely scale as they grow in levels. My numbers on it might have been a bit low for a first pass though so I'll probably buff it a bit. I have to be careful though because remember that monsters won't stop attacking, like players might, so it can do a lot of damage to them really fast if they are hard hitting enemies with a high attack speed.

Bulwark curse is much stonger, plus reduces crit and got 0 sec cooldown, mage curse got 15 sec cooldown.

[Haligali]

Well you have a point my friend with the curse is useless in pve, but its gives a diff dimension for a tank to use it in pvp, yes the curse of bulwark hurts in pvp I guess, but thats what im saying, just find a diff combo to counter a curse tank proc weapon. I mean I dnt know mage combo, but im sure theres something u guys can counter for it? Thanks for the reply hali.

Yes, can counter curse with a pet named misty which removes curse and all debuff, many people use it in clash, but this pet got extreme long 40 sec cooldown.

[Pedgon]

Belive it or not, mage curse works in the same way:



Bulwark curse is much stonger, plus reduces crit and got 0 sec cooldown, mage curse got 15 sec cooldown.

huumm i heard that mages' curse was based on damage taken and not on a fixed stat number =/ confused

[Haligali]

huumm i heard that mages' curse was based on damage taken and not on a fixed stat number =/ confused

Ikr, but this statement was false. Curse does not reflect back damage, curse takes damage based on the cursed damage stat.

[Zeus]

I don't think anything should be nerfed - bulwark or SnS. I think new strategies to counter them should instead be thought of. Everyone creates these nerf this / buff that threads whenever something new is release. Honestly, people learn to adapt and the cry subsides.

Here's the inherent problem: Nott. STG has made them ridiculously weak and then try to compensate by giving them a stronger weapon. Sorry, this isn't a solution because it means the other two classes must have far weaker weapons. Instead, keep the game fun for everyone by fixing the problems of the Nott race. They truly need stun immunity and a better heal as well as some increased damage reduction to be competitive in this day and age.

[Bigboyblue]

I don't think anything should be nerfed - bulwark or SnS. I think new strategies to counter them should instead be thought of. Everyone creates these nerf this / buff that threads whenever something new is release. Honestly, people learn to adapt and the cry subsides.

Here's the inherent problem: Nott. STG has made them ridiculously weak and then try to compensate by giving them a stronger weapon. Sorry, this isn't a solution because it means the other two classes must have far weaker weapons. Instead, keep the game fun for everyone by fixing the problems of the Nott race. They truly need stun immunity and a better heal as well as some increased damage reduction to be competitive in this day and age.

If mages were immune to stun it would be a great help. Also, maybe the shield duration could be longer and absorb more? That would give us the extra damage reduction. Our skills are descent and really like most other posts say mage>rouge>warrior>mage. The only problem for mages is rogues can one shot us, or stun us with charged auto and 3 shot us. If a mage lands the first shot on a rogue it's over but if the rogue gets first it it's a toss up. Rogues don't need to land the first blow to kill a warrior and warriors are the same when fighting mages.

[Linkincena]

Its doing the exact same as the mage curse skill, however mage curse skill got a long cooldown. Makes us mages more useless in pvp.

Rogues got last season arcane shield, warriors now curse like hell, next season warriors will have timeshift rogues will have fireball. Ok gives us juggernaut and aimed shot please.

I like the last line...
Something new for mages

[Haligali]

It seems many have no problem with a 0 sec cooldown curse, then removing the cooldown of the arcane shield shouldnt be a problem either.

[- Samdegreat]

This weapon is the key for a war to kill a rogue with 4000 health, it's been impossible unless there packs fail.

For a mythic weapon its damage is lower then most if not all legendary items at 41 (20-40 damage loss) where as the glaive grants 70 damage over bulwark and is lv 36 so if your gonna get rid of the curse boost its damage so it's at least round about the lv 36 mythic weapon :)

Also there limited edition, it's not like everyone has one, same with SNS its op but who cares there's not many out there :)

If the bulwark is nerfed then price will drop everyone will complain at sts, it will become useless and blast to the past everyone will be using magma swords again, no change!

[- Samdegreat]

Its doing the exact same as the mage curse skill, however mage curse skill got a long cooldown. Makes us mages more useless in pvp.

Rogues got last season arcane shield, warriors now curse like hell, next season warriors will have timeshift rogues will have fireball. Ok gives us juggernaut and aimed shot please.

Rogues with fireballs?
Check the proc on magmatic blades hahahahaha

[Haligali]

This weapon is the key for a war to kill a rogue with 4000 health, it's been impossible unless there packs fail.

For a mythic weapon its damage is lower then most if not all legendary items at 41 (20-40 damage loss) where as the glaive grants 70 damage over bulwark and is lv 36 so if your gonna get rid of the curse boost its damage so it's at least round about the lv 36 mythic weapon :)

Also there limited edition, it's not like everyone has one, same with SNS its op but who cares there's not many out there :)

If the bulwark is nerfed then price will drop everyone will complain at sts, it will become useless and blast to the past everyone will be using magma swords again, no change!

A curse with 0 sec cooldown, is it ok or no? Please answer :)

[Madnex]

I too have seen the destructive reflect of bulwark proc but come on, there's no need to nerf anything here just adapt, use different strategies. Why must everything be done with shield fire light ice? If you really want a chance as mage vs bulwark warrior, gale/light/ice/shield/heal works. Remove the DoT's and you're getting somewhere.

[- Samdegreat]

A curse with 0 sec cooldown, is it ok or no? Please answer :)

Obviously not because you can skill switch while curse is active lol :)
Mage will get there day eventually........................................ ..............

[utpal]

seriously here, mages are so underpowered.
in PL(emchantress) and SL(engineer) , these both class is powerful with right build. both can stun lock to some extent.
but mages here is LOLclass in pvp.
sts plz buff mages. 7season has entered and still mages are underpowered.

[Ravager]

The weakness to Bulwark is it's horrible range and need to charge for the curse to be reliable. I've had lots of speed pet mages and rogues run away from me constantly. They end up rooting me then killing me. I feel like a sitting duck sometimes when I'm rooted. Not all the time but that worked against me. With lots of stun, speed, range I could not charge my normal attack and get in range of them.

If you guys are talking about clashes, well, I'm not a big fan of clashes for a few reasons. It forces everyone to be bunched up in this mash-fest where all the rogues and mages get the kills and warriors get nothing but deaths. Rogues and mages are willing to sacrifice the class range advantage to fight in close quarters with the warrior?

[Anarchist]

Mages are not underpowered :P
In clashes they are better than rogues and if built correctly a mage can kill the class itssupposed to surpass, rogues.

[spimeslam]

I never used to pvp but I started trying after they buffed bulwark I got some kills but I still die like crazy. I use bulwark and Singe I have 7.3k HP 2.3k armor and I die like all the time but atleast I manage some kills somehow at ctf. At tdm on the other hand I get slayed either way.

If you nerf bulwark next level cap (46) the saw/glaive wont be as good at pvp and if bulwark isn't either everybody has to have arcane maul (mind you that 46 cap is when they remove arcane maul from locked limiting them to rare finds in elite gold chests) Just because warrior can kill don't take that away the proc can be dodged just like s&s pool they only hit right by warrior. To avoid being hit just kite warrior and besides that at pvp its hard for warrior to have time to charge bulwark and land hit.. trust me it isn't easy so mostly its the weaker less lasting proc that does hit.

Jmho but I think the bulwarks fix was best thing for warrior in a long time. And if you nerf it again it will make warriors less desirable for parties and pvp.

[Gorecaster]

There's no class struggle here. Just op buffs. Let's face the facts that weapons need to evolve or it's zzz. Tanks basically got a fifth mana free skill with zero cd, and anyone that had singe got double buffed to baller status. Yes it's hard, really hard but strategy is the key in PvP, not constant nerfing of something challenging. I full on raged the first day of these new buffs, but stop thinking about easy kills and work at it.

[Ihateppl]

Its doing the exact same as the mage curse skill, however mage curse skill got a long cooldown. Makes us mages more useless in pvp.

Rogues got last season arcane shield, warriors now curse like hell, next season warriors will have timeshift rogues will have fireball. Ok gives us juggernaut and aimed shot please.

rogues already have fireball, magma daggers remember?

[spimeslam]

Sounds like this thread is more about mages weakness than the bulwark. All I have to say is life gems for mage assist way more than for rogue or warrior because warrior gets HP from str but mages have low HP and already have high damage output. Try gemming some gear with life gems because I've saw lvl 13 mages full life gem with littlebear pet and they have 3k+ HP. They are so op they are next to unbeatable.

The weakness can be overcome without the weakening of other classes.

[Haligali]

lol seems like every warrior and rogue knows how to play a sorcerer, but this thread is not about this.

This thread is about: is it ok a 15 sec cooldown skill on a weapon with 0 sec cooldown?

[spimeslam]

I believe that bulwarks proc is truly avoidable. rogue or mage should not stand right by warrior because they have the ability to attack over distance. The warrior is meant to be more deadly at close range because right now a warrior is only deadly at close range and if they aren't deadly at close range they aren't deadly at all. the mage curse does damage compared to damage output by attacker the bulwarks proc damage is a set number. So its possible for mage curse to hit a lot harder than bulwarks close range proc that is hard to land and charge. The only time a mage should get close to warrior is to curse them and warrior doesn't have ample time to charge and just wait for mage to come close and if mage runs in and curses and moves back away the warriors long charge for proc isn't even possible in this short time window. Images and rogues are meant to be evasive otherwise they wish to be warriors.

[Speedofsound]

Warriors rightfully deserve this weapon considering rogues and mages both got insanely powerful 41 mythics this season. Also even tho this can curse dps is lower and the weapon itself looks lame imo.

[Ishtmeet]

First of all, why do you want Bulwark to be fixed? Because you're mage and don't play Warrior? So?
We all have noticed, bulwark makes the warrior class weak in pvp because of low damage+Low heal and weak proc. Still complaining? Oh well, mage's root proc is better than any proc in game, you can kill a rogue with that proc, easily. As you know Warriors > Mages so no need to nerf something, you can die without a bulwark as well. This proc is not good for 1v1, unless the enemy knows how to VS warrior. Isn't it easy? Bulwark has got a very short range, why not to kite them, run away? No one wants to stand near a warrior and play, you got joystick use it and stay away from that shortranged charge attacks.
Since, it got a bad stats, just a proc that doesn't suits you, doesn't mean that it should be nerfed.

-1

[Ishtmeet]

lol seems like every warrior and rogue knows how to play a sorcerer, but this thread is not about this.

This thread is about: is it ok a 15 sec cooldown skill on a weapon with 0 sec cooldown?

It has a range, no? Warrior's skill have the same cool down like yours. Keep distance from the tanks having bulwarks and it won't be any problem. And please tell me, how 0 sec cool down? it takes 1.5 sec to charge and 1 sec to charge again after the previous one. It's a primary attack, shouldn't be compared with a skill.

[Raregem]

I personally don't think the bulwark should be nerfed. All classes now have an OP weapon.. so it's even imo.

I do think that the curse should be more noticeable, in a clash you aren't looking at your feet. I would like to see something similar to mage curse with maybe a sickly green hued cloud over your head.

Range on bulwark is AWFUL(I tested it with a friend)! So we just need to re-strategize in clashes and don't go and hug the warrior. Which most skip warriors and go for the dps anyways.

[Haligali]

Warriors rightfully deserve this weapon considering rogues and mages both got insanely powerful 41 mythics this season. Also even tho this can curse dps is lower and the weapon itself looks lame imo.

Deserve what for? Warrior arcane weapon is bugged since its release and they still able to use, mythic glaive, magma claymore, even the goblin glaive wasnt so crap as the goblin weapons for the other classes. Group of warrior now dont need a curse mage in team.

[Ravager]

It has a range, no? Warrior's skill have the same cool down like yours. Keep distance from the tanks having bulwarks and it won't be any problem. And please tell me, how 0 sec cool down? it takes 1.5 sec to charge and 1 sec to charge again after the previous one. It's a primary attack, shouldn't be compared with a skill.

And rogues dodge this, A LOT.

[Speedofsound]

Deserve what for? Warrior arcane weapon is bugged since its release and they still able to use, mythic glaive, magma claymore, even the goblin glaive wasnt so crap as the goblin weapons for the other classes. Group of warrior now dont need a curse mage in team.
To be honest curse isnt as affective anymore anyways. In a clash an offensive mage with lightning is very powerful. A lot of rogues took out nox and use razor. Curse doesnt touch us.

[Bless]

My suggestion: dont nerf or whatever, just remove the curse, the op healing is more than enough proc on bulwark. Its a total fail design, giving a tanking pve weapon the most powerful pvp skill, which got a long cooldown for a reason. Curse is useless in pve.

hali bro, u are still missing the point..NO tank wants "tanking weapon" its just useless both in pve or pve!! And removing curse..oh well..bulwark would be same crap that was before..just with better stats and heal!

And we're all saying "curse" but actually this isnt curse, like the one from mages! This reverse damage works based on damage from your stats..always around same damage! max i saw was 450 crit thick with vengeful blood on..but rare! Quit tank pls. you arent fit to be a tank with that logic.

[Ishtmeet]

And rogues dodge this, A LOT.
Yes, why don't they post threads about: Rogue's dodge our stun almost everytime? lol
Warriors have lot of disadvantages in PvP, for example:-

1) Very Very slow kills, talking about warmonger- Comparing a mage , warrior and rogue. Suppose rogue takes "X" days to get warmonger, Mage will take about 1.3x days for warmonger and for warriors, it will be like 3x? or 4x? Whenever I enter TDM, I try to kill anyone, then a rogue/mage comes and steals it. It sux, and same for clashes, 3 hour long clashes give warrior about 10-15 kills, seriously? while rogues get over 100 or 150.

2) No instant heal: When a warrior heal, it heals around 15% hp per tick and it's 90%hp per 6 ticks. Rogue's get instant heal and yes not forgetting the self heal and heal of time benefit. It's approx. 40% per pack and from an approximation, rogue can heal around 150% HP. Mages have instant heal , and that's OP as well.

3) Charged warrior skills slow us down: Don't you know, charged skward smash roots warrior for 1-2 secs? Using axe roots us for 1-2 secs? It makes us very slow and sometimes due to these skills, we end up dying. Rogues and mages can use any skill without any hesitation.

So, shall I go and create a thread asking for some skills for rogue and mages that slow down their movement? Or their heal should be nerfed? Or Something about those KS?

Let's just play with what we got.

[Haligali]

To be honest curse isnt as affective anymore anyways. In a clash an offensive mage with lightning is very powerful. A lot of rogues took out nox and use razor. Curse doesnt touch us.

Thank you, so 'if curse isnt as affective anymore anyways' as you said then it shouldnt be a problem removing from bulwark. Seems like we got a solution. :)

[Bigboyblue]

I don't think the bulwark is a huge issue. This weapon from what I hear gives warriors a chance at killing rogues which before was pretty hard. No class should automatically beat any other class. A rogue can kill a mage and warriors always kill mages. Every mage and warrior knows that this match up is always going to the warrior. When a rogue and warrior face off the warrior may win although the rogue usually does. When a mage and rogue face off the rogue may win although the mage usually does. A mage faces off against a warrior and the warrior always wins. This is where the unbalance is. The bulwark is fine but mages do need something added to them to have a chance against warriors. Warriors should win 70% of the time but not 100%. My post is based on equal geared and skilled players. I realize mages can kill warriors that don't know how to play or come in naked.

[Speedofsound]

Thank you, so 'if curse isnt as affective anymore anyways' as you said then it shouldnt be a problem removing from bulwark. Seems like we got a solution. :)
yes. If curse isnt a problem why remove it? You literally just contradicted yourself xD

[Ishtmeet]

I don't think the bulwark is a huge issue. This weapon from what I hear gives warriors a chance at killing rogues which before was pretty hard. No class should automatically beat any other class. A rogue can kill a mage and warriors always kill mages. Every mage and warrior knows that this match up is always going to the warrior. When a rogue and warrior face off the warrior may win although the rogue usually does. When a mage and rogue face off the rogue may win although the mage usually does. A mage faces off against a warrior and the warrior always wins. This is where the unbalance is. The bulwark is fine but mages do need something added to them to have a chance against warriors. Warriors should win 70% of the time but not 100%. My post is based on equal geared and skilled players. I realize mages can kill warriors that don't know how to play or come in naked.
I remember 2 of those who liked this thread were trolling me before. When I created a thread about "Some benefits for Non Plat users". I said, it's impossible to kill arcane rogues and bla bla. They said, PvP needs SKILLS , not the GEAR. So my question," Where did your skills go? Just learn to play , or try to use SKILLS".

[Haligali]

yes. If curse isnt a problem why remove it? You literally just contradicted yourself xD

Lol, you said that curse isnt a problem, not me. XD

[kinzmet]

Bulwark war with SnS? If I'm that warrior I'll go VB, JUGG, HoR, RallyCry and Charged DPS any sorc I meet FTW.

[Speedofsound]

Lol, you said that curse isnt a problem, not me. XD
It isnt a problem so why are you complaining in the first place? You are making negative sense sir lol.

[Arry]

Not sure why everyone is saying this is so easy to avoid, warriors have the longest range skill (axe throw) which also stuns and pulls their opponent within melee range, combined with SS this is making it actually impossible to avoid. With top gear a mage will have around 6% dodge you'll be missing maybe 1/20 times. impossible to 'kite' these warriors with those skills lol. so please elaborate on how attack a warrior when none of my skills will hit with staying out of their axe throw range, when the whole fight they use SS to chase you and axe to pull you?..also im pretty sure both of these skills stun giving you ample time to charge for 1 second.

Hali is talking about 0 sec cd because after the curse is gone, a warrior can curse again immediately, also having 4 skills available to use. No gun proc, misty, curse or anything will save u in this situation. only option is to run and countdown their jugg hope they chase u and try again...if u havent already wasted your shield.

I'm pretty sure the proc rate on it isnt intended to be 100% as it is now, otherwise a mythic gun might proc 100% of the time on charge and i think you'd see a thread filled with warriors complaining about how they cant move rather than this. At least if the proc had a chance rate, like it should, there would be an easier solution to counter this and maybe some mages could still have a fighting chance.

[spimeslam]

A mage is able to use time skill and effortlessly plug slowed opponents with the hard hitting curse. But in the same way curse for mage works if warrior procs curse just don't sttack until the curse falls and avoid coming to close to warrior to avoid it again. Just up your playing don't try to make people overly weak (OW) just because you can't stay away from a warrior with sexy bulwark ;)

[Anarchist]

I remember 2 of those who liked this thread were trolling me before. When I created a thread about "Some benefits for Non Plat users". I said, it's impossible to kill arcane rogues and bla bla. They said, PvP needs SKILLS , not the GEAR. So my question," Where did your skills go? Just learn to play , or try to use SKILLS".

Its a game of roles. Nearly everyone on forum just try to pull the favour to their sides and when they have nothing to gain or lose roll their mouths.

[spimeslam]

@ Arry I believe you are talking about a super pro pvp warrior because I don't use axe throw or jugg and I get slayed and rarely get kills. If they are pro warrior yes they should be able to rock your world just as I'm sure you (or pro rogue) would rock my world if I tried to pvp you.

[Instanthumor]

I too have seen the destructive reflect of bulwark proc but come on, there's no need to nerf anything here just adapt, use different strategies. Why must everything be done with shield fire light ice? If you really want a chance as mage vs bulwark warrior, gale/light/ice/shield/heal works. Remove the DoT's and you're getting somewhere.

I never use DoT anymore vs warrior, and still my HP drops like I'm clocking someone with DoT while cursed. The only strat here is to avoid melee range, but the warrior's bound to get you eventually.

Bulwark being OP? I personally have no problem with that. Giving warriors a mage skill that is buffed 100x? That, I do have a problem.

[Ishtmeet]

Not sure why everyone is saying this is so easy to avoid, warriors have the longest range skill (axe throw) which also stuns and pulls their opponent within melee range, combined with SS this is making it actually impossible to avoid. With top gear a mage will have around 6% dodge you'll be missing maybe 1/20 times. impossible to 'kite' these warriors with those skills lol. so please elaborate on how attack a warrior when none of my skills will hit with staying out of their axe throw range, when the whole fight they use SS to chase you and axe to pull you?..also im pretty sure both of these skills stun giving you ample time to charge for 1 second.

Hali is talking about 0 sec cd because after the curse is gone, a warrior can curse again immediately, also having 4 skills available to use. No gun proc, misty, curse or anything will save u in this situation. only option is to run and countdown their jugg hope they chase u and try again...if u havent already wasted your shield.

I'm pretty sure the proc rate on it isnt intended to be 100% as it is now, otherwise a mythic gun might proc 100% of the time on charge and i think you'd see a thread filled with warriors complaining about how they cant move rather than this. At least if the proc had a chance rate, like it should, there would be an easier solution to counter this and maybe some mages could still have a fighting chance.

1. Axe throw has 7 second cooldown, isn't it? And what your saying, warrior can use his charged bulwark just after the axe throw, it's NOT possible. Takes 1.5 seconds to charge and these 1.5 seconds are enough to move far, isn't it? Why bringing S&S again? It's about the bulwark, not S&S. FYI S&S ability has a cooldown as well. Btw , what about not using your skills when the "curse" proc is on you? Use "SKILLS".

2) Gun's proc has root, which can't be avoided and our juggernaut doesn't work on it as well. That root couldn't be avoided and yet it's a rare proc, not much rare BTW.Use "SKILLS" and don't attack when you're under curse. Oh well, you talking about jugger? If a warrior uses jugger, he would be out of mana very fast, just wait when he's out of mana and use "SKILLS".

3) It is intended to be 100%, as it can be avoided whereas myth gun's proc can't be avoided. Just accept the fact, Mages can't kill equal geared warriors, even if you use those "SKILLS".

[Arry]

I never use DoT anymore vs warrior, and still my HP drops like I'm clocking someone with DoT while cursed. The only strat here is to avoid melee range, but the warrior's bound to get you eventually.

Bulwark being OP? I personally have no problem with that. Giving warriors a mage skill that is buffed 100x? That, I do have a problem.

Your problem may come from the DOT from your pet, even pets auto-attack gives damage to you from the bulwark curse as i understand.

[spimeslam]

The warrior curse isn't close to mage curse that's a pretty absurd comparison.

[Haligali]

It isnt a problem so why are you complaining in the first place? You are making negative sense sir lol.

Heh, read your comments again pls. Seems like you are alone with your opinion here.

[Bigboyblue]

I remember 2 of those who liked this thread were trolling me before. When I created a thread about "Some benefits for Non Plat users". I said, it's impossible to kill arcane rogues and bla bla. They said, PvP needs SKILLS , not the GEAR. So my question," Where did your skills go? Just learn to play , or try to use SKILLS".

I'm confused. Are you saying I trolled a thread of yours before? You must be mixing me up with someone else. I never do that, and always respect players posts. Also, I have never made a post saying that skill outweighs gear. I've literally been doing endgame pvp for 4 days and I see how much gear matters. Arcane ring rogues do insane crit damage. Any arcane ring wearer does. Legendary players have the same problem with full mythic gear players. Gear matters a great deal in pvp. A skilled player with better gear will kill a lesser geared player with equal skill.

I'll also reiterate that the bulwark isn't really a problem but mages do need some sort of buff to have a chance at fighting warriors.

[Volt]

If bulwark gets nerfed. I say mythic Gun loses its root and mythic bow loses 50 dmg. Seems fair imo seeing how the other weapons are insanely op

[Arry]

1. Axe throw has 7 second cooldown, isn't it? And what your saying, warrior can use his charged bulwark just after the axe throw, it's NOT possible. Takes 1.5 seconds to charge and these 1.5 seconds are enough to move far, isn't it? Why bringing S&S again? It's about the bulwark, not S&S. FYI S&S ability has a cooldown as well. Btw , what about not using your skills when the "curse" proc is on you? Use "SKILLS".

2) Gun's proc has root, which can't be avoided and our juggernaut doesn't work on it as well. That root couldn't be avoided and yet it's a rare proc, not much rare BTW.Use "SKILLS" and don't attack when you're under curse. Oh well, you talking about jugger? If a warrior uses jugger, he would be out of mana very fast, just wait when he's out of mana and use "SKILLS".

3) It is intended to be 100%, as it can be avoided whereas myth gun's proc can't be avoided. Just accept the fact, Mages can't kill equal geared warriors, even if you use those "SKILLS".


Firstly i didn't mention SnS once in my previous post, not sure where you magically saw me bring this up. With axe throw & skyward smash combination im guaranteed to be stunned which gives a warrior plenty of time to charge one attack even if you cant move for one second. Secondly, The root lasts 2-3 seconds which is nothing for a warrior to take some damage IF that proc is lucky enough to occur, also your immobilized but u can still use skills to pull your opponent.

Being equally geared or not isnt the issue im addressing, its a warriors ability to stun easily pull the opponent, or jump to, and curse. Dont act like you dont use juggernaut i know for a fact 90% of warriors use it and have no problem with mana vs a mage, perhaps if u have a mage, u could show us these skills that are used to counter that combination :) id be more than willing to use my noob warrior to test it.

[Haligali]

If bulwark gets nerfed. I say mythic Gun loses its root and mythic bow loses 50 dmg. Seems fair imo seeing how the other weapons are insanely op

Lets say, bulwark nerf and mages arcane weapon dont get buff either, deal ok?

[- Samdegreat]

If bulwark gets nerfed. I say mythic Gun loses its root and mythic bow loses 50 dmg. Seems fair imo seeing how the other weapons are insanely op

Agreed lol

[Benworushi]

really boring ..this game already enuf boring ...nerf bulwark .tank weapon ..u guys really think war glad hold shield run elite ..its boring .most of play pvp .but sts just design a no dmg weapon ...that sadly for war ..if war have new mythic weapon lvl 41.then plz sts nurf bulwark .i even agree remove it .super ugly shield ..

[Niixed]

Was Waiting for this Thread.

I'd rather mages get the proper buffs they deserve in PvP over nerfing other classes or weapons. and not just at end game either.

Its pretty apparent that STS already makes adjustments to the classes so they play "more fair" in PvP, why can't they adjust mages so they are better able to have a fair fight.

I'm actually quite happy to see a weapon that was considered PvE only be viable in PvP as well. Its adds greatly to the variety in PvP and not everyone has to rely on the same builds/weapons/gears/pets to compete.

I don't mind a powerful warrior weapon, but it will make the anti-mage imbalance even worse. Mages will now get the lowest number of kills on top of the highest number of deaths. It's starting to feel like class discrimination against mages. I'm going to be posting some hard data on this and I hope STS will realize how bad it is.

[Instanthumor]

First of all, why do you want Bulwark to be fixed? Because you're mage and don't play Warrior? So?
We all have noticed, bulwark makes the warrior class weak in pvp because of low damage+Low heal and weak proc. Still complaining? Oh well, mage's root proc is better than any proc in game, you can kill a rogue with that proc, easily. As you know Warriors > Mages so no need to nerf something, you can die without a bulwark as well. This proc is not good for 1v1, unless the enemy knows how to VS warrior. Isn't it easy? Bulwark has got a very short range, why not to kite them, run away? No one wants to stand near a warrior and play, you got joystick use it and stay away from that shortranged charge attacks.
Since, it got a bad stats, just a proc that doesn't suits you, doesn't mean that it should be nerfed.

-1

Calling me out that I'm not a warrior is just lol, lol.

First of all, it is debatable whether the root proc is the best proc in game. Even if it is, chances of it occurring is rare, unlike the Bulwark which has a 100% chance to proc. Out of 10 matches vs rogues, the gun will proc MAYBE once out of ten times. I'm complaining because it's not balanced. Please tell me, WHO made the game this way that it's warrior > mage > rogue > warrior? Tell me, who? I tell you now, anytime somebody posts that, I just laugh.. because it's not true. Give me any warrior - samael, arcane ring, glaive/maul, anything - I'll beat him one way or the other with my non-arcane ring mage 1v1. And yet you still say warrior > mage?

A warrior could use absolutely NO skills, have NO pet and still beat me just using Bulwark's curse. IMO, that's just dissing mages. Probably the most important job for a mage in a clash is to Curse, but really, what's the point of mages when warrior's have a BETTER curse with theoretically 0 sec cooldown time? Every other class has their measure of crowd control, whether it be their pet or their skills, so what really is the point of mages? I've actually tested this earlier with several warriors. All they did was use charge bulwark (they didn't even heal) and I killed myself before I could kill them - full offensive, no DoT build. That shouldn't be happening. There's no balance whatsoever.

You say the proc is not good for 1v1? Lol ok whatever dude. Bulwark doesn't have "short" range for a warrior weapon. It just had its range INCREASED. You want me to kite? Ok I try my best to kite warrior using gale and such, but 90%+ of warriors will use this axe + ss against mage 1v1. Axe + ss that's already in range, all it takes is one hit from Bulwark and my hp will start dropping 50% in 2 seconds. Jugg counters movement impairing effects so there is no real way to stop a warrior from reaching you. Gale's cooldown is over 5 seconds.

If sts randomly buffs bulwark an additional 300 armor, I'm not gunna complain one bit. But giving them a mage skill really ticks me off as well as the rest of mages out there. Just because we're midgets, who do you take us for?

[spimeslam]

I say boost all armor for mages 15% but if a mage is full life gems people will complain that mage are to op because already a full life gem mage is op if you ask me. They have HP closer to warrior and damage like a rogue (without the high crit). mages are an assist class just like warrior is defensive and rogues are offensive but we all do damage in different ways. A mage isn't really supposed to stand on their own but I got my butt kicked anyway by mages at pvp so idk. If mages get stronger I will just get whooped more but I do believe something should be done for them without altering other classes to accomplish this.

The sorcerers at pl are squishy and they are here too. They can control the battle though if they are backed up appropriately by team mates.

After I am able to connect without serious lag I will go fight a pro mage, but I don't use jugg or axe throw nor do I know how to succeed well with those skills. But if I just squash the mage then there is imbalance. I believe it takes a pro armored pvper with loads of skill to accomplish overpowering everybody. If they are that good.. that's exactly what they are. I don't believe just 1 or 2 things makes somebody able to defeat everybody.

All classes right now have awesome mythics which is great that everybody got something worth while.

Boost all mage armor by 15% would this not make them beatable but not unbeatable? I do want everyone to be happy and if multiple mages are feeling shorted that speaks for a % of the population that are not active at forums.

I believe bulwarks proc isn't as powerful as curse skill because skills have 5 points. The charge is fast for it and if you have 5/5 curse it not only delivers damage which is all bulwarks curse is but the proc is limited to less than half the damage curse skill is capable of. So there really isn't a problem there if you ask me. If it was like fifth skill for warrior it would be a worthless one.

[Hercules]

It thread should to be closed :/

[spimeslam]

The proc maybe 100% but for Slow charged attack and its ur choice to attack while proc is active. If you don't attack proc effects you none whatsoever which is what I do if I get cursed. If you wish to attack while cursed by a mage you wont survive.
2 warriors going head to head with bulwark would be test to see.

[Instanthumor]

It thread should to be closed :/

Why? I think the discussion is pretty good.

[aarrgggggg]

No just no

Bulwark JUST received a much needed buff because as it was it was a useless weapon.
Now its actually a decent weapon as it should be.
Definitly do not nerf the RECENTLY BUFFED bulwark.


Sidenote: Cooldown for mages shield is way too long. <--------------------FIX THIS

[Pedgon]

Quit tank pls. you arent fit to be a tank with that logic.

..that's what all warriors think ..so maybe we should all quit tank, kid! sad comment..:stupid:

[Ipoopsy]

I think the weapon is fine. If you're not a war class and you get curse by a war weapon's proc, that means your not playing your classes well enough. Why would you get in melee range of a war anyway? Most rogue and mages fight from a distance using range weapon/skills.

[Instanthumor]

I think the weapon is fine. If you're not a war class and you get curse by a war weapon's proc, that means your not playing your classes well enough. Why would you get in melee range of a war anyway? Most rogue and mages fight from a distance using range weapon/skills.

Read post #87. Ty

[Ipoopsy]

Read post #87. Ty

I did. You must be a bad mage then to get curse proc by a war.

Nuff said.

[spimeslam]

If warrior kills you with bulwark its still just good game. Ill say again use life gems for more HP and stay away from warrior best you can. If you can't well.... they got ya!

[Instanthumor]

I did. You must be a bad mage then to get curse proc by a war.

Nuff said.

Please explain.

[Speedofsound]

I did. You must be a bad mage then to get curse proc by a war.

Nuff said.
Lolwut.
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/09/19/06eff0be95b2574cd83791152a479571.jpg

[Gensin]

Its doing the exact same as the mage curse skill, however mage curse skill got a long cooldown. Makes us mages more useless in pvp.

Rogues got last season arcane shield, warriors now curse like hell, next season warriors will have timeshift rogues will have fireball. Ok gives us juggernaut and aimed shot please.

Uhm,
Rogues have fireball already btw, (Magmatic Daggers).

[Dex Scene]

It thread should to be closed :/
Heck no!! I was enjoying reading all of it till this post of yours and lots of informative discussion.

[Ishtmeet]

Calling me out that I'm not a warrior is just lol, lol.

First of all, it is debatable whether the root proc is the best proc in game. Even if it is, chances of it occurring is rare, unlike the Bulwark which has a 100% chance to proc. Out of 10 matches vs rogues, the gun will proc MAYBE once out of ten times. I'm complaining because it's not balanced. Please tell me, WHO made the game this way that it's warrior > mage > rogue > warrior? Tell me, who? I tell you now, anytime somebody posts that, I just laugh.. because it's not true. Give me any warrior - samael, arcane ring, glaive/maul, anything - I'll beat him one way or the other with my non-arcane ring mage 1v1. And yet you still say warrior > mage?

A warrior could use absolutely NO skills, have NO pet and still beat me just using Bulwark's curse. IMO, that's just dissing mages. Probably the most important job for a mage in a clash is to Curse, but really, what's the point of mages when warrior's have a BETTER curse with theoretically 0 sec cooldown time? Every other class has their measure of crowd control, whether it be their pet or their skills, so what really is the point of mages? I've actually tested this earlier with several warriors. All they did was use charge bulwark (they didn't even heal) and I killed myself before I could kill them - full offensive, no DoT build. That shouldn't be happening. There's no balance whatsoever.

You say the proc is not good for 1v1? Lol ok whatever dude. Bulwark doesn't have "short" range for a warrior weapon. It just had its range INCREASED. You want me to kite? Ok I try my best to kite warrior using gale and such, but 90%+ of warriors will use this axe + ss against mage 1v1. Axe + ss that's already in range, all it takes is one hit from Bulwark and my hp will start dropping 50% in 2 seconds. Jugg counters movement impairing effects so there is no real way to stop a warrior from reaching you. Gale's cooldown is over 5 seconds.

If sts randomly buffs bulwark an additional 300 armor, I'm not gunna complain one bit. But giving them a mage skill really ticks me off as well as the rest of mages out there. Just because we're midgets, who do you take us for?
1) Dude seriously???!? Do you think you can beat a fully geared warrior? Killing some afk's doesn't mean you can kill all. Oh well, just try to fight some good tanks. And can you just PM me the name of those tanks having arcane ring+Maul those you already beat in 1v1? Can I have a video pls.
2) Game is balanced. If you think mage is underpowered, go make a warrior.
3) Just accept the fact Warriors > Mages.

[SacredKnight]

Tell you what...

To make everyone be quiet...

Reduce SnS Purple pools dmg by 10-15%

Reduce Bulwark curse affect dmg by 10%

Increase HP and armor of mages by 11% in PvP

:P

[Xeusx]

Lol@ThisDiscussion.

[Instanthumor]

1) Dude seriously???!? Do you think you can beat a fully geared warrior? Killing some afk's doesn't mean you can kill all. Oh well, just try to fight some good tanks. And can you just PM me the name of those tanks having arcane ring+Maul those you already beat in 1v1? Can I have a video pls.
2) Game is balanced. If you think mage is underpowered, go make a warrior.
3) Just accept the fact Warriors > Mages.

1.) Just to name a few - barzagli, triplewarrior, drjester, angeldevil, etc. Want more? PM me. I don't need a video to have to prove it to you, ask people yourself.
2.) I probably have more warriors than you do, including my endgame warrior which you obviously don't know about it seems.
3.) I can't accept the fact that warriors > mages because it's not true. Please post a quote from a dev or someone where it says it's supposed to be warriors > mages > rogues > warriors, because there is none, tyvm.

[- Samdegreat]

1.) Just to name a few - barzagli, triplewarrior, drjester, angeldevil, etc. Want more? PM me. I don't need a video to have to prove it to you, ask people yourself.
2.) I probably have more warriors than you do, including my endgame warrior which you obviously don't know about it seems.
3.) I can't accept the fact that warriors > mages because it's not true. Please post a quote from a dev or someone where it says it's supposed to be warriors > mages > rogues > warriors, because there is none, tyvm.

If you seriosuly killed these nubs then I was right for them its gear>skill

Come vs me best of 10 if you kill me once I'll giv u 300k!

No joke :) pm me your in game name and I'll contact you !

Also I have no arcane ring or samael so should be easy for you haha

[Ishtmeet]

1.) Just to name a few - barzagli, triplewarrior, drjester, angeldevil, etc. Want more? PM me. I don't need a video to have to prove it to you, ask people yourself.
2.) I probably have more warriors than you do, including my endgame warrior which you obviously don't know about it seems.
3.) I can't accept the fact that warriors > mages because it's not true. Please post a quote from a dev or someone where it says it's supposed to be warriors > mages > rogues > warriors, because there is none, tyvm.

FYI I have 6 capped accounts, 3, 2 mage 1 rogue. I have 4 twink warriors at level 15, 12 , 23 and level 31(Using maul). Got more than this? I have fought a lot of mages, and seriously, if we have equal gear, he can't even take me below 30%. You saying this because , wariors in lvl 41 are using lvl 36 mythics right? Let the next season come and Prove your statement pls.
List of the above mentioned warriors, let them see this post. You killed them once in 10 fights? And the AL PvP system is: Warrior>Mage, ROgue> Warrior and Mage> Rogue, you know why? Because it is true and it is real. This is what I'm talking about players having the same gear(Myth with myth likewise). If a warrior with arcae ring and glaive loses to a mage in 1v1 (LOL!!!)! I'll advice him to learn PvP.


That's it, just face it buddy, Warriors>Mages even if you use your SKILLS.

[Anarchist]

If you seriosuly killed these nubs then I was right for them its gear>skill

Come vs me best of 10 if you kill me once I'll giv u 300k!

No joke :) pm me your in game name and I'll contact you !

Also I have no arcane ring or samael so should be easy for you haha

He is bragging with proves.
Sure in a overall match instant will never win but in 10 rounds he can win 1-4 times vs a war. Stun locks heal fails ecc.

[ClumsyCactus]

No offense guys, but...
103648

[Anarchist]

If you have nothing to add to a discussion and want everyone to shut up start the silence first by shutting up.
...

[utpal]

who want video of pvp duel ?
Instant vs Ishx

[Anarchist]

who want video of pvp duel ?
Instant vs Ishx


Arry vs ish too thanks.

[Madnex]

If tank goes jugg/axe/skysmash/bulwark charge/hor/repeat it's gg for *any* mage.

[Ishtmeet]

who want video of pvp duel ?
Instant vs Ishx
Waaa I'm ready!!! I got my camtasia ready as well lol

[Hectororius]

My Popcorn is ready

[Bless]

who want video of pvp duel ?
Instant vs Ishx
Waaa I'm ready!!! I got my camtasia ready as well lol Ill record xD

[spimeslam]

I went pvp last night and I'm bulwark user I didn't get a single kill. Oh yeah way to overpowered.. somebody said drop bulwark damage 10% lol at this cuz that was more than it was buffed in the first place. I don't enjoy barely getting kills (but I'm not full of rage like most pvpers) but face it u gotta have friends to 1v1 with that let you kill em 10 times cuz atm at pvp very few respectful people I asked all over and if I try 1v1 I get jumped and died 100%. Leave bulwark alone stop ruining fun for people.

Btw I use bulwark mythic set ring legendary amulet and Singe pet which got buffed too and I die more than kill if I kill at all. I have to have good back up and clash going on to manage any kills(help from other classes/players). I so hope you debuff me so I am able to suck a little more than I do already(sarcasm)

what I did see though is I was stunned a lot died because I couldn't heal I tried to charge bulwark as much as possible (so i could better understand why people were complaining) which very few hits landed and when they did hmm nobody died. If bulwark beats you then...the warrior has skills. I wouldnt go too extreme on this I'm sure STS can really test anything so using bulwark war and a mage (altho its hsrd to 1v1 at pvp at 41 period, so thats a snowballs chance in hawaii) they can battle and see its not about bulwark being too strong, its just that now it works better. But you can't test bulwark 1v1 without a controlled situation.

Before bulwark fix I went pvp with bulwark mages and rogues slayed me always which kept me from playing pvp. I just start after bulwark fix. cuz yes! I finally I got a weapon worth 41 mythic status and now its to op...
mages are strong rogues 1 hit and it takes a skilled warrior to kill anybody.

Props to those warriors that manage to slay well with bulwark but for me I gotta find a respectful fight with eqaul Gear without being jumped to have a real chance 1v1 but you just get jumped always cuz people at lvl 41 just beg for +kdr and they don't care how cheap they fight to do so.

Its ok I die some its pvp and there are better players than me out there but I wish everybody would see that, sometimes its best to say good fight and move on. I do it even when I get hanged and I leave respectfully before they do it again(which is about all I do at pvp til I got good backup).

Lower all damage output at pvp by a % if you must but don't make a mythic lesser (for any class) so unskilled players get easy kills. Bulwark isn't arcane ring in my hand but at all other lvls I've played at pvp mages are weak vs warriors. So why should they beat warrior at 41 and rogues best us too?

[Gensin]

My Popcorn is ready

Been there done that.

[Nesox]

1) 3) Just accept the fact Warriors > Mages.

I do not accept this assertion and neither should you. Would you just accept it as fair should a rogue kill you 90% of the time? Would Rogues just accept it as fair if mages actually killed them 90% of the time? Any class should have an equally sporting chance against any other class. The old Warr>Rogue>Mage>Warr assertion is purely and acceptance of piss poor programming.

Since Shield is not so much a skill as it is a requirement in order to survive the first hit mages, for all practical arguments, have only three skills to the other classes four. Adding a reliable curse to a weapon is essentially providing a 5th skill free of charge. If the curse had the same rare occurance that the procs on other weapons had then this would make it just another dynamic to the game that we would adapt to. Making it a very common occurance, on the other hand, is what we are complalining about. Make the root proc on the gun proc at the same rate as the Bulwark and I bet you won't think this argument was so unfounded.

[spimeslam]

Nobody had problems with the fact that bulwark had curse (atleast i heard none) til it was fixed and brought up to par with the other mythic. This proves it isn't just about the proc. People want to make it to where warrior don't have a chance at pvp without the lower lvl hard hitting mythical or arcane maul and it isn't as good as mages curse skill if it was I'd agree with a lot of what's said here.

Its hard to land bulwark proc and if it were just small chance it don't even make it much worth charging bulwark except in pve. Pavise process was already removed from pvp and I suppose nobody will be happy til same is done with bulwark. (I see people with glaive and they have 2.5k to 2.7k armor what chance does a bulwark tank stand against that) I have 2.3k armor and I need every bit of power that is currently there to get any kills at all. Lvl cap 41 will leave warriors with nothing but legendaries to fight with in pvp.

Boost something else for mage but leave bulwark as it is I could agree with. If bulwark is weakened then I think its time another class has their proc removed from pvp. It isn't fair warriors get shafted when it comes to their weaponry.. rogue and mage weapons are always better in pvp than the lower lvl mythic but every other turn for warrior is disappointment.

I agree it should be fair but not at the cost of taking abilities from the lowest damage output class that always gets the short stick.

Lets say curse is removed and the heal proc too because if we want we could argue that the heal proc should be on the mages weapon because it isn't just a self heal. And lets give warrior same proc as lvl 31 weapon and disable (or disable curse leave heal) from pvp how much would bulwark be worth value wise as of usability.
While all other classes get shafted. Procs are meant to give you special powers that you wouldnt be able to do that are outside the box of your classes capabilities. At sometime every class gets its chance to shine but atm I dont see much difference with classes except that if somebody had arcane ring.

The only way I can say to fix this is don't make it a curse but rather heavy bleeding that hits the same damage over time. And let go of the fact that the current bulwark proc that is escapable by not attacking. So u just take heavy bleed and you can't compare to curse because it isn't done as u take damage like reflect. Rather than the mini curse would you rather have heavy bleed that is unavoidable. Lets not forget its a new mythic weapon.take the idea of how the damage is done and you can't compare it to curse... at all

[Volt]

If tank goes jugg/axe/skysmash/bulwark charge/hor/repeat it's gg for *any* mage.

Wut nab starts with jugg

[matanofx]

Trolls trolls trolls

Mages have 2 choices of weapons (both expensive) Elon gun or kershal, anything else is eliminated faster than the speed of light in pvp

Wars have the usual maul and glaive but also magma claymore which is superbad and i see claymore warriors kill many better geared players of ALL classes

Im glad the bulwrak is finally something warriors want but giving it that curse is just not fair, giving the war weap the mages best pvp skill, give me aimed shot or jug please

I dont mind too much with bulwrak having increased dmg/dps but dang it when im cursed i become even weaker in pvp

Troll all you want usual trolls but theres fair and theres unfair

[Dex Scene]

Instant doesn't mind the bulwark getting buffs, the buffs should be there as it was a disappointing myth weapon for warrior. Warriors needed it.
What bugs instant or most of main mages is, warriors getting a mage skill as a proc.
Maybe a solution would be removing the curse proc and adding bit more damage to the bulwark.
Or other procs which is more of warrior stuffs like ignore 20% incoming damages or 100-150 armor added which stacks with other armor buffs etc etc

[spimeslam]

I respect all y'all just adding that in. I do like like to discuss stuff but it must be reasonable. I've already suggested adding 15 percent armor to all sorcerers.. so if u had 100 armor before u would have 115 armor after, this would make images not so squishy cuz well y'all they really are just lil blue squishballs

Change the proc to be harsh bleeding damage so it doesn't have the attack return of mage ,that is like a reflect shield in a way, but by doing this you leave yourself out of the option to to sit still and avoid that damage because bleeding hits per sec or whatever.

Or weaken it and all other mythic weapons by a % ... so pvp (not pve!) doesn't seem at so much of a discrimity. Tell me sometimes you don't feel like you have been 1 hit by the most lethal elite boss around (like arena) so either weaken the amount of damage people take in pvp by a so you can slow things down and enjoy it (like what was done in pocket legends) but that makes long battles between warriors if 1v1.

We should all have great damage output cuz we love that, but STS would have to compensate skill ability into it so we can be all classes individually effective and fun with perfect structure with no problem.
this is hard to succeed but important I guess its like that other thread.. work on the foundation.

[Ishtmeet]

I do not accept this assertion and neither should you. Would you just accept it as fair should a rogue kill you 90% of the time? Would Rogues just accept it as fair if mages actually killed them 90% of the time? Any class should have an equally sporting chance against any other class. The old Warr>Rogue>Mage>Warr assertion is purely and acceptance of piss poor programming.

Since Shield is not so much a skill as it is a requirement in order to survive the first hit mages, for all practical arguments, have only three skills to the other classes four. Adding a reliable curse to a weapon is essentially providing a 5th skill free of charge. If the curse had the same rare occurance that the procs on other weapons had then this would make it just another dynamic to the game that we would adapt to. Making it a very common occurance, on the other hand, is what we are complalining about. Make the root proc on the gun proc at the same rate as the Bulwark and I bet you won't think this argument was so unfounded.

Simple answer: You CAN escape the bulwark's proc, but you CAN'T escape from the root proc, so it's pretty obvious why it is meant to be 100%. Bulwark has a pretty short range, don't dare to come near us, or get killed lol.

[Madnex]

Wut nab starts with jugg
You can also start with HoR, same thing. The point is to avoid the potential stunlock to death from FB combo and pet panic/terrify. Nab.

[Speedofsound]

Simple answer: You CAN escape the bulwark's proc, but you CAN'T escape from the root proc, so it's pretty obvious why it is meant to be 100%. Bulwark has a pretty short range, don't dare to come near us, or get killed lol.
Skyward smash and immediately charge bulwark to curse the mage. Gg

[spimeslam]

The charge takes to long to proc mage before they escape and btw its only Gg if you attack while you are procced otherwise you take no damage. So you really kill itself :o just get away from warrior and anytime you see bulwark you watch for proc but otherwise just kite him to best of your ability can't you use Pierce to blast right through warrior. I used that move to escape inan elite charged attacks with my pve rogue. Use traps to suck in warrior and aim him. There's ways around this.

[Speedofsound]

The charge takes to long to proc mage before they escape and btw its only Gg if you attack while you are procced otherwise you take no damage. So you really kill itself :o just get away from warrior and anytime you see bulwark you watch for proc but otherwise just kite him to best of your ability can't you use Pierce to blast right through warrior. I used that move to escape inan elite charged attacks with my pve rogue. Use traps to suck in warrior and aim him. There's ways around this.
First off If ur using traps in pvp you shouldnt even be pvping. Thats a disgusting build. Second off ive seen tanks literally destroy geared mages with a bulwark. If you cant u need to rethink your strategy.

[Remember Me]

I think its OK for bulwark to be this powerful, after all the maul has had its time. I like how StS made an unexlusive weapon (meaning everyone can get) surpass the maul. I think its good but not OP, the roots are just as annoying as the curses.

[Xpolosion]

GG mages GG thanks again stg for destroying mages.. why did you give x2 curse buff. makes no sense

[Xpolosion]

so now wars have a 5th skill that requires no mana and procs on regular auto attacks.... not to mention they x2 buffed the curse. The curse was fine how it was..

[Legallyblonde]

Sts balance team be cray cray

[Ishtmeet]

Skyward smash and immediately charge bulwark to curse the mage. Gg

ou can't charge immediately, takes 1.5 sec to charge. Hence, why not to stop attacking when under curse's effect? Like what rogue's do when they're under mage's curse.

[Ishtmeet]

Why every mage is raged lol? Okay it's fine, just give me all those kills that people stole from me(KS) and it'll be alright, want to make it fair right? The bulwark's proc is not any kind of problem if he mage really knows "How to play" against warriors. Just see, warriors have 350 less HP regen per tick when they use Bulwark instead maul/glaive, that makes- around 2100 less Healing in 6 ticks- I.E Warrior can only heal 65-70% of his whole health, get it?. Isn't it a disadvantage as well, eh? Bulwark's stats are pretty weak as compared to mythics of other classes, that proc is what Bulwark is all about, why do you want it to be a legend weapon having no use at all?

[Ice]

Omg unlimited complains Up and down.... bulwark just got nerf up now people want it to nerf down... you guys never run out of complains.

[Anarchist]

Omg unlimited complains Up and down.... bulwark just got buff up now people want it to nerf down... you guys never run out of complains.
Edited



You Welcome. ^.^

[Ice]

Edited



You Welcome. ^.^

wahahah lol... meh this people keep complain 24hrs! SNS, Bulwark, Singe, Now Sts do what you have to do and leave it as the original planed or original stats.

As we can all see all this forum users never run out of complains, just dont listen to them and leave or bring back the original stats of everything. If you keep listening to them you will just go in circle buff up , nerf down , up , down never ending cycle!

[Xeusx]

wahahah lol... meh this people keep complain 24hrs! SNS, Bulwark, Singe, Now Sts do what you have to do and leave it as the original planed or original stats.

As we can all see all this forum users never run out of complains, just dont listen to them and leave or bring back the original stats of everything. If you keep listening to them you will just go in circle buff up , nerf down , up , down never ending cycle!
They want to posting too much to get the "Luminary Poster" title, lol.

[Ice]

They want to posting too much to get the "Luminary Poster" title, lol.

the guy who made this thread want to nerf everything, he want to buff whim brother too!
Instamore or whatever your name is, Why wont you make your own game! you cry a dude...

[Anarchist]

wahahah lol... meh this people keep complain 24hrs! SNS, Bulwark, Singe, Now Sts do what you have to do and leave it as the original planed or original stats.

As we can all see all this forum users never run out of complains, just dont listen to them and leave or bring back the original stats of everything. If you keep listening to them you will just go in circle buff up , nerf down , up , down never ending cycle!

Imo the forum was made purposely to discuss game balance and render the devs feedbacks while also discussing general nonsense.

Sayin buff this weapon cause its too weak for its status
Or
Nerf that pet cause its too strong and outbalance the game is a feedback. F E E D B A C K.

Forums wasn't meant exclusively for pvp dramas/ flamebaits/ clash videos, hope ya know.

[Dex Scene]

Imo the forum was made purposely to discuss game balance and render the devs feedbacks while also discussing general nonsense
F E E D B A C K.

Forums wasn't meant exclusively for pvp dramas/ flamebaits/ clash videos, hope ya know.

Haha ^
couldn't stop laughing at this

[Xeusx]

Imo the forum was made purposely to discuss game balance and render the devs feedbacks while also discussing general nonsense.

Sayin buff this weapon cause its too weak for its status
Or
Nerf that pet cause its too strong and outbalance the game is a feedback. F E E D B A C K.

Forums wasn't meant exclusively for pvp dramas/ flamebaits/ clash videos, hope ya know.
I'm feeling this post is too bossy :P

[Anarchist]

His brain don't have perfect memory.

Since you auto proclamed yourself forum TOS enforcer, please take a moment to remember:



Personal attacks include, but are not limited to insulting a poster directly:

Example: “You are stupid, you suck, and you should [censored].”
The above are a just few examples of behavior that is not tolerated on the forums. Basically, play nice and get along. Thanks!


Or you only remember to copy paste the forum rules when its convenient to you?

[Xeusx]

Since you auto proclamed yourself forum TOS enforcer, please take a moment to remember:



Or you only remember to copy paste the forum rules when its convenient to you?
Damn! I forgot that, sorry ;-;

Anyway, thanks for reminding me about that!

[Xpolosion]

Well give mages a war skill or rogue skill since they have all mage skills.. Let us get a stun block thru our shield upgrade

[Xpolosion]

Through a shield upgrade or something

[Ishtmeet]

the guy who made this thread want to nerf everything, he want to buff whim brother too!
Instamore or whatever your name is, Why wont you make your own game! you cry a dude...
Was a bit rude, but agree

[Arry]

Arry vs ish too thanks.

Gladly would :) anytime. get ur camtasia rdy

[Pedgon]

the guy who made this thread want to nerf everything, he want to buff whim brother too!
Instamore or whatever your name is, Why wont you make your own game! you cry a dude...

lool exactly bro!!;)

[Jonnymaynard]

Arry can show u how to beat an bullwark... SnS and ring needed

[spimeslam]

(Sarcasm) Lets just nerf all mythic and arcane they all to overpowered and lets remove all weapon procs because they all let our classes do stuff that's outside the box to what we are traditionally capable of.

This is a horrible idea... but realize all classes do have special abilities and they will get better and better but if you remove curse from bulwark other weapon procs come into question of if a certain class should have that ability via proc or otherwise.

[- Samdegreat]

Arry can show u how to beat an bullwark... SnS and ring needed

It can be done, I don't have ring or arcane pet but I fought mage for 2mins who had sns and ring they use sns to get shield back and eventually warrior runs out of mana to carry on....

Although I used bulwark so maybe magma for more damage would work

[spimeslam]

Instanthumor said bulwark could beat mage without warrior using pet or skills. I see this as impossible if this is possible why do you attack while procced by bulwark? That makes no sense.

[Ipoopsy]

Instanthumor said bulwark could beat mage without warrior using pet or skills. I see this as impossible if this is possible why do you attack while procced by bulwark? That makes no sense.

Maybe he need glasses to see clearly :P

[Caabatric]

So Instanthumor truly one of the best mages in the game is being called a noob.
Man i wish you guys would play a mage. I have been in pvp rooms where without even fighting me people say: "You play mage. Wow your a nub."
Your complaining about your heal which truly is the best in the game since it provides invincibility and heals the most(though it doesnt seem like it to a war with 7k+ hp.).

If you were to give a 7% dmg nerf on the curse of bulwark only and reduce root proc occurrence in a pvp room i am pretty sure most mages and wars will be happy.

[spimeslam]

I don't think I or anyone in this forum said instanthumor was a noob. I believe caabatric may be right about this issue but I'd make the changes strictly to pvp not pve. Some suggestions here are completely wack and craziness doesn't solve anything.

[Caabatric]

I don't think I or anyone in this forum said instanthumor was a noob. I believe caabatric may be right about this issue but I'd make the changes strictly to pvp not pve. Some suggestions here are completely wack and craziness doesn't solve anything.
Yeah I realize this after reading through it again, lol.
This is also why I said in a pvp room, similar to the rogue dmg nerf

[honeybutter]

As I promised someone earlier, I'm gunna write this little thread. Not 100% sure what it does, but all I know is that there's a little Curse thing (if I'm not mistaken, from a charged dps attack) that hurts A LOT and it's OP. Please nerf, ty. I thought this weapon's purpose was supposed to be a tanking weapon, but noooooooo, a non-arcane ring, no samael warrior w/ Bulwark does 5 times more damage than a max geared warrior. Yes, I am crying.

Couldn't disagree more. I have vs against this weapon since buff many times with my rogue, we have tested it and I also have a +9 on my warrior and used it quite a bit
Its, yes a little better now. The curse/reflect does return damage but nothing like curse on mage at all lol. Many wars that switched from glaives/mauls to this are actually easier to handle with a rogue. They lost any controllable burst damage. There is no stun proc, and extra damage is only a reflect, so HAVE to be hit very hard that moment which isn't very often to make a big impact.


but noooooooo, a non-arcane ring, no samael warrior w/ Bulwark does 5 times more damage than a max geared warrior. Yes, I am crying

You forgot add that it gets you a girlfriend and makes you rich and that you are selling 10 of them....... J/K!! <3<3 jajaja

[spimeslam]

I watched instanthumor get hit by bulwark proc a couple times maybe 3 and he kept attacking it eventually killed him with no heal or shield. That seems like what its supposed to do if you keep attacking. On the otherhand if it does response damage to each bit of damage from dot as well as regular attack/skills it shouldn't. If somebody drops clock on warrior it shouldn't retaliate large damage for each small tick of damage. Somebody tell me if it does? Does mage curse do this if clock drops while caster is cursed? This may be a dot reciprocal issue... I'm just trying to figure out what's up. But regardless I don't get kills hardly at pvp unless I got pro backup with me.

[Instanthumor]

I watched instanthumor get hit by bulwark proc a couple times maybe 3 and he kept attacking it eventually killed him with no heal or shield. That seems like what its supposed to do if you keep attacking. On the otherhand if it does response damage to each bit of damage from dot as well as regular attack/skills it shouldn't. If somebody drops clock on warrior it shouldn't retaliate large damage for each small tick of damage. Somebody tell me if it does? Does mage curse do this if clock drops while caster is cursed? This may be a dot reciprocal issue... I'm just trying to figure out what's up. But regardless I don't get kills hardly at pvp unless I got pro backup with me.

Look here. It seems that you (and the majority of the fellow bulwark users) are not getting the message because it's the weapon that YOU use making you biased towards anything I say about the Bulwark. What REALLY happened, was this: I got cursed from a charged bulwark attack, did ONE combo... Let me repeat myself... ONE combo (no DoT whatsoever) and DIED. That ONE combo from bulwark's curse literally demolished my 4k+ HP. That literally TEN TIMES better than a mage's curse, and that's what pisses me (and the other mages) off. Sts is literally dissing mages right now - not cool. A normal combo while cursed would probably deal around 10-15% of my hp at the very most, while ONE combo cursed from bulwark destroys my 4k HP. In my opinion, that's ridiculous.

Just to get you to realize. I DO NOT care whether bulwarks get buffed or not, I DO NOT care if they receive an additional 500 armor bonus or 1k hp bonus. I DO care that warriors have a mage's skill right now. Put it this way. If sts gives mages Juggernaut, how many warriors would complain? EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM. You feel me bro? Do you?

[matanofx]

As you said instant, they're biased towards anything you will say about bulwark cause theyre using a bulwark

You can say add dmg/add armor/whatever but when you say "nerf _____" trolls jump and comment

In private chats i had with bulwark warriors they told me "mage has just become significantly insignificant in pvp due to this curse"

Forums, it seems, isnt the place to get true opinions, only people with motives.

[Robhawk]

Well...

mages were the idiots in this game (pvp wise), they are the idiots and probably for ever will be !!!

Since L31 warriors owned everything with arcane maul, it got even worse with L36 myth glaive/bonesaw. As mage you have nearly NO chance in a vs!

For moooonth there is a glitch which gives rogues insane damageoutput in tdm. A rogue doesnt even need top gear to just 1 shoot a maxed out mage!

This new Shady n Surge is able to kill a whole team alone when its AA hits while stun/terrify from samaels...

So now the formerly bad bulwark curses? ARE YOU KIIIDDDDIINNNNNNGG MEEEE ?!?!!?!?

So whats the point for playing mage in pvp anymore? You can kill glitched rogues but the shieldcooldown will get it even... useless! Warriors run around with curse bulwark now... there is no chance to beat this 1on1, NO CHANCE! So hey we still can fight other mages... niiiiiiceeeee, TY !!!

I tell you something, BEFORE arcane ring, BEFORE SnS, BEFORE cursing bulwark there was at least some fun to play but now you (STS) not only messed up economy with all those plat abusers not beeing harmed.... NOW you also TOTALLY messed up PVP !!!

I wont play this until there are some major changes! TY!

ps: To all those "you need new strategies to counter cursing bulwark... to counter ShandynSurge" BLABLABLAAAAAAAAAAA
Play a mage vs all this nonsense and then tell me all your strategies WHICH ALL FAILED!

[spimeslam]

Uh woh ok..

[spimeslam]

Uh woh ok.. first off it was more than one curse and you just kept attacking hard humor which you aren't supposed to attack while cursed. So doing so and saying its overpowered isn't logical because if I do same to mages... ultimately its GD and I'm dead.

I have brought more solutions to this thread about solving the issue than any other. Believe me I want pvp to be fair to a extent for all players. Make bulwark curse into harsh bleeding damage and take away its reflect ability (not a mage ability) I'm not being disrespectful to anybody but I feel like this is pvp at forums and all I'm looking for is solutions. which I see none other than the dozen I've submitted here. By removing curse from warrior should'nt we remove fireball and lightning from rogues and similar stuff to other classes be removed from mages... root proc is like traps. Lets all come up with a solution not cry in a circle passing kleenex around like our friend died... or friends not dead he just needs operated on appropriately.

Lower curse damage by 7% in pvp somebody mentioned and lower chance for root proc in pvpis best advice I've saw from forumer here.

[Anarchist]

Mages are forming a angry mob here. Lol


Devs sup, wanna comment?

[Instanthumor]

Uh woh ok.. first off it was more than one curse and you just kept attacking hard humor which you aren't supposed to attack while cursed. So doing so and saying its overpowered isn't logical because if I do same to mages... ultimately its GD and I'm dead.


You're not very bright. That was a mere example to show how OP bulwark curse is compared to a mage's curse. Like I told you in-game, I'll tell you again, quit exaggerating. He cursed me ONCE... I combo'd him ONCE.. and died. Simple as that.

[obee]

Mages are forming angry mob here. Lol


Devs sup, wanna coment?
Ikr. Class imbalance has been a thing for a long time, they need to FREAKING FIX IT

[Caabatric]

Uh woh ok.. first off it was more than one curse and you just kept attacking hard humor which you aren't supposed to attack while cursed. So doing so and saying its overpowered isn't logical because if I do same to mages... ultimately its GD and I'm dead.

I have brought more solutions to this thread about solving the issue than any other. Believe me I want pvp to be fair to a extent for all players. Make bulwark curse into harsh bleeding damage and take away its reflect ability (not a mage ability) I'm not being disrespectful to anybody but I feel like this is pvp at forums and all I'm looking for is solutions. which I see none other than the dozen I've submitted here. By removing curse from warrior should'nt we remove fireball and lightning from rogues and similar stuff to other classes be removed from mages... root proc is like traps. Lets all come up with a solution not cry in a circle passing kleenex around like our friend died... or friends not dead he just needs operated on appropriately.

Lower curse damage by 7% in pvp somebody mentioned and lower chance for root proc in pvpis best advice I've saw from forumer here.

OMG i gave good advice lol.
Anyway the reason Instant attacked is because if he didnt attack he would just get pummeled because of the theoretical 0 sec cooldown. When he attacked the curse took the effect that it normally does and did major dmg. Normally while cursed you take 40%dmg(close to 1.8K) from fireball alone (from mage curse). We already know that the bulwark curse is similar to the mage curse just with no cooldown. This means that one combo form most mages = death unless they have full elo gems and str build in which case they have 6k hp or so (not comparable to a geared tank) and 1k armor (also not comparable).

P.S i picked the mage class because the description said i was able to harness the magic in arlor. Seems like its nothing special now.

[Dex Scene]

OMG i gave good advice lol.
Anyway the reason Instant attacked is because if he didnt attack he would just get pummeled because of the theoretical 0 sec cooldown. When he attacked the curse took the effect that it normally does and did major dmg. Normally while cursed you take 40%dmg(close to 1.8K) from fireball alone (from mage curse). We already know that the bulwark curse is similar to the mage curse just with no cooldown. This means that one combo form most mages = death unless they have full elo gems and str build in which case they have 6k hp or so (not comparable to a geared tank) and 1k armor (also not comparable).

P.S i picked the mage class because the description said i was able to harness the magic in arlor. Seems like its nothing special now.
You go my boy

[spimeslam]

I'm not trying to offend anyone and I don't think if have except humor may feel a little that way but he offended me too. I apologize if I have offended you instant I just really want a good constructive thread talk so something can be resolved because like I said I understand there is an issue. But the power of bulwark should be kept intact and be awesome unless we want to risk overhaul of all mythic 41 items.

The fight I witnessed instant do with warrior (just so this is understood) was just test to show power of bulwark the warrior didn't attack but just to proc a couple times. Yes a couple cuz instant said I qoute "proc again" and neither player had pets. I would have asked to see it again if he said it can be done with one proc but he insulted me and left the room. I'm sorry if you see me as a troll but I'm in no way a troll but stand for all warriors (and players in general) to say that all our weapons should be equally awesome. I agree vs mage bulwark may be more deadly but that don't help us vs rogues if we just make bulwark weaker.being honest if you think I'm merchant I'm not I have one bulwark I did have two but I sold 1 before buff and one after.

Like I said I don't hardly pvp whatsoever so I really could care less if they made bulwark crap for pvp lol but ik people would have issues and we are trying to fix issues not make more. As long as the weapon is great for pve, which its ok if u ask me, that's all I truly value pvp is just extra but that is thief move loved aspect of the game. I don't pvp enough so I don't make pvp build because it isn't worth my time so I die either way. You must commit to a build to be effective at pvp or get off the boat.

If it will make you feel better instant we could fight at pvp and you would beat me fair and sqaure with singe and bulwark and my pve specific build. And I have brought previous ideas to what could be done about bulwark all through this thread but this all has lost direction. This is my last post here y'all just be respective to other players/classes... nobody has to pay.

[Caabatric]

I'm not trying to offend anyone and I don't think if have except humor may feel a little that way but he offended me too. I apologize if I have offended you instant I just really want a good constructive thread talk so something can be resolved because like I said I understand there is an issue. But the power of bulwark should be kept intact and be awesome unless we want to risk overhaul of all mythic 41 items.

The fight I witnessed instant do with warrior (just so this is understood) was just test to show power of bulwark the warrior didn't attack but just to proc a couple times. Yes a couple cuz instant said I qoute "proc again" and neither player had pets. I would have asked to see it again if he said it can be done with one proc but he insulted me and left the room. I'm sorry if you see me as a troll but I'm in no way a troll but stand for all warriors (and players in general) to say that all our weapons should be equally awesome. I agree vs mage bulwark may be more deadly but that don't help us vs rogues if we just make bulwark weaker.being honest if you think I'm merchant I'm not I have one bulwark I did have two but I sold 1 before buff and one after.

Like I said I don't hardly pvp whatsoever so I really could care less if they made bulwark crap for pvp lol but ik people would have issues and we are trying to fix issues not make more. As long as the weapon is great for pve, which its ok if u ask me, that's all I truly value pvp is just extra but that is thief move loved aspect of the game. I don't pvp enough so I don't make pvp build because it isn't worth my time so I die either way. You must commit to a build to be effective at pvp or get off the boat.

If it will make you feel better instant we could fight at pvp and you would beat me fair and sqaure with singe and bulwark and my pve specific build. And I have brought previous ideas to what could be done about bulwark all through this thread but this all has lost direction. This is my last post here y'all just be respective to other players/classes... nobody has to pay.
Also add a nerf in pvp room to rogues mythic weapon.(cant think of one seems pretty balanced to me since proc isnt that great)

[Seoratrek]

Hey everyone,

I've removed the non-constructive posts here. Let's keep the discussion friendly, ok? :encouragement: I am also forwarding your concerns to the devs. Thanks!

[Instanthumor]

But the power of bulwark should be kept intact and be awesome unless we want to risk overhaul of all mythic 41 items.


If you were paying any attention to what I said, you would understand. My problem here isn't because bulwark is OP, personally, I WANT it to be OP. As I said before and I will say it again, giving warriors a MAGE skill is out of the question, and that's why this thread appeared in the first place, not because of some stupid buff bulwark got. Who cares about stats.



The fight I witnessed instant do with warrior (just so this is understood) was just test to show power of bulwark the warrior didn't attack but just to proc a couple times. Yes a couple cuz instant said I qoute "proc again" and neither player had pets.

Just to clarify. There is no need for exaggeration. "Proc a couple times"? Lol? It takes one proc to kill a mage. The first time he proc'd, I was stunned for pretty much the whole duration so I asked him to do it again to witness the whole effect. Why did you even state none of us had pets equipped? That has no effect on outcome at all. I only asked to unequip pet so pet damage wouldn't be counted in the test.

Warriors shouldn't be able to use a mage's skill. And even IF they do, it shouldn't be FIVE TIMES more powerful. That ONE combo (no dot) destroyed my 3.9k HP (without pet), while a mage's curse would probably do 15% damage. That's the main argument here, not none of your personal problems you have with my attitude. Deal with it. If you think I'm bad, you haven't even pvp'd it seems.

[Instanthumor]

As a mage, Curse is a useless skill now. Here's why: Curse is only effective against people who do DoT damage. Most mages already cut out any DoT from their build already, rogues adapt and not use Nox while cursed, warriors have no DoT attacks whatsoever. The majority of warriors now in pvp run with bulwarks. That means every pvp room you enter, chances are, you'll run with a bulwark warrior. That also means you have curse already, you don't need curse as a mage. So now mages have SEVEN skills to pick from, not eight like all the other classes. Are you discriminating against blue people? This is serious business here.

[Caabatric]

So now mages have SEVEN skills to pick from, not eight like all the other classes. Are you discriminating against blue people? This is serious business here.
Well we have 5 original skills. :)
Cya shield, bb fireball, tc curse.
Im sure mages design all the weapons now because all there "unique" attributes are being put inside the weapons.

[Ravager]

I fight a lot in tdm. Sometimes I'll fight in CTF. In CTF, people are in enclosed quarters and usually engaging head on. The mages die pretty easily here.

I have fought a few tdm matches with mages playing smart and not attacking while they are under the bulwark proc. It was annoying at first but I saw it as they were playing smart. My team even lost a few teams. Nearly evenly geared teams as well. Sometimes I would run into gale mages who would withhold on attacking as well. Evasive mages and rogues do well against warriors with bulwark.

Although the range on the bulwark is increased on charge, it still have extremely bad range. You literally have to be on top of the opponent. Sure warriors have the axe or skyward smash to get close to the opponent but then there is a 1/2 second to 1/4 second of pause for the warrior. The warrior can charge their attack but it won't be in time to immediate use the attack. During this duration, if the mage/rogue or opponent is not stunned, i have seen them charge sp or charge gale out. Sometimes even just walk away in the opposite direction since the charge will take a while for the autoattack of bulwark.

Smart team play can still take out bulwark players. Some old strategies won't work.

Arrypotta did a sample match with me and did well. He came close. I still beat him mainly due to class advantage I think. The match lasted forever. He used his range to his advantage many times and came close. He used a different build and different strategy than most mages I fought.

The bow is still the best of the 3 and was not nerfed. Although price doesn't always mean this but I'm sure in this case it has something to do with the price.

[Instanthumor]

I fight a lot in tdm. Sometimes I'll fight in CTF. In CTF, people are in enclosed quarters and usually engaging head on. The mages die pretty easily here.

I have fought a few tdm matches with mages playing smart and not attacking while they are under the bulwark proc. It was annoying at first but I saw it as they were playing smart. My team even lost a few teams. Nearly evenly geared teams as well. Sometimes I would run into gale mages who would withhold on attacking as well. Evasive mages and rogues do well against warriors with bulwark.

Although the range on the bulwark is increased on charge, it still have extremely bad range. You literally have to be on top of the opponent. Sure warriors have the axe or skyward smash to get close to the opponent but then there is a 1/2 second to 1/4 second of pause for the warrior. The warrior can charge their attack but it won't be in time to immediate use the attack. During this duration, if the mage/rogue or opponent is not stunned, i have seen them charge sp or charge gale out. Sometimes even just walk away in the opposite direction since the charge will take a while for the autoattack of bulwark.

Smart team play can still take out bulwark players. Some old strategies won't work.

Arrypotta did a sample match with me and did well. He came close. I still beat him mainly due to class advantage I think. The match lasted forever. He used his range to his advantage many times and came close. He used a different build and different strategy than most mages I fought.

This is true. Whenever I am cursed, I do not use any dps attacks (they're quick and drain your hp). In a ctf spawn room, where majority of 1v1's take place, the space is only so limited. You're bound to be cursed sooner or later.

Rav next time we're on, let's vs in tdm. I will be honest, in an arranged 1v1, I never lost to a warrior in a tdm room, but it's hard to set up a 1v1 there due to other people...

[Ravager]

This is true. Whenever I am cursed, I do not use any dps attacks (they're quick and drain your hp). In a ctf spawn room, where majority of 1v1's take place, the space is only so limited. You're bound to be cursed sooner or later.

Rav next time we're on, let's vs in tdm. I will be honest, in an arranged 1v1, I never lost to a warrior in a tdm room, but it's hard to set up a 1v1 there due to other people...

Sure np. But I don't recall the last time I've lost to a mage as well so not sure what would help here.

I think mages overall have a bad class disadvantage fighting a warrior head on.

It was moreso the team efforts than fighting a warrior head on that won the tdm vs 4v4 battle.

[spimeslam]

I agree with everything ravager says and instanthumors response too. +1 both

[Serillia]

As a mage, Curse is a useless skill now. Here's why: Curse is only effective against people who do DoT damage. Most mages already cut out any DoT from their build already, rogues adapt and not use Nox while cursed, warriors have no DoT attacks whatsoever. The majority of warriors now in pvp run with bulwarks. That means every pvp room you enter, chances are, you'll run with a bulwark warrior. That also means you have curse already, you don't need curse as a mage. So now mages have SEVEN skills to pick from, not eight like all the other classes. Are you discriminating against blue people? This is serious business here.

Rogues dont use Shadow storm shot(and prolly never will unless its buffed) and Tanks dont use Rally cry much in pvp.....................Sooo,that narrows it down to 7 skills per class ^_^

[Robhawk]

This is true. Whenever I am cursed, I do not use any dps attacks (they're quick and drain your hp). In a ctf spawn room, where majority of 1v1's take place, the space is only so limited. You're bound to be cursed sooner or later.

Rav next time we're on, let's vs in tdm. I will be honest, in an arranged 1v1, I never lost to a warrior in a tdm room, but it's hard to set up a 1v1 there due to other people...

Although i fully agree with you on the topic of the thread i have to say you dont play much tdm then... there are A LOT of good warriors that gonna kill you 1on1! To just reduce it to samael, if you dont have one you wont have a chance vs a good warrior! RavagerX is for sure one of those good warriors and i dont think you can beat him more than perhaps once out 10 and then it was your lucky crit and his unlucky timing to call HoR too late f.e.

[Instanthumor]

Although i fully agree with you on the topic of the thread i have to say you dont play much tdm then... there are A LOT of good warriors that gonna kill you 1on1! To just reduce it to samael, if you dont have one you wont have a chance vs a good warrior! RavagerX is for sure one of those good warriors and i dont think you can beat him more than perhaps once out 10 and then it was your lucky crit and his unlucky timing to call HoR too late f.e.

I do TDM on a daily basis. I can speak for myself on that part, ty. I can also prove to you that you don't need Samael to kill a warrior in 1v1. Ty for your input.

[Robhawk]

I do TDM on a daily basis. I can speak for myself on that part, ty. I can also prove to you that you don't need Samael to kill a warrior in 1v1. Ty for your input.

Well i never saw you in a single tdm room for month... perhaps timezone difference? Did you change your ign?

[Instanthumor]

Well i never saw you in a single tdm room for month... perhaps timezone difference? Did you change your ign?

Timezone it is.

[Robhawk]

Timezone it is.

I see... well if you really beat RavagerX in a vs best of 5 or more, you get my credits... But hey arry lost to him and he is skilled, arcane ring, fully grand gems and samael... so... GL! ;)
Let us here the results of the match or even better show a video! :D

[UndeadJudge]

But doesn't bulwark curse stack with mages curse..? Or does it not?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[komatovic]

Ok, i read most of it and basically warriors are stating: " bulwark isn't that op...the curse can be defeated if you change your whole build and strategy", and all the other 2 classes are agreeing that bulwark's curse is madness...my opnion is that the bulwark curse should have it's proc rate reduced to balance with bow/gun's procs, the rest including the status is ok...

increase 70 damage on bulwark???sure, give mage's an "enraged in 10 seconds" proc on gun aswell, along with juggernaut and maybe shadow veil

funny story: I was fighting alone 2 rogues on tdm, then a warrior joined them...I combo'd charged fireball, light + clock+ slag's aa = 2 dead rogues, then the warrior just appeared, stood on my clock, charged the curse and said "hi"( i had arc shield on and full hp) and i lived long(not really) 2.5 seconds

without the clock, the same thing happens...but i live around 4-6 seconds

...Those buffs should be well-thought made, not just making careless editions

*Sorry if any bulwark warrior got offended(please don't reflect my words into my direction), not my intention ^-^

[Visiting]

Let's give Elo Rifle an OP version of Juggernaut, seems fair right?

[Zeus]

As Raregem suggested in another thread, instead of nerfing bulwark, developers should make the curse proc more visible. As a result, classes will know when not to attack in 1v1 situation but it would still maintain effectiveness in a clash because collectively, a team would have no choice but to attack.

That being said, I'm still maintaining my stance that nothing should be nerfed and instead players should be given time to find ways to combat pets, weapons, and gears.

[Ophelia]

Ok, i read most of it and basically warriors are stating: " bulwark isn't that op...the curse can be defeated if you change your whole build and strategy", and all the other 2 classes are agreeing that bulwark's curse is madness...my opnion is that the bulwark curse should have it's proc rate reduced to balance with bow/gun's procs, the rest including the status is ok...

Having duelled many bulwark-users, I do agree with koma that its frequency of proc has to parallel that of other classes' mythic weapons.

To highlight th jarring proc rate disparity, this is my experience of vsing a bulwark tank couple of days back. Within that duel...th tank had 4 reflect procs on me, on top of 1 healing proc - that's a total of 5 procs.

Now take that number measured against th backdrop of my mythic bow, which didn't proc even once at all in th entire course of that 1v1 (Yes, I did use charged normal attack).

I hope STS looks into and revises the bulwark proc rate accordingly. At present, the likelihood of that reflect proc is seemingly too disproportionate.

[Ravager]

Having duelled many bulwark-users, I do agree with koma that its frequency of proc has to parallel that of other classes' mythic weapons.

To highlight th jarring proc rate disparity, this is my experience of vsing a bulwark tank couple of days back. Within that duel...th tank had 4 reflect procs on me, on top of 1 healing proc - that's a total of 5 procs.

Now take that number measured against th backdrop of my mythic bow, which didn't proc even once at all in th entire course of that 1v1 (Yes, I did use charged normal attack).

I hope STS looks into and revises the bulwark proc rate accordingly. At present, the likelihood of that reflect proc is seemingly too disproportionate.

Bow also has a proc to heal a small amount of hp 100% of the time on every skill/attack and every dot tick I believe.

Bow is still best of the 3 and that's why the price is still high on bow. Bulwark is about the same price as gun.

[Instanthumor]

As Raregem suggested in another thread, instead of nerfing bulwark, developers should make the curse proc more visible. As a result, classes will know when not to attack in 1v1 situation but it would still maintain effectiveness in a clash because collectively, a team would have no choice but to attack.

That being said, I'm still maintaining my stance that nothing should be nerfed and instead players should be given time to find ways to combat pets, weapons, and gears.

Making proc more visible won't make a difference unless you're blind.

+1 give mages Juggernaut

[Zeus]

Making proc more visible won't make a difference unless you're blind.

+1 give mages Juggernaut

As a rogue, I've fought bulwark tanks & used a mythic ring, mind you. To me, it did not seem that effective provided that I did not try attacking while cursed. Then again, this is just a rogue's opinion.

[will0]

is it true that bulwark charge process roots 100% ? i saw the green circles on the mobs during pve when the bulwark warrior charges it every time... if so .... then again STS gave bulwark skill in a weapon mage already has to root but mythic gun only random roots and not during charging.

[Instanthumor]

As a rogue, I've fought bulwark tanks & used a mythic ring, mind you. To me, it did not seem that effective provided that I did not try attacking while cursed. Then again, this is just a rogue's opinion.

I am also aware that by not attacking, the curse is less effective. However, by continuing to not attack, you won't get anywhere winning the vs. There's a specific time when the warrior can go down. Mages must deal a certain amount of damage each 15 seconds, and much different as far as strats when talking about a rogue who can easily dish a lot of damage in a short period of time. This is from a mage's point of view.


is it true that bulwark charge process roots 100% ? i saw the green circles on the mobs during pve when the bulwark warrior charges it every time... if so .... then again STS gave bulwark a weapon mage already has to root but mythic gun only random roots.

The greenish circles indicate that the mob is cursed. Not needed to make circles bigger.

[Caabatric]

Hey Zeus maybe you don't know but rogues attacks don't deL you much dmg. Rogue aim shot under ruse takes about 5% of hp which is ridiculous whereas one fireball take about 30-40% hp, no dot.

[Zeus]

Hey Zeus maybe you don't know but rogues attacks don't deL you much dmg. Rogue aim shot under ruse takes about 5% of hp which is ridiculous whereas one fireball take about 30-40% hp, no dot.

Hey, Caab. I'm aware of the curse mechanics and how they function. In a rogue's arsenal, we have other skills like Noxious bolt which reflect similar levels of damage that a spell like fireball would reflect.

On top of that, razor shield and upgraded shadow piercer with low damage are also highly reflective in terms of damage reflected by curse.

My point? There are skills in a rogue's aresnal that can drop an unwary rogue as well!

[Caabatric]

Hey, Caab. I'm aware of the curse mechanics and how they function. In a rogue's arsenal, we have other skills like Noxious bolt which reflect similar levels of damage that a spell like fireball would reflect.

On top of that, razor shield and upgraded shadow piercer with low damage are also highly reflective in terms of damage reflected by curse.

My point? There are skills in a rogue's aresnal that can drop an unwary rogue as well!
Kk thx for informing me.

[Geusaquc]

How about giving mages a passive proc on the new mythic? Rogues have passive heal when dealing damage, tanks have passive heal when taking damage, mages don't have anything either way.
Whilst I agree with Zeus saying we need to invest some time into combatting the new play style tanks have been given, I think that if sts is going to buff the warrior weapon like they have, the mage weapon should have a passive proc like the other two classes have. The one class that needs a passive doesn't get it smh... And before you all say that the armor proc is passive, it's not. By passive I mean not having to spam the regular attack button to get a benefit. Tbh I don't even use the regular attack much simply because it takes me 5 seconds to get the proc benefit that the other two classes get simply by playing how they always do.
The bulwark buff annoys me a lot but I'm not going to complain too much just yet.

Finally, all you people that think anything is going to be done; either mage buff or warrior nerf, is just insane. We all know it won't happen, just sit back and accept the fact that tanks are the new mages of Arlor:
SS & axe = fireball & gale stuns.
Rally cry = gale speed.
WM = ice & clock slow.
HoR = shield AND heal
Bulwark = curse
Give tanks lightning and they have more effectiveness as a mage than half the mages out there. (In comes maul lightning proc)

[Haligali]

Haha, i just found a conversation during the warriors insane windmill glitch, when one warrior could one ss+wm combo kill 4 people:

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?88595-Why-the-windmill-is-OP/page2

"learn how to PvP better", "stop crying", "stop whinning"

"mages need a buff", "mages are worthless"

The names here may different, but some things just never change.

[Zeus]

Lol, isn't hotpimp CTF?^

[Remiem]

Hey guys. We have QA looking into this. :) Thanks for the feedback. I'll update when I know more. Locking this up now.