PL PvP

[Itoopeo]

For everyone who thinks they are pro, or better than someone else ->

No one is good at PL pvp. The win/loss rate is mostly about luck, rest are from items, which increase someones luck.
PvP in this game is based on POSSIBILITIES. Crit% Hit% Sun% Dodge% and so on.
To actually see who is good at this game, STS should remove all percentages from PvP and allow us to build more health and armor. Also adding stuns and silences too so it would not be just dps fight. Crit% could actually stay because every class has very high crit%.

As bear now: Im gonna snare you in my massive stacking hit% debuff for rest of your life so you wont hurt me if you dont dodge and get away.
As bird now: Im just going to spam all my skills on you and hope at least some of them hit you and I dodge all your debuffs.

^Thats basically all luck of dodges and hits.

After STS fixes this problem: You need fast fingers and a strategy to take down your opponent based on his skills and class. You know all hits are quaranteed and only stopping thing is his armor which has 100% success rate unlike dodges.
As bear: Im just gonna trick this bird in my 1 second stun so I can get close and hit my cripple and after that all my abilities and hope I have enough armor and health to keep me alive until he dies.
As bird: I would repulse him and make him waste that stun and then root him in place for enough time to shoot my full combo because bear is stronger in close combat.
Mages should have more combos for massive bonus damages if those combos are used. Im not gonna give an example about mage because honestly, I have no idea how mage works because I never played that class.

Also, birds blind could be turned into silence type thing so opponent can move and autoattack but not use his skills. OR it would be actual blind and target wont see anything because his screen would have turned black or grey but he could still move and use skills, but he has no idea where he is going or is he going to hit those skills anywhere.

Fox could be something between mage, with many combos for bonus damage but still uses heavy armor like bear, but with less health and stats.
Rhino would have lowest damage of all and mostly trust in autoattacks and and one damage skill and stun in charge. Rest all armor and heal.

Regens are messed up in this game so maximum should be like 10 or 15 h/s so autoattacks would actually matter too and rhinos massive hammers would actually hit big chunck of opponents health by every hit. Still less than any class obiously due to consentration on maximum survivability.



Currently as bird you know when bear hits his debuffs and dodges your blinds and stuff, you know you are in trouble, if you dont have massive luck (what all pros sometimes have, and that makes them evern more pro):disturbed:

Everyone who cries here about this thread and says im just someone who has never been good in pvp and so on and so on can just stop writing his comment right now. Those are not needed here at all.

Comment what do you think about this concept and should sts take this and give it a try

[Laar]

Lol youre trying to turn PL into League of Legends

First you introduce the ranked system, now you do this
Everything you mentioned is so OP, for example the birds. You're gonna turn birds into a Lucian with a Zyra root + Teemo blind like wtf thats OP

[Ssneakykills]

No!

[Itoopeo]

Lol youre trying to turn PL into League of Legends

First you introduce the ranked system, now you do this
Everything you mentioned is so OP, for example the birds. You're gonna turn birds into a Lucian with a Zyra root + Teemo blind like wtf thats OP

Still this is a class with significantly lower armor and health.
As an example bird would have 500 health and 200 armor (-40% incoming damage)
Bear would have 900hp with 600 armor (-85% incoming damage or something like that)

In case of bird vs bird it would be all about knowing your range so you could walk in and out and hit your skills but cause your opponent to miss his.

And mage would wear similiar armor as bird but she has more burst damage and shorter range. To kill bird she could use mana shield 400+800=1200health basically. And burst the bird down before before he can take advantage of birds higher dps.

Im not turning this into league of legends, Im trying to give people new concept to think about. The current luck based pvp just causes cry and rage because "pros" get beaten by new lucky naabs. Even tho if these old players had the skill, They could still be losing a lot if opponents happen to have good luck with dodges and hits and stuff. It is very annoying when opponent really has that luck to dodge all debuffs and then kill you and spam laugh and fart emotes. It would not happen anymore because more skill -> better win rate it would be so simple

And forget the ranked system thing i admit that was from league

[KingFu]

Do you only make rage posts?

[Laar]

But still Lucian + Zyra + Teemo is pretty OP, not to mention that Lucian is the best ADC right now in League alongside Tristana, so making him even more OP in PL is like insane

[Itoopeo]

But still Lucian + Zyra + Teemo is pretty OP, not to mention that Lucian is the best ADC right now in League alongside Tristana, so making him even more OP in PL is like insane

I have never played Lucian or zyra or tristana so i am not making bird into lucian or something. Bird wont be op, because he is the squishiest character and he doesnt even have highest damage output in game.

Bear has damage debuff and damage buff, he has second highest survivability and really good dps. Bear has stun and three snare skills. If you compare bear to league of legends champions, you see bear is very op too.

And so is mage with very high burst damage and proper shield.

Fox is balancing between medium-high survivability, melee range and higher burst than bird, but a lot lower dps in general.

Rhino does lowest damage but has highest survivability. He is like tanky trundle with strong heal and medium auto attack damage and not many damage skills.


All characters are OP = balanced PvP so basically none of them are OP because they are all as strong in different categories that they can take advantage of.

[Rescind]

I don't get how all characters will be OP.. Clearly you're giving the bears a big advantage. You might as well take damage buff, crit%, and hit% out and have no damage reduction skills because that seems more balanced than what you're stating

[Lexlyde]

Wow... This is just rage, you are adding statistics to make it a little bit more "trustable" but all you are saying is actually false ( at balanced lvls ). When you win 10-0 vs the same class, same gear its because you have a better build, combo, timing, range knowledge etc.
So yes there is an important luck factor but its not all about luck.

And this thread only concern 1vs1 but Pl pvp is based on team deathmatch mode, not go system.

Ps: Go.

[AppleNoob]

Still this is a class with significantly lower armor and health.
As an example bird would have 500 health and 200 armor (-40% incoming damage)
Bear would have 900hp with 600 armor (-85% incoming damage or something like that)

In case of bird vs bird it would be all about knowing your range so you could walk in and out and hit your skills but cause your opponent to miss his.

And mage would wear similiar armor as bird but she has more burst damage and shorter range. To kill bird she could use mana shield 400+800=1200health basically. And burst the bird down before before he can take advantage of birds higher dps.

Im not turning this into league of legends, Im trying to give people new concept to think about. The current luck based pvp just causes cry and rage because "pros" get beaten by new lucky naabs. Even tho if these old players had the skill, They could still be losing a lot if opponents happen to have good luck with dodges and hits and stuff. It is very annoying when opponent really has that luck to dodge all debuffs and then kill you and spam laugh and fart emotes. It would not happen anymore because more skill -> better win rate it would be so simple

And forget the ranked system thing i admit that was from league

Nobody really wants PL to be league of legends, the reason why is because PL as a game has its own and individual style that keeps me coming back for more.

I disagree with you on how you said nobody is good at this game, i have seen people stomp kite, time their heals, fire me at the right time, and so on. What im trying to see is instead of doing one massive change like the Great nerf which didn't work so well in some cases, instead offer small changes to the game and slowly change over to a better version.

[Oculus]

Hmm seems pretty cool to me.
One thing though, no such thing as luck, it's chance.

[Itoopeo]

Nobody really wants PL to be league of legends, the reason why is because PL as a game has its own and individual style that keeps me coming back for more.

I disagree with you on how you said nobody is good at this game, i have seen people stomp kite, time their heals, fire me at the right time, and so on. What im trying to see is instead of doing one massive change like the Great nerf which didn't work so well in some cases, instead offer small changes to the game and slowly change over to a better version.

Oh you have 1% Health left and you stomp kite me... Let me dodge that and your HS snare too and kill you with double screams. <- that wouldnt happen anymore

[Waug]

pl PvP is not bad all, just devs couldn't optimize as lvl cap kept arriving.

BTW it sounds like as a regular football player u complain football is not being as tactical as chess.

[Impact]

If u think pl pvp is no skill, check out al pvp, its whoever has the better gear no skill needed, ex: a arcane rogue vs a non arcane rogue, the non wrcane can have alot better tapping skills and shoot 3 skills and not kill then arcane, the arcane will just tap one skill and its gg, so the point is enjoy pl pvp.

[Intersection]

I will I'm fairly new im I've decided Al pvp requires no skill so have come to u guys seeking fun that I know I will receive

[GiveMeWings]

If u think pl pvp is no skill, check out al pvp, its whoever has the better gear no skill needed, ex: a arcane rogue vs a non arcane rogue, the non wrcane can have alot better tapping skills and shoot 3 skills and not kill then arcane, the arcane will just tap one skill and its gg, so the point is enjoy pl pvp.
pl pvp needs skill there are lot of ppl who has the right timing and know how to pvp well, sure you need a good hear but like all pvp/pve games, don't forget there is also pve in the game...It is also luck sometimes you dodge sometimes no, but a skilled person beats 10-3 or more a non skilled person that three deads are thanks to luck

[GiveMeWings]

oo sorry I didn't read the whole message though u said pl pvp didnt need skill soz

[Everyone'sFavMage]

PvP in this game is based on POSSIBILITIES. Crit% Hit% Sun% Like the possibility of getting a sun burn? Not gunna lie my Mage would look hot af with a nice tan.

[Trenton]

Lol you're no good at PL so you say no one is good at PL

Almost as bad as Anigraasas

[GiveMeWings]

Lol you're no good at PL so you say no one is good at PL

Almost as bad as Anigraasas

lelelel I just found anigraasas the other day with my bear... he called me noob and said he owns all lv77 even with lust sets and 3 pc rings, then he added he would make a lv 61 mage to own all lv 61 players in game lol

[Laar]

I have never played Lucian or zyra or tristana so i am not making bird into lucian or something. Bird wont be op, because he is the squishiest character and he doesnt even have highest damage output in game.

Bear has damage debuff and damage buff, he has second highest survivability and really good dps. Bear has stun and three snare skills. If you compare bear to league of legends champions, you see bear is very op too.

And so is mage with very high burst damage and proper shield.

Fox is balancing between medium-high survivability, melee range and higher burst than bird, but a lot lower dps in general.

Rhino does lowest damage but has highest survivability. He is like tanky trundle with strong heal and medium auto attack damage and not many damage skills.


All characters are OP = balanced PvP so basically none of them are OP because they are all as strong in different categories that they can take advantage of.
You play League of Legends but you haven't played Lucian or Tristana, the most broken ADCs in the game

Fml

[Itoopeo]

If u think pl pvp is no skill, check out al pvp, its whoever has the better gear no skill needed, ex: a arcane rogue vs a non arcane rogue, the non wrcane can have alot better tapping skills and shoot 3 skills and not kill then arcane, the arcane will just tap one skill and its gg, so the point is enjoy pl pvp.

Yes and top of that they have dodges and non quaranteed crits too makes it even worse.
In PvE my warrior takes so much beating hes like undying But in pvp This girl who is like !/5 of my weight shoots one pink thing to me and im like "AhH!" and fall down dead as stone. Isnt that realistic and fair?

[Itoopeo]

You play League of Legends but you haven't played Lucian or Tristana, the most broken ADCs in the game

Fml

I played jinx and Ashe like once to decide it was not for me.
I play OP endgame toplaners Like Tryndamere and Jax mostly. And mid sometimes but very rarely and still only with melee assassins like Zed or Talon.

But this is PL PvP it doesnt matter now

[Laar]

You play League of Legends but you haven't played Lucian or Tristana, the most broken ADCs in the game

Fml

I played jinx and Ashe like once to decide it was not for me.
I play OP endgame toplaners Like Tryndamere and Jax mostly. And mid sometimes but very rarely and still only with melee assassins like Zed or Talon.

But this is PL PvP it doesnt matter now
I'm sorry but they nerfed Jax really hard a few patches ago, and I will beat Tryn 1v1 any day as long as I have ignite

Also I bet your Zed mechanics are trash

[Itoopeo]

I just logged in PL with my 73 goldshield Bird and 45 bear and talked with people. Mostly on level 45 i was talking with all those active PvPers and all of them agreed its very much about luck in pvp.

In bear vs bear both have good dodge but the first one to get his hellscream ridiculously strong debuff in, basically wins the fight. 90% of time.
With good ping its easier and all the timing skill you need is really the thing to hit HS in range before your opponent, and then hope you dodge his debuff too. After that just walk close to him and spam all skills until he dies, and make sure HS is always on cooldown.

Same routine is for birds and mages basically and if you have enough luck to hit that debuff, its quaranteed win. Always.

In my concept HS would have 1 second stun to get closer to opponent and small damage reduction. The other debuff would have strong damage reduction and then there is cripple that snares your opponent(bear) in place so he cant get away and get rid of those debuffs. He can try to combo you off at the right moment but you have beckon to bring him with you and stomp removes all snares so you are back on him and almost winning. But if you hit beckon too late from his combo, he will get away and get rid of those debuffs and after that beckon+stun you and now he is on the winning side.

Currently first one to hit HS gets his opponent to endless debuff loop and stacks take his "hit possibility" to negative percentages so he has no way to do anything but hope for random luck with his debuffs which is almost impossible with 17hit% and opponents 50% dodge. Hes just sitting there losing hp fast.



This "remove possibilities" thing is not copy of LoL, almost every game has it like that because pvp should not be like fruit game, it should be based on player skills.
As an example in guild wars PvP everyone has the exact same armors and weapons depending on class. It is perfectly balanced without luck. A skilled player has more kills than deaths because he is obviolsy better than his opponents and he also has point captures because its is a massive multiplayer team fight so you fight for your team not farm kills.

Words like "wtf rush, hunted" "cry noob" "you suck" are all caused by this possibility system. Without it there would not be luck based fights, it would all be skill based and better wins so there would be no reason to say "hunted" for no reason because he could not have killed you five times in a row in first place.

Also booting system causes this rage and should be removed. If you dont want random better players to come beat you up, create your own game and invite your friends.

Remove all possibilities from PvP and also someones ability to boot people from rooms. -> PvP would be perfectly fixed and people would actually start liking this game.
On PvE side im not gonna make theories now but drop rates for "good" items are ridiculously low so only rich old players can stand a change against other rich players.(Different thing in very low levels because good items are worth like nothing so everyone can get them)

[Itoopeo]

I'm sorry but they nerfed Jax really hard a few patches ago, and I will beat Tryn 1v1 any day as long as I have ignite

Also I bet your Zed mechanics are trash

Im not gonna argue in that.
Just talk about this concept, you can read about it in the first message of this thread.

[sonoobish]

Do you only make rage posts?

Rekt.

[Laar]

Yea and the OP says that birds should be turned into a Lucian + Zyra + Teemo

[AppleNoob]

Oh you have 1% Health left and you stomp kite me... Let me dodge that and your HS snare too and kill you with double screams. <- that wouldnt happen anymore

Im talking about low level, also if this debate is about 76 quit crying about it man. If we went with your idea it would be like a 20 tank mage vs a 20 tank mage battle, pointless and boring, at least with this we actually don't wait 2-5 min just for a death.

[XghostzX]

I've never been entirely content with the PvP system. However I think change at this point is stupid.

It's balanced enough, guys. It's very well playable. At this point we're all used to the dodge/crit/hit percent that it seems somewhat pointless to retweak stats. Odds are, STS screws things up even more.

There is not a whole lot of way to balance a game like PL, so the luck factor (in a more positive attitude) makes up for that dull and surface-leveled gameplay.

[Itoopeo]

Im talking about low level, also if this debate is about 76 quit crying about it man. If we went with your idea it would be like a 20 tank mage vs a 20 tank mage battle, pointless and boring, at least with this we actually don't wait 2-5 min just for a death.

2-5min is not bad if we consider we have two tank mages who has chosen to go for rhino style PvP. Damage is low due to bad scaling with sword and mage skills. Plus this percentages drop off would make fights shorter actually, because there would not be half of the damage income dodged.

I also talked about armor scaling in the beginning somewhere, because I took a calculator in my hand and a molten talon equipped in game.
There was a level 77 mage and i threw talons at her until i did not crit or she didnt dodge.
She had 200 armor and I had little over 200 damage. My basic attack without crit did like 18 damage per hit. that means 200armor reduces incoming damage by over 90%. And bears have even more armor. Thats something really crazy and dps has no value in endgame because of that armor thing. 200 armor should reduce incoming damage by max 50% and it would be fine. There are talons for birds with over 700 dps and very close range. But it doesnt matter because it wont even beat bears regen at max level.

A bow with 350Dps and very high damage kills opponents much faster than a talon with 700dps even tho you can just stand back with bow and never get close to target.
Daggers needs major buff in damage because currently they are very useless because of this armor reduction thing. People would actually consider those if the damage would be similiar to bow damage. (bow does 500damage) Little bit less than bow damage but very short delay between attacks. Like 420 damage and what is the attack speed now maby 0.4 or 0.3s. That would end up in insane dps (like 1400-1500dps) But because of armor it would hit less damage than a bow but much faster. It would actually kill something.

I have heard some bears use daggers against INT mages because it works well with rage buff. With buff to dagger it would be OP in hands of bear so sts should balance it by making bears have major loss in skill damage compared to actual str weapons.

[Itoopeo]

I've never been entirely content with the PvP system. However I think change at this point is stupid.

It's balanced enough, guys. It's very well playable. At this point we're all used to the dodge/crit/hit percent that it seems somewhat pointless to retweak stats. Odds are, STS screws things up even more.

There is not a whole lot of way to balance a game like PL, so the luck factor (in a more positive attitude) makes up for that dull and surface-leveled gameplay.

It is playable but causes so much rage and cry and frustration always so it would be very very good thing if sts could change it from luck based to skill based.

[Itoopeo]

Yea and the OP says that birds should be turned into a Lucian + Zyra + Teemo

Just stop comparing this to League Of Legends

[DivineMoustache]

This is a stance that I'm definitely for: reducing luck factors. It will make PL much more skill based across the board, while still retaining the classic range and movement based gameplay that it's built upon.

Of course, not everything is as easy as it seems. STS has increased damage without thought so much that by nerfing dodge, you're essentially condemning any dodge-reliant chars to be 2-3 hit killed. They'd have to completely rebalance damage, heal, and everything else. Is it worth the effort? To us, absolutely. There's just not enough of us left though to justify them putting that much tweaking and work into PL, it's more productive for them to work on AL (and create even more imbalance within that game too.)

[Itoopeo]

This is a stance that I'm definitely for: reducing luck factors. It will make PL much more skill based across the board, while still retaining the classic range and movement based gameplay that it's built upon.

Of course, not everything is as easy as it seems. STS has increased damage without thought so much that by nerfing dodge, you're essentially condemning any dodge-reliant chars to be 2-3 hit killed. They'd have to completely rebalance damage, heal, and everything else. Is it worth the effort? To us, absolutely. There's just not enough of us left though to justify them putting that much tweaking and work into PL, it's more productive for them to work on AL (and create even more imbalance within that game too.)

Do this rework to PL (takes maximum two months intensive work from sts)
Maby throw out a TV commercial or advertise in internet somehow and dayym
There we go plus million daily players and even more plat sold. Tell them about other sts games inside PL and even more players will arrive and this daily deal plat guy would drown in plat orders!

But sts decided to put all effort in arcane battlegrounds which I did not even look up in play store because I already know its battle dragons with AL toons and i didnt like BD much because of so many inbalances. (bombers ew quaranteed 100% every time) BD type games wont be succesfull in near future because there is this one company from Finland called Supercell blocking out every competitor so easily.

[KingFu]

It is playable but causes so much rage and cry and frustration

For you, maybe.

[AppleNoob]

Do this rework to PL (takes maximum two months intensive work from sts)
Maby throw out a TV commercial or advertise in internet somehow and dayym
There we go plus million daily players and even more plat sold. Tell them about other sts games inside PL and even more players will arrive and this daily deal plat guy would drown in plat orders!

But sts decided to put all effort in arcane battlegrounds which I did not even look up in play store because I already know its battle dragons with AL toons and i didnt like BD much because of so many inbalances. (bombers ew quaranteed 100% every time) BD type games wont be succesfull in near future because there is this one company from Finland called Supercell blocking out every competitor so easily.
Nah. We are not going to get million or more players through a tv or internet ad, and if we do you know what will happen? The people that join will be put off by the scammers and trolls. The game is dying, let it go.

[Seoratrek]

I'm going to close this now since it is no longer constructive. I'll make a note of the ideas. :)