Balance PvP!

[EQT]

Rogue:
I agree with the 20% damage reduction in PvP maps, the developers were right to nerf rogue's damage. If you guys remember the time when they introduced the show-able damage increase from pets; rogues were virtually unstoppable.

Problem:
Unlike warrior or sorcerer, rogues do not have a mana regen ability - this greatly decreases a rogue's survivability. I know EVERYONE will agree with me once your mana has run out; you cannot do anything on a rogue except run away, trullicide or rely on sorcerer or warrior's ability (vengeful blood or heal with empower). To combat this rogues should have the ability to regen mana.

Solution:
1)Make the skill Good Medicine regen mana INSTEAD of health at the same speed. The reason why you cannot have both is because that would be too great of an advantage for rogue, making them too op. OR an alternative is making the skills cost less mana.

2) Replace the skill trauma surgeon (upon charged cast will provide self heal for caster) with a small but sufficient mana burst. Much like glacien AA but a tad better.

Sorcerer:
I realise the developers are going to create a buff for sorcerers in 2015, I am so excited for it and I wish to put forward some ideas.

1. Mage's are always complaining they are squishy, even with the recent buff of the arcane shield.
Solution:
Replace the displacement wave skill of arcane shield [When casting charged arcane shield enemies will be knocked away] (it is practically redundant in PvP as well as PvE), this is due to the 2 second invulnerability of a charged arcane shield, the 2 seconds allows the sorcerer to run to safety anyway. Instead of that replace it with a 15 second armour buff of 25% on charged cast.

2. The most apparent way to get a kill as a sorcerer is getting a lucky critical upon using your lightening strike. This will make PvP experience for sorcerers more skill based and fun; not luck.
Solution:
Half the amount of crit you get from dexterity and put it into int, these points should go towards raising critical bonus as well as mana (this is fairly self explanatory).
HOWEVER:
To make this balanced you would have to decrease the 250% bonus damage on critical lightening strike by a bit.

3. Increase the range on normal uncharged curse 6m.

4. Decrease the cool down time on the arcane shield.

5. For twinks the choice of item is fairly straight forward, expedition rifles are the go to weapon for low level sorcerers, please create variation.
Introduction of a gun with similar power as the expedition gun range, but make the ability: chance to cast an arcane proc OR increase critical for a certain period of time OR raise the primary stat of it. (like gloom hunter bows).

Warrior IMO for twink PvP is fairly balanced and perfect as it is. I am not sure about endgame because I don't have a char over l22.
HOWEVER, rogue and sorcerer is weak in comparison. I do not have a PvP warrior atm, I will make one in the near future and feedback after.

From experience as a L20 mage/sorcerer I can now create an opinion on warriors at the bracket 18-22. I have come up with an improvement for warriors.
I was a max int sorcerer with best gear for my level and 1 para gem, I used blinky as a pet and had a full damage skill build (fire frost light shield and heal). I won't go into depth of how I did it, it was so complicated and I had to put my full attention if I wanted to kill a warrior. I was able to kill most L20-21 warriors and the occasional l22 warrior. The only way possible was to kite the warriors. If you guys have played pocket legends before you know what I mean.

Anywho...
Warriors could do with some sort of snare? Not for too long but enough to get in a combo maybe like a 1.5 second snare. Of course these snares could not be in quick succession of each other so make a 7 second invulnerability to get snared again from the previous one.

Solution:
Make an ability to snare on the skill chest splitter. Why chest splitter? The warriors have to still work to snare them if you put it on skyward smash or axe throw it will be too easy to snare the opponent.

BTW
Snare is not the same as stun. The opponent can still do their skills, they just are not able to move.


That is all I have come up with so far, will add to it if necessary please leave feedback.

[Arrowz]

Lmao make it so rogues cant heal, haha no that is not a good idea. That is why there are things around the map that fill ur mana. Give mages arcane proc? We might aswell give it to warriors while we are at it. And warriors are not balanced for twink pvp. A max warrior that is actually good is unkillable 1v1. Plus, there is a reason why people say max 2-3 warriors for wars. Its because warriors are op and by far the strongest class at twink levels. You never see anybody saying max 3 rogues are max 3 mages for wars. I wonder why.

[EQT]

Lmao make it so rogues cant heal, haha no that is not a good idea. That is why there are things around the map that fill ur mana. Give mages arcane proc? We might aswell give it to warriors while we are at it. And warriors are not balanced for twink pvp. A max warrior that is actually good is unkillable 1v1. Plus, there is a reason why people say max 2-3 warriors for wars. Its because warriors are op and by far the strongest class at twink levels. You never see anybody saying max 3 rogues are max 3 mages for wars. I wonder why. Lol your misread it mate, I didnt say replace heal I said replace the good medicine effect heal over time with mana gain over time the packs will still be there for heal. Also thats why I am saying they need to buff rogue and mage to make it balanced with warriors.

[Arrowz]

Lol your misread it mate, I didnt say replace heal I said replace the good medicine effect heal over time with mana gain over time the packs will still be there for heal. Also thats why I am saying they need to buff rogue and mage to make it balanced with warriors.

Ok this makes more sense then. I agree with you rogues and mages need buffed at twink lvls. Really all they need to do for rogues imo is make it so rogues under lvl 20 or some such level dont have the dmg nerf and mages need more survivability so they dont get killed by 1-2 combos without shield. Maybe some skill that grants dmg reduction. Even with an armor buff rogues will just eat through that with aimed shot. And even with more health they will still take just as much dmg. As far as i see it dmg reduction is the only way to increase their survivability.

[Remarked]

actually above lvl 21 a maxed warrior can die pretty easily against a maxed rogue
especially 26+

[UndeadJudge]

I crit warriors 2.2k+ as a 27 bow rogue.

Warriors are paper without jugg.


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[Arrowz]

To remarked and undeadjudge that is why i suggested under lvl 20 :)

[uunknownn]

Good suggestion bout rogue:) and agree warrior is fine at lvl 20+ ..at lower level warrior is too o.p..and right max gear warrior is unkillable with those vb ++++str ..

[UndeadJudge]

To remarked and undeadjudge that is why i suggested under lvl 20 :)

Yeah I know, but just letting him know since he said he doesn't play above 22.

IMO I might even consider warriors OP at levels below 20.


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[UndeadJudge]

Good suggestion bout rogue:) and agree warrior is fine at lvl 20+ ..at lower level warrior is too o.p..and right max gear warrior is unkillable with those vb ++++str ..

Not really...breaking jugg has become an issue with the new para gems.

Increase Jugg's HP to maybe 750, and make the self heal actually heal 25% instead of 15%. Just my 2 cents.


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[Theillist1]

Biggest problem now is rogues have been nerfed too much and all a warrior must do is equip 4-6 para gems to two shot their own class not even a squishy or rogue.

[Hilyana]

From an endgame player's perspective, I pretty much agree with everything, however I must disagree with this:


Int points should go towards raising critical bonus as well as mana

Critical is all that rogues have... I already see many geared mages with 35%+ critical, that's almost as much as average rogue's critical. Also, what would be dexterity for if mages get critical from intelligence points?


Replace the displacement wave skill of arcane shield [When casting charged arcane shield enemies will be knocked away] (it is practically redundant in PvP as well as PvE), this is due to the 2 second invulnerability of a charged arcane shield, the 2 seconds allows the sorcerer to run to safety anyway. Instead of that replace it with a 15 second armour buff of 25% on charged cast.

Imo, if shield was absorbing more damage, it would be way, way better. I myself have a mage and I got to try it in pvp (elon gun, mythic set, mythic ring and lunar), with shield on I still got hit 50% of my hp by rogues critical hits, and it's broken too fast. I would suggest to make the cooldown shorter as well, for example when I was fighting warriors, the time I got to wait to cast shield again after my second heal was way too long.. Making me die without giving any chance. This is how it goes everytime: I cast shield under 50% hp, heal, shield gets broken, I may heal a second time if the warrior doesn't have a crazy damage, and then... I die, because I still have 5-6 seconds to wait for my second shield.

So yes, a shorter cooldown on shield with a little bit more damage absorbed would help mages A LOT.

[EQT]

From an endgame player's perspective, I pretty much agree with everything, however I must disagree with this:



Critical is all that rogues have... I already see many geared mages with 35%+ critical, that's almost as much as average rogue's critical. Also, what would be dexterity for if mages get critical from intelligence points?



Imo, if shield was absorbing more damage, it would be way, way better. I myself have a mage and I got to try it in pvp (elon gun, mythic set, mythic ring and lunar), with shield on I still got hit 50% of my hp by rogues critical hits, and it's broken too fast. I would suggest to make the cooldown shorter as well, for example when I was fighting warriors, the time I got to wait to cast shield again after my second heal was way too long.. Making me die without giving any chance. This is how it goes everytime: I cast shield under 50% hp, heal, shield gets broken, I may heal a second time if the warrior doesn't have a crazy damage, and then... I die, because I still have 5-6 seconds to wait for my second shield.

So yes, a shorter cooldown on shield with a little bit more damage absorbed would help mages A LOT.

To be honest rogues have aimed which gives a stackable 20% crit.

[Remiem]

Thanks for the suggestions! These are great and very specific. I'll make sure to get them into the hands of the devs to take a look at next month.

[Kingofninjas]

To be honest rogues have aimed which gives a stackable 20% crit.

If we stack 20 crit, we will not have time to charge our aimed shot. We can stack about 10% crit on aimed shot.

[Leonut]

Reduce Lightning damage skill to 200% from 250% is a joke. I rather not have critical from int. I have 44% crit as it is. You obviously do not know what you are saying or eons behind in terms of recent events.

[Ovtlaw]

Lmao make it so rogues cant heal, haha no that is not a good idea. That is why there are things around the map that fill ur mana. Give mages arcane proc? We might aswell give it to warriors while we are at it. And warriors are not balanced for twink pvp. A max warrior that is actually good is unkillable 1v1. Plus, there is a reason why people say max 2-3 warriors for wars. Its because warriors are op and by far the strongest class at twink levels. You never see anybody saying max 3 rogues are max 3 mages for wars. I wonder why.

Lol. To fight with stacking tank is easy. Warrior is weak if u know how to kill them... In 23 if u stack 4-5 tanks is the weakest line up. Ur team will get farm easy.

[EQT]

Reduce Lightning damage skill to 200% from 250% is a joke. I rather not have critical from int. I have 44% crit as it is. You obviously do not know what you are saying or eons behind in terms of recent events.
Thank you for telling me this. I did not recognise the end game perspective. I shall update the thread.

[Madnex]

There's no bracket where stacking tanks doesn't guarantee winning. Unless the gear/experience gap is too large, the opposition will get farmed by alternated horns.

For true class balance there will have to be no skills with set amounts of say, STR. Having jugg and VB give 50 STR is overpowered at low levels and underpowered at endgame. Also, there's no reason that this +50 buff should heal when casted, this is a unique behaviour. But guess who's not going to like the balancing business? Anyone who's benefitted/-ing by those imbalances.

[xutreuqux]

Im pvping on lv1, coz i cant afford higher lvls xD i dont have to buy ring, amulet or helm in lv1 :) and all dat comes r food, so im happy. And now der is level one guild, which has pretty much members now, we can vs and farm together. All classes r balanced in lv1, as rogues cant crit, no skill and no use for mana. The prob is u hav to wait a while b4 any food came :/ and lv2-3s is like god for us lol we cant beat dem, many reasons. but since level one is friendly with bangis ng pinoy, the lv2-3 pvp guild, we r pretty much safe :) i tried higher lvl pvps once, classes arent balanced :/ so i do this lv1 pvp. Its all abt skill, when to charge, when to activate aa, etc. If yall wanna call me a poor noob lol i am xD

[Artoholics]

Im pvping on lv1, coz i cant afford higher lvls xD i dont have to buy ring, amulet or helm in lv1 :) and all dat comes r food, so im happy. And now der is level one guild, which has pretty much members now, we can vs and farm together. All classes r balanced in lv1, as rogues cant crit, no skill and no use for mana. The prob is u hav to wait a while b4 any food came :/ and lv2-3s is like god for us lol we cant beat dem, many reasons. but since level one is friendly with bangis ng pinoy, the lv2-3 pvp guild, we r pretty much safe :) i tried higher lvl pvps once, classes arent balanced :/ so i do this lv1 pvp. Its all abt skill, when to charge, when to activate aa, etc. If yall wanna call me a poor noob lol i am xD
Such low lvl PvP is a joke...

[Remarked]

if you were to decrease bonus damage on lightning than decrease aimed shot on rogue too.
better yet dont even decrease it period lol

[Artoholics]

if you were to decrease bonus damage on lightning than decrease aimed shot on rogue too.
better yet dont even decrease it period lol
Decrease aimed shot were just awfull for rogues because we already got damage debuff in PvP, so dont even think about it!

[Auso]

yeh ..i thinck rog need some skill for mana regen :O

[Artoholics]

Mana regen for rogue=silly, just give us our dmg lol

[Arrowz]

There's no bracket where stacking tanks doesn't guarantee winning. Unless the gear/experience gap is too large, the opposition will get farmed by alternated horns.

For true class balance there will have to be no skills with set amounts of say, STR. Having jugg and VB give 50 STR is overpowered at low levels and underpowered at endgame. Also, there's no reason that this +50 buff should heal when casted, this is a unique behaviour. But guess who's not going to like the balancing business? Anyone who's benefitted/-ing by those imbalances.

The +50 buff isnt healing them. By having 50 more str their health pool increases by 500. Similar but its not technically a heal. If you use this buff while your health is at 100% it would have the same effect, health pool increasing by 500. But how can you heal when u are already at 100% health? U cant

[Madnex]

The +50 buff isnt healing them. By having 50 more str their health pool increases by 500. Similar but its not technically a heal. If you use this buff while your health is at 100% it would have the same effect, health pool increasing by 500. But how can you heal when u are already at 100% health? U cant
The point is, this is a unique behaviour. There are tons of pets and weapon procs that give you stats which increase your max HP but none of them heals.

[UndeadJudge]

The +50 buff isnt healing them. By having 50 more str their health pool increases by 500. Similar but its not technically a heal. If you use this buff while your health is at 100% it would have the same effect, health pool increasing by 500. But how can you heal when u are already at 100% health? U cant

I think it actually does heal. If I use it at 90% hp, I'll be at 100% after use. At 100% you gain the additional HP but obviously don't regain anything.


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[EQT]

You guys are going a bit off topic lol :)

[Arrowz]

Such low lvl PvP is a joke...

I think his entire post was meant to be a joke. But to get back on topic, to buff rogues i think the self heal on cast from combat medic should restore mana over time instead just like how one of the upgrades restored health over time. To buff mages i think arcane shield should reduce dmg taken a certain perfentage maybe like 25% for 5 seconds. Also the cool down should be a bit shorter. And lifegiver definitely needs a buff. The health and mana regen that it gives should scale based upon lvl rather than being the same at all lvls. For warriors vengeful blood should scale based upon lvl so that its not nearly as overpowered at twink lvls below 20 but also so that its stronger at higher levels.

[EQT]

I think his entire post was meant to be a joke. But to get back on topic, to buff rogues i think the self heal on cast from combat medic should restore mana over time instead just like how one of the upgrades restored health over time. To buff mages i think arcane shield should reduce dmg taken a certain perfentage maybe like 25% for 5 seconds. Also the cool down should be a bit shorter. And lifegiver definitely needs a buff. The health and mana regen that it gives should scale based upon lvl rather than being the same at all lvls. For warriors vengeful blood should scale based upon lvl so that its not nearly as overpowered at twink lvls below 20 but also so that its stronger at higher levels.

Finally some proper feedback, they are good ideas I'll add a few into the post. Thanks!

[Froxanthar]

Good but I think it will only good for twinks because as for endgame,

1. Rogues don't need mana regeneration on skills. There's a ring, packs and a pets for them to get unlimited mana regen.

2. Mages shield took long enough for a legendary warrior to break it.
I would suggest to buff Mage heal cooldown faster by 50% and lower their heal for -40%.

3. For warrior, Juggernaut need a buff. Their cooldown is way too long for endgame and self heal rarely work since most Rogues can easily pierce through that 25%.

[nevercan]

Good but I think it will only good for twinks because as for endgame,

1. Rogues don't need mana regeneration on skills. There's a ring, packs and a pets for them to get unlimited mana regen.

2. Mages shield took long enough for a legendary warrior to break it.
I would suggest to buff Mage heal cooldown faster by 50% and lower their heal for -40%.

3. For warrior, Juggernaut need a buff. Their cooldown is way too long for endgame and self heal rarely work since most Rogues can easily pierce through that 25%.

U think mages heal low down with 40% wil be fair? Mages on endlvl only heal 60-70% of thier max hp, while tanks and rouges can 100%
Low mage heal to 20-30% is just an therribel joke

[siddhant]

Good but I think it will only good for twinks because as for endgame,

1. Rogues don't need mana regeneration on skills. There's a ring, packs and a pets for them to get unlimited mana regen.

2. Mages shield took long enough for a legendary warrior to break it.
I would suggest to buff Mage heal cooldown faster by 50% and lower their heal for -40%.

3. For warrior, Juggernaut need a buff. Their cooldown is way too long for endgame and self heal rarely work since most Rogues can easily pierce through that 25%.

hmm at lvl 15 u only get 50%of ur heal back and out of that u wanna take out 40%hmm plz think before typing ty

[Litheus]

rogues 250% damage should be nerfed...right now they are op in end game

[Pillowhead]

hmm at lvl 15 u only get 50%of ur heal back and out of that u wanna take out 40%hmm plz think before typing ty

40% from 50% is around 20%, so your heal will heal around 30%, still not that bad.
the guy suggested it, don't be rude.
Think before you type x

[Froxanthar]

I would suggest to buff Mage heal cooldown faster by 50% and lower their heal for -40%.


Lets say current Mage heal is 10 seconds cooldown.

Cooldown is faster by 50% ( from 10 seconds ) = heal is now have 5 seconds cooldown and to make it balance heal is reduce to 40%.

Which mean, the different is you can use heal more frequent.
Imagine you use it with Shield - Gale - Heal - Gale - Heal - Shield :rugby:

[Warrior_NOT_MEDIC]

they have had many chances to balance pvp but instead they seem to make the rogue stronger and stronger whilst neglecting the other classes. yeah lets make rogues be able to break jugg on a warrior with 2400 armour.... goodgame .... pffft fix it quick...

[Doobiez]

I have a low lvl twink and I see maxed out rouges beat warriors everyday rouges the only thing they need a buff for is there mana 1v1 wise and clash in twink lvls rouges are very op but It seems balanced to me I don't know why rouges are mad #2015ageofthemage

[nevercan]

Lets say current Mage heal is 10 seconds cooldown.

Cooldown is faster by 50% ( from 10 seconds ) = heal is now have 5 seconds cooldown and to make it balance heal is reduce to 40%.

Which mean, the different is you can use heal more frequent.
Imagine you use it with Shield - Gale - Heal - Gale - Heal - Shield :rugby:
It wont safe you of 1shot of rouges

[Lightzzout]

👍👍👍 this thread

[Litheus]

its same everywhere...classes like rogues are bad for earlygame but they are good at endgame...the more higher level the game gets the more op they become...there will be a time when they will have 100% crit

[Twix]

Crit is the only reason that rogues are still considered a class in this game. Without it everyone would say "mage pls", since mage has aoe damage for pvp and pve, all rogues have is aimed shot for their best skill, while warriors and mages have many variations. An aimless rogue is a helpless rogue

[ilikerice]

^^ what he said

[Kriticality]

I imagine I get combo more than mages at endgame by other rogues. There are plenty of tanks that give me problems at end game and several mages that fireball crit lightning VERY hard. My preferred party is 2 rogues, a warr and a mage or 2 warr, 1 rogue and a mage. I think balance pvp isn't about buffing or nerfing any one class. I think PVP balance should mean that teams are optimal with all three classes on a team. To all the mages getting one shot/combod, shield timing and good tanks are a must. I have 4415 health and 1734 armor, 635 dmg and I get beat on too. At least mages have a defense to combo with shield. I think an extra .5-1 sec invulnerability on top of the already 2 seconds would be very significant buff for mage. I know it would cause me problems. I've never PVP anywhere but endgame, but ring mages and bonesaw, ring tanks are no easy task even with good timing. Happy to play with anyone.

IGN Kriticality

[Twix]

It seems like many mages begging for a mage buff in pvp just dont know how to time their actions. If done properly, they will charge shield, stunlock you and kill you. They still have the ability to stunlock rogues and tanks and theyre still complaining.. and now with eye gems mages can go above 50% crit. No need for a rogue.

[siddhant]

It seems like many mages begging for a mage buff in pvp just dont know how to time their actions. If done properly, they will charge shield, stunlock you and kill you. They still have the ability to stunlock rogues and tanks and theyre still complaining.. and now with eye gems mages can go above 50% crit. No need for a rogue.
Yup i guess u are the only pro mage who knows how to time ur skills right all other mages asking for a buff are nub is that what u mean to say and rouges need just one aim shot to go through any mage without shield on and still beat mages in terms of crit by miles.

[kixkaxx]

Yup i guess u are the only pro mage who knows how to time ur skills right all other mages asking for a buff are nub is that what u mean to say and rouges need just one aim shot to go through any mage without shield on and still beat mages in terms of crit by miles.

So why I didn't see mage like seven or goblin or arry or condra or voorg ... asking for buff? To play Mage, you need more skills than rogue, and a higher gear threshold.

[siddhant]

So why I didn't see mage like seven or goblin or arry or condra or voorg ... asking for buff? To play Mage, you need more skills than rogue, and a higher gear threshold.
They dont ask for buff because they are fully arcane geared hence they dont get 1shot and stuff where as the middle class
which forms a backbone cant obviously afford those kind of gear y should it be a legendary gear rouge>mythic geared mage is the reason y we are asking for balance ty.

[Kriticality]

How do you balance middle gear without affecting the fully geared? Imo max geared players are very well balanced. I get one shot by rogues and one lightning by arrypotta all the time lol.

[Castellann]

Conrad isn't maxed geared. However in 1v1 fights he can take down almost anyone. Arrypotta also has similar ability, he just happens to have maxed gear. Same with Voorg. The mages mentioned have studied their skills and roles in the game and adapted their style to be most effective at their role. If you've read Conrad's posts or watched his videos you would have known he interprets the mage class as an ultimate support class. A truly top-class mage isn't all about kills and kdr, it's about how he/she supports the team and makes it better. In my experience at endgame I've always appreciated a mage who is able to heal at critical moments, time stuns and curse to greatest effect and nuke hard for AOE damage to the opposing team when required. Kills will come when your team is winning.

The only problem with this is everyone's fixation with kdr. I might sound hypocritical for stating this because I am a rogue who happens to have a pretty nice kdr, but when you have a clash and your classes are built as such, you play to your strengths and abilities to win. Mages, rogues and tanks have their separate strengths and roles to play.

U read my mind Saf! Totally agree!

[siddhant]

Conrad isn't maxed geared. However in 1v1 fights he can take down almost anyone. Arrypotta also has similar ability, he just happens to have maxed gear. Same with Voorg. The mages mentioned have studied their skills and roles in the game and adapted their style to be most effective at their role. If you've read Conrad's posts or watched his videos you would have known he interprets the mage class as an ultimate support class. A truly top-class mage isn't all about kills and kdr, it's about how he/she supports the team and makes it better. In my experience at endgame I've always appreciated a mage who is able to heal at critical moments, time stuns and curse to greatest effect and nuke hard for AOE damage to the opposing team when required. Kills will come when your team is winning.

The only problem with this is everyone's fixation with kdr. I might sound hypocritical for stating this because I am a rogue who happens to have a pretty nice kdr, but when you have a clash and your classes are built as such, you play to your strengths and abilities to win. Mages, rogues and tanks have their separate strengths and roles to play.
Hmm mages as support class with heal our heal heals like what 50-60%then u have a big cd and again we are said to be good in clashes but the optimum choice for most clashes is 2rouge2tank1mage
And i guess 2>1 i have already mentioned i dont want mages to be buffed to make them best in vs but atleast second best in clashes rouges are preety much ruling vs as well as clashes and after the lvl46cap who knows we will have rouges running around with 75%crit 3\4 shot crit that is gg once the mage
shield down.

[siddhant]

How do you balance middle gear without affecting the fully geared? Imo max geared players are very well balanced. I get one shot by rogues and one lightning by arrypotta all the time lol.
Suppose a country like qatar(no offence)is said to be underdeveloped but yet that country has 5billionares what would u want the government to say that our country is developed because we have 5billionares
Same is the case with al there are fully almost maxed out gear which constitute like what 5%of the total mages doesnt make the rest 95%not get a buff?

[Kriticality]

Suppose a country like qatar(no offence)is said to be underdeveloped but yet that country has 5billionares what would u want the government to say that our country is developed because we have 5billionares
Same is the case with al there are fully almost maxed out gear which constitute like what 5%of the total mages doesnt make the rest 95%not get a buff?

What buff are you considering? 300 extra armor on gear won't help you from getting combod. 1000 extra health on gears won't help either. This is something that rogues have to deal with as well without any invulnerability. STS has ended up with good balance maxed out. Similar in PVE, rogues have a very difficult time leveling up solo. Mages are much better than any other class. Rogues should not get PVE buff because it would throw end game even more out of whack.

Nerfing rogues isn't the answer either because nobody will kill good tanks at that point. If you think a buff is coming that will stop mages from being combod, it can't without making mages tanks. I've stated many times that an excellent buff for mage would be replace knock back on shield with stun immunity for 3 seconds and buff heal.

Most of these things can be solved by playing on a good team and using good tanks. I'd love to hear your ideas about a buff for mages and also your ideas about what you think that mages weakness should be.

[Remarked]

Hmm mages as support class with heal our heal heals like what 50-60%then u have a big cd and again we are said to be good in clashes but the optimum choice for most clashes is 2rouge2tank1mage
And i guess 2>1 i have already mentioned i dont want mages to be buffed to make them best in vs but atleast second best in clashes rouges are preety much ruling vs as well as clashes and after the lvl46cap who knows we will have rouges running around with 75%crit 3\4 shot crit that is gg once the mage
shield down.
mage heal isnt 50-60% at endgame btw its like full hp lol

[bedmaster]

I cant afford real server endgame pvp so i tried it at test server. I got elonbow with para, perf blood ruby, perf fang and icescale potency set with 650+ dmg, 40% crit, and i use scorch. I tried vs with a mage with similiar gear, but without para. Maybe its bcuz my lack of skill but i kill him as much as he kills me, he stunlocks and curses to kill me. And i aim and hope for lucky crits to kill him. Idk wat dis means.

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[siddhant]

What buff are you considering? 300 extra armor on gear won't help you from getting combod. 1000 extra health on gears won't help either. This is something that rogues have to deal with as well without any invulnerability. STS has ended up with good balance maxed out. Similar in PVE, rogues have a very difficult time leveling up solo. Mages are much better than any other class. Rogues should not get PVE buff because it would throw end game even more out of whack.

Nerfing rogues isn't the answer either because nobody will kill good tanks at that point. If you think a buff is coming that will stop mages from being combod, it can't without making mages tanks. I've stated many times that an excellent buff for mage would be replace knock back on shield with stun immunity for 3 seconds and buff heal.

Most of these things can be solved by playing on a good team and using good tanks. I'd love to hear your ideas about a buff for mages and also your ideas about what you think that mages weakness should be.
I am not asking for buff in stats but proper implementation of our skills lifegiver(to some extent)heal and mana upgrade over time useless the reduction of 10%dmg in curse useless because most players in pvp are rouges ice lol we cant freeze where as breeze the so called nerf one is still op yesterday only we lost
5vs5clash because the opponent team were using breeze so just fail almost our skills it is irritating when u go on to curse and the opponent freezes leading to fail in skills in shield displacement wave useless clock cant root so many flaws in our skills and when u talk abt mage being the "best" class in pve is totally wrong the best team of pt is team of 4rouges or some ppl use 3rouge 1mage ik rouges would be hating me now but i guess the health of rouges should be reduced this will actually sort a lot of mess ty.

[siddhant]

mage heal isnt 50-60% at endgame btw its like full hp lol
My bad it is 50-60heal at 15 but even i dont think most mages use heal in their top4skills they usually swap heal so again swapping in middle of clash especially with ur shield down is risky i would actually want mages to get 5skill slots just
my opinion ty.

[siddhant]

I cant afford real server endgame pvp so i tried it at test server. I got elonbow with para, perf blood ruby, perf fang and icescale potency set with 650+ dmg, 40% crit, and i use scorch. I tried vs with a mage with similiar gear, but without para. Maybe its bcuz my lack of skill but i kill him as much as he kills me, he stunlocks and curses to kill me. And i aim and hope for lucky crits to kill him. Idk wat dis means.

Sent by a nub using Tapatalk
Ermm if u ask me those stats are actually
bad for rouge 650dmg +add 10nerf =only 585dmg and err as a pet u use scorch even blinky is better than scorch in vs and i guess u dont have much experience so right useage of skills/passive matter2 ty.

[bedmaster]

Ermm if u ask me those stats are actually
bad for rouge 650dmg +add 10nerf =only 585dmg and err as a pet u use scorch even blinky is better than scorch in vs and i guess u dont have much experience so right useage of skills/passive matter2 ty.
Maybe ur right, its the first time i play as rogue lol

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[Kriticality]

Ermm if u ask me those stats are actually
bad for rouge 650dmg +add 10nerf =only 585dmg and err as a pet u use scorch even blinky is better than scorch in vs and i guess u dont have much experience so right useage of skills/passive matter2 ty.

My post states no pve buff for rogue bc of endgame. Nobody in their right mind would prefer to level in tombs with 4 rogues. Mages can easily solo tombs leveling up. Not the case with rogues. It's slower and far more expensive for mana alone.

I'm fully imbued para/eye, frost bow, planar pendant, mythic ring. I have 657 damage which is quite good for rogue. My damage is 537 in pvp or around 18% difference. Take away pet damage and then nerf 10% and that is a rogues pvp damage. Legendary rogues will not break 600 damage in pve. Mythic rogues without para Prob won't either.

The only things a rogue had at end game more than Mages are armor and aimed shot.

You want Mages to be able to stun->root->freeze and think that is balance? At end game with max gear, Mages usually beat rogue 1 v 1, rogue can beat tank, and tank can beat mage but they can go either way. That's how it should be. When you say give your skills back like that's how they're supposed to work in pvp, it's not. That's why they are nerfed. If that were the case then give rogue damage and pet damage, fix razor shield and Mages can have their skills.

I literally had a conversation with someone I consider to be the strongest mage in game. This was after I fought him a day earlier. I asked him if any rogues can kill him 1 v 1. He said some can. I asked him if any without arcane ring can and he flat out told me "never." He doesn't use nekro either. This is not the case with rogues.

If you walk into end game pvp with 3300 health and 1022 armor as a mage or a mythic rogue with 3300 health and 1400 armor, the same thing will happen to both. I'd much rather fight a well geared rogue than a well geared mage.

As per breeze, I already suggested in many threads to replace knock back with stun/movement impairment immunity.

[siddhant]

My post states no pve buff for rogue bc of endgame. Nobody in their right mind would prefer to level in tombs with 4 rogues. Mages can easily solo tombs leveling up. Not the case with rogues. It's slower and far more expensive for mana alone.

I'm fully imbued para/eye, frost bow, planar pendant, mythic ring. I have 657 damage which is quite good for rogue. My damage is 537 in pvp or around 18% difference. Take away pet damage and then nerf 10% and that is a rogues pvp damage. Legendary rogues will not break 600 damage in pve. Mythic rogues without para Prob won't either.

The only things a rogue had at end game more than Mages are armor and aimed shot.

You want Mages to be able to stun->root->freeze and think that is balance? At end game with max gear, Mages usually beat rogue 1 v 1, rogue can beat tank, and tank can beat mage but they can go either way. That's how it should be. When you say give your skills back like that's how they're supposed to work in pvp, it's not. That's why they are nerfed. If that were the case then give rogue damage and pet damage, fix razor shield and Mages can have their skills.

I literally had a conversation with someone I consider to be the strongest mage in game. This was after I fought him a day earlier. I asked him if any rogues can kill him 1 v 1. He said some can. I asked him if any without arcane ring can and he flat out told me "never." He doesn't use nekro either. This is not the case with rogues.

If you walk into end game pvp with 3300 health and 1022 armor as a mage or a mythic rogue with 3300 health and 1400 armor, the same thing will happen to both. I'd much rather fight a well geared rogue than a well geared mage.

As per breeze, I already suggested in many threads to replace knock back with stun/movement impairment immunity.
Lol i think that when u talk abt "pve"just lvling up plays a very small role the major content of pve atm is planar tombs and elites and rouges are much more efficient in those content than mages.
Ur stats i guess can u upload a screenie i dont think any rouge using imbued frost bow myth ring planar pendant will have such sad stats when i see fully legendary rouged(excluding myth)run with dmg of around 525-575u have a far much better gear than him +para so i dont believe on the dmg said by u and y would u use a dmg pet when it is nerf for its crit/aa?.
The mage whom u talking abt i guess has planar pendant which gives 600health which is huge buff for any mage and if a rouge plays tactfully he can easily win through a mage but some rouges i have seen is using nox against mage curse like ssly and if u fight a mage with 550dmg 1100armour against rouge with 550dmg and 1400armour i feel rouge has much more chance of winning just make use of right skills and packs play an important role in vs if u dont have pets like sam etc that being said i guess u saw the poll should mage freeze be given back in pvp and their were more votes on yes if u remember when the majority of players agree to it idk how it is that a pet can do the same thing and a class cant i guess there was a post which mentioned that tanks and rouges had most of the skills in their weapons/pets(dont remember really well)like curse being there in bonesaw or some weapon so all are skills are basically being given out in gear so do u call this as balance?ty.

[Kriticality]

I will post stats with expedition recurve potency, mythic armor, helm, fang, blood ruby. 8 reg dex, 6 grand dex so add ~16-17 damage to mythic pics pve and pvp. I will also post imbued and frost bow and planar pve and pvp. All pics are taken with Samael.

PVE Mythics Legendary Bow

124570

PVE Imbued etc para

124571

PVP Mythic

124572

PVP Imbued

124573

You are off on your numbers... This is obv about PVP and you can see that in PVP, a mythic rogue with only legendary bow is in the 410-440 range. Perhaps you saw a legendary rogue with a damage elixir?

[siddhant]

I will post stats with expedition recurve potency, mythic armor, helm, fang, blood ruby. 8 reg dex, 6 grand dex so add ~16-17 damage to mythic pics pve and pvp. I will also post imbued and frost bow and planar pve and pvp. All pics are taken with Samael.

PVE Mythics Legendary Bow

124570

PVE Imbued etc para

124571

PVP Mythic

124572

PVP Imbued

124573

You are off on your numbers... This is obv about PVP and you can see that in PVP, a mythic rogue with only legendary bow is in the 410-440 range. Perhaps you saw a legendary rogue with a damage elixir?
"i have seen rouges running with around
550dmg" obviously means pve u cant check some1stats when they are pvping i guess again just by looking at ur gear i dont understand what ring or amulet u using (sorry for me being a nub here) a better ss would be that showing ur inv along with stats this will easily make me identify whether it a myth ring+imbued+frost gun+planar and that thing abt pvp ss i guess it even says fight when u fight in arena or somewhere how am i to beleive it is pvp room or arena?

[Kriticality]

In my second pic you can see my helm with 2 para, mythic ring, mythic bow, and planar pendant icon. The gems are 2 para, 5 eye, 6 grand dex. It says fight in CTF. I'll post pic of legendary bow, mythics in inv on fang so you can see it's not doom or lepre and difference between frost and exp to show bow is level 41.

124574

124575

I'm not lying to you lol. Planar and icescale potency are ~20-30 damage less than the mythics per set.

[siddhant]

In my second pic you can see my helm with 2 para, mythic ring, mythic bow, and planar pendant icon. The gems are 2 para, 5 eye, 6 grand dex. It says fight in CTF. I'll post pic of legendary bow, mythics in inv on fang so you can see it's not doom or lepre and difference between frost and exp to show bow is level 41.

124574

124575

I'm not lying to you lol. Planar and icescale potency are ~20-30 damage less than the mythics per set.
Lol it would be better if u show me ur gear in game after 45mins?cauz again there are 1000of ways in which i could manipulate my stats and that rouge was using singe and not sam btw ty.

[Kriticality]

Sure, if you think i'm misleading you. I'm happy to show you in game and feel free to ask one of the rogues you know at end game.

[Remarked]

Hahahaha Rekt

[Twix]

Siddhant, seems like you're a mage that complains so you can get more of an advantage than you already have. In endgame pvp, as a rogue, I will say its fairly challenging to vs a endgame mage. 1) you have a 2s invulnerability that lets you charge in 2) your fireball stuns for like 4 fricking seconds. 3) your lightning gives almost the same benefit as aimed shot 4) your ice slows down to the point a rogue cant even reach packs 5) with slag/sam you can stunlock and Its gg. Also, dont complain about rogues having "op crit", because theres mages out there that have 50-60% base crit.

[siddhant]

Siddhant, seems like you're a mage that complains so you can get more of an advantage than you already have. In endgame pvp, as a rogue, I will say its fairly challenging to vs a endgame mage. 1) you have a 2s invulnerability that lets you charge in 2) your fireball stuns for like 4 fricking seconds. 3) your lightning gives almost the same benefit as aimed shot 4) your ice slows down to the point a rogue cant even reach packs 5) with slag/sam you can stunlock and Its gg. Also, dont complain about rogues having "op crit", because theres mages out there that have 50-60% base crit.

all the above points are useless when a rouge can just one aim shot me and mages running with50%crit again there are special players who spend much more than the common players do so again i wouldnt consider that to be a valid point ty.

[Rx8]

all the above points are useless when a rouge can just one aim shot me and mages running with50%crit again there are special players who spend much more than the common players do so again i wouldnt consider that to be a valid point ty.

Ugh, sid, hit me up in game @ Volted .

[nevercan]

Siddhant, seems like you're a mage that complains so you can get more of an advantage than you already have. In endgame pvp, as a rogue, I will say its fairly challenging to vs a endgame mage. 1) you have a 2s invulnerability that lets you charge in 2) your fireball stuns for like 4 fricking seconds. 3) your lightning gives almost the same benefit as aimed shot 4) your ice slows down to the point a rogue cant even reach packs 5) with slag/sam you can stunlock and Its gg. Also, dont complain about rogues having "op crit", because theres mages out there that have 50-60% base crit.
1 its useles
2 firebal barely stuns on tanks rouges somethimes 4 sec not olways.
3 i think you are dreaming
4 ice shoud stun wich it doesnt but a pet can freeze so a rouge uses breeze and bam mage frozen
5 sam/slag/breeze can be used by any clas INCLUDING rouges.
And also rouges crit in combonaition with damage are way more painful (crit on tank 4-6k) and mages dont reach much more then 55% crit with maxed out gears.

[siddhant]

Ugh, sid, hit me up in game @ Volted .
Why?

[siddhant]

1 its useles
2 firebal barely stuns on tanks rouges somethimes 4 sec not olways.
3 i think you are dreaming
4 ice shoud stun wich it doesnt but a pet can freeze so a rouge uses breeze and bam mage frozen
5 sam/slag/breeze can be used by any clas INCLUDING rouges.
And also rouges crit in combonaition with damage are way more painful (crit on tank 4-6k) and mages dont reach much more then 55% crit with maxed out gears.
This.

[Rx8]

1 its useles
2 firebal barely stuns on tanks rouges somethimes 4 sec not olways.
3 i think you are dreaming
4 ice shoud stun wich it doesnt but a pet can freeze so a rouge uses breeze and bam mage frozen
5 sam/slag/breeze can be used by any clas INCLUDING rouges.
And also rouges crit in combonaition with damage are way more painful (crit on tank 4-6k) and mages dont reach much more then 55% crit with maxed out gears.

- Do u even use it properly? Thats one of the key skills in killing a rogue.
2- Are u even charging FB properly? Or do u lag alot?
3- Lightning is almost good as aimed, a critical lightning drains alot of HP on the enemy.
4- Can u try maintaing a range if the rogue is using breeze? Try if it helps? Ice is a PAIN for rogues! It slows them down and almost prevents them from reaching the packs! Try usin fireball, ice,light? See if it helps?
5-Lol, mages light crit hurts ALOT.

[Remarked]

- Do u even use it properly? Thats one of the key skills in killing a rogue.
2- Are u even charging FB properly? Or do u lag alot?
3- Lightning is almost good as aimed, a critical lightning drains alot of HP on the enemy.
4- Can u try maintaing a range if the rogue is using breeze? Try if it helps? Ice is a PAIN for rogues! It slows them down and almost prevents them from reaching the packs! Try usin fireball, ice,light? See if it helps?
5-Lol, mages light crit hurts ALOT.

Yaaaaaasssss

[nevercan]

- Do u even use it properly? Thats one of the key skills in killing a rogue.
2- Are u even charging FB properly? Or do u lag alot?
3- Lightning is almost good as aimed, a critical lightning drains alot of HP on the enemy.
4- Can u try maintaing a range if the rogue is using breeze? Try if it helps? Ice is a PAIN for rogues! It slows them down and almost prevents them from reaching the packs! Try usin fireball, ice,light? See if it helps?
5-Lol, mages light crit hurts ALOT.
1 i use it probebly + you forgot to use number 1
2 i charge firebal olways pfffff
3 i think you where drunk when you sow this when a mage crits 2k max a rouge crits 4k 2k difference is that olmost the same?
4 ice doesnt have that much effect since it only slows down and breeze can freeze and rouges can use it and what does ice heal since 1 when shield down you are a dead man o wait its dead mage. You use most of the cases shield and heal so where can you put ice in?
5 light mage crit maybe hurt on a lvl 39 crap rouge not otherwise.