Has the new gear made crafting obsolete?

[Snakespeare]

I got a recipe from Goldfever this morning and took the time to investigate whether to sell it or save it to craft with. This is what I found.

If I craft it I will essentially take a normal bow and reduce the damage by 6 points, gain 2 additional bonus dex points, and add 6 H/s. This is true whether you craft the autobow or the recurve.

Then I contrasted the resulting bow with the new Sewer King's Gemstone Scarab. This bow has the 6 H/s you would get from crafting your recurve, and it has the same full damage of the recurve, as opposed to losing 6 points of damage from crafting. It also has 6 M/s, which is a huge boon. The price however, is 6 fewer ponts of hit% and 6 fewer points of crit%.

So I put this question to all archers. Has the introduction of the new to-die-for bow made crafting obsolete?

[Royce]

6 Crit is better than 6 damage (as long as your damage is over 100), just sayin ;)

[Ellyidol]

You're totally right.

More than obsolete though, i don't think crafting even developed into anything other than the initial rush to get a set to see if there was a set bonus. After that, its just been a downward spiral.

I just got a recipe too, and i suggest we just keep them for future and hopeful change of the crafting system. :)

[krazii]

6 Crit is better than 6 damage (as long as your damage is over 100), just sayin ;)

What's special about 100 DMG? I missed that post somewhere.

Agree with Elly! Crafting, while a great idea is in vast need of improvement and I am also holding off until they revise it. At this point it makes no sense to craft most items. Furthermore, it would be really nice to have the option to customize a crafted piece to your liking. Say you get a certain number of attribute points you can use to add to the item your crafting and you choose where you want to put them (with some restrictions on the max you can put into one attribute).

Kraz

[Riccits]

ya crafting makes items "worser" in some way... its just the kick to craft something thought, bcz many ppl do it anyway...

from beginnig i thought we can personalize some items through crafting, giving some crit, dogde, hs, ms etc. to build our personalized set with our preferences.. but it wasnt so :)

[Ellyidol]

I think Royce means that as long as your damage is over 100, 6% crit adds more damage overall than 6 actual damage.

200 damage : 6% more criticals from 200 damage is better than just 6 more damage to that 200.

I think :D

[FluffNStuff]

6 Crit is better than 6 damage (as long as your damage is over 100), just sayin ;)

Crit to damage formula:
If DamageAdd + Current Crit * (DamageAdd) / 100 > New Crit * (Current Damage - Enemy Armor) / 100 then Damage is better then Crit.

Gets even Crazier for Rage on a Bear ;)

[Royce]

What's special about 100 DMG? I missed that post somewhere.

Look at it this way. If you do 100 damage, and have 6% Crit. 6 out of 100 times you will do double damage, so over 100 shots, you get 100*100+6*100=10600 damage. If you do 106 damage instead, with no Crit, over 100 shots you do 106*100=10600 damage. So if you do over 100 damage, the Crit is more valuable, under 100 damage, the added damage means more.

[FluffNStuff]

Look at it this way. If you do 100 damage, and have 6% Crit. 6 out of 100 times you will do double damage, so over 100 shots, you get 100*100+6*100=10600 damage. If you do 106 damage instead, with no Crit, over 100 shots you do 106*100=10600 damage. So if you do over 100 damage, the Crit is more valuable, under 100 damage, the added damage means more.

Postings popping up quick here, so you might have missed, but that ignores armor. Real Formula is:
If DamageAdd + Current Crit * (DamageAdd) / 100 > New Crit * (Current Damage - Enemy Armor) / 100 then Damage is better then Crit.

[Riccits]

Crit to damage formula:
If DamageAdd + Current Crit * (DamageAdd) / 100 > New Crit * (Current Damage - Enemy Armor) / 100 then Damage is better then Crit.

Gets even Crazier for Rage on a Bear ;)

u should teach it at school LOL!
nice one! :)

[Royce]

Postings popping up quick here, so you might have missed, but that ignores armor. Real Formula is:
If DamageAdd + Current Crit * (DamageAdd) / 100 > New Crit * (Current Damage - Enemy Armor) / 100 then Damage is better then Crit.

Right but I was trying to simplify. I've gotten caught up in too many complicated discussions lately lol. Anyway that's why I said "do" 100 damage and not "have" 100 damage ;)

[FluffNStuff]

Right but I was trying to simplify. I've gotten caught up in too many complicated discussions lately lol. Anyway that's why I said "do" 100 damage and not "have" 100 damage ;)

Gotcha :) I have just been testing the hack out of it to see if Henchman was better for Dagger then Raid Roach.

[Doubletime]

Postings popping up quick here, so you might have missed, but that ignores armor. Real Formula is:
If DamageAdd + Current Crit * (DamageAdd) / 100 > New Crit * (Current Damage - Enemy Armor) / 100 then Damage is better then Crit.

And who said we would never use all that math they made us learn in school. Nice post Fluff.

[Snakespeare]

But to the point:

On scarab, you give up the crit to gain M/s and H/s. On the crafted bow you give up the damage to gain H/s. M/s is very needed for archers at this level. I swear I burn through mana pots like they are going out of style. So I feel the scarab is the better bow.

Are you making a case that the Custom Recurve is better than the SK Scarab because it has such high crit%?

I think if crafting gave me M/s like the JK Scarab, it would be worth it. But right now it is 350K for the recipe, 300K for the bow, another 700K in additional materials for an item that you can't sell for 500K, whereas the SK scarab is going for 750K.

[Kindread]

I dunno but I have the crafted leather, talon and wing and that gives mena health regen of 30. I don't know about you guys but I'm loving the set. I've lost some damage but with 73 crit, it makes up for it. Having both the sewer bow and the raid recurve, and I can tell you there is still real value in the crit heavy recurve. I switch to it for bosses.

[Royce]

But to the point:

On scarab, you give up the crit to gain M/s and H/s. On the crafted bow you give up the damage to gain H/s. M/s is very needed for archers at this level. I swear I burn through mana pots like they are going out of style. So I feel the scarab is the better bow.

Are you making a case that the Custom Recurve is better than the SK Scarab because it has such high crit%?

I think if crafting gave me M/s like the JK Scarab, it would be worth it. But right now it is 350K for the recipe, 300K for the bow, another 700K in additional materials for an item that you can't sell for 500K, whereas the SK scarab is going for 750K.

The argument about damage, Crit, etc. vs. regen is a tricky one. Except in PvP, you never actually need regen since you can just spam pots (edit: and technically archers really never need regen since they have skills for both health and mana regen, little used though they may be). It's impossible to argue that trading damage or Crit for regen will make you more effective, but it can sure save you a ton of gold. Since there is no way to meaningfully compare gold spending to damage done, there is no real way to compare those factors and it just comes down to preference.

[Snakespeare]

Ah! So that IS your point! Thanks, Royce. Sorry, didn't get it the first time. You think the Custom Recurve is still better than SK Scarab because of the crit. And Morawk says he switches to it for boss fights even though he has SK scarab, too.

In short, crafting is not really obsolete, as I had feared.

But the price is insane. You have to spend twice as much to make the Custom Recurve than to buy the SK Scarab.

[Physiologic]

I expect Cinco to b-slap us in the face again with set bonuses for crafted gear and the non-crafted gear.

Look at the late additions of the Gurgox Rift set, Sunblessed Archer set, Keeper's Enchantress set, Death set, Shadows set, and Hate set bonuses.

Or, he may not.

Anyway, I hoarded 5 Raid Roach caps for 80k just in case :)