Upcoming Change to Skills: Global Cool-Down

[Cinco]

Pocket Legends will soon support a global 'cool-down' for all Skills.

This means that you will no longer be able to execute all of your skills at exactly the same time. (i.e. no more "Skill Spamming") All of your characters' skills will have a brief cool-down period after any skill is executed.

One important result of this is better Client performance. Due to the fact that we will no longer have every player on-screen firing off all of their abilities in the exact same fraction of a second - Clients will be able to run significantly faster in combat.

Another important result is a reduction in overall damage. Since you have to wait a tiny bit after executing a Skill before firing any of your other Skills, it should make sense that you will experience a reduction in your characters' overall DPS.

We have no specific data to share about the cool-down periods at this time. We are testing this new system for its impact on fun-factor and will iterate on the Skills and game-balance until it feels right.

However - I can say right now that PVP feels a lot better with this system in-place. We're not one-shotting each other with all of our Skills anymore... like we used to in the first half-second of combat... We like this, but we realize that some of you may not.

Feel free to post your thoughts and questions in this thread. I hope to be able to answer some of them before the change is ready for release. (And, as always, entertaining predictions of doom, gloom and economic ruination are most definitely welcome :)


Smiles and good cheer,

- Cinco


Testing Update (3.10.2011) - played (PVE only) with global cool-down times at ~0.50 seconds quite a bit this morning. Overall the combat requires significantly more skill and more strategy. As far as I'm concerned that's a really, really good thing! Right now I'm considering increases to player damage (all classes)... but it's not certain. We still have a lot more multiplayer testing to do (to discern how much damage a well-geared group can do now that we have GCD).

[Physiologic]

Cool-down on skills, check. What about potion cool-down?

This seems suggested simply because of PvP (a very small percentage of the community plays PvP). If brought over to PvE, that's a lot of unhappy people doing farming runs and XP grinding runs. Granted, it'll make runs tougher but they will still be much slower than before. And I'll probably hate that for the next elite level cap :p Is it possible to have this feature only in PvP and not PvE?

edit(i posted this on page 7 but ill post it here again):
Cinco, I think that you should create some sort of poll.

If a) A majority of players say YES to PvE cool-down and b) Cool-down will reduce lag experienced by many users from skill mashing, then yes go along with the plan.

If a) A majority of players say NO to PvE cool-down and b) Only a small % of users experience lag from skill mashing, then only limit cool-downs to PvP.

I don't see why a complete overhaul on PL's battle system is necessary because of the iPad's inherent design flaw to use all skills at once in PvP. PvP should only be fixed - PvE shouldn't be affected at all.

How much of the total population in Pocket Legends PvP? How many PvE games do you see versus PvP games?

[Parasyte]

That sounds good. One quick question tho, will it be like if you have 5 people in your group you will get to use 1 move then someone else gets to use a move? Or will it be the samething but just longer cool-down periods?

[Ellyidol]

Sounds fair. Removes the difference between multiple skill mashing from tablets vs smaller devices.

I have a slight feeling nothing is gonna change for birds, since most need to differentiate skill orders vs a different opponent. But for bears, Uh oh.

Also, does this mean overall game speed will be reduced? Or is the in-between skill cooldown just enough to prevent multiple skills at once?

[Kossi]

ok. now if this is going to work, you guys should increase the range of all str weapons due to kiting

[Ellyidol]

ok. now if this is going to work, you guys should increase the range of all str weapons due to kiting

Or add a skill that bears can use to help with beckon pulling.

Tbh, the only window we have to let out all our slashes as a nuke is in between beckon and stomp combo. With these changes, I'm not sure if it will be possible anymore, therefore there goes our killing combo.

[Echelong]

Why not apply this to pvp only and leave pve as it is right now? This could make runs a lot longer than they are now and therefore less enjoyable. I just had a flashback when Blizzard put a global cooldown on Shaman shock spells. It wasn't fun.

[KingFu]

Finally! I cant wait for this! It won't only make PvE more fun, but will have PvP require a little more of a skill factor. Before (mainly with archer) it was who could whip out their combo first. I'm half and half with Phys on the only in PvP part though. I think PvE would be a lot more fun, but then again, it would have it's down sides (IE mages not being able to heal appropriately, tanks not being able to group up and stun mobs as easily, archers not being able to set up cruel blast as easily) It'd definitely give PvE a more challenging side, but it would also make it a lot harder for the classes to do their jobs. Any idea to be able to cope the two?

[Physiologic]

I like the fact that it makes the game harder. But I realize, that in the long run, if Bandit Hideout runs go from 3 minutes and 30 seconds to 6-7 minutes, I might not like to farm anymore, that's all.

[Sanatorium]

Awww what about Combos, will the cool down affect them in any way?
Also for potion cool down, noooo... don't please, even when you spam health pots and health skills you STILL get mob'd down.
Leave the pots how they are, they're great.

[Kossi]

im indifferent on PvE, but i want to see how PvP will change

[Lesrider]

This does not sound fun for pve. How would you even get combos to work?

[Zerious]

I don't like this, I would honestly, full-heartedly, prefer to lag out on my ipod than play slower. But that's just one opinion... Although the idea for pvp is intriguing...

[KingFu]

This does not sound fun for pve. How would you even get combos to work?

As I said, cruel blast would be nearly impossible to set up depending on the time. I am concerned about how it'll play out with mages healing, and tanks grouping together enemies.

[Kossi]

As I said, cruel blast would be nearly impossible to set up depending on the time. I am concerned about how it'll play out with mages healing, and tanks grouping together enemies.

im sure they have something planned

[Lesrider]

If it takes too long to get through a run in this game, it will scare away casual players. Only the hardcore will put in the time. One of PL's greatest assets is that you can pick up and play for 15 minutes, or you can play for hours. If 15 minutes doesn't get you far, it may scare some people off.

[Echelong]

I like the fact that it makes the game harder. But I realize, that in the long run, if Bandit Hideout runs go from 3 minutes and 30 seconds to 6-7 minutes, I might not like to farm anymore, that's all.

This is what I am afraid off. This would turn fun hours of farming into tedious long runs that would make players quit. I agree with the devs on applying it to pvp though.

[Tiliana]

Regarding PVE, will the bosses still be spamming their skills as fast as they normally do? If so, then we are put at a severe disadvantage. We won't be able to heal as fast as we are getting hit. With the type of armor mages have, we will be massacred. I like a challenge, but It will be like fighting against M.Bison's unstoppable sliding toe kick.

[Moogerfooger]

Love the game, and this may help the PvP experience, but would destroy PvE and would decrease the fun factor (and my personal interest and what I consider fun in the game, fwiw) to almost nil. If I am reading this right, this would totally affect combos and game play to a painful crawl. I understand the desire to draw out gameplay, but there has got to be a better solution.

PvP...maybe. PvE...no, no and no.

0.02.

[noobmigo]

I have one question.
Does that mean:
(a) All of the skillls have same C-D, just you cannot press all of the skills at the same time
(b) All of the skills have the current C-D, just you cannot presss all of the skills at the same time.
or (c) All of the skills have current C-D, except that everytime you press a skill, the C-D for everything resets.

If it is C, I'm going to think about only going with one buff.
Anyway, wonderful idea devs, it's just going to take some getting used to.

[WhoIsThis]

I strongly dislike this idea as well. It won't make the game any more interesting, just a longer grind. I think that if the game needs to be made harder (which the Sewers level does), it should be with tougher opponents (ex: more hp).

It may work on PvP, but again, I strongly disagree with applying this to PvE. PvP games should have the option of setting this mode either on or off.

Edit:

Client performance should not be an issue. With each generation of phone getting substantially faster (new phones this year come with ARM Cortex A9 Processors), I highly doubt that this will be a serious problem in a year or so. In any event, I'd imagine that the majority of the demographic that plays this game is "tech-savvy".

[thugimmortal]

Now bears will totally suck
we want something to speed up our killing not slow us down even more

[Sigkill]

Sigkill doesnt like this idea :(

[icantgetkills]

looks very good :D as long as there isnt like a 10 second time in between XD
i think that this is be very good for PVP maybe not so much PvE as it will be hard to defeat mobs and bosses without the ability for fast combo

[KingFu]

Sigkill doesnt like this idea :(

Mysticaldream doesn't care:o

[Physiologic]

The only way to combat the slowness of a global cool-down in PvE is to INCREASE skill damage for all classes - especially bears, since they will suffer way too much.

Comboing is easy to fix, just increase the time for a combo to connect. I believe the maximum time in-between skills for a combo is ~2 seconds. Just increase it to 3-4 seconds or something :D

[noobmigo]

Now bears will totally suck
we want something to speed up our killing not slow us down even more

Yup, if it is my option (C), I'm gonna cry, cry, and play on my bird for the rest of my life.
It seems like the bird is the only one that is barely affected by this, but who knows?

[Moogerfooger]

Comboing is easy to fix, just increase the time for a combo to connect. I believe the maximum time in-between skills for a combo is ~2 seconds. Just increase it to 3-4 seconds or something :D


Yeah, that's gonna be exciting.

*Tap Shattering Scream*

*Take a nap*

*Eat dinner*

*Watch the news*

*Examine one's toenails*

*Hit Blast Shot*

Sorry homephys, transparent attempt to extend gameplay by reducing it to a painful crawl via a fairly radical mechanics redesign.

[Physiologic]

Extending time-to-finish-combo is the only thing I can think of that'll go hand-in-hand with global cool-downs, it's an easy fix but one I am not too particularly fond of.

[noobmigo]

Extending time-to-finish-combo is the only thing I can think of that'll go hand-in-hand with global cool-downs, it's an easy fix but one I am not too particularly fond of.

*puts thinking cap on*

[Junside]

Is this implemented in any other MMO PVP faction?

Why do I feel like this will only hurt birds? Especially if the global cooldown duration is the same for all classes. Mages and Bears don't really need to use their skills as fast as possible.

[Moogerfooger]

Mages and Bears don't really need to use their skills as fast as possible.

Get ready to be politely flamed by some mages on here who do use their skills as fast as possible :p

[Junside]

Get ready to be politely flamed by some mages on here who do use their skills as fast as possible :p

Well, don't you need to pause before pulling off a combo? I don't have to do that with my bird.

[KingFu]

Is this implemented in any other MMO PVP faction?

Why do I feel like this will only hurt birds? Especially if the global cooldown duration is the same for all classes. Mages and Bears don't really need to use their skills as fast as possible.

I disagree, with mages, don't they need to heal every chance they get for AoE bosses like Bandit queen as well as deal damage? I know when i go in, i heal my teqm as much as they need it, on top of debuffing, waiting for it to take effect, then set up as many combos as I can. As for warrior, I always use beckon them together, use hell scream, then stomp to group them together stunned, and set up the smash combo for damage. I'm not one of those people that just goes crazy and spams random skills, but on some occasions it is needed to use skills in a certain order in a time frame to keep the game smooth.

[Moogerfooger]

Well, don't you need to pause before pulling off a combo? I don't have to do that with my bird.

That wasn't my point and I wasn't talking about combos specifically. Your assertion that mages don't need to use their skills as fast as possible is....up for debate, and I'm sure some of the better mages will chime in.

Edit: ^^^ see? Mage chimes in.

[WhoIsThis]

Is this implemented in any other MMO PVP faction?

Why do I feel like this will only hurt birds? Especially if the global cooldown duration is the same for all classes. Mages and Bears don't really need to use their skills as fast as possible.

On the contrary, int mages desperately need to do exactly that - spam like hell.

It's a race against the clock to see if our spells can kill the target faster or if they can kill us. Spamming is essential. We don't have any more hp than from Forest Haven. Neither do pure dex birds.

[Conradin]

Pvp will be seriously different.

[Junside]

I disagree, with mages, don't they need to heal every chance they get for AoE bosses like Bandit queen as well as deal damage? I know when i go in, i heal my teqm as much as they need it, on top of debuffing, waiting for it to take effect, then set up as many combos as I can. As for warrior, I always use beckon them together, use hell scream, then stomp to group them together stunned, and set up the smash combo for damage. I'm not one of those people that just goes crazy and spams random skills, but on some occasions it is needed to use skills in a certain order in a time frame to keep the game smooth.


That wasn't my point and I wasn't talking about combos specifically. Your assertion that mages don't need to use their skills as fast as possible is....up for debate, and I'm sure some of the better mages will chime in.

Edit: ^^^ see? Mage chimes in.

I still feel it will hurt birds the most, if anything. But I do see the points you guys brought up.

[KingFu]

I still feel it will hurt birds the most, if anything. But I do see the points you guys brought up.

I agree archers may take the biggest hit since they are a DPS based class, and it may be difficult for them to set up the Cruel Blast combo, but I think all classes will take a hit of some sort.

[Vallist]

how about we do this for pvp but not for pve

this only sounds fair on pvp to me not pve, pve is all skill unleashed

IfYouSeeThisMessageSayHIMESSAGE!

[Tiliana]

Spamming skills quickly after a Rez is a must. When someone is rezzed I instantly, heal and buff as fast as my (soon to be unnecessary) lightning quick reflexes allow before they fall down again. The speed of the skill wielder was part of what set apart the best from everyone else...notice I said part not all. Simmer down slow movers. :)

[Sun]

I'm 1000% in favor of this change

[Kossi]

im 1000% in favor with this update also, but the cooldown time MUST be within 0.5-1.5 second max cooldown time

EDIT: also, buffs should also not have a cooldown effect

[Keohike]

i do not like this idea at all since im mostly pve :(

[Kossi]

did anyone else notice that cinco's avatar is like a skull when you go to his page?

are new avatars coming out ? :D

[Snakespeare]

i'm opposed, but it doesn't matter

[Kossi]

i support this mainly because:

i will lag a whole lot less
more skill req. in pvp

[Moogerfooger]

i'm opposed, but it doesn't matter

Sadly, probably true.

[romgar1]

Im all for making pvp more balanced and skill based. As for pve, I would like to see how it affects the lag factor before i make a judgment. If you are going to balance pvp by changing the pve expect critics. You will definetly draw more into pvp by creating a ranking system complete with rewards and adding a 1v1 match to the mix. Ok for now I will try to stay on topic so thats all I will say.

[Keohike]

Im all for making pvp more balanced and skill based. As for pve, I would like to see how it affects the lag factor before i make a judgment. If you are going to balance pvp by changing the pve expect critics. You will definetly draw more into pvp by creating a ranking system complete with rewards and adding a 1v1 match to the mix. Ok for now I will try to stay on topic so thats all I will say.

I like your idea of ranking system and 1v1. That be cool.

[Kossi]

and staking? what about staking?

[Thelonearcher]

YES !!!! +83937EU6Y4RRY738292746738293874647382129837464783 298374T547382938745T473822938475T7438293874R6T5Y7U 4RFHJ3EDXCBNIKMTYGH5674R3EDFHXCB7UJN8IKMXCNM372898 3746478329293e647382919837eu46ry37829 BYE BYE MULTITOUCHERS ! BOOM BABY!

[Kossi]

YES !!!! +83937EU6Y4RRY738292746738293874647382129837464783 298374T547382938745T473822938475T7438293874R6T5Y7U 4RFHJ3EDXCBNIKMTYGH5674R3EDFHXCB7UJN8IKMXCNM372898 3746478329293e647382919837eu46ry37829 BYE BYE MULTITOUCHERS ! BOOM BABY!

lol this is good for you because it basically secures your spot on the leaderboards

[Thelonearcher]

lol this is good for you because it basically secures your spot on the leaderboards

Honestly who could pass me?

[Kossi]

Honestly who could pass me?

skimmey..hes been getting lots of kill very fast

[Thelonearcher]

skimmey..hes been getting lots of kill very fast

Ok he got 2,000 I got 4,000 in one week honestly no competition

[Thelonearcher]

He's good at getting free kills and multitouching though

[Kossi]

He's good at getting free kills and multitouching though


by the time he got 1k kills, you had like 30k

[Thelonearcher]

by the time he got 1k kills, you had like 30k

During ao2 great depression I quit pvp for 2 months ;) id have about 100k kills by now

[Thelonearcher]

Doesn't it make you wonder how someone could get that many kills so quickly, honestly. Only one solution. Pvp more then me or get free kills. And god knows no one pvps more then me lol

[Kossi]

During ao2 great depression I quit pvp for 2 months ;) id have about 100k kills by now

when everyone was sellin pinks for 5k?

[Kossi]

Doesn't it make you wonder how someone could get that many kills so quickly, honestly. Only one solution. Pvp more then me or get free kills. And god knows no one pvps more then me lol

im the BEST lv30 out there
but if impelf returned to pallydom, he would totally kick my gluteus maximus

[Zerious]

Doesn't it make you wonder how someone could get that many kills so quickly, honestly. Only one solution. Pvp more then me or get free kills. And god knows no one pvps more then me lol

Eh, I'd say Imp would make the top of enchantresses.... Sorry Brooke...

But Yeah I have something to add onto the idea regarding pvp. Wouldn't it be a battle on who can get all their skills out while their opponent is frozen by GCD? I thought about this, and I don't find this a good thing at all. Slower PVE runs, PVP would be like Final Fantasy fights... I'll quit.... This really would kill my love for PL...

[Physiologic]

Cinco, I think that you should create some sort of poll.

If a) A majority of players say YES to PvE cool-down and b) Cool-down will reduce lag experienced by many users from skill mashing, then yes go along with the plan.

If a) A majority of players say NO to PvE cool-down and b) Only a small % of users experience lag from skill mashing, then only limit cool-downs to PvP.

I don't see why a complete overhaul on PL's battle system is necessary because of the iPad's inherent design flaw to use all skills at once in PvP. PvP should only be fixed - PvE shouldn't be affected at all.

How much of the total population in Pocket Legends PvP? How many PvE games do you see versus PvP games?

[WhoIsThis]

PvP I think should be optional too - meaning that the host should be able to set the type of game. Plus there needs to be a way to know what type of game it is. An example would be one type of game would be the normal color, and the other type would be say, striped.

[KingFu]

Maybe archer in PvP will require some skill now.....

I'm kind of excited to see this happening, as I said above. Just not sure what will become of PvE

[Cmandial]

Devs. Just saying when y'all did the combat rebalance last time, didn't you say that you wanted to tear the focus away from auto attacking, and shift it to skills. I can find a quote somewhere of y'all saying you wanted this to be a skill oriented games instead of a "press auto attack and wait" game. I think this will hurt birds the most to be honest. We rely almost solely on fast execution of our skills in pvp. How is anyone supposed to kill a Mage in full Fury Fighter's that can just heal and auto attack you while they heal ur slow skills with 30 H/S and over 160 armor.

[RATTANSINGHNAGRA]

I'm a level 52 bear and I can honestly say I am so disappointed with the bear class in this game. If you do this change I will literally never play again. I do not play or like PVP I am a straight PVE guy and I have a hard enough time playing as it is now. I beg of you please do not do this, you will see in the long run it is a mistake.




IfYouSeeThisMessageSayHIMESSAGE!

HIMESSAGE!

[Rebel]

Slowly but surely ;)

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?3151-My-Suggestion-on-PvP-Balance

How about some cast times and skill trees up next.

[evelo2]

Sigh...

This game is currently a fun blast, that doesn't have all the crap of its big brothers.
And now we start to add all the silly rules.

The true fun in this game is blasting through levels, and relaxing.

For the love of all things, don't mess with stuff that isn't broke.

It is already tedious enough killing Keeper, without less DPS.

I played 10years + of EQ, Wow, SWG, Planetside and I find this to be easy to drop into.

[Nightarcher]

Maybe archer in PvP will require some skill now.....

I'm kind of excited to see this happening, as I said above. Just not sure what will become of PvE

Well realistically, it takes less skill to get all your combo skills out with a gap between them than all at once. So yes, archers will have to rethink their strategy and plan for longer battles, but it will just change from the skill of fast combo-ing to who can kite the best.

In the sense of archers will be ridiculously handicapped over all other classes by this update, then yes, it will require more "skill."

--

EDIT: and yea I am extremely worried about PVE too. This update might only apply to PVP games, but if it doesn't, classes will all be weaker.

SPECIFICALLY THE ARCHER! Thanks to bears stealing our freaking dodge and us having lower armor then mages, our only defense is offense. If the Devs put gaps between our skills I might just quit, because then I'll be a sitting duck. (almost literally)


Basically this update seems like it will cripple archers the most. Boo...

[Lesrider]

Sounds like only the pvpers like this idea. So implement it for pvp and please leave pve alone!

[Durnam]

This has me concerned about the balance of classes now. I'm not the most experience player here so if I'm wrong about something, please correct me.

Dex gives out the most damage per weapon. Fallowed by strength and Int. This would mean this new system would severely hurt INT characters, who have no strong armor, weak weapon damage, and now are extremely vulnerable to any sort of solo play. Hell its going to be near impossible to solo play for exp. (I'm sure the idea of the game isn't to have solo play, but to make it unplayable if you don't do any co-op is absurd.)

The other major issue is the mana bar regain rate. At the moment i try to max out my mana regen and try to max out a skill before learning another, this means i almost never run out of mana. Now with this new system, i doubt my mana amount will ever go down. This leads to a possibly very problematic question, whats the point in maxing out int anymore? Int stat has become so useless now, its perhaps the worst thing to invest points in.

This seemingly small change, could drastically create another re-imbalance of stats, and the game itself. Naturally boss battles are going to get harder due to being able to heal spam. I hope another re-balancing of the battle system will take place after this is implemented.

[Rebel]

This has me concerned about the balance of classes now. I'm not the most experience player here so if I'm wrong about something, please correct me.

Dex gives out the most damage per weapon. Fallowed by strength and Int. This would mean this new system would severely hurt INT characters, who have no strong armor, weak weapon damage, and now are extremely vulnerable to any sort of solo play. Hell its going to be near impossible to solo play for exp. (I'm sure the idea of the game isn't to have solo play, but to make it unplayable if you don't do any co-op is absurd.)

I agree. That's why I think that skill damage for other classes should be lowered, as the enchantress's main offenses are her skills while the warrior has his high armor and the avian his high dps weapon.

[RATTANSINGHNAGRA]

Sounds like only the pvpers like this idea. So implement it for pvp and please leave pve alone!

YES! Please listen to us devs!

[Magicalbanana]

two words...this sucks

[Cmandial]

In no way are enchantresses underpowered. Have u faced imperialelf?

[Parasyte]

I strongly disagree to this because I like twinking (if that's a word) so this update will be impossible to make a twink that can PvE and PvP. This update will make alot of people quit or not play as much so less platinum will be bought so STS will not make as much as they could so this update will hurt everybody if u think about it.
This is strictly my opinion so please don't flame me if you disagree.

[Magicalbanana]

In no way are enchantresses underpowered. Have u faced imperialelf?

yes some people like imp are very good enchantresses, but its the class in general

[Lesrider]

Mages aren't underpowered, but they will be if they can't use their skills!

[Justg]

Folks, this is a necessary and beneficial change. You have not even played with it yet and are making sweeping generalizations. Give us your level opinions and help us tweak it when it goes in. We promise we will listen (as long as the feedback is rational) and we'll keep iterating on it until it feels right.

[Cmandial]

yes some people like imp are very good enchantresses, but its the class in general

Let me rephrase. PALADINS are in no way underpowered. Over 160 armor with high dodge and 30 h/s and m/s.

[Lesrider]

Folks, this is a necessary and beneficial change. You have not even played with it yet and are making sweeping generalizations. Give us your level opinions and help us tweak it when it goes in. We promise we will listen (as long as the feedback is rational) and we'll keep iterating on it until it feels right.

Maybe we shouldn't be given this info then, until more info can be given? Hard to discuss without speculating when we don't know much about it.

[Magicalbanana]

pallys are a diff story theyve got the best of both worlds

[Ellyidol]

Maybe we shouldn't be given this info then, until more info can be given? Hard to discuss without speculating when we don't know much about it.

I agree.

Not to sound ungrateful for the early statement, warning if you may, but maybe it would be better if actual figures were given out too. It seems, for me at least, that expectations range from a split second delay only up to a much longer delay which confuses me (maybe others) on what to expect.

Thank you though, for letting us know. I suspect that reaction and comments now are MUCH more civilised than what they would be if this was just implemented without warning.

[Physiologic]

Folks, this is a necessary and beneficial change. You have not even played with it yet and are making sweeping generalizations. Give us your level opinions and help us tweak it when it goes in. We promise we will listen (as long as the feedback is rational) and we'll keep iterating on it until it feels right.

G, all of us are making generalizations because only general info has been posted (nothing in detail at all) :p I would imagine the thread being a whole lot different if specifics were mentioned.

[FluffNStuff]

As I am not huge into PVP, I will let those that are speak for that, but I would like to post some thoughts on PVE. I would like to start with a clip from the previous rebalance:


...
Class Skills - In the updated balance, a substantial portion of all class' damage comes from the skills. Some time ago we changed skills to use formulas - driven by statistics - instead of constant values. This change didn't mean much due to the fact that armor and weapons didn't change. Now, with this upcoming change, skills play a much bigger role and their reliance on your character statistics is much more profound.

After our most recent internal tests, we feel that we are very close to our goal of rewarding Warriors, Archers and Enchantresses who play their characters 'smartly.' It now feels much more important to use debuffs, crowd-control skills, damage skills, in the right order and for the right reasons.

Oh! Also - the cool down times for skills have been dramatically affected. Since so much of your effectiveness now comes from skills, being able to fire them off more frequently feels a lot better and makes combat more fun.
...


This appears to be a step back from the previous changes. As players we have learned to adapt play style and to become more reliant on skills. Now is this change going to be for all skills or just damage skills? Are bears going to have to use iron armor, wait, use evade, wait, use rage then attack? If so, are the durations going to increase? Is the global cool down going to replace the current cool down or just augment it?

As to character specifics, I have started playing my high level archer more lately and I believe they will suffer the most. The archer class is designed to kill quickly and that damage output comes from fast skills. Killing quickly is not a luxury to archers, it is a necessity. They are not designed for drawn out fights, so their only survival chance is to eliminate the threat in a timely manner. Are you planning on reducing the mob armor/ hp to line up better with the new average player DPS?

And of course, two hand weapon skills ;) This change makes the 2hand skill correction even more important. I picked up the new Gem hammer to test, and it adds less to skills then Level 50 one hand weapons. Combine that with the new cool downs, and their benefit is almost entirely gone.

Now one thing I have not mentioned is the fun. I know there was a lot of complaining when the last re-balance happened that it would slow down the game and ruin the fun. That was clearly not the case, so I will reserve judgment on that until I see this in action.

[Justg]

So either we don't tell you what we have planned and surprise you with it (bad) or we tell you what is up so you know what is coming and can help us figure it out.

We would rather keep you informed, and we hang out with you guys here because we expect you to give us a good rational discussion. Don't hate on the idea of it, play it when it comes. And help us iterate on it until it fits with the overall game,

[Zeus]

So either we don't tell you what we have planned and surprise you with it (bad) or we tell you what is up so you know what is coming and can help us figure it out.

We would rather keep you informed, and we hang out with you guys here because we expect you to give us a good rational discussion. Don't hate on the idea of it, play it when it comes. And help us iterate on it until it fits with the overall game,


Can you give us in depth and detail description for the update? Would be greatly appreciated and might be the solution to calm panicking players right now. Thanks G :), Have a Good One.

[Physiologic]

Much appreciated for keeping us informed. This is just a big change to the system so who wouldn't expect initial shocks? :) Anyway I hope we can see this soon so we can provide better feedback from empirical and experimental observations.

[Lesrider]

So either we don't tell you what we have planned and surprise you with it (bad) or we tell you what is up so you know what is coming and can help us figure it out.

We would rather keep you informed, and we hang out with you guys here because we expect you to give us a good rational discussion. Don't hate on the idea of it, play it when it comes. And help us iterate on it until it fits with the overall game,

Sounds like you just intended this to be a heads up, and have us discuss it when it's implemented? Without more information, I don't see what kind of discussion you would expect other than what's been said here. If that's the case, it's fine. But it sounded like you WANTED us to discuss it.

[Ellyidol]

So either we don't tell you what we have planned and surprise you with it (bad) or we tell you what is up so you know what is coming and can help us figure it out.

We would rather keep you informed, and we hang out with you guys here because we expect you to give us a good rational discussion. Don't hate on the idea of it, play it when it comes. And help us iterate on it until it fits with the overall game,

Not what I meant G, sorry if it was misleading. Again I'm not being ungrateful for the information, in fact, I am happy that you let us know.

Best to probably, as you said, just give it a try and let you know. :)

[FluffNStuff]

Can you give us a general idea of what kind of delay you are thinking? We were just discussing in chat that if you are talking about a .5 second delay, then that would make a lot of sense. It is long enough to stop the 'fire em all at once' skill spamming, but short enough to let the game keep its flow in PVE.

[DanielRH]

I like the idea for PVP cause right now it's just a tapping speed race.

But I do NOT like the idea for PVE, it would make the time per run alot more and would most probably mess up alot of the characters main points (healing for mages and so on...)

[Necrobane]

LOVE! I have been asking for this for ages and am extremely happen to see it finally happening, although wouldn't it be kinda wrong having such short cooldowns on spell? I mean it means that you revolve around like 3 spells, the rest of the time is global cooldown. I reckon if you do it right people will come up with rotations ect, now THAT would be good. :)

[superglut2]

Increase skill damage on some spell in pve and it would work.

[Royce]

I can't really even form an opinion on this without some sort of general approximation of the length of this global cooldown. Certainly it will affect archers (already the best PvP class) least and affect bears and mages more dramatically, but in general I am not opposed to the idea as long as the cooldown is pretty short. For instance, as a mage, I like to try to heal every 3 seconds. If there is a 2 secod global cooldown, I would have to quit healing or never do anything else. It seems like very short cooldown skills like heal should perhaps be made stronger and with a longer cooldown for this to work. But again it's hard to say, not knowing a ballpark figure for the length.

[Tsarra]

I was going to get all kinds of indignant on this thread, too...but if the change is needed, it's needed. I'll tell you guys right now that any more than a quarter-second delay would pretty much kill solo PvE; I realize I'm hugely in the minority here, but I speak for (probably) all 7 or 8 of us when I say that solo PvE is slow enough.

Mob health reductions across the board to account for the slower kill speeds? It sounds as though this change is being made to mitigate user hardware/lag issues more than anything, so keeping everything fair across the board might not be a bad idea.

And fix crafting, please! (I realize this is neither here nor there, but since you're all reading...)

[Kindread]

I love the idea and I think you guys are being a little dramatic. They're trying to stop the one action kill with a slight global cooldown. It will only take the briefest if delays to stop a one action kill on an iPad or whatever. Im level 56 now and my inspect page is hidden but if you could see it, it would show 0 arena battles. I came from WoW PvP and then text MUD PvP (which is really fun) and the idea of one hit kills or the iPad one button kill did not interest me at all. Without having ever tried PvP, I always assumed it was all about who knew their range the best and could fire their super secret one hit kill first. Not too interested. Now that I know I'm not at a super disadvantage for not having a iPad, I might let y'all pad your kill ratios with this PL PvP noob. :)

[rocket]

I am not sure what to make of this change without some more details on how exactly it will be implemented. A 0.1 sec delay would not be that bad, but if it is closer to 1 sec it will likely adversely effect PVE.

If this is mainly being implemented for PVP purposes, I would suggest a simpler solution. Just double each players hitpoints on PVP maps. (Can be implemented as an automatic elixir when joining a PVP map.) No more oneshot kills and then the natural cool down for each skill will come into play. No adverse effects on PVE play.

If a global cooldown is implemented, then I suggest that the skill cooldown times be reduced by the amount of the global cooldown.

[Luchta]

The only question I've got is since I've never played on a ping lower than 280 (that's the best I can get), will this have a significant change effect or this will be like everyone will have the same ping/delay as I have? If it's the latter, then that would be awesome.

I play at an average of 415 ping. Yes I'm jealous of people who can get anything lower than 200. I've tried it and the difference is astronomical.


If a global cooldown is implemented, then I suggest that the skill cooldown times be reduced by the amount of the global cooldown.

I'm not sure if I got it right as well. But global c/d is when you can't press 2 skills simultaneously. It's like counting with your fingers by two's and by one's. Counting by two's will be some sort of trial and error.

GC-D to me is like any or most MMO games. You can't press skill 1&2 at the same time of the fraction of amount of time. The theory behind it with pc games is already evident in some videos posted here and on youtube. In PC games, you press skill 1 first then repeatedly press skill 2 to catch up with the GC-D. So it won't make any difference in game play the way I see it.

[MoarPewPew]

Omg!!! I have been wanting this forever!!!

This will be a great addition to the game because players will need to use more "skill" in picking the right moved to use in a certain situation.

Also now we can create skill rotations. (If you don't know what that is you figure out what moves maximize your dps and what order to use them)

I have a question.


Will combos still work? And will you have to adjust the duration of debuffs so we can pull the combo off?

[Riccits]

iam really concerned about this change... often are 10 ore more skills lounched to kill a whole crowd.. and now we should wait...? just for not may lagging..? this wont help anything... and 1 noob in a party may could ruin all...?
we really need more infos about its working... we all usually use a lot the skills, and i can immagine its frustrating press skills button 10x and nothing happens... :-/
why new useless stange nerfs when game is fine atm...? when theres a reason to make some balacing in pvp ok, but let pve how it is pls..

[Echelong]

So either we don't tell you what we have planned and surprise you with it (bad) or we tell you what is up so you know what is coming and can help us figure it out.

We would rather keep you informed, and we hang out with you guys here because we expect you to give us a good rational discussion. Don't hate on the idea of it, play it when it comes. And help us iterate on it until it fits with the overall game,

You made a good point as I would like you (STS) to keep us informed. Its hard to give feedback when only general information has been given. I've had bad experience with global cooldowns on WoW when they gave shamans (class that has been nerfed over and over since the start) on our Shock spells and made 2 of them practically useless.

I would like to know about how long is the global cooldown? 1/10 of a sec or more? What about your testing; how long have dungeon runs on average been with or without the cooldown? I think this is the most discussed aspect and what have gamers worried the most.

It would be a big problem if the global CD made runs much longer or made combat to hard for casual gamers. Please provide us with some feedback of your testing on these aspects.

[noneo]

I personally have only really experienced noticable lag since the new alien oasis town was released. (using Samsung Fascinata - Galaxy S) Whats going to happen when you are in battle, and got critically hit and need to quick hit your heal, drain life, and mana shield to get you back up to full health? Are we going to just have to spend a ton more on potions and the like?

Also, how is reducing the amount of damage we do in PVE in any way better? That just doesn't make any sense.

I definitely think a poll needs to be created.

[adwin]

My opinion is the same as most of the other ppl who have bothered with a feedback.
If PvP is "flawed", fix pvp. The current system works very well for PvE, so why change something that just works?
It's like the BIOS in a computer. If it works, don't touch it.
You could also enable the cooldown in pvp games only, but leave it as is in pve.

Can you tell us more about combos then? Some skills DO require a very small cooldown before it's successfully initiated.
For instance, cruel blast combo. You should take human reaction/reflex time into consideration as well.

On a side not, IF this cooldown were in the milliseconds range (for example, 300ms-400ms), this could be a good thing, since it would prevent button mashing.
BUT
Sometimes, unleashing one skill after another is crucial for survival. For example, while being surrounded by a big mob. There are a lot of areas in PL where that can happen.
Soloing maps would suffer even more so from this global cooldown.

Devs are NOT end users, and are most certainly biased.
What you CAN do: create a test map (this is an idea for the future as well), where ppl can join and test your WIP.
This could connect to a specified backend/server, with the additional settings in place.
THEN gather feedback and make a decision.

AND/OR

you could also make a poll. Although it would be kindda hard to express an opinion without a hands-on.

OR

make the change for a brief testing window - for example, 2 days and gather feedback.


>EDIT< updated post:

1 VERY IMPORTANT thing:
There should be an exclusion regarding self buffs - talking especially from a bird's POV. Focus and Escape should be excluded from the global cooldown. These have enough of their own as it is now.

2: I'm thinking, that only damage-dealing skills should be GC'd. Debuffs *should* be excluded as well.

[Luchta]

When I used to play MMO, I remember it clearly that global cool-down doesn't actually mean you need to press it repeatedly make the skill cast right after cool-down. I know a lot of people tap like crazy as if playing galaga on a family computer. Once you press it and it's passed the cool-down, it will register and i'm sorry to say, if you pressed skill #3 first instead of skill #2, you either die or fail a combo. In other MMO games, you even have to wait for the first spell/skill to finish casting together with it's designated "animation". That's just basic global cool-down the way I see it and it's still used today.

In other words, you could still tap like an idiot or learn how to wait for the skills to register/shoot. So it's up to the devs whether they plan to set it as animation based cool-down (which is unlikely) or maybe a few nano seconds delay from which a skill registers itself (most likely) the moment it's pressed.

Also, if you can add the condition if {account=lag} then {cooldown=0};

[Justg]

I'll let Cinco talk more about the specifics, but my understanding is the design team is looking at around a .5 second cool-down. One effect of this is that usage of skills will become more of a rhythmic nature (2-ish every second-ish) as opposed to spammy button-mashing.

Thanks for the Thread Cool Down in tone, it really is beneficial for us to talk about this with you in a level fashion, and you guys should know by now we are here with you to work together and make this game as great as it can be. We'll be tweaking things all up and down the DPS >>> Mob HP chain to make this feel fantastic.

- g

[skimmey]

He's good at getting free kills and multitouching though
Any proofs?
Damn i dont get why u have to be that kind of a sore loser :/
I always play it fair unlike u who rushes in a friendly 1/1 like a kill addict.

[Echelong]

I'll let Cinco talk more about the specifics, but my understanding is the design team is looking at around a .5 second cool-down. One effect of this is that usage of skills will become more of a rhythmic nature (2-ish every second-ish) as opposed to spammy button-mashing.

Thanks for the Thread Cool Down in tone, it really is beneficial for us to talk about this with you in a level fashion, and you guys should know by now we are here with you to work together and make this game as great as it can be. We'll be tweaking things all up and down the DPS >>> Mob HP chain to make this feel fantastic.

- g

Very kool G. .5 secs doesn't sound as bad and if you guys are willing to tweak dps or mob health to compensate for the global CD. If you get any data on the difference between runs with and without the CD would be great.

[Kindread]

Most awesome news! 0.5 secs is perfect. It's exactly how I play at the moment. I kind of develop a rhythm where I hit the skill then anticipate when it lights back up. After awhile you get a feel for how long each cooldown takes. Its always been one after the other. Ive never intentionally hit multiple skills at the same time playing on a 3GS. I've made it playing in PvE this way to 56 so don't worry about it destroying your PvE experience. You'll survive. :)

[FluffNStuff]

I'll let Cinco talk more about the specifics, but my understanding is the design team is looking at around a .5 second cool-down. One effect of this is that usage of skills will become more of a rhythmic nature (2-ish every second-ish) as opposed to spammy button-mashing.

Thanks for the Thread Cool Down in tone, it really is beneficial for us to talk about this with you in a level fashion, and you guys should know by now we are here with you to work together and make this game as great as it can be. We'll be tweaking things all up and down the DPS >>> Mob HP chain to make this feel fantastic.

- g

Reducing individual cool downs by the half second global cool down and increasing time to combo by a second should keep the over all dps the same. In fact, it could increase useful DPS, because with the spamming there is a lot of over killing.

[karmakali]

Not really sure how this will change combos. Ultimately I am a creature of habit and dislike change when it is presented. But....that being said- you guys have made alot of changes since I started playing and it has mostly all worked out for the positive. I'll take a wait and see attitude....but reserve the right to bi*** later ;)

[Ellyidol]

I'll let Cinco talk more about the specifics, but my understanding is the design team is looking at around a .5 second cool-down. One effect of this is that usage of skills will become more of a rhythmic nature (2-ish every second-ish) as opposed to spammy button-mashing.

Thanks for the Thread Cool Down in tone, it really is beneficial for us to talk about this with you in a level fashion, and you guys should know by now we are here with you to work together and make this game as great as it can be. We'll be tweaking things all up and down the DPS >>> Mob HP chain to make this feel fantastic.

- g

Sounds awesome. Now timing could come into play too.

Thanks very much for the detail. :)

[StompArtist]

Feel free to post your thoughts and questions in this thread. I hope to be able to answer some of them before the change is ready for release. (And, as always, entertaining predictions of doom, gloom and economic ruination are most definitely welcome :)

- Something tells me that there was a vote (likely at a Starbucks) on who the sacrificial lamb in STS would be and Cinco took the smallest straw. Glad you are settling in the new role. lol

[hawkei]

Folks, this is a necessary and beneficial change. You have not even played with it yet and are making sweeping generalizations. Give us your level opinions and help us tweak it when it goes in. We promise we will listen (as long as the feedback is rational) and we'll keep iterating on it until it feels right.

I'm not complaining I'm glad its not going to be 1 shot pvp anymore :D

[hawkei]

I'll let Cinco talk more about the specifics, but my understanding is the design team is looking at around a .5 second cool-down. One effect of this is that usage of skills will become more of a rhythmic nature (2-ish every second-ish) as opposed to spammy button-mashing.

Thanks for the Thread Cool Down in tone, it really is beneficial for us to talk about this with you in a level fashion, and you guys should know by now we are here with you to work together and make this game as great as it can be. We'll be tweaking things all up and down the DPS >>> Mob HP chain to make this feel fantastic.

- g
I hope you don't mean making the enemies with more hp:confused:

[BeardedBear]

I was initially excited when reading this, until I read some of the comments. I was under the impression it would nerf birds a bit, but when it comes to bears, they will be really nerfed now. It's hard enough to use bears at end game PVP, now it will be even harder.

Just a thought about cooldowns. Say it last 2-3 seconds or whatever between one skill and the next. We will find ourselves not able to use all of our skills in a row. For example; on a bear, you would initially beckon (and/or hellscream) and start raining down your slashes, then end with a stomp. The skill you use first would be up from cooldown before you use your last skill in your combo due to the wait time between skills, no?

[Luchta]

Hey more enemies is good isn't it. As long as the cruel blast can kill 30 of em. LOL!

[krazii]

Thanks for giving us a heads up before you do this and letting us voice our opinion. Most of how I feel is already been voiced and I agree that it's a little frustrating to see another nerf after the combat re-balance awhile ago where you came out and said you'd like to emphasize skill use. But until I use it, I really don't know. I do propose the following:

1. Implement this in PVP only at first. Give us a chance to go in there and experience it and then give you feedback before you implement it in PVE too.

2. Instead of a cool down between every skill use, how about implement it between the use of every two or three skills. That way we can fire off our combos a little better and the change likely won't feel as severe.

Thanks,

Kraz

[Moogerfooger]

Most awesome news! 0.5 secs is perfect. It's exactly how I play at the moment. I kind of develop a rhythm where I hit the skill then anticipate when it lights back up. After awhile you get a feel for how long each cooldown takes. Its always been one after the other. Ive never intentionally hit multiple skills at the same time playing on a 3GS. I've made it playing in PvE this way to 56 so don't worry about it destroying your PvE experience. You'll survive. :)

Many of us don't play this way, and have figured out specific rhythmic skill chains with the current skill cooldowns that work well for a given class, and there is a rhythm to it as well, no matter how fast it may look like sometimes. Just because you made it to 56 playing this way (congrats by the way), doesn't mean it is the best/only way for everyone and that rhythm can't be done the way it is right now...because it can.

That said, I will wait and see how tests/rollout goes.

[superglut2]

Many of us don't play this way, and have figured out specific quick skill chains with the current skill cooldowns that work well for a given class, and there is a rhythm to it as well, no matter how fast it may look like sometimes. Just because you made it to 56 playing this way (congrats by the way), doesn't mean it is the best/only way for everyone and that rhythm can't be done the way it is right now...because it can.

That said, I will wait and see how tests/rollout goes.

I do the same as morak. Im even fine with 1 sec. I have like a finger beat gong on with my birdie when i play pve :D would def be less lagg on my iphone, on ipad it doest bother me but on iphone its rly annoying sometumes.

[Djinn80]

I think this is a good mix. If its .25-.5 seconds between skills thats totally fine. I would argue/request for extended buff times (evade, focus, rage, etc) since fights will last longer. For example, my STR bird is who I'm most worried about. He has 12 seconds to kill an ememy or he's toast b/c the dodge buff will wear off. Not to mention he is being kited the whole time and hopes specifically to get close enough to fight.

If root spells landed more frequently (for some reason 100%+ hit misses 60% of the time - excluding dodge) it wouldn't be as big of a deal.

I do think a small cool down is good. Not many RPG games let you unleash 5 spells in a half second - no skill in that.

This will make all distance weapons more powerful (wands, bows, talons..) since its all about running and hitting people. Most likely this will make Dex Bears and mages a little more powerful. Mages mostly since they won't be one shotted anymore.

Overall I think its good and trust after a few days of it being live there will be enough suggestions on how to tweak it to perfection. Just let us buy Rose wands again for a day please :)

[Echelong]

Only thing I am thinking now is how this will affect debuffs and time it takes to clear dungeons. Increasing the time could mean people would use less debuffs and instead just use skills to kill.

An example on the enchantress is when I go into a group of mobs (normally rushing in) I will use lightning, my two debuffs, frost blast and fire blast normally and sometimes I would do Drain life first because of the cast time. With a .5 sec global CD would mean to chose between debuffs to kill faster.

G said they will be tweaking DPS and Mob health so I am just hoping they test all aspects of PVE. For PVP I think this will be a welcome change but they will have to tweak Pallys because fights could last for days with the new Fury change.


I think this is a good mix. If its .25-.5 seconds between skills thats totally fine. I would argue/request for extended buff times (evade, focus, rage, etc) since fights will last longer.

This is a good idea to make buffs and debuffs last longer with a longer cooldown of course +1

[Moogerfooger]

I think this is a good mix. If its .25-.5 seconds between skills thats totally fine. I would argue/request for extended buff times (evade, focus, rage, etc) since fights will last longer. For example, my STR bird is who I'm most worried about. He has 12 seconds to kill an ememy or he's toast b/c the dodge buff will wear off. Not to mention he is being kited the whole time and hopes specifically to get close enough to fight.

If root spells landed more frequently (for some reason 100%+ hit misses 60% of the time - excluding dodge) it wouldn't be as big of a deal.

I do think a small cool down is good. Not many RPG games let you unleash 5 spells in a half second - no skill in that.

This will make all distance weapons more powerful (wands, bows, talons..) since its all about running and hitting people. Most likely this will make Dex Bears and mages a little more powerful. Mages mostly since they won't be one shotted anymore.

Overall I think its good and trust after a few days of it being live there will be enough suggestions on how to tweak it to perfection. Just let us buy Rose wands again for a day please :)

Good points. Guess we will have to just wait and see.

[Lesrider]

I agree with what Fluff said about it seeming to go backwards (it was a long post, so sparing everyone by not quoting it). In this game, in the current state, auto-attack is not really effective at all, other than for birds. This game has become completely centered on the skills. If a cooldown is coming for the skills, then the weapons would need to be more effective. Also, this makes more sense maybe for bears and birds (they should be more weapon-based), but mages in all games have nothing but their spells. Perhaps a balance is needed to make bears and bird weapons more effective on their own, but allow mages to spam skills faster than bears and birds? I'm just throwing ideas out there, haven't really thought it all through. It just seems like an equal global cooldown for all classes would be very imbalanced.

Also, I don't know whether this is feasible for sometime down the line, but maybe make regular attacks more interesting, instead of this auto-attack? I played Braveheart, and you basically swipe your finger in a circular motion to get your sword spinning around you. That's how you attack. And then there are skills, which have a longer cooldown. Keep in mind, this is for a warrior class -- usually warriors don't rely much on skills/spells, they're more of an extra bonus.

I'm not saying you guys need to copy that exactly. I just think it could make it more interesting if there was more than just auto-attack. Then maybe the game would be less skill-based, and less laggy. or would that create its own lag. I dunno...

[Physiologic]

I'll let Cinco talk more about the specifics, but my understanding is the design team is looking at around a .5 second cool-down. One effect of this is that usage of skills will become more of a rhythmic nature (2-ish every second-ish) as opposed to spammy button-mashing.


Fluff and I were postulating how long the cool-down might be last night around midnight:

http://i54.tinypic.com/bf199l.jpg

:D

[superss]

cool i like the concept but i like to spam kill :( im okay with it though

[Riccits]

the bear standard bear tanking methods wont work so anymore.. after bear making the crowd u normally need to nuke em fast, if not they follow again bear or running around again... in a crowd everyone uses his skills, and when i cant use one bcz 4 others pressing like crazy skill buttons it ends in a chaos...
imagine ur behind the group have to clear 2-3 mobs somewhere and u cant use skills then bcz the rest of group is fighting somewhere else... u wont be able to defense urself... gah...

[Cmandial]

I would like to see around a 1/3 second oval cooldown because a .5 second cooldown would end up being slower than that because of the time skills take to actually activate after they have been pressed.

[wvhills]

I'm just one person but here's my opinion...
I'm still not sure I understand...does it mean that you have to wait a few seconds between using each skill? When running into a room I like to focus, evade, then root once I'm in, then shattering scream and blast shot for the combo. If its the boss then I'll throw a break armor in right before the combo. I try to do all this as fast as possible. If they change it so you have to wait then I really don't think I'll play anymore. I'm more of a casual player (about an hour a day) and it seems if they do this then it'll greatly increase the time it takes to clear a map. As a casual player the reason I play PL and not WoW is because I can have fun make progress by playing intermittently through the day. If this increases the time it takes to clear maps and consequently the time it takes to level up and use better gear, etc. then I won't be playing anymore.
I think spacetime needs to carefully consider who they're market is...is it the hardcore player or is it the casual player?

[BlazeMystic]

As a casual player – I have no idea about game mechanics at all and if I’ve understood correctly you will only be able to do one skill at a time and will have to wait for the cool down before doing another skill – my concerns are:
• The game may be very slow and boring and levels will take too long to complete. Arduous rather than fluid and rhythmic.
• Soloing (esp with int mage) will be impossible because she will die very quickly due to lack of speed of skill usage.
• Mage will be rubbish given the fact that she depends on skills to stay alive and only being able to pull off one skill at a time will surely mean she will die frequently. Either that or there will be a lot of running away.
• I can picture the scene that everyone will be demanding to be healed and revived - but instead they will have to wait in a queue like fashion because first the mage will busy trying to stay alive herself and casting each one of her skills in preferential order - depending on how nice that player is!

Like I said, I’m a casual player, so perhaps I’ve got it completely wrong and it will be all fine and dandy. If the devs feel the current system needs tweaking, then who am I to argue with. Great game though – perhaps too good! Lol.

[Echelong]

Maybe the global cooldown change could be applied to all attack/debuff skills and not to buffs and mages healing. This would help keeping the group alive.

[Tamino]

I am playing since a few months, but I feel a little worried about this change (one may argue that it is the most frequent reaction about incoming changes, and he was right).

I see only a few situations in which a "cluster" of skill should be casted in a short time, because my playing style (as an Archer) strongly relies on skills, so that I am shooting them as soon as they are available and the main issue is the skill-cooldown. For timed-combo, I already need to wait between the two skills for the combo to be effective, so again no problem.

But what about buffers? In mid-term battles, Focus and Evade effect vanishes, and I need to cast them again; this is a full second in which I cannot shoot attack skill (and in most cases, since weapon time is about 1.0, neither fire with main weapon). As a net effect, our DPS delivery will not be "continuous" as today, but like hiccups... It could be a nightmare to play....

[Kalielle]

I hope the delay won't be too long. I think it should be just enough to prevent people from firing several skills at once (because the game wasn't meant to be played tapping skills with 3 fingers). Or maybe implement a longer delay just for pvp. For pve I think having to wait would be frustrating.

As a mage I pride myself on healing quickly and timing it just right during difficult battles (as opposed to just spamming heal whether the party's health is down or not). I would hate it if I were saving my heal and watching my party's health bar so I can react instantly when needed, but then not be able to cast quickly because I happened to cast frostbite right before my party took damage.

[Lesrider]

I hope the delay won't be too long. I think it should be just enough to prevent people from firing several skills at once (because the game wasn't meant to be played tapping skills with 3 fingers). Or maybe implement a longer delay just for pvp. For pve I think having to wait would be frustrating.

As a mage I pride myself on healing quickly and timing it just right during difficult battles (as opposed to just spamming heal whether the party's health is down or not). I would hate it if I were saving my heal and watching my party's health bar so I can react instantly when needed, but then not be able to cast quickly because I happened to cast frostbite right before my party took damage.

I keep hearing this about people tapping multiple skills at once with multiple fingers. Are the iPad users doing this? Bc I'm on my iPhone, and I use only my thumbs to play. So I can't tap more than one skill at a time. If this is meant to stop people from tapping multiple skills at once, then maybe that ability alone can be removed? But regular gameplay using just your two thumbs shouldn't be affected by this.

[Echelong]

@ Kalielle: Cinco said it would be a .5 second delay and they will do tweaks to DPS and Mob health but like you I am worried about healing and buffs.

[Tsarra]

Thanks for the Thread Cool Down in tone, it really is beneficial for us to talk about this with you in a level fashion, and you guys should know by now we are here with you to work together and make this game as great as it can be. We'll be tweaking things all up and down the DPS >>> Mob HP chain to make this feel fantastic.

If it wasn't you guys doing this, I'd be really mad. :p You've taken great care of me and all of the friends I've made since I started playing, though, and you've all made it clear that the players are the most important part of PL. I have faith that you all will do this right.

A 1/2 second cool down seems a little long in the tooth, but I won't know more until I have a chance to test it and provide feedback. :)

Would it have been okay to leave PvP out of PL in the first place? It seems like a rather small piece of the game...and it's also seems to have really screwed up the balance. Any number of whiny threads about how bears are terrible and useless or how the devs want all birds to die will illustrate that point better than I ever could.

The most important piece to remember is that this is a mobile game, I would think; having said that, making the runs noticeably longer would not have a positive effect on the game at all. If mob health, DPS and the like are being rebalanced along with this (in order to maintain run times), then I'd probably be okay with this overall.

The last piece of this is muscle memory - namely, remembering how to deal with a room full of mobs by remembering where and when to press, rather than knowing what to press. People are going to be horrible playing their characters at first after this goes in...which I'm fine with. Puts us all back on the same page again. ;)


I'm just one person but here's my opinion...
I'm still not sure I understand...does it mean that you have to wait a few seconds between using each skill? When running into a room I like to focus, evade, then root once I'm in, then shattering scream and blast shot for the combo. If its the boss then I'll throw a break armor in right before the combo. I try to do all this as fast as possible. If they change it so you have to wait then I really don't think I'll play anymore. I'm more of a casual player (about an hour a day) and it seems if they do this then it'll greatly increase the time it takes to clear a map. As a casual player the reason I play PL and not WoW is because I can have fun make progress by playing intermittently through the day. If this increases the time it takes to clear maps and consequently the time it takes to level up and use better gear, etc. then I won't be playing anymore.
I think spacetime needs to carefully consider who they're market is...is it the hardcore player or is it the casual player?

Yeah...what he said.

[Kalielle]

Echelong, I think your idea is great that the delay should apply only to damage skills. That would still prevent one-shotting but would keep timed healing useful. It would also avoid the problem of a debuff running out before you get to cast the subsequent damage skill that the debuff was supposed to help with in the first place.

[hawkei]

Is there a given date to when this might happen?

[SamTheDog]

I've played PL about a year now and only just started playing WOW, so someone clear things up for me a little. I've noticed that there is already this kind of cool down with abilities in WOW. You hit skill and all the skills have a brief cool down where you can't do anything, and the one you hit has it's normal cool down. Was there this same kind of uproar in WOW? Doesn't seem to spell the end of the world there, isn't that what they are proposing here?

[Echelong]

Is there a given date to when this might happen?

No word yet.

[Echelong]

I've played PL about a year now and only just started playing WOW, so someone clear things up for me a little. I've noticed that there is already this kind of cool down with abilities in WOW. You hit skill and all the skills have a brief cool down where you can't do anything, and the one you hit has it's normal cool down. Was there this same kind of uproar in WOW? Doesn't seem to spell the end of the world there, isn't that what they are proposing here?

There aren't many global cooldowns on WoW at least from what I remember form 6 years ago. Only the shock spells on the Shamans. The global cooldown means that you can't cast any skill for .5 seconds after you casted one.

[IamBored]

Just wondering if they make the mobs have more HP so mobs don't die on the first set of combo would people complain? If they increase the mobs hp, it could mean 2x the time it took us to clear now. If they put in the global cool down, it could also mean 2x the time to clear but it would help with the server performance while the 2x hp does not. I believe most spells in WOW has a cool down meaning heal take 3 seconds to cast while in PL everything is instant.

[Echelong]

Just wondering if they make the mobs have more HP so mobs don't die on the first set of combo would people complain? If they increase the mobs hp, it could mean 2x the time it took us to clear now. If they put in the global cool down, it could also mean 2x the time to clear but it would help with the server performance while the 2x hp does not. I believe most spells in WOW has a cool down meaning heal take 3 seconds to cast while in PL everything is instant.

That is called cast time not a cooldown. Cooldown is the time in between casts. I don't think they will increase Mob health is anything diminish it a bit or add more dps.

[Kindread]

Trust me, you guys should just wait and give it a go before freaking out too much. Most games have this gcd to prevent the ability to fire simultaneous skills. You'll still be fast, you just won't be able to fire all at once. If you study music or play, it's sort of like that. Count off one-two-One, two-two-One, three-two-One, etc. Fire your skill, count the one-two and thats your half second. It's not that long to where it would delay PvE by double or triple the time to clear a map and it'll make PvP alot more interesting.

[Luchta]

Most like you can't queue your shots by tapping too fast. Everything will be uniform the way the client is supposed to handle the skills. So yeah, I agree with the others saying it would take more skills now.

But I'd like to be one to see the duel between the two. I'll bet 100k.

[Sun]

WoW has a global cooldown of 1.5 seconds. This has always been the case, since the beginning. A global cooldown means you have to know the right time to use the right skill, because you can't just use them all at once as you can now in PL. There would be 100x more of an uproar if the GCD were removed, because it would just mean whoever could push their burst dps buttons faster would win, aka no skill at all.

[evelo2]

How about a trade off, reduction in actual skill cool down?

[evelo2]

Folks, this is a necessary and beneficial change. You have not even played with it yet and are making sweeping generalizations. Give us your level opinions and help us tweak it when it goes in. We promise we will listen (as long as the feedback is rational) and we'll keep iterating on it until it feels right.

Sorry Justg,

Why is it necessary?
I play in full groups with all hell breaking loose, and if there is the odd lag spike, I don't care.

But if I find myself spending another 10mins killing that keeper, or if this becomes less fun, then believe me I do.

I think you are in the business of retaining paying customers ( I spend a fair bit ).
So I would seriously consider listening.
People do not pick up on a thread with this much negative feeling without reason.

The increase in XP as part of the last release, has for many of us working people with families ( AND MONEY )
turned this game into a grind fest.
Don't make grinding a chore now.

The customer is always right?

Perhaps it is time to consider a pre-release server, one where people can pop on and try these changes?

[Moogerfooger]

There would be 100x more of an uproar if the GCD were removed, because it would just mean whoever could push their burst dps buttons faster would win, aka no skill at all.

Good points....but I could say that knowing which buttons to hit quickly in a certain order to maximize damage/healing/buffs/debuffs/whatever also takes skill and game play knowledge and dexterity to execute right, especially when taking individual skill cooldowns into effect.

I see your intended point and agree with the majority of your post, but to say it takes no skill at all is false; a player who knows quick patterns/combos/timing - in ANY game - will smoke a random button masher 100 times out of 100.

Whoever suggested a pre-release/preview server, even if just for a few players (the Guardians?) to scope out and get pre-release feedback, was a good idea.

[Moogerfooger]

Trust me, you guys should just wait and give it a go before freaking out too much. Most games have this gcd to prevent the ability to fire simultaneous skills. You'll still be fast, you just won't be able to fire all at once. If you study music or play, it's sort of like that. Count off one-two-One, two-two-One, three-two-One, etc. Fire your skill, count the one-two and thats your half second. It's not that long to where it would delay PvE by double or triple the time to clear a map and it'll make PvP alot more interesting.

I'm a musician...i apparently like speed metal and you like slow jazz in the way we play :p

[Kindread]

Blues man! It's all about the blues. I even make scrunchy faces when I'm killing mobs.

[Frenzyn]

I love you guys.

[Moogerfooger]

Blues man! It's all about the blues. I even make scrunchy faces when I'm killing mobs.

Nice. Scrunchyface is now how I will refer to you, if I run across you :p I dig blues as well.

/threadhijackover

[adwin]

Like I already mentioned in my post, I was thinking about 0.3s-0.4s, but up to 0.5 should, in theory, be fine.


1 VERY IMPORTANT thing:
There should be an exclusion regarding self buffs - talking especially from a bird's POV. Focus and Escape should be excluded from the global cooldown. These have enough of their own as it is now.

2: I'm thinking, that only damage-dealing skills should be GC'd. Debuffs *should* be excluded as well.


All in all, I'm *carefully* up for the GC, but it has to be thoroughly tested and implemented.
I don't do speed metal ;]
AND
instead of senselessly button mash, ppl should UNDERSTAND what they're doing. Then again, everyone has a different definition of "fun". Some don't care about technicals and style, they get off by just playing and killing off.

It's impossible to please everyone, which is why this has to be implemented (if it comes to this), in a graceful manner.
*cue* transition melody.

[Uimacaz]

I, personally, vote No on this.

Being able to quickly kill enemies as an archer is the only way to survive with the incredibly low armor and dodge with the new Sewer gear.

For PvP it makes complete sense... But depending on the length of time we are talking about here for a cool down, I think there needs to be more worked out and changed if this is implemented. Just a split second so that you have to press each skill individually would be fine. One of the things I enjoy about Pocket Legends is the fast paced fighting. You have to know what you are doing and act quickly to survive and be a true benefit to your team. I'm not sure I would experience the same level of fun if the pace of the game was slowed down significantly.

For those experiencing lag from spell/skill spamming - turning on Pixel Double in the Options screen helps a lot, especially in The Catacombs and Roach Motel. (The enemy mobs create much more lag than a group of players ever could here.)

- Adam

[Frenzyn]

I, personally, vote No on this.

Being able to quickly kill enemies as an archer is the only way to survive with the incredibly low armor and dodge with the new Sewer gear.

For PvP it makes complete sense... But depending on the length of time we are talking about here for a cool down, I think there needs to be more worked out and changed if this is implemented. Just a split second so that you have to press each skill individually would be fine. One of the things I enjoy about Pocket Legends is the fast paced fighting. You have to know what you are doing and act quickly to survive and be a true benefit to your team. I'm not sure I would experience the same level of fun if the pace of the game was slowed down significantly.

For those experiencing lag from spell/skill spamming - turning on Pixel Double in the Options screen helps a lot, especially in The Catacombs and Roach Motel. (The enemy mobs create much more lag than a group of players ever could here.)

- Adam


Well, To be honest pvp would be much better, and pve might get a hit, but then again it might be a bit better.

I am only concerned about combos, how are combos affected if you cant do 2 skills in a row without a 2 sec cooldown?
Also in my opinion skill spamming can save ur life at times, so i hope they implement a system where u can
do an avian scream and blast shot at the same time, for they are different things.

I personally think you guys should definitely up the bars on ranger health if you do this, to atleast 650...
Its incredibly unfair making the ranger the one known for low armour but high numbers in hit, when you take the hit away, it might just become "the ranger"...
This would help my managing for not wasting 90% of my mana in 2 seconds tho, so i applaud you for taking away my urges and saving me cash. :)

-Spencer

[rocket]

Fine tuning PVP (5-30% of total players?) at the expense of rebalancing PVE seems counterproductive to me.

As far as client side performance goes, phones just keep getting faster and faster. A lot of those with iphone 3s will probably be upgrading to iphone 5s this year. I have a feeling that a lot of the lag people experience is due to a poor data connection, which this change will not affect.

Comparisons to WOW are interesting but not that helpful because the two games are designed completely differently. WOW was designed from the start with casting times taken into consideration. PL was not, you have always been able to instantly cast another spell. Changing it now, will require rebalancing.

[bravemenrun]

Not sure how I feel. For PVE, .5 secs may hardly be noticable, so if it helps the server load, it may indeed be a good thing. But if it is noticable, it might ruin my game. i hate waiting, i like feeling like I have to work fast, bam bam heal bam! I wish you guys had a beta server for us to test on. But I suppose if there's a huge recall effort by players, you could always roll it back or tweak the cool down time at a later date.

[Mikeylito]

Ughhh if my run to level 56 drags on any longer i just might end up quiting. Also why change pvp? Its fun snd entertaining. Dont change it!! People just need to practice. A lil cooldown Wont make them better. I do believe u should make it so you cant smash the buttons all at once.....one after another real fast is fine. So implement that but cmon a skill cooldown would ruin what i love best about this game.... And that is that its fast paced!!!!

[Kindread]

Ughhh if my run to level 56 drags on any longer i just might end up quiting. Also why change pvp? Its fun snd entertaining. Dont change it!! People just need to practice. A lil cooldown Wont make them better. I do believe u should make it so you cant smash the buttons all at once.....one after another real fast is fine. So implement that but cmon a skill cooldown would ruin what i love best about this game.... And that is that its fast paced!!!!

What you're asking for is exactly what they're doing.

[noobmigo]

I've thought about a system, and after heavy thinking, I have decided on something.
I would ONLY vote YES if the conditions are sort of like these.

1. Global Cooldown is 0.5-1.5 seconds
2. Current skill after use Cooldown stays the same.
3. The "Combo Timer" is extended to 3-4 seconds instead of 2
4. PvE is not affected. Or armor goes up. Way up
5. Skill Damage goes...up
6. Buffs are not affected. Nor is heal.
7. Bears get a new combo ;)

And those are my conditions.

[noobmigo]

Ughhh if my run to level 56 drags on any longer i just might end up quiting. Also why change pvp? Its fun snd entertaining. Dont change it!! People just need to practice. A lil cooldown Wont make them better. I do believe u should make it so you cant smash the buttons all at once.....one after another real fast is fine. So implement that but cmon a skill cooldown would ruin what i love best about this game.... And that is that its fast paced!!!!

I laughed. My friend, you are arguing with yourself.

[Kossi]

I've thought about a system, and after heavy thinking, I have decided on something.
I would ONLY vote YES if the conditions are sort of like these.

1. Global Cooldown is 0.5-1.5 seconds
2. Current skill after use Cooldown stays the same.
3. The "Combo Timer" is extended to 3-4 seconds instead of 2
4. PvE is not affected. Or armor goes up. Way up
5. Skill Damage goes...up
6. Buffs are not affected. Nor is heal.
7. Bears get a new combo ;)

And those are my conditions.

and there must be a drastic m/s increase for all levels

[Zeus]

and there must be a drastic m/s increase for all levels

Yea.... Paladins with 30 ms or pure int elfs with 47 ms doesn't sound too good to me. Without burst dps, we wouldn't be able to drain their mana.

[adwin]

I've tried simulating a 0.5s gc in a few runs today.
This *could*, probably, work in areas of low mob concentration and low threat level, but definitely not in an area of high mob concentration/high threat.

Which brings me to believe, that this would probably work only for pvp.

[Lesrider]

What you're asking for is exactly what they're doing.

If that were the case, they would just make it impossible to use more than one skill at the SAME time. But they're not doing that. They're creating a cooldown that prevents you from spamming skills one after another. So they're not doing what he's asking for.

[Kindread]

It's the same thing. The only question is how short to make the cooldown.

[Lesrider]

It's the same thing. The only question is how short to make the cooldown.

No, not the same thing.
Many of us can't use more than one skill at once anyway, bc we're only using our two thumbs to play! Adding a cooldown for everyone between skills is not the same as just preventing the few (or many? I dunno.) who are using multiple fingers from tapping multiple skills at once.

[Pharcyde]

I've tried simulating a 0.5s gc in a few runs today.
This *could*, probably, work in areas of low mob concentration and low threat level, but definitely not in an area of high mob concentration/high threat.

Which brings me to believe, that this would probably work only for pvp.

I know exactly what you mean, I just ran through a map while simulating a cool down time, and it was really really annoying. I think that they will either need to 1.) significantly increase damage or 2.) Group cool downs.

What I mean by group cool downs is a mage can heal AND cast a damage spell WITHOUT the cooldown. Because mages taking aggro will be basically healing the whole time and casting zero damage.


Yea.... Paladins with 30 ms or pure int elfs with 47 ms doesn't sound too good to me. Without burst dps, we wouldn't be able to drain their mana.

That is why they are considering adjusting damage accordingly. Slower spells and higher damage will mean a zestier PvP, where order of spells and combos actually really matter and not just finger speed.


It's the same thing. The only question is how short to make the cooldown.

Which will be tested. The devs are playing the maps themselves, trying to see what is enjoyable and what is not. I have a feeling they will be adjusting the cool down time a lot after it is officially released, since the real answer to that question lays within the reaction of every PL player that plays the new system.

[Riccits]

I've tried simulating a 0.5s gc in a few runs today.
This *could*, probably, work in areas of low mob concentration and low threat level, but definitely not in an area of high mob concentration/high threat.

Which brings me to believe, that this would probably work only for pvp.

u just test ur personal cooldown, not of the whole group. after 0.5s only 1 of 5 can use a skill what iam unterstanding here.. so practically in average u can use a skill every 2,5sec.

[Luchta]

Riccits, it's a client based cool-down. So it's an individual cooldown per skill, not the whole group.

[Riccits]

Riccits, it's a client based cool-down. So it's an individual cooldown per skill, not the whole group.
why they call it "gobal cool down"? so its a block of my personal skills only? anyway .5 is too much... 0,1-0,2 is mor than enough

[Luchta]

The reason they call it global is because all clients (phones/tablets running pocket legends) will have this cool-down rule/policy in their skills with no exception.

To the devs: Did you also put a cool-down in the emoticons? Now I can't laugh continuously or enter a text message then do an emoticon.

[Waterserenity]

Awww what about Combos, will the cool down affect them in any way?
Also for potion cool down, noooo... don't please, even when you spam health pots and health skills you STILL get mob'd down.
Leave the pots how they are, they're great.

Then at least for warriors and mages give us a significant damage increase, cuz still less lag but we more or less balance out?fair enough?

[davidis57]

If buffs and combos are affected this will not be a good thing unless there were macros or single button combo skills. There is already a delay to make combo hits. Anymore of a delay would kill a combo from a successful hit.

[Necrobane]

Just wondering, how long is the break while waiting for damage spells to come off coold own on average for each class? I like the global cool down cos it will mean your constantly hitting ablities, no unnatural breaks after spamming your combo although I really do think that abilities will need longer cool downs since otherwise you'll constantly have a whole heap of abilities ready to use because your using others whenever the global cool down allows you to.

[krazii]

Folks, this is a necessary and beneficial change. You have not even played with it yet and are making sweeping generalizations. Give us your level opinions and help us tweak it when it goes in. We promise we will listen (as long as the feedback is rational) and we'll keep iterating on it until it feels right.

JustG,

Could you please provide more specifics as to why this is a "necessary" change and how it's a "beneficial change". To the layperson, it seems like things are working fine now and this is just another nerf that will result in slower gameplay and longer levels. The only thing I've read regarding a benefit is the performance of the "client side" of things but I really don't see any threads of complaints about the performance of "client" side of things. What is broken that needs to be fixed? I'm not criticizing, I'm just curious.

Thanks,

Kraz

[Zerious]

I'll let Cinco talk more about the specifics, but my understanding is the design team is looking at around a .5 second cool-down. One effect of this is that usage of skills will become more of a rhythmic nature (2-ish every second-ish) as opposed to spammy button-mashing.

Thanks for the Thread Cool Down in tone, it really is beneficial for us to talk about this with you in a level fashion, and you guys should know by now we are here with you to work together and make this game as great as it can be. We'll be tweaking things all up and down the DPS >>> Mob HP chain to make this feel fantastic.

- g

Ohhh... I get it now. So it's an individually based spacer? Like there are the cooldowns for each skill, along with a skill execution cooldown? Like potions then. This makes way more sense and I love the sound of this :D I was totally worried there lol. This means I'll play better while listening to music! :o

[jiroununu]

I support this change because 1: if that really will minimise the lag problem (i've never played this game under 300 ping and im from syndey), it will be great for this WORLDWIDE game.

2: With this change, there will require more tatics and skills in dungeon. I can imagine the must exist of a tank(bear), mage transfer from nuke into more concentrate on heal and archer should be the best DPSer.

And i don't see how this gonna delay the time we clear mobs. for a standard group example, 1 bear, 2 mages and 2 birds. Bear run into first taunt,beckon,hellscream and stomp,that all will cost 2secs(assuming 0.5 GCD), bird run in put thorn wall,shatter scream,blast shot,that all will cost 2-2.5secs(0.5-1secs spent on catching up with bear), and 1mage run in put lightning icenova and firestorm while the other mage run in put weakness lightning and heal or damage depends on situation.
The whole attack combo will cost 2-2.5secs in total and that will wipe out at least 10 groups on mobs for sure.
If everyone in group cooperate well and cast the right skills in the right time in stead of spamming, there shouldn't be a delay in clearing mobs at all. The only siganificant change i can imagine is the introduction of a bear existance. Yes, MMORPG need a tank and a tank is a must have, but PL doesn't get that point well in the past.

For the boss fight, yes, it will be delayed quite a bit and more importantly, bear will lose aggro control for sure unless only bear put a damage pot on him.
DEVS need to make bear skills generate aggro, ie: beckon can generate extra aggro, taunt will work 100% if it didn't miss, dodge the target and make one of the slash has a chance to taunt target.

Any way, nice change and this game is more and more like WOW i hope it won't go too far and lost its oringinal idea: POCKET!

[Slush]

this=fail.

[giayuan]

IMO, this update will be extremely major and will impact the whole game. New pvp strategies must be made and pve will just be different all over. And NO to cooldown for pots.

[Pokechmp]

This means that you will no longer be able to execute all of your skills at exactly the same time. (i.e. no more "Skill Spamming") All of your characters' skills will have a brief cool-down period after any skill is executed.

Won't that make playing a bit harder? Like what if I wanted to use nightmare and weakness at the same time?

[Pharcyde]

Won't that make playing a bit harder? Like what if I wanted to use nightmare and weakness at the same time?

That is part of the debate here.

They will adjust accordingly so that the game is still enjoyable and not too hard.

[Uimacaz]

Now that I see an estimated time of cool-down that you're testing, 0.50 seconds, it sounds fine. I was thinking the cool down would be at least a full second.

- Adam

[kobebean]

Major dislike. That's going to throw off all our combos....and also wreck about a billion twinking builds people have built over time. Unless you're going to give us plat/free respecs....

[Echelong]

Major dislike. That's going to throw off all our combos....and also wreck about a billion twinking builds people have built over time. Unless you're going to give us plat/free respecs....

No necessary. They will tweak DPS and mob health to compensate. They are testing this atm and after they apply it we are going to test it and give our opinions. It is a .5 sec which can be a lot but if they do the right amount of tweaks it may be worth it. Also make PVP more challenging since right now all it takes is who mashes the combos faster (iPads almost always will win). I just hope they don't give the global cooldown to buffs and healing spells. This could be bad for all classes.

[kobebean]

Still changes strategy in PVP by... a lot. Especially for counter-warbird, counter-int mage, and anything designed to actually withstand the nuking....My god, Deronwilliams is going to be useless. I would want free respecs at least.

[Echelong]

Still changes strategy in PVP by... a lot. Especially for counter-warbird, counter-int mage, and anything designed to actually withstand the nuking....My god, Deronwilliams is going to be useless. I would want free respecs at least.

I think this is one of the main reasons for this change. You will still be able to nuke just not in less than 1 sec.

[WhoIsThis]

Part of being a good player is being able to react fast. I strongly disagree with this respec and feel that this will lead to a deskilling in this aspect of the game.

[kobebean]

I think this is one of the main reasons for this change. You will still be able to nuke just not in less than 1 sec.

I meant as in my characters are all designed to withstand the nuke...built to stop it....and now anyone will be able to....waste of design.

[Pharcyde]

I just like the idea because it will remove lag. Guys, I have a feeling that things will be better after this. They will most likely beef up skills damage to compensate for the spell timing.

So there are 12 spells, at 0.5 seconds cool down per spell, you can cast the entire spell book in 6 seconds. So you can cast 120 spells a minute, and 600 spells in 5 minutes. That still seems plenty powerful to me.

Also people are not considering the other variables involved in this. - Players normally don't cast spells while they run, and large portions of the dungeon is running. Then the other variable is the time it takes to tap a spell, lift and move your finger to another spell, and tap it. It will still be a little bit of wait since it doesn't take 0.5 seconds of a second to move a finger, but you wont be actually waiting 0.5 since there is a small delay in finger movement.

[adwin]

I support this change because 1: if that really will minimise the lag problem (i've never played this game under 300 ping and im from syndey), it will be great for this WORLDWIDE game.

2: With this change, there will require more tatics and skills in dungeon. I can imagine the must exist of a tank(bear), mage transfer from nuke into more concentrate on heal and archer should be the best DPSer.

And i don't see how this gonna delay the time we clear mobs. for a standard group example, 1 bear, 2 mages and 2 birds. Bear run into first taunt,beckon,hellscream and stomp,that all will cost 2secs(assuming 0.5 GCD), bird run in put thorn wall,shatter scream,blast shot,that all will cost 2-2.5secs(0.5-1secs spent on catching up with bear), and 1mage run in put lightning icenova and firestorm while the other mage run in put weakness lightning and heal or damage depends on situation.
The whole attack combo will cost 2-2.5secs in total and that will wipe out at least 10 groups on mobs for sure.
If everyone in group cooperate well and cast the right skills in the right time in stead of spamming, there shouldn't be a delay in clearing mobs at all. The only siganificant change i can imagine is the introduction of a bear existance. Yes, MMORPG need a tank and a tank is a must have, but PL doesn't get that point well in the past.



1: my ping is 50-200 - usually ~120
2: what you're depicting is very nice, albeit in theory only. The only situations this would work, is that you would be playing only with teammates you know, and each one of them knows each other's tactics. Which means, that you would barely be able to play in pub games.




So there are 12 spells, at 0.5 seconds cool down per spell, you can cast the entire spell book in 6 seconds. So you can cast 120 spells a minute, and 600 spells in 5 minutes. That still seems plenty powerful to me.

Also people are not considering the other variables involved in this. - Players normally don't cast spells while they run, and large portions of the dungeon is running. Then the other variable is the time it takes to tap a spell, lift and move your finger to another spell, and tap it. It will still be a little bit of wait since it doesn't take 0.5 seconds of a second to move a finger, but you wont be actually waiting 0.5 since there is a small delay in finger movement.

1: remember that players usually have self-buffs and debuffs, and these need to be on most of the time, which actually reduces your spellbook to ~8 spells, which in turn, reduces your window of opportunity.
2: I'm not writing about button mashing, but in certain situations, you really need to tap fast (stronghold, swill, roach). Believe me, reaction times are less than 0.5s in these cases.
Here's some reading regarding the matter: http://www.humanbenchmark.com/tests/reactiontime/stats.php
you can test yourself here: http://www.humanbenchmark.com/tests/reactiontime/index.php

In which case, if your reaction is a combo, this means that 0.2s is actually for your combo, not 1 press.

In that case, the GC should NOT BE MORE than 0.2s.

[davidis57]

Make buffs last longer especially self buffs. constant self buffing is a pain.

[Pharcyde]

I have a feeling the devs will make some sort of system for buffs/debuffs and healing. These should not be restricted, since often are needed on a moments notice. Gold Fever is a must for instant spells, because when a pure int mage gets the fever, the mage needs to BOV and MS up or else they get one shotted.

[Kossi]

@adwin

0.2 is about the speed people tap at regularly...
imo it should be 0.5

[Pharcyde]

@adwin

0.2 is about the speed people tap at regularly...
imo it should be 0.5

Agreed, try this if you still think 0.5 is too long.

Take a stop watch - most phones have a stop watch app built in - and every 0.5 of a second, tap on something. I gurentee you will start to fall behind because the 0.5 comes a lot faster then you would expect.

Then try 0.2, I pretty much was tapping as fast as I could to keep up. 0.2 is too little.




In that case, the GC should NOT BE MORE than 0.2s.

I just ran the tests, my fastest reactions were over 0.2 seconds. So that means it would cool down before I even press again? That would do nothing, cuz I could still button jam the same.

[adwin]

@Kossi & @Pharcyde
I'll have to disagree

1: if 0.2s is the speed ppl usually tap (instead of in just dire situations), they must suffer from hyperactivity lol
My taps are 0.5s-1.0s apart, and pick up the pace when there's a big and/or threatening swarm.

2: you can't take 0.5s as a base (argumenting the falling behind).
Most of the time, you're planning your run in advance. You see the map, you know where the mob is and what you have to do, you just need to do it fast.
If you want to convince me that 0.5s is enough, do the following:

- start a raid roach, swill pitz or stronghold game.
- go to the highest concentration of mob/fire goblins (especially in the big, square rooms before the boss), try to play aggressively (stay in front of the group) while keeping a 0.5s delay among your skills. I guarantee you that the goblins will get you no matter how you plan out your skills (while keeping the simulated delay).

IF there has to ba a GC, it's 0.2s, nothing more. Then again, the devs could probably make different delays for pve and pvp.

[Kossi]

I can tap 10 skills in like 1.5 secs adwin... And lone is still faster

[rocket]

I support this change because 1: if that really will minimise the lag problem (i've never played this game under 300 ping and im from syndey), it will be great for this WORLDWIDE game.


This update will improve client side performance, i.e. when you are in a full group and everyone is nuking 10 mobs and you see PL slow down. It will not necessarily help your ping time. Considering you are in Sydney, for the data to travel halfway across the globe in 300 ms seems pretty remarkable to me.

This appears to be a common misconception, perhaps the Devs can elaborate further on how this update will effect ping times specifically.



I just like the idea because it will remove lag. Guys, I have a feeling that things will be better after this. They will most likely beef up skills damage to compensate for the spell timing.

So there are 12 spells, at 0.5 seconds cool down per spell, you can cast the entire spell book in 6 seconds. So you can cast 120 spells a minute, and 600 spells in 5 minutes. That still seems plenty powerful to me.

Also people are not considering the other variables involved in this. - Players normally don't cast spells while they run, and large portions of the dungeon is running. Then the other variable is the time it takes to tap a spell, lift and move your finger to another spell, and tap it. It will still be a little bit of wait since it doesn't take 0.5 seconds of a second to move a finger, but you wont be actually waiting 0.5 since there is a small delay in finger movement.

This will have a significant impact on gameplay. For example, lightning has a 3 second cool down. Let's say we are in a boss fight and I am using all my 12 skills, that means I can only effectively use my heal and lightning skills once every 6 seconds. So my healing power and lighting damage are used half as much as they used to be. This is an overly simplistic example of course but it makes the point that overall we are losing DPS and for mages, healing per second.

By the way, I normally run and cast all the time and so do most people that kite.

[Pharcyde]

@Kossi & @Pharcyde
I'll have to disagree

1: if 0.2s is the speed ppl usually tap (instead of in just dire situations), they must suffer from hyperactivity lol
My taps are 0.5s-1.0s apart, and pick up the pace when there's a big and/or threatening swarm.

2: you can't take 0.5s as a base (argumenting the falling behind).
Most of the time, you're planning your run in advance. You see the map, you know where the mob is and what you have to do, you just need to do it fast.
If you want to convince me that 0.5s is enough, do the following:

- start a raid roach, swill pitz or stronghold game.
- go to the highest concentration of mob/fire goblins (especially in the big, square rooms before the boss), try to play aggressively (stay in front of the group) while keeping a 0.5s delay among your skills. I guarantee you that the goblins will get you no matter how you plan out your skills (while keeping the simulated delay).

IF there has to ba a GC, it's 0.2s, nothing more. Then again, the devs could probably make different delays for pve and pvp.

You are forgetting one crucial variable that none of us have to make a valid roach map test.



We have no specific data to share about the cool-down periods at this time. We are testing this new system for its impact on fun-factor and will iterate on the Skills and game-balance until it feels right.

Meaning
1.) We have no clue IF they will be doing 0.5
2.) by iterate, they mean to do (something) over again or repeatedly. Not to utter again or repeatedly. Meaning that they will be adjusting mobs, skills, player attributes and any other things that are needed to make a balanced game.

[Pharcyde]

This update will improve client side performance, i.e. when you are in a full group and everyone is nuking 10 mobs and you see PL slow down. It will not necessarily help your ping time. Considering you are in Sydney, for the data to travel halfway across the globe in 300 ms seems pretty remarkable to me.

This appears to be a common misconception, perhaps the Devs can elaborate further on how this update will effect ping times specifically.




This will have a significant impact on gameplay. For example, lightning has a 3 second cool down. Let's say we are in a boss fight and I am using all my 12 skills, that means I can only effectively use my heal and lightning skills once every 6 seconds. So my healing power and lighting damage are used half as much as they used to be. This is an overly simplistic example of course but it makes the point that overall we are losing DPS and for mages, healing per second.

By the way, I normally run and cast all the time and so do most people that kite.

Yes and no, you will most likely not be having to use all 12 spells in the same order and every single time. Then your buffs take 60 seconds to reload, drain life takes 25, and I believe your debuffs take longer than 6 seconds. Trust me, you will be using heal and lightning more than once every 6 seconds.

Then what I mean by running is that in parties, often large clumps of mobs get cleared, meaning that you find yourself running for a second or so without any mobs to clear. The only dungeon I can think of that would be nonstop casting is alien oasis 3, since the concentration of mobs is so thick and aggro attraction ranges are so high.

Edit: sorry double post.

[adwin]

I can tap 10 skills in like 1.5 secs adwin... And lone is still faster

This might be a bit OT, but: what device are you playing on?
My initial reaction time averages ~200ms, with planned skill loadout a bit faster (you have 150ms)
I've played on a few devices, and not every one of them has the touch screen as responsive (mainly due to multitouch issues - most of the older devices are dual touch, not pure multitouch), meaning that not on every device the efficiency will be the same.

[Phaded]

I keep seeing it'll bring skill to pvp... Sadly it won't. all it will do is make fights longer...

Just seems like a half a'd way of fixing things instead of expanding skills or revamping some of them.

But I will say it'll finally give me a reason to quit.

[lilbyrdie]

I was about to make a long post about how bad this change is. It initially didn't seem right. But, we must make one assumption: that the developers will balance PvE for the change. Having made this game, I assume they are too smart to hose it that much.

I ran through a couple of scenarios with timings and kept coming to the same conclusion, assuming a 500ms cool down: It only affects the first ~7 seconds for a mage. And that's if the mage doesn't start with buffs. If buffs are already in effect or on their own cool-down, the effect is even less.

So, I have to assume that they'll balance the mobs so mages don't get steamrolled in the first few seconds. (Not that we don't already get steamrolled now by certain mob types (looking at you, archer mobs), but that shouldn't change.)

So, instead of blasting this change, I have a suggestion:

Instead of making a tap or click timeout, why not allow us to click at full speed to but add each skill to a visual, server-side skill queue. The skills will pop off the queue and trigger with the 500ms cool down. This has two positive changes:

1) It prevents the stated problem in PvP where the skills all go off at once. To me, that's a design flaw in the game that skills can all go off at the same time. This fixes that flaw.

2) It means when lag hits in the middle of a battle, the skills will still be queued up on the server side -- exactly like auto fire of a weapon is currently -- making brief lag disruptions much, much less of a problem.

Of course, the queue need not be unlimited in length. 6-10 queued up skills ought to be enough -- that's now 3-5 seconds. Enough to schedule out all skills, pass through medium lag dips, and be able to adjust the ordering for the next volley of skills based on those results.

If the queue was visual, a cancel queue or tap to remove queued skill might be useful in case of a mistake. Personally, I think this would take more skill to use. The order matters because of the individual skill cool downs. Double up on a drain and you'd probably need to reset the skill queue are stand there like a fool for 12 seconds. :)

Right now, once the initial volley is finished, I'm mostly just looking at the cool down timers and tapping them as quickly as possible when the cool down finishes. With a scheduled queue, I'd have more time to think about to think about the next move while the current queue items run their course.

Just a thought... I think it could take the solution to stated PvP issues and provide a solution to a small PvE issue (lag) while adding fun. Above all else: do not forget that this is a mobile game. A run of 5 minutes is perfect. 15-30 minutes gets too long for a coffee break game. If we can't be productive in 5 minutes, forget it. Too many users won't have time to play. Personally, I think that if the change is balanced in PvE, the time to do runs won't be affected. Let's hope that is true.

(As a side note -- the other stated issue, of client slowdowns, is not on issue on any device I play on... and I have several. Changing game rules to fix performance issues is a smoke screen, I hope, for bigger issues.)

(As a second side note -- I do not play PvP and currently have no plans to. I don't think the rules between the two should be different, though, because then it's basically two different games (unless that's the point). However, mobs have far, far more health than players and skills appear adjusted for that. Even at my low level of 37 I see some attacks hit mobs that one single-hit kill many tanks. So, I see the issues and this does seem a reasonable solution to slow it down. But that's all it will do. The kills would likely still take just as many skill clicks...)

Thanks for a great game! Keep it that way!

[Luchta]

When devs say game balance, it almost always means PvP. The difference between PvP and PvE is astronomical. I'm not that good with PvP but I love it. For me it's the only reason I go level. that's the only way I could at least par against other players who play longer hours. I may kill some but I could be killed more. Nonetheless, it's what the game balance is directed to. So please try it first then make suggestions so you would know what the devs are talking about and see the bigger picture.

[Barbamitsos]

Ty devs.... Birds are goin dooooooOoooooOoooOoOoOown :)

[anglfyr]

I dont like slow killing.. makes me sleepy. Im just gonna leech :/ hahaha kiddin!
Ugghh devs pls dont make this game boring. We only like pure fun, speed & action.
Dont care bout the lags.. were getting used to it. :D

[Pharcyde]

I dont like slow killing.. makes me sleepy. Im just gonna leech :/ hahaha kiddin!
Ugghh devs pls dont make this game boring. We only like pure fun, speed & action.
Dont care bout the lags.. were getting used to it. :D

It wont be slow killing, the devs are gamers too, and they understand exactly what we mean by action, speed and intensity. So they will make sure game play is still just as enjoyable, if not, even more enjoyable with a universal reduction in lag. I have a feeling that damage spells are about to get beefed up BIG time and buffs will be increased with this update.

[lUp3]

I hardly play PvP. Being a bear the starting few run ins werent successful :D. Please keep this global cooldown to PvP. PvE -> Strategy is fun and also makes for smarter gameplay. But you also have to take into account that most people play in random groups and that might totally defeat the purpose if they cant work as a team leading to lesser number of people trying out random games which in turn would lead to people only being in groups and lesser interaction between different 'clans'. The strategy does come into play in the elite dungeons so like Shadow caves to an extent if not played well would just be a huge pot burn. I say this as most Sewer runs are for pinks now with harder gameplay-> farming becomes harder (Only got 2 pinks till now) and after all that effort you are rewarded with nothing but an orange item :-/

Laggy gameplay is ok I can live with it but having to play each level strategizing and people ditching if things dont work out is kinda not the experience I am looking for. Keep things as they are for PvE increase difficulty and drop rate for dungeons(Also level based drops such that like in nightmare at lvl 50 is a cakewalk so lesser drops for them). IMHO

[Kindread]

There is no PvP game that allows you to fire multiple skills at once. Probably not that many PvE games either. Not trying to be a bad guy here but I think everyone's just been spoiled with the way the setup's been. When gcd is added, it'll just be a small adjustment to your play style and you'll move on. You guys haven't even seen or tried a sample of it yet and are already speculating that it will destroy PvE and increase run times by 3 to 4 times the length. It's not going to change things that much.

[Keohike]

There is no PvP game that allows you to fire multiple skills at once. Probably not that many PvE games either. Not trying to be a bad guy here but I think everyone's just been spoiled with the way the setup's been. When gcd is added, it'll just be a small adjustment to your play style and you'll move on. You guys haven't even seen or tried a sample of it yet and are already speculating that it will destroy PvE and increase run times by 3 to 4 times the length. It's not going to change things that much.

I don't even want to try it lol.
Sideways thumb up
Keohike

[shmoo]

Why not apply this to pvp only and leave pve as it is right now? This could make runs a lot longer than they are now and therefore less enjoyable. I just had a flashback when Blizzard put a global cooldown on Shaman shock spells. It wasn't fun.

This is a very good idea that is the best of both worlds. Since the main purpose of the GCD is mainly for PvP. :)

[Physiologic]

Did anyone even notice Cinco's update on his original post? Haven't seen any comments regarding increased skill damage to compensate for the global cool-down.




Testing Update (3.10.2011) - played (PVE only) with global cool-down times at ~0.50 seconds quite a bit this morning. Overall the combat requires significantly more skill and more strategy. As far as I'm concerned that's a really, really good thing! Right now I'm considering increases to player damage (all classes)... but it's not certain. We still have a lot more multiplayer testing to do (to discern how much damage a well-geared group can do now that we have GCD).

[Tamino]

Increasing player damage is an useful side effect - but not enough. From archer point of view a low lever mob (a BS goblin for a 50+ player, a croc for a 35+ player) needs 2 skill shots to be completely dispatched (+ one main weapon shot sometimes). With a 1/2 second between the two, one cannot clean first mob before entering in mob group range (and switching to AoE skills). It is a nightmare? No. It significantly changes playing style? Yes. More damage compensates the interval? No, unless skill damage is doubled (this would make the the boss fights too easy).

[LordEspe]

I believe the DEVs known what they are doing! I mean look what they have given us so far! They are not going to turn This gem into a plain rock! They say it's a necessary adjustment and I I'll gladly take a smooher game play! The GCD will tak place of the MULIPLE game freezes!!!! (hopefully)

I welcome this change with open thumbs!! :)

[Lesrider]

True, other games have spell/skill cooldowns. But those games also have passive skills and/or stronger weapons.
Like I said earlier, most games have warriors/archers mostly dependent on their weapons (and passive skills), with the active skills/buffs being something you use mostly on bosses and harder enemies. Only mages are firing off spells all the time because the drawback of being a Mage is you have crappy armor and weapons. But your spells kick butt.
But PL, especially after the "re-balance," made weapons just about useless and put all the focus on skills/spells. Not to mention, you have 12 skills/spells and they're all active. That's a lot of spells to have at your disposal without being allowed to use them. Perhaps some should be turned into passive skills then?

To get what I mean, go try playing PL without using skills and then try playing just about any other game out there without using (active) skills. The difference is astronomical. As It stands, PL is all about the skills. Unless they change it drastically, I don't see how more/longer cooldowns won't slow it down and/or cause people to stop using half their skills.

[markus]

Meah don't like the sounds of this in pve.... pvp I think it hits right but not pve for sure.

[Tengotengo]

There's a lot of individual complaints about cooldown affecting performance, but that can just be altered with gear or technique changes. The outcry for lag correction far outstrips the need for contact kills.

[Justg]

There is no PvP game that allows you to fire multiple skills at once. Probably not that many PvE games either. Not trying to be a bad guy here but I think everyone's just been spoiled with the way the setup's been. When gcd is added, it'll just be a small adjustment to your play style and you'll move on. You guys haven't even seen or tried a sample of it yet and are already speculating that it will destroy PvE and increase run times by 3 to 4 times the length. It's not going to change things that much.

Truer words have never been spoken.

[Kossi]

oh i have so many questions to ask and the fear of them not being answered.

[rocket]

There is no PvP game that allows you to fire multiple skills at once. Probably not that many PvE games either. Not trying to be a bad guy here but I think everyone's just been spoiled with the way the setup's been. When gcd is added, it'll just be a small adjustment to your play style and you'll move on. You guys haven't even seen or tried a sample of it yet and are already speculating that it will destroy PvE and increase run times by 3 to 4 times the length. It's not going to change things that much.

So what you are saying is take something out that makes Pocket Legends unique so it can be more like every other game out there?

No one has said that it will increase run times by 3 to 4 times. It is probably closer to 25% longer but we won't know for sure until it is implemented.

If it is not going to change things that much, then why are they going to increase player damage? It is obviously enough of a change that PVE needs to be rebalanced.

[kopi]

oh man, it means i cant round up the mobs in stronghold anymore :(

Btw what about weapon swing speed? Will it be restored back to before the nerf?

[Kindread]

So what you are saying is take something out that makes Pocket Legends unique so it can be more like every other game out there?

Come on, that's a weak arguement. I seriously doubt that the ability to spam all skills at once and one shot your opponent is what makes Pocket Legends unique. This is a great game and there are many other more important things that makes this the best game on all platforms. And one of the most important things that makes this game unique is the fact that the Devs give a sh_t and are constantly striving to give you a better playing experience. Trust them. They play PL just like us. They know what they're doing and they're not out to destroy the game for you.

[Numbers]

If you need the ability to spam all your skills at once in order to enjoy this game, I really feel bad for you.

[Zerious]

Did anyone even notice Cinco's update on his original post? Haven't seen any comments regarding increased skill damage to compensate for the global cool-down.

if this is the case, we might want added health/ mana maxes as well. I don't wanna be able to join a pvp game and kill everyone with a buffed pure int firestorm...

[ThaGod]

finally, we will be able to tell what Lone does to us...

[Zerious]

finally, we will be able to tell what Lone does to us...

if skills get pumped up, good luck figuring out which arrow killed you

[Zeus]

finally, we will be able to tell what Lone does to us...

Don't copycat :D, figure out your own combo's.

[rocket]

There is no PvP game that allows you to fire multiple skills at once. Probably not that many PvE games either.

Let me try again.

Just because other games do not do it, does not mean that PL should not do it. In fact your very statement implies, that it is something that makes PL different from many other games. In other words, unique*.

Disclaimer:
*Note that use of the word unique is not meant to imply better or worse, only that it is different. Also, it is not meant to imply that it is only distinguishing factor that makes PL unique. In fact, there are exactly 57 characteristics of PL which make it different from most other MMORPGs at this time.

[Kindread]

Semantics. :)

[Djinn80]

I think that instead of adding a GDC, they should just add more Health to all characters as they level up. Ie: add a boost of health per lvl based on race & str. Again, I dont mind a .25 second GDC but anything longer might be troublesome.

I wouldn't worry about performance with massive spell casing all at once - add an option to "minimize effects" that shows only 2-6 effects at a time if there is a performance issue for the device.

If lvl 40+ had more health they wouldn't get one shot so often. The ability to spam skills quickly does add to the "skill factor" of players and timing is huge. Lag is a big killer and a .25 sec GDC would help even it out some.

I'm just trying to play out a lvl 25 mage vs lvl 25 mage scenario in my head with GDC. The fight wouldn't end because heals could be timed with ease and damage would be delt slowly.

[Pharcyde]

Let me try again.

Just because other games do not do it, does not mean that PL should not do it. In fact your very statement implies, that it is something that makes PL different from many other games. In other words, unique*.

Disclaimer:
*Note that use of the word unique is not meant to imply better or worse, only that it is different. Also, it is not meant to imply that it is only distinguishing factor that makes PL unique. In fact, there are exactly 57 characteristics of PL which make it different from most other MMORPGs at this time.

While you debate a dead argument to the ground, I will state this.

No matter how good your argument is, a dev just made a statement going against what you said. Meaning, no matter how good or brilliant your idea or suggestion is, you will always be wrong.



There is no PvP game that allows you to fire multiple skills at once. Probably not that many PvE games either. Not trying to be a bad guy here but I think everyone's just been spoiled with the way the setup's been. When gcd is added, it'll just be a small adjustment to your play style and you'll move on. You guys haven't even seen or tried a sample of it yet and are already speculating that it will destroy PvE and increase run times by 3 to 4 times the length. It's not going to change things that much.



Truer words have never been spoken.

[Zeus]

While you debate a dead argument to the ground, I will state this.

No matter how good your argument is, a dev just made a statement going against what you said. Meaning, no matter how good or brilliant your idea or suggestion is, you will always be wrong.

Like you said. Always bribe the developers with lotion backrubs to keep them happy :D.

[Pharcyde]

http://www.uvprocess.com/products%5CSAFETY%20PRODUCTS.A1.SKIN%20CARE%20PROD UCTS.SKINCARE%5CUV%20SKIN%20LOTION.SKINCARE%20K%5C SKINCARE%20K_I002001hand_WebPic1.JPG

*Squirts lotion and rubs hands*

Lets do this! ;)

[Prest87]

I'm looking forward to this because it will make pvp more fun(probally) and it gives us non iPad users a chance to fire out skills just as quick!

[Luchta]

I'm looking forward to this because it will make pvp more fun(probally) and it gives us non iPad users a chance to fire out skills just as quick!

I hope so too.

[Hullukko]

Folks, this is a necessary and beneficial change. You have not even played with it yet and are making sweeping generalizations. Give us your level opinions and help us tweak it when it goes in. We promise we will listen (as long as the feedback is rational) and we'll keep iterating on it until it feels right.

I'll tell you what doesn't feel right. Slowing my game experience because of flaws in something that apple has made, that doesn't sound right.
Regardless of how you do it or what other implications it may have.

Do it to improve playing experience for us all, as it might be the case for pvp, then fine, but to screw everybody because some players suffer from lag on slow devices is just insane.

[Keohike]

http://www.uvprocess.com/products%5CSAFETY%20PRODUCTS.A1.SKIN%20CARE%20PROD UCTS.SKINCARE%5CUV%20SKIN%20LOTION.SKINCARE%20K%5C SKINCARE%20K_I002001hand_WebPic1.JPG

*Squirts lotion and rubs hands*

Lets do this! ;)

rofl.............

[Luchta]

I'll tell you what doesn't feel right. Slowing my game experience because of flaws in something that apple has made, that doesn't sound right.
Regardless of how you do it or what other implications it may have.

Do it to improve playing experience for us all, as it might be the case for pvp, then fine, but to screw everybody because some players suffer from lag on slow devices is just insane.

I think you are torn between do it or not do it. You literally blamed everyone else for making you play longer? Sorry but no pun intended, have you tried the game with the new "in development global cool-down" already?

[sharken]

I would be willing to accept a (short) global cool-down if it would help with the issue i am experiencing.

More often than not when playing bird, an attack does not register, i dont know what happens to the
action but it is certainly not being registered. Mostly there are plenty of enemies in range, but still the
attack fails to register.
Not sure how to further troubleshoot this, so my hope is that a global cool-down will fix the issue.

EDIT: My device is a Galaxy S (I9000) which is hardly a slow device.

[Hullukko]

I think you are torn between do it or not do it. You literally blamed everyone else for making you play longer? Sorry but no pun intended, have you tried the game with the new "in development global cool-down" already?

No, not torn at all. I think you've misunderstood what I was trying to say, because I was not even trying to make a statement about whether it's a good or a bad change.
I was criticising the rationale behind the change. They said it was necessary due to lag and I understood from this thread that it's client-side lag on some slower devices due to simultaneous spells. If that's inaccurate, then I'm sorry, I've misunderstood the lag they were referring to.

But if it is that slow device lag then that is a silly reason in my opinion. That's all I was trying to say. Fixing lag by slowing it for everybody is patching the wrong leak. I'm sorry that my personal disappointment leaked into the message so much.

And I certainly did not "literally blame everyone else for making me play longer".

Moreover, I'm not trying to say they're silly, I'm fairly sure they've thought about this carefully. I'm implying that there are alterior motives at play.

This or that, I'm not really that much bothered about it. They do what they think is right, it's their game and I either live with it or find something else. Simple.

[DeadEyedEagle]

This is going to kill PVE badly! Pvp is gonna be better but.... still pve is the main part of the game.

[Kossi]

This is going to kill PVE badly! Pvp is gonna be better but.... still pve is the main part of the game.

this is my prediction: in order of pvp beastliness...

1- Enchantresses
2- Birds (if skilled)
3- Bears (wa wa waaah)

[Prest87]

This is going to kill PVE badly! Pvp is gonna be better but.... still pve is the main part of the game.

It wont kill it just make it more of a challenge, what is wrong with a challenge?

[Echelong]

I like the idea that it will require more skill and it would affect how people play their class. It could get harder with some classes like a mages heal, if its not tapped fast enough now an archer or mage could die very fast mostly 2 shots will kill them unless they are in str gear.

For testing you guys should use at least the following groups with gear intended to them: 3/4 archers and 2/3 enchantresses; 2 archers; 2 elfs and 1 bear; 3/4 archers and 1/2 bears. These are the most common groups at least from my experience.

A good/average team will finish all the new BS levels in less than 5 minutes. We have an average time of 4 minutes per run with our groups so far a lot of the times less than 4 and that is without using damage pots. You could make runs and see the average time you make a run with and without the GCD.

Another idea is that the GCD doesn't affect buffs and healing skills, only attack and debuffs skills. Buffs and debuffs should last longer with buffs having a longer CD. Debuff CD should stay relatively the same because its used once in a group of mobs and they will be dead fast enough and you will need it for the next group.

If it takes to long to finish a dungeon it will discourage a lot of people and more than half (a lot more from my point of view) are casual players. I don't know if you could get a group of players to test this out on a different server like the fnord server at the start of the game and you could give access to some players only and record the data.

[noneo]

I agree, I think the global cool down will provide much more of a challenge.

Currently, anyone can walk into a dungeon they’ve never been in, know nothing about the mobs or bosses, spam all of their spells, and still make it through unscathed (especially with a team). But requiring the expertise of each skill, and knowing exactly when to press each skill, as to not negatively affect your survival, will add much more value to game play. It will add a great deal more to teamwork IMO as well. Players will have to strategize when to press certain skills to achieve COMBOS, all while still balancing of their other skills, as not to get killed. Also, Mages will have to plan when to use heal. If someone is in need of healing and the mage just shot off Lightning then the dying will soon become the dead :p

Adiitionally, the cooldown could reduce the monotony when grinding.

Overall, I think the cooldown will add a large amount of depth to the game and add room for expanding knowledge in the sense of player skill.

[Lesrider]

If mages have to choose between healing and nuking, I predict there will be a lot more dying in this game :P

[Echelong]

If mages have to choose between healing and nuking, I predict there will be a lot more dying in this game :P

LOL I thought the same and birds die enough already. That is why I suggested that buffs and healing skills should not be affected by the GCD.