I don't think Arcane Legend is as Fun as the old days!

[Ice]

Do you guys miss the old days?

PVP is boring :( no more rivalry.. less pro players... meh

[Allows.]

noobs with kershal these days.

[Ice]

noobs with kershal these days.

kershal for noobs anyways :(

[Visiting]

Maybe, just maybe, if PVP was played the way it was meant to be played, instead of this "to kill or not to kill", free flagging, gang riddled pvp we currently play. Then people may find some interest in playing PVP...

[obee]

AL used to be literally the best game I played. The only thing that keeps me from even logging on every once in a while is the social factor.

[Alhuntrazeck]

I swear, PvE is becoming more interesting than PvP these days. And this is coming from the guy who used to "lol@pve" to counter keikali's "lol@pvp"s. There are 2 main reasons:

1. Gear Discrepancies

Gone are the days when all one had to do to be good in PvP was to farm for decently atttainable gear, then practice, practice, practice until they got good at PvP. Right now, HOWEVER skilled you are, if you're geared out with mythic armor & helm with a legendary weapon, you'll get trashed 10 times out of 10 by a maxed out opponent. It is getting so pathetically ridiculous that people are beginning to not bother about PvP at all. Why would they, if every time they stepped into PvP, a frost bow, arcane ring, Planar amulet, imbued rogue comes along running from spawn to spawn 1 hitting them in TDM and camping outside waiting for the spawn bubble to run out in CTF?

The clear reason is this; the differences between the top-of-the-line gear and the second best gear is far too large. The elite players who spend real life money or pour hours and hours into this game to get the best gear deserve to have great gear! But not at the rate things are at the moment. Let's take a look at the gear discrepancies between an average-geared player and one who is maxed-out -

(From a rogue and mage POV. My warrior hasn't been geared out yet so I can't comment here)

The weapon: The difference between an Expedition Rifle and the Elondrian Rifle is a whopping 90+ damage and about 200-300 HP depending on gems!

Ring: The arcane ring gives an average boost of 300 HP and 40 damage over a Blood Ruby depending, again, on gems.

And amulet: The L41 mythic amulet is the strangest of all, giving a ground-breaking 600 HP increase over a Lunar or Fang!

Overall: a maxed out opponent versus an average, mythic armor & helm user has 1.1k HP more, and 130 damage more. And we're not even including the arcane pets here versus an average user's Slag or Malison!

Which wouldn't be as much of a problem if this top-of-the-line gear was actually obtainable. The reality? It sure as hell isn't! The total cost of completely gearing out your character including an arcane pet, say Nekro, actually exceeds the current gold cap. And gold in AL is hard to earn. The best Legendary items looted sell for hundred K's. So the only way of actually getting yourself geared up? Open Locked Grand Crates of the Watch.

In other words, PAY TO WIN. Clearly something is wrong here!

The consequences of this is far-reaching. When people begin to lose interest and turn to other sources of entertainment - PvE, or simply quitting the game - the number of players in PvP is reduced. There are far more empty rooms than there ever were before.

Next season provides an ideal opportunity to narrow gear discrepancies and make gear attainable. STS had the right idea by making certain things like Nekro, Imbueds and the mythic Amulet craftable.

In any MMORPG, gear should be obtainable in two ways, freemium and premium. The "premium way" should never become the norm! The best gear should be farmable a well as available in locked crates. If farmable is too easy (resulting in flooding the market), the way the Imbueds are crafted can be implemented. Unrefined gear can drop from bosses & chests & crates and have to be refined in certain ways. This will make people more interested in PvE and also increase player participation in PvP when people get good gear. The second step will be to narrow differences between top level gear and the second-best legendaries. Differences should be 20-30 damage for weapons and 200-300 HP for armor & helms.

But that's only solving one half of the problem.

2. PvP Isn't Being Played the Way Its Meant to Be

#1 is the Developers' job to fix. #2 is ours, the Player Base.

There are currently two PvP maps - Capture the Flag (CTF) and Team Deathmatch (TDM). I don't spend much time in TDM so I'm assuming things are fine over there, but its CTF where things are screwed up.

First of all, I don't believe many of the players actually know what Capture the Flag is. Its an incredibly fun game where each team has a flag to defend while at the same time trying to capture the other, opponent team's flag. The team must work as a cohesive unit to make sure their flag is safe while at the same time trying to sneak past opponents to grab their flag. The first team to reach 5 flags wins the game.

At the current way its being played, there are two groups of people in CTF - one, the people who're killing and being killed. The ones who ignore the flag and run from spawn to spawn trying to kill others while also being killed. This comprises the majority. #2 is the flaggers, the people who carry a crystal from one flag room to the other while being unhindered simply because they're "flagging". They do this to notch up the score on their screen, & to get the 10K Flags AP, and to get on the Leaderboards, whether AP or CTF Flags.

Awhile back a few players (most of whom have quit) including myself used to have CTF games which were tremendous fun, comprising strategy, technique, teamwork...sneakiness...and so on! Gear of course played a role but if a friendly game, teams were switched around to even out the discrepancies - or they'd simply gear down. But of course it is hardly practical to continuously host CTF games. Only a few people would be able to play and matches took a long time to organize. People themselves need to take the initiative to play the game the way its meant to be played.

And, of course, that requires motivation. Its a bit late in the game to change APs or the Leaderboards by removing the flag APs and the flags LB (which were a bad idea in the first place) - two years late, in fact. Many people have spent hours and hours flagging and it wouldn't be fair to make changes now.

So, the motivation. In place of the KDR box we have on our character screens, a button could be placed called Kills and Deaths or whatever, just an example. This would open a page which has 4 sections: the PvE KDR, CTF KDR, TDM KDR and a new counter called Wins and Losses - already been suggested before. The idea is, every time the game ends, the losing team would have one point added to their losses and the winning team would have one point added to their wins. This would motivate people to protect the flag and prevent their KDR from being ruined. Removing the existing KDR would be a bad idea because, just like for the flags, people have worked very hard for their kills.

If these 2 are fixed, PvP should become a much better place!

Just my $.02 and sorry for the long-wided post!

[najcomp]

I swear, PvE is becoming more interesting than PvP these days. And this is coming from the guy who used to "lol@pve" to counter keikali's "lol@pvp"s. There are 2 main reasons:

1. Gear Discrepancies

Gone are the days when all one had to do to be good in PvP was to farm for decently atttainable gear, then practice, practice, practice until they got good at PvP. Right now, HOWEVER skilled you are, if you're geared out with mythic armor & helm with a legendary weapon, you'll get trashed 10 times out of 10 by a maxed out opponent. It is getting so pathetically ridiculous that people are beginning to not bother about PvP at all. Why would they, if every time they stepped into PvP, a frost bow, arcane ring, Planar amulet, imbued rogue comes along running from spawn to spawn 1 hitting them in TDM and camping outside waiting for the spawn bubble to run out in CTF?

The clear reason is this; the differences between the top-of-the-line gear and the second best gear is far too large. The elite players who spend real life money or pour hours and hours into this game to get the best gear deserve to have great gear! But not at the rate things are at the moment. Let's take a look at the gear discrepancies between an average-geared player and one who is maxed-out -

(From a rogue and mage POV. My warrior hasn't been geared out yet so I can't comment here)

The weapon: The difference between an Expedition Rifle and the Elondrian Rifle is a whopping 90+ damage and about 200-300 HP depending on gems!

Ring: The arcane ring gives an average boost of 300 HP and 40 damage over a Blood Ruby depending, again, on gems.

And amulet: The L41 mythic amulet is the strangest of all, giving a ground-breaking 600 HP increase over a Lunar or Fang!

Overall: a maxed out opponent versus an average, mythic armor & helm user has 1.1k HP more, and 130 damage more. And we're not even including the arcane pets here versus an average user's Slag or Malison!

Which wouldn't be as much of a problem if this top-of-the-line gear was actually obtainable. The reality? It sure as hell isn't! The total cost of completely gearing out your character including an arcane pet, say Nekro, actually exceeds the current gold cap. And gold in AL is hard to earn. The best Legendary items looted sell for hundred K's. So the only way of actually getting yourself geared up? Open Locked Grand Crates of the Watch.

In other words, PAY TO WIN. Clearly something is wrong here!

The consequences of this is far-reaching. When people begin to lose interest and turn to other sources of entertainment - PvE, or simply quitting the game - the number of players in PvP is reduced. There are far more empty rooms than there ever were before.

Next season provides an ideal opportunity to narrow gear discrepancies and make gear attainable. STS had the right idea by making certain things like Nekro, Imbueds and the mythic Amulet craftable.

In any MMORPG, gear should be obtainable in two ways, freemium and premium. The "premium way" should never become the norm! The best gear should be farmable a well as available in locked crates. If farmable is too easy (resulting in flooding the market), the way the Imbueds are crafted can be implemented. Unrefined gear can drop from bosses & chests & crates and have to be refined in certain ways. This will make people more interested in PvE and also increase player participation in PvP when people get good gear. The second step will be to narrow differences between top level gear and the second-best legendaries. Differences should be 20-30 damage for weapons and 200-300 HP for armor & helms.

But that's only solving one half of the problem.

2. PvP Isn't Being Played the Way Its Meant to Be

#1 is the Developers' job to fix. #2 is ours, the Player Base.

There are currently two PvP maps - Capture the Flag (CTF) and Team Deathmatch (TDM). I don't spend much time in TDM so I'm assuming things are fine over there, but its CTF where things are screwed up.

First of all, I don't believe many of the players actually know what Capture the Flag is. Its an incredibly fun game where each team has a flag to defend while at the same time trying to capture the other, opponent team's flag. The team must work as a cohesive unit to make sure their flag is safe while at the same time trying to sneak past opponents to grab their flag. The first team to reach 5 flags wins the game.

At the current way its being played, there are two groups of people in CTF - one, the people who're killing and being killed. The ones who ignore the flag and run from spawn to spawn trying to kill others while also being killed. This comprises the majority. #2 is the flaggers, the people who carry a crystal from one flag room to the other while being unhindered simply because they're "flagging". They do this to notch up the score on their screen, & to get the 10K Flags AP, and to get on the Leaderboards, whether AP or CTF Flags.

Awhile back a few players (most of whom have quit) including myself used to have CTF games which were tremendous fun, comprising strategy, technique, teamwork...sneakiness...and so on! Gear of course played a role but if a friendly game, teams were switched around to even out the discrepancies - or they'd simply gear down. But of course it is hardly practical to continuously host CTF games. Only a few people would be able to play and matches took a long time to organize. People themselves need to take the initiative to play the game the way its meant to be played.

And, of course, that requires motivation. Its a bit late in the game to change APs or the Leaderboards by removing the flag APs and the flags LB (which were a bad idea in the first place) - two years late, in fact. Many people have spent hours and hours flagging and it wouldn't be fair to make changes now.

So, the motivation. In place of the KDR box we have on our character screens, a button could be placed called Kills and Deaths or whatever, just an example. This would open a page which has 4 sections: the PvE KDR, CTF KDR, TDM KDR and a new counter called Wins and Losses - already been suggested before. The idea is, every time the game ends, the losing team would have one point added to their losses and the winning team would have one point added to their wins. This would motivate people to protect the flag and prevent their KDR from being ruined. Removing the existing KDR would be a bad idea because, just like for the flags, people have worked very hard for their kills.

If these 2 are fixed, PvP should become a much better place!

Just my $.02 and sorry for the long-wided post!

Agree

[nevercan]

I swear, PvE is becoming more interesting than PvP these days. And this is coming from the guy who used to "lol@pve" to counter keikali's "lol@pvp"s. There are 2 main reasons:

1. Gear Discrepancies

Gone are the days when all one had to do to be good in PvP was to farm for decently atttainable gear, then practice, practice, practice until they got good at PvP. Right now, HOWEVER skilled you are, if you're geared out with mythic armor & helm with a legendary weapon, you'll get trashed 10 times out of 10 by a maxed out opponent. It is getting so pathetically ridiculous that people are beginning to not bother about PvP at all. Why would they, if every time they stepped into PvP, a frost bow, arcane ring, Planar amulet, imbued rogue comes along running from spawn to spawn 1 hitting them in TDM and camping outside waiting for the spawn bubble to run out in CTF?

The clear reason is this; the differences between the top-of-the-line gear and the second best gear is far too large. The elite players who spend real life money or pour hours and hours into this game to get the best gear deserve to have great gear! But not at the rate things are at the moment. Let's take a look at the gear discrepancies between an average-geared player and one who is maxed-out -

(From a rogue and mage POV. My warrior hasn't been geared out yet so I can't comment here)

The weapon: The difference between an Expedition Rifle and the Elondrian Rifle is a whopping 90+ damage and about 200-300 HP depending on gems!

Ring: The arcane ring gives an average boost of 300 HP and 40 damage over a Blood Ruby depending, again, on gems.

And amulet: The L41 mythic amulet is the strangest of all, giving a ground-breaking 600 HP increase over a Lunar or Fang!

Overall: a maxed out opponent versus an average, mythic armor & helm user has 1.1k HP more, and 130 damage more. And we're not even including the arcane pets here versus an average user's Slag or Malison!

Which wouldn't be as much of a problem if this top-of-the-line gear was actually obtainable. The reality? It sure as hell isn't! The total cost of completely gearing out your character including an arcane pet, say Nekro, actually exceeds the current gold cap. And gold in AL is hard to earn. The best Legendary items looted sell for hundred K's. So the only way of actually getting yourself geared up? Open Locked Grand Crates of the Watch.

In other words, PAY TO WIN. Clearly something is wrong here!

The consequences of this is far-reaching. When people begin to lose interest and turn to other sources of entertainment - PvE, or simply quitting the game - the number of players in PvP is reduced. There are far more empty rooms than there ever were before.

Next season provides an ideal opportunity to narrow gear discrepancies and make gear attainable. STS had the right idea by making certain things like Nekro, Imbueds and the mythic Amulet craftable.

In any MMORPG, gear should be obtainable in two ways, freemium and premium. The "premium way" should never become the norm! The best gear should be farmable a well as available in locked crates. If farmable is too easy (resulting in flooding the market), the way the Imbueds are crafted can be implemented. Unrefined gear can drop from bosses & chests & crates and have to be refined in certain ways. This will make people more interested in PvE and also increase player participation in PvP when people get good gear. The second step will be to narrow differences between top level gear and the second-best legendaries. Differences should be 20-30 damage for weapons and 200-300 HP for armor & helms.

But that's only solving one half of the problem.

2. PvP Isn't Being Played the Way Its Meant to Be

#1 is the Developers' job to fix. #2 is ours, the Player Base.

There are currently two PvP maps - Capture the Flag (CTF) and Team Deathmatch (TDM). I don't spend much time in TDM so I'm assuming things are fine over there, but its CTF where things are screwed up.

First of all, I don't believe many of the players actually know what Capture the Flag is. Its an incredibly fun game where each team has a flag to defend while at the same time trying to capture the other, opponent team's flag. The team must work as a cohesive unit to make sure their flag is safe while at the same time trying to sneak past opponents to grab their flag. The first team to reach 5 flags wins the game.

At the current way its being played, there are two groups of people in CTF - one, the people who're killing and being killed. The ones who ignore the flag and run from spawn to spawn trying to kill others while also being killed. This comprises the majority. #2 is the flaggers, the people who carry a crystal from one flag room to the other while being unhindered simply because they're "flagging". They do this to notch up the score on their screen, & to get the 10K Flags AP, and to get on the Leaderboards, whether AP or CTF Flags.

Awhile back a few players (most of whom have quit) including myself used to have CTF games which were tremendous fun, comprising strategy, technique, teamwork...sneakiness...and so on! Gear of course played a role but if a friendly game, teams were switched around to even out the discrepancies - or they'd simply gear down. But of course it is hardly practical to continuously host CTF games. Only a few people would be able to play and matches took a long time to organize. People themselves need to take the initiative to play the game the way its meant to be played.

And, of course, that requires motivation. Its a bit late in the game to change APs or the Leaderboards by removing the flag APs and the flags LB (which were a bad idea in the first place) - two years late, in fact. Many people have spent hours and hours flagging and it wouldn't be fair to make changes now.

So, the motivation. In place of the KDR box we have on our character screens, a button could be placed called Kills and Deaths or whatever, just an example. This would open a page which has 4 sections: the PvE KDR, CTF KDR, TDM KDR and a new counter called Wins and Losses - already been suggested before. The idea is, every time the game ends, the losing team would have one point added to their losses and the winning team would have one point added to their wins. This would motivate people to protect the flag and prevent their KDR from being ruined. Removing the existing KDR would be a bad idea because, just like for the flags, people have worked very hard for their kills.

If these 2 are fixed, PvP should become a much better place!

Just my $.02 and sorry for the long-wided post!
Didnt the arcane ring give 100+ armor? Or am i dreaming?

[Kriticality]

It gives 170 armor. Here's a ss for reference

129417

[Anyona]

Didnt the arcane ring give 100+ armor? Or am i dreaming?

It gives +170 armor

[Kriticality]

There are plenty of people that thrive and destroy in pvp with gear less than max. However, its no place for someone with all legendary items. The irritating part for me in PVP is people cherry picking their games. I'm not saying farm deaths, but there's nothing wrong with losing either. People are playing fire, they probably just skerrrd of you hehe. :-)

[Serancha]

PVP hasn't been fun since the middle of season 4 when Samael was released. That was the changing point. Before that it was awesome.

However, I think what Fire is referring to as "the good", is the season 5 drama, which most people didn't consider fun, and drove a lot of serious players out of the pvp environment. PvP was already ruined at that time, and has just gotten worse since. Why anyone would want all that childish drama is beyond me, but I guess it takes all kinds.

[Quonabebi]

I do agree thing i like about games with pvp is when it takes. skill not who has more gear and then the people with gear dont fight eachother

[carmine_blade]

From a complete PVP noob's perspective:

CTF sucks. I mean SUCKS. You encounter people either furiously intent on flagging or people who will stay and kill if you look like "foods" or who will leave if they see someone who may present a challenge. Your own damn team won't support you (if you have the flag) because they are too busy blocking or because they want the flag, and the other team will mercilessly farm anyone noobish provided it doesn't interfere with their own flagging. I'm not a quitter, I have a terrible, TERRIBLE kdr lol because I'll try and stick it out a bit. But now I won't do CTF because it's as fun and enjoyable as going to the dentist without pain relief.

TDM is much better (I'm almost even on kills and deaths there), but still prone to ganging, and uber-geared people being big cry babies and leaving if someone kills them, if they're not murdering the sorcerer with epic gear and Barney repeatedly. \

The thing is, short of removing the incentives for this behaviour (APs and LBs, which would spark a massive outcry), it is never gonna stop unless the AL community self-regulates and cleans itself up. But this will never happen either because many people are a**holes without honour or a sense of fairplay. Witness the number of people who join the team that already has 3 people on it, not the team with 1 person.

So for me PVP remains an intriguing yet extremely irritating diversion that I visit when I'm bored of farming PVE just to remind myself how terrible it is. The only thing I can think of that may help is having practice areas (perhaps in guild halls) where deaths don't count and people can learn the ropes without farming deaths; geared/skilled players would more inclined to fight fair and teach others in a no-death area because they have nothing to lose; their precious KDR remains intact.

[Energizeric]

I do agree that the best gear is too OP. The best pets are not actually that OP. If you compare an arcane pet to a mythic or top legendary pet, there are plenty of good legendary PvP pets like Breeze that can be obtained for 10% of the cost of an arcane pet.

But items like the Arcane ring are too OP. IMO the best gear only needs to be slightly better than the next best gear and it will still command a premium price, but maybe not 50m premium, which is fine. I can remember in Pocket Legends when people used to pay $20m for a dragon vanity set because it gave them a bonus of a few stat points, not hundreds. Players will always pay a premium for any advantage they can get, no matter how small, because what else is there to do with your gold?

The solution is to keep the arcane gear very rare, but also don't make it so OP that you need it to compete. It should clearly give an advantage, but not a ridiculous one. For example, the Elondrian Rifle does not need to have 90 more damage than the Expedition Rifle. If the difference was 30 damage, it would still be well worth the price.

[Serancha]

This is totally true.

I remember back in season 2 and 3, the best gear would give only a couple of points bonus in a given stat over the next best one. Those items went for close to a million - which was the most anything cost at that time. These items that only gave 1.5 damage more than the next best item were highly sought after.

The new gaps of hundreds of damage and hundreds of armour make the wealth / stat gap way to huge.

[vawaid]

when I played for first time a year ago, pvp already sucks. arcane and mythic changed everything (maybe).

sent by a nab using tapasucks

[Alhuntrazeck]

I do agree that the best gear is too OP. The best pets are not actually that OP. If you compare an arcane pet to a mythic or top legendary pet, there are plenty of good legendary PvP pets like Breeze that can be obtained for 10% of the cost of an arcane pet.

But items like the Arcane ring are too OP. IMO the best gear only needs to be slightly better than the next best gear and it will still command a premium price, but maybe not 50m premium, which is fine. I can remember in Pocket Legends when people used to pay $20m for a dragon vanity set because it gave them a bonus of a few stat points, not hundreds. Players will always pay a premium for any advantage they can get, no matter how small, because what else is there to do with your gold?

The solution is to keep the arcane gear very rare, but also don't make it so OP that you need it to compete. It should clearly give an advantage, but not a ridiculous one. For example, the Elondrian Rifle does not need to have 90 more damage than the Expedition Rifle. If the difference was 30 damage, it would still be well worth the price.

I agree except for the pet thing. Some of the newer arcane pets are miles ahead of mythic pets. Heck, Samael, which most players have anyway, is like a severely buffed slag with almost double the panic chance as well as panic on auto attack and health and mana regen. The top level pets like Nekro and Shady and Surge are so far away from the rest of the pets that its hilarious. A Nekro user will 90% of the time kill a non-Nekro user regardless of class, gear and skill. Shady and Surge is the perfect timed runner with that 30% banish & damaging pools. The difference between pets sohuld really be toned down.

No pet should be worth as much as an arcane ring, the best item in the game...

[Kriticality]

The other issue is everyone is so used to getting beaten and blaming it on gear. At these end game tourneys, with gear restrictions, the same people are at the top of the heap really. I assure you there are PLENTY of people with arcane rings either trying to play and getting beaten or not playing because it's not as easy as they thought. I know plenty of people that have switched to rogues bc they're "OP" in pvp and get trounced.

I'd be happy to gear down in PVP if asked and it's fair and have many times. I, for one, am in a PVP focused guild. My gear is for fighting other geared people in guild clashes primarily. It's not just gear, the tactics are constantly evolving. Some of the strategy conversations that we have are a lot more than what a casual pvper may suspect. The strategies are developed to clash with other OP teams. I recently got a ring and was doing just fine before it.

[bmooooo]

The thing is its too hard to coop up with new op gears/pet without spending real money so ppl start to quit and loose hope and atm pve is dead. You need to be geared if u wanna farm new maps like planar arena/tombs. Only max geared players profits pve the most

[Pillowhead]

S3, I was twinking as a lvl 11, I had 65dmg, 1.1k health, 495 mana, with bonechill set, malison as pet, all that for around 200-400k gold, nowadays twinks at lvl 11 have like 120dmg, 1.6k hp, 1k mana, all that for around 4m + pet money.

[SacredKnight]

PvP hasn't been fun since Arcane and Mythics were released as fast as locks were popped TBH :/

[Kingofninjas]

I do agree that the best gear is too OP. The best pets are not actually that OP. If you compare an arcane pet to a mythic or top legendary pet, there are plenty of good legendary PvP pets like Breeze that can be obtained for 10% of the cost of an arcane pet.

But items like the Arcane ring are too OP. IMO the best gear only needs to be slightly better than the next best gear and it will still command a premium price, but maybe not 50m premium, which is fine. I can remember in Pocket Legends when people used to pay $20m for a dragon vanity set because it gave them a bonus of a few stat points, not hundreds. Players will always pay a premium for any advantage they can get, no matter how small, because what else is there to do with your gold?

The solution is to keep the arcane gear very rare, but also don't make it so OP that you need it to compete. It should clearly give an advantage, but not a ridiculous one. For example, the Elondrian Rifle does not need to have 90 more damage than the Expedition Rifle. If the difference was 30 damage, it would still be well worth the price.

The difference between gear is ridiculous. Arcane ring adds about 300 (ish) hp, 170 armor, and a whopping 30-40 damage over the next best, which is the mythic ring. The elond bow adds about 80 damage over expedition bow. Imbued set (potency armor/ brutality helm) adds 200 ish armor (on rogue) and about 10 damage. I won't even get into what all the OP gems have done to the balance between rich and poor.

Pets like nekro and sns ridiculous as well. A nekro user must be incredibly bad or in the process of pinging out to lose to a player without one. A team of 3/4 sns players can dominate timed runs (except arena).

The next level cap provides a great opportunity to fix some of this. Introduce a lvl 46 mythic ring that we have been screaming for for ages. It should surpass the arcane ring, but it should come pretty damn close. Introduce pets to counter nekro and sns, or a pet that has a similar but no so powerful AA as them. I would love a pet that can remove any buffs to opponent team, the way misty or iron bite removes the debuffs. Make the cost 1000 fragments idc, just make it attainable thru something other than luck.

The gear gaps should be limited to a maximum of 300 hp 150-200 armor and 30 damage between a legendary and a mythic user.

[Wazakesy]

The difference between gear is ridiculous. Arcane ring adds about 300 (ish) hp, 170 armor, and a whopping 30-40 damage over the next best, which is the mythic ring. The elond bow adds about 80 damage over expedition bow. Imbued set (potency armor/ brutality helm) adds 200 ish armor (on rogue) and about 10 damage. I won't even get into what all the OP gems have done to the balance between rich and poor.

Pets like nekro and sns ridiculous as well. A nekro user must be incredibly bad or in the process of pinging out to lose to a player without one. A team of 3/4 sns players can dominate timed runs (except arena).

The next level cap provides a great opportunity to fix some of this. Introduce a lvl 46 mythic ring that we have been screaming for for ages. It should surpass the arcane ring, but it should come pretty damn close. Introduce pets to counter nekro and sns, or a pet that has a similar but no so powerful AA as them. I would love a pet that can remove any buffs to opponent team, the way misty or iron bite removes the debuffs. Make the cost 1000 fragments idc, just make it attainable thru something other than luck.

The gear gaps should be limited to a maximum of 300 hp 150-200 armor and 30 damage between a legendary and a mythic user.

The mythic ring being better than the arcane ring sounds OK, but it should be 10000% farmable, popping locks the most ridiculous idea.

Sure u could add in locks, but remember that the gap between the poor vs riches increases the ridiculousness of PvP. If you farm, its much much much more better, at least people can get a chance to actually obtain it including the F2P players. From my lock poppin experience, it seems ill need to pop another 1000 more to even get a arcane that is as low as an HJ.

I am tired of soloing maps, as i find that no one wants to farm. It feels so ridiculous that the game is now all about ,oney, gears, wrecking each other in PvP, always hunting for advantages. This game is wrecked, its not like people want fun anymore, it just seems that you want to be rich and beat everyone...thats what i am seeing ever since i came back.

[Kriticality]

There is a lot of representation from f2p players. What advantages should the people that keep sts afloat have over the people that enjoy the game and don't spend money. I have no issue with farming. I actually looted my second recipe today at ~1000 arena runs. I would never spend money, especially the amount I've spent without some obvious advantage.
As I said in another thread... Any ring that's better than arcane ring will have the drop rate of arcane shard in elite dragon scale chest if it's farmable. The gear gap will become wider. If anyone is paying attention, it's the same people with the best gear. Anything that comes out better will be well out of the price range for anyone not lucky enough to loot. That's assuming it's lootable. There are ways to farm imbued and planar and people are still focused on arcane ring.

Notice the difficulty of Planar recipe for a mythic pendant 10 levels after the previous mythic pendant and imagine the drop rate of something 5 levels after an ARCANE ring.

More op gear means more of an imbalance. Everyone was excited about Planar pendant until they didn't loot and can't afford to buy.

I don't have issue with things being farmable but people that spend money should have a real incentive to do so.

Mythic set users from 2+ years ago should not be able to leap frog the people that put in work or spent money for imbued sets.

I see nekro and I think "man, I want one. I'm gonna figure out how to get one."

Most people say it's too op. I say rise to the occasion. Farm, spend money, figure it out. Or don't and twink. Always assume the gear you have will be obsolete in 6 mos to a year.

[Serancha]

The original premise of the game was that you could get ALL items with a reasonable amount of work by farming. The advantage plat gave was supposed to be expediting the process so you could get items a bit faster.

This did NOT mean that the items had to be purchased by plat people who would then sell it on the cs. That is not how it was originally, nor should it have ever turned to that. It meant you could farm for any item you wanted, and could actually expect that one day you could obtain it with hard work.

The drop rates for farming any decent items are now so low that it's laughable. So what's the incentive to play?

[Ravager]

From a complete PVP noob's perspective:

CTF sucks. I mean SUCKS. You encounter people either furiously intent on flagging or people who will stay and kill if you look like "foods" or who will leave if they see someone who may present a challenge. Your own damn team won't support you (if you have the flag) because they are too busy blocking or because they want the flag, and the other team will mercilessly farm anyone noobish provided it doesn't interfere with their own flagging. I'm not a quitter, I have a terrible, TERRIBLE kdr lol because I'll try and stick it out a bit. But now I won't do CTF because it's as fun and enjoyable as going to the dentist without pain relief.

TDM is much better (I'm almost even on kills and deaths there), but still prone to ganging, and uber-geared people being big cry babies and leaving if someone kills them, if they're not murdering the sorcerer with epic gear and Barney repeatedly. \

The thing is, short of removing the incentives for this behaviour (APs and LBs, which would spark a massive outcry), it is never gonna stop unless the AL community self-regulates and cleans itself up. But this will never happen either because many people are a**holes without honour or a sense of fairplay. Witness the number of people who join the team that already has 3 people on it, not the team with 1 person.

So for me PVP remains an intriguing yet extremely irritating diversion that I visit when I'm bored of farming PVE just to remind myself how terrible it is. The only thing I can think of that may help is having practice areas (perhaps in guild halls) where deaths don't count and people can learn the ropes without farming deaths; geared/skilled players would more inclined to fight fair and teach others in a no-death area because they have nothing to lose; their precious KDR remains intact.

It's the sad truth about CTF. They just want the flag. Will call to gang and block if you attack the flagger. Your teammates sit there to watch you get ganged.

Everyone who enters CTF, expects you to enter ctf and stand in the middle if you are not flagging. If you attack someone, they take it personally. So you're supposed to stand in the middle and not attack anyone and watch the flaggers flag. This to me, greatly ruins the PVP experience.

Ironically, I know some people who free flagged their whole way or maybe even captured all their flags to 10k flags and then quit the game because they had nothing to do afterwards.

[Zylx]

The drop rates for farming any decent items are now so low that it's laughable. So what's the incentive to play?

There will never be a perfect drop rate that would satisfy players AND stabilize the economy.

Increasing drop rates:
- Decreases economic value
- Decreases demand
- Increases satisfaction for lower-class players
- Decreases satisfaction for upper-class players

Decreasing drop rates:
- Increases economic value
- Increases demand
- Decreases satisfaction for lower-class players
- Increases satisfaction for upper-class players

So basically adding incentives ruins the economy which also lowers long-term satisfaction. It kicks up the drive to play for a limited amount of time until the supply overlaps the demand. The only way to counteract this would be to release new and better items more frequently to raise the demand before the current items expire or fall short of the curve.

The drop rates are low because STS wants to preserve the longevity of the items, because they don't want to have to release new items more often. I find this as a good idea to an extent that has already been overexecuted. STS should release new items more often to increase interest and they would also have more elbow-room to have higher drop rates.

[Kriticality]

The original premise of the game was that you could get ALL items with a reasonable amount of work by farming. The advantage plat gave was supposed to be expediting the process so you could get items a bit faster.

This did NOT mean that the items had to be purchased by plat people who would then sell it on the cs. That is not how it was originally, nor should it have ever turned to that. It meant you could farm for any item you wanted, and could actually expect that one day you could obtain it with hard work.

The drop rates for farming any decent items are now so low that it's laughable. So what's the incentive to play?

I wasn't around then. This is clearly before mythic weapons, armor and amulets. I only started playing last october so idk. As far as I know, none of the mythics in crates were available from farming and hard work. You don't need arcane ring to be successful in PVP. You can farm until you loot or can buy imbued and same can be said about planar. I know there are some mythic pets that are sometimes purchaseable by plat, but this idea you speak of applies to all arcane pets as well. Were they ever farmable?

[Ladysophie]

It gives 170 armor. Here's a ss for reference

129417
Lol what is this, a rogue or a war.

[Serancha]

There will never be a perfect drop rate that would satisfy players AND stabilize the economy.

Increasing drop rates:
- Decreases economic value
- Decreases demand
- Increases satisfaction for lower-class players
- Decreases satisfaction for upper-class players

Decreasing drop rates:
- Increases economic value
- Increases demand
- Decreases satisfaction for lower-class players
- Increases satisfaction for upper-class players

So basically adding incentives ruins the economy which also lowers long-term satisfaction. It kicks up the drive to play for a limited amount of time until the supply overlaps the demand. The only way to counteract this would be to release new and better items more frequently to raise the demand before the current items expire or fall short of the curve.

The drop rates are low because STS wants to preserve the longevity of the items, because they don't want to have to release new items more often. I find this as a good idea to an extent that has already been overexecuted. STS should release new items more often to increase interest and they would also have more elbow-room to have higher drop rates.

We're talking about the difference between rare, ridiculous and impossible.


Rare:
I have run arena 600+ times and only seen one recipe drop, and that was for someone else.

Ridiculous:
In approximately 300 planar tombs runs, I have looted exactly 2 planar tombs chests. These chests contain one item, and there is a 4% chance of a dark armour inside that can be crafted into imbued. ALL other loot in those chests is worth maybe 10 gold tops.

Neither of the above situations are unusual as far as drop rates per number of runs.

Impossible
We have heard in another thread (http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?217082-Remiem-s-Weekly-Community-Update-March-25-2015&p=2102931&viewfull=1#post2102931), of over 20,000 arena chests opened and not one single fossil.

[Alhuntrazeck]

The original premise of the game was that you could get ALL items with a reasonable amount of work by farming. The advantage plat gave was supposed to be expediting the process so you could get items a bit faster.

This did NOT mean that the items had to be purchased by plat people who would then sell it on the cs. That is not how it was originally, nor should it have ever turned to that. It meant you could farm for any item you wanted, and could actually expect that one day you could obtain it with hard work.

The drop rates for farming any decent items are now so low that it's laughable. So what's the incentive to play?


I wasn't around then. This is clearly before mythic weapons, armor and amulets. I only started playing last october so idk. As far as I know, none of the mythics in crates were available from farming and hard work. You don't need arcane ring to be successful in PVP. You can farm until you loot or can buy imbued and same can be said about planar. I know there are some mythic pets that are sometimes purchaseable by plat, but this idea you speak of applies to all arcane pets as well. Were they ever farmable?



The game was actually far different 2 years ago. There were no crates, no mythics, no arcanes. The best gear was legendary and completely attainable if you worked for it. The old cap was 1M. Then STS introduced the Locked Crates which were a way for people to get things they could already farm for with plat. Which was fine.

But these crates were a big flop and sold for about 500G each. So STS then added the first mythic item, the mythic helm, and the Arcane Hooks. This of course got plenty of people to open crates because the above could not be looted anywhere else in the game besides elite chests, and those chests were so rare and the possibility of looting something was so low it was impractical.

IMO, the first mistake was to add exclusive item like the first arcane pet - Hammerjaw. Locked prices increased, people continued to pop crates, and STS was satisfied.

Now HJ was not as game changing as, say, Nekro was. And however much you argue about it, the only viable way of getting a fossil is through a crate. Hence began the P2W era, going on from HJ to Glacian to Whim Brothers to Samael to Singe to Nekro...and the cycle will only continue unless its firmly stopped.

People who pay have the right to have an easy way to getting what they want. Not to be the only people to get it. There is no way for a regular person to get maxed without spending plat. Is it just me, or is this screwed up?

[Zylx]

There will never be a perfect drop rate that would satisfy players AND stabilize the economy.

Increasing drop rates:
- Decreases economic value
- Decreases demand
- Increases satisfaction for lower-class players
- Decreases satisfaction for upper-class players

Decreasing drop rates:
- Increases economic value
- Increases demand
- Decreases satisfaction for lower-class players
- Increases satisfaction for upper-class players

So basically adding incentives ruins the economy which also lowers long-term satisfaction. It kicks up the drive to play for a limited amount of time until the supply overlaps the demand. The only way to counteract this would be to release new and better items more frequently to raise the demand before the current items expire or fall short of the curve.

The drop rates are low because STS wants to preserve the longevity of the items, because they don't want to have to release new items more often. I find this as a good idea to an extent that has already been overexecuted. STS should release new items more often to increase interest and they would also have more elbow-room to have higher drop rates.

We're talking about the difference between rare, ridiculous and impossible.


Rare:
I have run arena 600+ times and only seen one recipe drop, and that was for someone else.

Ridiculous:
In approximately 300 planar tombs runs, I have looted exactly 2 planar tombs chests. These chests contain one item, and there is a 4% chance of a dark armour inside that can be crafted into imbued. ALL other loot in those chests is worth maybe 10 gold tops.

Neither of the above situations are unusual as far as drop rates per number of runs.

Impossible
We have heard in another thread, of over 20,000 arena chests opened and not one single fossil.

I agree that some items should have their rates increased, but with STS's seemingly lack of attention towards updating their itemization, the items would become near worthless before STS releases something to replace them. Much like the Tindirin Elite Legendaries, which are not even worth the time to farm for. STS needs to up the drop rates and be ready to release better incarnations of the items to prevent the economy from collapsing on itself and avoid disinteresting the players.

[Unhinqed]

Do you guys miss the old days?

PVP is boring :( no more rivalry.. less pro players... meh
Here is how AL will be revived...

When they put a new god dang class to play, in the game.

[suckyiknow]

Is a mod gonna check this thread out? :rolleyes:

[ueveotadeo]

I agree that some items should have their rates increased, but with STS's seemingly lack of attention towards updating their itemization, the items would become near worthless before STS releases something to replace them. Much like the Tindirin Elite Legendaries, which are not even worth the time to farm for. STS needs to up the drop rates and be ready to release better incarnations of the items to prevent the economy from collapsing on itself and avoid disinteresting the players.

That is imho one of the biggest mistakes by STS. Let's be honest here, AL game play is quite simple, skill tree nonexistent so if you bother to read forums to see what each stats means you will have an overall understanding of game mechanics, which in AL case, is not that complex (appart of the buff/debuff system that really should be reviewed).

Now, I'm not saying that we don't have skilled players. I had the pleasure of running with some of them. What I'm saying, specially in PVP, is that Gear >>>>>> skills and as Alhuntrazeck said, best gear can be acquired by poping lockeds. No real skills involved, much less to use the acquired gear, which in turns leads us on how to control gear longevity/rarity and the only answer for that, taking in consideration how things work right now, is by increase/decrease drop rate.

Now I'll talk about my experience in game and I'll probably start with a very controversial theme that is item rarity. I never understood the need of some players in keep asking for things to stay "rare". I agree that some items should be more exclusive, but exclusive right now is having a bigger bank account. Imo Gear should give you a little bit of advantage on hardest maps, shouldn't be a game changing factor like it is right now.
Also, I never understood this "pro" concept that goes around this GAME, you can see that I said GAME, coz in the end it is just a GAME, you play to have fun, and to be considered a PRO right now, you just need gear. That is what, imo, is killing the game, jealousy to be the only one having an item, call me stupid but I dont see the point.

Coming back a little to the topic, why game is not fun? Because is everything about gears and "KDRs".

-CTF: Well, carmine_blade and Ravager already explained how pointless it is right now to go there.

-KDR: How many time the "pros" of PVP stay when the fight is balanced? when gear on both sides are at same level and you have to put some effort into it?

-Gears: the need for exclusiveness, the jealousy it is just sickening. Also all the work on new maps for new gears it is really unnecessary imo. We have a lot of "abbandoned" maps, something as simple as scaling those other elite maps to current lvl cap and adding a somewhat big questline that rewards you a new gear seems so simple. No need to spend months planing new maps, we got plenty of maps, we need items to farm. Please note when I say those things I mean to really reward people, not a really small chance to drop something that has an even smaller chance of having a good item inside.

Lately all updates have been about getting us into spending plats. Pets crates, 2x arcane chance. I mean, from january to september/october last year I dont remember having a 2x arcane/mythic drop rate. From october/november to january/february how many we got?

As Serancha said, the premise game was built on was that if you worked a little bit more, you could farm everything you need. By working harder you would develop your skills. So a win-win scenario. Right now you just need 1h a good credit card and some luck.

Also, by not making a somewhat more complex skill tree with more options I think STS moves on how to improve/balance things are way too limited. It is all about gears, weel, just my 2 cents.

[epicrrr]

@topic which is about the old days not rich-poor gap.

Rivalry means more trashtalking means more player with poisonous attitude and ego problem, isnt that what happened to level 41 a supposed model bracket for everyone but because of "rivalry" everyone started acting bad and the demons in their hearts were let loose that gives you a glimpse how bad mankind can be. Hence a couple of really bad issue resulting in a lot of player being banned from rival guild.

Why would anyone miss that?

[raw]

This thread is TL;DR, but the few responses I did read really stuck a chord for me. I'll tell you a little about my experience as it has changed over time.

I started playing AL back in s1 a mage who figured out the game pretty quickly, and started farming elite maps. I wasn't great or rich, but I was really enjoying playing. My goal was to buy a mighty flamestrike which cost about 100k at the time, and with a lot of hard work I was able to buy that item which was the best mage weapon at the time.

Point being, the way this game has changed from f2p to p2p is truly disappointing. But at the end of the day, I think we all realize that STS is a business, and understand that they have to find a way to make money off of all their hard work. What I expected, however, was for them to take that money and continuously improve the game's graphics, skill system, quest lines, skill trees, etc. But rather, we've seen that money go towards additional content (which is definitely still exciting, just not what the game needs). Fast forward to 2+ years later, and what we have is a game that has had layers upon layers of expansions built onto a shaky foundation.

The culture has changed completely. In s1 whenever I saw a maxed geared player I knew that this player had worked hard and achieved a commensurate reward for that farming. Now, when I see a fully maxed player (nekro/sns, imbued, arc ring) I just think to myself - by default - that they spent thousands of dollars on plat. The way people act in PvP (comparing s2/3/4 to s7) is insanely different. Back in the earlier seasons players didn't trash talk nearly the same amount as they do now. The PvP atmosphere is honestly unhealthy for anyone who stays in there too long. Just look at the CTF lb. If you sift past the kill farmers you'll notice that many of the top players have quit. Demonassa, Predladen, Xgra, etc.

Now that I've stated the obvious, lets look at potential ways that STG can rebound from years of allowing Arcane Legends to be their cash cow.

- First, see http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?216538-Give-the-farmers-a-bone-!!!! for suggestions on how to improve farming in-game. If you didn't click the link, basically this thread proposes ways to make farming more profitable by increasing gold loot from bosses
- Next, implement seasonal leaderboards
- Scale all elite maps to level 41
- Buff Scorch!
- Buff tank skills in PvE
- Correct skills so they all work as intended (CS not stopping windups, Nox damage being 15% less instead of more, SSS not aiming properly, glitched Shadow Pierce damage, etc...)
- Actually ban people for using profanity, & kill farming
- Increase moderator interaction with the game by hiring interns from your local university (University of Texas @ Austin)
- Decrease the gear gap by introducing strong gear next season that's targeted towards the "middle class"
- Update the graphics of player classes (rogues, tanks, mages).
- Incorporate a new quest line into older maps
- Buff drop rate from .000001% to like .1% (which works out to 1/1000) for fossil in arena. I GUARANTEE by doing this, you will increase the amount of players that run Arena by a significant amount, which would increase elixir and ankh sales, making you more money overall than keeping it as is
- Revamp rewards for hauntlet

If some of these things are done, the "good old days" will be back.

[Bellaelda]

This thread is TL;DR, but the few responses I did read really stuck a chord for me. I'll tell you a little about my experience as it has changed over time.

I started playing AL back in s1 a mage who figured out the game pretty quickly, and started farming elite maps. I wasn't great or rich, but I was really enjoying playing. My goal was to buy a mighty flamestrike which cost about 100k at the time, and with a lot of hard work I was able to buy that item which was the best mage weapon at the time.

Point being, the way this game has changed from f2p to p2p is truly disappointing. But at the end of the day, I think we all realize that STS is a business, and understand that they have to find a way to make money off of all their hard work. What I expected, however, was for them to take that money and continuously improve the game's graphics, skill system, quest lines, skill trees, etc. But rather, we've seen that money go towards additional content (which is definitely still exciting, just not what the game needs). Fast forward to 2+ years later, and what we have is a game that has had layers upon layers of expansions built onto a shaky foundation.

The culture has changed completely. In s1 whenever I saw a maxed geared player I knew that this player had worked hard and achieved a commensurate reward for that farming. Now, when I see a fully maxed player (nekro/sns, imbued, arc ring) I just think to myself - by default - that they spent thousands of dollars on plat. The way people act in PvP (comparing s2/3/4 to s7) is insanely different. Back in the earlier seasons players didn't trash talk nearly the same amount as they do now. The PvP atmosphere is honestly unhealthy for anyone who stays in there too long. Just look at the CTF lb. If you sift past the kill farmers you'll notice that many of the top players have quit. Demonassa, Predladen, Xgra, etc.

Now that I've stated the obvious, lets look at potential ways that STG can rebound from years of allowing Arcane Legends to be their cash cow.

- First, see http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?216538-Give-the-farmers-a-bone-!!!! for suggestions on how to improve farming in-game. If you didn't click the link, basically this thread proposes ways to make farming more profitable by increasing gold loot from bosses
- Next, implement seasonal leaderboards
- Scale all elite maps to level 41
- Buff Scorch!
- Buff tank skills in PvE
- Correct skills so they all work as intended (CS not stopping windups, Nox damage being 15% less instead of more, SSS not aiming properly, glitched Shadow Pierce damage, etc...)
- Actually ban people for using profanity, & kill farming
- Increase moderator interaction with the game by hiring interns from your local university (University of Texas @ Austin)
- Decrease the gear gap by introducing strong gear next season that's targeted towards the "middle class"
- Update the graphics of player classes (rogues, tanks, mages).
- Incorporate a new quest line into older maps
- Buff drop rate from .000001% to like .1% (which works out to 1/1000) for fossil in arena. I GUARANTEE by doing this, you will increase the amount of players that run Arena by a significant amount, which would increase elixir and ankh sales, making you more money overall than keeping it as is
- Revamp rewards for hauntlet

If some of these things are done, the "good old days" will be back.

All great ideas... I'd add to buff mages in pvp too
But those ideas would be great... Especially gear being added to close the gap and seasonal lbs! We've benn begging for seasonal lbs since game launched.

[Serancha]

something as simple as scaling those other elite maps to current lvl cap and adding a somewhat big questline that rewards you a new gear seems so simple.

I have always thought the old maps should be fully scaled also. They're elite, aren't they? Why can they not be actually elite?

[raw]

I have always thought the old maps should be fully scaled also. They're elite, aren't they? Why can they not be actually elite?

Agreed. There's no reason that a map like Forest should be finished in under a minute. I remember in s1 when I used to get one hit on that map. (I was really really noob, lol!)

If tombs are scaled, then so should elite maps.

[farizace99]

And about endgame pvp, it is not as fun as last time because now only players with arcane rings rules the pvp.And the rest of the players without mythic weapon/arcane rings will often lose in pvp..Unlike last time when endgame pvp lvl 36/41, there were no arcane ring players that enters pvp.Mostly all players play compy.Just saying im not jealous about rich players.Just that most other players with no lvl 41 mythic weapon,arcane ring and arcane pets just slowly lose interest in endgame pvp.

[Zylx]

That is imho one of the biggest mistakes by STS. Let's be honest here, AL game play is quite simple, skill tree nonexistent so if you bother to read forums to see what each stats means you will have an overall understanding of game mechanics, which in AL case, is not that complex (appart of the buff/debuff system that really should be reviewed).

Now, I'm not saying that we don't have skilled players. I had the pleasure of running with some of them. What I'm saying, specially in PVP, is that Gear >>>>>> skills and as Alhuntrazeck said, best gear can be acquired by poping lockeds. No real skills involved, much less to use the acquired gear, which in turns leads us on how to control gear longevity/rarity and the only answer for that, taking in consideration how things work right now, is by increase/decrease drop rate.

Now I'll talk about my experience in game and I'll probably start with a very controversial theme that is item rarity. I never understood the need of some players in keep asking for things to stay "rare". I agree that some items should be more exclusive, but exclusive right now is having a bigger bank account. Imo Gear should give you a little bit of advantage on hardest maps, shouldn't be a game changing factor like it is right now.
Also, I never understood this "pro" concept that goes around this GAME, you can see that I said GAME, coz in the end it is just a GAME, you play to have fun, and to be considered a PRO right now, you just need gear. That is what, imo, is killing the game, jealousy to be the only one having an item, call me stupid but I dont see the point.

Coming back a little to the topic, why game is not fun? Because is everything about gears and "KDRs".

-CTF: Well, carmine_blade and Ravager already explained how pointless it is right now to go there.

-KDR: How many time the "pros" of PVP stay when the fight is balanced? when gear on both sides are at same level and you have to put some effort into it?

-Gears: the need for exclusiveness, the jealousy it is just sickening. Also all the work on new maps for new gears it is really unnecessary imo. We have a lot of "abbandoned" maps, something as simple as scaling those other elite maps to current lvl cap and adding a somewhat big questline that rewards you a new gear seems so simple. No need to spend months planing new maps, we got plenty of maps, we need items to farm. Please note when I say those things I mean to really reward people, not a really small chance to drop something that has an even smaller chance of having a good item inside.

Lately all updates have been about getting us into spending plats. Pets crates, 2x arcane chance. I mean, from january to september/october last year I dont remember having a 2x arcane/mythic drop rate. From october/november to january/february how many we got?

As Serancha said, the premise game was built on was that if you worked a little bit more, you could farm everything you need. By working harder you would develop your skills. So a win-win scenario. Right now you just need 1h a good credit card and some luck.

Also, by not making a somewhat more complex skill tree with more options I think STS moves on how to improve/balance things are way too limited. It is all about gears, weel, just my 2 cents.

What there needs to be is an improvement to itemization. As I said before, an item will only last as long as demand exceeds supply. The Tindirin Legendaries were considered top-notch for the middle class of players upon release who couldn't afford mythics. It also gave an incentive to farm the hell out of Tindirin. Imo, elite legendaries should be refreshed every month or two to keep the stats at a competitive level, instead of waiting a year for a new expansion to hit and allow the middle class to fall behind.

I'm torn on the crates though. What completely ruins them is the lack of variety in the loot. Its always 2k 2k 2k or 2k Legendary Smelly Helm 2k. They are completely worthless because no one wants to open them. If exclusive items were to be removed, the crates will go back to being worth 500g, and crates are the best thing to farm for the lower class, beginner players. The only way to save these crates is to increase demand.

I really wish STS would allow a way to "unlock" these crates to allow f2p players to have a chance of looting these exclusive items. And the problem isn't in releasing exclusive items, its in releasing exclusive items that are far beyond in stats than what they should be. The improved itemization I mentioned before would take care of this. The middle class should be competitive with the upper class. Stat differentials should only be minor.

My 2 cents :)

[darthdlo]

Plat purchased drgb vanity did not give stat bonuses only the looted versions did had every set including blk regular gear version that y i quit pl they screwed that up bad

[Petrichor]

When I ask my friends from other legends games why they will not play AL or give it more of a chance they all pretty much say the same thing, "It cost too much money." I used to be very active in season 1. I remember when locks came out and we thought it was absolutely ridiculous to spend 15 plat to open a chest. In fact, I think bojangles and I laughed about the idea that people would. Fast forward to today and people are spending hundreds of dollars to potentially loot something of value. I just think it is a bit ridiculous that the only way to obtain the arcane pets are by spending lots of plat and having enough luck to win the lottery. I have seen the threads complaining about the drop rates in PvE. I think that is what stops me from playing more actively. I love farming, but as said above, it is is not encouraging to farm something that is a rare drop only to open it and have an even more rare chance of getting the item you're hoping for.
I do understand that plat spending helps support the economy. I just think drop rates should be increased. There are other ways to keep the economy going then to limit the best items to a chest where you have to potentially spend hundreds of dollars on. Perhaps better elixirs for farming maps similar to how it was done in PL. Or implement other advantages. In PL they introduced the thrasher elixirs. Those still remain successful as far as I have seen; however, they are not completely necessary. It's the person's choice whether to purchase it or not. If you chose not to spend your money on an elixir then you still had a good enough chance at getting the item you want. It wasn't like if you don't buy it then you're out of luck. I just find it very discouraging. Like, if I am going to spend money on a game I want to feel confident that it might benefit me and not just have me sitting there with like 100k in profit, which in AL is not very much. Even if it is just on elixirs, I know that I spent my money having fun farming with friends rather than sitting in town pressing an unlock button.

[Kingofninjas]

Back in s1, I was a silly little mage who didn't know about respec, had a 3 str 2 int 1 dex build and basically believed that I could get the best possible gear. I spent my days levelling up and standing in pier trying to find a party for elite Bael. When I realized my build was silly, I deleted that mage and build another one. But, while doing all this, the best gear was ALWAYS within reach. By the time Nordr was released, in s3, I had moved on to playing tank. During that reason, I was pretty much in Elite Oltgar all day. I farmed my way to a noble set, an entombed hammer of warfare, and a little gold in my pocket. I even got gutsy and opened rougly 50 elite golden chests at once, which would have sold for enough to buy me a mythic set. My point is, that back then not only was the best gear farmable, but I am sure I could have stood my own fairly well in PvP (i never entered pvp so I would not know for sure).

In s6, I finally got a mythic helm and armor (upgraded). This is when I first entered PvP. At first, I had no clue what i was doing. A kind soul must have seen some sort of potentil in me and invited me to join Epitome of Silentkill, where they taught me not to open a clash with charged nox and about the distance of aimed shot and all kinds of helpful tricks. But even with only a mythic set and a legendary ring, amulet and weapon, PvP was possible and I could hold my own against majority of players.

Today, I am one of those overgeared players the legendary PvPers rightfully complain about. I have enough gear that while VSing a legendary rogue my tactic is pretty to tank their first combo and then 1 hit them while their skill is on cd. Am I they only one who finds something wrong with that. The funny fact is, there are players who can do that against me as well. These are the ring, imbued set and nekro users. I can't even imagine how it is for the legendary players. The gear gap is so ridiculous that there are players with pretty much twice the stats of a legendary one. I do not consider myself to be a noob, but while facing a nekro user, pretty much all I can do is hide and pray that they start pinging out so I have a chance.

Here are solutions to start off with to resolve this obscene gear difference-

1) Give us the lvl 46 mythic ring that should have been released instead of the lvl 41 mythic amulet and MAKE IT FARMABLE. Throw it in locked crates if you want, but make it possible to get without spending a single locked and without requiring a unnatural amount of luck.
Note: I do not consider planar amulet or nekro farmable because the odds of looted a recipe or fossil are just too low. Also, a high number of ankhs, which are nothing but plats are needed.

2) Make the legendary gear that drops from the hardest elite bosses not 5 levels, but 1 or two levels below the mythic one. Give us an amulet that when ocmpared to the planar amulet only shows a hp difference of 200 or max 300 hp instead of the 700-800 hp it has over the fang of fenrir. Give us a weapon that is only 20-30 damage weaker than the mythic one instead of a 80-100 damage difference. MOST OF ALL GIVE US A NEW MYTHIC RING.

3) Introduce farmable pets that either directly counter nekro and sns, such as a pet that removes all buffs from the opponent team the way misty and ironbite remove debuffs from our own, or a pet that has a similar AA to theirs. For example, a pet that gives us a shield that provides stun immunity and aborbs more than 500 damage would be appreciated. Nekro will remain on top because of the speed boost and the fact that its shield will absorb more damage, but players who cannot afford to spend 50m on a pet have an alternative to it.

4) Start cleaning up PvP, especially ctf. There are far too many players who walk into a pvp, especially ctf, game and simply expect not to be killed or be able to free flag without being bothered. When you kill them, they take offence and start spewing such profanities that if they were not hiding behind a computer screen, would result in them being beaten up. Just the other day, I refused to allow a player to free flag because the opponent team was a player down in a clash, so he blocked the game for over 20 minutes by simply staying dead and trash talking while we clashed. Start banning dummy farmers and actually issuing temporary and eventually permanent bans for the use of excessive profanities.

[Tatman]

Introduce actual gamemasters. If you don't know what a gamemaster is -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamemaster

This will solve a lot of problems, especially ones that have to do with using profanities, dummy farming, scamming, bullying and stuff like that. Plus, if at least some of them (the gms) play the game, they will, for example, tell devs how a 100 gold drop is not "substantial" and, what's even better - devs might actually listen to them. ;)

[Twinisland]

Back in s1, I was a silly little mage who didn't know about respec, had a 3 str 2 int 1 dex build and basically believed that I could get the best possible gear. I spent my days levelling up and standing in pier trying to find a party for elite Bael. When I realized my build was silly, I deleted that mage and build another one. But, while doing all this, the best gear was ALWAYS within reach. By the time Nordr was released, in s3, I had moved on to playing tank. During that reason, I was pretty much in Elite Oltgar all day. I farmed my way to a noble set, an entombed hammer of warfare, and a little gold in my pocket. I even got gutsy and opened rougly 50 elite golden chests at once, which would have sold for enough to buy me a mythic set. My point is, that back then not only was the best gear farmable, but I am sure I could have stood my own fairly well in PvP (i never entered pvp so I would not know for sure).

In s6, I finally got a mythic helm and armor (upgraded). This is when I first entered PvP. At first, I had no clue what i was doing. A kind soul must have seen some sort of potentil in me and invited me to join Epitome of Silentkill, where they taught me not to open a clash with charged nox and about the distance of aimed shot and all kinds of helpful tricks. But even with only a mythic set and a legendary ring, amulet and weapon, PvP was possible and I could hold my own against majority of players.

Today, I am one of those overgeared players the legendary PvPers rightfully complain about. I have enough gear that while VSing a legendary rogue my tactic is pretty to tank their first combo and then 1 hit them while their skill is on cd. Am I they only one who finds something wrong with that. The funny fact is, there are players who can do that against me as well. These are the ring, imbued set and nekro users. I can't even imagine how it is for the legendary players. The gear gap is so ridiculous that there are players with pretty much twice the stats of a legendary one. I do not consider myself to be a noob, but while facing a nekro user, pretty much all I can do is hide and pray that they start pinging out so I have a chance.

Here are solutions to start off with to resolve this obscene gear difference-

1) Give us the lvl 46 mythic ring that should have been released instead of the lvl 41 mythic amulet and MAKE IT FARMABLE. Throw it in locked crates if you want, but make it possible to get without spending a single locked and without requiring a unnatural amount of luck.
Note: I do not consider planar amulet or nekro farmable because the odds of looted a recipe or fossil are just too low. Also, a high number of ankhs, which are nothing but plats are needed.

2) Make the legendary gear that drops from the hardest elite bosses not 5 levels, but 1 or two levels below the mythic one. Give us an amulet that when ocmpared to the planar amulet only shows a hp difference of 200 or max 300 hp instead of the 700-800 hp it has over the fang of fenrir. Give us a weapon that is only 20-30 damage weaker than the mythic one instead of a 80-100 damage difference. MOST OF ALL GIVE US A NEW MYTHIC RING.

3) Introduce farmable pets that either directly counter nekro and sns, such as a pet that removes all buffs from the opponent team the way misty and ironbite remove debuffs from our own, or a pet that has a similar AA to theirs. For example, a pet that gives us a shield that provides stun immunity and aborbs more than 500 damage would be appreciated. Nekro will remain on top because of the speed boost and the fact that its shield will absorb more damage, but players who cannot afford to spend 50m on a pet have an alternative to it.

4) Start cleaning up PvP, especially ctf. There are far too many players who walk into a pvp, especially ctf, game and simply expect not to be killed or be able to free flag without being bothered. When you kill them, they take offence and start spewing such profanities that if they were not hiding behind a computer screen, would result in them being beaten up. Just the other day, I refused to allow a player to free flag because the opponent team was a player down in a clash, so he blocked the game for over 20 minutes by simply staying dead and trash talking while we clashed. Start banning dummy farmers and actually issuing temporary and eventually permanent bans for the use of excessive profanities.
Love this guy he used the hiding behind the screen line. BTW those geared unskilled free flagging players are noobs (not all geared players just the ones everyone hates) I one day wish to become as good as you in pvp.

[Kingofninjas]

Another big issue I forgot to mention in my previous post are guilds. These days, we see a couple of major guilds completely dominating PvP, especially CTF. In tdm the situation isn't so bad because the games are to short for it to escalate to the level it does in CTF, but CTF is a different ball game all together. We see guild with 3 people on each team, with a couple free flagging their way to 10k flags and the remaining running around spawning while their guild mates on the opposite side block. I am not naming any guild herguilds most of the major PvP guilds do indulge in this. Speaking as someone who has just recently made the switch from a major guild with over 300 people to solo to a small guild of friends, I have experienced this first hand, having been on both sides of this issue.

Some people, especially those with a large guild to back them up, immediately call, even when the fight is fair. It is too late to do much about this now, but for any future sts games, I strongly recommend that they limit the number of players in a single guild to 50-100. This will somewhat prevent bullying and force people to be selective about guilds, ideally grouping like minded, geared and skilled people together.

Currently, the situation in CTF is borderline unbearable, with a previously unseen amount of blocking, trash talking, and bullying going on. I usually try and kill free flaggers and help people who are being ganged, but there is only so much a few people can do, especially when they are against guilds of over 300 people each.
Sts needs to rethink the current PvP situation. I would suggest that they remove the chat box altogether. Do not provide people with a /a option at all. Alternatively, people entering a PvP room should be anonymous. They should have either a red or blue vanity depending on their team and be listed as Player #X.

[Bellaelda]

I don't think they should limit guilds that way cause large guilds are great for pve and finding groups to run, but I would be OK with making the pvp rooms anonymous or something along these lines.

[Kingofninjas]

I see everyone's concern with the gear discrepancy and I'll be honest that I felt the same way for a long time. It was frustrating to me that the same people in PVP who had arcane rings, were also the same people who had SNS for the last year. It was very difficult to beat a player with such and extreme difference in gear.

However, I want to make a couple of points from what I've noticed and maybe you can think about this for yourself. First, there are many players who are very rich and will always have unlimited gold until probably the day they quit. However, many of the players that you see wearing an arcane rings (including myself) are people who share the ring. For example, I'm a 50%owner of mine and I know some people who split the arcane rings 3 ways. This option is available to you as well if there's someone that you can truly trust. You can probably pick up a clean ring for around 40m so all you need to come up with is 20m for a 50% ownership. That's only 2 recipes from the arena. Sure, it may not happen over night but it will probably happen within the next few months if you keep at it. Bare in mind there's an expansion coming and also STS has announced that there's events on the horizon, so there's plenty of opportunities to make gold.


The second point I want to make is regarding Nekro. Everyone is currently jumping up and down and feeling that it is way too OP. I want this group of people to think which is better, having the option to one day own a Nekro or having the most OP pet in the game remain SNS, a pet which you can NEVER obtain. IMO SNS drastically changed and destroyed PvP for a very long time. As an averagely geared mage (without arcane ring), I was able kill many of the arcane rogues and I was ok with even losing 3/5 tries. However, SNS made it impossible. They simply stood in the stacked green pools and were healing faster than I could practically deal damage. Then my shield wore out and I would get 1 hit. In CTF, SNS is still extremely OP. What everyone needs to understand is in a short clash, having multiple Nekro's does not really offer an advantage because the shields do not stack and there is a cool down of about 3 seconds between shields. All you need is 1 Nekro per team. However, multiple SNS is very hard to fight against. Nekro is extremely new in popularity so just wait 2 or 3 months and every single team will have it just like everyone has Samael now. When that happens, the price won't be 40m+ but it will be 20m or so because it will be so common. Either way, everyone needs to get over Samael. That pet has had its day.

The last point I want to make is also about the arcane ring. It wasn't the arcane ring that was so extremely OP. Frankly, the stats aren't that impressive for the price. It was the fact that everyone else was using a mythic ring from 2 level caps ago. This was a huge mistake from STS in my opinion because there was nothing in between. There was thread after thread about this subject and it fell of deaf ears. All that STS needed to do is release a 41 ring that was slightly worse than the arcane one and the prices for both would have been moderate.

I do not think arcane ring is much of an issue. I do not own one and I can still compete against them. What I cannot compete against is nekro. As of now, the only way to get nekro is in a crate or to pay 50m for it, something I, and 95% of the playing population, are both unable and unwilling to do. If you try to vs a player of your gear level that has a nekro while you do not use it, I can assure you you will lose 9/10 times no matter how skilled you are.

Honestly, I am happy that there is a pet like nekro since PvP was just a stunfest before that, but that is only because I usually have a player with nekro on my side or one I can call for help. Most players do not have this privilige, and a nekro opposite to them means certain loss. Keeping in mind the difficulties of all players, it would be better if sns remained the best since they are rare enough that most people don't have to worry about running into one of them.

[Alhuntrazeck]

Another big issue I forgot to mention in my previous post are guilds. These days, we see a couple of major guilds completely dominating PvP, especially CTF. In tdm the situation isn't so bad because the games are to short for it to escalate to the level it does in CTF, but CTF is a different ball game all together. We see guild with 3 people on each team, with a couple free flagging their way to 10k flags and the remaining running around spawning while their guild mates on the opposite side block. I am not naming any guild herguilds most of the major PvP guilds do indulge in this. Speaking as someone who has just recently made the switch from a major guild with over 300 people to solo to a small guild of friends, I have experienced this first hand, having been on both sides of this issue.

Some people, especially those with a large guild to back them up, immediately call, even when the fight is fair. It is too late to do much about this now, but for any future sts games, I strongly recommend that they limit the number of players in a single guild to 50-100. This will somewhat prevent bullying and force people to be selective about guilds, ideally grouping like minded, geared and skilled people together.

Currently, the situation in CTF is borderline unbearable, with a previously unseen amount of blocking, trash talking, and bullying going on. I usually try and kill free flaggers and help people who are being ganged, but there is only so much a few people can do, especially when they are against guilds of over 300 people each.
Sts needs to rethink the current PvP situation. I would suggest that they remove the chat box altogether. Do not provide people with a /a option at all. Alternatively, people entering a PvP room should be anonymous. They should have either a red or blue vanity depending on their team and be listed as Player #X.

+1 to these suggestions.

The chatbox should remain imo, with the /a command removed, so people can discuss strategies.

[Kingofninjas]

I don't think they should limit guilds that way cause large guilds are great for pve and finding groups to run, but I would be OK with making the pvp rooms anonymous or something along these lines.

My apologies. I had not considered pve and was speaking from a pure PvP standpoint. Since limiting guilds would ruin the pve experience, and hence affect game experience, that is not a viable solution. In light of that, making PvP rooms anonymous, or making a separate anonymous room is the only solution that strikes me as viable to adopt.

[Kriticality]

If pvp was anonymous and you couldn't know if you're practicing with your team for either clash or sts tourney then there would have to be custom pvp games. Games where you have to be invited into the game and first to join each side would be responsible for the invited so to organize guild clashes/wars. People absolutely should be able to make teams to play with. It's team games.

That would also solve the issue of people wanting a 1 v 1 arena. If those 2 people join opposite sides, they can choose to invite others or stay 1 v 1.

I hear you about nekro but he's definitely beatable in a team game. It takes some creativity. I am a fan of nekro. I hope to have one in the not too distant future. I'm geared though and both sns and nekro are HUGE barriers for under or average geared players.

My best pvp times anyway are organized clashes. It's most fun and gives you a chance to encounter new problems and problem solve. Also lets you adjust strategy which is why it's important to know your team. Communication is key.

Maybe if there were different pvp "playlist." Like a royal rumble pit. Team vs. And of course a custom game option. Maybe even go so far as set amount of kills to win in custom games. I'd love a first to 100 tdm game.

[Kingofninjas]

If pvp was anonymous and you couldn't know if you're practicing with your team for either clash or sts tourney then there would have to be custom pvp games. Games where you have to be invited into the game and first to join each side would be responsible for the invited so to organize guild clashes/wars. People absolutely should be able to make teams to play with. It's team games.

That would also solve the issue of people wanting a 1 v 1 arena. If those 2 people join opposite sides, they can choose to invite others or stay 1 v 1.

I hear you about nekro but he's definitely beatable in a team game. It takes some creativity. I am a fan of nekro. I hope to have one in the not too distant future. I'm geared though and both sns and nekro are HUGE barriers for under or average geared players.

My best pvp times anyway are organized clashes. It's most fun and gives you a chance to encounter new problems and problem solve. Also lets you adjust strategy which is why it's important to know your team. Communication is key.

Maybe if there were different pvp "playlist." Like a royal rumble pit. Team vs. And of course a custom game option. Maybe even go so far as set amount of kills to win in custom games. I'd love a first to 100 tdm game.

The anonymous room suggestion was meant as an addition, not as a replacement.

As for nekro, it is beatable, but rarely so. If you wish to, I am happy to organize an even geared clash where my team has a nekro and yours doesn't (for the sake of better data as if it was your team with the nekro I could throw the game for the sake if pricing my point).

Additionally, I am always ready to clash on even pet terms just for fun, so hit me up in game any time.

[Newcomx]

Do you guys miss the old days?

PVP is boring :( no more rivalry.. less pro players... meh

This situation already occur long time ago... and still no change. We need revolutionary change in this game! Not only small change.

[Litheus]

more money making options will solve

[Bellaelda]

If pvp was anonymous and you couldn't know if you're practicing with your team for either clash or sts tourney then there would have to be custom pvp games. Games where you have to be invited into the game and first to join each side would be responsible for the invited so to organize guild clashes/wars. People absolutely should be able to make teams to play with. It's team games.

That would also solve the issue of people wanting a 1 v 1 arena. If those 2 people join opposite sides, they can choose to invite others or stay 1 v 1.

I hear you about nekro but he's definitely beatable in a team game. It takes some creativity. I am a fan of nekro. I hope to have one in the not too distant future. I'm geared though and both sns and nekro are HUGE barriers for under or average geared players.

My best pvp times anyway are organized clashes. It's most fun and gives you a chance to encounter new problems and problem solve. Also lets you adjust strategy which is why it's important to know your team. Communication is key.

Maybe if there were different pvp "playlist." Like a royal rumble pit. Team vs. And of course a custom game option. Maybe even go so far as set amount of kills to win in custom games. I'd love a first to 100 tdm game.

I really think that sts had a really good system in PL where u could create a game and lock the map so that only people with the password could join... I know they still have this system enabled in this game since they've used it for pvp tournaments... They should just allow us to create games ourselves... That would solve a ton of issues of blockers, 1v1, clash, etc!

[Arachnophobik]

Agreed. So much maxed ppl these days. Back then i only did tdm because most of the maxed out players are kill farming in ctf, nowadays theyre everywhere lol. Most people even leave the moment they enter a map knowing they will not stand a chance with their gear. I also see a lot of maxed out players with no skills these days, but due to the huge gear gap, they usually have the upper hand. They must be like "its ok if they leave when i get in the map, at least i wont die, i got my gear to cover up my crappy skills" :/

[Ice]

Great feed back from our pro players.. nice to see old names still active.

[Aprove]

I miss Crystal caverns and Tunnels of Valheim in the old days (Lv 31 Cap), It used to be one of the best Locked Farming spot and many people go there. Now it's not anymore, because STS remove the loot table :( . And I also miss the Lv 10 PVP when there was no Paracelsus gem user.

[SacredKnight]

I swear, PvE is becoming more interesting than PvP these days. And this is coming from the guy who used to "lol@pve" to counter keikali's "lol@pvp"s. There are 2 main reasons:

1. Gear Discrepancies

Gone are the days when all one had to do to be good in PvP was to farm for decently atttainable gear, then practice, practice, practice until they got good at PvP. Right now, HOWEVER skilled you are, if you're geared out with mythic armor & helm with a legendary weapon, you'll get trashed 10 times out of 10 by a maxed out opponent. It is getting so pathetically ridiculous that people are beginning to not bother about PvP at all. Why would they, if every time they stepped into PvP, a frost bow, arcane ring, Planar amulet, imbued rogue comes along running from spawn to spawn 1 hitting them in TDM and camping outside waiting for the spawn bubble to run out in CTF?

The clear reason is this; the differences between the top-of-the-line gear and the second best gear is far too large. The elite players who spend real life money or pour hours and hours into this game to get the best gear deserve to have great gear! But not at the rate things are at the moment. Let's take a look at the gear discrepancies between an average-geared player and one who is maxed-out -

(From a rogue and mage POV. My warrior hasn't been geared out yet so I can't comment here)

The weapon: The difference between an Expedition Rifle and the Elondrian Rifle is a whopping 90+ damage and about 200-300 HP depending on gems!

Ring: The arcane ring gives an average boost of 300 HP and 40 damage over a Blood Ruby depending, again, on gems.

And amulet: The L41 mythic amulet is the strangest of all, giving a ground-breaking 600 HP increase over a Lunar or Fang!

Overall: a maxed out opponent versus an average, mythic armor & helm user has 1.1k HP more, and 130 damage more. And we're not even including the arcane pets here versus an average user's Slag or Malison!

Which wouldn't be as much of a problem if this top-of-the-line gear was actually obtainable. The reality? It sure as hell isn't! The total cost of completely gearing out your character including an arcane pet, say Nekro, actually exceeds the current gold cap. And gold in AL is hard to earn. The best Legendary items looted sell for hundred K's. So the only way of actually getting yourself geared up? Open Locked Grand Crates of the Watch.

In other words, PAY TO WIN. Clearly something is wrong here!

The consequences of this is far-reaching. When people begin to lose interest and turn to other sources of entertainment - PvE, or simply quitting the game - the number of players in PvP is reduced. There are far more empty rooms than there ever were before.

Next season provides an ideal opportunity to narrow gear discrepancies and make gear attainable. STS had the right idea by making certain things like Nekro, Imbueds and the mythic Amulet craftable.

In any MMORPG, gear should be obtainable in two ways, freemium and premium. The "premium way" should never become the norm! The best gear should be farmable a well as available in locked crates. If farmable is too easy (resulting in flooding the market), the way the Imbueds are crafted can be implemented. Unrefined gear can drop from bosses & chests & crates and have to be refined in certain ways. This will make people more interested in PvE and also increase player participation in PvP when people get good gear. The second step will be to narrow differences between top level gear and the second-best legendaries. Differences should be 20-30 damage for weapons and 200-300 HP for armor & helms.

But that's only solving one half of the problem.

2. PvP Isn't Being Played the Way Its Meant to Be

#1 is the Developers' job to fix. #2 is ours, the Player Base.

There are currently two PvP maps - Capture the Flag (CTF) and Team Deathmatch (TDM). I don't spend much time in TDM so I'm assuming things are fine over there, but its CTF where things are screwed up.

First of all, I don't believe many of the players actually know what Capture the Flag is. Its an incredibly fun game where each team has a flag to defend while at the same time trying to capture the other, opponent team's flag. The team must work as a cohesive unit to make sure their flag is safe while at the same time trying to sneak past opponents to grab their flag. The first team to reach 5 flags wins the game.

At the current way its being played, there are two groups of people in CTF - one, the people who're killing and being killed. The ones who ignore the flag and run from spawn to spawn trying to kill others while also being killed. This comprises the majority. #2 is the flaggers, the people who carry a crystal from one flag room to the other while being unhindered simply because they're "flagging". They do this to notch up the score on their screen, & to get the 10K Flags AP, and to get on the Leaderboards, whether AP or CTF Flags.

Awhile back a few players (most of whom have quit) including myself used to have CTF games which were tremendous fun, comprising strategy, technique, teamwork...sneakiness...and so on! Gear of course played a role but if a friendly game, teams were switched around to even out the discrepancies - or they'd simply gear down. But of course it is hardly practical to continuously host CTF games. Only a few people would be able to play and matches took a long time to organize. People themselves need to take the initiative to play the game the way its meant to be played.

And, of course, that requires motivation. Its a bit late in the game to change APs or the Leaderboards by removing the flag APs and the flags LB (which were a bad idea in the first place) - two years late, in fact. Many people have spent hours and hours flagging and it wouldn't be fair to make changes now.

So, the motivation. In place of the KDR box we have on our character screens, a button could be placed called Kills and Deaths or whatever, just an example. This would open a page which has 4 sections: the PvE KDR, CTF KDR, TDM KDR and a new counter called Wins and Losses - already been suggested before. The idea is, every time the game ends, the losing team would have one point added to their losses and the winning team would have one point added to their wins. This would motivate people to protect the flag and prevent their KDR from being ruined. Removing the existing KDR would be a bad idea because, just like for the flags, people have worked very hard for their kills.

If these 2 are fixed, PvP should become a much better place!

Just my $.02 and sorry for the long-wided post!

Ahh yes! I remember when PvP was introduced! Back then I still had gear that could be obtained without spending 10000 Platinum or hours :/ Now I feel like the gear difference is too high for me to even try :/

[xnorwayx]

I read many posts in this thread and many other threads. As I understood:
people without skill but with gear > people with good skill and bad gear.
My suggestion:
I know it's hard to make but, ctf rooms with your normal gear and same gear for everyone. f.eks.: Room where you can use your own gear. mythic, arcane, legendaries. An room where you will get expedition potency bow, mythic set, blood ruby and lunar/fang/doom. (All gears I mentioned are just example)

[To be or not to be...]

Pro players? Your from karma or horror so you mean geared by pro not skill.

:banana:

[D.AL]

Agree with some points discussed here.

The pvp players know each other, but for something reason like in real life, ones u like and others u dont. In many times i saw fair fights, played great ones too, and when u were winning, a desesperate call make that match unfair - Tdm btw.

Nowadays it is regular it happens in almost every match. No 1 likes too loose. -Your ego get hurt.

The "old school" (most of them) are fair, like what: they wait the match beggins with full team, if its unbalanced they sit, thats awsome. Its a good example for those who started to play pvp, U dont see this acts from almost new players. Its rare.

IMO the "ungueared/noob" ones stay together, n they kill what moves. (They are weak, they know)

Noob/ungueared on pvp is food for the "proz n geared ones", it looks like a golden rush - its easier. That improves the kdr right ? It happens a lot. Most of ppl hate pvp cuz things like that.

Another point is the guildies. All the game know the enemies of each other. Most of time they go to hunt n not make a fair play. It get the ppl pissed. Is not ur fight n u get hurt as it was. Its a snowball

Im ok with the pvp system, if i dont like (cuz pvp reasons), i leave or "call my friends". Im not a saint, when the player wanna be unfair, he will be, and he know it.

When something like that happens, u ll hunt who pissed u off for the next 10 matches in the minimun. U ve spoiled the match for those who are there to play n make some fun.

Unfortunatly it happens every day ...

[Woundedwarrior]

I began playing right before the Nordr expansion was released (idk what season that would be called). Times were definantly different then. I remember looting a champions plate of will for warrior and selling it for 120k, thinking I was the luckiest richest person ever! Now 120k is next to worthless because all the best gear and pets combined cost a minimum of 120m (mythic weapon, imbued, arcane ring, planar pendant, arcane pet)

I havent really played much since the release of the arcane ring because imo its way to op. I understand it has to be good because its arcane and all but picture this:
- Legendary rings give around equal primary stat as the players level (lvl 41 ring gives about +41 primary stat, lvl 10 ring gives about 10 primary stat, etc.)
- Arcane ring gives +73 primary stat, including mana proc, insane armor, high secondary stats, and high dmg
- By the time legendary rings catch up to arcane rings in primary stat, the lvl cap will be about 71 (at current pace will be about 7 years if game is still around then). They still won't compare due to the other stats stated above

In other words, an arcane ring will be the best rings for the next 7 years. Sure there might be a new mythic ring thrown in there but odds are one won't come out very often and I would highly doubt a mythic ring would compare with an arcane ring. To me this is outragous that one piece of gear can benefit someone so greatly. I shudder to think what will happen if they complete the set by adding arcane armor/pendant.

[Ice]

Pro players? Your from karma or horror so you mean geared by pro not skill.

:banana:

hmmm we won clashed naked... so how come being naked is geared up? you can see it on youtube..

[Maunyabastian]

Ahh, Alhunt. You remind me of season 3 PvP. I was an average twink and can't afford a 200k PvP set. I joined Mythic Twinks. We once played a fun CTF. There were 10 players. We do "switching" between players, because some were OP at that time so we feel unfair (haha). That was the time where KDR lovers were few.

Advance to the Nordr expansion, I make myself a real twink. I joined Indo Twinks. We did 2v2 PvP tournament and I won 300k, 1st place. I become an officer in a month or two, then I take a break when Samael became popular in L10 (I can't afford it, shame.) I came back in December, the first Tarlok event. Looted a set of Tarlok Assault which was worth 1,5m-2m. Now they become trashes due to lack of armor (a full set of Icescale have more 70 armor than Tarlok Assault.) Their prices maybe 300k but no one's willing to pay for it.

I'm glad ring and amulet don't change, the Tarlok event's jewelries still exist in L10. They're still on top. Honestly I think events' gears MUST BE greater than lockeds' gears. Just like... the one and only... the most frustating... the most disgusting and controversial gem... Paracelsus.

When this came out, I was in break so I didn't have the chance to loot and I don't even know the event. Just like the Goblin and Ursoth, I missed a lot of events. Paracelsus gems somehow don't give 2.0 DMG. They add more and that's what make they suck, too OP, and ruin the L10 PvP.

But... there's no way out to close or at least minimalize the rich-poor gap. I'm still an undergeared tank in L10, but with my 2-year Storm Sword I will survive the flow. Because only dead fish follow the flow. However I'm still contributing to this community even though I'm a forgotten veteran.

[Overweightank]

Harmless drama is fun :P I loved the old days when there were rivals and only 2 guilds against eachother. Not much ganging. Videos, crazy stuff and silly trash talking. It was what made pvp fun! it was exciting! now u just join and get ganged by 3 nekro's by the same people and it's not fun being killed all the time for the stupidest reasons and being pummeled by trash and ganging. And unfair clashes, and poor community, and every guild is for themselves with countless amount of people hurt in the process. i think Fire is referring to;

AL's ol' Harmless fun drama Vs. our disgusting infested modern drama

[gumball3000]

hmmm we won clashed naked... so how come being naked is geared up? you can see it on youtube..
Naked means u still had your helmet, ring and amulet, and that is pretty much 1000 armor, the same as a mage. You were able to play naked just because your teammates did so much damage that they killed the opposite team before you died. I am pretty sure you already know this stuff.

[Overweightank]

Naked means u still had your helmet, ring and amulet, and that is pretty much 1000 armor, the same as a mage. You were able to play naked just because your teammates did so much damage that they killed the opposite team before you died. I am pretty sure you already know this stuff.

Karma and Horror are skilled too. You guys gotta PvP hardcore to understand.. Hate when people just spout things they REALLY don't know about. Unless you're a fully geared skilled hardcore pvp player. Don't trash other guilds and people! Ty :)

I actually know Karma and Horror Practice and PvP alot. Ik what they're capable of, and I have personal proof that you can be fairly - really good without being maxed.

[gumball3000]

Karma and Horror are skilled too. You guys gotta PvP hardcore to understand.. Hate when people just spout things they REALLY don't know about. Unless you're a fully geared skilled hardcore pvp player. Don't trash other guilds and people! Ty :)

I actually know Karma and Horror Practice and PvP alot. Ik what they're capable of, and I have personal proof that you can be fairly - really good without being maxed.
Look at ice play on youtube before you speak he doesn't even charge sky smash chest or axe throw.

[Overweightank]

Look at ice play on youtube before you speak he doesn't even charge sky smash chest or axe throw.

You don't need to charge SS . And maybe he has reasons or few flaws. But my point is if he was in a clash with same gear as you, who do you think would win? Please mind the skill that's needed for PvP and don't judge a player by their gear or attitude or guild.

PS: Those videos or pretty old... So... Lol...

[Ice]

Look at ice play on youtube before you speak he doesn't even charge sky smash chest or axe throw.

LOL only new players charge skills all the time...casting skills on talk only give a certain amount of % of success rate.

ahhh i wont explain in this forum why. lol maybe u will learn the secret why we always farm you guys or why we always win.. nice one in trying tho...

[bmooooo]

Imo charging ss are only done by new players. As a tank you should able to catch up with rogues and feeble them. And when u charge ss after u land the skill ull stop for like .5 or 1 sec( try it youll see try to ss when walking and compare the charged one) so the rogues that youre following prolly may cross you already and miss the feeble..

[Oezheasate]

Now, Im relatively new, actually downloaded the game at the end of 2014 but really started playing and getting past lvl 20 4 months ago. Right now i have all three classes at lvl 41 and perhaps between 2-5 million gold stashed and i have to say, the game is losing the fun factor, oh u still do explore new things but it's getting to be dull. The LB events are for the 1% of players and what I've seen so far is that the really good players have either been playing for years, are hardcore farmers or simply spend thousands of dollars. I feel like this game is adapting more to fit top geared players and not make it a fun experience for the rest of us 99%. By hardcore farmer i mean farming 8 hours a day, there's nothing wrong with having to farm but it gives too little profit these days so you either have to farm said 8 hours a day or you just dont farm anymore

[Hanschey]

would it be nice if they introduce a new PVP map wherein you can gear up with max gears and pets and to be paid in gold and would last for 30mins like elixir.

[Rockingtigertiger Tiger]

I agree 👏👏👍👌

[Pillowhead]

They should make an achievement for old players like :
1 Month - Title -insert-
6 Months - Title -insert-
12 months - Title & A pet
24 Months - Title
36 Months - (Something special)
48 Months - (Something special)

And of course, everything should be untradeable (1 per Email account).