Beckon improves when moving?

[braluk]

I've always noticed this but I want to see if other bears pick up on this as well. Is it me or does your beckon effectiveness/success increase when you are in motion towards the direction in which you want to pull enemies towards? I say this because 9/10 times beckoning a mob when standing still usually results in an incomplete pull, and more total misses than when I'm in motion towards a wall. When I'm moving I tend to get the majority of the group and they tend to move FAST into a wall- enough to smack it.

[Major]

I find the best way to use beckon is like you said, go up to wall then turn around use it and sort of run at the enemies. For some reason it just seems to pull them in better for me. Also if ya run out a bit you have a chance to use your stomp to put the enemies face into the corner, not to mention you get a combo.

[Ellyidol]

Quite the opposite from what I've noticed.

Seems to work better when you move against the mob direction being pulled just as you use it.

Also seems to work better if you don't have any targets.

[Major]

Really whoa cuz for me when I have someone auto targeted beckon works much better, and I've tested that a few times. When I don't have a enemy targeted beckon doesn't seem to pull them in as organized as when an enemy is targeted. Thats def the way it is for me anyways, so I dunno lol.

[Ellyidol]

Really whoa cuz for me when I have someone auto targeted beckon works much better, and I've tested that a few times. When I don't have a enemy targeted beckon doesn't seem to pull them in as organized as when an enemy is targeted. Thats def the way it is for me anyways, so I dunno lol.

Just speculation that me and a few other bears seem to have noticed :)

It might just be superstitions and the real and only factor affecting beckon is hit rate.

[Major]

Hmm hard to say I wouldn't say hit rate is a huge factor tho, I really dont know lol. All I know is my hit rate is low. Only in the process of making my first tank and all I worry about is my, dodge, health points, h/s, and armor. My beckon is full, right now my hit rate is like 80% lol, anyways I can pull more than one mob into the wall/corner or whatever. I always make sure I hit my auto attack before beckon cuz it always works better for me. That's just me tho lol.

[braluk]

Quite the opposite from what I've noticed.

Seems to work better when you move against the mob direction being pulled just as you use it.

Also seems to work better if you don't have any targets.

Probably so, but my only problem is when its a large mob, I always get stopped in my path if I run towards them or through them football style. Perhaps I don't have enough dodge so I've always found it much easier to run towards the wall and beckon when I'm perpendicular to the crowd moving to wall. If i can get past em without being stopped, I'll pull in the direction that my teammates are heading to decrease stoppage time. That works fairly effectively but even with a dodge of 36 (with evade) I still can't seem to slip past large mobs without at least being stopped in my tracks momentarily. Perhaps I should beckon before I aggro with my debuffs so I could get past them easier?

[braluk]

Hmm hard to say I wouldn't say hit rate is a huge factor tho, I really dont know lol. All I know is my hit rate is low. Only in the process of making my first tank and all I worry about is my, dodge, health points, h/s, and armor. My beckon is full, right now my hit rate is like 80% lol, anyways I can pull more than one mob into the wall/corner or whatever. I always make sure I hit my auto attack before beckon cuz it always works better for me. That's just me tho lol.

I'd imagine that hit rate has to have some global effect on all your skills- if not equally amongst all skills, then at least partially. There's been a few times in my earlier builds where my hit was around 80% where I missed a few in the crowd. I also wonder if it makes any difference if I get aggro on a mob before I pull and if it makes it more successful.

[JaytB]

Probably so, but my only problem is when its a large mob, I always get stopped in my path if I run towards them or through them football style. Perhaps I don't have enough dodge so I've always found it much easier to run towards the wall and beckon when I'm perpendicular to the crowd moving to wall. If i can get past em without being stopped, I'll pull in the direction that my teammates are heading to decrease stoppage time. That works fairly effectively but even with a dodge of 36 (with evade) I still can't seem to slip past large mobs without at least being stopped in my tracks momentarily. Perhaps I should beckon before I aggro with my debuffs so I could get past them easier?

I have a second set on my bear, which brings dodge to 35% unbuffed (so 63% dodge buffed, with 2xtaunt and evade). And yes, it does make a difference in being stopped in your tracks. I'm using royal sewer's in combination with fury.

[Ellyidol]

Yup dodge definitely helps. Though from what I understand, your trying to beckon them into the wall as soon as you hit the wall, which when you do, your actually still "stunned" in the middle of them? I get that too.

I like to fully run into the walls, and have me and the mobs settle before I make a pull. That's when they're all focusing on me though, if your just running through fast enough, a quick side step and pull should work.

Maybe my video would help.. :)

[WhoIsThis]

Just speculation that me and a few other bears seem to have noticed :)

It might just be superstitions and the real and only factor affecting beckon is hit rate.

I suppose another reason to use dex gear - better hit rates.

There's another thread about mages and fire blast no hitting all the targets in the blast radius too - perhaps there is an upper limit that the devs put on to prevent crashing on all AOE?

Simple way to test though - gather a lot of mobs from somewhere (it doesn't have to be a high level place) and try using beckon on them. Careful not to venture so far that some of the mobs reset. Gather as many as possible and see if there is some sort of limit. Try moving versus staying still as well to answer the original question.

[Ellyidol]

I suppose another reason to use dex gear - better hit rates.

There's another thread about mages and fire blast no hitting all the targets in the blast radius too - perhaps there is an upper limit that the devs put on to prevent crashing on all AOE?

Simple way to test though - gather a lot of mobs from somewhere (it doesn't have to be a high level place) and try using beckon on them. Careful not to venture so far that some of the mobs reset. Gather as many as possible and see if there is some sort of limit. Try moving versus staying still as well to answer the original question.

Yup, agree, there's definitely a max target limit.

Thing with beckon is that it's the only skill I've seen that actually "fails" - it just doesn't work.

No max targets, no miss, no dodge, just fail. =/

[kiitz]

The trials and tribulations of being a bear ;)

I too deal with these issues all the time. I've actually found that there is no difference for me in either moving or not moving while beckoning and also no difference between having a target, or not. I read in a post somewhere Ellyidol made a while back saying it was better to not have a target, but even clicking off target, I still felt I had the same success rate.

If i'm by myself (ahead of the rest of the group) and I have my gear on with 90+ hit, i'm pretty much always successful except for the errant 1 off mob (really annoying)

The only really big factor that disrupts Beckon frequently is engaging the mobs with the rest of the party. It feels like when I don't have aggro on the mobs, Beckon tends to not work as much. If there is an archer or mage who decides to run ahead of me and act like a pseudo tank blowing all their CDs before I get in position to group, it feels like I often only get 1-2 mobs instead of the 4-5 that are there. I dunno... just my experience.

Oh, and nothing is worse than getting your position reset. Example - running to the wall and beckoning, only to get reset a few feet away from the wall so all the mobs get flung everywhere. I also like to "get settled" before I actually beckon if I can, but sometimes you got that gungho bird or mage who will blow all their CDs as soon as they get in range of a single mob so I just take my chance and beckon as soon as I get in position without waiting for resets.

[braluk]

Does anyone else get "Bear Guilt" when teammates die (usually because they run ahead of me as pack leader before I have properly established control of mobs. I feel especially guilty when I'm the only one in the group left- although I feel the pain in the potions afterwards.

Anyways I'm getting sidetracked. Quick question. Outside of the unspecified damage that beckon does when successfully pulled, is there also damage for a strong pull of groups into a wall. I see stars smack up off their backs when they make impact and I'm unsure if this actually equates to damage. I'll see what I can scrounge up in gear for dodge. Given that I'm not 55+ yet, and I'd rather save up money for 55 gear instead of buying 53 fury gear, I'm stuck with the 50+ nonpinks. Bellow gear seems fairly good but without any hit% stats, it drops my hit right below 80.

[WhoIsThis]

Does anyone else get "Bear Guilt" when teammates die (usually because they run ahead of me as pack leader before I have properly established control of mobs. I feel especially guilty when I'm the only one in the group left- although I feel the pain in the potions afterwards.

Anyways I'm getting sidetracked. Quick question. Outside of the unspecified damage that beckon does when successfully pulled, is there also damage for a strong pull of groups into a wall. I see stars smack up off their backs when they make impact and I'm unsure if this actually equates to damage. I'll see what I can scrounge up in gear for dodge. Given that I'm not 55+ yet, and I'd rather save up money for 55 gear instead of buying 53 fury gear, I'm stuck with the 50+ nonpinks. Bellow gear seems fairly good but without any hit% stats, it drops my hit right below 80.


Good bears should wonder if they have done something wrong. I sometimes feel "mage guilt" and wonder if a good timed heal may have saved someone. Then again, I do cast heal as fast as it recharges anyways, so maybe not.

Come to think of it, braluk has raised an interesting point - is there any damage bonus for slamming a target into a wall?

[Moogerfooger]

Does anyone else get "Bear Guilt" when teammates die (usually because they run ahead of me as pack leader before I have properly established control of mobs. I feel especially guilty when I'm the only one in the group left- although I feel the pain in the potions afterwards.

Anyways I'm getting sidetracked. Quick question. Outside of the unspecified damage that beckon does when successfully pulled, is there also damage for a strong pull of groups into a wall. I see stars smack up off their backs when they make impact and I'm unsure if this actually equates to damage. I'll see what I can scrounge up in gear for dodge. Given that I'm not 55+ yet, and I'd rather save up money for 55 gear instead of buying 53 fury gear, I'm stuck with the 50+ nonpinks. Bellow gear seems fairly good but without any hit% stats, it drops my hit right below 80.

I totally get bear guilt, lol.

As far as the stars, that is usually a stun proc. Not positive it is just a proc of Beckon, or has something to do with smacking them off the wall.

[Major]

Ya beckon will has a stun chance, totally feel the bear guilt lol, but sometimes those mages/birds do to much dmg lol.

[Ellyidol]

Bear guilt? Only if I accidentally let out a taunt at the wrong time by a grate :D Other than that, there's really nothing you can do about it unless your playing sloppy..

For the walls, I'm inclined to think that there's no damage bonus. I've tried damage potting up, beckon them to the middle of the intersection, stomp, and they still die/close to dying much like how they would be at a wall.

Yup Beckon has a stun proc, 50/50 I think. The stars are "stun". Kinda overrated though, countless times I've seen them "stunned" but still move/attack/anything in both PvE/PvP.

[neko]

Does anyone else get "Bear Guilt" when teammates die (usually because they run ahead of me as pack leader before I have properly established control of mobs. I feel especially guilty when I'm the only one in the group left- although I feel the pain in the potions afterwards.

Huh! I'm so glad I'm not the only one! I feel like I just found me the "Bear Support Group" I never knew existed.

The ones I see die most often are the result of AOE near active firepits. There's not much I can do about that but I still feel bad. Then there are those times my Beckon fails and I'm thinking, "Awww come on, I needed that one!"

[krazii]

Totally agree there is a "momentum factor" to beckon and that walls do no damage. I also run to a spot do a quick sweeping tight turn and beckon. It seems that if I don't stop, my beckon is far more powerful. Note: The biggest thing IMO to an unsuccessful beckon is other members of your party attacking or using a skill (debuff, freeze, root..etc) on the mobs before you beckon. This is a pet peeve of mine. A good parties knows to let the beat set'em up before the birds and mages come in to knock them down.

Kraz