Influence of Pet in Arcane Legends Over Time

[raw]

Hi Everyone,

So I've been doing some thinking about how the importance of pets in Arcane Legends has changed over time. Just as a background for anyone who doesn't know me, I've been playing since S1 (my first account was a mage whose ign was Merkage and I was in Rage of Mages). In the earlier seasons pets really didn't make a difference. They were "nice to haves" and what really mattered more was your character's gear, and the skill in which you used your character. Pets complimented your character, and were more of a "cherry on top" in both PvE and PvP. At that time I thought of pets sort of like I thought of SuperSmash Brothers characters in that they were all equally as strong, but each one was slightly unique - but that was naive. I used to use Malison on my rogue (then named Merrrrrrrked) and Wrathjaw on my end game mage, and I never once got a complaint. I recall that the pet I dreamed about was Colton and I would've had to do daily quests for months straight just to earn it. When I finally did earn it, I was extremely happy and proud of myself. The months of dedication had finally paid off, and I was able to display my Colton with pride that I had worked hard for this.

Fast forward to season 7, pets have become the polar opposite of what they once were. Players are judged if they do not have the best pets simply because some arcane pets are exponentially better than the average legendary pet. The difference between pets is the same difference in player gear which I have mentioned before. Player pets/gear vary drastically from the average player to the best player, and it is a HUGE problem in AL. I could and should honestly make a graph just to show how (in my opinion) OP some pets are in comparison to others... Instead I will make a list which gives a number signifying it's power on a scale from 0-100. See below for the list which is primarily from a PvP perspective:

Deary - 10 points
Malison - 20 points
Slag/Ripmaw - 25 points
Dovabear - 25 points
Yowie - 25 points
Breeze - 30 points
Blinky - 30 points
Glacian - 30 points
Abaddon 30 points
HJ - 35 points
Singe - 45 poimts
Maridos - 50 points
Samael - 50 points
Nekro - 95 points
Shady and Surge - 100 points


These numbers are completely based on my opinion... but my point is that rather than pets complimenting our characters, they have become the primary factor in overall strength. I get that over time we need to introduce more powerful pets, but it has come to the point where the discrepancy between what the average player can afford (legendary or cheap mythic pets), what the upper class player can afford (cheap arcanes), and what the elite .1% can afford (Nekro/SnS) is huge, and only seems to be growing. Thank you STS for releasing Lemon n Lime. That was a step in the right direction, but it does not address the fundamental issue that you have already created pets which have the potential to do more damage than any player could possibly do (SnS pools being stacked on mobs), and you have created a pet which has the ability to replicate a mage's skill and do it better than the mage itself (nekro shield).

What irks me the most is that when I enter into PvP, or when I enter into a timed run, what ultimately decides who wins are the pets. Skill no longer plays an integral role. This wasn't always the case, and it honestly is driving players away. I can tell you that for a fact.

Here is a quote from the Arcane Legends description on the Google Play Store:

"As you fight enemies to destroy evil or battle in PvP, you will unlock special abilities for your character and find new pets that you can customize to suit your play style... Collect and grow mystical pets that help you on quests."

What I have noticed is that before mythic and legendary pets, the best pets were achievable by farming or doing dailies. (Malison in Rooks Nest, Colton through dailies). Albeit there were no grand locked crates at the time, the excitement of having something to work towards were really exciting and motivating. Any platinum purchases I made were for vanities, elixirs, or gold if I really needed it. The description above mentions "finding new pets" and "collect and grow mystical pets," neither of which are necessarily true. All we find are old dated pets which are eclipsed by the arcane and mythic pets only purchasable through platinum (with the exception of Grim during the Halloween event, and fossil through arena chests - lol).

Anyway I don't want to keep going on and on but the influence of pets in AL over time has been substantial. I for one have stopped PvPing again in end game because CTF and TDM come down to who has better pets, not who has more technique. TDM comes down to who has nekro. Timed runs come down to who has more SnS.

What is your opinion on the importance of pets in AL? Is it too much? Is it too little? What can STG to do bridge the gap between legendary and arcane pets? Do you have any suggestions to address this issue (keeping in mind that if it doesn't boost plat sales - even indirectly - then it wont be implemented)?

Best,

Raw

[gumball3000]

Pets like sns and nekro have abillities stronger than any skill in game.
Even samael is op with his stun and op regen.

I think we should quit dreaming about this game ever becoming balanced. Free to play means you can play all the maps and that you can buy all the items with gold if you choose to.

Sts knows players like to feel op and they do offer that for a premium price. You won't see high payers complayn that they are tired of killing everyone in pvp or that they are finishing the maps too fast.

You won't see those who loot nekro in arena complain because hey they got a few thousand dollars worth pet for free.

[Haligali]

Blinky deserve more than 35 point imho, and where is breeze?

[Jazzi]

Blinky deserve more than 35 point imho, and where is breeze?

^^ This. I aggree with the op about how important pets have become

[ilhanna]

I'm actually quite happy with the pet situation, tbh, even though I don't have any arcane pet (yet). Events have given non-plat players (the majority of endgamers) really useful pets like Blinky, Gyrm, Grimm. Even Yowie, Dova, Frist, Little Bear and Ironbite aren't so shabby either. I also like that Breeze and Shadowlurk are farmable. When you're average-geared, pets are really helpful, its selection becomes really crucial that I think of it as part of tactical knowledge. Maybe because I mainly run pve for farming and achievement, not timed run or pvp, I don't feel handicapped by the lack of super op pets.

Tbh if there is something that needs fixing in the pet system now, I think it's how few of them are worth farming anymore after the advent of new event pets and egg crates. If there are more pets to be farmed, or crafted a la Nekro, I think it will bring new life to the pve community and reinvigorate interest in the game in general.

[Dragoonclaws]

Blinky deserve more than 35 point imho, and where is breeze?

aaaand slag

[Haligali]

aaaand slag

Slag is in same as ripmaw, I disagree a bit, there was many complains about 5 slag teams in pvp after release (it was also available only for plat in that time).

Oh and shade, that pet is a good 60-70 imho at end game clashes.

Sent from my XT1092 using Tapatalk

[Dragoonclaws]

Has 100 points, feels cool.

https://i.imgflip.com/kii73.jpg (https://imgflip.com/i/kii73)

[Twinisland]

Create something so everyone has same gear in pvp rooms pets are not really that big of a gap compared to the best gears but it'll be nice if they made pets farm able instead of a plat gamble. These will never happen but a man can dream.

[notfaded1]

Also that graph you're putting up there is basically all about PvP (I knew that's what you meant raw)... in PvE Maridos is OP way over Nekro and everyone even singe except maybe... S&S well that's just one big !@#@#$$% and even that's debatable.

If you put this in PvP forum I could understand... but this is General Discussion so I can totally take issue with the ranking... js. I knew what u meant though.

[Iinorex]

Firstly, I agree with you wholeheartedly Raw. Last night we had a short clash where nobody used any pets (and we considered only using deary). It was almost like we were playing a different game. The movements were slow, the combos were different and I can honestly say that I felt like I didn't know how to play that way.

I don't want to get stuck in the details of your scoring system but I want to clarify one thing and I want everyone to consider this. I own Nekro and I will say here that it's a very good and OP pet. It grants protective shield, speed boost, removes movement impairing, it does armor debuff, etc. etc. What's even nicer about Nekro (which a lot of people have yet to enjoy) is that it is a pet that benefits the entire team. So if one player has Nekro, the entire team now becomes OP. I think that you're correct in giving this pet a 95 score. Heck, you can probably even give Nekro a score of 100, along side with SNS.

Let's compare this to SNS now. SNS is also a great pet. One can argue it's better or about equal in strength as Nekro (hence why you scored 95 vs 100). BUT...(big but), people forget that SNS's score should compound. When you have 2 sns per team, the team can activate both Arcane Abilites at the same time. Fights only last 5 seconds or so anyways usually, so it only makes sense to do so. Thus, the score should not be 100 in that case but, rather, 200 because you will have 6 purple pools and 6 green pools. The same is true when there are 5 sns on a team, where you can activate all of those arcane abilities at the same time. Tell me, who can survive 5 SNS arcane abilities activated at the same time? Where is the skill in that? My problem has never been with SNS per se, but it's with the fact that there is no cool down period between pet uses. See most people run when the opposing team has 3+ SNS so they don't really see it. But I try to challenge myself and I can really say this is more than a challenge. I urge the devs to try and survive in 15 purple pools that are stacked...even if nobody is attacking you, can you survive? In essence, the potential score of SNS is really 500.

See, Samael's panic cannot be stacked. If you hit 5 samael AA's simultaneously, only 1 gets used and the other 4 are wasted. If 5 Singe AA's are activated at the same time, you don't get super stats, right? No, you get the stat boost from only 1 AA and the other 4 are wasted. Nekro even goes as far as to give about a 5 second cool down period between uses. This makes the 3rd nekro on a team totally useless and in many instances, the 2nd Nekro is useless as well.

So, I ask why is this the case? Is this a long overlooked bug? I mean, who is crazy enough to stay around and fight 3 or 4 SNS, so I think this bug has been long overlooked.

correct man ..to the point...what should be done is when people 2 sns aa at same time then the pools should overlap like any other pets aa does

[raw]

Firstly, I agree with you wholeheartedly Raw. Last night we had a short clash where nobody used any pets (and we considered only using deary). It was almost like we were playing a different game. The movements were slow, the combos were different and I can honestly say that I felt like I didn't know how to play that way.

I don't want to get stuck in the details of your scoring system but I want to clarify one thing and I want everyone to consider this. I own Nekro and I will say here that it's a very good and OP pet. It grants protective shield, speed boost, removes movement impairing, it does armor debuff, etc. etc. What's even nicer about Nekro (which a lot of people have yet to enjoy) is that it is a pet that benefits the entire team. So if one player has Nekro, the entire team now becomes OP. I think that you're correct in giving this pet a 95 score. Heck, you can probably even give Nekro a score of 100, along side with SNS.

Let's compare this to SNS now. SNS is also a great pet. One can argue it's better or about equal in strength as Nekro (hence why you scored 95 vs 100). BUT...(big but), people forget that SNS's score should compound. When you have 2 sns per team, the team can activate both Arcane Abilites at the same time. Fights only last 5 seconds or so anyways usually, so it only makes sense to do so. Thus, the score should not be 100 in that case but, rather, 200 because you will have 6 purple pools and 6 green pools. The same is true when there are 5 sns on a team, where you can activate all of those arcane abilities at the same time. Tell me, who can survive 5 SNS arcane abilities activated at the same time? Where is the skill in that? My problem has never been with SNS per se, but it's with the fact that there is no cool down period between pet uses. See most people run when the opposing team has 3+ SNS so they don't really see it. But I try to challenge myself and I can really say this is more than a challenge. I urge the devs to try and survive in 15 purple pools that are stacked...even if nobody is attacking you, can you survive? In essence, the potential score of SNS is really 500.

See, Samael's panic cannot be stacked. If you hit 5 samael AA's simultaneously, only 1 gets used and the other 4 are wasted. If 5 Singe AA's are activated at the same time, you don't get super stats, right? No, you get the stat boost from only 1 AA and the other 4 are wasted. Nekro even goes as far as to give about a 5 second cool down period between uses. This makes the 3rd nekro on a team totally useless and in many instances, the 2nd Nekro is useless as well.

So, I ask why is this the case? Is this a long overlooked bug? I mean, who is crazy enough to stay around and fight 3 or 4 SNS, so I think this bug has been long overlooked.

This scoring system was just something I made up on the fly. It's not very accurate and is just meant to display the point that Nekro/SnS are so far beyond every other pet.

I commend you on having a no pet clash. This reminds me of s2 where pets weren't allowed in PvP! But anyway honestly that's amazing, and I'd be 100% willing to pvp that way so do PM me if you have another one of those. I recall about two weeks ago I asked a guild who was using 2 sns and 2 nekro to play legendary pets only, and they laughed and refused. Considering that our team was severly outgeared I didn't see the point in even attempting to clash, so I left. Point being that pets trump everything, and those who are fortunate enough to have these - at no fault of their own - use them to reap extremely large benefits against those who don't.

Candy, you're right I did take into account PvP heavily in my scoring, but I do think that most of these hold true for PvE. Nekro gives speed boosts, and grants insane survivability in harder maps. SnS is essentially in every single timed record if you look closely at the leaderboard.

[Imsofancy]

How is HJ greater then glacian? @.@ very interesting post raw, but what if you did a ranking on pet value in PvE as well, Im curious to see if I have any of those pets with more than 50 points lol.

[Iinorex]

i played a mmorpg before where there were about 20 pets...all looked cool and were awesome and we had to choose one pet at the start of game and play with only that pet

[raw]

How is HJ greater then glacian? @.@ very interesting post raw, but what if you did a ranking on pet value in PvE as well, Im curious to see if I have any of those pets with more than 50 points lol.

Glacian gives no damage % boost to the user. I find this extremely disappointing when this pet used to cost 8m.

[Tatman]

I'd say it's 100 points for Nekro and SnS. Whatever points for all other pets. It's a waste of time to even begin to explain how wrong this is.

[Candylicks]

Candy, you're right I did take into account PvP heavily in my scoring, but I do think that most of these hold true for PvE. Nekro gives speed boosts, and grants insane survivability in harder maps. SnS is essentially in every single timed record if you look closely at the leaderboard.

LOL Why is my name here when I haven't even posted.

All I have to say is put SnS in locked.

End of discussion.

[raw]

LOL Why is my name here when I haven't even posted.

All I have to say is put SnS in locked.

End of discussion.

LOL oh that was faded... my bad =P

[Ardbeg]

Great post from Raw and Shiny nailed it.
It s the stacking of the AAs that needs to be looked at (with the obvious worst case of SNS).
I love how STG designed LNL so that it s AA has to be orchestrated to use it s full potential.

----------------------------------------------
The more powerful a Pet s AA is, the more Skill should it take to use it to the full effect.
----------------------------------------------

Now Nekro doesn t follow this design, but keep in mind that it was adjusted to counter SNS which was a brilliant move by STG.

i would rather see hard to execute combos with pet AAs then just stacking exploits.

[Kakashis]

Yeah, pets change the game substantially. I knew this since Sams banish.

[Rubana]

Great thread raw!

[Serancha]

Regarding the comment about mythic pets being farmable, I think you maybe misinterpreted the description. Mystical means magical - mythical / mythic means extremely rare.


The gap between the top pets and others is akin to that of arcane ring vs everything else. It's beyond extreme. However I do agree with Hali and Candy, that although your point is understood, your point scale is indeed way off for PvE, and missing some key pets.

[raw]

Regarding the comment about mythic pets being farmable, I think you maybe misinterpreted the description. Mystical means magical - mythical / mythic means extremely rare.


The gap between the top pets and others is akin to that of arcane ring vs everything else. It's beyond extreme. However I do agree with Hali and Candy, that although your point is understood, your point scale is indeed way off for PvE, and missing some key pets.

Again, the point scale was just something i created in like 5 minutes, not something to be taken too literally. The point is just that Nekro/SnS are beyond OP, and nothing comes close - even Maridos IMO.

[extrapayah]

it's time for sts to implement shared pet stable, hmmm

[Serancha]

LOL Why is my name here when I haven't even posted.

All I have to say is put SnS in locked.

End of discussion.


Candy / Fade..... potato / potaato lol

[cami]

Hi Everyone,

So I've been doing some thinking about how the importance of pets in Arcane Legends has changed over time. Just as a background for anyone who doesn't know me, I've been playing since S1 (my first account was a mage whose ign was Merkage and I was in Rage of Mages). In the earlier seasons pets really didn't make a difference. They were "nice to haves" and what really mattered more was your character's gear, and the skill in which you used your character. Pets complimented your character, and were more of a "cherry on top" in both PvE and PvP. At that time I thought of pets sort of like I thought of SuperSmash Brothers characters in that they were all equally as strong, but each one was slightly unique - but that was naive. I used to use Malison on my rogue (then named Merrrrrrrked) and Wrathjaw on my end game mage, and I never once got a complaint. I recall that the pet I dreamed about was Colton and I would've had to do daily quests for months straight just to earn it. When I finally did earn it, I was extremely happy and proud of myself. The months of dedication had finally paid off, and I was able to display my Colton with pride that I had worked hard for this.

Fast forward to season 7, pets have become the polar opposite of what they once were. Players are judged if they do not have the best pets simply because some arcane pets are exponentially better than the average legendary pet. The difference between pets is the same difference in player gear which I have mentioned before. Player pets/gear vary drastically from the average player to the best player, and it is a HUGE problem in AL. I could and should honestly make a graph just to show how (in my opinion) OP some pets are in comparison to others... Instead I will make a list which gives a number signifying it's power on a scale from 0-100. See below:

Deary - 10 points
Malison - 20 points
Slag/Ripmaw - 25 points
Dovabear - 25 points
Yowie - 25 points
Breeze - 30 points
Blinky - 30 points
Glacian - 30 points
Abaddon 30 points
HJ - 35 points
Singe - 45 poimts
Maridos - 50 points
Samael - 50 points
Nekro - 95 points
Shady and Surge - 100 points


These numbers are completely based on my opinion... but my point is that rather than pets complimenting our characters, they have become the primary factor in overall strength. I get that over time we need to introduce more powerful pets, but it has come to the point where the discrepancy between what the average player can afford (legendary or cheap mythic pets), what the upper class player can afford (cheap arcanes), and what the elite .1% can afford (Nekro/SnS) is huge, and only seems to be growing. Thank you STS for releasing Lemon n Lime. That was a step in the right direction, but it does not address the fundamental issue that you have already created pets which have the potential to do more damage than any player could possibly do (SnS pools being stacked on mobs), and you have created a pet which has the ability to replicate a mage's skill and do it better than the mage itself (nekro shield).

What irks me the most is that when I enter into PvP, or when I enter into a timed run, what ultimately decides who wins are the pets. Skill no longer plays an integral role. This wasn't always the case, and it honestly is driving players away. I can tell you that for a fact.

Here is a quote from the Arcane Legends description on the Google Play Store:

"As you fight enemies to destroy evil or battle in PvP, you will unlock special abilities for your character and find new pets that you can customize to suit your play style... Collect and grow mystical pets that help you on quests."

What I have noticed is that before mythic and legendary pets, the best pets were achievable by farming or doing dailies. (Malison in Rooks Nest, Colton through dailies). Albeit there were no grand locked crates at the time, the excitement of having something to work towards were really exciting and motivating. Any platinum purchases I made were for vanities, elixirs, or gold if I really needed it. The description above mentions "finding new pets" and "collect and grow mystical pets," neither of which are necessarily true. All we find are old dated pets which are eclipsed by the arcane and mythic pets only purchasable through platinum (with the exception of Grim during the Halloween event, and fossil through arena chests - lol).

Anyway I don't want to keep going on and on but the influence of pets in AL over time has been substantial. I for one have stopped PvPing again in end game because CTF and TDM come down to who has better pets, not who has more technique. TDM comes down to who has nekro. Timed runs come down to who has more SnS.

What is your opinion on the importance of pets in AL? Is it too much? Is it too little? What can STG to do bridge the gap between legendary and arcane pets? Do you have any suggestions to address this issue (keeping in mind that if it doesn't boost plat sales - even indirectly - then it wont be implemented)?

Best,

Raw

AWESOME thread Raw, but My eyes can see this little error xD

[Deluxeq]

Idk about everyone else but i personally loved how i had to farm maps to earn eggs... now a days its all about locked crates and platinum that the basics of farming have gone down the drain. Farming now a days is just to get money and i find it kinda boring having to open locks for pets or farm for items to sell for money to buy pets. I loved how back then eggs were farmable and the best pets dropped from bosses. Why cant any mythical pets be dropped from bosses also? Just with a low drop rate... just like recipie. And Arcane pets be dropped from bosses in tombs or mobs in tombs with a low drop rate also. Why has this game become a Lock Dependent game :/

[raw]

hahaha I should have put more thought into this =P

Hali please take a stab at re-valuing the numbers and ill edit the main post!

[raw]

Idk about everyone else but i personally loved how i had to farm maps to earn eggs... now a days its all about locked crates and platinum that the basics of farming have gone down the drain. Farming now a days is just to get money and i find it kinda boring having to open locks for pets or farm for items to sell for money to buy pets. I loved how back then eggs were farmable and the best pets dropped from bosses. Why cant any mythical pets be dropped from bosses also? Just with a low drop rate... just like recipie. And Arcane pets be dropped from bosses in tombs or mobs in tombs with a low drop rate also. Why has this game become a Lock Dependent game :/

I feel the same exact way. I understand that the model of having gambling locked crates promotes 'plat binging' where players purchase and use large amounts of platinum in a short period of time. While this may be profitable for STG, it is not sustainable and is not a typical source of revenue for MMORPGs. Typically subscription fees are the primary source of revenue.

Anyway given that subscriptions are not the model of Arcane Legends, I do think that promoting mythic drops (as rare as planar pendant recipe), and arcane drops (as rare as fossil in arena chests for arcane drops) would've been a far superior model. The benefits of this can be viewed from two perspectives.

From the Player POV:
- additional motivation to farm harder elite maps (that may not have valuable legendary drops)
- hope that some day you will receive a mythic or arcane drop (much like there is that hope in arena for a recipe/fossil)
- reduces the dependency on locked crates, and makes players focus more on farming - > increasing the amount of players who farm - > increasing the popularity of Arcane Legends mid to late season (where players generally have nothing to do and quit)
- Allows f2p players to compete with p2p players

From the STG POV:
- Decreases Arcane Legends abandonment rates (meaning less players quit the game due to the hopelessness of ever striking it big that most f2p players currently are feeling)
- Increases the farming of elite maps ... thereby increasing Ankh sales exponentially, and accordingly elixir and potion sales.

In doing something like this to at least compliment locked crates, it'll give players much more to look forward to, will increase player participation in elite farming, and will increase revenue.

So why hasn't this been implemented?

[Deluxeq]

I feel the same exact way. I understand that the model of having gambling locked crates promotes 'plat binging' where players purchase and use large amounts of platinum in a short period of time. While this may be profitable for STG, it is not sustainable and is not a typical source of revenue for MMORPGs. Typically subscription fees are the primary source of revenue.

Anyway given that subscriptions are not the model of Arcane Legends, I do think that promoting mythic drops (as rare as planar pendant recipe), and arcane drops (as rare as fossil in arena chests for arcane drops) would've been a far superior model. The benefits of this can be viewed from two perspectives.

From the Player POV:
- additional motivation to farm harder elite maps (that may not have valuable legendary drops)
- hope that some day you will receive a mythic or arcane drop (much like there is that hope in arena for a recipe/fossil)
- reduces the dependency on locked crates, and makes players focus more on farming - > increasing the amount of players who farm - > increasing the popularity of Arcane Legends mid to late season (where players generally have nothing to do and quit)
- Allows f2p players to compete with p2p players

From the STG POV:
- Decreases Arcane Legends abandonment rates (meaning less players quit the game due to the hopelessness of ever striking it big that most f2p players currently are feeling)
- Increases the farming of elite maps ... thereby increasing Ankh sales exponentially, and accordingly elixir and potion sales.

In doing something like this to at least compliment locked crates, it'll give players much more to look forward to, will increase player participation in elite farming, and will increase revenue.

So why hasn't this been implemented?
I agree man and if people dont quit it means STG gets more people buying things like u said before. More people = more Ankh buyers and i feel like if this was done STG would be in the same place they are right now... just with more players, more reputatuion, and a long lasting community of Players... just like any other game, there are things like Locked Crates where a player buys some type of game currency and spends it on gambling for items, but there is also another way to obtain those items... might take long but its worth it in the outcome

[Givemeahellyeah]

Firstly, I agree with you wholeheartedly Raw. Last night we had a short clash where nobody used any pets (and we considered only using deary). It was almost like we were playing a different game. The movements were slow, the combos were different and I can honestly say that I felt like I didn't know how to play that way.

I don't want to get stuck in the details of your scoring system but I want to clarify one thing and I want everyone to consider this. I own Nekro and I will say here that it's a very good and OP pet. It grants protective shield, speed boost, removes movement impairing, it does armor debuff, etc. etc. What's even nicer about Nekro (which a lot of people have yet to enjoy) is that it is a pet that benefits the entire team. So if one player has Nekro, the entire team now becomes OP. I think that you're correct in giving this pet a 95 score. Heck, you can probably even give Nekro a score of 100, along side with SNS.

Let's compare this to SNS now. SNS is also a great pet. One can argue it's better or about equal in strength as Nekro (hence why you scored 95 vs 100). BUT...(big but), people forget that SNS's score should compound. When you have 2 sns per team, the team can activate both Arcane Abilites at the same time. Fights only last 5 seconds or so anyways usually, so it only makes sense to do so. Thus, the score should not be 100 in that case but, rather, 200 because you will have 6 purple pools and 6 green pools. The same is true when there are 5 sns on a team, where you can activate all of those arcane abilities at the same time. Tell me, who can survive 5 SNS arcane abilities activated at the same time? Where is the skill in that? My problem has never been with SNS per se, but it's with the fact that there is no cool down period between pet uses. See most people run when the opposing team has 3+ SNS so they don't really see it. But I try to challenge myself and I can really say this is more than a challenge. I urge the devs to try and survive in 15 purple pools that are stacked...even if nobody is attacking you, can you survive? In essence, the potential score of SNS is really 500.

See, Samael's panic cannot be stacked. If you hit 5 samael AA's simultaneously, only 1 gets used and the other 4 are wasted. If 5 Singe AA's are activated at the same time, you don't get super stats, right? No, you get the stat boost from only 1 AA and the other 4 are wasted. Nekro even goes as far as to give about a 5 second cool down period between uses. This makes the 3rd nekro on a team totally useless and in many instances, the 2nd Nekro is useless as well.

So, I ask why is this the case? Is this a long overlooked bug? I mean, who is crazy enough to stay around and fight 3 or 4 SNS, so I think this bug has been long overlooked.

Wow, well explained Shiny.
Its true PVP is no more Players vs Players but unfortunately it's Pet's Vs Pet's.
L n L arcane ability has been beautifully executed.
But SnS is something you cannot counter against that easily.
I'm an active PVP player and i have seen lot of clashes end in just few seconds, i don't see where the player skills are being tested.
When there are Sns poison pools spread over, 1st thing i try to do is locate a spot where there isn't any pool/pools that would kill me in seconds.
Being a warrior , I find it extremely difficult to survive with 8000 Heath and 2.8k Armor.
I cant even imagine how tough it must b for a Rogue / Mage who hardly has half the Health n Armor of a Warrior.
It's even harder for me to imagine ppl who use Legendary gears n pets to even survive for a second in those pools.
Its very disappointing to view from a player point who owns legendary gears n enters PVP for having fun n ends up with frustration for getting killed not by an opponent but by an opponent's pet which is more over powered then the opponent itself.

Below video shows how just 2 SNS can impact in PVP (CTF). I recorded the below video when i realized i had disconnected.


https://youtu.be/8rSxFUWbpGI

The above visual shows 6 Posion pools (Death Pools) and 6 health pools.
That's just 2 SnS.
Add another SNS make it 3.
Now, its 9 Poison n 9 health pools.
Let's assume we some how managed to land on a spot ( Trust me concentrating to find a spot just to survive is the last thing you wanna do when u r in PVP trying to kill an opponent ) where there isn't poison. Here all you trying to do is to survive. Even if u manage to survive and hit ur opponent ... Bang.. Wow we totally forgot abt the Health pools that wouldn't let ur opponent die.
All i'm trying to say is when there are so many pools spread across ur path all u r thinking is Survival and not thinking abt countering ur opponent or chasing ur opponents DPS.
Its insane to imagine 4 or 5 SNS in a team. That's like playing in God Mode.
SNS AA needs to be looked upon which is impacting PVP.
I think there are just 150 + SNS in the server which is a minority when compared to other pets which are still loot-able from Locked Crates.

I really hope STS will try to see from a Player point.

[Ardbeg]

Wow, well explained Shiny.
Its true PVP is no more Players vs Players but unfortunately it's Pet's Vs Pet's.
L n L arcane ability has been beautifully executed.
But SnS is something you cannot counter against that easily.
I'm an active PVP player and i have seen lot of clashes end in just few seconds, i don't see where the player skills are being tested.
When there are Sns poison pools spread over, 1st thing i try to do is locate a spot where there isn't any pool/pools that would kill me in seconds.
Being a warrior , I find it extremely difficult to survive with 8000 Heath and 2.8k Armor.
I cant even imagine how tough it must b for a Rogue / Mage who hardly has half the Health n Armor of a Warrior.
It's even harder for me to imagine ppl who use Legendary gears n pets to even survive for a second in those pools.
Its very disappointing to view from a player point who owns legendary gears n enters PVP for having fun n ends up with frustration for getting killed not by an opponent but by an opponent's pet which is more over powered then the opponent itself.

Below video shows how just 2 SNS can impact in PVP (CTF). I recorded the below video when i realized i had disconnected.


https://youtu.be/8rSxFUWbpGI

The above visual shows 6 Posion pools (Death Pools) and 6 health pools.
That's just 2 SnS.
Add another SNS make it 3.
Now, its 9 Poison n 9 health pools.
Let's assume we some how managed to land on a spot ( Trust me concentrating to find a spot just to survive is the last thing you wanna do when u r in PVP trying to kill an opponent ) where there isn't poison. Here all you trying to do is to survive. Even if u manage to survive and hit ur opponent ... Bang.. Wow we totally forgot abt the Health pools that wouldn't let ur opponent die.
All i'm trying to say is when there are so many pools spread across ur path all u r thinking is Survival and not thinking abt countering ur opponent or chasing ur opponents DPS.
Its insane to imagine 4 or 5 SNS in a team. That's like playing in God Mode.
SNS AA needs to be looked upon which is impacting PVP.
I think there are just 150 + SNS in the server which is a minority when compared to other pets which are still loot-able from Locked Crates.

I really hope STS will try to see from a Player point.

i thinkthere were 10 lb slots for each class with some ties. also maybe some ss contest and the locked crate glitch on xmas. with some banned players <40

you and shiny are spot on: the stacking is the problem. wether sns should come back or not is debatable. but to make pvp and timed runs fair for the current and the future player base, the stacking needs to be looked into (and the lb reset). now shoot me!

[hellsminion]

100% right imo if u don't have sns or nekro, PvP n timed runs r just a thing in the past. It is sad tht if u don't spend real life money in game. U have no chance at a one items seems like. I have been playing al now since mid s1 and last week I finally after all tht time looted a Sam egg. Am one of those guys who likes to hunt for their items n not buy my status. Just sad tht sts noes kids play this game and most will never be able to purchase plat not even once. And for tht dang fossil in arena chest I says it's a false . Trully no it's not just say it is since it's so dang rare. Recipe is same way. I have put countless days into arena with no return. Gets very discouraging at Times. Love the game. Work it shat out sts. (Hellsminion)

[xnorwayx]

raw, please add ribbit to your best pvp pets list :banana:

[Ardbeg]

here s just another thought (i know this is a really really weird one):

if you guys would just consider playing ctf as the original intended tactical team game, sns wouldn t give anyone an advantage at all. you all deliberately choose to clash in the middle, then complain that sns is not designed and balanced for that abuse.
please just spend half a minute thinking about that!

[azagreoralu]

Idk about everyone else but i personally loved how i had to farm maps to earn eggs... now a days its all about locked crates and platinum that the basics of farming have gone down the drain. Farming now a days is just to get money and i find it kinda boring having to open locks for pets or farm for items to sell for money to buy pets. I loved how back then eggs were farmable and the best pets dropped from bosses. Why cant any mythical pets be dropped from bosses also? Just with a low drop rate... just like recipie. And Arcane pets be dropped from bosses in tombs or mobs in tombs with a low drop rate also. Why has this game become a Lock Dependent game :/

STS needs to fine a different way to make money from plat because locks just ruin the point of a RPG. in most MMORPG you have to farm for the best gear not gamble. As others have said with more elite farming comes more use of ankhs = more plat to buy ankhs. I think STS should consider letting us farm stuff for 2 weeks and see how it is. Until changes are made it is pet v pet. And please make SNS AA non stackable that would help pvp so much

[Jexetta]

here s just another thought (i know this is a really really weird one):

if you guys would just consider playing ctf as the original intended tactical team game, sns wouldn t give anyone an advantage at all. you all deliberately choose to clash in the middle, then complain that sns is not designed and balanced for that abuse.
please just spend half a minute thinking about that!

Yes, I'm sure a warrior running using nekro and flagging would be easy to stop - if the game actually was played "capture the flag" the nekro nerf threads would be amazing.

I stopped playing this game for a reason. Almost all of the gear in game revolves around gambling. The amount of money some people spend on this game is staggering, but intended. And, honestly, no one from season 1,2,3 that is still playing is even playing the same game anymore - it's a similar feel but the cost threshold in order to come back into the game is mind boggling. In essence, the skeleton of the game remains, but the actual cladding is nothing but. There is no coming back from how the game evolved, and sadly, that's just how it is.

I would be happy if the code got out and someone put a version of AL out that is permanently capped at a lower season.

[Serancha]

Yes, I'm sure a warrior running using nekro and flagging would be easy to stop - if the game actually was played "capture the flag" the nekro nerf threads would be amazing.

I stopped playing this game for a reason. Almost all of the gear in game revolves around gambling. The amount of money some people spend on this game is staggering, but intended. And, honestly, no one from season 1,2,3 that is still playing is even playing the same game anymore - it's a similar feel but the cost threshold in order to come back into the game is mind boggling. In essence, the skeleton of the game remains, but the actual cladding is nothing but. There is no coming back from how the game evolved, and sadly, that's just how it is.

I would be happy if the code got out and someone put a version of AL out that is permanently capped at a lower season.


This post is so completely accurate. It is sad what the game has turned into.

[Kingofninjas]

As usual, you hit the nail right on the head raw. PvP is now pet vs pet. As of now tdm, is like this. You have a nekro and opponents have none, you win. You can even win 2-3 on one with not much of a problem. As an experiment, I went into tdm with a friend if mine who owns nekro decked out in a full tarlok set, an epic ring and a lvl 31 bonechill bow. All my friend did was gve me nekro shield. The only rogue who beat me one on one had a planar amulet and an arcane ring. Mages with anything less than planar amulet could not win. This was on no part skill. All I did was spam arrows and throw down packs when necessary. There were the occasional one comboes through my low armor, but if I had been using regular gear, those could have been easily avoided.

Since the release of samael l, which was when arcane legends died and pet legends was born, pets have become essential if you want to compete in PvP. I did not PvP till s4, but when I did, I could manage just fine with my crate bow and malison. Now, walking into PvP with an expert bow and ending up against a nekro user is pretty much a hopeless fight. May as well fight with your fists for all the damage you can do. As of now, two or three guilds hold almost all the nekro and sns players, and hence dominate PvP, which is another major issue that needs to be addressed.

Today, most people run the second they see a nekro. I disagree with that mentality, but it is not baseless. The only way to survive an encounter with a nekro in PvP is to run, or get one of your own. Sts is continually coming up with new ways for pets to change the game. Breeze freezes in PvP, something that was never done before, and an entire class had a skill that could have done the same thing but was not allowed to for fear of them becoming OP. Maridos can banish on its PA now. What's next? A pet that can banish in pvp? I wouldn't be surprised. The game is slowly but surely deteriorating. I for one am hopelessly tired of this game and the utter incompetence of the devs and mods to fix the issues that need to be fixed. Instead, we get these stupid skill description changes that.nobody gives a hoot about. The only reason I still play is the social aspect and the hope that the upcoming expansion won't follow the familiar sts pattern if being trash.

[lonakana]

i disagree with pets being the key factor in timed runs, its all about which team uses macro and auto pots the best

[Ardbeg]

Yes, I'm sure a warrior running using nekro and flagging would be easy to stop - if the game actually was played "capture the flag" the nekro nerf threads would be amazing.

I stopped playing this game for a reason. Almost all of the gear in game revolves around gambling. The amount of money some people spend on this game is staggering, but intended. And, honestly, no one from season 1,2,3 that is still playing is even playing the same game anymore - it's a similar feel but the cost threshold in order to come back into the game is mind boggling. In essence, the skeleton of the game remains, but the actual cladding is nothing but. There is no coming back from how the game evolved, and sadly, that's just how it is.

I would be happy if the code got out and someone put a version of AL out that is permanently capped at a lower season.

i was not defending sns stacking (please see my previous posts) and nekro was designed to counter that so it s a wrong to right another wrong. it s a mess, i know that, but still the best choice stg could make.

[azagreoralu]

If STS doesn't make some changes people will just keep leaving and new players will only last until they see how hopeless it is to get good gear/good pet. Even if they do nekro and SNS are too op there is nothing that can compare with them. What happened to they days where AL was super popular. Right now AL is losing end game and new players at high rates. What would happen if this was fixed and things weren't about pets that almost can't be gotten, what if things weren't all about the pets? I think that if everything wasn't about pets and locks then AL would bring in new and old player's. Changing things is really the only good option now.

[twoxc]

here s just another thought (i know this is a really really weird one):

if you guys would just consider playing ctf as the original intended tactical team game, sns wouldn t give anyone an advantage at all. you all deliberately choose to clash in the middle, then complain that sns is not designed and balanced for that abuse.
please just spend half a minute thinking about that!

Yea this indeed hit the spot lol.

Also to those who say there is nothing to farm anymore and only farm to get rich and not like the old days where we farm to earn pet and eggs and such. Who doesn't want to farm and get rich? and first of all there is ARENA, you can farm recipe which is at the same time a chance to open chest for Fossil, which you also then have to farm for the recipe to craft it into an egg. You missed the old days since season 2 and wish things stay the same old way. It's like asking the game to stand still and not make any progress, which as of right now the game is at a stand still with nothing new and everyone is complaining and quitting cause it's boring but at the same time waiting for expansion wanting new equip want new pets etc etc.

I believe sts is designing and making this game to suit everyone including new players, not just for the veterans and plus they do require some sort of income. Can't complain on free stuff, what more can you ask for. You can't expect a massive MMO to be perfectly balanced. Where there is good there is evil. It's only a matter of time when sns will get outdated just like samael. I don't ever remember seeing any complain about samael being over power or was it because it was in LOCKED?

So if everything is basically obtainable through locked, why even bother having sts making special events with special prizes. why not just tell sts to put all event banners and prizes and vanity and such to be in locked. wouldn't it be a lot easier? Someone out there bound to not be able to afford it. Would you rather have 95% of the players to have SNS and only 5% not able to get it?

one way or another everyone earned their stuff and pet. rather it's hard core grinding farming or just throw a lot of cash into the game. If SnS which apparently is by far the best of the best for everything and you want it in lock, wouldn't this make it a PAY TO WIN? what happen to those that doesn't even use real money period? or what happen if someone rich decide to start playing and basically can spend 2-3000 bucks and bam got the best of the best pet plus gears. Not that it isn't already a Pay to Win.

If this so to happen, then hell there are a lot of people willing to pay a fortune for vanities and collectible. Bring those old stuff from previous seasons 1-2-3 and put them in lock and have a chance as arcane rarity. Let me get a chance to obtain them also since I was never around for it. Also why does sts even bother with discontinuing item such as hooks and glacial/hammerjaw lol. just think about it.

[kiwotsukete]

Ethyl is my go to pet, shiloh has that 12% speed boost like a baws

[gumball3000]

I don't know why everyone thinks sns is that op. I find it much easier to play against sns that against nekro. Now sns and nekro is a killer combo but then again nekro is op on its own.

Now we are also complaining about pets being op in a pvp map that is not played as intended. Ofc sns is op when it stacks in those tiny ctf corridors but it wouldn't be that op if everyone played real ctf because it is easily dodged.

Sts makes these pets thinking people play real ctf when instead ctf map is used to do 5v5 inside some tiny corridors. Very little skill is needed when you play like that and ofc the team with the best gear usually wins.

There is absolutely no reward for winning the match by scoribg the 5 flags and absolutely no penalty for losing.

I asked multiple moderators about pvp balance and fixes anytime soon and the answer is always the same: we have no plans to change the pvp right now.

Its really obvious something is wrong, just search youtube for arcane legends ctf and see how many of those vids are real ctf: 0.

I still laugh at sts for making a pure pvp game. It is going to be a total failure if its managed the same as al pvp. I also laugh at remiem because when i ask her about things being added to the game she always responds with: we don't know how to code that stuff into the game. How can you make a game from scratch if you don't know how to code? Something is deffinitely fishy and as i said before, sts is in the business of making money not in the business of making great games.

If they ever add something to the game it is to create revenue like the crafting system or energy system for events that they are so proud of like they are some coding masterpieces.

[Zeus]

I don't know why everyone thinks sns is that op. I find it much easier to play against sns that against nekro. Now sns and nekro is a killer combo but then again nekro is op on its own.

Now we are also complaining about pets being op in a pvp map that is not played as intended. Ofc sns is op when it stacks in those tiny ctf corridors but it wouldn't be that op if everyone played real ctf because it is easily dodged.

Sts makes these pets thinking peiple play real ctf when instead ctf map is used to do 5v5 inside some tiny corridors. Very little skill is needed when you play like that and ofc the team with the best gear usually wins.



Wow, never saw it from that point of view.

[Bellaelda]

Just wish that there was a way to obtain these op pets!

Nothing worth working for or trying to get at the moment since the best pet has been discontinued.

[twoxc]

Just wish that there was a way to obtain these op pets!

Nothing worth working for or trying to get at the moment since the best pet has been discontinued.

almost half the people here comment saying nekro is equal to sns so start farming arena bella xD get it lol.

[Serancha]

i disagree with pets being the key factor in timed runs, its all about which team uses macro and auto pots the best

I've never run a macro or an autopot in my life. I don't play on chrome. Pets do make a massive difference in timed runs - however skill is still a factor, along with luck.

[gumball3000]

In order to score in ctf, you still need to clash so the other team drops the flag. They're not just going to sit and watch you score, right? No, they're going to pick up the flag as well and at some point your team will collide with theirs and you will be forced to clash. The flag makes no difference. Sorry, but I don't follow.
You know that the thing where both teams can't flag at the same time is just a gimmick by sts that was added thinking they will prevent free flagging and promote real ctf? Show me another game of ctf where you cannot flag at the same time as the opponent.

[twoxc]

In order to score in ctf, you still need to clash so the other team drops the flag. They're not just going to sit and watch you score, right? No, they're going to pick up the flag as well and at some point your team will collide with theirs and you will be forced to clash. The flag makes no difference. Sorry, but I don't follow.

yea the problem, lol if someone kill someone while flagging they end up calling and ganging/blocking etc which lead to drama.

If anything i think sts should just lock pvp room once it is filled 5/5 ctf and 4/4 tdm until it's finish or complete or when one side of the team leave and room automatically closed or at least reward something when one side is scored to 5 flag first, such as 1 ankh maybe, just a thought.

[gumball3000]

yea the problem, lol if someone kill someone while flagging they end up calling and ganging/blocking etc which lead to drama.

If anything i think sts should just lock pvp room once it is filled 5/5 ctf and 4/4 tdm until it's finish or complete or when one side of the team leave and room automatically closed or at least reward something when one side is scored to 5 flag first, such as 1 ankh maybe, just a thought.
People love stats, you don't have to give ankhs, just numbers. We have kill death ratio but no win lose ratio.

[Zeus]

On topic,

Yes, Raw. Pets have become more and more prevalent in AL. Unfortunately, in order to compete, you and other players are going to have to keep up and purchase new pets. I realized this a long time ago & thus, purchased every arcane pet.

Obviously, STG is not going to change anything as it requires too much effort this late in the game. However, what STG could do is release a new type of PvP arena, one where only certain gear and pets are allowed. These pets and gear would be able to be purchased in kit form from the platinum store to be used in the arena or sold on CS. This way, everybody has an equal chance at PvP in that specific map. This would also earn platinum through the purchases of gear/pets.


Off topic,

Nekro is a very OP pet. To this day, I will mainly use Nekro over SNS even if there's already a Nekro present. It's just so much more beneficial to have one compared to any other pet. Even without the shield, it has a larger terrify range than Samael, gives a terrific speed boost and slows opponents down significantly. The shield is amazing, yes, but even without the shield, the AA is still pretty darn good.

Additionally, I feel that the Nekro to SNS rule is highly exaggerated. In my experience, if there's 1 Nekro & 1 SNS & I have the option to add another Nekro or another SNS to clash, I'll always pick the second Nekro. Clashes at end game often DO last through the second shield and therefore it is more important to have a second shield rather than some damage pools that may not even hit your opponent.

Yes, others have made valid points like SNS pools should not stack with other SNS and frankly, there's logic and I cannot deny that. Heck, I dare say I might agree with it. However, one must keep in mind that Nekro has surpassed SNS is almost every aspect of the game excluding high leveled time runs or end game clashing. In TDM, there is no outright advantage to using SNS other than the healing pools. The pools are easily avoided even if there's stacking of SNS. So, really, there's only two small parts of the game where SNS is the lead pet. That is: clashes (& only after having a first and second Nekro present) & timed records in higher level maps. If you don't believe me, check how often I pull out my SNS over using my Nekro. In my videos, I hardly will use SNS over a Nekro.



So, is it really so bad that there's a pet that's dominant in two small aspects of the game? There are other time run maps to do that SNS is not useful in. Players still get a banner, so how does non-SNS prevent one from obtaining the same end result as an SNS player?

In clashes, I will generally stack a Nekro before a SNS for reasons already stated. There's about 2 videos where I use my SNS over my Nekro in a clash. Let us not forget that all pets eventually get replaced. Has anyone forgotten that Samael went through Nordr, Shuyal and most of Tindirin before relinquishing it's throne? The day will come for SNS one day too and I suspect it's soon.


My 2 cents.

[Kingofninjas]

On topic,

Yes, Raw. Pets have become more and more prevalent in AL. Unfortunately, in order to compete, you and other players are going to have to keep up and purchase new pets. I realized this a long time ago & thus, purchased every arcane pet.

Obviously, STG is not going to change anything as it requires too much effort this late in the game. However, what STG could do is release a new type of PvP arena, one where only certain gear and pets are allowed. These pets and gear would be able to be purchased in kit form from the platinum store to be used in the arena or sold on CS. This way, everybody has an equal chance at PvP in that specific map. This would also earn platinum through the purchases of gear/pets.


Off topic,

Nekro is a very OP pet. To this day, I will mainly use Nekro over SNS even if there's already a Nekro present. It's just so much more beneficial to have one compared to any other pet. Even without the shield, it has a larger terrify range than Samael, gives a terrific speed boost and slows opponents down significantly. The shield is amazing, yes, but even without the shield, the AA is still pretty darn good.

Additionally, I feel that the Nekro to SNS rule is highly exaggerated. In my experience, if there's 1 Nekro & 1 SNS & I have the option to add another Nekro or another SNS to clash, I'll always pick the second Nekro. Clashes at end game often DO last through the second shield and therefore it is more important to have a second shield rather than some damage pools that may not even hit your opponent.

Yes, others have made valid points like SNS pools should not stack with other SNS and frankly, there's logic and I cannot deny that. Heck, I dare say I might agree with it. However, one must keep in mind that Nekro has surpassed SNS is almost every aspect of the game excluding high leveled time runs or end game clashing. In TDM, there is no outright advantage to using SNS other than the healing pools. The pools are easily avoided even if there's stacking of SNS. So, really, there's only two small parts of the game where SNS is the lead pet. That is: clashes (& only after having a first and second Nekro present) & timed records in higher level maps. If you don't believe me, check how often I pull out my SNS over using my Nekro. In my videos, I hardly will use SNS over a Nekro.



So, is it really so bad that there's a pet that's dominant in two small aspects of the game? There are other time run maps to do that SNS is not useful in. Players still get a banner, so how does non-SNS prevent one from obtaining the same end result as an SNS player?

In clashes, I will generally stack a Nekro before a SNS for reasons already stated. There's about 2 videos where I use my SNS over my Nekro in a clash. Let us not forget that all pets eventually get replaced. Has anyone forgotten that Samael went through Nordr, Shuyal and most of Tindirin before relinquishing it's throne? The day will come for SNS one day too and I suspect it's soon.


My 2 cents.

Nekro broke PvP. Giving one team stun immunity and no viable way to break the shield makes one team OP and the other food. Most rogues cannot afford to rush and try to break the shield with pure damage. Believe me, I have tried. In all honesty, I would rather face 3 sns and no nekro over 1 nekro no sns any day of the week. Even with sns, with a well time heal and a lucky crit, you can win the clash. With nekro, unless the enemy dps are ridiculously defensive, there is pretty much no hope.

For pve, especially pure arena, nekro and sns provide such a huge stat boost that they dominate those runs, and having a team of 1 nekro 3 sns or even 2-2 would annihilate tombs. Once the timers in arena came back, I had this naive notion that I would be able to get on arena lb, but you need a ring and ideally a nekro or sns for that.

What baffles me to this day is why sts made so many buff Nerf cycles with sns. It should have remained the way it was immediately after the ursoth event, when a single pool could not kill a tank. Stacking sns was such a huge error IMO. No other pet stacks, and when a pet with such a powerful aa stacks, it can wreck havoc. No pet should deal more damage than 4 rogues, which is what happens in arena if pools stack and we manage to lure boss into them.

Also, yes samael reigned for for to long, but having a samael in the opposing side never meant instant loss as is the case with nekro. I do not have much of a problem with sns because it is avoidable. It hard be hard in CTF maps, but it is possible. With nekro, you can't even out run it because it panic and slows you, simultaneously giving the enemy speed and stun immunity. It makes 1 team impossible to 1 combo or even stun while stunning the other team. It is unbelievably frustrating to shoot 2 full combos into a rogue with nekro shield, only to be 1 hit by a stray uncharged aimed. Playing against nekro, especially when the opponents are unskilled and win only because of nekro makes me want to throw my device against the wall. As of now, nothing can beat a player with nekro of the other player doesn't have one which is just stupid for a game where PvP is one for the main focuses.

[Kingofninjas]

yea the problem, lol if someone kill someone while flagging they end up calling and ganging/blocking etc which lead to drama.

If anything i think sts should just lock pvp room once it is filled 5/5 ctf and 4/4 tdm until it's finish or complete or when one side of the team leave and room automatically closed or at least reward something when one side is scored to 5 flag first, such as 1 ankh maybe, just a thought.

I love the idea of giving ankh for the winning team. Also, I wish people automatically joined the team with less players in tdm and CTF, and if they don't do damage for 30 seconds, automatically removed from the map.

[Zeus]

Nekro broke PvP. Giving one team stun immunity and no viable way to break the shield makes one team OP and the other food. Most rogues cannot afford to rush and try to break the shield with pure damage. Believe me, I have tried. In all honesty, I would rather face 3 sns and no nekro over 1 nekro no sns any day of the week. Even with sns, with a well time heal and a lucky crit, you can win the clash. With nekro, unless the enemy dps are ridiculously defensive, there is pretty much no hope.

For pve, especially pure arena, nekro and sns provide such a huge stat boost that they dominate those runs, and having a team of 1 nekro 3 sns or even 2-2 would annihilate tombs. Once the timers in arena came back, I had this naive notion that I would be able to get on arena lb, but you need a ring and ideally a nekro or sns for that.

What baffles me to this day is why sts made so many buff Nerf cycles with sns. It should have remained the way it was immediately after the ursoth event, when a single pool could not kill a tank. Stacking sns was such a huge error IMO. No other pet stacks, and when a pet with such a powerful aa stacks, it can wreck havoc. No pet should deal more damage than 4 rogues, which is what happens in arena if pools stack and we manage to lure boss into them.

Also, yes samael reigned for for to long, but having a samael in the opposing side never meant instant loss as is the case with nekro. I do not have much of a problem with sns because it is avoidable. It hard be hard in CTF maps, but it is possible. With nekro, you can't even out run it because it panic and slows you, simultaneously giving the enemy speed and stun immunity. It makes 1 team impossible to 1 combo or even stun while stunning the other team. It is unbelievably frustrating to shoot 2 full combos into a rogue with nekro shield, only to be 1 hit by a stray uncharged aimed. Playing against nekro, especially when the opponents are unskilled and win only because of nekro makes me want to throw my device against the wall. As of now, nothing can beat a player with nekro of the other player doesn't have one which is just stupid for a game where PvP is one for the main focuses.


Just as there are skills to prevent or reduce SNS pool damage, there should be made pets that disable a Nekro shield. Violet was a nice start, but I agree...there needs to be more.

[Visiting]

Small suggestion here, but, maybe for all pets that can "banish", let them "banish" Nekro's shield in PVP....?

[Zeus]

Small suggestion here, but, maybe for all pets that can "banish", let them "banish" Nekro's shield in PVP....?

Wow! I love that idea!

[Tatman]

There is no going back from where this game is now. Too late for this.

The whole idea of creating a pet to "counter" another pet is just laughable. I know some people truly believe in the fairy tale about how Nekro was buffed to counter SnS. Nekro was buffed, because a small group of owners just couldn't stop whining. Maybe it's time we start whining about another pet that "counters" Nekro. I'll steal Ral's idea and suggest a pet that doesn't just banish Nekro's shield, but Nekro itself. Or why not a pet that banishes all other pets. Then after another outbreak of whining - a pet that grants immunity to banish. Then.. well, we will think of something.

And while we are at it, let's not forget pve too. A pet that banishes bosses. Only for people who "put a lot of time and effort to obtain it". Transferable once. For a chosen few.

That's how ridiculous things are in this game right now.

[Kingofninjas]

Just as there are skills to prevent or reduce SNS pool damage, there should be made pets that disable a Nekro shield. Violet was a nice start, but I agree...there needs to be more.

I still feel that when nekro shield absorbs a stun for you, after it saves you from lets say, 2 stuns, the shield needs to be broken. Or after saving you from the first stun the damage absorbed by the shield reduces to 25% and after taking the second one it vanishes all together.

[Kingofninjas]

Small suggestion here, but, maybe for all pets that can "banish", let them "banish" Nekro's shield in PVP....?

I think this solution would simply make pets even more of a game changer. As of now, the only pets that banish are samael, nekro and maridos (grim doesnt count). These pets will become even more of a must have and further increase our reliance on them. I would much rather have a weapon has a proc which removes nekro shield or a pet with an aa that does so.

[Wazakesy]

I think this solution would simply make pets even more of a game changer. As of now, the only pets that banish are samael, nekro and maridos (grim doesnt count). These pets will become even more of a must have and further increase our reliance on them. I would much rather have a weapon has a proc which removes nekro shield or a pet with an aa that does so.

In dat caze ill use u as a tank :p

[Kujimasun]

yea the problem, lol if someone kill someone while flagging they end up calling and ganging/blocking etc which lead to drama.

If anything i think sts should just lock pvp room once it is filled 5/5 ctf and 4/4 tdm until it's finish or complete or when one side of the team leave and room automatically closed or at least reward something when one side is scored to 5 flag first, such as 1 ankh maybe, just a thought.

Good idea :D

[Froxanthar]

Small suggestion here, but, maybe for all pets that can "banish", let them "banish" Nekro's shield in PVP....?
I gotta loves ya idea..

[Dex Scene]

Glacian is somewhere 45 Imo.
Glacian rogue is neat,!!!

[Kingofninjas]

Glacian is somewhere 45 Imo.
Glacian rogue is neat,!!!

Glacian is by far the most useless arcane pet. It was the slowest and worst PA and the worst AA. The only thing good about it is the crit. It is worse than FlapJack in pve due its lack of damage. If it weren't for its crit, it would be at a 20.

[Dex Scene]

Glacian is by far the most useless arcane pet. It was the slowest and worst PA and the worst AA. The only thing good about it is the crit. It is worse than FlapJack in pve due its lack of damage. If it weren't for its crit, it would be at a 20.
I meant for Pvp! A glacian Rogue > A dova/ slag rogue

[lonakana]

I've never run a macro or an autopot in my life. I don't play on chrome. Pets do make a massive difference in timed runs - however skill is still a factor, along with luck.


excuse my french, but this was huge sarcasm. dm hilariously had been accused of auto potting before, actually was just brought up again tonight. wonder why i mentioned it here?

[Haligali]

hahaha I should have put more thought into this =P

Hali please take a stab at re-valuing the numbers and ill edit the main post!

Hehe, maybe in another thread, this turned into nekro owners complaint about sns. :D

There is a twink factor, eg dova is awful pet at end game due to lack of arcane ability, while shade and some other less stat overloaded pets better at lvl41 thank to arcane ability.

[Givemeahellyeah]

Nekro broke PvP. Giving one team stun immunity and no viable way to break the shield makes one team OP and the other food. Most rogues cannot afford to rush and try to break the shield with pure damage. Believe me, I have tried. In all honesty, I would rather face 3 sns and no nekro over 1 nekro no sns any day of the week. Even with sns, with a well time heal and a lucky crit, you can win the clash. With nekro, unless the enemy dps are ridiculously defensive, there is pretty much no hope.

For pve, especially pure arena, nekro and sns provide such a huge stat boost that they dominate those runs, and having a team of 1 nekro 3 sns or even 2-2 would annihilate tombs. Once the timers in arena came back, I had this naive notion that I would be able to get on arena lb, but you need a ring and ideally a nekro or sns for that.

What baffles me to this day is why sts made so many buff Nerf cycles with sns. It should have remained the way it was immediately after the ursoth event, when a single pool could not kill a tank. Stacking sns was such a huge error IMO. No other pet stacks, and when a pet with such a powerful aa stacks, it can wreck havoc. No pet should deal more damage than 4 rogues, which is what happens in arena if pools stack and we manage to lure boss into them.

Also, yes samael reigned for for to long, but having a samael in the opposing side never meant instant loss as is the case with nekro. I do not have much of a problem with sns because it is avoidable. It hard be hard in CTF maps, but it is possible. With nekro, you can't even out run it because it panic and slows you, simultaneously giving the enemy speed and stun immunity. It makes 1 team impossible to 1 combo or even stun while stunning the other team. It is unbelievably frustrating to shoot 2 full combos into a rogue with nekro shield, only to be 1 hit by a stray uncharged aimed. Playing against nekro, especially when the opponents are unskilled and win only because of nekro makes me want to throw my device against the wall. As of now, nothing can beat a player with nekro of the other player doesn't have one which is just stupid for a game where PvP is one for the main focuses.

Imagine 3 sns and 2 nekro in a team... That's much worse..
Ppl dont stack Nekro bcoz the aa of nekro doesn't stack. They stack sns and along with sns they will use 1 or 2 nekro's. Thats something hard to encounter unless we ve the same combination of pets imo is tough to come across.. A player simply has to give up when an opponent has 3 sns n 2 nekro.. Even by stacking 5 nekro to encounter 3 sns n 2 nekro its not possible to survive unless the toons are controlled by robots .. A tank may try to survive bt not the other classes.
Sts needs to find a solution and should control the domination of pets like Nekro n Sns.

[Maunyabastian]

Ahh, remember when PvP was "petless"? Those good old days.

[Arrowz]

There needs to be some skill combo that can break the shield. I used to play pocket legends at the lvl 66 cap and mages had a shield that caused then to lose mana instead of health when they took dmg. However, the dex class had a 2 skill combo that when used would instantly break thie shield. Add in somethin like this, just someway to break the shield

[Wazakesy]

Ahh, remember when PvP was "petless"? Those good old days.

Yet mages were dominated by tanks, so were rogues capable of causing havoc for the sorcerers. The uncharged invulnerability was good during those days..until they knocked off the freeze, root, remove uncharged INVUL. and converted it into Charged INVUL. Well, it was a bit of pain tho...and when pets came in, worse.

[Zeus]

excuse my french, but this was huge sarcasm. dm hilariously had been accused of auto potting before, actually was just brought up again tonight. wonder why i mentioned it here?

It's like people don't realize that God gave us 10 fingers and you're allowed to use more than two! A miraculous revelation, isn't it?

[Serancha]

excuse my french, but this was huge sarcasm. dm hilariously had been accused of auto potting before, actually was just brought up again tonight. wonder why i mentioned it here?

See kids, this is a prime example of how text doesn't always convey the actual message. ;)

[raw]

I've never run a macro or an autopot in my life. I don't play on chrome. Pets do make a massive difference in timed runs - however skill is still a factor, along with luck.

Seeing as I've held records at one point or another this season in nearly every single map I can tell you that generally macros/pets > skill/luck

Pets: If you take a look at the lb, I can guarantee you that 95% of map records involve nekro or sns, if not both.
Macros: This is hard to prove obviously but I know a few players who are currently on the LB that use these for a few things such as autopotting, pre-programmed combos, pet resummon hotkeys, etc. I'll definitely get heat for saying that, but it is the truth. Fortunately, autopotting and pet resummons are the only macros I've noticed that make a difference within timed runs.

Also @ Zeus, I'm glad you have purchased every single Arcane Pet, but here's a reality check: 99.9% of arcane legends can't afford a HJ, and the vast majority of us don't spend thousands of dollars on a mobile game. This post is not about Nekro/SnS as much as it is about pets being more powerful than actual players, and that the majority of Arcane and Mythic pets are only accessible to a small portion of the player base. My posts tend to focus on the average player base, so please think about them when you're commenting on my thread.

Anyway, back to the original topic because this is clearly becoming a SnS/Nekro nerf thread...

We need better mid-tier pets to be released, and we need ways to farm better pets. As of now I log in and I have nothing to do since I quit PvP, and since timed runs are dominated by nekro/sns users - neither of which I have, and will probably ever obtain.

It would be nice to hear from a moderator on what they think of this...

[Jazzi]

99.9% of arcane legends can't afford a HJ, and the vast majority of us don't spend thousands of dollars on a mobile game. This post is not about Nekro/SnS as much as it is about pets being more powerful than actual players, and that the majority of Arcane and Mythic pets are only accessible to a small portion of the player base. My posts tend to focus on the average player base, so please think about them when you're commenting on my thread.

Anyway, back to the original topic because this is clearly becoming a SnS/Nekro nerf thread...

We need better mid-tier pets to be released, and we need ways to farm better pets. As of now I log in and I have nothing to do since I quit PvP, and since timed runs are dominated by nekro/sns users - neither of which I have, and will probably ever obtain.

It would be nice to hear from a moderator on what they think of this...

^^ This. Very well said indeed.

[Zeus]

Seeing as I've held records at one point or another this season in nearly every single map I can tell you that generally macros/pets > skill/luck

Pets: If you take a look at the lb, I can guarantee you that 95% of map records involve nekro or sns, if not both.
Macros: This is hard to prove obviously but I know a few players who are currently on the LB that use these for a few things such as autopotting, pre-programmed combos, pet resummon hotkeys, etc. I'll definitely get heat for saying that, but it is the truth. Fortunately, autopotting and pet resummons are the only macros I've noticed that make a difference within timed runs.

Also @ Zeus, I'm glad you have purchased every single Arcane Pet, but here's a reality check: 99.9% of arcane legends can't afford a HJ, and the vast majority of us don't spend thousands of dollars on a mobile game. This post is not about Nekro/SnS as much as it is about pets being more powerful than actual players, and that the majority of Arcane and Mythic pets are only accessible to a small portion of the player base. My posts tend to focus on the average player base, so please think about them when you're commenting on my thread.

Anyway, back to the original topic because this is clearly becoming a SnS/Nekro nerf thread...

We need better mid-tier pets to be released, and we need ways to farm better pets. As of now I log in and I have nothing to do since I quit PvP, and since timed runs are dominated by nekro/sns users - neither of which I have, and will probably ever obtain.

It would be nice to hear from a moderator on what they think of this...


Your times were in the beginning of the season, which any time runner knows do not last.



I'm willing to bet that DM doesn't need any of those pets to beat records posted by other players. They've been doing this for seasons. Players like me and you are new at it. Yes, it may seem like the pets but it's really not. I can show many instances where that can be proven.

[raw]

Your times were in the beginning of the season, which any time runner knows do not last.



I'm willing to bet that DM doesn't need any of those pets to beat records posted by other players. They've been doing this for seasons. Players like me and you are new at it. Yes, it may seem like the pets but it's really not. I can show many instances where that can be proven.

Again Zeus, this thread is not about timed runs. Please read the OP before posting.

@ your comments... we are not on the same page in terms of timed runs, so please do not couple me with you. Also, seeing as you have 22,000 posts on this forums you should be aware that using guild names/players on the forums in any ill manner is against the rules, so please keep that off of the this thread. I will not be getting into an argument with you as you commonly do on threads. Moving on.

[twoxc]

Seeing as I've held records at one point or another this season in nearly every single map I can tell you that generally macros/pets > skill/luck

Pets: If you take a look at the lb, I can guarantee you that 95% of map records involve nekro or sns, if not both.
Macros: This is hard to prove obviously but I know a few players who are currently on the LB that use these for a few things such as autopotting, pre-programmed combos, pet resummon hotkeys, etc. I'll definitely get heat for saying that, but it is the truth. Fortunately, autopotting and pet resummons are the only macros I've noticed that make a difference within timed runs.

Also @ Zeus, I'm glad you have purchased every single Arcane Pet, but here's a reality check: 99.9% of arcane legends can't afford a HJ, and the vast majority of us don't spend thousands of dollars on a mobile game. This post is not about Nekro/SnS as much as it is about pets being more powerful than actual players, and that the majority of Arcane and Mythic pets are only accessible to a small portion of the player base. My posts tend to focus on the average player base, so please think about them when you're commenting on my thread.

Anyway, back to the original topic because this is clearly becoming a SnS/Nekro nerf thread...

We need better mid-tier pets to be released, and we need ways to farm better pets. As of now I log in and I have nothing to do since I quit PvP, and since timed runs are dominated by nekro/sns users - neither of which I have, and will probably ever obtain.

It would be nice to hear from a moderator on what they think of this...

All I gotta say is Farm Arena, Fossil does exist in those chest. A lot of people say they will never obtain Arcane ring when it first came out and now everywhere I look I see Arcane ring lol. You can't ask for something to Farm and then not wanna farm because the road is bumpy and rough or the reward is not to your liking. Sts has put a few decent pet for the majority of the players. Breeze, Fossils, Snappy. They are good pets, hell Nekro is indeed BEST for most TIMED MAP which is why nekro is consider one of the best and it is ARCANE.

You ask for more farmable mythic pets which i'm sure these pet won't come close to Arcane pets unless you expecting mythic pets to out best an arcane pet and to be setting TIMED using mythic pet? the leaderboard isn't just a board for anyone to tackle with any equipment or pets, the times are best for a reason because it's require the best of the best pets/equipment and yea some experience and skills xD just need lots of practice.

You want farmable mythic pet will mythic recipe pendant is quite deadly and is really good can't do any record without one nor can you do a record without arcane ring. Oh and about when you were once had every record in almost every map, that was before mythic pendant and nox fix plus among other stuff. there's a huge damage different in that and at the time lol no one or should I say DM was so not into doing record because it was at the release of Planar tomb which many were focus on farming and getting rich xD. Just saying.

[Serancha]

You want farmable mythic pet will mythic recipe pendant is quite deadly and is really good can't do any record without one nor can you do a record without arcane ring.

Didn't we get 3:09 pure arena with me wearing a blood ruby? lol

[Rockingtigertiger Tiger]

I think sts should pay some sought of attention towards to those players who can afford and who can't afford despite of this realising lots of arcane pets have created a huge gap between rich and poor but if sts should realise something which could solve this issue coz it's already a rat race for arcane stuff 😬😬

[Spell]

Small suggestion here, but, maybe for all pets that can "banish", let them "banish" Nekro's shield in PVP....?
You do realise that sns pools banish right? Its an endless cycle xD

[twoxc]

You do realise that sns pools banish right? Its an endless cycle xD

LOL LIA, yea which then lead back to SNS being Over Power then nerf thread then etc etc etc endless cycle indeed hahaha. Wait but Lia you can avoid from getting into sns pool xD hehe.

[Zeus]

Again Zeus, this thread is not about timed runs. Please read the OP before posting.

@ your comments... we are not on the same page in terms of timed runs, so please do not couple me with you. Also, seeing as you have 22,000 posts on this forums you should be aware that using guild names/players on the forums in any ill manner is against the rules, so please keep that off of the this thread. I will not be getting into an argument with you as you commonly do on threads. Moving on.

I noticed usage of time runs as a reference so I wanted to clarify that times in the beginning of the season mean nothing. They are always wiped, redone, etc. Therefore, one cannot use them as a reference that pets were the reason that one's timeds for wiped.

I am aware of the forum rules. I am complimenting DM, not insulting them. Thank you!

[supersyan]

hey a question? if 2 SNS on both team. How do you distinguish which pool is your team?

[Visiting]

hey a question? if 2 SNS on both team. How do you distinguish which pool is your team?

There will be a small circle inside the pool with your team color (red or blue), but honestly, it distinguishing the difference is super hard, so just staying out of all pools except the green ones is your best bet.

[Sorcerie]

We got new arcane pets for days and still no new mythic ring to bridge the gap between Blood Ruby and Rendtail ring users.

#priorities #can we focus on gear again pls

[Visiting]

It was an attempt to continue the samael era

I do not own a Samael (and have no interest in buying one), it was more of a leap into to finding viable counters for the Nekro shield.

[Visiting]

I see. But Grimm shouldn't be able to banish a 50m shield. Imo, this pet is already becoming very common. Most teams I'm on (pve & pve) have 2-3 nekros already. In a few months it will cost 20m and half of Arlor will own one.

Are you suggesting that a mythic rarity pet shouldn't have even a chance to surpass an arcane pet?

[raw]

I see. But Grimm shouldn't be able to banish a 50m shield. Imo, this pet is already becoming very common. Most teams I'm on (pve & pve) have 2-3 nekros already. In a few months it will cost 20m and half of Arlor will own one.

Shiny, not to derail your point or to criticize you personally, but I think the logic you are using exemplifies the delusion that a lot of forumers have about Arcane Legends. A vast majority of forum posts are from the perspective of those who have been playing for a long period of time, and those who tend to gather real influence in the forums are often very rich in game. What we fail to realize is that most of Arcane Legend players are very poor. We often hear about the incredible amount of downloads that AL gets from the various stores, but in all honesty where are those players now? The customer retention in AL seems extremely low (meaning that people who download and try AL tend to quit more often than they keep playing). Customer retention should be one of the top priorities of any company.

Point being, that a vast majority of the threads in the General Discussion and Player vs Player address items that will help the top percentage of players, and is not representing the average player base. Your point below really exemplifies this. When I play TDM/CTF, I feel terrible for the average player who has no chance. When I run elites with randoms they are so vastly undergeared, and undereducated about the best tips/tricks that I literally wonder why they even bother playing.
Most teams I'm on (pve & pve) have 2-3 nekros already. In a few months it will cost 20m and half of Arlor will own one.

With no income, and nothing profitable except Arena - which if you've played with legendary gear and mediocre experience will end up costing you a ton of ankhs - what do players have to look forward to? I loved the Halloween event because it actually gave players something notable to work towards. Grim!

Now what do they have? Planar Tombs? Locked Crates? zzz

I really behoove everyone on this forum to think about the future of our game and realize that we as the dedicated and active player base need to do more to promote the growth of this game by encouraging updates that will benefit all, not just us.

[JohnnyHardcore]

You know that the thing where both teams can't flag at the same time is just a gimmick by sts that was added thinking they will prevent free flagging and promote real ctf? Show me another game of ctf where you cannot flag at the same time as the opponent.

World of Warcraft.

[Tatman]

My rogue, which I use to farm the Arena, is fully legendary. My rogue has a legendary expedition bow, it has icescale armor and helm and my pet is blinky. I use a haunted ring most of the time. This is an extremely inexpensive setup. This toon has looted multiple recipes. Enough recipes that any new player with the same setup as me can earn millions within a few months. It's up to them if they want to put in the time to farm. Most people don't put in the time and then they make a thread here saying stuff like, "did recipe get nerfed? I farmed for 5 hours and got nothing."

You are a well-known player. I'm not as well-known as you are, but I still get invites for Arena/Tombs, if I happen to run with more or less the same gear described above; e.g. when my main gear is upgrading.

Now imagine a player who only has this one toon with an expe bow and an icescale set. He doesn't have a (near) maxed mage alt. He doesn't have a myth bow or a planar pendant upgrading. He probably doesn't have many strong friends either. He runs with other similarly geared players, mostly pugs, and he spends much more ankhs and pots than you or me.

So, please. Spare us those fairy tales about the multiple recipes that anyone can farm and get maxed in a few months.

[Ardbeg]

You are a well-known player. I'm not as well-known as you are, but I still get invites for Arena/Tombs, if I happen to run with more or less the same gear described above; e.g. when my main gear is upgrading.

Now imagine a player who only has this one toon with an expe bow and an icescale set. He doesn't have a (near) maxed mage alt. He doesn't have a myth bow or a planar pendant upgrading. He probably doesn't have many strong friends either. He runs with other similarly geared players, mostly pugs, and he spends much more ankhs and pots than you or me.

So, please. Spare us those fairy tales about the multiple recipes that anyone can farm and get maxed in a few months.

i made a rogue after i was frustrated with the tank performance in arena (which has greatly improved after the buff), icescale gear, standard jewelry, exp bow and blinky as pet. you can very well run arena with that setup and farm recipes. ravagerx runs a similar setup i think on his rogue. i do run with very mixed parties and there are a lot of ways to save ankhs (breeze, kelvin, study halis great guide,...)
it s always a bit of a ankh vs run time situation, but yes, you can indeed run arena with medium gear in everyones reach. just don t expect record times.

[Mimmay]

How do people read huge huge comments? I DO NOT UNDERSTAND

[JohnnyHardcore]

You are a well-known player. I'm not as well-known as you are, but I still get invites for Arena/Tombs, if I happen to run with more or less the same gear described above; e.g. when my main gear is upgrading.

Now imagine a player who only has this one toon with an expe bow and an icescale set. He doesn't have a (near) maxed mage alt. He doesn't have a myth bow or a planar pendant upgrading. He probably doesn't have many strong friends either. He runs with other similarly geared players, mostly pugs, and he spends much more ankhs and pots than you or me.

So, please. Spare us those fairy tales about the multiple recipes that anyone can farm and get maxed in a few months.

Well said. When my mage was in legendary gear started running arena. Heard all the gushing about farming it. Had NO idea what I was getting in to.

Yes, once players get the knack for it, it's viable to farm with low ankh usage. But that first two weeks of trying killed it for me. For 2 weeks myself and
3 guildies in a similar situation tried farming it. And in that two weeks while we figured it out all four of us went through ~25 ankhs per RUN. And in those two weeks between all four of us the best drop we saw was reinforced gems. Of those, we got 4 cumulatively between us. Other than that, junk.

2 quit AL straight up. "If this is end game farming why bother playing at end game." 1 won't set foot in arena anymore because even 500k is a lot of gold to someone that only plays a couple hours a day instead of 140/168 hours in a week, and he just can't get a leg up to afford it.

Point; end game farming is for people who have put enough time in to be the elite 5% and they are more vocal than the majority of low end players. Something is wrong with that.

[Thexkid]

Lets keep the feedback constructive and on topic. When pets become more useful/valuable than ones toon itself then thats when this game will take a turn for the worse(for the rich). How much is full gear compared to the price of sns or even nekro. The ring is the only character item that compares to the value. Also would you rather be on the team with 4 but having a nekro/sns and rest samaels or be on the team with 5 toons but all samaels(thats an extra pet and player;) i have to admit its now become less about gear and more about the pet. Ive seen toons sell their ring and get a nekro. Its now become ither have an op pet or you cant compete. Even i have 2 toons with sam and one with maridos max geared but if i vs or compete against nekros and sns in pvp without having one or even one on my team it feels like the pet is most of the difference when we/I lose, not because the other team is more skilled. Even though they might be.. that even adds to the fire lol. I pvp quite a bit and if i see a toon without a good arcane pet then i will rush them and be very surprised if i lost the fight. Pets in this game our like cars in real life. They have became the most important item, and show your "status" in game. We might as well start riding them ;D lol
I freestyled all of the above so please dont critique it too hard :) i think sts should not make pets more useful/valuable than the average or even maxed geared player, what do you think?

[JohnnyHardcore]

To clarify my point, if we dont want to increase drop rates, if we don't want to add new rewards, we should have the arena scaled explicitly to player STATS, not level. Make it as hard for the arcane/mythic players so we burn through the same amount of ankhs or as easy for legendary players so they can burn through less.

Make the rewards fit the risks d expense output.

[Kingofninjas]

Sorry, but arena is simply not a viable way to earn money. The parties I run with cost me about 1-2 ankh per run on an average, and the only way for me to cut my pot and ankh cost is through reinforced gems. I have terrible luck and I know it, so this may not be the case for all players, but I have run over 1000 runs without seeing a recipe drop. I do solo and duo every Noe and then, so let's say my average party consists of 3 players. That's 3000 runs where I have not seen a hint of that damn recipe. Heck, in 3000 runs I would expect to see someone loot a fossil. Often, I can't even loot a reinforced gem in the 15-20 arena chests I can farm per ankh kit.

Planar tombs, at least, gives me an assured 100k profit from selling a tomb chest every 20 runs. Due to lack of new content however, end game farming is dead. For a while, magmatic claymores of assault sold for 500-700k. Very profitable to farm. Nowadays, nobody uses those, so its become relatively worthless. Planar weapons are so dead I melt the ones I loot of gift them to under geared players. Another idiotic thing, IMO, is these pet crates. Shadowlurk was one of the last profitable eggs that people could farm for reasonable profits, and it just got destroyed by the pet crate.

Even of sts doesn't have the time to make new content, they can update the loot table. I believe it was candylicks who made a suggestions for keys for locked crates to drop from elites. They could make para and eye gems a incredibly rare drop from pt3 boss. Make some bonus bosses like krunch and bael II for elite maps that drop gear that is better than your run of the mill crate legendary. GIVE US A NEW MYTHIC RING. This arlorian eggshell band was rubbing salt in the wound of blood ruby users. Get our hopes up and then stomping on them. I'd happily farm 1000 arena chest (in batches of 250) 1000 fragments and even some dragkin teeth if it meant I could get a better ring. All I'm saying, is that from an average players (non plat) point of view, there are very very limited ways to earn gold that.does not require insane luck or a risk of loss.

[Ardbeg]

To clarify my point, if we dont want to increase drop rates, if we don't want to add new rewards, we should have the arena scaled explicitly to player STATS, not level. Make it as hard for the arcane/mythic players so we burn through the same amount of ankhs or as easy for legendary players so they can burn through less.


Uhm no! just no! Why would anyone bother to gear up if it doesn t grant s him benefits?
why would you farm for the new gear if you get scaled down immediately so you don t feel a difference?
communism only works for smurf village, surely not for mmos, they are created around gear differences,....
i run arena everyday with parties optimized for friendship and not gear, and i saw a lot of the regulas loot a recipe by now.

[JohnnyHardcore]

Uhm no! just no! Why would anyone bother to gear up if it doesn t grant s him benefits?
why would you farm for the new gear if you get scaled down immediately so you don t feel a difference?
communism only works for smurf village, surely not for mmos, they are created around gear differences,....
i run arena everyday with parties optimized for friendship and not gear, and i saw a lot of the regulas loot a recipe by now.

This. This is exactly what I mean about the vocal 5%. "Noo. We're elite. That doesn't work for us. Sorry. Not allowed, we don't seem as god-like." Enough. You want to be the best of the best? Start competing with the 4.99% that are on tier with you and stop feeling like king pimp for being better than the 95% that can't even imagine competing with you anymore. Stop being glad when the market crashes on the only items mid ranges can earn gold from and pissed off when it crashes on your purchases from three years ago.

Markets change, progress happens. Nobody is asking to be handed the gme, or a way to be exactly the same as you. Everyone is asking to LEVEL THE PLAYING FIELD so we aren't chasing you with two broken legs with no crutches.

[Ardbeg]

This. This is exactly what I mean about the vocal 5%. "Noo. We're elite. That doesn't work for us. Sorry. Not allowed, we don't seem as god-like." Enough. You want to be the best of the best? Start competing with the 4.99% that are on tier with you and stop feeling like king pimp for being better than the 95% that can't even imagine competing with you anymore. Stop being glad when the market crashes on the only items mid ranges can earn gold from and pissed off when it crashes on your purchases from three years ago.

Markets change, progress happens. Nobody is asking to be handed the gme, or a way to be exactly the same as you. Everyone is asking to LEVEL THE PLAYING FIELD so we aren't chasing you with two broken legs with no crutches.

read again, when tanks were severily left behind i built a very *mediocre* geared rogue to make the point, that i can still farm better with it then on my maxed out tank. and i was right.

i farmed with it a lot. and i gave feedback in the forum that we need a better return in arena to make it worth farming, as most pve guild gms did. stg listened and created the reinforced gems. no game changers, but a help to keep up with the costs for ankhs.

i play all classes in endgame and since i am here since the start of the game i learned some things about game mechanics.

shiny also made his points based on knowledge and experience, not on wishful thinking.

if you read my post again, please point out where i played the elite card as you mentioned. a lot of people ran with me as a legendary rogue. and we have regularily legendary players in our party and still end up with very enjoyable runs, profitable after some grinding.

if your idea of an mmo is that you can just wander through it and have the same gear level after weeks as players who are here for several years, maybe you should overthink that a bit. my main point stays, arena can be done without max gear, as a lot of experienced players can show you.

[Kriticality]

This. This is exactly what I mean about the vocal 5%. "Noo. We're elite. That doesn't work for us. Sorry. Not allowed, we don't seem as god-like." Enough. You want to be the best of the best? Start competing with the 4.99% that are on tier with you and stop feeling like king pimp for being better than the 95% that can't even imagine competing with you anymore. Stop being glad when the market crashes on the only items mid ranges can earn gold from and pissed off when it crashes on your purchases from three years ago.

Markets change, progress happens. Nobody is asking to be handed the gme, or a way to be exactly the same as you. Everyone is asking to LEVEL THE PLAYING FIELD so we aren't chasing you with two broken legs with no crutches.

Ard doesn't pvp much that I see and most of us that I play with gear, got it to play with the top 5% or whatever percentage you believe it to be.

I could care less about playing under geared people in pvp. I end up sitting in tdm most of the time anyway. The reason I spent the money I did was to compete with the people you are referring to.

I didn't play before this season. In fact I've only been playing 6 months I think. I don't have any reference point to before it was this way. I still find this game to be very fun.

I learned arena with blinky and slag just like everyone else. I got smashed in tombs just like everyone else. If you were slinging breeze egg at the beginning of tombs, you could've been pulling in 7-10m for the first and second month.

There are ways to catch up, money or luck, skill and time.

I don't think people feel like they are too elite. Just that people should walk a similar path for comparable results. Remember, nobody had planar pendant or imbued to start running arena for recipe obviously. They were mythic players with varying weapons and pets.

[Serancha]

As much as I don't want to get info this whole derailed debate, I have to say that making money on arena is not something one can rely on. I have done over 1500 runs and have still not looted anything more valuable than a reinforced blood gem.

Those who have looted multiple recipes and the very few who have obtained fossils are not actually the norm, I don't believe.

[twoxc]

As much as I don't want to get info this whole derailed debate, I have to say that making money on arena is not something one can rely on. I have done over 1500 runs and have still not looted anything more valuable than a reinforced blood gem.

Those who have looted multiple recipes and the very few who have obtained fossils are not actually the norm, I don't believe.


What you mean they are not actually the NORM? I looted a fossil xD you don't believe me?

[Kriticality]

As much as I don't want to get info this whole derailed debate, I have to say that making money on arena is not something one can rely on. I have done over 1500 runs and have still not looted anything more valuable than a reinforced blood gem.

Those who have looted multiple recipes and the very few who have obtained fossils are not actually the norm, I don't believe.

I've looted 2 recipes and would be happy to make an agreement with you or anyone else that if any one of us loots recipe, I'd give 600k-1M to all party members if everyone else will do the same. LMK. Lets get this gold. I'd also give 1M to each member of party if I loot fossil. Let's get this gold!!!

[Serancha]

What you mean they are not actually the NORM? I looted a fossil xD you don't believe me?

Of course I believe you silly. I am just pointing out that just because someone runs arena, even if they run it a lot, there is no guarantee they're going to loot anything valuable in any number of runs. In fact. a lot of people may never see a fossil - that's all I meant.

[Tatman]

i made a rogue after i was frustrated with the tank performance in arena (which has greatly improved after the buff), icescale gear, standard jewelry, exp bow and blinky as pet. you can very well run arena with that setup and farm recipes. ravagerx runs a similar setup i think on his rogue. i do run with very mixed parties and there are a lot of ways to save ankhs (breeze, kelvin, study halis great guide,...)
it s always a bit of a ankh vs run time situation, but yes, you can indeed run arena with medium gear in everyones reach. just don t expect record times.
I am not sure why some of you can't understand what I mean.

I am levelling a mage at the moment. It will be an undergeared toon. I will be bad as an endgame mage at the beginning. However, I know I'll be running with more or less the same people I've been running so far on my rogue. They'll do some bad runs with me until I get in the groove. Because those people know me and like running with me. I'm pretty sure same goes for most of you here with the undergeared alts.

I don't think I need to explain why the above does not apply to the vast majority of legendary players in this game. And I mean actual players, not alts of maxed ones.

[Oursizes]

This thread is for pets effecting the game, a bit side tracked here. But yes gear=gods father, pets=god. Nowadays mythic geared players don't even think about inviting a legendary wep player to the team. I asked a tank with elon bulwark today if he can invite me to his party,he responded by saying that he was looking for high geared players. I use a mythic set, fang of fenrir, expe bow and arlor potency ring. These are the types of gears many average players use, give or take. And many average players have blinky or gyrm(like I do). But truth is unless you have good gears and pets, no one will invite you.

[Visiting]

Lol this is not a fairy tale. As Ardbeg stated, Ravagerx has a,similarly geared rogue as me, i.e. all legendary. The two of us legendary players have looted millions from arena combined. How's that for a fairy tale. The point is that we spent many hours per day over many months of farming. We usually did not run with friends who had maxed toons.

If you notice a well geared cow walking around arlor, ask him how many hours he's farmed to get there. It'll blow your mind.

While this is true, most players can't afford an arcane ring/planar pendant which you can transfer across toons (assuming they're on the same account), plus, it's not like you have monetary struggles when it comes to purchasing Ankhs/Pots/Pet Food...

[Caabatric]

Overall lets say that you loot a recipe every 1000 runs.(which isn't unlikely)
In those 1000 runs you should have made about 300-500k ish from reinforced gems.
Then from personal experience i take from 3-8 ankhs in arena so we will average 5 ankhs per run.
that is 5 runs every 40-50k.
1000/5 = 200 (ankh kits used)
200*45k= 9m (cost of ankh kits)

add in potion cost and u have a - profit gain...


This is what the average player can expect from arena unless they get lucky.
U must loot a recipe in 900 runs to even make 1m of profit.

Add in time now.

Average time for an average geared pt(mythic set, one or 2 members with mythic weapon)= 8-15min. (for our purposes 12 we will say minutes)
12*900= 10800 minutes
10800/60 = 180 hours (assuming no break in finding party waiting no dc etc....)

So what were people saying that arena is profitable......

On topic, well said raw though your point system is off imo.

[Haligali]

Of course I believe you silly. I am just pointing out that just because someone runs arena, even if they run it a lot, there is no guarantee they're going to loot anything valuable in any number of runs. In fact. a lot of people may never see a fossil - that's all I meant.

I have written a guide about arena environments and I hold some arena records too, lost my count around 2000+ runs, never looted recipe.

[gumball3000]

This thread is for pets effecting the game, a bit side tracked here. But yes gear=gods father, pets=god. Nowadays mythic geared players don't even think about inviting a legendary wep player to the team. I asked a tank with elon bulwark today if he can invite me to his party,he responded by saying that he was looking for high geared players. I use a mythic set, fang of fenrir, expe bow and arlor potency ring. These are the types of gears many average players use, give or take. And many average players have blinky or gyrm(like I do). But truth is unless you have good gears and pets, no one will invite you.
If that tank is looking only for high gear players it means he is not a very good player himself. Trust me, if he is only looking for people like that you don't want to run with him anyways.

[ilhanna]

If that tank is looking only for high gear players it means he is not a very good player himself. Trust me, if he is only looking for people like that you don't want to run with him anyways.

True. And the people he expects to run with probably don't need him.

[Aziiii]

Just 2 seasons ago we gave a guildie (not gonna say name) with decent gear and mali as a pet an arena timed run and a banner...and as for myself i ran some times using grym or slag,only got sam this season so i dont see a problem in pets..and i can give many more examples of people not using op pets and still finding a way to succede in what they want..sure some of them are op But Its the skills that matter, the team u run with, the timing ..i guess bowth pve and pve.

[Tatman]

I have written a guide about arena environments and I hold some arena records too, lost my count around 2000+ runs, never looted recipe.
2000 runs not enough. Go farm some more and you'll be a billionaire in no time. ;)

[ilhanna]

I won't argue that you can farm arena with average gear. My guildmates and I do it everyday. My only problem is how luck-dependent recipe and fossil loot is in arena. Yes, all farming is luck-based but given how expensive Arena runs are, the returns are frankly discouraging, even with reinforced gem and consumables in master chest. With Tindirin elite and Planar Tomb at least there are dragkin teeth and fragments you can collect to exchange for something valuable. The only thing people are sure of collecting in Arena are worthless Shades and Nobles and blue junks.

And doesnt't anyone think it's pathetic that Arena and Tombs are the only places worth farming now? The cost of farming there is prohibitive for some. And there isn't much in the way of dependable fall back plan, a place where people can farm to get themselves ready for Planar farming, or where Planar farmers in need of quick cash for ankh/elixir/pet feed can replenish their resources before going back to recipe/fossil farming. There is very little new players (not alts of established endgamers) can farm to fund progress to where they will be ready for Planar. Not every player has plat to fall back on. Farm events, farm easy maps, crawl before you can run, I'm familiar with the sermons. The fact is, pve farming has been considerably reduced now to two exclusive zones, there aren't many other options available for those who are unable to farm those zones due to experience/gear/resources inadequacy, luck prevails over hard work, and this is what's presented to new players. Yes, many poor players leave game anyway, but with a lot of established endgamers quitting, doesn't it make more sense to give starting out players more even playing field, give them a more reasonable hope and goals to attain to keep them playing. The future of AL rests not only on the big plat spending BNFs, but on new players as well.

[twoxc]

I've looted 2 recipes and would be happy to make an agreement with you or anyone else that if any one of us loots recipe, I'd give 600k-1M to all party members if everyone else will do the same. LMK. Lets get this gold. I'd also give 1M to each member of party if I loot fossil. Let's get this gold!!!

I've been doing this since recipe and fossil was put into arena loot. Base on recipe value, before when it was 11-15m, I was in a party of 3 and 2 of us looted recipe. Both the looter gave 2 mil each to the third person. On the day I looted a fossil, I was also in a party of 3 and I gave 5mil each to each party member. It was Lonakona and Prodtigy. What goes around come around ^^ keep doing good deeds rather it's big or small. This will keep their motivation up and for them to keep on playing and continue to strive on without feeling down and crappy about not getting anything. I know the feeling of not looting anything and seeing your party loot stuff and get rich it's very depressing.

[Zeus]

I've been doing this since recipe and fossil was put into arena loot. Base on recipe value, before when it was 11-15m, I was in a party of 3 and 2 of us looted recipe. Both the looter gave 2 mil each to the third person. On the day I looted a fossil, I was also in a party of 3 and I gave 5mil each to each party member. It was Lonakona and Prodtigy. What goes around come around ^^ keep doing good deeds rather it's big or small. This will keep their motivation up and for them to keep on playing and continue to strive on without feeling down and crappy about not getting anything. I know the feeling of not looting anything and seeing your party loot stuff and get rich it's very depressing.

I'm claiming 2m per recipe that you've looted in a party with me! 2 I think! Pay up ;)


*jokes*

But yes, I fully agree with what goes around comes around which is why I'll go 50-50 on profits if someone helped me make a sale.

[Farminer's]

I'm claiming 2m per recipe that you've looted in a party with me! 2 I think! Pay up ;)


*jokes*

But yes, I fully agree with what goes around comes around which is why I'll go 50-50 on profits if someone helped me make a sale.
I wish I would be lucky enough to even be able to get a Party to run cause no one needs a bad warrior -.-

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk

[Kingofninjas]

I completely agree with splitting all money earned while farming, but its very hard to find people who agree to this. Back when Mali was worth like 200-300k, I would run with a group who agreed to split any money earned from looting it. Good days. I would get up to 500k per day for hard grinding. However, when I bring this idea up with randoms I run with, most of them instantly leave the map and the others lol. I would be happy to evenly split the gold of any valuable item I loot (above 1m) both for arena and the upcoming expansion. Hit me up!

Note: You will probably be doing most of the giving gold since I have horrendous luck in pve. xD

[Kakashis]

Gold sharing would be nice, but it really comes down to who you run with and trust. Some get gold sickness after looting the recipie. They won't want to share.

They should just make it equal drops where everyone in party loots the same thing.

[Farminer's]

I completely agree with splitting all money earned while farming, but its very hard to find people who agree to this. Back when Mali was worth like 200-300k, I would run with a group who agreed to split any money earned from looting it. Good days. I would get up to 500k per day for hard grinding. However, when I bring this idea up with randoms I run with, most of them instantly leave the map and the others lol. I would be happy to evenly split the gold of any valuable item I loot (above 1m) both for arena and the upcoming expansion. Hit me up!

Note: You will probably be doing most of the giving gold since I have horrendous luck in pve. xD
Hmu at Uiflaotara I will run with you for recipe and split gold with you as long as I get enough for a arcane pet (perf 5m) from recipe if I loot u can have rest. Lol

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk

[Excuses]

131197

I suggested this long ago and no one cared about it lol

And yes, since panic + slag(then Sam follwed) introduced, pets has become one of the most important thing. Good money maker I guess.

Hope we can have a pure farmable crafting arcane pet like Eric suggested too.

[twoxc]

But nekro is a Pure farmable crafting pet. The more arena you finish the more chest you open the more chance you get that fossil. Its just not fixed like Flagging in pvp to get that final AP lol. this is straight up luck and yea the luck is so off. one can loot in 10 chest and one can loot in 500+ lol ridiculous.

[Kyle Holmes]

Everyone saying that average geared toons can run arena but they always mention 'rogue' try being an average geared tank and then come back and post. Can't earn money to buy ankhs because the price of locked is so low and there is no other places to farm that would be profitable.

sent from fritters beak

[jn2002dk]

As a new player it's a bit disheartening to read this

I do have a few questions though

Are Grand Crates likely to rise in price again once the next expansion hits?

I've been saving mine so far but if it's just going to keep dropping i might as well get rid of them

Secondly, i have a lot plat and i could use some advice on how to spend it

Should i convert it to cash by selling ankhs/luck/xp stuff or are there some really good pets for a sorcerer and a rogue i should get first?

I went ahead and got Haze for both characters, they also have Courage from the adventurer pack

[Iinorex]

All I gotta say is Farm Arena, Fossil does exist in those chest. A lot of people say they will never obtain Arcane ring when it first came out and now everywhere I look I see Arcane ring lol. You can't ask for something to Farm and then not wanna farm because the road is bumpy and rough or the reward is not to your liking. Sts has put a few decent pet for the majority of the players. Breeze, Fossils, Snappy. They are good pets, hell Nekro is indeed BEST for most TIMED MAP which is why nekro is consider one of the best and it is ARCANE.

You ask for more farmable mythic pets which i'm sure these pet won't come close to Arcane pets unless you expecting mythic pets to out best an arcane pet and to be setting TIMED using mythic pet? the leaderboard isn't just a board for anyone to tackle with any equipment or pets, the times are best for a reason because it's require the best of the best pets/equipment and yea some experience and skills xD just need lots of practice.

You want farmable mythic pet will mythic recipe pendant is quite deadly and is really good can't do any record without one nor can you do a record without arcane ring. Oh and about when you were once had every record in almost every map, that was before mythic pendant and nox fix plus among other stuff. there's a huge damage different in that and at the time lol no one or should I say DM was so not into doing record because it was at the release of Planar tomb which many were focus on farming and getting rich xD. Just saying.

so you think everyone got their arcane rings by farming?

[Iinorex]

I see. But Grimm shouldn't be able to banish a 50m shield. Imo, this pet is already becoming very common. Most teams I'm on (pve & pve) have 2-3 nekros already. In a few months it will cost 20m and half of Arlor will own one.

most teams you are on have 2-3 necros because you play with the same team
and banish is banish be it from a 12mil pet or 400k pet

[Iinorex]

Sorry Raw, but I am going to disagree with you as well. You're not exactly scrounging up change to pay for pet food. If someone saw you idle in town, they would judge you as a rich player.

The fact that you run with under geared random players does not prove anything. Those people are probably in maps that they should not be in either because they lack the skill, gear or both. Nonetheless, those random players will make some of the best friends while struggling to complete one of those maps. Sure, they'll die 10x a run, but they'll have a great time doing it. Tell me that you remember those days. I know I do.

FYI, I sold my mythic bow long ago. My rogue, which I use to farm the Arena, is fully legendary. My rogue has a legendary expedition bow, it has icescale armor and helm and my pet is blinky. I use a haunted ring most of the time. This is an extremely inexpensive setup. This toon has looted multiple recipes. Enough recipes that any new player with the same setup as me can earn millions within a few months. It's up to them if they want to put in the time to farm. Most people don't put in the time and then they make a thread here saying stuff like, "did recipe get nerfed? I farmed for 5 hours and got nothing."

The people who you are calling poor now will be sorted out into two groups. Some of them will quit the game and make all sorts of excuses. Others will figure out how to earn gold and they will hit the ground running in the next expansion. Those players will be rich by the end of the next level cap and the same poor people will still be pointing fingers and writing threads to blame STS.

You know, people really need to stop asking for the best items to be easily farmable. Arcane Legends is a game to you and I, but to STS this is a business. In my company, we don't give things out for free so why should this be any different? They have done a lot of events so people could acquire items to sell or use. Despite that, there has been multiple confirmed Fossils looted as well. Don't expect a fossil to drop on a regular basis though, because Arcane Legends is a business and they're not here to hand away one of the best items in the game.

ur rogue is legendary but you have a mage with necro n arcane ring...any rogue with the items can farm arena or tombs nicely but the problem is in buying pots n ankhs

[Iinorex]

read again, when tanks were severily left behind i built a very *mediocre* geared rogue to make the point, that i can still farm better with it then on my maxed out tank. and i was right.

i farmed with it a lot. and i gave feedback in the forum that we need a better return in arena to make it worth farming, as most pve guild gms did. stg listened and created the reinforced gems. no game changers, but a help to keep up with the costs for ankhs.

i play all classes in endgame and since i am here since the start of the game i learned some things about game mechanics.

shiny also made his points based on knowledge and experience, not on wishful thinking.

if you read my post again, please point out where i played the elite card as you mentioned. a lot of people ran with me as a legendary rogue. and we have regularily legendary players in our party and still end up with very enjoyable runs, profitable after some grinding.

if your idea of an mmo is that you can just wander through it and have the same gear level after weeks as players who are here for several years, maybe you should overthink that a bit. my main point stays, arena can be done without max gear, as a lot of experienced players can show you.

i am against the hardness of tombs or arenas based on gears but pls dont say u have a medium geared rogue n farm elites...firstly you have a multimillion dollar warrior at ur disposal secondly u dont have to think about ankhs thirdly u are a old player n u r famous...imagine a new player with legend gear..if he is rogue it is ok...if he is warrior or mage life will be hard for him...you cant understand out pain till u become one of us

[Iinorex]

Ard doesn't pvp much that I see and most of us that I play with gear, got it to play with the top 5% or whatever percentage you believe it to be.

I could care less about playing under geared people in pvp. I end up sitting in tdm most of the time anyway. The reason I spent the money I did was to compete with the people you are referring to.

I didn't play before this season. In fact I've only been playing 6 months I think. I don't have any reference point to before it was this way. I still find this game to be very fun.

I learned arena with blinky and slag just like everyone else. I got smashed in tombs just like everyone else. If you were slinging breeze egg at the beginning of tombs, you could've been pulling in 7-10m for the first and second month.

There are ways to catch up, money or luck, skill and time.

I don't think people feel like they are too elite. Just that people should walk a similar path for comparable results. Remember, [B]nobody had planar pendant or imbued to start running arena for recipe obviously. They were mythic players with varying weapons and pets.

you want us to believe you farmed all ur gear?
i have no problem with people being heavily geared but dont make it sound like you farmed without eating or drinkink day n night to get your gear

[Kriticality]

you want us to believe you farmed all ur gear?
i have no problem with people being heavily geared but dont make it sound like you farmed without eating or drinkink day n night to get your gear

I don't want you to believe that. I don't think I said that. I've both farmed tens of millions and platted tens of millions. ;)

[Kingofninjas]

But nekro is a Pure farmable crafting pet. The more arena you finish the more chest you open the more chance you get that fossil. Its just not fixed like Flagging in pvp to get that final AP lol. this is straight up luck and yea the luck is so off. one can loot in 10 chest and one can loot in 500+ lol ridiculous.

Nekro is only pure farmable theoretically. Practically, it is impossible to put a approximate number if the number if chest you have to open to get nekro. People have opened 5k+ chest since it was announced in arena chest without looting. If 5k runs isn't enough what is?

[ilhanna]

Everyone saying that average geared toons can run arena but they always mention 'rogue' try being an average geared tank and then come back and post. Can't earn money to buy ankhs because the price of locked is so low and there is no other places to farm that would be profitable.

sent from fritters beak

One of my go-to warriors for arena is full legendary, and no I'm not talking about Imbued. He doesn't even have fancy gems in his gear, no arcane pets either. But with him my party can do 7-8min runs at 1 death per run or less, with two legendary bow rogues in party.

In contrast I've run with Bonesaw warrior who died more than me, demanded remaps whenever we got enraging obelisk, and was so slow boss had already killed one of the dps before he started tanking. I've run with Frost Bulwark warrior who ran around killing his allies with proximity ring and had to be told to heal.

In my book, a pro player doesn't necessarily have the best gear. But with them in party, a run goes more efficiently, that even the hardest challenges feel easier and more manageable.

[regizakirs.rs]

Shiny, not to derail your point or to criticize you personally, but I think the logic you are using exemplifies the delusion that a lot of forumers have about Arcane Legends. A vast majority of forum posts are from the perspective of those who have been playing for a long period of time, and those who tend to gather real influence in the forums are often very rich in game. What we fail to realize is that most of Arcane Legend players are very poor. We often hear about the incredible amount of downloads that AL gets from the various stores, but in all honesty where are those players now? The customer retention in AL seems extremely low (meaning that people who download and try AL tend to quit more often than they keep playing). Customer retention should be one of the top priorities of any company.

Point being, that a vast majority of the threads in the General Discussion and Player vs Player address items that will help the top percentage of players, and is not representing the average player base. Your point below really exemplifies this. When I play TDM/CTF, I feel terrible for the average player who has no chance. When I run elites with randoms they are so vastly undergeared, and undereducated about the best tips/tricks that I literally wonder why they even bother playing.

With no income, and nothing profitable except Arena - which if you've played with legendary gear and mediocre experience will end up costing you a ton of ankhs - what do players have to look forward to? I loved the Halloween event because it actually gave players something notable to work towards. Grim!

Now what do they have? Planar Tombs? Locked Crates? zzz

I really behoove everyone on this forum to think about the future of our game and realize that we as the dedicated and active player base need to do more to promote the growth of this game by encouraging updates that will benefit all, not just us.
Very well stated Raw

[regizakirs.rs]

Of course I believe you silly. I am just pointing out that just because someone runs arena, even if they run it a lot, there is no guarantee they're going to loot anything valuable in any number of runs. In fact. a lot of people may never see a fossil - that's all I meant.
To further cement this point Kalizzaa ran the arena god knows how many times and I ran with also as a guildie and he never saw a recipe or fossil.

[GuardianTwo]

One of my go-to warriors for arena is full legendary, and no I'm not talking about Imbued. He doesn't even have fancy gems in his gear, no arcane pets either. But with him my party can do 7-8min runs at 1 death per run or less, with two legendary bow rogues in party.

In contrast I've run with Bonesaw warrior who died more than me, demanded remaps whenever we got enraging obelisk, and was so slow boss had already killed one of the dps before he started tanking. I've run with Frost Bulwark warrior who ran around killing his allies with proximity ring and had to be told to heal.

In my book, a pro player doesn't necessarily have the best gear. But with them in party, a run goes more efficiently, that even the hardest challenges feel easier and more manageable.

I agree with you completely, but only thing I wanna say is, is there anyone who plays after seeing a warrior with complete legendary set??? Very few..... Yes I am mainly talking about PUG's here. And also not criticising anyone but whenever someone with complete legendary(mainly tank) set asks for a pt , there is really close to no probability that will get a pt. And there can be some tank who MAY be playing that map for first time completely unknown of what to do will still get a pt if having those mythics....
Sorry to go completely off topic but I just wanted to say it. :)
Yes I am one of those nab(can say completely nab still trying to get pt) tanks with legendary set :3

[regizakirs.rs]

I've been doing this since recipe and fossil was put into arena loot. Base on recipe value, before when it was 11-15m, I was in a party of 3 and 2 of us looted recipe. Both the looter gave 2 mil each to the third person. On the day I looted a fossil, I was also in a party of 3 and I gave 5mil each to each party member. It was Lonakona and Prodtigy. What goes around come around ^^ keep doing good deeds rather it's big or small. This will keep their motivation up and for them to keep on playing and continue to strive on without feeling down and crappy about not getting anything. I know the feeling of not looting anything and seeing your party loot stuff and get rich it's very depressing.
Twoc no offense but the average AL player can't afford to give out 5 mill. Let alone alot of players haven't seen 5 mill. unless it's attached to someone else lol. But it's a good thing to do for others though.

[Iinorex]

arena is soloable.....at first it was hard for me to even do arena in a party...but some of my friends from a elite pve guild showed me how to do it n i can solo it...not with rcord breaking time but i can without much death

[Kyle Holmes]

One of my go-to warriors for arena is full legendary, and no I'm not talking about Imbued. He doesn't even have fancy gems in his gear, no arcane pets either. But with him my party can do 7-8min runs at 1 death per run or less, with two legendary bow rogues in party.

In contrast I've run with Bonesaw warrior who died more than me, demanded remaps whenever we got enraging obelisk, and was so slow boss had already killed one of the dps before he started tanking. I've run with Frost Bulwark warrior who ran around killing his allies with proximity ring and had to be told to heal.

In my book, a pro player doesn't necessarily have the best gear. But with them in party, a run goes more efficiently, that even the hardest challenges feel easier and more manageable.
But you know what to do when it comes to arena. I for one don't have a clue where to start because I've prob tryed it once. I've killed one boss in my entire AL life and I soloed that one. Would really help for someone to make a video explaining how a warrior should run it without using a shed load of ankhs.

sent from fritters beak

[ilhanna]

But you know what to do when it comes to arena. I for one don't have a clue where to start because I've prob tryed it once. I've killed one boss in my entire AL life and I soloed that one. Would really help for someone to make a video explaining how a warrior should run it without using a shed load of ankhs.

sent from fritters beak

The tank I mentioned above had run elite with me since we were both lvl 36. I know what he is capable of, we had run low to no deaths elite many many times. Since Planar Arena and Tombs are elite content on steroid packed in claustrophobic small space, my personal advice for warriors is to run a lot of elite, practice protecting your party by getting to know what your skills/pets do, and in the process making friends with rogues and mages who, on seeing your capability, won't hesitate to join you when you ask for Arena party. If you need to be in a guild to do this, join one. Just practice running elite until pet choice, skills selection and timing of taunts become almost instinctive for you.

Then read forum guides on Arena. There are some helpful, detailed ones out there. Jirikjurasek's blog post on tanking Arena is specially written with warrior in mind, read it. That way you won't be completely clueless going into Arena.

All these still don't guarantee you random party, I know. One of the reasons I only run Arena with friends and guildmates now is because randoms are untested and ankhs are precious. So making friends with active players, joining active pve guild and doing runs with your guild mates and friends and keep learning are the only course of action I can suggest now.

[Niixed]

What irks me the most is that when I enter into PvP, or when I enter into a timed run, what ultimately decides who wins are the pets. Skill no longer plays an integral role. This wasn't always the case, and it honestly is driving players away. I can tell you that for a fact.

Very well stated. In pvp, Nekro being as ridiculously op as it is means the power disparity between the haves/have nots is so great that they end up not playing together. I don't stay long when the opposing team has Nekro. There's no point, why even bother playing with a Nekro opponent?

This is something STG has yet to grasp. Catering only to the extremely wealthy or overly vocal players creates a game nobody ends up playing. Where is the craftable mythic pet? Legendary? Anyone?... Is this thing even on?

Same thing with timed runs... what's the point if you always lose or always win? SNS destroyed the entire timed run competition! What motive do players have to play? It's not the lack of new content, it's lack of motivation driving players away.

[Caabatric]

The tank I mentioned above had run elite with me since we were both lvl 36. I know what he is capable of, we had run low to no deaths elite many many times. Since Planar Arena and Tombs are elite content on steroid packed in claustrophobic small space, my personal advice for warriors is to run a lot of elite, practice protecting your party by getting to know what your skills/pets do, and in the process making friends with rogues and mages who, on seeing your capability, won't hesitate to join you when you ask for Arena party. If you need to be in a guild to do this, join one. Just practice running elite until pet choice, skills selection and timing of taunts become almost instinctive for you.

Then read forum guides on Arena. There are some helpful, detailed ones out there. Jirikjurasek's blog post on tanking Arena is specially written with warrior in mind, read it. That way you won't be completely clueless going into Arena.

All these still don't guarantee you random party, I know. One of the reasons I only run Arena with friends and guildmates now is because randoms are untested and ankhs are precious. So making friends with active players, joining active pve guild and doing runs with your guild mates and friends and keep learning are the only course of action I can suggest now.

Yes completely agree.
I have run with complete legendary rogues and tanks at pug and have gotten lower ankh usage and average times which is perfectly fine with me. (9-13 minutes)
@kyle i will send u pm c:

[Iinorex]

necro's damage reduction should get nerfed in pvp or return rogue's their damage in pvp...damage absorbtion should stay stay...so that rogues get their damage higher n can break necro's shield early....n in next level cap damage absorption will not increase that much...so their shield will be more fragile....thus breaking necro's shield ever sooner
hence rogue's damage nerf in pvp should be removed or necro's damaage reduction should be removed

[cami]

OMG Raw , for LAST TIME. Is SINGE POINTS no SINGE POIMTS -.-

[raw]

OMG Raw , for LAST TIME. Is SINGE POINTS no SINGE POIMTS -.-

ahahahahahaha.
POIMTS IT IS FOREVER AND EVER =P

[cami]

ahahahahahaha.
POIMTS IT IS FOREVER AND EVER =P

xD hahaha :3