Scaling of old elite maps

[Serancha]

Current issues

For the last few months, player interest has declined to an all-time low.

This can be seen clearly by the number of guild hoppers bouncing between guilds, the steady decline of online players (last night there were 12 out of 300 on my F/L online during North American prime time), and the #1 ranked guild for most online in the 7 day range is 22% below what it was a year ago.

Even considering that the economy always crashes as soon as an expansion is announced, much of this decline has to do with boredom - too little variety of maps to farm, too little loot of value to farm for, and too little challenge.

We have 3 new maps being added for the level 46 cap, and this is not going to hold people's attention for long. There is talk of a lot of potentially farmable stuff, so what's the deal? Are these items all going to squeeze into the three new bosses, leaving people groaning at the tedium of repetition?


Proposal

Why not take all the lovely elite maps from ALL the other seasons, and instead of having them easy enough for a naked level 20 to run with no viable loot, scale the mobs up to 46 like elites should be, and populate ALL the elite bosses in the game with viable loot. This would add a ton of interest and variety into the game, allowing for people to choose what they want to farm and where. If all maps were equally challenging (as far as mob level goes), and all had loot we could use - it would provide a lot more purpose for this new "skip-the-leveling" feature.

I have never seen the point of having low level elites, and wasted maps. Having maps with useless loot and one-hit-able mobs is a waste of space and bandwidth. It wouldn't take a lot of resources to scale things up, since the coding for scaling mobs is already present for tombs and other maps.

Are there any reasons for this not to be implemented? It may just fix the problem of severely declining player interest, loot distribution issues and a lot of other things.

[Justno]

Current issues

For the last few months, player interest has declined to an all-time low.

This can be seen clearly by the number of guild hoppers bouncing between guilds, the steady decline of online players (last night there were 12 out of 300 on my F/L online during North American prime time), and the #1 ranked guild for most online in the 7 day range is 22% below what it was a year ago.

Even considering that the economy always crashes as soon as an expansion is announced, much of this decline has to do with boredom - too little variety of maps to farm, too little loot of value to farm for, and too little challenge.

We have 3 new maps being added for the level 46 cap, and this is not going to hold people's attention for long. There is talk of a lot of potentially farmable stuff, so what's the deal? Are these items all going to squeeze into the three new bosses, leaving people groaning at the tedium of repetition?


Proposal

Why not take all the lovely elite maps from ALL the other seasons, and instead of having them easy enough for a naked level 20 to run with no viable loot, scale the mobs up to 46 like elites should be, and populate ALL the elite bosses in the game with viable loot. This would add a ton of interest and variety into the game, allowing for people to choose what they want to farm and where. If all maps were equally challenging (as far as mob level goes), and all had loot we could use - it would provide a lot more purpose for this new "skip-the-leveling" feature.

I have never seen the point of having low level elites, and wasted maps. Having maps with useless loot and one-hit-able mobs is a waste of space and bandwidth. It wouldn't take a lot of resources to scale things up, since the coding for scaling mobs is already present for tombs and other maps.

Are there any reasons for this not to be implemented? It may just fix the problem of severely declining player interest, loot distribution issues and a lot of other things.

Agreed :P
Especially for elite farmers the game is practically dead in terms of loot...elites are way to easy with to little loot :/
Tombs provided small amounts of entertainment/challenge for a while but again, loot was blehhh

+1 good idea!

[Oursizes]

Good idea. Hopefully a mod/dev sees this thread

[Ssneakykills]

This idea would also be great for players yet to complete some of the elite map achievements too as they struggle to find runs in certain maps, good idea sera!

[Ravager]

Agreed. Whats the point of leveling to 40/41 and then being able to access a level 25 elite zone in brackenridge to breeze through with crap loot?

[Ladysophie]

Off topic: I don't understand the logic of giving gold to level up and then few weeks later introducing auto level-up for 1 plat lol
Anyway i pretty much agree with was is being proposed here. Great idea! :)

[ClumsyCactus]

I was LITERALLY thinking about posting this a few hours ago, but you Said it better than i ever will!
I have never seen a single game Where i can solo a endgame zone in the worst gear i own, it is just not supposed to be that Way!

Also, i would suggest adding a new gamemode, Where maybe 10 players can play a Map,but ONLY if they are the Same guild,and it is incredibly hard...
Just a dream, but it would WAKE the game up, and there could perhaps be guild LBs of what guild can clear the maps fastest.
(Yes I am being inspired by WoW alot lately)

[Serancha]

Please make your own thread for new ideas and leave this one for the discussion it was made for.

The topic here is about making all elite maps have fully scaled mobs with appropriate loot - including ingredients to craft new mythics - rather than cramming everything into only 3 maps.

[kixkaxx]

I'm thinking to make top twink gears obtainable from lower lvl elites instead of locks/events.

[represents]

Very nice idea and i see a lot of other people agreeing also.

[Anarchial]

Current issues

For the last few months, player interest has declined to an all-time low.

This can be seen clearly by the number of guild hoppers bouncing between guilds, the steady decline of online players (last night there were 12 out of 300 on my F/L online during North American prime time), and the #1 ranked guild for most online in the 7 day range is 22% below what it was a year ago.

Even considering that the economy always crashes as soon as an expansion is announced, much of this decline has to do with boredom - too little variety of maps to farm, too little loot of value to farm for, and too little challenge.

We have 3 new maps being added for the level 46 cap, and this is not going to hold people's attention for long. There is talk of a lot of potentially farmable stuff, so what's the deal? Are these items all going to squeeze into the three new bosses, leaving people groaning at the tedium of repetition?


Proposal

Why not take all the lovely elite maps from ALL the other seasons, and instead of having them easy enough for a naked level 20 to run with no viable loot, scale the mobs up to 46 like elites should be, and populate ALL the elite bosses in the game with viable loot. This would add a ton of interest and variety into the game, allowing for people to choose what they want to farm and where. If all maps were equally challenging (as far as mob level goes), and all had loot we could use - it would provide a lot more purpose for this new "skip-the-leveling" feature.

I have never seen the point of having low level elites, and wasted maps. Having maps with useless loot and one-hit-able mobs is a waste of space and bandwidth. It wouldn't take a lot of resources to scale things up, since the coding for scaling mobs is already present for tombs and other maps.

Are there any reasons for this not to be implemented? It may just fix the problem of severely declining player interest, loot distribution issues and a lot of other things.


Agreed if and only if leaderboards are cleared first :)

[Serancha]

Agreed if and only if leaderboards are cleared first :)

If this happened it would optimally be for the new season, so yes, fresh leaderboards.

[twoxc]

i'll just insert *Useless* xD

[Serancha]

i'll just insert *Useless* xD

Exactly what your post is. Well stated.

[Tatman]

I agree and at the same time I doubt it will be done.

[Serancha]

Why wouldn't it? It makes no sense to continue keeping the older elites useless when the expansion is only 3 maps and player interest is on a steep decline.

[Tatman]

Because it could have been done at any moment in the past, yet it wasn't; I doubt it's that hard from a dev standpoint.

Anyway, as I said, I fully support this idea.

[-no]

Why wouldn't it? It makes no sense to continue keeping the older elites useless when the expansion is only 3 maps and player interest is on a steep decline.


What loot would brakenridge contain if all elites were scaled to 46?
I think it would have to be something in a vanity idea-quest-->pieces from boss--> craft vanity
If brackenridge or rooks nest contained any new content loot, the prices would drop severely. Those two zones will alwyas be easier, even scaled to 46.

[Serancha]

What loot would brakenridge contain if all elites were scaled to 46?
I think it would have to be something in a vanity idea-quest-->pieces from boss--> craft vanity
If brackenridge or rooks nest contained any new content loot, the prices would drop severely. Those two zones will alwyas be easier, even scaled to 46.

There are different qualities of the new armour, aren't there? It wouldn't have to be the best - just something viable. Even a chance at tokens, as was already suggested by Shiny, would be fine. Anything to make the currently wasted maps a decent level of difficulty and worthy of running and farming.

Trust me, when rooks nest elite was scaled full level, it was plenty hard.

[Ebezaanec]

+1

I've been playing Diablo 3 for some time now and they have the same concept incorporated with farming. Desirable loot (much, much more than AL) can be found in almost any of the scaled maps, with the exception of a few exclusives. That made it less monotonous for players, because they weren't seeing the same environment over and over for weeks.

Variety is the spice of life.

[-no]

There are different qualities of the new armour, aren't there? It wouldn't have to be the best - just something viable. Even a chance at tokens, as was already suggested by Shiny, would be fine. Anything to make the currently wasted maps a decent level of difficulty and worthy of running and farming.

Trust me, when rooks nest elite was scaled full level, it was plenty hard.

Yes, i remember how hard it was. But with the gear, and pets we have now, elite bradkeridge and rooks will be very easy compared to shuyal/tindirin. Newest content in these zones would be a mistake. As in tokens for fossil, ingredients for nekro/myth gear, etc.

[Serancha]

Yes, i remember how hard it was. But with the gear, and pets we have now, elite bradkeridge and rooks will be very easy compared to shuyal/tindirin. Newest content in these zones would be a mistake. As in tokens for fossil, ingredients for nekro/myth gear, etc.

I'm sure it's more than possible to scale them so they are comparable in difficulty. It would certainly take less time than making more new maps. The idea is to make all the maps useful and provide end-game players with more than 3 maps to farm for stuff to sell.

I'm not saying put fossil drops on elite Jarl, (I don't believe Jarl is rated as a boss any longer - so wouldn't apply as far as loot goes) I'm saying scale up the maps and put something in them that's going to be worth more than 5K gold, so people have options on what they want to farm.

If what Shiny says is true, and I believe him if he states something as fact, we have one map that 1000+ players will be farming nonstop when expansion comes. How long do you think the items from that map will retain value? I give it 3 weeks tops. If the loot was spread out with a chance to get from any elite boss (with all bosses being level 46) then people would spread out, and no one batch of loot would be overfarmed immediately.

[Kreasadriii]

Good idea!
Got some question then..
1. If the lvl scaled in elite maps, how about people to farm there with legendary gear, low potions, low ankhs.
Should they must wait until got gold to buy the preparation for that elite maps?

FYI, correct me if i'm wrong.
We get a loot that has 100k prize from the elite, before we get the 100k loot, We already buy ankhs, its about 50-60k,
and if its very hard elite maps then it will cost at least 5-10 ankhs which is cost 100k-120k for the players who run the elite maps.

So, this idea is only to make few elite maps that capably only by overgeared players?
Because most people with legendary gear even has skill would die easily in these elite maps.
If this idea approved, then only overgeared players can making many gold when new cap released.
What happened with the rest of players that still struggle for their own gear?

Sorry a lot of question, this is because I'm so interest with the details of this awesome briliatn idea. :semi-twins:

[Serancha]

Elite maps are designed for good (elite legendary) to highly (mythic / imbued) geared players - not only over geared players.

Under-geared players should be playing the normal maps until they gear up. This change would not affect anyone in that sense, since you can't earn a living from low elites at this time anyways. Better to farm teeth in normal tindirin.

[bedmaster]

Make them elite bosses drop crate tokens so we can buy shard etc :)

http://i1383.photobucket.com/albums/ah282/chandra7plav/Mobile%20Uploads/PicsArt_1428811885348_zpsxpktgrgj.jpg (http://s1383.photobucket.com/user/chandra7plav/media/Mobile%20Uploads/PicsArt_1428811885348_zpsxpktgrgj.jpg.html)

[kananaskis]

I think this is a great proposal.

all the legendary weapons that can drop in kraken, shuyal, and nordr elites should stay (such as firesquid rods, mountain teeth daggers, entombed hammers, etc) since these are cool weapons and still sell. Perhaps they could be scale up more. Before i got an elon gun i used a nordr jewel of brutality level 40 which has a great proc. Work has already been done designing these items so why not keep them a viable part of pve gear.

But also perhaps new legendary gear could be added elite loot tables in addition to those that are already there.

Make new quests for elite maps.

Add some egg drops...heck make hammerjaw a rare drop or involved quest in kraken since hj suits kraken and same for galacian in nordr since galacian suits nordr art themes.

idk, I'm just brainstorming...i think if there was a variety of new things to farm, and the lower elite maps were more challenging, players could strategically choose to farm different areas and it would be much more interesting.

I go with the flow, so for example, last fall elite caves was very popular for elite dragonscale chests, parchments, teeth, and shadowlurk eggs. Now people are focusing on planar tombs. I enjoy running with friends and decent rewards. But I get bored of doing the same map over and over. So I'll still go over to nordr elite just to see if i can loot a legendary weapon or elite chest. Even if nothing of value drops, at least nordr elite is still challenging enough to keep me on my toes.

More variety would spice things up, I think this is the way to go. Cheers!

[Serancha]

+1 this really needs to be done...

Preferably add some jewel shards in each elite map. Make sure the different jewel shards dropping here form a jewel which will be OP enough to be expensive for people who don't have the "over geared" equipment.
Or maybe adding twink items as drops in the maps.
Whatever the case people need more maps to farm and not just wait for an update then flock the same map in server.(flocking leads to all the ping issues atleast for me)

The only problem I have is; excluding under geared people from these maps, they too need something to farm, hand them elite brack or ydra to farm. I spent most of my time in elite brack when I had full mythic set(everything else was pink), stepping stones are needed to farming; not having these leads to these under geared pot-scrapping non-ankh-using players where they shouldn't be.

What can you make money with farming elite brackenridge and ydra now? Egg crates made kettle worthless. Better to farm normal tindirin for teeth, no?

[kananaskis]

sure like avikk suggests above, elites could be set up as stepping stones. nordr elite was too extreme and inaccessible for me for a long time while rooks nest and lost mages mine were my introduction to elite farming. so these could be more challenging than they are now but easier still than elites of more recent expansions.

anyway there's lots of great suggestions in this thread.

[kona]

Lets have good drops from elite bosses and probably huge gold drops like 2k,5k,10k(higher for more difficult bosses and this gold drops without any luck or chance to, just like after every arena run u get chest)....if u see at current loot drops, one can waste 1k+ of pots to complete 1 run and get epic loot worth 4-10gold(its not encouraging right?)......and i dont see any problem with it.Say lot of players will start running elites,noobs will start leeching and some will only farm for gold.This will cause the population to get more gold.So is it wrong for people to have more gold? will they purchase all items and horde to create artificial shortage in market and then sell? will dependency on plats will decrease? well all arcanes like pets come from locks which open with plat so dependency on plats will not decrease. Also its very important to have a good source of gold specially for new players.When i was new,if i ever looted a locked, i could sell it for 10k+ in cs and gold earning wasnt hard(well locks were high due to plat farming but still it was good source).Also daily quest doesnt offer much and most u can earn in this game is mostly by selling stuff to other players and during events. i think we need more options than just siiting in towns tryna merch

[Serancha]

I think this is getting off topic again. The issue with low level and undergeared players making money is a different topic than this. Putting proper loot in normal maps is necessary, but also not what this thread is about. This is also not about whether undergeared players should be running the same level maps as those who have worked 2 years to earn elite level gear.

The issue is that the lower elites are currently only used for ap's, so players reach cap, run them once, then spend a year+ farming the same couple of maps for current loot. The idea is to make use of all the game's content and spread current elite loot out among all elite maps, giving the players who have been here for 2+ years and are losing interest a choice in how they wish to play.

Sts also needs to make a way for new players to make money, but that is a topic someone can make a separate thread about.

[merch_master]

100% agreed.
Maybe all elite golden chests can drop tokens and maybe different sections can drop noble/higher than cracked version of jewels so all maps are played for the desired loot instead of just that one fastest map.
This would also not need an increase in loot table which i always find STS reluctant to do, but still spice up elite runs.

[kona]

I think this is getting off topic again. The issue with low level and undergeared players making money is a different topic than this. Putting proper loot in normal maps is necessary, but also not what this thread is about. This is also not about whether undergeared players should be running the same level maps as those who have worked 2 years to earn elite level gear.

The issue is that the lower elites are currently only used for ap's, so players reach cap, run them once, then spend a year+ farming the same couple of maps for current loot. The idea is to make use of all the game's content and spread current elite loot out among all elite maps, giving the players who have been here for 2+ years and are losing interest a choice in how they wish to play.

Sts also needs to make a way for new players to make money, but that is a topic someone can make a separate thread about.

ok maybe i didnt understand what the topic is about.I replied thinking it was about making drops better so players actually want to run elites....ps about good gold drops from bosses...pls share ur thoughts on this :)

[merch_master]

You too are getting off topic XD
I am because i look at this thread like a sales pitch XD
We need to make it sound good for the dev reading this too. I believe they will be more willing to bring this change if not much needs to be tweaked with the loot table , since we also need to consider the "graphic footprint" ( or something similar) of the game and they are lazy ( jk) [emoji14]

[Serancha]

There are lots of good comments and ideas here aside from the trolling.

The definition of an expansion is to actually increase the number of maps we can play at our level and earn money on, not make old maps unplayable in favour of fewer,new maps.

If the devs say no to this, I know a lot of players would like to hear the rationale behind people leveling to 45 just to play a map with mobs easy enough to solo at level 20. I can't explain it any clearer than I have.

[Bellaelda]

Great idea.

[Newcomx]

Current issues

For the last few months, player interest has declined to an all-time low.

This can be seen clearly by the number of guild hoppers bouncing between guilds, the steady decline of online players (last night there were 12 out of 300 on my F/L online during North American prime time), and the #1 ranked guild for most online in the 7 day range is 22% below what it was a year ago.

Even considering that the economy always crashes as soon as an expansion is announced, much of this decline has to do with boredom - too little variety of maps to farm, too little loot of value to farm for, and too little challenge.

We have 3 new maps being added for the level 46 cap, and this is not going to hold people's attention for long. There is talk of a lot of potentially farmable stuff, so what's the deal? Are these items all going to squeeze into the three new bosses, leaving people groaning at the tedium of repetition?


Proposal

Why not take all the lovely elite maps from ALL the other seasons, and instead of having them easy enough for a naked level 20 to run with no viable loot, scale the mobs up to 46 like elites should be, and populate ALL the elite bosses in the game with viable loot. This would add a ton of interest and variety into the game, allowing for people to choose what they want to farm and where. If all maps were equally challenging (as far as mob level goes), and all had loot we could use - it would provide a lot more purpose for this new "skip-the-leveling" feature.

I have never seen the point of having low level elites, and wasted maps. Having maps with useless loot and one-hit-able mobs is a waste of space and bandwidth. It wouldn't take a lot of resources to scale things up, since the coding for scaling mobs is already present for tombs and other maps.

Are there any reasons for this not to be implemented? It may just fix the problem of severely declining player interest, loot distribution issues and a lot of other things.

We cannot break even in elite farming nowadays.

[Maunyabastian]

Someone please answer me, is she saying they have to scale old elite maps to L46 and give a certain loot for each bosses?

[Anarchial]

Hi,
The fact that newbies wont have elites maps to run is legit and is also associated with your proposal. If your proposal is heard then the entire al newbie population will be thrown off elites. As a gaming company it is not justified to entirely block the elite section to the new comers just because they dont have good gear.
Also if this change is implemented then the population who just got cut off will rage here eventually reverting the change.

So it would be best if mob and boss scaling occurs upto level 46 but only considering the most powerful player in the pt on timer start.

That way the newbie pt would be able to fight bosses according to their stats and get loot and so does op parties. But i guess scaling problems like in twink levels of events would start happening. Not sure though.

Or STS can introduce a "Mega Elite" section with your implementation. That way no one gets cut off and everyone is happy

[PhoenixPrime]

Might be slightly off topic, but is it possible that there might be '4' maps? Whatever the community goal is to open up the new maps might be a playable map that sticks around too. Maybe it wasn't released in the test in order to not spoil the surprise?

Back on topic, I would love to see something worth farming in the Elite maps. We finally got to the point of being able to do them, and were severely disappointed at the loot... Better loot would definitely be welcome, 8^).

[Candylicks]

Yes we need something to farm off all arlor elites. We have suggested this many many MANY times. Gear is time consuming on them, but allowing the new currency and items that we need for crafting to drop in ALL elite maps is a must. Hopefully they are already on this....

They certainly can't expect us to just play three maps from now on. Right?

[Serancha]

They certainly can't expect us to just play three maps from now on. Right?


I sure hope not. There is no way I'll make it to another expansion if that's the case.

[Candylicks]

I sure hope not. There is no way I'll make it to another expansion if that's the case.
Maybe today we will find out more with the 'new items dropping in arlor'. Pretty sure it's going to be rage of Ren related.

[Serancha]

Dunno. I don't get the concern that there will no longer be elites for newbies. Elite by definition is not for newbies. Besides which, the unscaled maps hold no loot worth any money, so nobody is running them currently - not newbies, not anyone.

[Wutzgood]

I wouldn't mind if I could get all the old elite weapons at level 45. Some have great procs that i would still use. Scale the levels and the same drops.

They normally do this but only for the previous 2 seasons of the new cap. That's how level 40 Nordr jewels and level 35 firesquid rods exist. If they do it like they normally do we should have shuyal and tindrin gear scaled to 45 at least. Nordr and below would remain the same tho.

I like the idea and hope it works.

[Ssneakykills]

I really hope this idea is considered by the devs as it makes sense and makes use to those elite maps that aren't used as much.

I'd also be very disappointed if we only get 3 maps because it gives no variety and it's not consistent with prior expansions

[Arpluvial]

Hey, guys!

This thread is full of solid feedback, for sure! While we encourage the feedback, let's make sure to stay on topic. :)

[Dalmony]

If this idea were to be implemented, ensuring that it was accessible for newbies and still allowed them a place in end game would be a huge part of that, so it isn't really off topic but its just taking the implementation/Development of this idea to a deeper level.

At the moment, elites kinda suck for everyone to some extent: for well geared farmers looking to make serious gold, farming tends to be restricted to a very small selection of elite maps from the current expansion. This gets old and repetitive VERY quickly and while good money can often be made, it isn't the most stimulating game experience in the long term.

For players who have just hit cap level and may be slightly undergeared looking to make average to low income from elites, there are "easy" elites: these are FAR too easy for even under-geared players, and they basically offer no income whatsoever.

There are in total around 40 elite dungeons in the game if we include arena and planar tombs - plenty for scaling up all the maps and still having something for everyone.

A good compromise might be:

Brackenridge -> Dead city: Scaled to 5 levels below cap (41).

Put a couple of new farmable eggs in these maps, and also add small gold drops to the chests which drop here which increases in such a way that normal chests contain the least gold, and banded chests contain slightly more, also depending on the rarity of the chest. Maybe even add twink gear to the drops here.

Kraken -> Ren'gol: Scale to Cap level (46)

To contain items such as new gear items, the more sought after jewels, and some crafting sub-components relevant to the crafting of new mythics dropping from the bosses here. Adding something of interest to their respective chests (like a gold drop, ankhs, respec scrolls, even orc tokens :-O) could also be of interest.

To summarise:

I am saying "no" to the original idea of scaling up every single elite map to 46, although I do totally agree with the concept.

I am suggesting as an alternative to the originally posted idea, that "most" of the maps be scaled up leaving the first few maps at 5 levels below cap as an entry point to elites for newly capped players. In all cases the loot in elite maps across the game definitely needs to be revamped.

[Xorrior]

What the game needs is fresh new loot worthy of farming from Brack to Tind.

Helps the non-plat players to make some gold. Twinks with new gear etc etc etc....Keep the economy thriving.

BTW I hope the new expansion is NOT just 3 maps! One and a half year approx for 3 maps? Puh-lease!

[mesalin]

Good idea !

I'm so fresh

[Dalmony]

I actually briefly mentioned the suggestion for all elites to be scaled up to cap level, or 5 below minimum in this thread here:

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?180484-Fairer-paths-to-gear-and-pushing-platinum-onto-personalisation-and-pets

Which also contained more extended ideas on how this idea would work together with crafting components to make crafting tie all elite areas together.

[Slekki]

Love the idea :)

[Serancha]

If this idea were to be implemented, ensuring that it was accessible for newbies and still allowed them a place in end game would be a huge part of that, so it isn't really off topic but its just taking the implementation/Development of this idea to a deeper level.

At the moment, elites kinda suck for everyone to some extent: for well geared farmers looking to make serious gold, farming tends to be restricted to a very small selection of elite maps from the current expansion. This gets old and repetitive VERY quickly and while good money can often be made, it isn't the most stimulating game experience in the long term.

For players who have just hit cap level and may be slightly undergeared looking to make average to low income from elites, there are "easy" elites: these are FAR too easy for even under-geared players, and they basically offer no income whatsoever.

There are in total around 40 elite dungeons in the game if we include arena and planar tombs - plenty for scaling up all the maps and still having something for everyone.

A good compromise might be:

Brackenridge -> Dead city: Scaled to 5 levels below cap (41).

Put a couple of new farmable eggs in these maps, and also add small gold drops to the chests which drop here which increases in such a way that normal chests contain the least gold, and banded chests contain slightly more, also depending on the rarity of the chest. Maybe even add twink gear to the drops here.

Kraken -> Ren'gol: Scale to Cap level (46)

To contain items such as new gear items, the more sought after jewels, and some crafting sub-components relevant to the crafting of new mythics dropping from the bosses here. Adding something of interest to their respective chests (like a gold drop, ankhs, respec scrolls, even orc tokens :-O) could also be of interest.

To summarise:

I am saying "no" to the original idea of scaling up every single elite map to 46, although I do totally agree with the concept.

I am suggesting as an alternative to the originally posted idea, that "most" of the maps be scaled up leaving the first few maps at 5 levels below cap as an entry point to elites for newly capped players. In all cases the loot in elite maps across the game definitely needs to be revamped.

I could live with that, and your post is well stated. However, I still don't see the point. New players have all the normal maps to run, plus all the tombs and kraken mines.

When the game was new, elite was something people worked hard to get to, and worked harder to accomplish. The first time I went to elite Brackenridge Forest, it took me over 20 pots to kill the first group of mobs with a party. It was exhilarating. Like, wow there's a whole other game once you get to the end, this is awesome! We have a reason to keep going, working for gear and playing. The whole elite-for-noobs concept detracts from that.

If they get to elite level and go to Brackenridge to find it super easy, when they hit the scaled maps they're cannon fodder because they expect it to be easy. Better to start as you mean to go on.

However, if there's not enough loot to spread through all the elite maps, then this would be a logical option. Really though, your suggestion would just mean scaling one more group of maps. Nordr - Tindirin is already scaled, so scaling just Kraken fully just moves the pounding point lower. But, 5 levels below cap is better than 20 levels I guess.

[Candylicks]

I could live with that, and your post is well stated. However, I still don't see the point. New players have all the normal maps to run, plus all the tombs and kraken mines.

When the game was new, elite was something people worked hard to get to, and worked harder to accomplish. The first time I went to elite Brackenridge Forest, it took me over 20 pots to kill the first group of mobs with a party. It was exhilarating. Like, wow there's a whole other game once you get to the end, this is awesome! We have a reason to keep going, working for gear and playing. The whole elite-for-noobs concept detracts from that.

If they get to elite level and go to Brackenridge to find it super easy, when they hit the scaled maps they're cannon fodder because they expect it to be easy. Better to start as you mean to go on.

However, if there's not enough loot to spread through all the elite maps, then this would be a logical option. Really though, your suggestion would just mean scaling one more group of maps. Nordr - Tindirin is already scaled, so scaling just Kraken fully just moves the pounding point lower. But, 5 levels below cap is better than 20 levels I guess.

I totally agree with this. Why the heck aren't they scaling all the elites anymore? I also remember capping and THEN starting elite maps after and they were so hard! Now they aren't scaling them all and they simply serve as a purpose for people to run them for the LB with insane times. All elites need to scale up to reflect the new cap. It really is the only thing that makes sense to me.

[ClumsyCactus]

I could live with that, and your post is well stated. However, I still don't see the point. New players have all the normal maps to run, plus all the tombs and kraken mines.

When the game was new, elite was something people worked hard to get to, and worked harder to accomplish. The first time I went to elite Brackenridge Forest, it took me over 20 pots to kill the first group of mobs with a party. It was exhilarating. Like, wow there's a whole other game once you get to the end, this is awesome! We have a reason to keep going, working for gear and playing. The whole elite-for-noobs concept detracts from that.

If they get to elite level and go to Brackenridge to find it super easy, when they hit the scaled maps they're cannon fodder because they expect it to be easy. Better to start as you mean to go on.

However, if there's not enough loot to spread through all the elite maps, then this would be a logical option. Really though, your suggestion would just mean scaling one more group of maps. Nordr - Tindirin is already scaled, so scaling just Kraken fully just moves the pounding point lower. But, 5 levels below cap is better than 20 levels I guess.

Now, I agree with you, Don't get me wrong...
But has ANYONE ever Earned any gold to get decent gear to run elites from normal maps?
Aside from lock-farming, Which they will remove right?,The Only normal Map Who gives decent payoff is to run normal wilds for teeth all day, and that would leave the elite core of the playerbase with ALOT of new stuff, and the people Who does not have so much gold with farming in one Map.

Just want you to explain, even though I completely agree with pushing everything up to cap level, because, as you say, elites are not supposed to be able to be soloed by random Low level players.

[Serancha]

Now, I agree with you, Don't get me wrong...
But has ANYONE ever Earned any gold to get decent gear to run elites from normal maps?
Aside from lock-farming, Which they will remove right?,The Only normal Map Who gives decent payoff is to run normal wilds for teeth all day, and that would leave the elite core of the playerbase with ALOT of new stuff, and the people Who does not have so much gold with farming in one Map.

Just want you to explain, even though I completely agree with pushing everything up to cap level, because, as you say, elites are not supposed to be able to be soloed by random Low level players.

If they are made easy and supplied with loot, then that loot will just be exploited by everyone - including the geared players.

Better to have everything the same level and give the newly capped a reason to get geared. If they can get elite loot without getting geared, there is no reason to play and earn their way up.

Most of us earned our mythic money in KM3 farming crates. Now that there are new crates, that should be possible again. Plus there is Tindirin, plus there is whatever the normal map thing is this coming season. There is no need for extra "easy" maps - we have enough of those already.

Scaling the old elites would not change anything for new players. There is nothing they can make money on in those maps at this time anyways.

[Tatman]

Now, I agree with you, Don't get me wrong...
But has ANYONE ever Earned any gold to get decent gear to run elites from normal maps?
Aside from lock-farming, Which they will remove right?,The Only normal Map Who gives decent payoff is to run normal wilds for teeth all day, and that would leave the elite core of the playerbase with ALOT of new stuff, and the people Who does not have so much gold with farming in one Map.

Just want you to explain, even though I completely agree with pushing everything up to cap level, because, as you say, elites are not supposed to be able to be soloed by random Low level players.
Maybe they could put some eggs in some of the normal maps (normal Rage maps?) like they did in normal Nordr. Vixen eggs and especially Kelvin ones used to maintain a good price for a long time.

p.s. Sorry, Serancha, for the offtopic lol.

[Xorrior]

Maybe they could put some eggs in some of the normal maps (normal Rage maps?) like they did in normal Nordr. Vixen eggs and especially Kelvin ones used to maintain a good price for a long time.

p.s. Sorry, Serancha, for the offtopic lol.

Yes put things like Dova eggs, Fritters, Sky, silver, lil bear eggs, frist eggs, Gyrm eggs etc etc.. Either in lower elites or normal maps. Come on STS freshen things up. Allow new ppl and under geared ppl to make some gold in the game.

Have stuff drop like archon rings like maybe a good stat amulet or two like wild talisman or even 26/31 mythics. I'm just throwing out ideas here.

For example you can create Kelvin's cousin Melvin where he panics instead of stunning and put him in Kraken blood hammer map.

[Serancha]

Loot distribution has been broken for a long time. Too many untended exploits left anything found in normal maps worthless, and then the pet egg crates finished off the destruction. Yes, I agree that normal maps need viable loot in them, but again that's another issue which has it's own logistical problems due to rampant exploitation.

There is a lot of talk amongst older players concerned that this very limited expansion is going to be the end of the road. This thread provides a solution that would generate fresh interest in all players, give the newly capped plat-leveled newbies a purpose to continue playing and earn decent gear, and halt the steep decline in player activity.

It would give players options on how and where they wish to play, preventing the 3 new maps from being overfarmed and retaining value for the new items. There is no downside except for those who want to run easy maps and say they are doing elite. There's nothing elite about that.

The definition of elite is: a select part of a group that is superior to the rest in terms of ability or qualities.

It is supposed to be a challenge, and was never supposed to be for people in epic or low-level gear.


A dev response on this matter would be appreciated.

[Elder]

There are different qualities of the new armour, aren't there? It wouldn't have to be the best - just something viable. Even a chance at tokens, as was already suggested by Shiny, would be fine. Anything to make the currently wasted maps a decent level of difficulty and worthy of running and farming.

Trust me, when rooks nest elite was scaled full level, it was plenty hard.

Love this idea, and I can attest to elite rook nests difficulty in its prime.

[Dalmony]

I could live with that, and your post is well stated. However, I still don't see the point.

The point is simply to keep a sort of linear progression for players as they develop their characters; to keep the game fun with relevant map areas all the way through character development, rather than presenting players with a huge insurmountable jump in difficulty once they cap and unlock elites. The gap today between a newly capped player and a capped player with the very best of gear, is significantly larger in terms of wealth, stats, and game experience/knowledge than it was the first time you played Brackenridge elite.


New players have all the normal maps to run, plus all the tombs and kraken mines.

Please tell me more about how tombs and kraken mines create a stimulating and enjoyable play experience that will keep capped players in game, give them farming options, and motivate them to keep coming back for more of the same >.<



The whole elite-for-noobs concept detracts from that.


Not every player with average gear is “noob” some players just actually prefer a slightly more casual game experience, and would be/are happy to farm mild level difficulty elites and slowly amble their way towards better gear, or simply be content with legendaries. Lost mages mine and Rooks nest are still popular maps...



If they get to elite level and go to Brackenridge to find it super easy, when they hit the scaled maps they're cannon fodder because they expect it to be easy. Better to start as you mean to go on.


If this really did turn out to be a massive problem (though it hasn't up to now) it would easily be resolved by simply labelling the elite maps like they did on the regular map. If they really wanted to go wild they could even colour code the harder areas to have red names to make it even MORE obvious.



Really though, your suggestion would just mean scaling one more group of maps. Nordr - Tindirin is already scaled, so scaling just Kraken fully just moves the pounding point lower. But, 5 levels below cap is better than 20 levels I guess.

If we followed the current trend, when expansion hit we would have just Shuyal, Tindirin, and Rengol as max scaled elites with everything else being slightly lower- Nordr would be left at elite level 40/41 (the difficulty level that I'm suggesting be applied instead to brack, ydra, and dead city).

Including everything from Kraken onwards would actually give us an extra 2 areas to play in for a total of 5 areas, plus planar tombs would be 6 if they scale to 46 as well.

We do for sure agree on the fact that 20 levels below cap is just plain ridiculous and unnecessary.

[Xorrior]

I would like to summarise what I'd said before.......

The DEVs can scale any map if they like, but if the loot is rubbish no one is going to bother!

And now I present you with a TL;DR moment.......

Imagine this game being an iceberg and the decent farmable stuff is at the tip - limited and prone to over-farming. But if you look below the surface, you would see a huge unplayed area, where fresh content could be spread and the maps revitalised. It could mean more income for STS i.e ankhs, potions , lixers all need to be bought.

If I was lead Dev I would even create an energy zone map. If you have energy you can enter with mobs and bosses that would make arena seem like child's play but the loot from it would be awesome. STS finance dept would be happy, plat spenders can do the plat to gold thing, people can farm exclusive rare loot and have an extra farmable map.

What I'm trying to say is have people who are farming spread out across Arlor and not all loot dry an endgame map, where the loots worth no longer becomes decent.

I give ya an example right now about endgame dryness......

I want to buy a mythic bow right! WTH is there to farm for me to get the remaining gold amount. Virtually nothing! I require 10m do you know how many breezes I gotta farm for that!!!!!!!! Imagine the amount of boring tooth runs to do so I can get drag bars and sell them to reach that target! Farming the tip of the iceberg cornered with tooth runs and breeze runs and not much else.

The key to the game is not scaling alone but freshening up the loot table with needed and wanted items. Yes it takes time and effort but you guys are the DEVs it's what you guys get paid for....amirite?

[Sorcerie]

Scale the maps up to 46 for sure.

Then give Elite Bloodhammer a chance to drop Hammerjaw, and Elite Grimnr a chance to drop Glacian, Elite Inan' a chance to drop Samael, and Elite Rendtail a chance to drop Singe. All of these pets will be discontinued once the new locked crates are implemented. This idea would certainly breathe life into each one of the past campaigns as people will always need pets and will want to complete their pet collections.

It would be a farmable way to get the Arcane AP that wouldn't involve chests. Plus, a real farmable arcane in the game in the form of an egg would just really be awesome as arcane pets could really rally people to farm those maps and bosses with relentless vigor, I know I would. Pets are a major aspect to the game, so why not make it a bigger challenge with the old arcanes, pokemon style, lol.

Just an idea...

[Serancha]

The point is simply to keep a sort of linear progression for players as they develop their characters; to keep the game fun with relevant map areas all the way through character development, rather than presenting players with a huge insurmountable jump in difficulty once they cap and unlock elites. The gap today between a newly capped player and a capped player with the very best of gear, is significantly larger in terms of wealth, stats, and game experience/knowledge than it was the first time you played Brackenridge elite.

You don't have to have arcane gear to run scaled elites. People seem be unaware of this. Yes, you need decent legendaries, but most players have that after a few weeks in the game. It's not even expensive by anyone's standards. Within days of the last cap, the top crate legendaries were purchasable for under 10K for all classes. People then used these to farm for better ones in the (scaled) elite maps.



Please tell me more about how tombs and kraken mines create a stimulating and enjoyable play experience that will keep capped players in game, give them farming options, and motivate them to keep coming back for more of the same >.<

Many many members of my guild over the past two years have spent a lot of time crate farming. Doing so forged bonds between guild members, got people used to their characters and skills, and earned them enough money to go arcane plat-free. Players did this because we knew there was more to the game to experience, and that to run that content optimally, better gear needed to be earned. So we worked to earn it. It gave us a goal and a purpose and kept us logging in.




Not every player with average gear is “noob” some players just actually prefer a slightly more casual game experience, and would be/are happy to farm mild level difficulty elites and slowly amble their way towards better gear, or simply be content with legendaries. Lost mages mine and Rooks nest are still popular maps...

*sigh* I did not say all average geared players were noob, nor did I think it. It was just a general term I used to encompass this "easy elite" situation that people mistakenly think is actually being used. Since the pet crates came along, there's nothing in those maps to make money on.


As for the rest, I'm not going to keep repeating the same explanations. Ultimately it's up to the devs whether they want to sort this out.

Looking at the outline on the crate thread, (http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?238565-Rage-of-the-Ren-gol-Sneak-Peek-Ren-gol-Crates) you can see that they only provided for farming of normal maps (from Ydra up which is good), and elites from Shuyal up, This means the normal maps are covered and the new elites covered, but the remainder of the elite maps are excluded completely. That is what this thread is looking at.

[Shaytarria]

++++++++++++++1

[Dalmony]

Neither will I keep saying the same things. However... thinking that the easier Elites are used is not a mistake. I frequently see people farming elite rooks nest, Elite mage mine, and even Elite jarl, despite the fact that the income from t hose maps is low, people still enjoy them. The rest would be used too by those same players.

In my 2 and a half years playing I have never farmed crates. I bonded with my guild by teaching them elites and farming those... everyone's idea of fun is different and I personnally get bored of km3 before a half an hour elixir runs out. If that was only real option at end game once I capped Id lose interest go find a game which had more to offer me... everyone is different.

[greekAL]

just give the ppl the option to farm those tokens guys and all will be happy! our last season all ppl were mad by recipe drop rate! butt all those ppl were happy to farm tombs cause if u ar unlucky u still gather tokens after hard work! thats what the game needs something to give u when u spent hours of farming! not wait a lucky drop from locks/bosses!

[kona]

unless the elite map's drop rates are good and offer good loot ,making them challenging wouldn't make me feel like running them

[UnnamedGuy]

Current issues

For the last few months, player interest has declined to an all-time low.

This can be seen clearly by the number of guild hoppers bouncing between guilds, the steady decline of online players (last night there were 12 out of 300 on my F/L online during North American prime time), and the #1 ranked guild for most online in the 7 day range is 22% below what it was a year ago.

Even considering that the economy always crashes as soon as an expansion is announced, much of this decline has to do with boredom - too little variety of maps to farm, too little loot of value to farm for, and too little challenge.

We have 3 new maps being added for the level 46 cap, and this is not going to hold people's attention for long. There is talk of a lot of potentially farmable stuff, so what's the deal? Are these items all going to squeeze into the three new bosses, leaving people groaning at the tedium of repetition?


Proposal

Why not take all the lovely elite maps from ALL the other seasons, and instead of having them easy enough for a naked level 20 to run with no viable loot, scale the mobs up to 46 like elites should be, and populate ALL the elite bosses in the game with viable loot. This would add a ton of interest and variety into the game, allowing for people to choose what they want to farm and where. If all maps were equally challenging (as far as mob level goes), and all had loot we could use - it would provide a lot more purpose for this new "skip-the-leveling" feature.

I have never seen the point of having low level elites, and wasted maps. Having maps with useless loot and one-hit-able mobs is a waste of space and bandwidth. It wouldn't take a lot of resources to scale things up, since the coding for scaling mobs is already present for tombs and other maps.

Are there any reasons for this not to be implemented? It may just fix the problem of severely declining player interest, loot distribution issues and a lot of other things.

Great idea for those who wanna see lvl41/46 Flamestrikes/charwards/Lifethiefs etc!

[Socrates]

is the expansion rly only 3 maps?? I thought that there where only 3 maps in the test server and the other two maps would be a surprise for when the expansion will hit....... That sure is a hit below the waist if it's true :/

[Serancha]

Neither will I keep saying the same things. However... thinking that the easier Elites are used is not a mistake. I frequently see people farming elite rooks nest, Elite mage mine, and even Elite jarl, despite the fact that the income from t hose maps is low, people still enjoy them. The rest would be used too by those same players.

In my 2 and a half years playing I have never farmed crates. I bonded with my guild by teaching them elites and farming those... everyone's idea of fun is different and I personnally get bored of km3 before a half an hour elixir runs out. If that was only real option at end game once I capped Id lose interest go find a game which had more to offer me... everyone is different.

There are options at end game. You can wear epic gear and farm normal maps or spend 50k on legendary gear and farm elites. It really isn't that difficult to get good enough gear to run scaled maps. By end game, most people have enough gear to manage it.



unless the elite map's drop rates are good and offer good loot ,making them challenging wouldn't make me feel like running them

That is why the proposal includes the distribution of elite loot through all the elite maps, providing they are scaled.




is the expansion rly only 3 maps?? I thought that there where only 3 maps in the test server and the other two maps would be a surprise for when the expansion will hit....... That sure is a hit below the waist if it's true :/

Only 3 bosses were shown in the sneak peeks, and there has been nothihg said to imply that there will be a full 5 map expansion,

[Dalmony]

Yes there are often cheap options for gear, but it isn't only gear which gets in the way of newly capped players farming endgame against the hardest hitting elite mobs.

Sometimes and most often, it is gold or lack of it - often players don't have enough gold to sustain themselves in the hardest elites for long enough to make it to their first hugely valuable drop, in terms of ankh costs, pot costs, pet food costs for the couple of pets they have which are decent enough to run there. That's when they move down to the next farming tier to start to build up some gold first.... And as I've said not everyone wants to do that in just km3 (and regular wilds as had also been pointed out).

I just think that it's important to keep something to everyone's tastes, whatever the reason might be for those - fun factor / gold / time / a love of picking on weak(ish) goblins / etc. And at the end of the day I am not trying to argue for zero changes to be made, just that they be made while taking the entire player base into consideration (by leaving a small number of elites scaled down a little bit and to a lesser extent than they were previously).

I think we are probably going to have to agree to disagree on some things. All of what is being said here is healthy to the development of what is being proposed here and that's the main aim of the thread.

Thanks for bringing it up :)

[ClumsyCactus]

Scale the maps up to 46 for sure.

Then give Elite Bloodhammer a chance to drop Hammerjaw, and Elite Grimnr a chance to drop Glacian, Elite Inan' a chance to drop Samael, and Elite Rendtail a chance to drop Singe. All of these pets will be discontinued once the new locked crates are implemented. This idea would certainly breathe life into each one of the past campaigns as people will always need pets and will want to complete their pet collections.

It would be a farmable way to get the Arcane AP that wouldn't involve chests. Plus, a real farmable arcane in the game in the form of an egg would just really be awesome as arcane pets could really rally people to farm those maps and bosses with relentless vigor, I know I would. Pets are a major aspect to the game, so why not make it a bigger challenge with the old arcanes, pokemon style, lol.

Just an idea...

I support this!!

[OdenTheJust]

Perfect exactly what the game needs, this would make the game so much more fun, like it used to be, like how it should be.

[kananaskis]

The more i think about this, the better it seems.

Serencha's proposal to "... take all the lovely elite maps from ALL the other seasons, and instead of having them easy enough for a naked level 20 to run with no viable loot, scale the mobs up to 46 like elites should be, and populate ALL the elite bosses in the game with viable loot."

This would add to the game a real "variety of maps to farm", "loot of value to farm for", and new challenges, which would increase player interest and activity.

Two alternatives have emerged in this thread.

Serancha proposes that all elite maps be "equally challenging (as far as mob level goes), allowing for people to choose what they want to farm and where. If all maps were, and all had loot we could use - it would provide a lot more purpose for this new "skip-the-leveling" feature." There's lots of support for this in this thread.

Others suggest scaling elites up but not all to the same degree. The most detailed proposal here by Dalmony who suggests "an alternative to the originally posted idea" where the majority "...of the maps be scaled up leaving the first few maps [Brakenridge to Dead City] at 5 levels below cap as an entry point to elites for newly capped players", and that Kraken, Nordr, Shuyal, Planar, Tindrin, & Ren'gol be scaled to 46.

Both make a strong case I think. Generally, there is a consensus that the current low level elites are way to easy now and will become more irrelevant with level 46. So: Scale all to 46 to challenge players, having only to choose on which loot and quests to focus on, or have a set of elite maps scaling to 41as an entry point while most scale to 46.

On the one hand, Serancha points out that if all elites were scaled, then this is what most endgame players would be running, or gearing up to run, and new legendaries will be enough to begin these fully scaled elites. Also if some elites are left at an easier level they would be open to over-farming.

On the other hand, having some elites five below level cap will allow newer players to transition toward the tougher maps. Indeed this was my experience, beginning AL 4 months before the Tindrin expansion and 41 cap. I found this useful on the learning curve before actually getting tto the 41 scaled elites (Nordr Shuyal Tindrin). It was also a means at the time to farm up to better gear for 41 elites. But i appreciate that Serancha points out that in earlier seasons, all elites were fully scaled and the jump from normal to elite was by no means insurmountable.

I am wondering what people think and look forward to the discussion. Many good points have been made here.

As far as new loot, some specific suggestions were put forward here and there. I imagine that the the majority of citizens of Arlor would agree with additional gear drops, craftables, and quest rewards spead thru all elites, rather than in a few maps. The specifics of this are complex and there is much possibility here, but to me the important part of this thread now is how elites should be scaled up: some 41 & most 46; or all 46?

[Bigboyblue]

I would like to see all maps scaled to 46 with descent loot dropping from them. I remember running from brakenridge to kraken solo with my lvl 41 toon. I'm a mage and could solo these maps. I was wearing pink gear at the time as well. This doesn't involve skill, it doesn't help you gain real elite experience. There isn't really a point of having a lesser scaled elite map. The loot dropped isn't very good either so you end up running them once for APs and then grinding out the newest elite maps for drops. This gets boring and tedious pretty quick and also leads to over farming.

If all maps were scaled and each area had different drops it would open the game up. We could be entertained for longer, farm longer and the loot would hold value longer.

[Serancha]

We've hit 40 thanks on the original post. That is a huge show of support from the community. I think we'd all like to hear some feedback from the devs. Either yes they can implement it or a valid reason why they can't / won't.

[Niixed]

I also fully support this idea, and I have something to add.

With Ren'gol Locked dropping usable tokens, STS seems to be finally grasping the idea that players should not get nothing for something. Farming elites has been akin to struggling with all of your strength for 15-30 nonstop minutes just to pull down the lever of a slot machine ONE TIME. If you lucky you get something of actual value, if not HAHAHAHAHA! It's no wonder even maxed-out top-geared players tend to shy away from farming elites.

If STS scales the old elites and adds better, worthwhile loot, I encourage them to also...


...boost the gold reward that typically drops from bosses to equal 50% of the cost of the potions expected to be used during an average run in that map.
...in addition to gold and and loot, a chance to drop tradable elixir, respec scrolls, or ankhs.
...consider including a token system for legendary gear/elixirs/ankhs/etc that can also be purchased from a vendor. Tokens could drop from copper/silver/gold chests (not necessarily guaranteed tokens like with the Ren'gol crates)

[Xxdisarrayxx]

Current issues

For the last few months, player interest has declined to an all-time low.

This can be seen clearly by the number of guild hoppers bouncing between guilds, the steady decline of online players (last night there were 12 out of 300 on my F/L online during North American prime time), and the #1 ranked guild for most online in the 7 day range is 22% below what it was a year ago.

Even considering that the economy always crashes as soon as an expansion is announced, much of this decline has to do with boredom - too little variety of maps to farm, too little loot of value to farm for, and too little challenge.

We have 3 new maps being added for the level 46 cap, and this is not going to hold people's attention for long. There is talk of a lot of potentially farmable stuff, so what's the deal? Are these items all going to squeeze into the three new bosses, leaving people groaning at the tedium of repetition?


Proposal

Why not take all the lovely elite maps from ALL the other seasons, and instead of having them easy enough for a naked level 20 to run with no viable loot, scale the mobs up to 46 like elites should be, and populate ALL the elite bosses in the game with viable loot. This would add a ton of interest and variety into the game, allowing for people to choose what they want to farm and where. If all maps were equally challenging (as far as mob level goes), and all had loot we could use - it would provide a lot more purpose for this new "skip-the-leveling" feature.

I have never seen the point of having low level elites, and wasted maps. Having maps with useless loot and one-hit-able mobs is a waste of space and bandwidth. It wouldn't take a lot of resources to scale things up, since the coding for scaling mobs is already present for tombs and other maps.

Are there any reasons for this not to be implemented? It may just fix the problem of severely declining player interest, loot distribution issues and a lot of other things.

+1 I support this 100% . Amazing idea from an intelligent, veteran player and a proven astonishing GM . Her experience , and words should not be taken lightly. I really hope the devs not only reply or give her a type of answer, but began communicating with her personally, as I believe (as well as many many others) she can help keep this game alive. I'd really hate to see this game die or descend . Please do not underestimate her comprehension or disregard her perception and mastery understanding of this game.

[Ssneakykills]

I'm surprised a dev/mod hasn't stepped up and give us their thoughts on this thread yet especially as the thread has gained a lot of attention and popularity

[Serancha]

Still no response. I guess providing feedback isn't as productive as it used to be. As shown in this thread, nobody is looking forward to over a year of running only 3 elite maps.

[Arpluvial]

Hey guys!

No worries, we are paying attention to the feedback. I've already made note of this thread and passed it along. :) The team is always listening.

[Dimitrian]

Hey guys!

No worries, we are paying attention to the feedback. I've already made note of this thread and passed it along. :) The team is always listening.
Hey Arpy!
Can you also see my suggestions ? Think i have some great ones :D

Also this idea is very awesome!


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[Promagespvp]

Exactly what your post is. Well stated.
+1 Thug Life

[Remiem]

Hey everyone. This is a really solid idea, and I love all of the great discussion and feedback it's created. :D The new Ren'gol crates will definitely breathe some new life into Elites as the Locked Large Ren'gol crates will be dropping in Shuyal, Tindirin and Ren'gol elite maps. But we will definitely consider your suggestions going forward. Our overall goal is to keep you guys entertained with a steady stream of new stuff post expansion and I think you'll be pleased with the things we have in store.

[Serancha]

If it doesn't come soon you may be waiting alone. There's less people logging in by the day now.

[Ravager]

Even less if Rouges of Rengal is all about rogues and not warriors/mages.

[Dimitrian]

Now my speculation is that expansion comes on 7/1.
Why?
Because the lock sale will end on 7/1.We had would have an entire week without crates, how much more?

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[Dimitrian]

Even less people will be logging in if its full of bugs and the content is dis-heartening [emoji14]
Wut?
We had a test server...

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[Dimitrian]

Even less if Rouges of Rengal is all about rogues and not warriors/mages.
*facedesk*
If you think that this will be true,than it might be.
Stop,acting like a pesimistic,the devs have announced that they were working on an expansion since halloween.
They had about 8 months to think about it (and i think they restarted everything for some reason).
They also had a test server.If there will be bugs in the first phase of the expansion(the rebuilding one), i doubt about it.
They even said they will make something about the mob density,so i'm 95% sure that every class will be useful.

No h8 plz.

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[Ravager]

Even less if Rouges of Rengal is all about rogues and not warriors/mages.
*facedesk*
If you think that this will be true,than it might be.
Stop,acting like a pesimistic,the devs have announced that they were working on an expansion since halloween.
They had about 8 months to think about it (and i think they restarted everything for some reason).
They also had a test server.If there will be bugs in the first phase of the expansion(the rebuilding one), i doubt about it.
They even said they will make something about the mob density,so i'm 95% sure that every class will be useful.

No h8 plz.

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Im really hoping so too. For example, majority are optimally done with majority rogue parties. I use the timed lbs as a reference for optimal runs. The last time I recall wars were really wanted was Elite Skull Cove when it was first introduced at 26 cap. The mob density was huge near Bloodhammer. Thats just one example of how reviving an old level would help other classes especially since, based on test server testing and feedback and of course their valid reason of latency concerns behind it, mob density being low for new levels makes me wonder.

[Serancha]

Lol Rouges of Rengal. Rengal wears makeup, does he? Silly Ravvy.

[Dimitrian]

Im really hoping so too. For example, majority are optimally done with majority rogue parties. I use the timed lbs as a reference for optimal runs. The last time I recall wars were really wanted was Elite Skull Cove when it was first introduced at 26 cap. The mob density was huge near Bloodhammer. Thats just one example of how reviving an old level would help other classes especially since, based on test server testing and feedback and of course their valid reason of latency concerns behind it, mob density being low for new levels makes me wonder.
Another solution to this might be to improve the warrior damage aswell.
We need more bosses with huge mob density.I saw in the test server that Korgar spawns mobs,and he also has reflection shield which is great.
To make warriors more useful in the arena,i suggest that the guy who you talk to start the run should be the 5th and final boss.He would be like: "WHAT?!?HOW IS THIS POSSIBLE!!MY MINIONS!!LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT A TRUE FIGHT MEANS!" and he would transform into some-what demon who deals heavy damage and spawns mobs.This IMO would be very good for warriors.
I also saw a great suggestion,for some kind of "endless challenge", something like a Ren'gol arena,but with mobs,that come in waves.

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[Serancha]

STS should really reconsider this. Players are not happy at all about being relegated to only 3 maps between events / content releases. The game and community would be much healthier if there were actual variety in the maps we could farm for loot.

After all, right now it's just crates. Why not scale up the other elites and put large ren'gol crates as drops from those bosses?

[Anyona]

+1 to this idea, keep the thread alive!

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[kinzmet]

+1

If this idea is to be implemented, I would love if theres a pop-up window before going in an scaled elite map where it shows the possible loots. With those teaser loots showing up, players will crave to play it more provided of course that those loots were valuable.

[Otahaanak]

+1
Free the....I mean scale the maps!


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[Caabatric]

+10000000

arena is dead for pugs,drag bar profit is almost dead, locks are so bleh, jewels are so bleh......

honestly people who are farming hard enough to get 1m i dont know how they haven't gotten bored of game yet....

[Serancha]

I'd like to see the primary stat jewels dropping in the scaled elites also. This would encourage a lot more people to both farm elites and get any missing ap's.