Regarding the Difficulty of Ren'Gol Elites

[Madnex]

Seeing as more and more people are complaining about how easy the maps were, I noticed that almost no one paid attention to the reasons why that is.

-Firstly, the huge Orc Gladiator's bug. In the new elites, the primary challenge you face is based on the combination of the 40% dmg reduction buff that this orc gives to his allies combined with the frequent and potent shaman healing. Well, atm, this type of orc is bugged and does not move from his spawn nor does he cast his buff unless you walk up close to him (like literally step on his feet). Combined with the healing shamans no longer being covered by the dmg reduction shield anyway and the newly added cooldown on the falling rocks from the Orc Brute to lower the stuns, you can see why the maps seem like child's play right now.

-Secondly, it appears that the intention of creating these new elites was not to create the next extreme challenge for the 10% maxed out players but instead to provide a means for the average, more casual player to get the new mythic set through farming. Hence there's no timer this time, another thing that makes these maps easier. Now, part of the difficulty has shifted from finishing a tough map to consistently grinding an average map.

On the other hand, Planar Tombs were labeled as the "elite of the elite" so it's understandable if the new maps seem easier in comparison (even though we haven't played them at their designed level of difficulty yet). Those maps had a different purpose which was complemented by their higher boss difficulty.

-Finally, realize the gear advantage that no one is paying attention to. Last season only a handful of people had arcane rings and planar pendants (which together provide an emormous survivability boost) and even fewer had Nekro's. Considering how overpowered those arcanes are --despite how common they have come to be-- you can't just assume this gear as the norm and request more difficult maps ignoring the (fewer now) lesser geared masses. Especially Nekro since 80% of the map being challenging is based on a multitude of stuns.


In conclusion, all current feedback on the map/boss difficulty should not be made the reason for any changes yet. We need the bugs fixed and explanations given first on what was changed by plan.

[Dimitrian]

-Secondly, it appears that the intention of creating these new elites was not to create the next extreme challenge for the 10% maxed out players but instead to provide a means for the average, more casual player to get the new mythic set through farming. Hence there's no timer this time, another thing that makes these maps easier. Now, part of the difficulty has shifted from finishing a tough map to consistently grinding an average map.

Finally someone who agrees with me!

[Candylicks]

I also agree that the maps and frequency of mythic ingredient drops SHOULD stay as is. IF they choose to up the challenge it should only be done with fruitful rewards at the end, such as a new array of items that drop at bosses.

[Tatman]

Well, I wrote a long post here, but not gonna submit it. I'll probably be told to get a room again.

I'll just say that I disagree with a lot of the things you say. Just a few quick points though:

1. I believe only the gladiator bug is actually a bug. Everything else seems intended to me.

2. We obviously have very different opinions on what is "elite". In terms of what we have seen so far, these maps are not elite in my book. And one more thing - people grinded all previous elites, level of difficulty didn't stop any determined elite runner, regardless of their gear. So, yes, maybe another tier of difficulty should indeed be introduced, as someone suggested recently.

3. I don't know what the norm is, but it definitely isn't ruby, fang and Malison. I truly believe at least arcane ring IS the norm at the moment. Nekro isn't but like I said on other threads - you can complete these maps on a pet like Blinky without much trouble. And by the way - why did they give us all these shards, fossils and arcanes in general, if they intended to present us with these new elites all along? Don't tell me you haven't thought about this. Something is really rotten in the state of AL, if you ask me.

[Oezheasate]

#Scale the old elite maps

[twoxc]

Seeing as more and more people are complaining about how easy the maps were, I noticed that almost no one paid attention to the reasons why that is.

-Firstly, the huge Orc Gladiator's bug. In the new elites, the primary challenge you face is based on the combination of the 40% dmg reduction buff that this orc gives to his allies combined with the frequent and potent shaman healing. Well, atm, this type of orc is bugged and does not move from his spawn nor does he cast his buff unless you walk up close to him (like literally step on his feet). Combined with the healing shamans no longer being covered by the dmg reduction shield anyway and the newly added cooldown on the falling rocks from the Orc Brute to lower the stuns, you can see why the maps seem like child's play right now.

-Secondly, it appears that the intention of creating these new elites was not to create the next extreme challenge for the 10% maxed out players but instead to provide a means for the average, more casual player to get the new mythic set through farming. Hence there's no timer this time, another thing that makes these maps easier. Now, part of the difficulty has shifted from finishing a tough map to consistently grinding an average map.

On the other hand, Planar Tombs were labeled as the "elite of the elite" so it's understandable if the new maps seem easier in comparison (even though we haven't played them at their designed level of difficulty yet). Those maps had a different purpose which was complemented by their higher boss difficulty.

-Finally, realize the gear advantage that no one is paying attention to. Last season only a handful of people had arcane rings and planar pendants (which together provide an emormous survivability boost) and even fewer had Nekro's. Considering how overpowered those arcanes are --despite how common they have come to be-- you can't just assume this gear as the norm and request more difficult maps ignoring the (fewer now) lesser geared masses. Especially Nekro since 80% of the map being challenging is based on a multitude of stuns.


In conclusion, all current feedback on the map/boss difficulty should not be made the reason for any changes yet. We need the bugs fixed and explanations given first on what was changed by plan.

Child's Play AP is not easy to achieve lol.

[extrapayah]

a bit out of topic but, a parked run of planar tombs 3 is easier than these maps...

[kananaskis]

a bit out of topic but, a parked run of planar tombs 3 is easier than these maps...

not really off topic at all, as it reiterates madnex's point that scaled elites (planar, tindrin, shuyal, and new glintstone maps) are relatively easier for many due to stronger gear.

[kananaskis]

OP writes: "-Secondly, it appears that the intention of creating these new elites was not to create the next extreme challenge for the 10% maxed out players but instead to provide a means for the average, more casual player to get the new mythic set through farming. Hence there's no timer this time, another thing that makes these maps easier. Now, part of the difficulty has shifted from finishing a tough map to consistently grinding an average map."

i think this assessment is correct. sts knows how to design cutting edge challenging maps. i am inclined as well to think these new maps are part of a greater road map which includes more challenging maps ahead. the glintstone maps serve a current design purpose.

[Dimitrian]

a bit out of topic but, a parked run of planar tombs 3 is easier than these maps...

I think that after you die,the mobs should go back to their place.This way,warriors will be warriors,not valets.

Excuse my grammar.

[extrapayah]

I think that after you die,the mobs should go back to their place.This way,warriors will be warriors,not valets.

Excuse my grammar.

if the mobs are returning, it will be like how rengol maps right now, we skip them...

[intizamfamily888]

Say hi to 10-15m ancestral runes if the new elites get buffed

Gesendet von meinem LG-P760 mit Tapatalk

[Dimitrian]

if the mobs are returning, it will be like how rengol maps right now, we skip them...

I was reffering to the other maps that need parking.
And i don't want them skippable,i want that the mobs would follow you through the entire map and when you die,they would go back to their place.

[Dimitrian]

I disagree, parking requires more skill than spamming skills. Parking and skipping mobs (to me) have always been a part of doing elites.

Mobs are fine as they are, this is coming from someone whose spent around 200-300 ankhs farming for runes and fangs. I could have easily saved those ankhs and bought the fangs and runes from my gold I saved, hardly any profit made when I'm running with a disorganised party.

You didn't understand...
My idea was about changing the role of the warriors,from parking valets,to damage soaker.

[Dimitrian]

Here's a white by you:

I think warriors should be both parking valets and damage soakers. On a side note: any decent mage can park too. Our shield+galw means we are better valets than you.

At the moment,warriors are just valets,and maybe 10 or 15% damage soakers.If any decent mage can park,then warriors are useless.

[Dimitrian]

Warriors have almost been "useless" for 3-4 seasons now, this is a discussion for another thread. Raising the difficulty of mobs will hardly do anything but elongate the time of the run, which will probably only cause more deaths. I've seen a few decent time warriors who know when to aggro the mobs(that or luck has been on their side way too much).

I would rather warriors get an upgrade to VB and rally cry(VB gives damage and crit to party members and rally cry provides stun immunity and MS, let's not forget these shouldn't stack). Providing these two will mean warriors can run easy maps as well as hard maps. Giving warrior skills a longer aggro time or a better aggro stance would be the icing on the cake.

Making warriors better damage soakers doesn't really guarantee them a spot in the endgame parties who would rather spend less time in maps(which usually means less deaths and expenses).

1)*facepalm* I didn't said the mobs should raise in difficulty,i said that the mobs that follow you throught the entire map (for example,the green dudes in shuyal and the planar tombs) should reset when you die.

2)Nice suggestions.Please take that in consideration sts!

3)Doing what i said in number one would be the most simple solution,and sts always chooses the most simple solution.

[Dimitrian]

Oh my bad, but still a no to the parkable mobs resenting, parking is fun(even more for me when I don't have an Arlorian driving licence x))

Simple doesn't mean best! Reseting mobs will hardly mean a warrior sees a spot in the party, I've seen way too many warriors who can't even park -_-
"Simple doesn't mean best"...tell sts this one!

And yeah,i now see that resetting mobs won't be such a good idea...and as even the mages can park now...then the only solution is to make the buff you mentioned in your last post.