Please address the clear imbalances related to the warrior class

[Khicho]

I am going to try very best to keep this post both positive and constructive. For starters I think it is important to recognize the recent efforts that have been made to balance AL in the way of loot distribution closing the player gap related to gear. And even though this post is/will be to point out several inconsistencies and weaknesses related to the warrior class. You (STS) have done a really nice job improving the sorcerer class. You have mad just the right amount of tweaks to offer them enough increased durability and damage to become a force.

Now the issue at hand. I know this has been brought to your attention numerous times so nothing I am about to say will be new. The warrior class in AL has so many shortfalls that it is really difficult to know where to start. So maybe it is easiest to break it down into PVE and PVP.

PVE:
So for starters I have played many computer based RPG's such as EQ, WoW, and Warhammer. In all of these games the tank class has ALWAYS been one if not the most integral classes to successfully running PVE. Especially when it came time to engaging any end game boss. this couldn't be further from the truth in our game. In fact most groups simply avoid inviting warriors because they are dead weight. And honestly who can really blame them. The groups are more effective in terms dmg output and time spent running without them. Bottom line tanks are not needed at ALL in PVE. I realize that AL is not a computer based game but one of the attractive features to this game is that you can get similar gaming experience on your phone or tablet.

PVP:
This is the one area of this game that keeps the tank class alive. Because lets be honest if it wasn't for PVP there wouldn't be a single tank in AL. The warrior class in AL pvp is the most integral class. It is by far the hardest class to play because of the numerous responsibilities and the most sought after when it comes to clashes. And this is all GREAT except over the past two season tanks have been reduced to nothing more than giant pin cushions. Why? We do not do enough dmg to keep up rogues or mages so it is virtually impossible to kill and the few kills that we do get most of the time dont even off set the amount of deaths that we take. Again to reference other similar games the Tank class played with skill dominates every other class at it should.

Please take this feedback as sincere and well meaning. There are so many things that could be done to resolve these issues and for the longest we have been promised that something would be done.

[Eldorado]

PVE : Tanks are wortless.
PVP: Tanks are the best, to be honest better than a rogue at twink level in both 1 vs 1 and also Clash and also better than a rogue in clash in the end game.They are invincible specially when multiple tanks in the party specially at twink levels. If a tank lose, it just mean they are undergeared or need more practice.

[Oursizes]

Umm what? As far as endgame goes a tank can easily kill a rogue, except for those morons without a nekro using vb of course...

[Kingofninjas]

Umm what? As far as endgame goes a tank can easily kill a rogue, except for those morons without a nekro using vb of course...

Tanks are not very good for vs the dps classes, especially rogue. Mages go 50-50 with tanks but a rogue will almost always beat an evenly geared tank.

If what you say comes from personal experience, then try timing ur skills when your not feebles, and waiting out jugg instead of spending mana trying to break it.

[KnowledgeFTW]

Honestly a tank vs a dps (preferably rouge) wont end well for the warrior.
Towards mages, it depends on the gear, but once the arcane shield is down, you should be able to kill them so i would say 50% chance to win.

Vb is not needed in endgame pvp imo, jugg,cs,axe or skyward, and horn dominates.

[Khicho]

Respectfully, you are wrong. As it relates to end game tanks. Not twinks because as the first person said and I agree with from lvls 1to15 or so tanks are kings of pvp. That said in end game equally geared and skilled tanks vs rogues. Rogue wins 9 out of 10 times. Tanks vs mage, mage wins 7 out of 10 if they use gale. And this is 1v1 which I wasn't even talking about. I was referring to clashes.

[Madnex]

Respectfully, you are wrong. As it relates to end game tanks. Not twinks because as the first person said and I agree with from lvls 1to15 or so tanks are kings of pvp. That said in end game equally geared and skilled tanks vs rogues. Rogue wins 9 out of 10 times. Tanks vs mage, mage wins 7 out of 10 if they use gale. And this is 1v1 which I wasn't even talking about. I was referring to clashes.
So bottom line is, you're expecting to get more than sporadic kills in a clash instead of the dps. Tell us more about how pure tanks are doing that in any sort of team fights in any game?

[Oursizes]

Tanks are not very good for vs the dps classes, especially rogue. Mages go 50-50 with tanks but a rogue will almost always beat an evenly geared tank.

If what you say comes from personal experience, then try timing ur skills when your not feebles, and waiting out jugg instead of spending mana trying to break it.

I figured that out a while back, but then now and then theres a tank that keeps wondering why he dies faster than paper burns, and its generally due to using vb instead of jugg. Jugg will make it harder to die and reduce damage too.

[Madnex]

Also, concerning pve, the primary problem lies in the reduced and mixed together class roles and the fact that everyone has potions to mash. In other cases/games where class division means something, even max-geared dps get down'd like flies in seconds at the highest difficulty maps. And the second most important, tanks are actually capable of monopolizing the aggro and incoming damage - yes, it does require timing and practice but it's there, it's possible.

Here in AL --due to game design-- there's neither content elite enough to make a tank necessary nor an appropriate skillset for them to effectively tank anyway. At this point of the game, it's too late for drastic changes IMO. Dps is the optimal path for elite farming, no way around that.

[Dimitrian]

Also, concerning pve, the primary problem lies in the reduced and mixed together class roles and the fact that everyone has potions to mash. In other cases/games where class division means something, even max-geared dps get down'd like flies in seconds at the highest difficulty maps. And the second most important, tanks are actually capable of monopolizing the aggro and incoming damage - yes, it does require timing and practice but it's there, it's possible.

Here in AL --due to game design-- there's neither content elite enough to make a tank necessary nor an appropriate skillset for them to effectively tank anyway. At this point of the game, it's too late for drastic changes IMO. Dps is the optimal path for elite farming, no way around that.

Well Warriors were useful before Nekro showed up.You don't need a tank because if your pt has nekro,you won't take any damage at all.
Even if they scale the elites,i'm sure that tanks still won't be useful,becuse everyone will use Nekro.

[Kakashis]

The just need to make it impossible for rogues and mages to do elites without a warrior. Allow warriors to have insane armor and survivability like every other game for pve only. Pvp just keep them as is.

[Eldorado]

Well Warriors were useful before Nekro showed up.You don't need a tank because if your pt has nekro,you won't take any damage at all.
Even if they scale the elites,i'm sure that tanks still won't be useful,becuse everyone will use Nekro.
Ankhs or instant resu makes tanks useless.Nekro? Why mages die then even if they have shield and their shield is far better than nekro shield? Improve tanks abilility to maintain aggro and maybe some will consider because it will make them use less ankh.

[Oursizes]

No one will care until aggro skills actually get fixed. As of right now half of the warrior skills are useless, the other half are for pvp.

[Khicho]

So bottom line is, you're expecting to get more than sporadic kills in a clash instead of the dps. Tell us more about how pure tanks are doing that in any sort of team fights in any game?

No that is not what I am saying. It is about level of enjoyment, period. There is very little satisfaction playing a class that can not at the very least match the number of deaths that they take during a clash. Especially when they are the core of the group. I have played a tank since season 2 and it was always the case that rogues racked up the most kills with mages second and tanks 3rd and this was fine because... Even though as a tank I wouldn't get a lot of kills I was also tough as nails and very difficult to kill so we weren't just soaking up the deaths.

Judging by the reponses I am seeing many are either coming from rogues or players that do not play end game clashes. This is not a new problem. There have been countless threads regarding this.

The bottom line is all classes be it rogue, mage, or tank should have an equal chance to kill every other class depending on skill and circumstance. This is simply not the case.

[Oezheasate]

Anybody who says that an evenly skilled and geared tank can beat or be as succesful in 1 v 1 as an evenly geared and skilled rogue/mage has no idea or not enough idea, heck i only get kills against better geared rogues atm because they are plain inexperienced, I'm sorry but no, tanks are the class which get bullied in pve and pvp (excepting clashes). Period.

[Excuses]

Warrior is useless in pve because it's broken.
Why would you run with a tank when it can't taunt so dps dies, does not dmg and even die with dps together.

1. Sts put dot on ss hoping it will help taunt but tbh ss doesn't taunt at all. I rather expect to stun than taunt. Dot should be on cs or wm.
2. Cd 's range is too short and it lost boss windup interrupt on most of elite boss. And it does weakest taunt and dmg too.
3. Vg and jugg should be scaled level. So end level gets more survivability and low twinks tanks become balanced with other classes.
4. Either more dmg or armor debuff will be needed in pve only on taunt skills.
5. Idk if it's just for me but I don't understand why more dmg gets more heal. It should be more armor/hp to get more heal.

Tbh this will be hard to be fixed unless sts make a waiting pt room that will hold start until +3 of pt joins and that requires all 3 classes. People who likes solo will hate that but this is MMORPG so we should play with other people.
Making boss harder is not a solution when warrior itself is broken.

[Oezheasate]

The funny thing is that those that still farm with warrior turn to a hybrid and i will soon have to follow that path, they go for more damage and lose survivability which doesnt change anything because at the end of the day the maps arent hard enough for a skilled tank to die except those onehits in planar tombs.

[Khicho]

Warrior is useless in pve because it's broken.
Why would you run with a tank when it can't taunt so dps dies, does not dmg and even die with dps together.

1. Sts put dot on ss hoping it will help taunt but tbh ss doesn't taunt at all. I rather expect to stun than taunt. Dot should be on cs or wm.
2. Cd 's range is too short and it lost boss windup interrupt on most of elite boss. And it does weakest taunt and dmg too.
3. Vg and jugg should be scaled level. So end level gets more survivability and low twinks tanks become balanced with other classes.
4. Either more dmg or armor debuff will be needed in pve only on taunt skills.
5. Idk if it's just for me but I don't understand why more dmg gets more heal. It should be more armor/hp to get more heal.

Tbh this will be hard to be fixed unless sts make a waiting pt room that will hold start until +3 of pt joins and that requires all 3 classes. People who likes solo will hate that but this is MMORPG so we should play with other people.
Making boss harder is not a solution when warrior itself is broken.

I agree with everything that you said.

Or one very simple fix to pve would be to leave everything as is and give tanks a MASSIVE damage boost. I mean lets face it the tank class as is has no current value so rather than changing the game just increase the level of damage to match rogues and mages and problem solved!

[Madnex]

No that is not what I am saying. It is about level of enjoyment, period. There is very little satisfaction playing a class that can not at the very least match the number of deaths that they take during a clash. Especially when they are the core of the group. I have played a tank since season 2 and it was always the case that rogues racked up the most kills with mages second and tanks 3rd and this was fine because... Even though as a tank I wouldn't get a lot of kills I was also tough as nails and very difficult to kill so we weren't just soaking up the deaths.

Judging by the reponses I am seeing many are either coming from rogues or players that do not play end game clashes. This is not a new problem. There have been countless threads regarding this.

The bottom line is all classes be it rogue, mage, or tank should have an equal chance to kill every other class depending on skill and circumstance. This is simply not the case.
Bolded part is the issue here because you're trying to be dps in order to get more kills so of course you won't reach the class's intended survivability. And the '''countless'' threads (one of which is mine (http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?222224)) are pertaining warrior improvements in PvE, never PvP.

Class balance can't work like that; the tank should have the advantage over aoe dps and a disadvantage fighting single target dps. In 1v1 situations.

Or one very simple fix to pve would be to leave everything as is and give tanks a MASSIVE damage boost. I mean lets face it the tank class as is has no current value so rather than changing the game just increase the level of damage to match rogues and mages and problem solved!
That is a poor and not thought-through suggestion. You want to give the warriors equal damage output with dps but keep the double HP and 50% or higher armor? Oh that's not game-changing at all! Seems to me like you want to be dps without leaving your warrior. Won't happen.

[Khicho]

Bolded part is the issue here because you're trying to be dps in order to get more kills so of course you won't reach the class's intended survivability. And the '''countless'' threads (one of which is mine (http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?222224)) are pertaining warrior improvements in PvE, never PvP.

Class balance can't work like that; the tank should have the advantage over aoe dps and a disadvantage fighting single target dps. In 1v1 situations.

That is a poor and not thought-through suggestion. You want to give the warriors equal damage output with dps but keep the double HP and 50% or higher armor? Oh that's not game-changing at all! Seems to me like you want to be dps without leaving your warrior. Won't happen.

You are speak as if the game is designed to account for the classes current strength and weakness. The game is designed to spam potions to stay a live, use elixers to increase damage and accomplish damage mitigation, and ankh for quick resurrection. All this makes the class roles non existence. So rather than redesigning the entire game just make it so no matter what class you play you enjoy pve.

[Madnex]

You are speak as if the game is designed to account for the classes current strength and weakness. The game is designed to spam potions to stay a live, use elixers to increase damage and accomplish damage mitigation, and ankh for quick resurrection. All this makes the class roles non existence. So rather than redesigning the entire game just make it so no matter what class you play you enjoy pve.
If you give one class the advantage the other two have and more, you're gonna have to do that for them too or else there's no balance. Where will that lead? To classes being merely different character skins. That's not the way to go.

Creating environments and situations where a specific class's skill is the only way through would work. Or cross-class combos to make up for the dps loss and party buffs for having one of each in the map. All suggested multiple times to no avail.

[Trojan2100]

Pve warrior what a joke. Most of you guys suggested giving mobs more hp and stronger attacks to make tank more attractive to the group. Well that back fired big time now we need more Dps to take down the mob so warriors are still out.
Sts tends to give ppl what they want with a little twist.

[yubaraj]

Maybe limiting use of ankhs per run and cooldown on use of health and mana pots. Maybe it will force rogue to depend on warrior and mage for survival. Just a thought.

[Madnex]

Maybe limiting use of ankhs per run and cooldown on use of health and mana pots. Maybe it will force rogue to depend on warrior and mage for survival. Just a thought.

Ankh limit will just force slower runs with different tactics like reset half the mob group, kill the other half and then finish off the ones reset. Cd on potions just means many more warrior deaths and way too many more sorcerer deaths since rogues have about 5x their dodge while ranking second in survivability in terms of hp-armor. This would also inevitably equal slower runs without making them any more interesting or fun.

[Serancha]

Ankh limit will just force slower runs with different tactics like reset half the mob group, kill the other half and then finish off the ones reset. Cd on potions just means many more warrior deaths and way too many more sorcerer deaths since rogues have about 5x their dodge while ranking second in survivability in terms of hp-armor. This would also inevitably equal slower runs without making them any more interesting or fun.

And it would further encourage all-rogue runs, since between dodge and ranged bow attacks, they are the only ones unlikely to be affected by such restrictions.

[Madnex]

Pve warrior what a joke. Most of you guys suggested giving mobs more hp and stronger attacks to make tank more attractive to the group. Well that back fired big time now we need more Dps to take down the mob so warriors are still out.
Sts tends to give ppl what they want with a little twist.

IMO another thing that makes warriors still sit out is the low mob count per group. Traditionally in games where tanks are a necessity the advantage a good tank and an experienced AoE mage make basically relies on large pulls, with mobs having an incredibly large leash range to support it. Something that was actively enforced in the new maps was the exact opposite - small groups with short leashes (to combat latency but ...yeah).

[Oursizes]

IMO another thing that makes warriors still sit out is the low mob count per group. Traditionally in games where tanks are a necessity the advantage a good tank and an experienced AoE mage make basically relies on large pulls, with mobs having an incredibly large leash range to support it. Something that was actively enforced in the new maps was the exact opposite - small groups with short leashes (to combat latency but ...yeah).

We can probably blame sts on this pne. They DID say that their game engine couldnt keep up with the high mob counts(or something like that? When they removed 3/4 of mobs in tindirin)

[Edward Coug]

Maybe limiting use of ankhs per run and cooldown on use of health and mana pots. Maybe it will force rogue to depend on warrior and mage for survival. Just a thought.

I think mages are great in the new maps. Warriors, not so much.

[extrapayah]

You are speak as if the game is designed to account for the classes current strength and weakness. The game is designed to spam potions to stay a live, use elixers to increase damage and accomplish damage mitigation, and ankh for quick resurrection. All this makes the class roles non existence. So rather than redesigning the entire game just make it so no matter what class you play you enjoy pve.

i agree on this, mashing potions, lix, and ankhs only make tank or damage absorber class unnecessary..

and fyi, it was mostly rogues players who asked to make elite rengol harder

and also even though the mobs density is increased, with most skills have maximum target (mostly 5-6), it won't make large pulls faster

[Pedgon]

I agree with everything that you said.

Or one very simple fix to pve would be to leave everything as is and give tanks a MASSIVE damage boost. I mean lets face it the tank class as is has no current value so rather than changing the game just increase the level of damage to match rogues and mages and problem solved!

I've been saying this for ages..thank you!

[Mariohekmat]

Warriors really needs buff specially in pve how come you expect a warrior to make gold if he cant find a party not all ppl are rich that they can make a mage or rogue just for pve!! Why the skills is called juggernaut if mobs brake it so easly? Lol
In pvp warriors are still needed cuz in clashes but in vs is very hard now mage can kill a warrior so my point is and imo warriors are only needed in clashes

[Trojan2100]

Warriors really needs buff specially in pve how come you expect a warrior to make gold if he cant find a party not all ppl are rich that they can make a mage or rogue just for pve!! Why the skills is called juggernaut if mobs brake it so easly? Lol
In pvp warriors are still needed cuz in clashes but in vs is very hard now mage can kill a warrior so my point is and imo warriors are only needed in clashes

Don't forget war also good for daily story token

[Samaeldavisjr]

Don't forget war also good for daily story token

Lmfao! ^^^

As far as this thread goes, it's all a moot point and has been posted several times. Stg doesn't have a clue how to fix it or it would've already been handled. Zzzzz

[Mariohekmat]

Don't forget war also good for daily story token

Lmao warriors are useless for almost everything now excpet clash

[Cody Black]

Will there be a response on here from sts about this issue?

It's tough playing a warrior with hardly any damage reduction or damage out put.

[Warrior_NOT_MEDIC]

So bottom line is, you're expecting to get more than sporadic kills in a clash instead of the dps. Tell us more about how pure tanks are doing that in any sort of team fights in any game?

Go play Forsaken World and you will see Tank is KING of pvp

[Madnex]

Go play Forsaken World and you will see Tank is KING of pvp
AL's warrior is basically a mix of FW's protector with FW's warrior (tank hybrid) if you compare their skill sets. AL doesn't have as many classes hence you can't really make that comparison.

So of course in AL, even if a warrior specialized in damage dealing skills he would simply not be as effective as a rogue is in terms of single-target damage (only one of his highest-damage attack skills is single-target for warrior while all of rogue's are).

[noobseller]

Just delete warrior on pve. And reroll Tetris on Gba.

[Xdumbx]

I am going to try very best to keep this post both positive and constructive. For starters I think it is important to recognize the recent efforts that have been made to balance AL in the way of loot distribution closing the player gap related to gear. And even though this post is/will be to point out several inconsistencies and weaknesses related to the warrior class. You (STS) have done a really nice job improving the sorcerer class. You have mad just the right amount of tweaks to offer them enough increased durability and damage to become a force.

Now the issue at hand. I know this has been brought to your attention numerous times so nothing I am about to say will be new. The warrior class in AL has so many shortfalls that it is really difficult to know where to start. So maybe it is easiest to break it down into PVE and PVP.

PVE:
So for starters I have played many computer based RPG's such as EQ, WoW, and Warhammer. In all of these games the tank class has ALWAYS been one if not the most integral classes to successfully running PVE. Especially when it came time to engaging any end game boss. this couldn't be further from the truth in our game. In fact most groups simply avoid inviting warriors because they are dead weight. And honestly who can really blame them. The groups are more effective in terms dmg output and time spent running without them. Bottom line tanks are not needed at ALL in PVE. I realize that AL is not a computer based game but one of the attractive features to this game is that you can get similar gaming experience on your phone or tablet.

PVP:
This is the one area of this game that keeps the tank class alive. Because lets be honest if it wasn't for PVP there wouldn't be a single tank in AL. The warrior class in AL pvp is the most integral class. It is by far the hardest class to play because of the numerous responsibilities and the most sought after when it comes to clashes. And this is all GREAT except over the past two season tanks have been reduced to nothing more than giant pin cushions. Why? We do not do enough dmg to keep up rogues or mages so it is virtually impossible to kill and the few kills that we do get most of the time dont even off set the amount of deaths that we take. Again to reference other similar games the Tank class played with skill dominates every other class at it should.

Please take this feedback as sincere and well meaning. There are so many things that could be done to resolve these issues and for the longest we have been promised that something would be done.
I laughed when I read the responses. It seems that people dont notice that your complaining about the tank in pve not pvp. Pvp keeps warrriors alive. In pve warrior suck.

[Ipoopsy]

If you give one class the advantage the other two have and more, you're gonna have to do that for them too or else there's no balance. Where will that lead? To classes being merely different character skins. That's not the way to go.

Creating environments and situations where a specific class's skill is the only way through would work. Or cross-class combos to make up for the dps loss and party buffs for having one of each in the map. All suggested multiple times to no avail.

That can work...

IF, they implement the Loots necessary for that specific class that needs helps from other classes.

[Trojan2100]

Stop trying to force warrior in group , I have an idea lets get all the Warriors together team up and don't let any other class in . Yea that will show other class .

[Maarkus]

Trying to keep this thread alive as until now still no response from STS

[Oezheasate]

I don't remember STS answering to a thread discussing the issues with warriors till now

[Cody Black]

Where was the reply?

[Maarkus]

Dear STS,

Please advice us on the show of apathy (intentional or not) as it is worrying, towards the warrior class inefficiency in PVE posts.

What is your position on the inefficency of the warrior class toon in PVE? Do you even belive that they are ineffcient?

It is clear now that the warrior class is inefficient in PVE, as shown many numorous threads by differnt forumers that play different classes about:
1. advising new players pve orriented to NOT make warriors as it is a farmers nightmare class
2. Constant posts about how bad the warrior class is in pve in terms of taunting mobs
3. Numerous posts advising constructive comments on how to make the warrior class more efficient

What happened to your Rengol Map design will encourage mutli class parties project? This was your proposed solution.
1. Have you seen the feedback? Is it not apparent that most, if not all have mentioned that warriors are not needed in rengol?
2. Did you have your own team test? Ingame and not with all that kill all commands?
3. Have you evaluate the map based on real player experience?

In recent posts ive noticed dev/producers reply to posts about rengol craft equipment queries, and other queries but never about the warrior class pve inefficiency queries, is this intentional?

Lets just say that the current solutions : a) map design b) new gear in play are not working to achieve warrior class efficiency in PVE . Are you even discussing how to resolve this? Are there new proposals?

Lastly, thank you for the line up of events and with a time table for delivery it is much appreciated. And in line with these events which are inclined to favor 'dmg/dps classes', does this not warrant more attention to a class which is being left behind? Does it not dawn to your planners that such events are and gear release create a 'classism' effect in the ingame society?

Well this is still an attempt to reach out, by no means do i expect a reply or quick action, just dont tell us that you are ware and working on it as i have read that answer for the last 2years, we tried to voice out our concerns i mean its been 2 years since we warrior dedicated players have been asking for your intervention.

Thanks for reading ... If u are reading this...

Maarkus

[Oursizes]

Dear STS,

Please advice us on the show of apathy (intentional or not) as it is worrying, towards the warrior class inefficiency in PVE posts.

What is your position on the inefficency of the warrior class toon in PVE? Do you even belive that they are ineffcient?

It is clear now that the warrior class is inefficient in PVE, as shown many numorous threads by differnt forumers that play different classes about:
1. advising new players pve orriented to NOT make warriors as it is a farmers nightmare class
2. Constant posts about how bad the warrior class is in pve in terms of taunting mobs
3. Numerous posts advising constructive comments on how to make the warrior class more efficient

What happened to your Rengol Map design will encourage mutli class parties project? This was your proposed solution.
1. Have you seen the feedback? Is it not apparent that most, if not all have mentioned that warriors are not needed in rengol?
2. Did you have your own team test? Ingame and not with all that kill all commands?
3. Have you evaluate the map based on real player experience?

In recent posts ive noticed dev/producers reply to posts about rengol craft equipment queries, and other queries but never about the warrior class pve inefficiency queries, is this intentional?

Lets just say that the current solutions : a) map design b) new gear in play are not working to achieve warrior class efficiency in PVE . Are you even discussing how to resolve this? Are there new proposals?

Lastly, thank you for the line up of events and with a time table for delivery it is much appreciated. And in line with these events which are inclined to favor 'dmg/dps classes', does this not warrant more attention to a class which is being left behind? Does it not dawn to your planners that such events are and gear release create a 'classism' effect in the ingame society?

Well this is still an attempt to reach out, by no means do i expect a reply or quick action, just dont tell us that you are ware and working on it as i have read that answer for the last 2years, we tried to voice out our concerns i mean its been 2 years since we warrior dedicated players have been asking for your intervention.

Thanks for reading ... If u are reading this...

Maarkus

I dont think they ever actually play without the kill all command. And if they do, then they will have 1 million damage like seo and 1hit every mob. Sts thought 1hitting mobs would make warriors needed? Id actually have their skills fixed tbh.

[Maarkus]

I dont think they ever actually play without the kill all command. And if they do, then they will have 1 million damage like seo and 1hit every mob. Sts thought 1hitting mobs would make warriors needed? Id actually have their skills fixed tbh.

Well tru skills need to be fixed as even if a warrior can achive rogue stats we will ever achive their effectiveness in PVE due to our skill inefficiency but from what i remember STS has mentioned in the forum that the skill revamp is no longer on their mind or is their last option or its just not being reviewed as their lates attempt to fixtings was thru map design thus i didnt bring it up (even if i should)

Hope this helps

[Cody Black]

Yeah no response...

[kydrian]

Bump 1+

Sent from my LG-D500 using Tapatalk

[Eldorado]

Warrior is useless in pve but does not mean they are weak just imagine if four warriors party. For sure they will be no casualties since they are invulnerable most of the time and use less potions. But the drawback is a slow run. If four mages party they will clear mobs faster using less potion but the drawback is they will kill boss slower resulting to a normal run and for sure some casualties. If four rogues party they will kill boss faster but the drawback is they will kill mobs slower, use a lot of potions and for sure some casualties. The problem about warrior is they cannot hold agro effectively resulting for dps to die plus mage that is meant to support groups by means of lifegiver is a big fail since it attracts mobs. Just imagine if mages can have both aoe attack and support at the same time and will also increase the effectives of a tank/group. Rouge is perfect as it is right now in pve and will work more effectively with support.

[Excuses]

Warrior is useless in pve but does not mean they are weak just imagine if four warriors party. For sure they will be no casualties since they are invulnerable most of the time and use less potions. But the drawback is a slow run. If four mages party they will clear mobs faster using less potion but the drawback is they will kill boss slower resulting to a normal run and for sure some casualties. If four rogues party they will kill boss faster but the drawback is they will kill mobs slower, use a lot of potions and for sure some casualties. The problem about warrior is they cannot hold agro effectively resulting for dps to die plus mage that is meant to support groups by means of lifegiver is a big fail since it attracts mobs. Just imagine if mages can have both aoe attack and support at the same time and will also increase the effectives of a tank/group. Rouge is perfect as it is right now in pve and will work more effectively with support.

Tank dmg is 3-10 times lower than rogue.
Would you run a map for 1 hour to save pots?
I know it's an example but non sense.
Tank's problem is not just aggro. Survivability and slowing down run too. That's what I ask cancel ability back on cs, scale vg/jugg, more armor reducion on skills.

[Dimitrian]

Tank dmg is 3-10 times lower than rogue.
Would you run a map for 1 hour to save pots?
I know it's an example but non sense.
Tank's problem is not just aggro. Survivability and slowing down run too. That's what I ask cancel ability back on cs, scale vg/jugg, more armor reducion on skills.
*cough*cough*buff warrs*cough*cough*

[Cody Black]

Can you make my warrior into a rogue ?

[Oezheasate]

I think u cant but im not sure

[Oezheasate]

Tank dmg is 3-10 times lower than rogue.
Would you run a map for 1 hour to save pots?
I know it's an example but non sense.
Tank's problem is not just aggro. Survivability and slowing down run too. That's what I ask cancel ability back on cs, scale vg/jugg, more armor reducion on skills.

My rogue is undergeared, only 690 dmg at lvl 46, working on that though, but even my rogue reaches 1.9k armor. Thats not much less than a maxed tank at 2.7k-3k armor. Its insane that rogues have come so close armor wise to tanks.