Ikronos divine vs Owner [part 2]

[xnorwayx]

Owner : Coughin(rogue), Iskala(rogue), Accordance(rogue), Veage(Warrior) and Zeucon(mage)
Kronos + Ressurected : Epicr(rogue)[swapped with Nucleons right after first death], Roged(rogue), Nucleons(rogue), Nekrouser(mage)[isn't on ss Becouse he got 0 kills], Bossuser(mage), Phebebe(warrior)
Total score : Owner 67 : 8 Ikronos
141633
141634

[Titanium]

twinks nowadays are unstoppable. 68 kills for one team is a reason to show off imho ! Congratz !

[xnorwayx]

twinks nowadays are unstoppable. 68 kills are a reason to show off imho ! Congratz !

Well, at your favourite endgame, for these 40 minutes u ofc could'be gotten 200+ kills, but at endgame is all about, who crits first now. If both teams have same geared people, both teams will win or lose. At twinks battles are more skill based, for example, which team better times nekro/mari/heal, which team have better focus at rogues/mages etc.
P.S.: It's 67 kills, not 68.

[Titanium]

If both teams have same geared people, both teams will win or lose. At twinks battles are more skill based, for example, which team better times nekro/mari/heal, which team have better focus at rogues/mages


That's correct ! I couldn't say it better myself.

[xnorwayx]

That's correct ! I couldn't say it better myself.

Yea, that's why twinks are skill based and endgame skill based only at half =)

[Titanium]

Yea, that's why twinks are skill based and endgame skill based only at half =)

Music for my ears !

[xnorwayx]

Music for my ears !

Happy to hear that =)

[Zeus]

Well, at your favourite endgame, for these 40 minutes u ofc could'be gotten 200+ kills, but at endgame is all about, who crits first now. If both teams have same geared people, both teams will win or lose. At twinks battles are more skill based, for example, which team better times nekro/mari/heal, which team have better focus at rogues/mages etc.
P.S.: It's 67 kills, not 68.

Lol, one mistake at end game and you are dead. What's more is that your death may cost the entire team's death as well. Rejoining is not as simple as it is for twinks. I've twinked before is twinking is far more lenient on mistakes than end game is.

[Serillia]

At lower levels, you can afford to make mistakes. Its true, clashes last longer at twinking levels, giving it more time for different strategies. But mistakes will not be punished much. At least not as much as in endgame. Crit does play a very superior role than it does in twink levels. But imo, thats what makes it more fun and more challenging. You need to hide very efficiently. Its not just about rushing the other rogues and mages. Its also about protecting yourself from hits (No, tank help in survival, but at endgame it mostly depends on your positioning). And like Zeus said, if one of your teammates die, it will in most cases mean the death of your whole team. Imo, endgame is much more challenging and once you get past the initial ragequits, the most fun PvP bracket ^_^. Then again, its just my opinion.

[xnorwayx]

Lol, one mistake at end game and you are dead. What's more is that your death may cost the entire team's death as well. Rejoining is not as simple as it is for twinks. I've twinked before is twinking is far more lenient on mistakes than end game is.

*sigh* U don't see alot of skill needed at endgame. First, who crits wins. U call this skill?

[xnorwayx]

At lower levels, you can afford to make mistakes. Its true, clashes last longer at twinking levels, giving it more time for different strategies. But mistakes will not be punished much. At least not as much as in endgame. Crit does play a very superior role than it does in twink levels. But imo, thats what makes it more fun and more challenging. You need to hide very efficiently. Its not just about rushing the other rogues and mages. Its also about protecting yourself from hits (No, tank help in survival, but at endgame it mostly depends on your positioning). And like Zeus said, if one of your teammates die, it will in most cases mean the death of your whole team. Imo, endgame is much more challenging and once you get past the initial ragequits, the most fun PvP bracket ^_^. Then again, its just my opinion.

Right now, endgame is : rushing non ringers / non nekrousers and skip geared. That's what happened alot with me and some my friends I pvped with. They all had rings and nekros... Everyone skipped them and killed only me. I think it's very unfair to most undergeared people there. Most fun pvp place is definitely 46 tdm with enemy team, full of fair players, where everyone kills everyone, without looking at gear. At twink lvls, you can attack whoever u want. I myself attack every player, who isn't my guildie, Becouse this way I can find good players.

[Alhuntrazeck]

Right now, endgame is : rushing non ringers / non nekrousers and skip geared. That's what happened alot with me and some my friends I pvped with. They all had rings and nekros... Everyone skipped them and killed only me. I think it's very unfair to most undergeared people there. Most fun pvp place is definitely 46 tdm with enemy team, full of fair players, where everyone kills everyone, without looking at gear. At twink lvls, you can attack whoever u want. I myself attack every player, who isn't my guildie, Becouse this way I can find good players.

If you're the least geared person in a team, of course you'll be picked out. It's the same way from L1 to 46, from AL PvP to WoW PvP, from street fights to world wars. It's just the way the world works...

And you honestly can't expect to wreck with far less gear. Step into twink PvP with epics, no para and no arcane pet, and see how fast you get targeted.

[Iosses]

Hello, as an officer of the owner guild I would like to question the in game name of the player that posted this thread? Thank you for reading have a great day.

[Nostek]

ss was from olfnir, feel free to pm or duel him in game, thx

[Hail]

How is making a mistake and possibly causing your team to die called skill? What I love about low level is how an opportunity can open in order to turn the tide of a battler, either it be 1v1, 5v5 or even 3v4. This is why I prefer lower levels rather than higher levels where once you make a mistake its over.

Anyway goodjob in the clash, looks fun.

[xnorwayx]

If you're the least geared person in a team, of course you'll be picked out. It's the same way from L1 to 46, from AL PvP to WoW PvP, from street fights to world wars. It's just the way the world works...

And you honestly can't expect to wreck with far less gear. Step into twink PvP with epics, no para and no arcane pet, and see how fast you get targeted.

Skipping geared people without even attacking them. And then u, endgamers call twinks noobs, couse we kill newbs.

[Girlady]

I want to make twink

Sent from my LGMS323 using Tapatalk

[Ovtlaw]

Skipping geared people without even attacking them. And then u, endgamers call twinks noobs, couse we kill newbs.

Watch this video. Twink is for newbies... I can 3v5 easy... End game is more in experience, team work and skills. If u do t know. Now u know

http://youtu.be/WnXakjs54yw

[Devrail]

Is lvl 13 active?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Arrowz]

Watch this video. Twink is for newbies... I can 3v5 easy... End game is more in experience, team work and skills. If u do t know. Now u know

http://youtu.be/WnXakjs54yw

then come 17 and lets see u 3v5

people run from our lvl to 23

[Ovtlaw]

then come 17 and lets see u 3v5

people run from our lvl to 23

Ok. I'll spend 15 mils

[Arrowz]

Ok. I'll spend 15 mils

pls do, i spent 25m

[sapdcroi]

Watch this video. Twink is for newbies... I can 3v5 easy... End game is more in experience, team work and skills. If u do t know. Now u know

http://youtu.be/WnXakjs54yw

karma vs golden lotus
twink vs endgame?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pW4ZhBvBkhg

[xnorwayx]

karma vs golden lotus
twink vs endgame?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pW4ZhBvBkhg

Thanks for vid. This will keep all these people, who say twinks are noobs away from my threads. =)

[xnorwayx]

The argument for this would be:

Less crit= more chance based PvP.
Since the variable is more etc etc.

Endgame clashing is also about pairing pet aa's and stuns(skills for other nabs). If you can't sync heal you shouldn't even be in PvP imho.

Maybe endgame clashes are faster than twink clashes. One run in can be GG, but in endgame you don't have common gear nabs running around trying to kill his own teammate and wondering why no hits show up.


My experience of thinking:

Nab:"how to get out of here?"

Twink:"huhu come to me"

Not to mention the few clashes I was in went on for 15 minutes no wipe out. I went for a haircut while I got my pet monkey to button smash. As a rogue twink PvP was very boring for me and as an even geared mage without breeze(during breeze glitch) I got constantly replaced so I decided to endgame tdm, where matches take 5-15 seconds to find and no one asked me to "out or they farm us".
Probably my bad making a mage when breeze glitch was about to happen.

Oo and 15 minute clashes before para was out, at times we went on for an hour with the nabs dieing and no wipe out.

My experience of endgame : Joined room, when left spawn got ganged by 3 nekro and ring rogues. When said try to play fair? They answered : cry noob.

[kjed]

so this thread turns out to be "end gamer's vs twinks"

(grab's michael jackson's popcorn)

Sent from my SM-E700H using Tapatalk

[Arrowz]

The argument for this would be:

Less crit= more chance based PvP.
Since the variable is more etc etc.

Endgame clashing is also about pairing pet aa's and stuns(skills for other nabs). If you can't sync heal you shouldn't even be in PvP imho.

Maybe endgame clashes are faster than twink clashes. One run in can be GG, but in endgame you don't have common gear nabs running around trying to kill his own teammate and wondering why no hits show up.


My experience of thinking:

Nab:"how to get out of here?"

Twink:"huhu come to me"

Not to mention the few clashes I was in went on for 15 minutes no wipe out. I went for a haircut while I got my pet monkey to button smash. As a rogue twink PvP was very boring for me and as an even geared mage without breeze(during breeze glitch) I got constantly replaced so I decided to endgame tdm, where matches take 5-15 seconds to find and no one asked me to "out or they farm us".
Probably my bad making a mage when breeze glitch was about to happen.

Oo and 15 minute clashes before para was out, at times we went on for an hour with the nabs dieing and no wipe out.

If u went on for an hour then clearly u were all bad

[Zeus]

karma vs golden lotus
twink vs endgame?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pW4ZhBvBkhg

Have twink players come to end game, lol. (Oh wait, they do...they get one hit, blame it on crit and then go twink). Mind you, amongst all the twink players, we got the best score against the winning team. So yes, I find that an achievement. Furthermore, I played a class that was not even my main class and still we performed relatively well.

Anyways, Nasty was also a well known twink too...so he's fought both end game and twink @ maxed clashes.

[sapdcroi]

Have twink players come to end game, lol. (Oh wait, they do...they get one hit, blame it on crit and then go twink). Mind you, amongst all the twink players, we got the best score against the winning team. So yes, I find that an achievement. Furthermore, I played a class that was not even my main class and still we performed relatively well.

Anyways, Nasty was also a well known twink too...so he's fought both end game and twink @ maxed clashes.

nasty said endgame is more experience. i have question. why golden lotus won? i play twink and i say twink is more experience? let respect player play in twink

[Zeus]

nasty said endgame is more experience. i have question. why golden lotus won? i play twink and i say twink is more experience? let respect player play in twink

I do agree that both levels take skill. To say otherwise would be ignorant. However, as someone who has played both levels...endgame takes more skill. I would welcome Golden Lotus to come to end game and duel us. So far, every twink that has gotten geared and come to end game has agreed that end game requires far quicker timing, quicker thinking which in short means more skill. Twinking is far more forgiving on things like ping, timing, etc. This is a fact that simply cannot be denied.

[xnorwayx]

I do agree that both levels take skill. To say otherwise would be ignorant. However, as someone who has played both levels...endgame takes more skill. I would welcome Golden Lotus to come to end game and duel us. So far, every twink that has gotten geared and come to end game has agreed that end game requires far quicker timing, quicker thinking which in short means more skill. Twinking is far more forgiving on things like ping, timing, etc. This is a fact that simply cannot be denied.

I don't see any skill in rushing bad geared people with nekro shield on.

[Titanium]

I don't see any skill in rushing bad geared people with nekro shield on.

Gear isn't everything anymore with Nekro around. Bad geared people will always have a shot to kill other people who dont have a nekro. But what i'm supposed to say about people new to the game who want to find out what pvp is .. and they find out after twinks are spawning them " me kill first, then u kill " . It's very hilarious to share kills . Look at endgamers pvp kdr and then look at twinks pvp kdr. Tell me who's farming more and who doesn't.


Yeah. Don't understand why Titanium is hating so much on twinks.

I don't hate twinks. I do respect some of the twinks. I don't hate nobody.

[yubaraj]

If someone say Endgame has or need more skill than twink because of quick thinking and quick reaction then I disagree.

What is there to quick think or quick act if endgame skill cooldown and twink cooldown and movement speed are same.

I do agree that endgame player kills or die faster because of the difference between health and damage ratio with twinks

[Zeus]

If someone say Endgame has or need more skill than twink because of quick thinking and quick reaction then I disagree.

What is there to quick think or quick act if endgame skill cooldown and twink cooldown and movement speed are same.

I do agree that endgame player kills or die faster because of the difference between health and damage ratio with twinks

If you think speed is being able to avoid shots...being careful of positioning...knowing when to push and when to fall back. Additionally, if you're just using skills the second they're off cool down in end game PvP then you are doing PvP wrong.

[yubaraj]

If you think speed is being able to avoid shots...being careful of positioning...knowing when to push and when to fall back. Additionally, if you're just using skills the second they're off cool down in end game PvP then you are doing PvP wrong.

I know you are pro but I am a noob twink.

However; I was disagreeing on the more skill part.

The thing I am saying is both endgame and twink needs skill. I am not saying twinks Need more skill than endgame PVP. Skill or knowledge is kind of same for every level.

Things you said about pushing forward falling back, pushing forward, skill using. All those parts are same for twinks too. Twink also should know when to use which skill, When to charge or spam skill, when to take cover on another player or environment, how to coordinate pets AA, strength and weakness of all the classes and skills of other classes.

So I still disagree if you think the endgame needs more skill than twink.


Edit: twinks have limited skill points so sometime it's more challenging what skills to use for vs and clash.

[Kingofninjas]

For people who think end game is all luck based because it is pure crit, please think again. In a clash, MOST of the attacks from mages and rogues are in fact crits, which actually evens the scales and reduces the luck factor. In twinks, the rate of crit is lower, resulting in more variability and hence a greater "luck" factor as you call it.

Additionally, if you play against people who out gear you, obviously you will lose. If I walk into twink levels with a epic set and 3% crit, of course the enemies will destroy me with their significantly higher crit. Voila! Crit became a factor at twink levels too.

As people already stated, end game required much better technology, ping, and quicker thinking. One mistake from any player and the whole team dies. At twink levels a single mistake won't even cause the player who made it a death most of the time.

For those bringing up the Golden Lotus match, Night and Zeus were both not playing their preferred classes, and they had much less experience at twink levels than their opponents. Why don't the Golden Lotus team come to end game and challenge the same team with their rogue playing a tank and their tank as the rogue? Let's see if they win.

[butterspar]

Twink = Endgame with less skill points

Nuff said

[Alhuntrazeck]

Skipping geared people without even attacking them. And then u, endgamers call twinks noobs, couse we kill newbs.

Why not...? If you pick out the weakest player, it is now a 4v5. This thing happens in twink PvP too lol.

[sapdcroi]

I do agree that both levels take skill. To say otherwise would be ignorant. However, as someone who has played both levels...endgame takes more skill. I would welcome Golden Lotus to come to end game and duel us. So far, every twink that has gotten geared and come to end game has agreed that end game requires far quicker timing, quicker thinking which in short means more skill. Twinking is far more forgiving on things like ping, timing, etc. This is a fact that simply cannot be denied.
if u said endgame takes more skill. i played mage in twink. so u can tell me how mage in endgame use skill. many of them use fight light or ice when fight cuz and game have high dmg? they use curse in endgame?. tell me how they build and use curse in endgame?

[sapdcroi]

For people who think end game is all luck based because it is pure crit, please think again. In a clash, MOST of the attacks from mages and rogues are in fact crits, which actually evens the scales and reduces the luck factor. In twinks, the rate of crit is lower, resulting in more variability and hence a greater "luck" factor as you call it.

Additionally, if you play against people who out gear you, obviously you will lose. If I walk into twink levels with a epic set and 3% crit, of course the enemies will destroy me with their significantly higher crit. Voila! Crit became a factor at twink levels too.

As people already stated, end game required much better technology, ping, and quicker thinking. One mistake from any player and the whole team dies. At twink levels a single mistake won't even cause the player who made it a death most of the time.

For those bringing up the Golden Lotus match, Night and Zeus were both not playing their preferred classes, and they had much less experience at twink levels than their opponents. Why don't the Golden Lotus team come to end game and challenge the same team with their rogue playing a tank and their tank as the rogue? Let's see if they win.
ik that in endgame when someone make a mistake they and their team will die. pvp in twink and in endgame really are diffirence. maybe golden lotus cant win in endgame but they win in tournament cuz they play in twink they have more experience gw in their lvl they play. if u have experience gw in twink tell me about gw 2 warrior 1 mage 2 rouge?

[Griiiim]

Owner is for sure the better guild. More experienced and great strategies.

[Arrowz]

For people who think end game is all luck based because it is pure crit, please think again. In a clash, MOST of the attacks from mages and rogues are in fact crits, which actually evens the scales and reduces the luck factor. In twinks, the rate of crit is lower, resulting in more variability and hence a greater "luck" factor as you call it.

Additionally, if you play against people who out gear you, obviously you will lose. If I walk into twink levels with a epic set and 3% crit, of course the enemies will destroy me with their significantly higher crit. Voila! Crit became a factor at twink levels too.

As people already stated, end game required much better technology, ping, and quicker thinking. One mistake from any player and the whole team dies. At twink levels a single mistake won't even cause the player who made it a death most of the time.

For those bringing up the Golden Lotus match, Night and Zeus were both not playing their preferred classes, and they had much less experience at twink levels than their opponents. Why don't the Golden Lotus team come to end game and challenge the same team with their rogue playing a tank and their tank as the rogue? Let's see if they win.

your right twinks dont have as much crit. and u know what that means? u cant rush a rogue for 2 seconds and one combo them. As a rogue or mage you have to put urself at risk longer to kill and enemy dps than at endgame. Knowing when you have enough time to rush an enemy dps and kill them takes just as much skill to become effective at. Not to mention that twinking takes more coordination to kill specific people than at endgame. At endgame you can be blown up by one other person almost instantaneously. To have this same effect at twinks requires 2-3 people on the same team to read eachother and act at the sametime before the opportunity is lost rather than just 1 rogue finding an opening and killing an enemy rogue.

endgame requires different kinds of skill than twinking does. Clearly that is shown by the fact that zeus and Night are two of the best endgamers but they still lost the twink tournament. Based upon how long this argument has been going on for across countless different threads and THERE STILL ISN'T AN AGREEMENT UPON WHICH REQUIRES MORE SKILL, just settle for the fact that they are different and can't be compared.

[Zeus]

your right twinks dont have as much crit. and u know what that means? u cant rush a rogue for 2 seconds and one combo them. As a rogue or mage you have to put urself at risk longer to kill and enemy dps than at endgame. Knowing when you have enough time to rush an enemy dps and kill them takes just as much skill to become effective at. Not to mention that twinking takes more coordination to kill specific people than at endgame. At endgame you can be blown up by one other person almost instantaneously. To have this same effect at twinks requires 2-3 people on the same team to read eachother and act at the sametime before the opportunity is lost rather than just 1 rogue finding an opening and killing an enemy rogue.

endgame requires different kinds of skill than twinking does. Clearly that is shown by the fact that zeus and Night are two of the best endgamers but they still lost the twink tournament. Based upon how long this argument has been going on for across countless different threads and THERE STILL ISN'T AN AGREEMENT UPON WHICH REQUIRES MORE SKILL, just settle for the fact that they are different and can't be compared.


There are times to rush and there are times when you cannot rush, just like twinkling. If I, as a rogue, varnish and kill the other rogue then there is a serious weak link in that teams strategy. Also, the enemy rogue also has an opportunity to snipe me in the same moment that I am opened. Don't forget, DPS is rarely ever stunned in clash. In fact, tanks are usually the most stunned. If timed right, DPS can go unstunned for most of the clash. The times you can be stunned, I shall answer: Well, what were you doing crossing your tank if you can be stunned?

However, we can both agree on that both types of PvP take skill. I just ask that twinks who can gear a toon try out clashes at end game. From the small sample population of those players that have, in my experience, have said that end game is harder to be good at and is less forgiving on mistakes.

[xnorwayx]

Why not...? If you pick out the weakest player, it is now a 4v5. This thing happens in twink PvP too lol.

Not 4v5, but farming undergeared person, while ur team stays and just watches at u being farmed. No one even attack them.

[xnorwayx]

There are times to rush and there are times when you cannot rush, just like twinkling. If I, as a rogue, varnish and kill the other rogue then there is a serious weak link in that teams strategy. Also, the enemy rogue also has an opportunity to snipe me in the same moment that I am opened. Don't forget, DPS is rarely ever stunned in clash. In fact, tanks are usually the most stunned. If timed right, DPS can go unstunned for most of the clash. The times you can be stunned, I shall answer: Well, what were you doing crossing your tank if you can be stunned?

However, we can both agree on that both types of PvP take skill. I just ask that twinks who can gear a toon try out clashes at end game. From the small sample population of those players that have, in my experience, have said that end game is harder to be good at and is less forgiving on mistakes.

There is no time for rushing newbs =) just rush then anytime, couse they can't do anything.

[Kingofninjas]

your right twinks dont have as much crit. and u know what that means? u cant rush a rogue for 2 seconds and one combo them. As a rogue or mage you have to put urself at risk longer to kill and enemy dps than at endgame. Knowing when you have enough time to rush an enemy dps and kill them takes just as much skill to become effective at. Not to mention that twinking takes more coordination to kill specific people than at endgame. At endgame you can be blown up by one other person almost instantaneously. To have this same effect at twinks requires 2-3 people on the same team to read eachother and act at the sametime before the opportunity is lost rather than just 1 rogue finding an opening and killing an enemy rogue.

endgame requires different kinds of skill than twinking does. Clearly that is shown by the fact that zeus and Night are two of the best endgamers but they still lost the twink tournament. Based upon how long this argument has been going on for across countless different threads and THERE STILL ISN'T AN AGREEMENT UPON WHICH REQUIRES MORE SKILL, just settle for the fact that they are different and can't be compared.

Thank you. Exactly what I meant. At end game, a rogue hitting another rogue, sometimes even with nekro shield, will blow them up. Heck, even a mage can blow them up without nekro shield. At twink levels it takes 2-3 synced players to nuke down a enemy dps. How often does that happen? Being able to get in and out of enemy territory, and killing an enemy dps in the process, is something that I feel twinks do not fully appreciate the difficulty of at end game for the very reasons you stated. My argument that end game requires more skill (aka ping, device and common sense) than twinking is based upon this.

[Kingofninjas]

Also to add on to my previous post, since for some reason I can't edit, I can assure you that a rogue should be able to see a rush coming and land the first shot (potentially stopping the rush by killing the enemy) or hide if he cycles his skills right. I have personally seen this done, both to and by me in relatively even gear clashes.

[Titanium]

For those bringing up the Golden Lotus match, Night and Zeus were both not playing their preferred classes, and they had much less experience at twink levels than their opponents. Why don't the Golden Lotus team come to end game and challenge the same team with their rogue playing a tank and their tank as the rogue? Let's see if they win.

Golden Lotus should come to play a tournament at endgame. If they will manage to get into quater-finals then it's a performance. Horror managed to get into finals without any twink pvp experience. They only wanted to prove a point what endgame is capable of.

[xnorwayx]

Also to add on to my previous post, since for some reason I can't edit, I can assure you that a rogue should be able to see a rush coming and land the first shot (potentially stopping the rush by killing the enemy) or hide if he cycles his skills right. I have personally seen this done, both to and by me in relatively even gear clashes.

Aimed+nox, then fast hide back wall. When nekro rogue comes 1 more combo and still not enough to kill. And then in a second they 1 shot you and say : hide more noob.

[Arrowz]

Thank you. Exactly what I meant. At end game, a rogue hitting another rogue, sometimes even with nekro shield, will blow them up. Heck, even a mage can blow them up without nekro shield. At twink levels it takes 2-3 synced players to nuke down a enemy dps. How often does that happen? Being able to get in and out of enemy territory, and killing an enemy dps in the process, is something that I feel twinks do not fully appreciate the difficulty of at end game for the very reasons you stated. My argument that end game requires more skill (aka ping, device and common sense) than twinking is based upon this.

Nuking a player actually happens pretty often. Atleast my guild does, we can keep a rogue out of a fight entirely if we choose to. The other guilds, not so much. Thats y they cry about lvls while ganging and we win 4v5s vs higher lvls

[Ovtlaw]

Twink = Endgame with less skill points

Nuff said

No your wrong, skill points is not the major part. It's how u fight of using your class...

For example: when ur tank play at level 23. U always die like paper. Cause u chose to have a nice stat on health and dmg instead put those extra points in jug skill.... After that your team swapped you cause u don't like to use jug.. Lol

[Ovtlaw]

ik that in endgame when someone make a mistake they and their team will die. pvp in twink and in endgame really are diffirence. maybe golden lotus cant win in endgame but they win in tournament cuz they play in twink they have more experience gw in their lvl they play. if u have experience gw in twink tell me about gw 2 warrior 1 mage 2 rouge?

Dude. In twink 23 I can tank with 4 rouges and farm the whole twink 23 bracket... My rogues alway have mana n I always stay healthy... Imo twink is too easy because real player always at end game

[Ovtlaw]

your right twinks dont have as much crit. and u know what that means? u cant rush a rogue for 2 seconds and one combo them. As a rogue or mage you have to put urself at risk longer to kill and enemy dps than at endgame. Knowing when you have enough time to rush an enemy dps and kill them takes just as much skill to become effective at. Not to mention that twinking takes more coordination to kill specific people than at endgame. At endgame you can be blown up by one other person almost instantaneously. To have this same effect at twinks requires 2-3 people on the same team to read eachother and act at the sametime before the opportunity is lost rather than just 1 rogue finding an opening and killing an enemy rogue.

endgame requires different kinds of skill than twinking does. Clearly that is shown by the fact that zeus and Night are two of the best endgamers but they still lost the twink tournament. Based upon how long this argument has been going on for across countless different threads and THERE STILL ISN'T AN AGREEMENT UPON WHICH REQUIRES MORE SKILL, just settle for the fact that they are different and can't be compared.

Dude. U lucky cause your enemy doesn't have no skill. Your video show that ur always open n no enemy rogue go atk u. If my twink 23 were there. You get farm... Xsolo is my rogue in 23. Recognize me

[sapdcroi]

Dude. In twink 23 I can tank with 4 rouges and farm the whole twink 23 bracket... My rogues alway have mana n I always stay healthy... Imo twink is too easy because real player always at end game
do u remember thanhdaoz who scammer your arcane ring? before him came 23 him had been 10. and i saw some your video. many loser in my lvl come to 23 in 2014@@ so do u mean thanhdaoz is pro? u said lvl 23 for pros@@

[Arrowz]

Dude. In twink 23 I can tank with 4 rouges and farm the whole twink 23 bracket... My rogues alway have mana n I always stay healthy... Imo twink is too easy because real player always at end game

Use 4 rogues at 17. Ill take the free kills anyday

[Ovtlaw]

Use 4 rogues at 17. Ill take the free kills anyday

Lol. Like I said before. Your videos show You fight against noobs. Come to 23 or end game when u want to fight real skill player.


Ign : Nasty

[Arrowz]

Lol. Like I said before. Your videos show You fight against noobs. Come to 23 or end game when u want to fight real skill player.


Ign : Nasty

Ur videos show u stacking tanks and fighting rogues with samael. Pff

[Ovtlaw]

Ur videos show u stacking tanks and fighting rogues with samael. Pff

Lol. Which video I stacking tanks? Or va rogue with samael?


Ign : Nasty

[Arrowz]

Lol. Which video I stacking tanks? Or va rogue with samael?


Ign : Nasty

http://youtu.be/1gFEbGd6_nc 3 tanks vs. 1 tank

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fM4VhKci-60 rogue using samael.

How r u gonna lie ur way out of this?

[Ovtlaw]

http://youtu.be/1gFEbGd6_nc 3 tanks vs. 1 tank

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fM4VhKci-60 rogue using samael.

How r u gonna lie ur way out of this?

3 tank 1 rogue vs 1 tank 3 mages in end game usually 1 tank 3 mages will win. You can ask Zeus or any pro in 46. They will tell you how weak is tank stacking.

That rogue only use samael at start cause he thinks he can win without nekro. After his 1st lost. He start to use nekro and still lost...

Btw. Tank class is build for team fight not for solo. Especially if you play at 46. Tank is very weak if playing solo


Ign : Nasty

[Arrowz]

Not to mention the fact u rushed them with only 3 players

[Ovtlaw]

Not to mention the fact u rushed them with only 3 players

We did wait. It just magnum doesn't want to join fast enough. They're scared.

And you should fight with enemy that have same gear n pet like your team. Stop farm noobs n under gears player n post on YouTube. Pretend your pro

Twink will never reach highest skills unless they can survive in 46 pvp

[Arrowz]

We did wait. It just magnum doesn't want to join fast enough. They're scared.

And you should fight with enemy that have same gear n pet like your team. Stop farm noobs n under gears player n post on YouTube. Pretend your pro

Twink will never reach highest skills unless they can survive in 46 pvp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kG6GAjysnFM

4v5, 2 tanks on my team didnt even have para and I rekt a lvl 19 rogue with maridos. Keep making up bs

[Ovtlaw]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kG6GAjysnFM

4v5, 2 tanks on my team didnt even have para and I rekt a lvl 19 rogue with maridos. Keep making up bs

Dude. Their team suck. None of them aim at you. Their tank doesn't support that rogue. If u fight against me. Ill make You useless. Just like how I did to Voorg ( rank 1 mage in level 46 )


Ign : Nasty

[Arrowz]

Dude. Their team suck. None of them aim at you. Their tank doesn't support that rogue. If u fight against me. I make I useless. Just like how I did to Voorg ( rank 1 mage in level 46 )


Ign : Nasty

then come 17, o wait u wont cuz ur nothing but words

[Ovtlaw]

then come 17, o wait u wont cuz ur nothing but words

Lol. I did play at 17... Ask nostek. It's bunch of kids. They always block, gang and trash talk. I always ask them to have a fair clash they refused and trash talk more. I don't have time to keep on join fast gang the enemy force them to leave map n start new one. Keep doing this over and over. It's a waste of time, and I don't think I learn anything from this dirty style

One more thing about twink 17. They love to stack tank. 4-5 tanks.

Ign : Nasty

[Hail]

This is getting ridiculous. Every single level requires its own flavor of skill. No level is more or less skilled, and of course if you begin a new level you are going to get farmed by the players that practice at said level every single day. So can we please get over this twink vs endgame bs?

I play 9 because I love 9's play style. Arrowz plays 17 because (assuming he) loves 17's play style. And the rest play 46 because they love 46's play style. End of story.

[Alhuntrazeck]

Not 4v5, but farming undergeared person, while ur team stays and just watches at u being farmed. No one even attack them.

Right, because the same thing doesn't happen at all in twink levels. Show me a video where 4 twinks fight to the death protecting a "noob" with rare gear.

[Ovtlaw]

Right, because the same thing doesn't happen at all in twink levels. Show me a video where 4 twinks fight to the death protecting a "noob" with rare gear.


http://youtu.be/_-sHYthDPBA


Ign : Nasty

[Arrowz]

http://youtu.be/_-sHYthDPBA


Ign : Nasty

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pZwCa4eRSqo

2v5 aswell. Whats ur point

[Farminer's]

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/18/7f5f036a088121c628736bb96baced9a.jpg
Every level takes different skill
1v3 et vs Tga

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk

[butterspar]

No your wrong, skill points is not the major part. It's how u fight of using your class...

For example: when ur tank play at level 23. U always die like paper. Cause u chose to have a nice stat on health and dmg instead put those extra points in jug skill.... After that your team swapped you cause u don't like to use jug.. Lol

This shows how much you know me. Do you still rage kick people after you die once?

[butterspar]

Lol. I don't like play with noobs. Twink is too easy. End game it's where real skill player are at. Just like all the videos u posted. U only fight beginners player. When u bored of them go level up. Zeus gonna show u how small skill u have as a rogue


Ign : Nasty

If you "farmed all of 23" repeat it and Farm all of 46, stop hiding behind Zeus and Show some skills.

[Oursizes]

This is getting ridiculous. Every single level requires its own flavor of skill. No level is more or less skilled, and of course if you begin a new level you are going to get farmed by the players that practice at said level every single day. So can we please get over this twink vs endgame bs?

I play 9 because I love 9's play style. Arrowz plays 17 because (assuming he) loves 17's play style. And the rest play 46 because they love 46's play style. End of story.

Thanks for the post.

[Oursizes]

Right now, endgame is : rushing non ringers / non nekrousers and skip geared. That's what happened alot with me and some my friends I pvped with. They all had rings and nekros... Everyone skipped them and killed only me. I think it's very unfair to most undergeared people there. Most fun pvp place is definitely 46 tdm with enemy team, full of fair players, where everyone kills everyone, without looking at gear. At twink lvls, you can attack whoever u want. I myself attack every player, who isn't my guildie, Becouse this way I can find good players.

I agree with this. And endgame has a new rule "dont hit flagger or i gang u make u have very big problem fokk". Its very hard/near impossible to withstand a 2v1 in endgame(assuming all 3 players have ring and nekro). Its all about gears now there. At twink level you can do a 3v1 and still win assuming you play properly. I once farmed a magnum flagger and he called his whole guild and their mother to kill me. Stupid things like this made me quit endgame pvp.

[xnorwayx]

I agree with this. And endgame has a new rule "dont hit flagger or i gang u make u have very big problem fokk". Its very hard/near impossible to withstand a 2v1 in endgame(assuming all 3 players have ring and nekro). Its all about gears now there. At twink level you can do a 3v1 and still win assuming you play properly. I once farmed a magnum flagger and he called his whole guild and their mother to kill me. Stupid things like this made me quit endgame pvp.

Yeah. At twink lvl if you and your tank are good, you can easily handle 2v5. This happened to me and Ioss few days ago. We wrecked enemy team 2v5 and when their block left farmed them in 3v4.

[Zeus]

Thats a funny statement. I usually wouldnt get involved in forum stufd like this, but just because youre going around calling everyone a noob. At endgame all I've seen you ever do is fight undergeared players or call 4 more of your horror buds and 2 blocks to farm a geared player. You call this skill? Ive seen you avoid so many players with equal gear than i can count. So before you go around calling people a noob, please take a moment to reflect upon yourself. Each bracket takes its own skill, as Hail has said. For lower level brackets it requires focus for a longer period of time, while endgame requires focus for a short period, but the level of focus is different forall brackets. Endgame is about who can crit first now, and i disagree with zeus' post about endgame requiring any real skill(other than a clash). As he is a rogue with 70% crit now, it sure must require a lot of "skill" to kill players . theres no real difference between endgame and twinking other than stats. The style of gameplay is the same.

My entire post is in reference to clashes...lol.

[Oezheasate]

Lol i dont really care about all this drama but one thing u guys have to accept because it is that way. Nasty is the most skilled current tank at endgame, as simple as that, i saw him tank with a bonesaw better than terror with a bulwark. No matter what most people agree he is the most skilled tank at endgame.

[Visiting]

Lol i dont really care about all this drama but one thing u guys have to accept because it is that way. Nasty is the most skilled current tank at endgame, as simple as that, i saw him tank with a bonesaw better than terror with a bulwark. No matter what most people agree he is the most skilled tank at endgame.

Night was still at endgame last I checked? >_>

[butterspar]

Lol i dont really care about all this drama but one thing u guys have to accept because it is that way. Nasty is the most skilled current tank at endgame, as simple as that, i saw him tank with a bonesaw better than terror with a bulwark. No matter what most people agree he is the most skilled tank at endgame.
What did he tank? A rouge that charged Nox? Oh wait never mind, it was probably one of those new players that auto leveled to 41 and have no idea what they're doing

[Arrowz]

Lol i dont really care about all this drama but one thing u guys have to accept because it is that way. Nasty is the most skilled current tank at endgame, as simple as that, i saw him tank with a bonesaw better than terror with a bulwark. No matter what most people agree he is the most skilled tank at endgame.

jugg is hard

[Oezheasate]

Night is not rlly active ;) believe me i play endgame pvp enough hours daily and nasty is pretty skilled eventhough he may brag too much.

Edit: So people dont accuse me of backpedalling, yeah nasty is the best active endgame tank atm.

[butterspar]

Night is not rlly active ;) believe me i play endgame pvp enough hours daily and nasty is pretty skilled eventhough he may brag too much.

Edit: So people dont accuse me of backpedalling, yeah nasty is the best active endgame tank atm.
Best at dying, running, spawning, ganging, and crying perhaps

[Kingofninjas]

What did he tank? A rouge that charged Nox? Oh wait never mind, it was probably one of those new players that auto leveled to 41 and have no idea what they're doing

He tanked against maxed out members of both Horror and Magnum (mostly Magnum), the two biggest rivals in PvP. These golds have the best geared rogues and mages in the game, and he was tanking for and against them. And given that tanks get 2 comboed with ease at end game, that's saying something. If you have so much skill, why don't you come to end game and prove that you are better than nasty? I am 100% sure he can out tank you at any level, and I have never seen you tank. That's how good a tank he is.

[xnorwayx]

He tanked against maxed out members of both Horror and Magnum (mostly Magnum), the two biggest rivals in PvP. These golds have the best geared rogues and mages in the game, and he was tanking for and against them. And given that tanks get 2 comboed with ease at end game, that's saying something. If you have so much skill, why don't you come to end game and prove that you are better than nasty? I am 100% sure he can out tank you at any level, and I have never seen you tank. That's how good a tank he is.

Any level you say? =) Why don't he come to 17 and kill butter. Oh, right. He can't. Gear = Gold = Nty

[Ovtlaw]

If you "farmed all of 23" repeat it and Farm all of 46, stop hiding behind Zeus and Show some skills.

Zeus has 10k hp 4K armor stat. He's my wall when I get into danger.

[Arrowz]

He tanked against maxed out members of both Horror and Magnum (mostly Magnum), the two biggest rivals in PvP. These golds have the best geared rogues and mages in the game, and he was tanking for and against them. And given that tanks get 2 comboed with ease at end game, that's saying something. If you have so much skill, why don't you come to end game and prove that you are better than nasty? I am 100% sure he can out tank you at any level, and I have never seen you tank. That's how good a tank he is.

Try tanking at 27 vs hook rogues

[Kingofninjas]

Try tanking at 27 vs hook rogues

I'm sure it would easier than at end game where I crit tanks with 3k armor for 5.5k after they have been axed. And I was using an Elon Bow at the time. It just got with new mythic bows giving an extra 80-90 dmg and some crit.

[Arrowz]

I'm sure it would easier than at end game where I crit tanks with 3k armor for 5.5k after they have been axed. And I was using an Elon Bow at the time. It just got with new mythic bows giving an extra 80-90 dmg and some crit.

Lots of skill involved in that

[Hail]

Lots of skill involved in that

Definitely! Won't get that sort of skill at lower levels.

[Hail]

However, we can both agree on that both types of PvP take skill. I just ask that twinks who can gear a toon try out clashes at end game. From the small sample population of those players that have, in my experience, have said that end game is harder to be good at and is less forgiving on mistakes.

Ofcourse they are going to say its harder.... They are not used to it.

[Ovtlaw]

Lots of skill involved in that

Yeah. Most rogue can crit me over 6k dmg. Im still staying alive and able to protect my team... That take skills n experience. Unlike tank in 17 need 4-5 combo to kill a tank. Lol

[Ovtlaw]

Ofcourse they are going to say its harder.... They are not used to it.

I play twink and 46. The only dif about it is end game gear and weapon looks a lot nicer... In pvp, If someone has noobs skill. They will b noob doesn't matter what level they play... This come from their fighting mentality....

[Arrowz]

Yeah. Most rogue can crit me over 6k dmg. Im still staying alive and able to protect my team... That take skills n experience. Unlike tank in 17 need 4-5 combo to kill a tank. Lol

U say twink tanks cant kill rogues in 1v1. Clearly ur lacking in experience

[xnorwayx]

Yeah. Most rogue can crit me over 6k dmg. Im still staying alive and able to protect my team... That take skills n experience. Unlike tank in 17 need 4-5 combo to kill a tank. Lol

Yeah most rogues can crit 17 tank over 1k. They are still staying alive and able to protect their team... That takes skill and experience.
Unlike tank in 46 need 2-3 combo to kill another tank. Lol

[Arrowz]

Yeah most rogues can crit 17 tank over 1k. They are still staying alive and able to protect their team... That takes skill and experience.
Unlike tank in 18 need 2-3 combo to kill another tank. Lol

Not to mention people dont use jugg at 17.

[Oezheasate]

Lel twinking is easy compared to endgame pvp bracket, much less noobs in endgame u can farm, be well geared and skilled or get eaten.

[Arrowz]

Lel twinking is easy compared to endgame pvp bracket, much less noobs in endgame u can farm, be well geared and skilled or get eaten.

much more undergeared players endgame, denying that is being ignorant. not to mention the fact that people rage if u attack flaggers. what a joke

[Visiting]

much more undergeared players endgame, denying that is being ignorant. not to mention the fact that people rage if u attack flaggers. what a joke

Have you been to endgame recently? Considering everything is pretty darn affordable now, you'll almost never see a nub geared player, at least in CTF, I can't really comment on TDM since I tend to stay out of there...

[Nostek]

It's funny that people compare lvl 15-17 twink clashes to their playing level saying the clashes last so long but don't really know what they are talking about or why it even lasts that long. Yet they still think it's because of the dmg difference lol

[sapdcroi]

Ovtlaw, bxne, xsolo, rvde, suspect = this line up never lost a single clash in 23....
dude. its easy let take your team come to 17 and fight with arrow. dont talk many in forum just fight and record video who win. arrow are waiting for u. and i think him will say welcome to 17 to u. i like watching videos muahahaah

[Oezheasate]

dude. its easy let take your team come to 17 and fight with arrow. dont talk many in forum just fight and record video who win. arrow are waiting for u. and i think him will say welcome to 17 to u. i like watching videos muahahaah

Lol why doesn't arrowz come to 46 then? There are lots of people who wanna show him how PvP at endgame really ticks instead of the stuff he keeps inventing. Mostly under geared noobs at endgame? Lol. It's expensive af to make a twink just to clash with arrow btw

[xnorwayx]

Lol why doesn't arrowz come to 46 then? There are lots of people who wanna show him how PvP at endgame really ticks instead of the stuff he keeps inventing. Mostly under geared noobs at endgame? Lol. It's expensive af to make a twink just to clash with arrow btw

Bro, have to disagree with you. You know me, we have played together alot. U also know that I wasn't competable at endgame pvp. I used 3m on my 13 rogue. Now I'm one of top rogues of my guild. Twinking costs not as much as endgame to be competable.

[Farminer's]

Alright I have some stuff to say, I agree endgame is costly and expensive but most end gamers farm under geared players just like y'all go for my under gear tank who (takes 5-10 combos) to get to 10% in 1v1. Now anyone that can make a tank match my gear and come 15 tank beat me in a 1v1 I will say has skills but if you don't you do not have skills, doesn't have to be pro gear just has to match.

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk

[Xdumbx]

much more undergeared players endgame, denying that is being ignorant. not to mention the fact that people rage if u attack flaggers. what a joke
From my experience, endgame pvpers are a lot more chill (although I have seen people endgame with no chill). The difference between twink lvls and endgame is: Twink lvls a little more drama, you have to manage your mana a lot more, and endgame you dont have nearly as much reaction time. They both require skill, just different types of skill :).

[Kingofninjas]

From my experience, endgame pvpers are a lot more chill (although I have seen people endgame with no chill). The difference between twink lvls and endgame is: Twink lvls a little more drama, you have to manage your mana a lot more, and endgame you dont have nearly as much reaction time. They both require skill, just different types of skill :).

For rogues, mana management is a huge part of playing random games. In clashes, if i amgoing to 3 skill (which I usually don't get to do cough*Zeus*cough), I let the Rogue (s) know so they can play accordingly.

[Seoratrek]

Closing this up. Please remember to keep the discussion civil and avoid sweeping generalizations of each other. Thanks! :)