A Suggestion For Future Updates..

[Zeus]

Hello,

While we all know there are several mixed feelings about the latest update, that is not what this thread is about. I am just interested in hoping that it does not happen again. So, with new gear and weapon releases, I suggest STG give comparison threads BEFORE the item is released. This way, there won't be people who are jaded on how the weapon turned out. The only angry people will be those that decided to gamble with their weapon and sell it before the stats were posted.

Item Comparison Guidelines:
The item comparisons should include the following:

- Detailed explanation of the mechanics of proc for each weapon/gear
- Skill damage comparison of weapon/gear of old weapon/gear vs. new weapon/gear
- Picture of the stats of the new weapon itself.
- Preview of the weapon equipped with stats shown (because DPS figures do not tell the full story).

If this is done, there will not be surprises and people will also be more likely to give level-headed feedback because they will not be playing with their bank accounts. A good majority of these posts come after people spent platinum looting the weapons only to find out that they are not that great. I am not placing the blame on anyone, but I suggest that we work together to bridge this communication issue.

Yes, this does mean that the act of a surprise will be minimal but isn't that better than having to deal with many angry customers?



Thoughts? Suggestions?

[Zeus]

For people nott using forums it will be a surprise.

True, but word is usually spread through third party communication apps, guildchat, or MOTD.

[mesalin]

I would like to have test server before adding to game new weapons. So we can see how its works, we can test it and check also our stats , skill damage and everything what we need before buying. Let's say server will stay open for 7 days. During that time each class get free weapon to test and then post feedback in forum. By this way sts can 'control' items before they will be added to game. Also by collecting feedback they can change stats , proc of weapons and remove bugs ( if they are)
What ya think?

<Forgiveness>

[Zeus]

I would like to have test server before adding to game new weapons. So we can see how its works, we can test it and check also our stats , skill damage and everything what we need before buying. Let's say server will stay open for 7 days. During that time each class get free weapon to test and then post feedback in forum. By this way sts can 'control' items before they will be added to game. Also by collecting feedback they can change stats , proc of weapons and remove bugs ( if they are)
What ya think?

<Forgiveness>

That would be cool, but I think iOS users would be left out of this, correct? That was a big issue before.

[Remiem]

I would like to have test server before adding to game new weapons. So we can see how its works, we can test it and check also our stats , skill damage and everything what we need before buying. Let's say server will stay open for 7 days. During that time each class get free weapon to test and then post feedback in forum. By this way sts can 'control' items before they will be added to game. Also by collecting feedback they can change stats , proc of weapons and remove bugs ( if they are)
What ya think?

<Forgiveness>

This is a great idea, but also very difficult for STS to do every time we make an update. A test server requires quite a lot of time and effort to duplicate the entire server, grant the new item(s), communicate how to access the test server, observe and moderate the new server, and then cleaning it all up when the test period ends. And, with so many variables in a test server (example: the impact of everyone in a party having an arcane weapon), it's not even a guarantee that we'll catch everything we there is to catch before something is released into the wild. Remember, we're humans too!

What we can commit to, and always have, is to listen closely to the community and do our best to take actions that benefit both you--the players--and the overall health and stability of the game. And, to do so in a timely manner. It's always great when we get something right the first time, but in the instances where there is room for improvement, we will always do our best to do what's best for you guys. :)

Thanks!

[Remiem]

Zeus, as for your suggestion, it is indeed a good one. We released the stats and detailed procs of the new Arcane weapons in the Wednesday update this week to solicit community feedback early for very similar reasons that you listed above. :) Unfortunately, it would be difficult to do a FULL comparison because there is such a diversity of builds, gear loadouts, etc. that even in our best attempts to capture the "majority" of Arlor in our comparisons, it just wouldn't catch everyone.

Our QA team does test the new weapons with different tiers of gear and in different levels of content difficulty to be as thorough as possible. But, as above, when there is room for improvement after and item's release we will always listen, iterate, and adjust as is appropriate for the game and gear progression.

Thank you guys all for the great suggestions. You're truly an asset to the game and the community.

[Zeus]

Zeus, as for your suggestion, it is indeed a good one. We released the stats and detailed procs of the new Arcane weapons in the Wednesday update this week to solicit community feedback early for very similar reasons that you listed above. :) Unfortunately, it would be difficult to do a FULL comparison because there is such a diversity of builds, gear loadouts, etc. that even in our best attempts to capture the "majority" of Arlor in our comparisons, it just wouldn't catch everyone.

Our QA team does test the new weapons with different tiers of gear and in different levels of content difficulty to be as thorough as possible. But, as above, when there is room for improvement after and item's release we will always listen, iterate, and adjust as is appropriate for the game and gear progression.

Thank you guys all for the great suggestions. You're truly an asset to the game and the community.

True, but if you compare to the previous best, the damage differences should be enough to indicate which one to get, correct? If not, that's okay. Thank you for taking our input into account!

[Kakashis]

Zeus, as for your suggestion, it is indeed a good one. We released the stats and detailed procs of the new Arcane weapons in the Wednesday update this week to solicit community feedback early for very similar reasons that you listed above. :) Unfortunately, it would be difficult to do a FULL comparison because there is such a diversity of builds, gear loadouts, etc. that even in our best attempts to capture the "majority" of Arlor in our comparisons, it just wouldn't catch everyone.

Our QA team does test the new weapons with different tiers of gear and in different levels of content difficulty to be as thorough as possible. But, as above, when there is room for improvement after and item's release we will always listen, iterate, and adjust as is appropriate for the game and gear progression.

Thank you guys all for the great suggestions. You're truly an asset to the game and the community.

Thank you Remiem for addressing the issue. Perhaps in the future if new items were to be implemented, we could have a ghost trial for a day or two, by which afterwards the item would disappear from our accounts. This would give everyone a chance to actually try out the weapon and see all the stats, get a chance to post results, before making any hard decisions whether or not to actually spend money trying to loot them!

[Mouly]

What about granting para_digm the new stuff to try out on his stream as the update goes live? That way we get to study the new items in action, furthermore STS doesn't have to deal with test servers and all that hassle.

[Remiem]

What about granting para_digm the new stuff to try out on his stream as the update goes live? That way we get to study the new items in action, furthermore STS doesn't have to deal with test servers and all that hassle.


This is actually quite feasible, and something we've considered with things like new pets (he also had Arcane Deary first). We couldn't guarantee that every item would be available early enough to tease in advance, but certainly worth trying for at least the big releases. Great idea Mouly. Thanks!

[Dragoonclaws]

Well I guess Para_Digm is going to have some great fun trying out everything xD

[mesalin]

This is a great idea, but also very difficult for STS to do every time we make an update. A test server requires quite a lot of time and effort to duplicate the entire server, grant the new item(s), communicate how to access the test server, observe and moderate the new server, and then cleaning it all up when the test period ends. And, with so many variables in a test server (example: the impact of everyone in a party having an arcane weapon), it's not even a guarantee that we'll catch everything we there is to catch before something is released into the wild. Remember, we're humans too!

What we can commit to, and always have, is to listen closely to the community and do our best to take actions that benefit both you--the players--and the overall health and stability of the game. And, to do so in a timely manner. It's always great when we get something right the first time, but in the instances where there is room for improvement, we will always do our best to do what's best for you guys. :)

Thanks!

Oh yeah. There will be little problem with test server. I know it's hard to make, just got idea :)
Anyway Thank you Remi for listen our feedback, and thanks for info about buff daggers. Hope they will be arcane now hahaha
Again Thank you Remi and STG
Good luck with testing!

<Forgiveness>

[Upperbound]

Sts dont u see what happening??? These rich people just bought all the arcane daggers for low price like 4-5m they was today. Now they crying for buff and if u buff it they will merch sell them for doubled price!
So the relatevely poor people who spend gold and plat to loot arcanes and then sold it being disappointed with stats will still lose gold but rich people who can merch buy all the arcanes will even richer.

For me dagger stats is ok, come one it is daggers - DPS weapon. They should not have more damage than bow, look at old arcane daggers, its OP for their level and have high DPS, not damage!

[mesalin]

Sts dont u see what happening??? These rich people just bought all the arcane daggers for low price like 4-5m they was today. Now they crying for buff and if u buff it they will merch sell them for doubled price!
So the relatevely poor people who spend gold and plat to loot arcanes and then sold it being disappointed with stats will still lose gold but rich people who can merch buy all the arcanes will even richer.

For me dagger stats is ok, come one it is daggers - DPS weapon. They should not have more damage than bow, look at old arcane daggers, its OP for their level and have high DPS, not damage!

Let me explain to you few things.
Arcane daggers were like mythic not arcane. Compare them with pervious daggers seems bad, to this new. I didn't got tons of daggers. I just got one from friend for test. He decided to sell so i bought it, and won't sell.
we don't cry. They needed buff anyway. Dude its arcane weapon. Daggers are not only DPS. I know few types of daggers that are DMG. Yes DMG. The legendary daggers ( fire effect ) lvl 30-31 adding more DMG than some bows there. Nice right?
Try to compare clean mythic bow(31) and arcane daggers from old expansions (26).


<Forgiveness>

[Tatman]

My suggestions:

1. Test all new stuff BEFORE you release it. Gear, pets, maps, what have you. Check, double check, triple check all the most important details - for example in this case: weapon damage, weapon skill damage, proc usefulness, proc rate etc. Compare those details with other gear/pets/whatever - in this case with the recently released myth weapons. Test new stuff in actual game environment - do some runs, check the times, pay attention to how the proc works and how often it occurs, play some pvp and so on and so forth.

2. Do long-term planning. Examples follow. When substituting a system in this game with another system, plan accordingly in order to make sure the new system is an upgrade and not a downgrade (e.g. jewels vs gems). When releasing a new weapon, plan ahead - have at least some idea when the next few weapon releases will be, what the next few weapon releases will be, how they will compare to your most recent and/or most powerful weapon etc. etc. Make sure you don't release both complete disappointments (e.g. glintstone set) and totally overpowered stuff that will be hard to replace in the future (e.g. arcane ring). Release stuff periodically and in the right times (e.g. don't release arcane weapons a couple months after same level/same type mythic weapons and a couple months before a 10-level-jump new cap).

I can add many other things, but I'm pretty sure it's not worth bothering. Those two I deem important enough to share though.

[Upperbound]

Let me explain to you few things.
Arcane daggers were like mythic not arcane. Compare them with pervious daggers seems bad, to this new. I didn't got tons of daggers. I just got one from friend for test. He decided to sell so i bought it, and won't sell.
we don't cry. They needed buff anyway. Dude its arcane weapon. Daggers are not only DPS. I know few types of daggers that are DMG. Yes DMG. The legendary daggers ( fire effect ) lvl 30-31 adding more DMG than some bows there. Nice right?
Try to compare clean mythic bow(31) and arcane daggers from old expansions (26).
<Forgiveness>

Compare 41 daggers (ghoulish) and 41 bows (elo/frost): -50/+200 damage/dps diff. Dont try to fool me, i have endgame rogue and i monitor market: the fact is - there is no single arcane dagger in CS now, despite those one with para. Merchs are waiting for buff. And if it will be buffed then expect 7-10m for daggers. And if it will be buffed then it will be evidence that game balance is controlled by a small group of well known forum people which sts call "community" lol and which are well known rich people as well (remember zeus video with 100m gold on each three chars?).

I can agree that new daggers could have SAME damage as glinstone bows, now they are 35 dmg less, but NOT higher damage.

[Upperbound]

My suggestions:

1. Test all new stuff BEFORE you release it.

2. Do long-term planning. Examples follow.

I can add many other things, but I'm pretty sure it's not worth bothering. Those two I deem important enough to share though.

Bro, what r u talking about?! Just put sns in massive locks and get profit, lol!

[mesalin]

Compare 41 daggers (ghoulish) and 41 bows (elo/frost): -50/+200 damage/dps diff. Dont try to fool me, i have endgame rogue and i monitor market: the fact is - there is no single arcane dagger in CS now, despite those one with para. Merchs are waiting for buff. And if it will be buffed then expect 7-10m for daggers. And if it will be buffed then it will be evidence that game balance is controlled by a small group of well known forum people which sts call "community" lol and which are well known rich people as well (remember zeus video with 100m gold on each three chars?).

I can agree that new daggers could have SAME damage as glinstone bows, now they are 35 dmg less, but NOT higher damage.

Nobody try fool ya here. And i have rogue too.
By the way why do you compare mythic daggers to mythic bow , while we got now arcane daggers and mythic bow?. Other story mate.
STG decide what's right here and community just help them. Are you mad for STS then?
BTW i didn't watched Video where Zeus have 99m or more. I play for fun, i watch rarely video in YouTube about game. Even if i go to watch then some fresh that my friend made.
Oh so you think community is rich? You'll be surprised how many players here isn't maxed out or even can't be.

[Killian229]

Main problem:
Not enough first hand testing.a developer I believe should play their game just as much as we do(not I until they can do math properly). Just testing something on a few baddies or few rounds pvp isn't going to give much info on incoming items.

if things were properly tested,this game should be better.I HATE the fact that they need to sell plat and things alike to make their money.that influences the outcome/detailed work that we end up with.CHARGE FOR YOUR NEXT GAME,NO MORE PLATINUM!

Paid test server(small charge to upkeep the server,trusted people only.obv).this would make your game better,without a doubt.

Or am I wrong here?

[tomsawer]

True, but word is usually spread through third party communication apps, guildchat, or MOTD.
I agree word of mouth is very powerful .

[ilhanna]

This is actually quite feasible, and something we've considered with things like new pets (he also had Arcane Deary first). We couldn't guarantee that every item would be available early enough to tease in advance, but certainly worth trying for at least the big releases. Great idea Mouly. Thanks!

Letting Paradigm test drive a gear or pet is a great idea. It would be a good idea as well to have hom show stat and skills dmg differences as he equips different gears. Also...would be ideal if he has a mage and warrior testing toons as well. But in any case, just make sure his videos are available for those who cannot stay up for his streams, and appended to the corresponding pet/gear's pre-launch introductory post.