Survival Tips for Rouges

[Kaziscate]

As a mage, we are weaker than rouges still (health and armor wise),but we manage to survive better than rouges and why is that? Now the obvious answer might be arcane shield, but I've been crafty enough to complete half of Elite Misty Grotto with no Lifegiver nor Shield. The secret to surviving as a mage is that they keep their distance from enemies. We mainly achieve this through Time Shift because it can root enemies, but rouges kinda have their own version of Time Shift as well. This skill is Entangling Trap. While it may not have the rooting capabilities of Time Shift, it can snare enemies, which hinders enemies' movements. What I usually do with Time Shift is that I plant it down then step back and pick off the enemies so you can use this technique as well for Entangling Trap. This may be a bit harder to do since the trigger radius for Entangling Trap is a bit minuscule and the enemies slowly move towards you and might be able to escape your entangling trap so you gotta keep moving. You can also use pets like crawly to root enemies for you to make your job as a ninja assassin of doom a bit easier. My second tip for keeping your distance between you and your enemy is to stun as much as possible (use pets). While your enemies are running like snails in your Entangling Trap, try stunning them as much as possible to make it less likely for them to get to you. Now some enemies are immune to your stunning capabilities (unless you got panic) so you will need to execute those enemies first as soon as possible or they will eventually be the cause of your death (don't worry mages have to deal with that too). Anyways those are the tips that I have for rouges and I hope this helps make you guys survive a lot longer. :)

Please note that these are just tips/suggestions so you don't have to try this out if you don't want to.

[Zynzyn]

As a mage, we are weaker than rouges still (health and armor wise),but we manage to survive better than rouges and why is that? Now the obvious answer might be arcane shield, but I've been crafty enough to complete half of Elite Misty Grotto with no Lifegiver nor Shield. The secret to surviving as a mage is that they keep their distance from enemies. We mainly achieve this through Time Shift because it can root enemies, but rouges have their own version of Time Shift as well. This skill is Entangling Trap. While it may not have the rooting capabilities of Time Shift, it can snare enemies, which greatly hinders enemies' movements. What I usually do with Time Shift is that I plant it down then step back and pick off the enemies so you can use this technique as well for Entangling Trap. This may be a bit harder to do since the enemies slowly move towards you and might be able to escape your entangling trap. You can also use pets like crawly to root enemies for you to make your job as a ninja assassin of doom a bit easier. My second tip for keeping your distance between you and your enemy is to stun as much as possible. While your enemies are running like snails in your Entangling Trap, try stunning them as much as possible to make it less likely for them to get to you. Now some enemies are immune to your stunning capabilities (unless you got panic) so you will need to execute those enemies first as soon as possible or they will eventually be the cause of your death (don't worry mages have to deal with that too). Anyways those are the tips that I have for rouges and I hope this helps make you guys survive a lot longer. :)

Glad to know mages are now strong enough to complete half of Elite Misty Grotto with no Lifegiver and Shield. STS has done a very good job with the sorcerer class and it has turned out well. Grats about that.

As for you comparing entangling trap's snare with timeshift's root and stating how they can be used in a similar manner with the same effect, I would beg to disagree. Snare and Root work differently, root being more effective in immobilizing mobs. Traps cannot work like clocks, unless sts decides to upgrade Traps with a striking ROOT ability. But that would mean that rogues would now be expected to crowd control rather than deal damage? Something odd about that.

If rogues were supposed to deal damage, they need to stay on their feet and deal damage. For mages to stun and slow, FIREBALL and ICE skills work wonders. What do rogues have for stuns? Stunning and keeping enemies at bay requires shooting charged basic attack arrows and stun-procing blades. Now may I ask, if rogues were to be busy doing this to stun/immobilize mobs in order to stay alive, who will deal damage in order to clear up the mobs fast? Warriors?

[Schnitzel]

Glad to know mages are now strong enough to complete half of Elite Misty Grotto with no Lifegiver and Shield. STS has done a very good job with the sorcerer class and it has turned out well. Grats about that.

As for you comparing entangling trap's snare with timeshift's root and stating how they can be used in a similar manner with the same effect, I would beg to disagree. Snare and Root work differently, root being more effective in immobilizing mobs. Traps cannot work like clocks, unless sts decides to upgrade Traps with a striking ROOT ability. But that would mean that rogues would now be expected to crowd control rather than deal damage? Something odd about that.

If rogues were supposed to deal damage, they need to stay on their feet and deal damage. For mages to stun and slow, FIREBALL and ICE skills work wonders. What do rogues have for stuns? Stunning and keeping enemies at bay requires shooting charged basic attack arrows and stun-procing blades. Now may I ask, if rogues were to be busy doing this to stun/immobilize mobs in order to stay alive, who will deal damage in order to clear up the mobs fast? Warriors?

I'm just a PvE engame mage, even with shield, I die near the entrance of elite misty grotto lol

And I may be the only one who think the nerf was a good idea ("oh he gave his opinion, lets hate him for it!" lol, just a game; chill)

I don't know how by how much the rogue armor stat was nerfed, but in my opinion, it allows for a need for warriors in maps, (a while back, we used to see a lot of pure-rogue (or mostly rogue, and maybe 1 mage) parties, warriors had a difficult time trying to find parties for runs), from my perspective, it seemed the rogues could be both a damage dealer and a tank.

By decreasing the armor stat, warriors are now needed for helping keep the damage targetted away from the squishy rogues and mages.



now I'm going to restate this one part:
This is just my opinion
no hate please.
I'm not posting to debate, I'm just posting to give my opinion.

[Kaziscate]

Glad to know mages are now strong enough to complete half of Elite Misty Grotto with no Lifegiver and Shield. STS has done a very good job with the sorcerer class and it has turned out well. Grats about that.

As for you comparing entangling trap's snare with timeshift's root and stating how they can be used in a similar manner with the same effect, I would beg to disagree. Snare and Root work differently, root being more effective in immobilizing mobs. Traps cannot work like clocks, unless sts decides to upgrade Traps with a striking ROOT ability. But that would mean that rogues would now be expected to crowd control rather than deal damage? Something odd about that.

If rogues were supposed to deal damage, they need to stay on their feet and deal damage. For mages to stun and slow, FIREBALL and ICE skills work wonders. What do rogues have for stuns? Stunning and keeping enemies at bay requires shooting charged basic attack arrows and stun-procing blades. Now may I ask, if rogues were to be busy doing this to stun/immobilize mobs in order to stay alive, who will deal damage in order to clear up the mobs fast? Warriors?

I'm not trying to say to make rouges into mages. My general tip is to just make it so that enemies are a far away distance from rouges and pets can be used to stun enemies. Also, you can still be able to use your high damage skills to dispose enemies quickly.

[Tapash Bose]

I'm just a PvE engame mage, even with shield, I die near the entrance of elite misty grotto lol

And I may be the only one who think the nerf was a good idea ("oh he gave his opinion, lets hate him for it!" lol, just a game; chill)

I don't know how by how much the rogue armor stat was nerfed, but in my opinion, it allows for a need for warriors in maps, (a while back, we used to see a lot of pure-rogue (or mostly rogue, and maybe 1 mage) parties, warriors had a difficult time trying to find parties for runs), from my perspective, it seemed the rogues could be both a damage dealer and a tank.

By decreasing the armor stat, warriors are now needed for helping keep the damage targetted away from the squishy rogues and mages.



now I'm going to restate this one part:
This is just my opinion
no hate please.
I'm not posting to debate, I'm just posting to give my opinion.

OOh noo..:)..Warriors now have 10k plus hp,3-3.5K armor and over 800 dmg...they are no more interested in tanking loool...so forget about the idea of Warrior protecting you :D

[soon]

Mage has more damage than rogue. All mage skills to attack make the most of the enemy stop attacking you,
hit more than one enemy. The main skills of rogue hit a single target. The use of mana pot is much smaller for you too.

Before or after rogue are bad to deal with crowds, I have always preferred mage and warrios the party. The only place where it was nice to have rogues was in planar arena. Why this is a place only to kill boss.

It reminds of when I played lv 41. Staying in a party of rogues meant to die several times.

[soon]

I'm just a PvE engame mage, even with shield, I die near the entrance of elite misty grotto lol

And I may be the only one who think the nerf was a good idea ("oh he gave his opinion, lets hate him for it!" lol, just a game; chill)

I don't know how by how much the rogue armor stat was nerfed, but in my opinion, it allows for a need for warriors in maps, (a while back, we used to see a lot of pure-rogue (or mostly rogue, and maybe 1 mage) parties, warriors had a difficult time trying to find parties for runs), from my perspective, it seemed the rogues could be both a damage dealer and a tank.

By decreasing the armor stat, warriors are now needed for helping keep the damage targetted away from the squishy rogues and mages.



now I'm going to restate this one part:
This is just my opinion
no hate please.
I'm not posting to debate, I'm just posting to give my opinion.

I always prefer to have warriors in the party. I played a lot with rogue. My point of view, be a rogue tank means getting tight the Q key almost endlessly hoping not take more than an attack and take time to heal. One run and 200 pots of mana and healt.

[Gerran]

As a mage, we are weaker than rouges still (health and armor wise),but we manage to survive better than rouges and why is that? Now the obvious answer might be arcane shield, but I've been crafty enough to complete half of Elite Misty Grotto with no Lifegiver nor Shield. The secret to surviving as a mage is that they keep their distance from enemies. We mainly achieve this through Time Shift because it can root enemies, but rouges have their own version of Time Shift as well. This skill is Entangling Trap. While it may not have the rooting capabilities of Time Shift, it can snare enemies, which greatly hinders enemies' movements. What I usually do with Time Shift is that I plant it down then step back and pick off the enemies so you can use this technique as well for Entangling Trap. This may be a bit harder to do since the enemies slowly move towards you and might be able to escape your entangling trap. You can also use pets like crawly to root enemies for you to make your job as a ninja assassin of doom a bit easier. My second tip for keeping your distance between you and your enemy is to stun as much as possible. While your enemies are running like snails in your Entangling Trap, try stunning them as much as possible to make it less likely for them to get to you. Now some enemies are immune to your stunning capabilities (unless you got panic) so you will need to execute those enemies first as soon as possible or they will eventually be the cause of your death (don't worry mages have to deal with that too). Anyways those are the tips that I have for rouges and I hope this helps make you guys survive a lot longer. :)

I am a rouge, I have done that many times back before when we still have fair armor, time shift is too OP to compare to entangling, its not gonna work that way because rouge skills specialize on a single target while mage is best on crowd control.. But I appreciate your effort :)

[greekAL]

dont forget rogues ar dmg dealers at single targets and sp is one of those dmg skills they need with tht armor is 50/50 to survive a sp thts my opinion btw!!!mages have tons of skills for crowd control at mage if u chain correct u can keep mobs stunned/freeze/snare for ever!!!rogues arent made for tht at all!

[Hulkystash]

I have a tip... stay behind a war like rogues were suppose too. Going head on and taking that much dmg for a rogue didnt seem right.

[bonjovi3223]

OOh noo..:)..Warriors now have 10k plus hp,3-3.5K armor and over 800 dmg...they are no more interested in tanking loool...so forget about the idea of Warrior protecting you :D
Exactly HOW MANY warriors have you seen with those stats??????

[Rosybuds]

I'm not trying to say to make rouges into mages. My general tip is to just make it so that enemies are a far away distance from rouges and pets can be used to stun enemies. Also, you can still be able to use your high damage skills to dispose enemies quickly. This was on a other page I copied and pasted as this will answer you point on Rogues are being Far away ...... Its is meant inno way an offence too your self I just Believe this must took into consideratition Also Hopefully it will be read by A Dev Also as its a must .....

Must say I was pretty shocked at this As a dagger user and always have been I consider myself a Tank Rogue as we used too be know in The P/L Days so we are in the middle of the battel with the tanks especailly at bosses I
Ive seen Tanks stand back and fight off the skeltons and whatever while in In fighting Orc king What about we wont stand a chance and we are not at a distance with bows So if your are going too reduce our Armour I hope you take into consideration for the dagger players and up the stats on both Mythic and Arcane daggers or whats the point of having daggers They Are to be in the middle of the fight just like a Tank. With Our Rogues backing us up with their bows .... PLEASE I'm Asking a Dev Too READ THIS as it makes sense unless you are giving us unlimted ankhs and Pots Thank You If You Do Read This as It must be too be Took into consideration. Thank

[Eagle Eye229]

So a few days Of Rouge not being #1 undisputed in pvp and pve and there is chaos.

Now you have to play with some thought and skill and your lost.

I play most my time on mage nowadays,never have I used A shield.i don't die a lot because I learned how to play right away.Now it time for rogues to understand how the game should be and it's chaos.

So let me get this straight:

Rogue want highest critical in game.ok
Rogue wants highest damage in game.ok
Rogues want highest single damage skill.ok
Rogues want highest dodge in game. OK
Rogues want highest DPS in game.ok

Absolutely no need for you to have second highest health/armor.Anything else you want to be #1 at?

No one here knows what we have coming for AL and people already in frenzy (majority rogues ofcourse).

How do any of you know what the balance is going to be at end game?maybe you will be OK. Honestly,anyone who says rogues weren't overpowered before this fix (Yes it was a fix,gg ST) are using their rogues blinders.Lets wait to see what sts did here on the expansion before you end your life.Maybe try one of these new op characters?You are allowed to make a character other than a rogue.i promise..

Like this so far sts,can't wait to see the new client.

[soon]

So a few days Of Rouge not being #1 undisputed in pvp and pve and there is chaos.

Now you have to play with some thought and skill and your lost.

I play most my time on mage nowadays,never have I used A shield.i don't die a lot because I learned how to play right away.Now it time for rogues to understand how the game should be and it's chaos.

So let me get this straight:

Rogue want highest critical in game.ok
Rogue wants highest damage in game.ok
Rogues want highest single damage skill.ok
Rogues want highest dodge in game. OK
Rogues want highest DPS in game.ok

Absolutely no need for you to have second highest health/armor.Anything else you want to be #1 at?

No one here knows what we have coming for AL and people already in frenzy (majority rogues ofcourse).

How do any of you know what the balance is going to be at end game?maybe you will be OK. Honestly,anyone who says rogues weren't overpowered before this fix (Yes it was a fix,gg ST) are using their rogues blinders.Lets wait to see what sts did here on the expansion before you end your life.Maybe try one of these new op characters?You are allowed to make a character other than a rogue.i promise..

Like this so far sts,can't wait to see the new client.


All claims in which rogues at the end of the game were OP. I have not seen anyone say that a rogue lv 10 was strong.

On the great Health, this was because the arc ring and planar pendent, which are items lv 41. Before that does not like you use. And with the level 56 these items will not have the same damage.

I do not think they need to change rogues low level. Preferred that this nerf was made as it was released LV 56. Since new items in the game.

[tomsawer]

Imo )The future of arcane legends should simply be this. A warrior should be in almost every party (mainly elite runs) to absorb damage pull aggro and hold it. Mage for crowd control releasing maximum damage. Rogue to start killing off the strongest first.
I realize the warrior ,mage and rogue do more than I mentioned but these are the basics.
I hope with the new expansion that the new maps elite ect. Require teamwork from each class to successfully clear the map without using pots ankas or failure .
Just my opinion,if I'm wrong or feel free to add just be kind .lol

[uehi]

I have a tip... stay behind a war like rogues were suppose too. Going head on and taking that much dmg for a rogue didnt seem right.
your tip useless if rogue die 1 shot from mob. not all player in game have planar pendant not all mith gear not all full jewels. not all arcane dagers for enought hp. to survive 1 shor

[acewasabi]

So if your are going too reduce our Armour I hope you take into consideration for the dagger players and up the stats on both Mythic and Arcane daggers or whats the point of having daggers They Are to be in the middle of the fight just like a Tank. With Our Rogues backing us up with their bows .... PLEASE I'm Asking a Dev Too READ THIS as it makes sense unless you are giving us unlimted ankhs and Pots Thank You If You Do Read This as It must be too be Took into consideration. Thank

agree 100% with this post. why even have daggers if our armor is so low we can't use them. sorta makes the BRAND NEW arcane daggers useless. daggers need hefty armor stats to compensate.

[Eagle Eye229]

agree 100% with this post. why even have daggers if our armor is so low we can't use them. sorta makes the BRAND NEW arcane daggers useless. daggers need hefty armor stats to compensate.

So maybe dagger and shield for rogues.It wouldnt give as large of a boost to Damage.two daggers should not have large armor buff.WHATS THE NEED FOR A WARRIOR CLASS IF A ROGUE CAN DO EVERYTHING?Honestly tell me how this would be fair?

Daggers =dps
Bow=straight damage and range


So we might as well give rogues a heal too.Oh that's right you got one.Might as well give you best aoe skill and matchable armor/health to warriors.Anything else rogues want?

[soon]

So maybe dagger and shield for rogues.It wouldnt give as large of a boost to Damage.two daggers should not have large armor buff.WHATS THE NEED FOR A WARRIOR CLASS IF A ROGUE CAN DO EVERYTHING?Honestly tell me how this would be fair?

Daggers =dps
Bow=straight damage and range


So we might as well give rogues a heal too.Oh that's right you got one.Might as well give you best aoe skill and matchable armor/health to warriors.Anything else rogues want?


I imagine that if you buy an arcane weapon it has to be better than the others. Rogues obtained an arcane dagger, not an arcane bow. So we have to close attack to activate the proc of weapon.

Yes, I need a warrior or a mage to stop the attacks of the enemy before the nerf. Now I die more times to stay in the crowd, even with a warrior around healing me.

Do not get me wrong, I approve of the classes remain balanced. But to say that the use masteries is a solution to the nerf was something wrong.


"Deal massive damage with deadly melee"




149140

[Ticklish]

So a few days Of Rouge not being #1 undisputed in pvp and pve and there is chaos.

Now you have to play with some thought and skill and your lost.

I play most my time on mage nowadays,never have I used A shield.i don't die a lot because I learned how to play right away.Now it time for rogues to understand how the game should be and it's chaos.

So let me get this straight:

Rogue want highest critical in game.ok
Rogue wants highest damage in game.ok
Rogues want highest single damage skill.ok
Rogues want highest dodge in game. OK
Rogues want highest DPS in game.ok

Absolutely no need for you to have second highest health/armor.Anything else you want to be #1 at?

.

Highest damage? And you say you play a mage? Without 30% damage elixir, even the highest damage rogue atm cannot reach 1.1++k damage. A mage with an arcane staff and fortified mind jewels hits 1,130 damage easy. Only a handful of rogues ever reach 1k damage pure at the moment. The same cannot be said for mages.

Highest dps? See above statement.

And please let us not talk about dodge. Lol.

The rogue class is having a difficult time adjusting to this nerf because:

1. The best weapon for our class are daggers. We actually have to fight close to mobs.

"Oh just stay out of range then. Use aim nox sss and whatever".

Okay, so that renders our proc useless. Thank you.

2. Even if we invite tanks to our party, only a limited number of warriors actually do know how to TANK. Because of all the cries for increasing damage, warriors now prefer to be doing the killing, as opposed to grouping mobs properly and taunting them, as well as making sure the heal is timed for red zones, and not for just healing themselves.

3. The nerf was introduced at a time when we have no other options gear-wise. Except to buy a 20+M pet. How's that for practically making the whole rogue community NEED munch mouth to make up for a little bit of the armor we lost.

4. No class was ever nerfed as bad as rogues. It's not as if our stats were bugged and they fixed it. Nope. They just cut our armor by at least 400 without warning. We all unanimously supported buffing other classes. But now everyone else just talks us down and tells us to ADJUST.

And I have a mage, which is geared in pinks and old mythics. But it fares better now than my fully-geared, jeweled-to-the-hilt rogue. So yes, I do have some comparison, in case you want to argue about us rogues not knowing how it feels to be a mage.





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[Eagle Eye229]

Honestly if all you guys cannot stay alive maybe you need a new team to run with.proper timing of certain class skills and the mobs won't even move,let alone have anyone other than tank take significant damage.

NONE of you complaining about "well I use daggers so now I need more armor so I can stand there and hit will soaking damage." Must have played Pocket Legends at all.go back to Ao expansion of Pl. Try running a dagger birdie.i ended up with around 100k pve kills with like 8k deaths.i wasn't playing dpser correctly and you will die.There is no such thing as a rogue-tank.if your standing still trying to kill before being killed,your doing it wrong.maybe try and let your tank take the threat first have mage drop some cc on them and the rogue kills them off.Really not that hard.if you don't know how to play it isn't up to sts to pander to the less experienced rpg players.learn to adapt or quit I guess.if I'm to ponder a guess,elite maps were not really suppose to be non elixir farming areas(especially same level elite maps).Rogues have other skills than the cookie cutter builds you see everywhere.maybe use a skill that adds buffs for self/party(psst,you do have one that works well).

Gamers used to at least try before you fail.Todays gamers fail because they don't try.not just in AL but everywhere.gamers have gotten lazy and uninspired by a challenge.

[soon]

Honestly if all you guys cannot stay alive maybe you need a new team to run with.proper timing of certain class skills and the mobs won't even move,let alone have anyone other than tank take significant damage.

NONE of you complaining about "well I use daggers so now I need more armor so I can stand there and hit will soaking damage." Must have played Pocket Legends at all.go back to Ao expansion of Pl. Try running a dagger birdie.i ended up with around 100k pve kills with like 8k deaths.i wasn't playing dpser correctly and you will die.There is no such thing as a rogue-tank.if your standing still trying to kill before being killed,your doing it wrong.maybe try and let your tank take the threat first have mage drop some cc on them and the rogue kills them off.Really not that hard.if you don't know how to play it isn't up to sts to pander to the less experienced rpg players.learn to adapt or quit I guess.if I'm to ponder a guess,elite maps were not really suppose to be non elixir farming areas(especially same level elite maps).Rogues have other skills than the cookie cutter builds you see everywhere.maybe use a skill that adds buffs for self/party(psst,you do have one that works well).

Gamers used to at least try before you fail.Todays gamers fail because they don't try.not just in AL but everywhere.gamers have gotten lazy and uninspired by a challenge.


What bothered me was that from day to night they speak "will decrease your armor". Should at least have warned just before and expected LV 56, with new items more skill points to use.

Say use 10 skill points to get 10% damage reduction means I lose my current skills to enable it. And you seriously think a rogue lv 15 is that strong need to nerf.

If I think to make a nerf anything in a rogue was wrong, yes I will complain about it. Just as I complained when the warriors lost proc Aegis.

Too bad that this discussion became a battle between the classes.

[Eagle Eye229]

@ ticklish
50% plus critical coupled with 3s cd on a skill that can pump out 7k crits.Crit 2-3times that's 14-21k damage in around 10-11 seconds.So yes,you must get more health and/or armor.those numbers don't make you a rogue cause your to squishy.you should be able to take a hit or two and just pot up.Thus you will never have to worry about dieing and can own AL again.

This is a rpg meaning everyone has a ROLE.Rogues DO NOT NEED TO HAVE EVERYTHING WOW...

adapt and get better instead of trying the same old op garbage moves and instead of you 1hitting things now you get the 1hit.Think how it was for warriors before this.WE couldn't even get into a party!THATS THE ONLY PROOF NEEDED TO SHOW THAT ROGUES WERE OP.

Mages have always been best balanced leaning towards op.Also noticed you didn't mention a warrior.any comparison there from you?

But I regress because stg made the right decision here.

As far as you little comment about having a mage,when u do your comparison, is it solo or Full Team (that includes a competent tank and X?

[epicrrr]

WHAT survival tips haha, though we die so fast but i think its a good balancing move for the game.

-low level pvp bracket

[Americabud]

Fair is fair, now since that class is not so op you just need to learn how 'to "adapt and survive" -zeus'. this guy was just giving you all some tips on how you might do that. the first comment is disagreeing lol just advice from the perspective of the squishiest class. imo distance is a big part in pve and pvp. Sometimes your close, sometimes you need to run away and keep your distance as a mage (no matter how far you run rouge comes speeding straight to you to deal damage but ya gotta keep running, warriors drag you back to them with axe throw, gotta keep moving) 1500 armour is not lax, being a mage in pvp/pve and your always on the brink of death! that shield has a cooldown and might not last the full duration if it takes too much damage(its just a crutch our Armour is broken so we use a crutch to defend). rouges stiil have the second highest armour in the game maybe take some more tips/advice or try to figure out for yourselves different ways you might play differently to be effective in pvp and pve. its a big change sure but its not the end of the rouges! at least dont just play and say well this is different i cant play like this, come and tell them to change it back, you should play to find out the best possible way for rouge to pve/pvp (might be different) i know alot of you guys didnt try that because the same day of the nerf and second day alot of people were on forums, thats not enough time to truly find a way to play with that armour reduction, thats only enough time to play, figure out the gameplay for rouge is different, and decide you rather the old rouge gameplay. all im saying is give it a shot, not a few days!

[uehi]

this thread about tips where they:)? not see nothing:? we talking about balans:? or tips survive:? i play rogue if somewone have any good tip for survive pls share it :)

[uehi]

Funy tip is not start map first let die other players and keep them agro xd dnt deal moch dmg xd let deal mage warior ;) then mob not hit you xd dnt use skill try only focus only aimed mob only one mob hit xd only 1 can hit you xd dnt run to far away from batle if you run to far all mob from area hunting you xd omg my english rly low xd

[uehi]

and my best tip for pvp dnt in pvp map;) alrdy rogue to weak;) cnt run cnt hide ;) its time to be silence and quit pvp ;) my tip you can survive in town...:)

[crudmudgeon]

Glad to know mages are now strong enough to complete half of Elite Misty Grotto with no Lifegiver and Shield. STS has done a very good job with the sorcerer class and it has turned out well. Grats about that.

As for you comparing entangling trap's snare with timeshift's root and stating how they can be used in a similar manner with the same effect, I would beg to disagree. Snare and Root work differently, root being more effective in immobilizing mobs. Traps cannot work like clocks, unless sts decides to upgrade Traps with a striking ROOT ability. But that would mean that rogues would now be expected to crowd control rather than deal damage? Something odd about that.

If rogues were supposed to deal damage, they need to stay on their feet and deal damage. For mages to stun and slow, FIREBALL and ICE skills work wonders. What do rogues have for stuns? Stunning and keeping enemies at bay requires shooting charged basic attack arrows and stun-procing blades. Now may I ask, if rogues were to be busy doing this to stun/immobilize mobs in order to stay alive, who will deal damage in order to clear up the mobs fast? Warriors?
... other classes don't need rogues to do all the damage. Get off your arse, heal yourself, help crowd control, AND QUIT CRYING

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[crudmudgeon]

dont forget rogues ar dmg dealers at single targets and sp is one of those dmg skills they need with tht armor is 50/50 to survive a sp thts my opinion btw!!!mages have tons of skills for crowd control at mage if u chain correct u can keep mobs stunned/freeze/snare for ever!!!rogues arent made for tht at all!
Nox ss and pierce all hit multiple targets. Its not below rogues to help crowd control with traps and throw some packs down in case of emergency where mage is waiting for heal cooldown.

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[crudmudgeon]

your tip useless if rogue die 1 shot from mob. not all player in game have planar pendant not all mith gear not all full jewels. not all arcane dagers for enought hp. to survive 1 shor
Don't play content you are not geared for.

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[ilhanna]

... other classes don't need rogues to do all the damage. Get off your arse, heal yourself, help crowd control, AND QUIT CRYING

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1. I thought we have learned the mistake of excluding one class from pve runs last season. Are you suggesting a repeat?
2. True pve rogue will never ask for healing. If a warrior fails to heal the party then he fails at tanking. If a mage uses heal in pve no wonder he needs help controlling the crowd.
3. This kind of hostility is totally uncalled for. Even Remiem didn't tell people to shut up.

[uehi]

Don't play content you are not geared for.

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so if player is not full gem not have arc dagers and arc pet he cnt farm elite ;) so for most of players is regular map and km3....;) ok thx ;)

[Ardbeg]

Imho, a full team of all classes should be needed to complete an elite map without spending tons of ankhs. The gear should basically determine the time to run the maps when the party is properly set up. I still recommend breeze to ease mobs. And i think it is too early to judge the changes, we need to watch the party mechanics with new gear at level 56. And here is another wild idea: run with friends you have fun with, enjoy the challenge no matter how long it takes. you are not at work here.

[uehi]

okk where is tip for survive xD

[ilhanna]

okk where is tip for survive xD

Some ideas, you probably know them already, and have practiced them:
1. Always use effigy buff on elite runs
2. Some pets like Stanlee and Swift have armor buff as happy bonus. Swift's AA can help with crowd control (since, chances are you won't have enough skills points to spend on trap) and Stanlee's gives dmg buff to the whole party
3. Blinky's AA drops enemy dmg by 40%. Time it well, it's a lifesaver
4. If you're using daggers use veil as support skill. Just spend point on armor buff and duration upgrades.
5. If you have it, time your razor shield well (for when Nekro's shield expires and warrior's heal on cooldown, when you have to move in close to pick out a target, etc).
6. If you don't trust your armor to sustain you when you pierce into a crowd of mobs, consider getting Shadow Storm Shot as your third attack skills in lieu of Shadow Piercer. Now that it's fixed, it's amazing.
7. Some of the warrior skills masteries can potentially help keep rogues safe in risky situations. My warrior friends and I have been testing them. They are more knowledgeable about it, but as far as our testings went, heal mastery helps buff armor to party, and windmill mastery's extra targets gives the skill extra taunt. When I ran with them I hardly needed support skills (razor, veil) because they really hold the mobs under tight taunt control, I could even slip in the middle of the crowd (for example to kill the Rengol shaman) and not be hurt at all. Consider discussing with your go-to warrior friends how their skills can best help the party. After all, dying and dead rogues slow down runs.

I'm sorry I can't share any tips for pvp as I'm not familiar with it. Hope these help.

[Fightbeast]

For those saying we rouges haven't checked how the new armor lvl works out for us, trust us we have. Ran numerous maps and tactics to see possible solution for survival and the only viable ones that were evident was spamming of thousands of pots everyday. And there are still chances you may die so one ankh kit a day too.
It is practically impossible for rouges to solo the elite rengols (which I used to everyday) without regretting having done the runs.
STS took a wrong decision here. Instead of buffing mages armor they proceeded to nerf the rouges armor and I think this impact was felt at both the capped and twink brackets with twinks suffering the most.
Each season we cross, we hope to become better then before but this time we rouges are back to where we started before expansion.
I ask the devs to run PvE and PvP maps before taking such a decision.
I am all for class balance and have always spoken for warriors and mages buff since I play those classes too and have seen their problems.
Right now both the mages and warrior classes are speaking against the rouges and think it was right of sts to nerf us. If that is the case and you guys hate rouges so much, I think you guys are better off running with mage and war parties only. Rouges can make their own pt's and run maps. We have accepted the cost of running the maps as rouges.

[eugene9707]

For those saying we rouges haven't checked how the new armor lvl works out for us, trust us we have. Ran numerous maps and tactics to see possible solution for survival and the only viable ones that were evident was spamming of thousands of pots everyday. And there are still chances you may die so one ankh kit a day too.
It is practically impossible for rouges to solo the elite rengols (which I used to everyday) without regretting having done the runs.
STS took a wrong decision here. Instead of buffing mages armor they proceeded to nerf the rouges armor and I think this impact was felt at both the capped and twink brackets with twinks suffering the most.
Each season we cross, we hope to become better then before but this time we rouges are back to where we started before expansion.
I ask the devs to run PvE and PvP maps before taking such a decision.
I am all for class balance and have always spoken for warriors and mages buff since I play those classes too and have seen their problems.
Right now both the mages and warrior classes are speaking against the rouges and think it was right of sts to nerf us. If that is the case and you guys hate rouges so much, I think you guys are better off running with mage and war parties only. Rouges can make their own pt's and run maps. We have accepted the cost of running the maps as rouges.

Imo, the nerf is to hinder the ability of rogue to solo end game elites. Just like how mages and warriors have an hard time to solo them.

[Fightbeast]

Imo, the nerf is to hinder the ability of rogue to solo end game elites. Just like how mages and warriors have an hard time to solo them.
Well isn't that then a problem itself!? Why in a game can't a class properly solo a map? Shouldnt a warrior, mage or rouge be able to do a map solo if they wished?

[eugene9707]

Well isn't that then a problem itself!? Why in a game can't a class properly solo a map? Shouldnt a warrior, mage or rouge be able to do a map solo if they wished?

they are anti-loner, the likes of us lol

[Ardbeg]

Some ideas, you probably know them already, and have practiced them:
1. Always use effigy buff on elite runs
2. Some pets like Stanlee and Swift have armor buff as happy bonus. Swift's AA can help with crowd control (since, chances are you won't have enough skills points to spend on trap) and Stanlee's gives dmg buff to the whole party
3. Blinky's AA drops enemy dmg by 40%. Time it well, it's a lifesaver
4. If you're using daggers use veil as support skill. Just spend point on armor buff and duration upgrades.
5. If you have it, time your razor shield well (for when Nekro's shield expires and warrior's heal on cooldown, when you have to move in close to pick out a target, etc).
6. If you don't trust your armor to sustain you when you pierce into a crowd of mobs, consider getting Shadow Storm Shot as your third attack skills in lieu of Shadow Piercer. Now that it's fixed, it's amazing.
7. Some of the warrior skills masteries can potentially help keep rogues safe in risky situations. My warrior friends and I have been testing them. They are more knowledgeable about it, but as far as our testings went, heal mastery helps buff armor to party, and windmill mastery's extra targets gives the skill extra taunt. When I ran with them I hardly needed support skills (razor, veil) because they really hold the mobs under tight taunt control, I could even slip in the middle of the crowd (for example to kill the Rengol shaman) and not be hurt at all. Consider discussing with your go-to warrior friends how their skills can best help the party. After all, dying and dead rogues slow down runs.

I'm sorry I can't share any tips for pvp as I'm not familiar with it. Hope these help.


great list. from my tests so far tanks can contribute most with windmill mastery (or axe mastery if wearing glintstone set).
cs jugg wm hor with wm mastery should be a very good option to run hard elites with every gear now. and of course, aegis.

[ilhanna]

great list. from my tests so far tanks can contribute most with windmill mastery (or axe mastery if wearing glintstone set).
cs jugg wm hor with wm mastery should be a very good option to run hard elites with every gear now. and of course, aegis.

My friend Vigulfr discovered this as well, with axe throw mastery:

Axe Throw mastery at 5/10 taunts a lot. Bleed effect is nice and also adds many Aegis stacks! Got 9 "!"-marks over a mobs head throwing it first time. Seems to consistently taunt a lot. Excellent in a boss fight!...

[Vjerevica]

How about you sacrifice some dmg and compensate amour with diamond jewels? Mages do sacrifice dmg to streghten shield.

[Avaree]

In the event the below post is missed, I thought its important to share the information in it....



Just to clarify on the armor/damage reduction, as well as the damage % versus raw damage values.

Armor % bonus is not the same as a damage reduction bonus and they do indeed stack. This means you can stack the Warriors armor bonus, then shadow veil on top of that armr bonus for a % gain, and then add damage reduction on top of that and it all plays nicely together. These are the sorts of synergies we encourage players to explore and find as a part fo the rogue armor reduction, as all of these elements combining together makes a very tanky rogue indeed. In PvE the benefit of multiple classes and abilities helps everyone compensate for their shortcomings for a more unified PvE experience. PvP is a diferent monster, but everyone seems to be exploring and finding the right ways to use these new masteries to each others benefit.

Damage wise the raw values do scale as the OP stated, but damage % bonus does not stack with other damage % bonus as it will use the highest value. Raw values can be scaled by the damage % bonus for even more damage. An example of this is the Glintstone Gun proc.

Thanks Cara!

[Ardbeg]

How about you sacrifice some dmg and compensate amour with diamond jewels? Mages do sacrifice dmg to streghten shield.

You are right, every class should make hard choices imho. And lowering the stats would raise the value of not so sought after jewels, which is a good thing. That being said, be careful what you wish for. Damage also determines the amount of healing a Tank provides with HOR. You would feel the loss too, probably even more than the tank.
And it s not like the timed run leaderboard is suddenly flooded with tanks. Tanks don't multiply their damage output with crits like rogue and mages. Mages should be kings of AOE damage, but tanks should be able to taunt mobs effectively.
Again i would wait how this plays out on new maps with new gear and evaluate the optimisations for now.

Try Breeze and Kelvin again, they still rock.

[Rosybuds]

So a few days Of Rouge not being #1 undisputed in pvp and pve and there is chaos.

Now you have to play with some thought and skill and your lost.

I play most my time on mage nowadays,never have I used A shield.i don't die a lot because I learned how to play right away.Now it time for rogues to understand how the game should be and it's chaos.

So let me get this straight:

Rogue want highest critical in game.ok
Rogue wants highest damage in game.ok
Rogues want highest single damage skill.ok
Rogues want highest dodge in game. OK
Rogues want highest DPS in game.ok

Absolutely no need for you to have second highest health/armor.Anything else you want to be #1 at?

No one here knows what we have coming for AL and people already in frenzy (majority rogues ofcourse).

How do any of you know what the balance is going to be at end game?maybe you will be OK. Honestly,anyone who says rogues weren't overpowered before this fix (Yes it was a fix,gg ST) are using their rogues blinders.Lets wait to see what sts did here on the expansion before you end your life.Maybe try one of these new op characters?You are allowed to make a character other than a rogue.i promise..

Like this so far sts,can't wait to see the new client.


If thats the case whats the point of Daggers !!!!! So Rogues just get one choice of weapon Bows And Hide behind tanks No Thank you I like too be in the middle of the fight. And No just b/c I and others have daggers does not mean we can do everthing a tank can do I reguary play in a team with One Tank One mage two Rogues and We need that Tank I Can assure of that !!!! But If Im using my daggers I know I need a Damn Good Rogue Behind me with their Bow watching me & the others guys Backs thank you very much With the Tank leading the way doing his job Taking most of the hits while im in their slicing & dicing helping him & The Mage doing all his stuff too keep our butts alive, Im too busy too go right into this just now but Daggers where gave too Rogues for a Reason and it was not too stand back and Hide !! Or too be put back in our stash along with that damn Legion Set and now the L46 Mythic daggers I bought and lost 1.8million on and used for one week + L46 Mythic Set or in my case The Helm and now My Arcane Dagger while be going the same way ... Think again this time please Rationally Oh and Ive never played PVP in A/L I only Play PVE again 2 different reasons for either not touching our Armour or upping our Daggers. Thank you

[Eagle Eye229]

If thats the case whats the point of Daggers !!!!! So Rogues just get one choice of weapon Bows And Hide behind tanks No Thank you I like too be in the middle of the fight. And No just b/c I and others have daggers does not mean we can do everthing a tank can do I reguary play in a team with One Tank One mage two Rogues and We need that Tank I Can assure of that !!!! But If Im using my daggers I know I need a Damn Good Rogue Behind me with their Bow watching me & the others guys Backs thank you very much With the Tank leading the way doing his job Taking most of the hits while im in their slicing & dicing helping him & The Mage doing all his stuff too keep our butts alive, Im too busy too go right into this just now but Daggers where gave too Rogues for a Reason and it was not too stand back and Hide !! Or too be put back in our stash along with that damn Legion Set and now the L46 Mythic daggers I bought and lost 1.8million on and used for one week + L46 Mythic Set or in my case The Helm and now My Arcane Dagger while be going the same way ... Think again this time please Rationally Oh and Ive never played PVP in A/L I only Play PVE again 2 different reasons for either not touching our Armour or upping our Daggers. Thank you

So you think you have to hide now and you lost igg on dagger you didn't do research on.not sts fault.give you your armor back?what is it going to be like at 56?that's right,NONE of you rogues can even wait for the new expansion to drop.keep the armor progression the way it was and end game rogues would have been way op (more than before).

so buff your defense with jewels/skills in essence trading in this armor nerf for a damage nerf .No one forces you to used primary Stat jewels/gems.there are other socketables out there.have you tried them?have you tried every possible variations in jewels/gems/pets/play style/skills? When you do that and can bring proof that it is impossible to stay alive then maybe people will listen.At the moment,I see no one saying anything to the likewise tried using defensive jewels,I tried my other skills that are defensive oriented and I tried switch the way I play to compensate for my armor loss.

All rogues are saying is:it's impossible to match a tank now(you guys don't ever mention mage)but I haven't tried anything new.

@ EVERY ROGUE: if you wonder why this had to happen you can blame sts.You can blame them for wanting to continue their hard work on this game.NOT ONE single developer is going to stop expanding their game so twink players can think it's fair.as of tomorrow lv46 will not be end game.While sts will work on more balance,their main focus is going to be events and ultimately the next expansion.its business and it's life.

With a game that continues to add new items (with everyone wanting awesome abilities on them)it gets harder and harder to balance each class.you wonder why a lot of items are trash?Do you guys understand how tedious it is to write rules and code for all these items at various levels?Let alone please the masses with as much balance as there can be.If you can't even understand why a universal critical reduction was needed than you better go read up on rpg mechanics-specifically balancing interclass roles in pvp.

No class should be better than all others in all aspects of a game.its OK to have a class good at one thing,that in turn must make you weak to something else.

This is how "balance" is going to look:

X>Y
Y>Z
Z>B
B>A
A>N

Each representing a different build/character or both.with more variety of builds adding "balance".


Daggers where given for a reason.Archer class has always been squishy.My slightly educated guess?character level progression with the old values were scaled at later levels (56-66 idk when it started to break or why but I'm sure it did and that's why this happened) whatever program they are using told them that something wasn't going to be good at all(massive op rogues).

Do people think when new items and such are tested that it is all manual?I don't think that's the case for any dev team.Its a program(you can start with excel)that auto runs the numbers for you.It would takes Months/years to test all these things with human controls.Computers are good with hard stats and are way faster than us :) people are what screw up a more balanced system.not everyone plays the same.

Give you rogues back your armor OK. Then crits need to be taken away (more balance with no crits)in pvp. Doesn't sound fun does it?

what's the fix?

everyone has an opinion but no ideas but you want your armor back.

I'm going to start a thread on this where we can more proactively tackle this besides jabbing each other.

[Eagle Eye229]

Take away crit for exchange of armor? tanks has damage and armor right now while rogues are way too squishy if one day they decided to take away tanks damage or nerf juggernaut i assure you that lots will be complaining which they are already complaining in the other thread.

Most of my above paragraph is related to the how numbers are ran on a computer and basic rpg mechanics.You don't even understand why I spoke of critical removal from pvp.jugg was nerfed for the longest time rendering it useless.same with warriors damage,it was useless to a party and rogues "got by" with their shear damage output coupled with just enough armor.ARCHER CLASS IS SQUISHY,IN MOST CASES THE WEAKEST VS HITS.

My first language is English and I assume that yours isn't. Not quite sure we understand each other fully.

when I said take away critical, I meant for everyone.which would hurt rogues the most.
any case,no one would like that.

[uehi]

Most of my above paragraph is related to the how numbers are ran on a computer and basic rpg mechanics.You don't even understand why I spoke of critical removal from pvp.jugg was nerfed for the longest time rendering it useless.same with warriors damage,it was useless to a party and rogues "got by" with their shear damage output coupled with just enough armor.ARCHER CLASS IS SQUISHY,IN MOST CASES THE WEAKEST VS HITS.

My first language is English and I assume that yours isn't. Not quite sure we understand each other fully.

when I said take away critical, I meant for everyone.which would hurt rogues the most.
any case,no one would like that.

what a kinda best tip for rogue thanks mate:)

[Killian229]

Could all of you clarify if you are having these problems with regular maps or elites? A well geared rogue shouldn't be dieing excessively in regular maps.

I use daggers and now have to use RS along with 10/10mastery.Take out some chaos jewels of your gear and throw in a few noble diamonds.It's not much but it makes a noticeable difference from not caring about my defense.
We used to be able to pump up our damage with all sockets going to primary stat or chaos.Now you must care about your defense and it does suck when your on your rogue.Basically if you don't like the armor reduction stg made,you can personally trade it in for a damage reduction.get some noble diamonds and experiment.
Only tip I can give really :)

Good luck to all on their Rogues! Gunna need it :)

[TW84]

Hey PVE warriors who want high DMG and never use a shield to tank. Please whine about dying in hard elites when mobs aren't properly controlled by a mage. Tell STS to buff your armor. Thanks.

*Sarcasm may have been used in this post*

[uehi]

[QUOTE=TW84;2426006]Hey PVE warriors who want high DMG and never use a shield to tank. Please whine about dying in hard elites when mobs aren't properly controlled by a mage. Tell STS to buff your armor. Thanks.

*Sarcasm may have been used in this
ppl using dagers like shild only for hp.

[Rosybuds]

So you think you have to hide now and you lost igg on dagger you didn't do research on.not sts fault.give you your armor back?what is it going to be like at 56?that's right,NONE of you rogues can even wait for the new expansion to drop.keep the armor progression the way it was and end game rogues would have been way op (more than before).

so buff your defense with jewels/skills in essence trading in this armor nerf for a damage nerf .No one forces you to used primary Stat jewels/gems.there are other socketables out there.have you tried them?have you tried every possible variations in jewels/gems/pets/play style/skills? When you do that and can bring proof that it is impossible to stay alive then maybe people will listen.At the moment,I see no one saying anything to the likewise tried using defensive jewels,I tried my other skills that are defensive oriented and I tried switch the way I play to compensate for my armor loss.

All rogues are saying is:it's impossible to match a tank now(you guys don't ever mention mage)but I haven't tried anything new.

@ EVERY ROGUE: if you wonder why this had to happen you can blame sts.You can blame them for wanting to continue their hard work on this game.NOT ONE single developer is going to stop expanding their game so twink players can think it's fair.as of tomorrow lv46 will not be end game.While sts will work on more balance,their main focus is going to be events and ultimately the next expansion.its business and it's life.

With a game that continues to add new items (with everyone wanting awesome abilities on them)it gets harder and harder to balance each class.you wonder why a lot of items are trash?Do you guys understand how tedious it is to write rules and code for all these items at various levels?Let alone please the masses with as much balance as there can be.If you can't even understand why a universal critical reduction was needed than you better go read up on rpg mechanics-specifically balancing interclass roles in pvp.

No class should be better than all others in all aspects of a game.its OK to have a class good at one thing,that in turn must make you weak to something else.

This is how "balance" is going to look:

X>Y
Y>Z
Z>B
B>A
A>N

Each representing a different build/character or both.with more variety of builds adding "balance".


Daggers where given for a reason.Archer class has always been squishy.My slightly educated guess?character level progression with the old values were scaled at later levels (56-66 idk when it started to break or why but I'm sure it did and that's why this happened) whatever program they are using told them that something wasn't going to be good at all(massive op rogues).

Do people think when new items and such are tested that it is all manual?I don't think that's the case for any dev team.Its a program(you can start with excel)that auto runs the numbers for you.It would takes Months/years to test all these things with human controls.Computers are good with hard stats and are way faster than us :) people are what screw up a more balanced system.not everyone plays the same.

Give you rogues back your armor OK. Then crits need to be taken away (more balance with no crits)in pvp. Doesn't sound fun does it?

what's the fix?

everyone has an opinion but no ideas but you want your armor back.

I'm going to start a thread on this where we can more proactively tackle this besides jabbing each other.

No that is what Devs get payed for and go too Uni for not us Players Why are you getting so worked about this thats what Id like too know ? You Sound Like Your CINCO LOCO Did you do this with the tanks when they were upset !! Or do you just find yourself jumping on everybandwagon saying STS on it You need too goo make some Camille Tea and Relax And for the 100th Time Its Not All About PVP you Cant do The same thing too Too players who play Two different games PVP PVE. Im no longer even getting into this made my feeling clear What I want Too Know is where is My L47 Helm And all my Gems that were in it in my Stash Gone too !!! Go see idf you can fix that with you X>Y Y>V