Regarding stuns in maps

[Serancha]

First off, I have enjoyed these maps so far, and found the mobs to be interesting and varied with good, well-spaced groupings. The bosses are also unique and interesting to fight. Thank you for the work on this.

Could the devs please look at the stuns though? They seem very long in duration, and the lack of stun immunity means getting chain-stunned is fairly common. As a rogue I can deal with it for the most part by alternating necro and razor, but for other classes anyone, without necro will be essentially screwed. Historically, there have been different environmental effects in each season - poison pools, ice, panic, slows etc., but the last 3 seasons in a row have been progressively longer and more frequent stuns. Disabling characters every few seconds doesn't make the game difficult, it interrupts the flow of play and makes it annoying.

Necro is affordable now, yes, but many players enjoy using a variety of pets and don't want to be forced to rely on the same one the entire time they play. After all, the fun part of an MMO is playing with different setups - which STS is starting to provide with more skill and gear options. However, forcing everyone to use the same skills and pet in order to remain functional in the new maps takes away from that. I'm not saying get rid of them completely, but maybe make the stuns shorter and a bit less frequent than "every second hit". Before speccing razor and switching to necro, I spent more time waiting for stuns to wear off than I did actually killing stuff. This means other classes and lesser-petted players will have a less-than-enjoyable time unless they always run with multiple necro players.

Just my opinion, thanks.

[Befs]

I agree, and I am a mage who doesn't use arcane shield (at least in normal maps), and although I have nekro, I find toor better for these maps. The chain stun is pretty intense.

Maybe a slight reduction in the time of the stun (from the bugs)

[Kakashis]

True, I'm still using razor shield because of the super long stuns!

[konafez]

I have started bringing violet with me on the new maps, her as gives stun immune for you and your pt

[Fyrce]

I have started bringing violet with me on the new maps, her as gives stun immune for you and your pt

Ohhh good idea!

[Dragoonclaws]

Talking about stuns. I used Kelvin on Jadis Gearloose. I noticed that the stun doesnt cancel Jadis' ability/special attack (gale/fire while being on the machine). I don't know if we can take this as a bug

[wwwgagacomtr]

yes long time stun + after zero mana and never help war heal shield and nekro shield. never run solo in normal map. stun stun stun with mana and heal speedy down :)

i thng if want run this map need strong teammates. because this normal maps same elit maps power. 1 war + 2 rog and 1 mage maybe nice combination.

[Zaizor]

I hate it, I've played the new maps, but I hate super long stuns and chain stunning. STS wants us to buy those stupid anti-stun potions for 30 plat. Unreal, they make maps unplayable unless you buy something to prevent it.

[Fyrce]

I experienced the least stuns w mage group. Next least deaths, stuns was w 3 warriors. Rogues dont seem to be able to avoid stuns, slow well but are amazing on bosses. I think that means 2-3 warrior/mages w rogue/s. Two warriors w aegis and a magma really hold aggro and can do huge pulls. Rogues and mages just have to stand back and pewpewpew.

[Pedgon]

First off, I have enjoyed these maps so far, and found the mobs to be interesting and varied with good, well-spaced groupings. The bosses are also unique and interesting to fight. Thank you for the work on this.

Could the devs please look at the stuns though? They seem very long in duration, and the lack of stun immunity means getting chain-stunned is fairly common. As a rogue I can deal with it for the most part by alternating necro and razor, but for other classes anyone, without necro will be essentially screwed. Historically, there have been different environmental effects in each season - poison pools, ice, panic, slows etc., but the last 3 seasons in a row have been progressively longer and more frequent stuns. Disabling characters every few seconds doesn't make the game difficult, it interrupts the flow of play and makes it annoying.

Necro is affordable now, yes, but many players enjoy using a variety of pets and don't want to be forced to rely on the same one the entire time they play. After all, the fun part of an MMO is playing with different setups - which STS is starting to provide with more skill and gear options. However, forcing everyone to use the same skills and pet in order to remain functional in the new maps takes away from that. I'm not saying get rid of them completely, but maybe make the stuns shorter and a bit less frequent than "every second hit". Before speccing razor and switching to necro, I spent more time waiting for stuns to wear off than I did actually killing stuff. This means other classes and lesser-petted players will have a less-than-enjoyable time unless they always run with multiple necro players.

Just my opinion, thanks.

The problem is that nekro shield or juggernaut from tanks do not work on 1 or 2 types of stun, and the terrible snare from "fireball tower" ALWAYS works (same for other snare on bosses)..ignore any immunity ability or skill!

But the major problem, during the last week, is this horrible horrible lag..impossible to play. Constant spiking and freezing, literally, every second..-.-

[Pedgon]

Talking about stuns. I used Kelvin on Jadis Gearloose. I noticed that the stun doesnt cancel Jadis' ability/special attack (gale/fire while being on the machine). I don't know if we can take this as a bug

It is..also arcane sword is not stunning on many of the mobs when proc is on..should be stunning on 100% of hits, like it says on proc's description; and on bosses..well does not stun at all! 20% chance on boss is more like 0%.. =/

[Fyrce]

Lag is definitely unplayable. As for the fire towers, once they spawn, move the whole mob group outside of them. Each shaman only spawns 1 set of fire towers and they only fire one direction. I think mage gale counteracts it which is nice for mages.

[Morholt]

Difficulty...? What? Am I missing something here?

I had no issues running through the glint campaign maps on my Nekro-less mage. I wouldn't try solo'ing at the moment due to lag, though.
I just joined pug maps and ran it if there was any random warrior in game (with the free mythic set out, most lvl 46+ warriors have decent defense & can take hits). 90% of the time my ping was red...around 1k. I died twice through all this...and that was from lagging hard at 1.5k ping and not knowing I was being hit. During my fight at Gladis...I was at a pretty steady of 1.3k ping the whole time. Some how others died and had no ankhs. I never died while being alone and was hurting him plenty (meaning I wasn't running to the corners and spamming health potions); at moments I was pretty much solo'ing him in a 4 person game despite terrible ping.

The ping is so bad I really can't even tell much of anything about any mobs. So far:
-Big worms have decent health, but are easy. Mini and also easy worms appear after killing the big one.
-The yellow circles are dot and deal decent damage (although probably even less than I think, since I'm probably in them for twice as long as I realize due to the lag). Just move our of them.
-I still have no idea what those green orb things are. They don't seem to do damage and are easy to kill. Maybe they heal/boost def of mobs? I don't know, so I just kill it first real quick.
- Still don't know anything about the Orange orb either. All I know is that it is an easy +1 to my kill count.

And that's it. Mobs aren't an issue. Bosses seem underwhelming. I'm lagging so hard I cant even tell what does what, yet I'm safe and mobs crumble quickly.

I'm a bit perplexed at why people want things to be even easier? A couple stuns in a row are annoying, but didn't leave me frustrated.

Nordr started out actually hard but was still doable. Then it was nerfed...more than once.
Shuyal was easy. But still nerfed.
Ren'gol was challenging (elites specifically...normal, not so much) but nerfed.
I wasn't playing for the start of garretta...but I'd be willing to bet that received an unnecessary nerf, too?
And here we are at the glint maps...the elite ones haven't even been released yet, but people are already calling for everything to be nerfed?!

No wonder I get so bored with AL. *sigh*

[tomsawer]

I think the green orbs regen health for the worms or what ever is close

[Schnitzel]

I agree with the stun point.

I don't have nor can I afford a Nekro (yea yea "poor nab" lol)
My arc shield, however, says it will remove all debuffs (and I usually always use it on charge)
But it kind of defeats the purpose of using it for removing a stun if the stun prevents me from using my shield...

[sinfuldito83]

Thank you for this post, I'm a mage who doesn't use arcane shield at all and these new maps are kicking my azz. I've defeated them all but man did it take forever. You get stunned for about half an hour and then these orcs toss you across the entire map and right into a mob of 300 enemies all waiting to continually stun you and toss you some more. There are times where you'd be lucky to even get a chance to attack.....

[Serancha]

Difficulty...? What? Am I missing something here?

I had no issues running through the glint campaign maps on my Nekro-less mage. I wouldn't try solo'ing at the moment due to lag, though.
I just joined pug maps and ran it if there was any random warrior in game (with the free mythic set out, most lvl 46+ warriors have decent defense & can take hits). 90% of the time my ping was red...around 1k. I died twice through all this...and that was from lagging hard at 1.5k ping and not knowing I was being hit. During my fight at Gladis...I was at a pretty steady of 1.3k ping the whole time. Some how others died and had no ankhs. I never died while being alone and was hurting him plenty (meaning I wasn't running to the corners and spamming health potions); at moments I was pretty much solo'ing him in a 4 person game despite terrible ping.

The ping is so bad I really can't even tell much of anything about any mobs. So far:
-Big worms have decent health, but are easy. Mini and also easy worms appear after killing the big one.
-The yellow circles are dot and deal decent damage (although probably even less than I think, since I'm probably in them for twice as long as I realize due to the lag). Just move our of them.
-I still have no idea what those green orb things are. They don't seem to do damage and are easy to kill. Maybe they heal/boost def of mobs? I don't know, so I just kill it first real quick.
- Still don't know anything about the Orange orb either. All I know is that it is an easy +1 to my kill count.

And that's it. Mobs aren't an issue. Bosses seem underwhelming. I'm lagging so hard I cant even tell what does what, yet I'm safe and mobs crumble quickly.

I'm a bit perplexed at why people want things to be even easier? A couple stuns in a row are annoying, but didn't leave me frustrated.

Nordr started out actually hard but was still doable. Then it was nerfed...more than once.
Shuyal was easy. But still nerfed.
Ren'gol was challenging (elites specifically...normal, not so much) but nerfed.
I wasn't playing for the start of garretta...but I'd be willing to bet that received an unnecessary nerf, too?
And here we are at the glint maps...the elite ones haven't even been released yet, but people are already calling for everything to be nerfed?!

No wonder I get so bored with AL. *sigh*

I'm sorry, but where did I ask for a nerf or for the maps to be made easier?

There is nothing difficult about stuns - all they do is interrupt the flow of play. Basically they are a waste of time. When almost every single mob in the map is a stun mob, it is just silly. I'd rather have mobs that do more damage and have more hp than sit there watching my character bent over with circling stars for half the run. All increasing the length of the stun does is waste more time. I didn't bring up the issue because I found it hard - I just hate having to repeatedly stop and wait to play again.

Add in the server lag issues and people just log out. But the server lag is a completely different topic, and I believe there are already 56328 threads on that.

[Morholt]

I'm sorry, but where did I ask for a nerf or for the maps to be made easier?

There is nothing difficult about stuns - all they do is interrupt the flow of play. Basically they are a waste of time. When almost every single mob in the map is a stun mob, it is just silly. I'd rather have mobs that do more damage and have more hp than sit there watching my character bent over with circling stars for half the run. All increasing the length of the stun does is waste more time. I didn't bring up the issue because I found it hard - I just hate having to repeatedly stop and wait to play again.

Add in the server lag issues and people just log out. But the server lag is a completely different topic, and I believe there are already 56328 threads on that.Sorry, Serancha. You indeed didn't bring up difficulty. I was more addressing the other comments (in this thread and others) about 'too difficult.' And also the annoying ping issue. And a little on the stuns.

I was trying to tie everything together in a neat little package of a post but...maybe the wifey is right and I'm starting to become a rambling old man. :P

But more on stuns: are you attempting to solo/two person the maps? I never felt like I was being constantly stunned-- and I don't even know which things all really cause the stuns (again, too much lag to really tell what exactly is happening). I think part of that is due to always being in a full pug. With 4 players, the number of stuns per player is reduced. Also, I allowed the warriors I came across the be a punching bag and take on a bigger share of the stuns. ^.^
Perhaps sts has more stun mobs in an attempt to make players want a 4 player group instead of the usual player-preferred 3?

[konafez]

Like I said I bring violet and she gives stun immune to pt so that's not my issue

Its the slow from those orbs, it never goes away till you kill them, you try to run past them and your slowed to a crawl for the rest the map

How bout putting a time limit on that

[Avaree]

First off, I have enjoyed these maps so far, and found the mobs to be interesting and varied with good, well-spaced groupings. The bosses are also unique and interesting to fight. Thank you for the work on this.

Could the devs please look at the stuns though? They seem very long in duration, and the lack of stun immunity means getting chain-stunned is fairly common.


Just my opinion, thanks.

**edit After running the maps with full party of three, one of each class, I see no reason for changes. Bring on the elites :)
below was when i soloed.**

I think the attack range on the beetles need to be adjusted. See in photo below, their attack range surpasses the range of aimed shot. If this was adjusted i think the stuns are fine. The beetles have low armor and are an easy kill providing you get them before you are stunned :)

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160403/9cd6b5bfe6b25fade2864cdbb84b7077.jpg

The beetle above stunned me when it was sitting between the flower and the small group rocks. Then came to attack. (The pet Violet is useful here but cd is too long, gives three second stun immunity)

The towers that produce orbs.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160403/75794366303cbce6bba9401150ae5936.jpg

Orange orb towers slows and damages the affected player, the farther away you get from the tower, the slower you are, the closer you are, the more dmg you receive. BUT if you destroy the tower when the player is out of range the orb continues to affect the player until the next orange tower is summoned and destroyed.

[Serancha]

Good info, thanks. I haven't gotten to do enough running to do full testing (or any testing at all that would provide real results due to lag), I just wanted to relay my initial impressions. With the current server situation, it's pointless to even log in though.

[Ardbeg]

Ironbite is worth a try too. Clears all stun and slow effects and buffs for 225 armor. Hey Rogues, i repeat: it buffs armor :) Now find a pet that buffs damage reduction on top...

[Avaree]

Ironbite is worth a try too. Clears all stun and slow effects and buffs for 225 armor. Hey Rogues, i repeat: it buffs armor :) Now find a pet that buffs damage reduction on top...

Its not a pet, but the skill shadow veil works :) reduces the damage & hit chance of baddies within the area by 15%

[konafez]

Ironbite is worth a try too. Clears all stun and slow effects and buffs for 225 armor. Hey Rogues, i repeat: it buffs armor :) Now find a pet that buffs damage reduction on top...

Try shadowlurk (yes I have a odd assortment of pets) does the same as as scorn but without the armor debuff

If you ever want to try something fun, get a party together with ribbit , shadowlurk, stanlee , and Ewin

Pushes rogues crit close to 100% and warriors damage through the roof

[soon]

Orange orb towers slows and damages the affected player, the farther away you get from the tower, the slower you are, the closer you are, the more dmg you receive. BUT if you destroy the tower when the player is out of range the orb continues to affect the player until the next orange tower is summoned and destroyed.


The biggest problem is the orb ignore their immunity.



149895


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynT0kyCSIm0&feature=youtu.be

[Avaree]

The biggest problem is the orb ignore their immunity.



149895




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynT0kyCSIm0&feature=youtu.be

I dont use razor. But this needs to be fixed, post this on the tech issues & bugs in new thread so the devs can review it :)

[Midievalmodel]

From a warrior perspective. Biggest issue for us is that stuns in the new map ignore the stun immunity and movement impairment upgrade of juggernaut skill. Its either the mobs stuns are bugged or the juggernaut skill upgrade itself is bugged.

[Serancha]

From a warrior perspective. Biggest issue for us is that stuns in the new map ignore the stun immunity and movement impairment upgrade of juggernaut skill. Its either the mobs stuns are bugged or the juggernaut skill upgrade itself is bugged.

Pretty sure it is the mob stuns that are bugged. Razor immunity is not working either.

[ilhanna]

Ironbite is worth a try too. Clears all stun and slow effects and buffs for 225 armor. Hey Rogues, i repeat: it buffs armor :) Now find a pet that buffs damage reduction on top...

Tried both Ironbite and Nilbog earlier. The warrior in my party said he preferred Ironbite as he felt its cooldown is shorter, but I felt that the run was easier when he used Nilbog, because it not only removed movement impairment, but DoT as well. Will test more when I'm done leveling and can wean myself from Abaddon.

Bumpity! The stunvaganza needs to be looked into.

[Ardbeg]

Tried both Ironbite and Nilbog earlier. The warrior in my party said he preferred Ironbite as he felt its cooldown is shorter, but I felt that the run was easier when he used Nilbog, because it not only removed movement impairment, but DoT as well. Will test more when I'm done leveling and can wean myself from Abaddon.

Bumpity! The stunvaganza needs to be looked into.

That is interesting, i will test Nilbog next. My favourite Antistun pet so far is Ironbite too, as i can use it too secure big mob pulls with armor buff or free allies. he also has a stun chance.

[Fyrce]

Gotta love Nilbog. I found the orb fireballs were avoidable, unless lag got in the way.

[Akazani]

I ran the new maps with a group consisting of two rogues, a tank, a sorc and breezed through easily. 200+ runs later and my conclusion is that the normal map is way too easy! Will run elites later to see how much harder it really is with all the so called stuns, but I think the maps are way too easy.

[Att]

I agree, and I am a mage who doesn't use arcane shield (at least in normal maps), and although I have nekro, I find toor better for these maps. The chain stun is pretty intense.

Maybe a slight reduction in the time of the stun (from the bugs)

I think gale storm mastery is good against chain stuns??

[vawaid]

yeah stun, I find this challenging. I don't mind, even I don't have nekro. I usually get long-chained stun in other game.

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Tapatalk

[extrapayah]

the difficulty is outrageous, in a perspective of new players, running new maps will only discourage playing more, dailies reward doesn't even cover 1/2 the cost of running a single map with new players' gear, and not even leveling in new map is better, old map still more effective, and rewards from boss doesn't even helping running the map easier, there is simply no clear roadmap for new players, and there is no viable strategy for new players to play the map, they simply need to overpower with gears, and then they can go rambo

[Avaree]

the difficulty is outrageous, in a perspective of new players, running new maps will only discourage playing more, dailies reward doesn't even cover 1/2 the cost of running a single map with new players' gear, and not even leveling in new map is better, old map still more effective, and rewards from boss doesn't even helping running the map easier, there is simply no clear roadmap for new players, and there is no viable strategy for new players to play the map, they simply need to overpower with gears, and then they can go rambo

These maps are not about op gear & crying first blood... They are about party mechanics, pets used & skill knowledge. (I am using all old gear, nothing over lvl46, using various pets. I swap with Nilbog & Sam.) These maps are very creative with several different challenges found in one group of mobs. The worst of all evils are the little bald headed gnomes carrying the green mushroom type of back pack :witless:

*Tip* this has been useful for me: (if you're playing rogue & using arcane daggers) charge auto attack, it stuns. I start to charge before coming up on the spiders, letting the tank grab aggro, then release auto charge next to mob, most times (unless lag causes auto not to relase) it will stun some of the mob, this can also make daggs proc . Charging auto attack on bow will stun too, but only one baddie at a time.

**The mobs that are ignoring stun immunity needs to be fixed.**

[eugene9707]

the difficulty is outrageous, in a perspective of new players, running new maps will only discourage playing more, dailies reward doesn't even cover 1/2 the cost of running a single map with new players' gear, and not even leveling in new map is better, old map still more effective, and rewards from boss doesn't even helping running the map easier, there is simply no clear roadmap for new players, and there is no viable strategy for new players to play the map, they simply need to overpower with gears, and then they can go rambo

i dont know though .... new players aren't suppose to go to this map, they have to go through all the previous maps first and potentially learn how to play in that period of time.

If everything is dumb-down so that "new players", who have no ideas of game mechanics and tactics, can go through, that'd be one boring game offering no challenges .... imo....

[ilhanna]

the difficulty is outrageous, in a perspective of new players, running new maps will only discourage playing more, dailies reward doesn't even cover 1/2 the cost of running a single map with new players' gear, and not even leveling in new map is better, old map still more effective, and rewards from boss doesn't even helping running the map easier, there is simply no clear roadmap for new players, and there is no viable strategy for new players to play the map, they simply need to overpower with gears, and then they can go rambo

I would say the Glintstone maps difficulty is just about right. The mobs health and armor are not ridiculously high, but their variety and unique attacks do make the maps more challenging, requiring more strategies in terms of kill prioritizing, choices of pets and skills and when to time them, and team work. The maps are tough to solo because at any time there are various attacks being hurled at you, and you need a team to share missions with: kill gnome mage; bust the orb; grab hibiscus buff, etc. These are maps made with full party in mind, it seems. With the new players having been given free mythics, I would say as long as they don't give up easily and learn fast, the new maps may prove to be a decent leveling location and if you take into account the jewels and coins, not so shabby a farming place either. I've run the new maps with PUGs and there are times when they quit. But here's the thing, the players who have been endgame longer, with more experienced in running difficult maps, they stick around. The people who I've seen on elite Rengol maps farming fangs or in Planar Tombs, they stick it out. Those with the telltale itty bitty kill count of new players who instaboosted their way to 46 give up sooner and lack the confidence to trio or duo when others poof.

But I agree the bosses should drop more profitably farmable items.

[Ardbeg]

the difficulty is outrageous, in a perspective of new players, running new maps will only discourage playing more, dailies reward doesn't even cover 1/2 the cost of running a single map with new players' gear, and not even leveling in new map is better, old map still more effective, and rewards from boss doesn't even helping running the map easier, there is simply no clear roadmap for new players, and there is no viable strategy for new players to play the map, they simply need to overpower with gears, and then they can go rambo

Where else should seasoned players find a challenge here in your opinion?
I really enjoy the new maps as teamwork over all classes and clever pet choices are rewarded over gear. Everyone has about the same gear by now, old or new, and you don t need expensive pets to master the maps. You just need teamwork and coordination, as it should be.

[Ticklish]

I agree that the new maps are better run with a party. I find chaining nekro very useful, especially for luring the spiders. However, I wish the mobs don't ignore juggernaut and razor shield. Tanks would be much appreciated in party if they can time jugg CD with luring mobs. Since razor shield is pretty useless, I use SSS instead. Helps in killing while staying out of those nasty pools.

[eugene9707]

I'll add something to contribute i guess ......

It seems like Razor doesn't remove the debuff from the red orb..... but for mages, the Gale mastery does ....

[wwwgagacomtr]

i use axe skill with my warior but never taunt 3 mobs ( my axe skill 5/5 + 9/10 ) old times pull 3 mobs but in this maps only 1 pull. i use jug + nekro + heal but slot speedy down my mana and heal after i die :)

usually first mob make stun after mana down and start heal down then die :) i use heal and mana pot for dont die but never enough push push push :) my war have 3k+ armor and 8k+ hp i dont thng new users in this maps :)

ok my arc sword make some stun but not enough. mobs stun maybe 45sc, my sword make only 5sc :) solo run imposibble in new normal maps. need good players for pt run.

[Ardbeg]

It's crucial to run with one or two anti-stun pets as several players pointed out, good options are nilbog, violet, ironbite, maybe even silver (test it next). Remember elite s are next and now is the time to find out what works best. Gear is almost on par for all player tiers now and survivability can be bought cheap with natures, reducing only the run time.

[Fyrce]

Actually what was super fun was running my warrior w/ aegis and magma w/ another warrior w/ aegis and nekro. We did pugs and did huge gathers. Stuns didn't matter since we easily survived them. Our aegis and magma concentrated aggro and damage. All the mages and rogues had to do was stand back and kill. I don't think either of us used Jug. I didn't and axe was doing some strange pulls, so we took that out also.

Huge Underhul gathers are great fun.

An all mage group was pretty fun too. Not too many deaths or stuns.

[Eatdamage]

Been using juggernaut with anti stun upgrade...charge jugger, pull beetles or stun mobs, use the heal shield, whirlwind...the aegis proc will shred em...i also have some points in whirlwind mastery..so it helps to proc fast and kill.

[Kaziscate]

Well there are a few ways to counter stunning, but it can be a bit limited (especially if you aren't having a non-stop flow of stun immunity). For mages the simple solution is to run a build that has Arcane Shield and Gale Force mastery. For rogues there is Razor Shield. For warriors I don't think there is a stun immunity skill unfortunately. To help with the stun immunity even further, use pets that provide anti-stun. The cheapest pet that I know that has this is Ironbite.

[Lolifee]

I'm using arcane shield, timed with nekro and gale. no probs

[ilhanna]

Tried running new map on my warrior and mage today. Actually enjoyed it more than runs on rogue, even though neither warrior nor mage has Nekro. Mage shield, warrior jugg and heal really help with stun.

Tried both Ironbite and Nilbog on warrior as well, and found that even my tank prefers Nilbog to the bat.

Bumpity!