[Design Blog] Increasing the Potential of Sorcerers

[VROOMIGoRealFast]

Hey Arlorians!

We’ve seen some good discussions lately talking about Sorcerers and their potential damage. We’ve done some comparative research on our end looking into the potential damage output of classes and we feel that Sorcerers are not shining in large group situations like we expect them to. We’ve evaluated the Sorcerer’s AoE potential and these are the solutions we plan to implement to help resolve this problem.

1) Increase the number of targets Fireball can hit by 2
Currently uncharged Fireball can hit up to 4 targets, while charged can hit up to 6. Comparing this to the AoE of other classes it actually left Sorcerers lacking in the AoE department. As a general update for all Sorcerers we want to increase the number of targets that Fireball can hit. Uncharged Fireball will be able to hit 6 targets, while charged fireball will be able to hit up to 8.

2) Change the Mastery of Fireball to “Increase the number of targets Fireball can hit by 1 for every 2 points, and decrease the cooldown of fireball by .1 second for each point”
We’ve heard from Sorcerers and agree that mana isn’t really their issue, and we feel that the Mastery for Fireball decreasing the mana cost isn’t that impactful. This is where the greatest AoE damage increase can come for Sorcerers. At max, this mastery will decrease the cooldown of fireball by 1 second, and increase the number of targets that can be hit by 5, which includes all bonus effects from upgrades.

3) Increase the damage output of Charged Time Shift on the initial drop of the Clock
Time Shift is a dual utility skill, providing crowd control and a good amount of damage. After our evaluation we found that while charging Time Shift provides other benefits, it doesn’t behave like other abilities in that charging increases the damage. We plan to bring up this damage so that charging Time Shift gives you a more relevant amount of AoE while still maintaining the crowd control effects.

*Update* As a note for potential feedback, we're planning on implementing all of the above options.

I want this because I play a Sorc myself,
STSVroom

[Schnitzel]

I like idea #1 & 3
Im only a lvl50 fairly geared sorcerer, but seems that a decreased 0.1s cool down and +1 target every 2 points means, if we put 6 points into the fireball mastery, we get 3 more targets to roast. But with a Time Shift skill doing more damage, we may get needed more in elite runs for draining mob health while freezing enemies in place (a better CC method imo)

Just my opinions.
*waits for angry replies*

[Anyona]

Thank you for yet another great update[emoji5]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[VROOMIGoRealFast]

I like idea #1 & 3
Im only a lvl50 fairly geared sorcerer, but seems that a decreased 0.1s cool down and +1 target every 2 points means, if we put 6 points into the fireball mastery, we get 3 more targets to roast. But with a Time Shift skill doing more damage, we may get needed more in elite runs for draining mob health while freezing enemies in place (a better CC method imo)

Just my opinions.
*waits for angry replies*

I'll update in the original post, but to clarify we're planning to implement all 3 options!

[Natalia Kulnu]

Chance clock CNT root most mobs in underhaul if the root gonna be added to all mobs in underhaul that's gonna make sorcs more useful

[Schnitzel]

I like idea #1 & 3
Im only a lvl50 fairly geared sorcerer, but seems that a decreased 0.1s cool down and +1 target every 2 points means, if we put 6 points into the fireball mastery, we get 3 more targets to roast. But with a Time Shift skill doing more damage, we may get needed more in elite runs for draining mob health while freezing enemies in place (a better CC method imo)

Just my opinions.
*waits for angry replies*

I'll update in the original post, but to clarify we're planning to implement all 3 options!

O

#11characters

[extrapayah]

there are some concerns with sorcerer:

1. we are lacking offensive buffs
2. stun duration being very random, elite mobs sometimes got stunned less than 1s
3. stun duration and gale push doesn't stack, making teamworks between mages unnecessary too hard, compare it to how arcane blades works between rogues, if we're talking in pvp, there is already post-stun stun-immunity that should be enough to avoid perma-stun
4. heal over time doesn't stack between mages, while rogues packs, and warrior HoR do

thanks :D, tbh a skill switch system will make playing with mage a lot more interesting, and can make mage as the busiest class to play :D, a real spellcaster, that can have high potential on how well you use all your skills/spells

[Niixed]

I heartily concur with the proposed changes, they sound awesome and are very encouraging. However I would actually rather see clock DoT increased rather than the initial damage, it seems it would be far more helpful especially in elites. Just a suggestion though.

[VROOMIGoRealFast]

4. heal over time doesn't stack between mages, while rogues packs, and warrior HoR do


We'll investigate and evaluate this. There should be a consistency between heals from characters and their stacking unless it would specifically cause issues. You may have found a good candidate for a #4

[Natalia Kulnu]

Why CNT we get our root power back like before ;)

[extrapayah]

We'll investigate and evaluate this. There should be a consistency between heals from characters and their stacking unless it would specifically cause issues. You may have found a good candidate for a #4

thanks :D also another old issue like mobs that are stunned by fireball/gale can't be pulled by rogue's trap

another note, we will definitely be happy if we are given a mechanism to control our gale dash, to control when to dash, and when to not :D

and yes clock not rooting most mobs in underhul really hurt us... at least if mobs can't be rooted, the 'snare'/slow from original clock should takes effect... same like ice, if mobs can't be frozen, why can't the slow/snare effect works?

[bonjovi3223]

I heartily concur with the proposed changes, they sound awesome and are very encouraging. However I would actually rather see clock DoT increased rather than the initial damage, it seems it would be far more helpful especially in elites. Just a suggestion though.
+1 to this..........

[Kriticality]

Good first steps. As everyone knows I'm here for the fame... The glory... A la Kenny Powers!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[extrapayah]

A charged time shift doesn't root mobs which happen to walk into the time shift, this wasn't like this before.
The number of mobs(I haven't done the counting but according to soeone on the forums) affected by clock is 11. If this number could be increased it would be better than the #1 stated in OP.

Gale with the extended knock back doesn't stun the mobs for the full amount of time.

Charged ice is only effective after the second charged ice hits mobs, it ignores most upgrades till the second charged ice hits a group of mobs.

Providing increase number of mobs hit from FB mastery will hardly solve anything for the average sorc, keep in mind there aren't enough skill points for mages even now, having to chose between increased AoE or the insanely useful ice mastery(it's a lifesaver at bosses) and clock mastery, leaves us lacking even more.

clock target max 10, it's on the description,

ice mastery helps? that's new @_@, i heard many said it's practically nonexistent chance at a mere 4%....

[Saud]

That's good thing to hear today
because while i was doing elite I actually felt unnecessary there
however, some of the changes are good
point 1 is very good, i always hate when i charge my fireball in big crowd of mobs
and some of them can't be stunned
point 2 is almost good, but its only when its full
because with point 1 buff and mastery we can Hit 13 Mobs!
also 1 sec reduce is kinda useful
point 3 I kinda didn't get it
does that mean the damage of ticks will increase
or when the clock dropping damage? ( i ment by dropping coming from the sky .. summon it )
and if so is it that big?
I kinda wish that clock can root all enemies
Thanks again for the buff..
hope that give us a chance to by in party of elite..

[RYYUKK]

Really thnx for this thread, there is some issues like last guys posted, ice skill dont freeze, clock doesnt been rooting mobs (new maps, or elite)

[Iiiiiiil]

i wish warriors skyward smash increase its maximum number of target not only radius when i level its masteries :(

and chest splitter please change its masteries please

[Gouiwaa9000]

Maybe a good idea is to give curse some use outside of PvP clashes? ( even there is going exticnt now ) it's been months since I saw a mage use curse in pve and PvP. It's a very cool side kick ,but it's simply not worth it to sacrifice a attack skill for it. I think this should be our de-buff skill . I suggest that curse will simply grant the sorcerer a 65%( 75% if charged ) damage reflection for its duration . + maybe a 1% armor bebuff per 2 points for its mastery , and In order to balance the skill, reducing the range of it by 1-2 meters?

[Ticklish]

I believe what we really expect is for mages to be able to do better crowd control. Allow their skills to stun/root/freeze/slow for all types of mobs, even if you need to decrease the duration for elites. If root is too op for elites, at least have it slow the mobs?

[Befs]

Great ideas, and they should be implemented. However, this will force sorcerers to use the above skills.

There should also be a small buff to crit as well imo.

[Zeus]

Great ideas, and they should be implemented. However, this will force sorcerers to use the above skills.

There should also be a small buff to crit as well imo.

Buffing crit would affect PvP, these changes affect PvE only. That's all that was wrong with sorcerer.

[Carapace]

I heartily concur with the proposed changes, they sound awesome and are very encouraging. However I would actually rather see clock DoT increased rather than the initial damage, it seems it would be far more helpful especially in elites. Just a suggestion though.

We did have a discussion about this, but the Time Clock and masteries make it a very powerful support spell in addition to the damage it deals in the side. Putting it more on Fireball keeps the idea that Fireball is for massive AoE, and not the support spell which is more responsible for snares, roots, and freezing in time.

We will re-evaluate after the fact but for now we're happy with the direction of the proposed changes. Keep the feedback coming!

[Carapace]

That's good thing to hear today
because while i was doing elite I actually felt unnecessary there
however, some of the changes are good
point 1 is very good, i always hate when i charge my fireball in big crowd of mobs
and some of them can't be stunned
point 2 is almost good, but its only when its full
because with point 1 buff and mastery we can Hit 13 Mobs!
also 1 sec reduce is kinda useful
point 3 I kinda didn't get it
does that mean the damage of ticks will increase
or when the clock dropping damage? ( i ment by dropping coming from the sky .. summon it )
and if so is it that big?
I kinda wish that clock can root all enemies
Thanks again for the buff..
hope that give us a chance to by in party of elite..

#3 means that the initial impact of the clock will deal more damage when Charged than it does now.

[Jiinzou]

What about increased chance to proc aoe effect on lightning..

[will0]

Since this thread is about "potential of sorcerer" i would like to highlight some issues with the skill Sorcerer has:

1.FB
> Since this is a fire skill similar to magma AA it should have more damage like arcane sword lava spouts granting immunity to sorcerer and fire damage effect should spread like poison in a radius the FB was cast. This will helps the survivability of sorcerer and more effective AOE damage.

2. Timeshift
> Rooting is the main point of having this skill, DOT should be increase damage not just the initial drop of the time shift. Rooting chance % should be made available in PVP as well using time shift (as per PVE mastery) not just slow players this will help sorcerer to create a barrier when 2-3 tanks are "ganging" in pvp with a team with no tanks

3. Curse skill
> This skill is totally obsolete needs a revamp for PVE as it is not even effective at all to debuff the mobs or any effectiveness of this skill < 1% sorcerer are using this skill in PVE or PVP
> PVP, skill is not use at all by most mages why ? It can be avoided and is not 100% effective due to the limits of reaching the far end of the range it can be cast and rogues just wait till it wears off the duration of the spell needs to be longer and buff, it can be cancelled by mage shield and some other skills other toons.

4. Lightning
> Chain AOE on charge should be look at improvement as the % is too low to get the AOE during PVE and only when the movs are dying. This is hardly effective in new maps where mobs have high hp also in elites. This should be part of the mastery upgrades to get more chain AOE chance and also not when mobs are low in hp then the chance to see AOE in effect

Just my thoughts to make sorcerer a better toon to play with ..... as a team in PVP or PVE

[Kaziscate]

Will the Countdown of Pain upgrade be affected by this damage buff as well? Also,here is a list of things I would like to see improved for sorcerers:

1. Lifegiver Mastery-This doesn't really help much in healing allies. I think 10%-25% hp would be a reasonable amount.
2.Curse-Some mages believe that curse deals damage based on a % of the damage received. This is wrong. Curse only deals damage at a set range. No matter how much damage it is, it is always the same. I understand that it is like this to keep the game balanced,but I think curse needs to return damage at a %. Maybe make it 115% damage on mobs and 60% on bosses.
3.Staffs-While staffs are doing good in PvE,the only thing I would like to see is if staffs can hit more enemies per normal attack and have a slightly larger radius.
4.Guns-Since mages do AoE damage,why not have it on guns too? (Yes I am aware that charged attacks on Mythic Guns can hit multiple enemies, but I want to see this on Legendaries too)
5.Lightning Bolt:Electrical Discharge- We're mages man, buff the chance of this up to something like 50% charged and 35% normal.
5.Arcane Shield+Arcane Shield Mastery-The only issue is that the upgrades for increasing the amount of damage absorbed is a bit too small,buff it up.

That's all the things that I think are changes that should be implemented for mages. :)

[Kingofninjas]

The idea of improving the number of targets hit by fireball is great. However, I think a greater initial number of targets hot and less benefit from mastery would be better so mages are not dependent on the mastery to perform their role.

My suggestion would be to change the numbers to uncharged fireball hits 7 targets and charged hits 10. With the mastery, every 3 points increases the number of possible targets by 1, as well as the cool down reduction you mentioned.

[tomsawer]

Hey Arlorians!

We’ve seen some good discussions lately talking about Sorcerers and their potential damage. We’ve done some comparative research on our end looking into the potential damage output of classes and we feel that Sorcerers are not shining in large group situations like we expect them to. We’ve evaluated the Sorcerer’s AoE potential and these are the solutions we plan to implement to help resolve this problem.

1) Increase the number of targets Fireball can hit by 2
Currently uncharged Fireball can hit up to 4 targets, while charged can hit up to 6. Comparing this to the AoE of other classes it actually left Sorcerers lacking in the AoE department. As a general update for all Sorcerers we want to increase the number of targets that Fireball can hit. Uncharged Fireball will be able to hit 6 targets, while charged fireball will be able to hit up to 8.

2) Change the Mastery of Fireball to “Increase the number of targets Fireball can hit by 1 for every 2 points, and decrease the cooldown of fireball by .1 second for each point”
We’ve heard from Sorcerers and agree that mana isn’t really their issue, and we feel that the Mastery for Fireball decreasing the mana cost isn’t that impactful. This is where the greatest AoE damage increase can come for Sorcerers. At max, this mastery will decrease the cooldown of fireball by 1 second, and increase the number of targets that can be hit by 5, which includes all bonus effects from upgrades.

3) Increase the damage output of Charged Time Shift on the initial drop of the Clock
Time Shift is a dual utility skill, providing crowd control and a good amount of damage. After our evaluation we found that while charging Time Shift provides other benefits, it doesn’t behave like other abilities in that charging increases the damage. We plan to bring up this damage so that charging Time Shift gives you a more relevant amount of AoE while still maintaining the crowd control effects.

*Update* As a note for potential feedback, we're planning on implementing all of the above options.

I want this because I play a Sorc myself,
STSVroom
Very nice guys,it's exactly what I believe the majority was needing.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

[johnycageee]

Then make rogues AoE charged attack can shoot 3 arrows in same time, only rogue can't shoot more mobs then 1-2...

Послато са GT-I9300 уз помоћ Тапатока

[Rehired]

However I would actually rather see clock DoT increased rather than the initial damage...

What does DoT stand for? I tried to figure it out but I can't...

[Kaziscate]

What does DoT stand for? I tried to figure it out but I can't...

Damage over Time

[Rehired]

Maybe a good idea is to give curse some use outside of PvP clashes? ( even there is going exticnt now ) it's been months since I saw a mage use curse in pve and PvP. It's a very cool side kick ,but it's simply not worth it to sacrifice a attack skill for it. I think this should be our de-buff skill . I suggest that curse will simply grant the sorcerer a 65%( 75% if charged ) damage reflection for its duration . + maybe a 1% armor bebuff per 2 points for its mastery , and In order to balance the skill, reducing the range of it by 1-2 meters?
+1 I totally agree

[Kriticality]

What does DoT stand for? I tried to figure it out but I can't...

Edit nm already posted

[Kriticality]

If at 1500 damage my fb and clock dot don't do at LEAST twice as much dot as a 600 damage warrior with magma and aegis than this is useless upon further consideration. It's not the number of targets a Mage can kill at a snails pace. It's the pace at which they don't kill. Keep the affected targets as is and apply a multiplier based on mobs affected to the dot ticks for Mage based on their damage. This will preserve rogues role. Bc if I clock or fb a boss bc it's only one it won't have any multiplier. The multiplier should slowly increase over time to make mages undoubtedly the best mob killers in the game. Much like rogues are the best boss killers in the game. The difference must be that extreme. Who can't stun? Why do I care about cc? If a tank can stun the same amount of mobs over say 10 seconds then these upgrades do nothing. If a tank can jugg, hold aggro, and let rogues and their other skills come in and stun, how exactly are mages superior? Bc it happens initially? This doesn't make Mage superior. Increase the dot progressively depending on the mob size. I don't wanna control the crowd. I wanna kill the crowd faster than the other two classes. That's the point of aoe.


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[Kriticality]

If at 1500 damage my fb and clock dot don't do at LEAST twice as much dot as a 600 damage warrior with magma and aegis than this is useless upon further consideration. It's not the number of targets a Mage can kill at a snails pace. It's the pace at which they don't kill. Keep the affected targets as is and apply a multiplier based on mobs affected to the dot ticks for Mage based on their damage. This will preserve rogues role. Bc if I clock or fb a boss bc it's only one it won't have any multiplier. The multiplier should slowly increase over time to make mages undoubtedly the best mob killers in the game. Much like rogues are the best boss killers in the game. The difference must be that extreme. Who can't stun? Why do I care about cc? If a tank can stun the same amount of mobs over say 10 seconds then these upgrades do nothing. If a tank can jugg, hold aggro, and let rogues and their other skills come in and stun, how exactly are mages superior? Bc it happens initially? This doesn't make Mage superior. Increase the dot progressively depending on the mob size. I don't wanna control the crowd. I wanna kill the crowd faster than the other two classes. That's the point of aoe.

I'm not trying to say to my buddies... "Hey Zeus l, guess what? I spent 50m on the most damage in game and I'm soooo happy, I clocked 11 MOBS TODAY IN UNDERHUL!! It took 50 seconds for them to die but I got 11 at once!!"

It sounds silly bc it is. Idk. Number don't seem to be the issue the more I think about it. Stay away from mana as you said and make us the most efficient aoe class. That's what we supposed to be.

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I'm also happy to submit videos and any other type of data that may be helpful to figuring this out.

[Jiinzou]

Thats why I think we need better lightning aoe.. If it affects pvp too much it can be pve only,no?

[Thediva]

Thank you so much! ^_^

[Asron9]

If at 1500 damage my fb and clock dot don't do at LEAST twice as much dot as a 600 damage warrior with magma and aegis than this is useless upon further consideration. It's not the number of targets a Mage can kill at a snails pace. It's the pace at which they don't kill. Keep the affected targets as is and apply a multiplier based on mobs affected to the dot ticks for Mage based on their damage. This will preserve rogues role. Bc if I clock or fb a boss bc it's only one it won't have any multiplier. The multiplier should slowly increase over time to make mages undoubtedly the best mob killers in the game. Much like rogues are the best boss killers in the game. The difference must be that extreme. Who can't stun? Why do I care about cc? If a tank can stun the same amount of mobs over say 10 seconds then these upgrades do nothing. If a tank can jugg, hold aggro, and let rogues and their other skills come in and stun, how exactly are mages superior? Bc it happens initially? This doesn't make Mage superior. Increase the dot progressively depending on the mob size. I don't wanna control the crowd. I wanna kill the crowd faster than the other two classes. That's the point of aoe.


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1+ for kill mob faster

[narultimania133]

1+ for kill mob faster

Totalmente deacuerdo con esto.
El mago tiene potencial, es injusto solo pesar que dependemos de un escudo para poder poder hacerle frente a las otras 2 clases.

[Daehanie]

Im loving it 😘😘😍😍😍

[Mewtuh]

Good points!

Gesendet von meinem E2303 mit Tapatalk

[extrapayah]

Aegis isn't the only weapon that supercedes mage abilities and steals our thunder. The Rogue dragon daggers' dragon bite proc takes out elite mobs faster than mages have ever been able to... ever. On top of that I suspect the Dragon Sword proc does more damage than clock and fireball DoT combined. Let's not forget the elon bulwark uber curse which is better than mage curse and costs only a weapon charge.

Whenever Warriors and Rogues are OP because of gear it almost always takes away from sorcerers. The Dragon Hunter staff proc is comparatively weak and Consecrate doesn't really make up for that weakness. I'm not asking for a buff here, just making a point.

this deserve more reads :P,

but unlike the original poster, i request for buffs, really wish you to consider stun duration to stacks, just like how aimed shot's armor reduction duration stacks, just like shock from dragon blades stacks, it won't be op, because many dangerous mobs are immune to fireball/gale stun. and gale push to be able to push already stunned opponents, just like how axe throw can still pull opponents on the same condition.

and boost in general damage output, worth enough to make sorcerers gets equal reduction of damage to rogues in pvp

[latoz]

Goodjob Vroom I like it :)
Hope u guys increase a little bit damage on Fireball like 5-10% more.

[Aerodude]

Awesome i was about to suggest about increasing fb target hit amount LOL okay so i was thinking that fb DoT should be increased same with clock and maybe make clock hit more than 10 maybe 15?or20? Mobs maybe in fb mastery add +2% Dot dmg something like that and like they said curse should be debuff alot

[Befs]

How about more enemies being able to be frozen by ice (with unlock ice wielder), and an increase to the range that enemies can be frozen within.

This won't affect PvP because ice doesn't freeze there, but it will greatly help us to crowd control.

There is also only a 20%(?) chance that a charged icebolt will even freeze, so we aren't looking at something too game-changing most likely.

[Jiinzou]

We need more aoe/dot output ,not more crowd control

[Untung]

@Vroom, do you know time swift have bug in 2nd and 3rd underhul map? Mobs (wizards and gnomes) still move around towards player even under effect of permanent stun from skill masteries (not walking but moving and not attack).

[Quew]

So excited about these changes. When oh when????

[Otahaanak]

Appreciate the proposed changes. Anything to give us a boost is welcome.

Regarding Fireball: I agree with the other posts here that increasing the number of targets is not helpful ( except maybe in the few maps where large pulls possible, if even then )

I think increasing the DoT or allowing the DoT to spread (like Nox) would be more beneficial for PVE.

My .02






IGN:
Drizzitty
Cryformana

[Muteds]

aw nice mage king of pve :D

[abigailsl]

Nice ithrowthings harder 😄

[Energizeric]

Just saw this thread today. Sounds good!

My preferred build is to go with Fire, Lightning, Shield, Heal. I find overall this is the most useful build, but I used to add Time Shift as a 5th skill and toggle it into the mix in elites, because Fire did not have a good enough AoE to take down elite mobs. Now with this updated skill mastery, I think I could get by without Time Shift.

With these new skill mastery upgrades, it really pays to try to get by with only 4 skills in your build, since you can then devote many more points to skill mastery upgrades than if you go with 5 or 6 skills.

[Carapace]

So one thing that is being underestimated here is the cool down reduction of Fireball with the mastery. At 10 points this increases the casting rate quite substantially, allowing you to cast 4 fireballs in the amount of time it would take to launch 3 before the mastery (non charged). That's an entire extra fireball worth of damage and DoTs to apply to a larger number of targets which in turn generates a significant DPS output change. The Damage is spread over multiple targets as well, so the bigger the pull the greater the boon.

We all like seeing big numbers on damage, but the rate at which we can put out those numbers is just as important as the numbers themselves. This also has the added balance of removing the mana cost reduction, therefore making it possible to spend that mana faster than you would normally in PvP.

These changes will be in the next update, we're looking forward to everyone trying out the change!

[upaokafi]

Hi

Ty for making changes to Mage, I look forward to testing them.

Note to the reader: skip this post if you don't like essays.

There is a lot of white noise out there and smeering of skills between the classes and i think this is causing quite a few problems. We expect all football players to have excellent ball skills but strikers have to be very quick, defenders have to channel the opposition and only the goalie can handle the ball, so there are distinct skills if the idea is to have a team. Would we rather play an individual sport like golf, where each player has to be good at all the same skills?

So, imo, if we prefer teams for game play this is how to unscramle the egg:

Mages are magical - things like stuns, rooting, dot, healing of team members, adding crit to team members, placing curses on mobs or bosses etc are where sts should focus. I dont think it is a good idea for pets to have Mage skills, pets should enhance the skills of the owner, whichever class the owner is.

Rogues are assasins - they should be poor at fighting mobs, they should be excellent killers of bosses. The oportunity for killing is presented by the magic woven by mages and the distraction caused by wars. An alone assasin caught by a mob should be a very bad situation for the rogue. Quick killing skills, sniper skills, camaflage etc are the focus areas.

Wars are tanks - they are there to keep the mobs busy or to hinder the boss and his evil helpers from moving around. Presently wars are so OP that they are mob and boss killers. There was a situation some while ago when wars were useful. They could park mobs, they could allow mages and rogues to run, they could pull multiple mobs and deliver these to mages to pound and rogues to pick off the straglers. A good war would setup the map for his team and sts should focus on this.

In terms of PvE, although i'm not a PvE player, i suspect similar principles should apply and balancing these i'm sure is needed and being done.

It might not be a bad idea of doing a similar balancing idea on a map like pt3 to test or to encourage teamwork. Adding "team tokens" for teams with all 3 classes present, or similar, may provide the incentive.

I think ppl are going to moan about their own skills when they are effectively competing with the other classes. To lever teamwork is a great way of avoiding this and ofc it is at the heart of the great social interaction the game provides. Getting the classes to work together is the ultimate leadership challenge, and maybe the great life lesson of this game.

Ty for your work on the game and thanks for letting me have my 2 cents.

Upa

[extrapayah]

So one thing that is being underestimated here is the cool down reduction of Fireball with the mastery. At 10 points this increases the casting rate quite substantially, allowing you to cast 4 fireballs in the amount of time it would take to launch 3 before the mastery (non charged). That's an entire extra fireball worth of damage and DoTs to apply to a larger number of targets which in turn generates a significant DPS output change. The Damage is spread over multiple targets as well, so the bigger the pull the greater the boon.

We all like seeing big numbers on damage, but the rate at which we can put out those numbers is just as important as the numbers themselves. This also has the added balance of removing the mana cost reduction, therefore making it possible to spend that mana faster than you would normally in PvP.

These changes will be in the next update, we're looking forward to everyone trying out the change!

couldn't agree more, probably one of the best offensive out there, other similar mastery either only increase max target or only decrease cooldown (some like jugg only decrease cooldown by 11%, but this one is legit 25%)
not to mention 2 out of 3 original effect of fireball are stackable, blind duration and dot

can't wait to try :D

[Asron9]

couldn't agree more, probably one of the best offensive out there, other similar mastery either only increase max target or only decrease cooldown (some like jugg only decrease cooldown by 11%, but this one is legit 25%)
not to mention 2 out of 3 original effect of fireball are stackable, blind duration and dot

can't wait to try :D
me tooo cant wait to try, love more my mage now yay

[Tatman]

If at 1500 damage my fb and clock dot don't do at LEAST twice as much dot as a 600 damage warrior with magma and aegis than this is useless upon further consideration. It's not the number of targets a Mage can kill at a snails pace. It's the pace at which they don't kill. Keep the affected targets as is and apply a multiplier based on mobs affected to the dot ticks for Mage based on their damage. This will preserve rogues role. Bc if I clock or fb a boss bc it's only one it won't have any multiplier. The multiplier should slowly increase over time to make mages undoubtedly the best mob killers in the game. Much like rogues are the best boss killers in the game. The difference must be that extreme. Who can't stun? Why do I care about cc? If a tank can stun the same amount of mobs over say 10 seconds then these upgrades do nothing. If a tank can jugg, hold aggro, and let rogues and their other skills come in and stun, how exactly are mages superior? Bc it happens initially? This doesn't make Mage superior. Increase the dot progressively depending on the mob size. I don't wanna control the crowd. I wanna kill the crowd faster than the other two classes. That's the point of aoe.


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This (the multipliers etc.) sounds great on paper, but I suspect it would require a heavy revamp of the mechanics.

For example, I, as a rogue, would then ask for something like this: If a rogue continually targets the same enemy (be it mob or boss), the damage of every hit should progressively increase too. So, for example if I do 1000-1500 damage on auto attack, the second auto attack should be 1100-1600, the third 1200-1700 and so on. If I switch targets, this resets.

It also begs the question - where do warriors fit in this?

[Kriticality]

This (the multipliers etc.) sounds great on paper, but I suspect it would require a heavy revamp of the mechanics.

For example, I, as a rogue, would then ask for something like this: If a rogue continually targets the same enemy (be it mob or boss), the damage of every hit should progressively increase too. So, for example if I do 1000-1500 damage on auto attack, the second auto attack should be 1100-1600, the third 1200-1700 and so on. If I switch targets, this resets.

It also begs the question - where do warriors fit in this?

Rogue already have stuff like that with aimed shot where the second will always hit harder than the first. The reason for multipliers for Mage is to protect rogues. I asked it be based on mob number so no multipliers for boss. Idc what rogue get as long as Mage has the same in damage proportion comparison. Mage should kill mob faster than rogues in a proportional way that rogues can kill bosses faster than Mage. So buff rogue to eternity for all I care as long *** the ratio is same.

A group of 4 mages should finish mob dense maps in the same time as 4 rogues. With the time difference mages lose on boss they gain on mobs and vice Versa. Therefore ofc rewarding team play.

[Tatman]

Rogue already have stuff like that with aimed shot where the second will always hit harder than the first. The reason for multipliers for Mage is to protect rogues. I asked it be based on mob number so no multipliers for boss. Idc what rogue get as long as Mage has the same in damage proportion comparison. Mage should kill mob faster than rogues in a proportional way that rogues can kill bosses faster than Mage. So buff rogue to eternity for all I care as long *** the ratio is same.

A group of 4 mages should finish mob dense maps in the same time as 4 rogues. With the time difference mages lose on boss they gain on mobs and vice Versa. Therefore ofc rewarding team play.
No, there is no "stuff like that" in the current system. And I am talking about something entirely different. You suggest that mage damage should depend on number of mobs. I suggest something similar for rogue. Simple as that.

[Kriticality]

No, there is no "stuff like that" in the current system. And I am talking about something entirely different. You suggest that mage damage should depend on number of mobs. I suggest something similar for rogue. Simple as that.

So rogue damage should be reduced for mobs then. You already have best damage for single target lmao by a long shot. Mages should be just as op with mobs as rogues are with boss. And Mage should be just as up with boss as rogues are with mobs. You stuck on the multiplier, I'm stuck on equality. As I said before, I don't care what happens to rogues and long as mages have something directly proportional. How that's accomplished is of no concern to me.

[Ulfric]

Hi

So, imo, if we prefer teams for game play this is how to unscramle the egg:

Mages are magical - things like stuns, rooting, dot, healing of team members, adding crit to team members, placing curses on mobs or bosses etc are where sts should focus. I dont think it is a good idea for pets to have Mage skills, pets should enhance the skills of the owner, whichever class the owner is.

Rogues are assasins - they should be poor at fighting mobs, they should be excellent killers of bosses. The oportunity for killing is presented by the magic woven by mages and the distraction caused by wars. An alone assasin caught by a mob should be a very bad situation for the rogue. Quick killing skills, sniper skills, camaflage etc are the focus areas.

Wars are tanks - they are there to keep the mobs busy or to hinder the boss and his evil helpers from moving around. Presently wars are so OP that they are mob and boss killers. There was a situation some while ago when wars were useful. They could park mobs, they could allow mages and rogues to run, they could pull multiple mobs and deliver these to mages to pound and rogues to pick off the straglers. A good war would setup the map for his team and sts should focus on this.

I think ppl are going to moan about their own skills when they are effectively competing with the other classes. To lever teamwork is a great way of avoiding this and ofc it is at the heart of the great social interaction the game provides. Getting the classes to work together is the ultimate leadership challenge, and maybe the great life lesson of this game.



I totally agree with this. all that we hope for is a gameplay where each class play their role. Balancing pvp is a different thing but seriously rogues with arcane blade are better mage than actual mages. Be it freeze, stuns, root the other class have a slice of sorcerers either through pets or weapons. so i would really love to see mages stun and freeze more effectively on pve.

[siibud]

blue smurf happy ...:applause:
:) smurf"..this is so smurf..:):excitement:
:) smurf like it...

[lissil]

While I appreciate the changes on fireball masteries and initial damage of time shift, I am more concerned about the ineffectiveness of time shift snare and root in elite underhul maps. I've always loved my time shift in elites and it's the first time in a release of new elite maps that I removed it from my skill hub. It does root and slow down bugs and worms but not orcs. And it's the orcs that does one hit KO's. I don't even need those orcs rooted, as I know they are somehow enraged, even just allowing them to be slowed down would be much appreciated.

[Zeazimeh]

Time shift mastery is better if root/slow enemies works, otherwise mobs just run out of dot. Root/slow should atleast work if enraged orcs cant be perma frozen.
Fireball max targets increased is good but dot is very less(for elite).
Ignition proc of new rogue daggers has better dot than pure ball of fire from a mage?
Fireball mastery could have had better effect as wildfire from flameforged staff. Anyways i feel fireball mastery is not good enough if one doesn't have extended aoe radius of fb
For sorcs to be in top timed runs we should be able to kill mobs faster, like kriticality (aka papalix) said.