[Design Blog] Updates to Aimed Shot

[VROOMIGoRealFast]

Hey Everyone,

I'll start with the tl;dr: Aimed Shot now does more overall damage!

It's time to learn about the new Aimed Shot!
Ok so I call it new Aimed Shot but there's not a whole lot different. The design team found an issue with Aimed Shot where the damage was incredibly inconsistent when it comes to which upgrades you use. I want to walk players through the entire process of how we found this issue and how we addressed it.

The Inconsistent Aimed Shot
Most abilities in Arcane Legends use a player's Bonus Damage when calculating how much damage to deal. Abilities in Arcane Legends also have a minimum amount of damage, as well as a maximum amount of damage they can deal, which provides the damage range you see in game. Specifically in the case of Aimed Shot, if you have the upgrades Accuracy and Critical Shot, the maximum damage the ability could do was applying a player's bonus damage twice. This resulted in the maximum damage for Aimed Shot if you have these 2 upgrades dealing a lot more damage than any other combination of Aimed Shot. This difference became more exaggerated the higher your Bonus Damage was which means that as Rogues level up higher and put more points into Dexterity the problem would only get worse.

Why this is a problem
Before I start this section I do want to reiterate that the point of this update is not to make Aimed Shot deal less damage. These changes are being done to make Aimed Shot more consistent both from a player perspective, and from a balance perspective. When any class has a skill or item that behaves in a crazy manner, it affects the balance of all classes and how we perceive them. When we make balance changes, especially large ones like the PvP adjustments earlier this year, we consider all classes under the expectation that they're behaving as we've intended them too. Anomalies like Aimed Shot dealing double Bonus Damage, or the Wildfire proc ignoring armor make us think Rogues are dealing the right amount of damage, or that Sorcerers are dealing too much damage, and so on. This isn't the actual case though, because a Rogue without Critical Shot and Accuracy is not doing enough damage by a large margin, and a Sorcerer not using a staff with Wildfire isn't dealing too much damage to mobs. Once we identify and correct these anomalies, we can better maintain the balance of all classes in AL.

The Adjustments
Again, the goal is not to reduce the amount of damage Aimed Shot does overall, but to make Aimed Shot more consistent and predictable. We have removed the issue of Aimed Shot with Critical Shot and Accuracy counting Bonus Damage twice, but to compensate for the loss of potential damage that Rogues are used to, we have increased other multipliers of Aimed Shot so that the average damage before the change will be the same after the change.
To more clearly show how the Aimed Shot will be affecting players, I've taken stats from various Rogues in Arcane Legends. With their STR, DEX, and INT values, I calculated their Aimed Shot damage if they were wearing the Immortal Corruption Bow. These calculations do not include any form of pet bonuses and damage jewels were not added.



Here is how the 6 Rogues looked before any changes were made to Aimed Shot.



Player

STR
DEX
INT
Aimed Shot Minimum Damage
Aimed Shot Maximum Damage
Aimed Shot Average Damage


Rogue 1

168

787

158

1383

3106

2244



Rogue 2

104

650

94

1155

2548

1851



Rogue 3

119

707

117

1247

2775

2011



Rogue 4

135

821

182

1443

3254

2348



Rogue 5

75

785

211

1392

3127

2259



Rogue 6

135

835

197

1469

3318

2394




Here are the same 6 Rogues after the upcoming changes to Aimed Shot go live


Player

STR
DEX
INT
Aimed Shot Minimum Damage
Aimed Shot Maximum Damage
Aimed Shot Average Damage



Rogue 1

168

787

158

1669

3060

2365



Rogue 2

104

650

94

1385

2519

1952



Rogue 3

119

707

117

1500

2739

2119



Rogue 4

135

821

182

1744

3203

2474



Rogue 5

75

785

211

1680

3080

2380



Rogue 6

135

835

197

1777

3265

2521




As you can see, the results of this change were to increase the minimum damage of Aimed Shot, while bringing down the maximum damage of Aimed Shot slightly, resulting in most cases a slight increase of Aimed Shot average damage. Because this new formula doesn't count Bonus Damage twice in the equation, it won't be scaling out of control as Rogues acquire more DEX through levels and gear.

As always we appreciate the community's feedback and understanding while this issue with Aimed Shot has been fixed!

PewPewPew,
-STSVroom

[intizamfamily888]

First
And nice to see that they get their damage back

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[Ireliaa]

looks nice on table lets test it out in game

seems to me min damage buffed max reduced average increased overall

[Lawpvp]

Barely changed the dmg at all. If an an endgame rogue was critting a tank with jugg for 300 before, now they'll hit for 360. Hip hip hooray. 3.6% of a 10k health tank. Seems balanced

[Justg]

Barely changed the dmg at all. If an an endgame rogue was critting a tank with jugg for 300 before, now they'll hit for 360. Hip hip hooray. 3.6% of a 10k health tank. Seems balanced

You understand how averages work, right? If you were involved with said tank of 10K health, you should do as much (or slightly more) damage to them. Hip hip hooray!

[azicheebahan]

If this was posted in beginning 9 pages of drama would have been avoided,Ty vroom

[Valkiryas]

His Vroom!

There's any update on Dragon Hunter Sword?! That sword and it's procs are killing endgame and 46 Twinks, those procs are dealing way too much damage for all targets on them.

[Ireliaa]

You understand how averages work, right? If you were involved with said tank of 10K health, you should do as much (or slightly more) damage to them. Hip hip hooray!

it applies on long term dpsing,like parse, now we cant do lucky bruiser high aimshot max dmg

yet the cut from max damage isnt that significant so i dont see any problem

anyway that still doesnt fix the current stiuation of pvp clash issue(not talking abour 1 vs 1 situation) we have you can deny it but its there
at least we got the aim back

[Lawpvp]

You understand how averages work, right? If you were involved with said tank of 10K health, you should do as much (or slightly more) damage to them. Hip hip hooray!

You understand thats irrelevant because 300 crit aimed shot on an endgame tank is a joke. Going off the the changes that 300 crit would increase roughly 20% and still be irrelevant. Maybe if i use 20 aimed shots. Not to mention rogues still wont do nearly as much dmg as before and were even at a disadvantage to tanks then

Unless there are other secret buffs being added, which wouldnt surprise me I dont expect this to be enough

[Ireliaa]

You understand thats irrelevant because 300 crit aimed shot on an endgame tank is a joke. Going off the the changes that 300 crit would increase roughly 20% and still be irrelevant. Maybe if i use 20 aimed shots. Not to mention rogues still wont do nearly as much dmg as before and were even at a disadvantage to tanks then

Unless there are other secret buffs being added, which wouldnt surprise me I dont expect this to be enough

exacly what im trying to say

[Justg]

You understand thats irrelevant because 300 crit aimed shot on an endgame tank is a joke. Going off the the changes that 300 crit would increase roughly 20% and still be irrelevant. Maybe if i use 20 aimed shots. Not to mention rogues still wont do nearly as much dmg as before and were even at a disadvantage to tanks then

Unless there are other secret buffs being added, which wouldnt surprise me I dont expect this to be enough

How about you check it out before immediately dismissing it?

[Lawpvp]

How about you check it out before immediately dismissing it?

I plan to, this is purely my speculation. Hence, "i dont expect this to be enough"

[Justg]

I plan to, this is purely my speculation. Hence, "i dont expect this to be enough"

Awesome, please let us know how it feels!

[Golem]

congratz rogues! :)

[Quonabebi]

Sounds,nice ty StS

[Ireliaa]

i want to apologise for previous rant, because i thought the change on it was permanent, and compensation was uncertain probably bc misunderstanding/communication

now i can do more damage wtihout unlucky min damage and seems more consistent high hits on pve

[bonjovi3223]

You understand thats irrelevant because 300 crit aimed shot on an endgame tank is a joke. Going off the the changes that 300 crit would increase roughly 20% and still be irrelevant. Maybe if i use 20 aimed shots. Not to mention rogues still wont do nearly as much dmg as before and were even at a disadvantage to tanks then

Unless there are other secret buffs being added, which wouldnt surprise me I dont expect this to be enough


exacly what im trying to say
This thread is about reinstating aimed shot with the fix they have applied. It is not about doubling the old AS dmg. Pls take your rants on a new thread.

[( DAMAGE )]

we tested aimed shot just 3 hours ago on a level 56 tank with 3.1k armor
charged crit aimed shot did 3.6k damage...well we did like 6 tries all were in between 3.2/3.6k
how does it do more max damage than what said on ur tablet?
and b4 aimed shot fix it used to crit 6/7k on 56 tanks!

[Justg]

we tested aimed shot just 3 hours ago on a level 56 tank with 3.1k armor
charged crit aimed shot did 3.6k damage...well we did like 6 tries all were in between 3.2/3.6k
how does it do more max damage than what said on ur tablet?
and b4 aimed shot fix it used to crit 6/7k on 56 tanks!

We just made the bounce with the fix.

[arcanefid]

we tested aimed shot just 3 hours ago on a level 56 tank with 3.1k armor
charged crit aimed shot did 3.6k damage...well we did like 6 tries all were in between 3.2/3.6k
how does it do more max damage than what said on ur tablet?
and b4 aimed shot fix it used to crit 6/7k on 56 tanks!

I think hitting for 6/7K damage on tanks is why it had to be nerfed

[Justg]

i want to apologise for previous rant, because i thought the change on it was permanent, and compensation was uncertain probably bc misunderstanding/communication

now i can do more damage wtihout unlucky min damage and seems more consistent high hits on pve

We get that this is a passionate issue, thanks for checking it out again and letting us know how it feels!

[( DAMAGE )]

idk how this works..
aimed shot atm did 6.5k damage on a level 56 tank!
is it back to how it was supposed to be 7k shots?
edit..is ut tablet showing the minimum and maximum damage without the crit?
like with that 250% on a crit would land a 7.5k shot if im right!
just need to understand what u guys changed coz it seems just like before maybe even better

[Ireliaa]

We get that this is a passionate issue, thanks for checking it out again and letting us know how it feels!

well in pvp nothing changed still mage warr fest. Only thing i can kill is other rogues . Cant win clash against 2 mage+ 2warr team no matter what( except if i find lucky alone mage wandering around)

[VROOMIGoRealFast]

idk how this works..
aimed shot atm did 6.5k damage on a level 56 tank!
is it back to how it was supposed to be 7k shots?

If you're only looking at the highest damage you're doing firing Aimed Shot, you'll see lower numbers than before. If you take the total damage you deal over a bunch of Aimed Shots, you'll see higher damage.

[( DAMAGE )]

I think hitting for 6/7K damage on tanks is why it had to be nerfed

after this last update it still is hitting tanks 6k+

[( DAMAGE )]

If you're only looking at the highest damage you're doing firing Aimed Shot, you'll see lower numbers than before. If you take the total damage you deal over a bunch of Aimed Shots, you'll see higher damage.

it still is doing 6k+ crits on 56 tanks.....
just not clear what fix-buff or nerf u did to it since the last to last update
it just seems better and more over powered!
Edit :just trying to understand what this fix was! tnx anyways

[intrepd]

We get that this is a passionate issue, thanks for checking it out again and letting us know how it feels!

That fix was worth it, tbh i dont really feel anything different from before nerf till now but its fine, can you look at korruption now since aimshot issue is done?

[AngryLucas]

For the example of the rogue 1, the difference between MaxBefore 3106 and MaxUpcoming 3060 is 46 and between AvBefore 2244 and AvUpcoming 2365 is 121.

This means that eventually the rogue will deal 46 damage less and on average the rogue will deal 121 more. More average damage for the character with the higher DPS.

Where is the balance? Thank you.

[soon]

1 - without upgrade the Aimed mastery?
2 - The other skill will be changes?

[eiv]

idk how this works..
aimed shot atm did 6.5k damage on a level 56 tank!
is it back to how it was supposed to be 7k shots?
edit..is ut tablet showing the minimum and maximum damage without the crit?
like with that 250% on a crit would land a 7.5k shot if im right!
just need to understand what u guys changed coz it seems just like before maybe even better

The table is only showing certain cases , with rogues of different damages , so a rogue with higher damage can do more damage

[Lunarpvp]

Thank you devs!!!

[Zeus]

The aimed seems to do more consistent damage, but I need some more time to play with it and test in many environments to see if it's any good. I fear that since we are missing our top end damage we will be even more useless in PvP when compared to the other classes, both of which have shields with considerable damage reduction to save them while still dishing out pretty good damage.

[Justg]

The aimed seems to do more consistent damage, but I need some more time to play with it and test in many environments to see if it's any good. I fear that since we are missing our top end damage we will be even more useless in PvP when compared to the other classes, both of which have shields with considerable damage reduction to save them while still dishing out pretty good damage.

Please test before speculation. Haven't we had enough drama on this issue?

[Shadowfaux]

Pardon me for saying so but isn't it your guyses job to test it before we even see it?

Sent from my LGMS550 using Tapatalk

[Justg]

Pardon me for saying so but isn't it your guyses job to test it before we even see it?

Nothing is the same as a Live environment.

[epicrrr]

I think hitting for 6/7K damage on tanks is why it had to be nerfed

Omg so theyre like 1-2 lucky max dmg crit hit before the changes? *shivers

[Zeus]

Please test before speculation. Haven't we had enough drama on this issue?

Yes, I am testing. That's why I didn't say anything bad about it yet! I'm just saying I'm fearful that'll be the case. We will see and I'll update as I get time to test.

Thanks Gary!

[Zeus]

Okay so I tested rogue against a warrior and mage scenario and it still does not stand a chance. It was not my team either, considering that my team was compromised of the team that I use for tournaments. The strategies were solid, but nothing works to help a rogue live against a pure warrior and sorcerer team. Therefore, rogues are still an outcast in PvP unless there is a rogue on the other side.

The spike damage which gave rogues a meager chance before is gone as well. So, we need some sort of adjustment. If developers could take a look what exactly happens to a rogue against a warrior and sorcerer stack...that would be great. Essentially, all the warriors and sorcerers have to do is shield and rush the other team with a rogue in it. There is nothing the rogue can do to win. The sorcerers cannot be slowed, due to the shields, and nobody dies during the rush either because of the multiple shields and multiple heals.

[Ireliaa]

Okay so I tested rogue against a warrior and mage scenario and it still does not stand a chance. It was not my team either, considering that my team was compromised of the team that I use for tournaments. The strategies were solid, but nothing works to help a rogue live against a pure warrior and sorcerer team. Therefore, rogues are still an outcast in PvP unless there is a rogue on the other side.

The spike damage which gave rogues a meager chance before is gone as well. So, we need some sort of adjustment. If developers could take a look what exactly happens to a rogue against a warrior and sorcerer stack...that would be great. Essentially, all the warriors and sorcerers have to do is shield and rush the other team with a rogue in it. There is nothing the rogue can do to win. The sorcerers cannot be slowed, due to the shields, and nobody dies during the rush either because of the multiple shields and multiple heals.

did the same had the same result and told about it, not trying to make a drama but we still fall behind considerably

[andreim]

hey, don't forget about twinks, don't change things that are viable only for endgame cases/scenarios

[Carapace]

Thanks for the follow-up feedback guys, now that Aim Shot is stabilized we can take a look at an issue like this with a clearer picture of what may need to be done.

PvE still feels on par with before? I know the comments above are specifically PvP related, just trying to get a broader picture.

[Avaree]

Hi Cara,

I solo tested a few mobs in an elite southern gate map after the hotfix. I feel I have more damage with normal aimed shot than before the fix (I dont use charged aimed shot very often).
Thanks,
Ava

[mrm]

Okay so I tested rogue against a warrior and mage scenario and it still does not stand a chance. It was not my team either, considering that my team was compromised of the team that I use for tournaments. The strategies were solid, but nothing works to help a rogue live against a pure warrior and sorcerer team. Therefore, rogues are still an outcast in PvP unless there is a rogue on the other side.

The spike damage which gave rogues a meager chance before is gone as well. So, we need some sort of adjustment. If developers could take a look what exactly happens to a rogue against a warrior and sorcerer stack...that would be great. Essentially, all the warriors and sorcerers have to do is shield and rush the other team with a rogue in it. There is nothing the rogue can do to win. The sorcerers cannot be slowed, due to the shields, and nobody dies during the rush either because of the multiple shields and multiple heals.

How does it preform in 1 vs 1?

[BabVna]

PVE looks good now with update. Thanks team

[Ireliaa]

Thanks for the follow-up feedback guys, now that Aim Shot is stabilized we can take a look at an issue like this with a clearer picture of what may need to be done.

PvE still feels on par with before? I know the comments above are specifically PvP related, just trying to get a broader picture.

pve is fine its more consistent damage as expected from table, tested and im fine with it
only problem we have is with pvp as from comments suggest

[Zeus]

How does it preform in 1 vs 1?

The usual. Rogue loses to warrior, but wins against Mage. So, in a 1v1, it is fine. Although, I will do some testing just to make sure.

[Eagleye]

Definetly notice the consistency from a pve standpoint, which is nice.

[intizamfamily888]

I won't be surprised if rogues get an arcane shield aswell after this much pvp complain....

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[mrm]

The usual. Rogue loses to warrior, but wins against Mage. So, in a 1v1, it is fine. Although, I will do some testing just to make sure.

Zeus i rember in one of you postes that you said that rougs are useliss now in clashes
A team with a rouge in vs a full team of war and mages the team with the rouge would underpreform
The resion for this as im seeing it is due to a rouge is a high dmg dealer against a single target that means thay sould actully over preform in 1 vs 1 but that seems yo be a bit of problim in vsing a tank

Now for the clash part due to most of a mages skills being crowd controll
And there nearlly unlimted mana suply that makes them perfect for a clash
And with a tank to soak up all the damge and the mages constintly healling him thay make a absolute team
But when adding a single targit rouge in to the part thay loose alot of crowd control power and most of the rouges atks are directid at the tank but with the mages that keeps healing him that makes the rouge bit useliss
Mayby the one way to make the rouge more usefull if the rouge mayby try getting around the war myby spliting from the party and moveing around try to stay out of sight intill the mages shiled goes in cd the start hitting them not sure if it will work tho

This is the way i see it way rouges are not needid for clashis anymore not sure if its the right resion
*sorry about any grammar mestakes

[DarrenPR]

For what it's worth: I ran arena after the fix to our aimed shot dmg and the times are showing that aimed shot is just as useful with regards to average damage output as it was before for at least the lower/mid end of PvE.

[Safiras]

Zeus i rember in one of you postes that you said that rougs are useliss now in clashes
A team with a rouge in vs a full team of war and mages the team with the rouge would underpreform
The resion for this as im seeing it is due to a rouge is a high dmg dealer against a single target that means thay sould actully over preform in 1 vs 1 but that seems yo be a bit of problim in vsing a tank

Now for the clash part due to most of a mages skills being crowd controll
And there nearlly unlimted mana suply that makes them perfect for a clash
And with a tank to soak up all the damge and the mages constintly healling him thay make a absolute team
But when adding a single targit rouge in to the part thay loose alot of crowd control power and most of the rouges atks are directid at the tank but with the mages that keeps healing him that makes the rouge bit useliss
Mayby the one way to make the rouge more usefull if the rouge mayby try getting around the war myby spliting from the party and moveing around try to stay out of sight intill the mages shiled goes in cd the start hitting them not sure if it will work tho

This is the way i see it way rouges are not needid for clashis anymore not sure if its the right resion
*sorry about any grammar mestakes

My experience with clashes is that what you suggest is easier said than done. More experienced PvP mages know how to use their tanks to hide from damaging combos. Good tanks also know how to use Axe Throw to prevent rogues from crossing over to attack their own DPS.

Your stated reasons for why rogues are less useful are correct. With rogues having no reliable defensive skill to protect temporarily from damage nukes they will stay irrelevant in clashes.