PVP Updates: Proposed Balance Changes PART 2 (7/22/2016)

[Hpnvx]

Form experience I've rarely seen a mage being on shoted by a single rogue through shield in a clash.

[Plqgue]

Tbh I stopped reading at 4.5k crit

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Bruh like us makes that have been playing the class every day don't know what our own damage outputs are

[Deathclaw]

The devs should test this themselves out before any big changes are implemented into the game. A lot of the statements that are coming from rogues are far from true.

[Breakingbadxx]

Let's hope the issue rogue's have in clashes gets reasonably solved soon. Because the last thing we need is the rogue community asking for the DODGE aspect of this game to be introduced as it works in other games. May I remind you that a 'rogue' type class in most games uses dodge to its full potential when compared to other classes, I.e. dodging is what glass cannons do best.

Rogue type classes with dodge are a nightmare to go up against in many games.

BUT, this is an aspect of their class and they can't be denied it.

Let's not get to that stage.

I'm sure if this was to happen, the ones "crying" wouldn't be the rogue community.

[Deathclaw]

Let's hope the issue rogue's have in clashes gets reasonably solved soon. Because the last thing we need is the rogue community asking for the DODGE aspect of this game to be introduced as it works in other games. May I remind you that a 'rogue' type class in most games uses dodge to its full potential I.e. dodging is what glass cannons do best.

Rogue type classes with dodge are a nightmare to go up against in many games.

BUT, this is an aspect of their class and they can't be denied it.

Let's not get to that stage.

I'm sure if this was to happen, the ones "crying" wouldn't be the rogue community.

If that gets implemented mages should be able to freeze in pvp , frost mages are also a nightmare to deal with as i have experienced from playing other mmos.

[Breakingbadxx]

If that gets implemented mages should be able to freeze in pvp , frost mages are also a nightmare to deal with as i have experienced from playing other mmos.
From the way dodging will work if it was made to work properly, a rogue dodging your 'frost' would be the last of your worries.

Let's just hope it doesn't get to that stage, because some from the mage community present here who seem to be against the rogue class receiving a reasonable change to make them a usable class in PvP clashes, are just asking for it.

[Plqgue]

From the way dodging will work if it was made to work properly, a rogue dodging your 'frost' would be the last of your worries.

Let's just hope it doesn't get to that stage, because some from the mage community present here who seem to be against the rogue class receiving a reasonable change to make them a usable class in PvP clashes, are just asking for it.

You mean those of us who are against them adding armor and buffing survivability of a class that isn't supposed to survive everything and just want the classes damage to be buffed while sts implements a class restriction in pvp ? You guys are actively trying to break pvp ...again

[Deathclaw]

From the way dodging will work if it was made to work properly, a rogue dodging your 'frost' would be the last of your worries.

Let's just hope it doesn't get to that stage, because some from the mage community present here who seem to be against the rogue class receiving a reasonable change to make them a usable class in PvP clashes, are just asking for it.

We are trying to fix pvp not break it.

[Saud]

I think rogues die too fast
Maybe give them there armor back (maybe 10% armor?)
Cause they already do damage
The problem here not damage
It's the survivability

I am mage

[Plqgue]

I think rogues die too fast
Maybe give them there armor back (maybe 10% armor?)
Cause they already do damage
The problem here not damage
It's the survivability

I am mage

We believe Rogues should take on the role of a "Glass Cannon". They should deal high amounts of damage, mostly focused on a single target, while being squishy if not careful. We want to continue improving this Cannon aspect of Rogues, without removing the Glass.

without removing the Glass.
Do you get what this means?

[intrepd]

But that's not true. Mages are support and dps rogues are pure paper dps and that's how it was supposed to be in the first place but for three years y'all were too tanky and and now that you aren't as tanky you die slot more there is no Nerf/buff needed class restrictions what's needed..
Cmon go tell them, I asked for a class restriction and same people are complaining about they wanna play with friends, fine still make a new CTF map with class restrictions then, this way you can play a fair clash in the new map, stack whatever with ur friends in old one.

[DAmage126]

Not at all, well try think about this scenario :

A mage attacks a rogue with the Shield on, my average with my shield on 5/5 is around 15 seconds or more and with almost 70% damage reduction.

You're saying that a rogue SHOULD wait untill shield goes off .... Mmmm in 15 seconds a mage can kill a rogue ....

Our survivality is just way too low.

Rogues have low survivability? 15 seconds mage can kill a rogue? Rogues kill mage in 1 second with aim shot crit and we our shield is easily popped by a few moves

[Nikool991]

I think you misunderstand this thread. The purpose of this thread is to make rogues useful, not make them even more useless. This change will encourage curse, which in turn encourages mage stack, which in turn promotes how useless rogue is in a team environment.

I'm not mad either, I'm just speaking with logic. Someone is free to prove me wrong on what I am saying, but the truth lies within itself. Additionally, using course would not create an opportunity for the tank/mage. If your DPS wipes, the rest of the team follows as well because you lose a lot of offensive damage. The negligible trade-off of losing an attack skill is worth it in this scenario.
Dont get me wrong here...but i think this thread is for class balance and not just for rogues dude

[intrepd]

Dont get me wrong here...but i think this thread is for class balance and not just for rogues dude

Both of the other classes are fine right now it's only rogues who's left but ur right its for balance

[Plqgue]

Cmon go tell them, I asked for a class restriction and same people are complaining about they wanna play with friends, fine still make a new CTF map with class restrictions then, this way you can play a fair clash in the new map, stack whatever with ur friends in old one.

Bro it's what seriously needed screw them and their friends clash it's time for pure balance which isn't achieved through Nerf's and buffs as we've seen proven over the past few years but class restriction

[Safiras]

Can I ask a question to those who have been actively engaged in this discussion? My experience is limited to endgame PvP and I haven't tried twink PvP before. Is the imbalance as bad as what is being seen at endgame?

[Plqgue]

Can I ask a question to those who have been actively engaged in this discussion? My experience is limited to endgame PvP and I haven't tried twink PvP before. Is the imbalance as bad as what is being seen at endgame?

It probably is since twinks got nerfed too

[Nikool991]

Both of the other classes are fine right now it's only rogues who's left but ur right its for balance
Not really left so far for rogues...compairing to past few seasons where arcane legends is called rogue legends

[intrepd]

Bro it's what seriously needed screw them and their friends clash it's time for pure balance which isn't achieved through Nerf's and buffs as we've seen proven over the past few years but class restriction

Look at it like this, i agree that buffing rogue will solve it but in few seasons there will be a buff needed again for a class (idk probably mages or rogues) best way is to make a class restriction on a NEW CTF MAP so everyone will be able to play with there friends in that CTF old map, class restriction is on new map to be fair.

if rogues get buffed now it will solve it for this expansion but who knows what will happen next expansion for all classes just like the past seasons

[Fredystern]

Geez what you ever see it on twink eye? In 48 1low gear mage+ 1full geared mage and 2 full geared rogue could beat 4warrior :/ i didnt see what to buff and nerf in 48, the only problem is the arc sword 46 proc

[intrepd]

Geez what you ever see it on twink eye? In 48 1low gear mage+ 1full geared mage and 2 full geared rogue could beat 4warrior :/ i didnt see what to buff and nerf in 48, the only problem is the arc sword 46 proc

how can a rogue beat 4 warriors? u talking about 4vs1 or 5vs5 against 4 warriors lol

[Fredystern]

how can a rogue beat 4 warriors? u talking about 4vs1 or 5vs5 against 4 warriors lol

4v4 its happen yesterday to me when playimg magr

[intrepd]

4v4 its happen yesterday to me when playimg magr

How about 2 tanks 2 mages 1 rogue vs 2 tanks 3 mages? can the rogue survive? i dont know about 48 but in 56 she cant

[Fredystern]

How about 2 tanks 2 mages 1 rogue vs 2 tanks 3 mages? can the rogue survive? i dont know about 48 but in 56 she cant
Not sure but if the mage could stay beside the rogue, i think rogue wont die

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[intrepd]

Not sure but if the mage could stay beside the rogue, i think rogue wont die

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the issue is the damage is pretty high at 56, even if the mage does and heals her its just not enough to survive against 3 mages.

[reiewaun]

Hey All,

We reviewed how Curse works in terms of reflecting damage. Curse puts a debuff on the enemy causing them to deal damage to themselves, based on their own damage stat. The reflected damage is not based on the amount of outgoing damage. This means that Aimed Shot, Noxious Bolt, or a basic attack will all return the exact same amount of damage to the Rogue.

From our perspective, this would make Noxious Bolt more worthwhile against a Sorcerer using Curse, because I will be dealing more damage to the Sorcerer, while taking the same amount of damage. There is also a very large range discrepancy between Curse and Noxious Bolt, Noxious Bolt has 3x the range of Curse.

Please keep the discussion going over the weekend and remember, be civil!
-STSVroom

Range has nothing to do in a clash, a mage with the invulnerability on shield and a speed set can just around, go in the back, toss a combo of fireball, lightning and curse and go back and hide on his wars,ask experienced players,don't depend on how game is developed, besides speed set not good for rogue vs wars and mages on clash, so mages will run like speedy Gonzalez and rip us apart
What I suggest me as rogue need for clash is survivability and the only way for it is getting hp or armor buff in pvp

[reiewaun]

Rogues have low survivability? 15 seconds mage can kill a rogue? Rogues kill mage in 1 second with aim shot crit and we our shield is easily popped by a few moves

Play pvp pls or get urself a pack of experience, if u don't known play mage, how to switch bubbles and when to focus on killing a rogue u prolly need to go cry on other thread, besides rogues with that scissors, rock, paper are supposed to kill mages, but it's not that easy cause rogues can't shot out as u say equally geared mages a rogue if not careful can lose vs mage, mages have 2 bubbles, also killing a war is almost impossible

[Ireliaa]

i see from comments mages are supporting it
lol is this mage balancing or? why do you guys try so hard to keep rogue out of pvp?

[Fredystern]

i see from comments mages are supporting it
lol is this mage balancing or? why do you guys try so hard to keep rogue out of pvp?

Cause we hate when rog just 1combo us when we didnt saw the rogue in clash, im serious 5.2k hp only 1aim with critical in 48 i dont know how much the damage in 56

[Ireliaa]

Cause we hate when rog just 1combo us when we didnt saw the rogue in clash, im serious 5.2k hp only 1aim with critical in 48 i dont know how much the damage in 56

if you cant handle the concept of " rogue " and "glass cannon" i suggest you to leave the rpg games
and no 2 mage taking 2 rogue right now u dont play the game?

[yubaraj]

My suggestion is to find some volunteers. Set up some tournaments. Record it log it do whatever need to. Watch it study it and try to find what's going on. Now you can see STS that you guys need to come with another solution because this buff is not gonna make rogue happy.

Take some time. No need to rush it. Try to make most people happy lol.

I don't think this thread is gonna be much help as I can see.

[Fredystern]

if you cant handle the concept of " rogue " and "glass cannon" i suggest you to leave the rpg games
and no 2 mage taking 2 rogue right now u dont play the game?
Ah whatever you only see everthing on rogue side not on warrior and mage side too

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[reiewaun]

Ah whatever you only see everthing on rogue side not on warrior and mage side too

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The mage and war side is to farm rogues on pvp?lol wtf

[Fredystern]

The mage and war side is to farm rogues on pvp?lol wtf
Nope rogue farm mage and warrior if they arent good enough in my brackets, but if the mage and warrior was skilled we wont know the result

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[Ireliaa]

Cause we hate when rog just 1combo us when we didnt saw the rogue in clash, im serious 5.2k hp only 1aim with critical in 48 i dont know how much the damage in 56

you arent even playing endgame what are you arguing here because you cant play mage rogue should be out of pvp teams?
people like you causing this balance to go nowhere

problem is obvious rogues stating that and solution is also obvious yet people here shooting opinions without having rogue cauing chaos and mess
i am seriously tired of looking on this threads its all jibberish talk without any progress

[Fredystern]

you arent even playing endgame what are you arguing here because you cant play mage rogue should be out of pvp teams?
people like you causing this balance to go nowhere

problem is obvious rogues stating that and solution is also obvious yet people here shooting opinions without having rogue cauing chaos and mess
i am seriously tired of looking on this threads its all jibberish talk without any progress
Sec
I cant play mage? -.- what i dreaming yesterday i was rarely die when clash and i cant play mage? Well mostly i was focus on protecting my rogue, and i say i dont know the condition in 56 so dont saying like im a newbie in pvp

Usually rogue was the who kill me in clash cause i know rogue was very strong in vs, even you think rogue was very useless in pvp but they do alot of damage in clash but mostly thier target was single, than compared to a mage, mage was only supporter that will try to keep thier ally to alive that what i got from being a mage from start AL, if you dont think like that, so why all rog usually focus on a mage than a warr than? After mage die warr will die soon if in bad states, compared ato a rogue, as Vroom say they was glass cannon thats mean do alot of damage but easily get killed, but if vs with a mage? They mostly survive that what i see from twink 9,22,41,48
As i say dont touch twink brackets anymore, we like what we got here and its only endgame problem not twink, so dont make any buff or nerf anymore in twink
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[Breakingbadxx]

Mage uses arcane shield > mage rushes rogue > mage places curse on rogue > rogue uses "buffed" noxus bolt > 2 second invulnerability on arcane shield negates noxus bolt damage > rogue takes reflected noxus bolt damage > rogue is hit with other attacks + DOT's > rogue dies.

This will all happen within 10 seconds. This is balance improvement right? Correct me if I'm wrong.

[Zeus]

Mage uses arcane shield > mage rushes rogue > mage places curse on rogue > rogue uses "buffed" noxus bolt > 2 second invulnerability on arcane shield negates noxus bolt damage > rogue takes reflected noxus bolt damage > rogue is hit with other attacks + DOT's > rogue dies.

This will all happen within 10 seconds. This is balance improvement right? Correct me if I'm wrong.

It's extremely difficult to explain this. I had sorcerers using curse last night and the second it lands, I'm wiping even faster than before. However, in developer's eyes, this will be a buff...In reality, it's just going to encourage sorcerers to use curse and further exacerbate the problem of rogues not having a place in PvP.

[Ireliaa]

solution is simple, buff the overall damage of rogue in pvp reduce the mage and warrior damage adjust it until it feels balanced with krdles pvp tests
reduction of jugger or shield option eliminated this is what we have left

yet we will hear others against this no matter what
people against rogue damage buff
people against shield or jugger reductions
people against proc adjustments
people against rogues overall?

nox 2x posion tick clearly has no effect and we had it before with the nox mastery bug, thats why mages rushing here and supporting it to close the deal

[Zeus]

solution is simple, buff the overall damage of rogue in pvp reduce the mage and warrior damage adjust it until it feels balanced with krdles pvp tests
reduction of jugger or shield option eliminated this is what we have left

yet we will hear others against this no matter what
people against rogue damage buff
people against shield or jugger reductions
people against proc adjustments
people against rogues overall?

nox 2x posion tick clearly has no effect and we had it before with the nox mastery bug, thats why mages rushing here and supporting it to close the deal

Exactly, lol. Sorcerers are supporting it because they know it benefits them and are trying to strong arm the developers about it.

[Ireliaa]

Exactly, lol. Sorcerers are supporting it because they know it benefits them and are trying to strong arm the developers about it.

funny thing is, they cancel proposals without testing in actual pvp enviroment because of random opinions, they should have at least gave it a chance last time.

[Plqgue]

if you cant handle the concept of " rogue " and "glass cannon" i suggest you to leave the rpg games
and no 2 mage taking 2 rogue right now u dont play the game?

Do you know that glass is broken easily?

[Plqgue]

solution is simple, buff the overall damage of rogue in pvp reduce the mage and warrior damage adjust it until it feels balanced with krdles pvp tests
reduction of jugger or shield option eliminated this is what we have left

yet we will hear others against this no matter what
people against rogue damage buff
people against shield or jugger reductions
people against proc adjustments
people against rogues overall?

nox 2x posion tick clearly has no effect and we had it before with the nox mastery bug, thats why mages rushing here and supporting it to close the deal

So once again the solution is buff rogues and Nerf the other classes....this is why mages are against you guys you only think of your class

[Plqgue]

Exactly, lol. Sorcerers are supporting it because they know it benefits them and are trying to strong arm the developers about it.

Says the guy who's literally trying to strong-arm developers to Nerf the other classes and buff his because he isn't top dog anymore

[Zeus]

Says the guy who's literally trying to strong-arm developers to Nerf the other classes and buff his because he isn't top dog anymore

That's not the truth at all, please do not twist things. Rogues literally do not have a place in PvP anymore. Why are others being so selfish to not allow rogues a place in PvP?

[Hpnvx]

solution is simple, buff the overall damage of rogue in pvp reduce the mage and warrior damage adjust it until it feels balanced with krdles pvp tests
reduction of jugger or shield option eliminated this is what we have left

yet we will hear others against this no matter what
people against rogue damage buff
people against shield or jugger reductions
people against proc adjustments
people against rogues overall?

nox 2x posion tick clearly has no effect and we had it before with the nox mastery bug, thats why mages rushing here and supporting it to close the deal
Lmfao, you dont know what balance is form these postes you've been making in all these threads I've seen you in is about nerfing tanks, ''nerf 46 proc to op'' etc etc etc etc..... quit crying about tanks ''Ruling to much in pvp'',worry about your self quit trying to nerf the game cause of something you can't handle.

[Niixed]

Says the guy who's literally trying to strong-arm developers to Nerf the other classes and buff his because he isn't top dog anymore

No player is able to "strong arm" developers. If this player you speak of has the power to strong arm devs, how then did rogues end up the weakest in PvP?

Nox bolt poison damage increase sounds like it would be a wash, from what I can gather. Nox bolt is popular in PvP, but it seems far too narrow of a fix because, to benefit, ALL Rogues in PvP would be required to get Nox bolt with poison upgrade. Knowing that every Rogue has Nox bolt poison would cause mages to use curse more often, thus discouraging Rogues from embracing Nox bolt poison upgrade and fewer would use it. Thus, Rogues would end up in exactly the same position as were before the Nox bolt poison damage buff.

I think Rogues should receive a 1% damage buff AND a 1% armor buff PER WEEK until it seems like Rogues are too strong. Then, devs should nerf 1% damage and 1% armor PER WEEK until balance achieved. In this way Devs would be able to detect balance by examining statistics and gauging player reaction. It would be imperfect, but would allow devs to hone in on a good balance, call it BoT, or Balance-over-Time. :P

[Zeus]

No player is able to "strong arm" developers. If this player you speak of has the power to strong arm devs, how then did rogues end up the weakest in PvP?

Nox bolt poison damage increase sounds like it would be a wash, from what I can gather. Nox bolt is popular in PvP, but it seems far too narrow of a fix because, to benefit, ALL Rogues in PvP would be required to get Nox bolt with poison upgrade. Knowing that every Rogue has Nox bolt poison would cause mages to use curse more often, thus discouraging Rogues from embracing Nox bolt poison upgrade and fewer would use it. Thus, Rogues would end up in exactly the same position as were before the Nox bolt poison damage buff.

I think Rogues should receive a 1% damage buff AND a 1% armor buff PER WEEK until it seems like Rogues are too strong. Then, devs should nerf 1% damage and 1% armor PER WEEK until balance achieved. In this way Devs would be able to detect balance by examining statistics and gauging player reaction. It would be imperfect, but would allow devs to hone in on a good balance, all it BoT, or Balance-over-Time. :P

This would be an awesome solution. Thank you for being level-headed and fair and not seeking vengeance for things of the past.

[Anyona]

Buffing damage is not the answer, I'm currently using Ribbit AA on SnS to reduce the amount of RNG within a rogue v mage scenario. Buff their heal so it has some sort of benefit to the team. Increase the damage reduction of Razor to around 25-30% and they should be set in a clash. Of course if the heal is too strong, re evaluate whether they should have as much damage. Survivability is the key to a balanced game.


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[Breakingbadxx]

I suggest the aimed shot or noxus bolt mastery for the rogue class be given a change.

Either mastery should be changed to such:

?% chance to disrupt/mute an enemy. Enemies disrupted/muted are unable to use skills or basic attacks for ?seconds.

*Ideally it should increase in chance to disrupt/mute and number of seconds enemies are disrupted/muted as it gets upgraded e.g. 1/10 will allow for 2% chance to disrupt/mute and 0.3 seconds of disruption/mute. Increasing at a rate of 2% chance and 0.3 seconds per upgrade. The end result would be 20% chance to disrupt/mute for 3 seconds.

This is an ability given to glass cannons to increase their survivability and usefullness in many other games.

As you should know, glass cannons are built for 1v1 scenario's, but not all glass cannons want to be forced to play in such a way.

This ability allows for the vicious heal and invulnerability cycle a team made up of warriors and mages have, to be broken at some point.

This gives the rogue class a purpose in team PvP scenario's, because frankly, increasing rogue armor is not an option and increasing rogue damage is a useless venture as the vicious heal and invulnerability cycle will always negate it.

Don't waste your time suggesting damage increases because we will be back for a PART 3, PART 4, PART 5 etc. etc. as far as I'm concerned.

- I am a warrior.

[Plqgue]

That's not the truth at all, please do not twist things. Rogues literally do not have a place in PvP anymore. Why are others being so selfish to not allow rogues a place in PvP?

Again I'm all for a damage buff and class restriction what I'm against is you and people like irellia who think that buffing rogues and needing everything else is a viable solution....

[Plqgue]

No player is able to "strong arm" developers. If this player you speak of has the power to strong arm devs, how then did rogues end up the weakest in PvP?

Nox bolt poison damage increase sounds like it would be a wash, from what I can gather. Nox bolt is popular in PvP, but it seems far too narrow of a fix because, to benefit, ALL Rogues in PvP would be required to get Nox bolt with poison upgrade. Knowing that every Rogue has Nox bolt poison would cause mages to use curse more often, thus discouraging Rogues from embracing Nox bolt poison upgrade and fewer would use it. Thus, Rogues would end up in exactly the same position as were before the Nox bolt poison damage buff.

I think Rogues should receive a 1% damage buff AND a 1% armor buff PER WEEK until it seems like Rogues are too strong. Then, devs should nerf 1% damage and 1% armor PER WEEK until balance achieved. In this way Devs would be able to detect balance by examining statistics and gauging player reaction. It would be imperfect, but would allow devs to hone in on a good balance, all it BoT, or Balance-over-Time. :P

If you read the thread they want solutions that increase the cannon aspect without messing up the glass aspect of rogues ....you're asking for the glass and the cannon to be buffed and that's not right

[Niixed]

If you read the thread they want solutions that increase the cannon aspect without messing up the glass aspect of rogues ....you're asking for the glass and the cannon to be buffed and that's not right

To convince me (and those reading this thread) you'll have to offer an actual explanation as to why a 1% damage/armor buff is "not right." 1% is, ya know, kinda modest.

It appears that Rogues are too much glass an not enough cannon. I think small increments are the best solution precisely because they are non-threatening and not extreme.

[Plqgue]

To convince me (and those reading this thread) you'll have to offer an actual explanation as to why a 1% damage/armor buff is "not right."

Adding armor would take away from the glass aspect of glass cannon....by getting rid of the glass aspect we go right back to rogues surviving everything in pvp and destroying all the other classes just like they did for three years...the reason they die so quick is because they are GLASS cannons
Glass is meant to be broken easily if you aren't careful

[Ireliaa]

Do you know that glass is broken easily?

well the problem is there its just glass where is the cannon? you are completely fine with 2 mages taking 2 rogues even if its suppose to be counterpick of that class
mages arent the most squishy, rogue is we have same armor without any shield or heal like that

again deflecting everything, against anything you are doing too much aoe when cluster together thats one of the aspects of this imbalance

[Niixed]

Adding armor would take away from the glass aspect of glass cannon....by getting rid of the glass aspect we go right back to rogues surviving everything in pvp and destroying all the other classes just like they did for three years...the reason they die so quick is because they are GLASS cannons
Glass is meant to be broken easily if you aren't careful
Right, because 1% more cannon and 1% less glass is going to totally break everything, and it's time to panic because Rogues are gonna instantly become total monsters watch out.

[Plqgue]

well the problem is there its just glass where is the cannon? you are completely fine with 2 mages taking 2 rogues even if its suppose to be counterpick of that class
mages arent the most squishy, rogue is we have same armor without any shield or heal like that

again deflecting everything, against anything you are doing too much aoe when cluster together thats one of the aspects of this imbalance

As I've stated about fifty times to you guys and gals that can't seem to read I'm all for a damage buff and class restriction but you guys want damage tons of armor and both other classes nerfed and call that balance

[Zeus]

Adding armor would take away from the glass aspect of glass cannon....by getting rid of the glass aspect we go right back to rogues surviving everything in pvp and destroying all the other classes just like they did for three years...the reason they die so quick is because they are GLASS cannons
Glass is meant to be broken easily if you aren't careful


Yet when we are asking for the cannon part to be buffed, people have an issue with it. So, make up your mind. The argument is that this is not a buff, but a nerf for reasons Niixed described. Before you say anything, Niixed is a sorcerer. Only, he doesn't feel the need to destroy classes and knows there is an issue with rogues.

[Plqgue]

Yet when we are asking for the cannon part to be buffed, people have an issue with it. So, make up your mind. The argument is that this is not a buff, but a nerf for reasons Niixed described. Before you say anything, Niixed is a sorcerer. Only, he doesn't feel the need to destroy classes and knows there is an issue with rogues.

I'm also asking for the cannon part to be buffed but not the glass and this is what you don't seem to understand ....

[Ireliaa]

I'm also asking for the cannon part to be buffed but not the glass and this is what you don't seem to understand ....

you dont even know what you are asking, so inconsistent

[Zeus]

I'm also asking for the cannon part to be buffed but not the glass and this is what you don't seem to understand ....

And how many times have I stated that I too would prefer the cannon part to be buffed? The only reason I stated the glass part to be less glass is because people do not understand the concept of a glass cannon. If you're going to hit hard, then you're going to die easily. If you're going to hit moderately and be able to have the damage healed or shielded away, then you need to add some survivability into the mix.

That's all I've been saying, please look at my posts. I'm not asking for anything more or anything ridiculous. I've simply suggested other options IF people cannot handle the concept of a glass cannon. That does not mean I like those other options.

That is why, this noxious bolt upgrade is going to do nothing to help rogues. This is also why I'm stating to developers all this is going to be doing is adding more glass to the glass cannon part of a rogue's role.

[Plqgue]

you dont even know what you are asking, so inconsistent

Explain to me how I'm inconsistent?
I've been asking for a damage buff and class restriction for two days now..you're a rude sarcastic troll with no real argument ....you immediately turned to name calling ...so please take your rude comments elsewhere child adults are speaking

[Anyona]

The current stats we're using cannot handle the cannon part of rogues, they're already taking 50% of tanks hp in 1 hit and 1 hitting/comboing both mages and rogues. So why increase the "cannon" when the problem is clear the "glass" part of the class? Do you want them 1 shotting tanks without jugg/nekro? If that happens then the game is truly broken.


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[Plqgue]

And how many times have I stated that I too would prefer the cannon part to be buffed? The only reason I stated the glass part to be less glass is because people do not understand the concept of a glass cannon. If you're going to hit hard, then you're going to die easily. If you're going to hit moderately and be able to have the damage healed or shielded away, then you need to add some survivability into the mix.

That's all I've been saying, please look at my posts. I'm not asking for anything more or anything ridiculous. I've simply suggested other options IF people cannot handle the concept of a glass cannon. That does not mean I like those other options.

That is why, this noxious bolt upgrade is going to do nothing to help rogues. This is also why I'm stating to developers all this is going to be doing is adding more glass to the glass cannon part of a rogue's role.

It's these other rogues that are asking for these nonsense buffs and Nerf's then, I'm behind you 100% if it's a damage buff and class restriction you really want ...

[Ireliaa]

Explain to me how I'm inconsistent?
I've been asking for a damage buff and class restriction for two days now..you're a rude sarcastic troll with no real argument ....you immediately turned to name calling ...so please take your rude comments elsewhere child adults are speaking

if thats the case you were supoorting mages should take rogues and rogues suppose to die on this because we were suppose to be "glass"

i dont think it is asking for damage buff you wanna kill rogues with mages on 2+ group vs senario

[Plqgue]

The current stats we're using cannot handle the cannon part of rogues, they're already taking 50% of tanks hp in 1 hit and 1 hitting/comboing both mages and rogues. So why increase the "cannon" when the problem is clear the "glass" part of the class? Do you want them 1 shotting tanks without jugg/nekro? If that happens then the game is truly broken.


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That's the job of a rogue man to be able to kill fast but also be killed just as fast

[Anyona]

That's the job of a rogue man to be able to kill fast but also be killed just as fast

So them 1 shotting the "tanks" within the game is acceptable? Though they were meant to withstand huge amounts of damage. Their damage is fine, improved survivability is the answer IMO.


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[Plqgue]

So them 1 shotting the "tanks" within the game is acceptable? Though they were meant to withstand huge amounts of damage. Their damage is fine, improved survivability is the answer IMO.


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I've. Posted this before, the thread is asking for ways to improve the cannon aspect of rogues without killing the glass aspect

We believe Rogues should take on the role of a "Glass Cannon". They should deal high amounts of damage, mostly focused on a single target, while being squishy if not careful. We want to continue improving this Cannon aspect of Rogues, without removing the Glass

[Ireliaa]

The current stats we're using cannot handle the cannon part of rogues, they're already taking 50% of tanks hp in 1 hit and 1 hitting/comboing both mages and rogues. So why increase the "cannon" when the problem is clear the "glass" part of the class? Do you want them 1 shotting tanks without jugg/nekro? If that happens then the game is truly broken.


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this is simply not true in any case. 1 hit %50 tank healt who are you fighting naked tank?
there is almost no window of taking down a tank with rogue, timed heals, juggers, pools etc when class stack occurs or mage and warr gets combined. Are we even playing same game man?

[Anyona]

I've. Posted this before, the thread is asking for ways to improve the cannon aspect of rogues without killing the glass aspect

We believe Rogues should take on the role of a "Glass Cannon". They should deal high amounts of damage, mostly focused on a single target, while being squishy if not careful. We want to continue improving this Cannon aspect of Rogues, without removing the Glass

There needs to be a limit to the certain amount of damage a class can deal, even the "Glass Cannons" need to have a cap on their damage output. The problem is they don't survive within a clash, how is increasing damage going to help them survive? They'll still die to 3 mages whilst unshielded.


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[Plqgue]

There needs to be a limit to the certain amount of damage a class can deal, even the "Glass Cannons" need to have a cap on their damage output. The problem is they don't survive within a clash, how is increasing damage going to help them survive? They'll still die to 3 mages whilst unshielded.


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They aren't meant to survive everything..... that's the point of the armor Nerf in the first place rogues were one shorting everything and getting 10-20kills per death and that's not what a glass cannon is while I agree on a damage cap I don't agree with increasing armor

[Anyona]

this is simply not true in any case. 1 hit %50 tank healt who are you fighting naked tank?
there is almost no window of taking down a tank with rogue, timed heals, juggers, pools etc when class stack occurs or mage and warr gets combined. Are we even playing same game man?

It is certainly the case, a tank without nekro or jugg can be taken down to 50% with aimed shot. I don't believe we are playing the same game.


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[Anyona]

They aren't meant to survive everything..... that's the point of the armor Nerf in the first place rogues were one shorting everything and getting 10-20kills per death and that's not what a glass cannon is while I agree on a damage cap I don't agree with increasing armor

I don't agree with increasing their armor. I believe they should have increased damage reduction on razor and a heal which actually benefits the team.


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[Zeus]

And where did I call any rogue retarded? It's true even with a buff rogues would still cry.

But that doesn't mean I'm against making the class effective without making it overpowerful

Smart rogues wouldn't cry. Just as there's not so smart sorcerers, there's also not so smart rogues. However, if very experienced players are saying this buff will suck, it's for a reason...and that reason is not out of greed. I personally do not expect to kill every class in the game. That's why I don't really complain if a warrior kills a rogue. In other MMOs, that is supposed to happen. The warrior is supposed to kill the rogue. However, in other MMOs, sorcerers are not so powerful where they remove the need for the rogue class. That's currently what's happening and what this proposed change will not fix.

That being said, Anyona does have a point where rogues will still die and if you increase the damage output too much, then rogues will be one hitting players. That is a legitimate concern, but if we do not want to increase survivability, then this is the only path that one can take. I would still personally prefer the damage over glass part of the game though. The reason being is that if you increase the defense of rogues too much, then the 1v1 balance is thrown off. I for one, don't really care about 1v1 because its a such a small aspect of the game I do not think it really matters.

[Zynzyn]

Having read several posts, I would like to make another suggestion. Feel free to post your opinion on this.

Perhaps this Nox tweak may work (lets test it):

A. If the ticking damage (DOT) from one Nox attack is noticeable enough (cannonify it please)
and,
B. If CURSE IMMUNITY is implemented. Let there be a gap between 1 curse and the next, like freeze, stun immunity etc. This might discourage curse-mage stacking as well.

[Anyona]

yea man i agree rogue is fine as it is, we should be happy yay 2x poison, go curse!
buff the mages please they are useless and tanks should be more solid and should do more dmg people stealing their kills!

I have never said I want tanks or mages buffed but please explain how increased damage will help a rogue survive within a clash? The problem is the "glass" part of the class. Whilst I still believe their should still be "glass", it currently stands that the "glass" is already cracked before anything hits the rogue.


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[Plqgue]

I don't agree with increasing their armor. I believe they should have increased damage reduction on razor and a heal which actually benefits the team.


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That's actually a great idea

[Zeus]

Having read several posts, I would like to make another suggestion. Feel free to post your opinion on this.

Perhaps this Nox tweak will work:

A. If the ticking damage (DOT) from once Nox attack is noticeable enough (cannonify it please)
and,
B. If CURSE IMMUNITY is implemented. This might discourage curse-mage stacking as well.

The nox can work if these two are implemented, but the damage would probably need to be a 2.5-3x increase. The 2x increase just will not cut it, especially with all the HoTs going around.

[Ireliaa]

That being said, Anyona does have a point where rogues will still die and if you increase the damage output too much, then rogues will be one hitting players. That is a legitimate concern, but if we do not want to increase survivability, then this is the only path that one can take. I would still personally prefer the damage over glass part of the game though. The reason being is that if you increase the defense of rogues too much, then the 1v1 balance is thrown off. I for one, don't really care about 1v1 because its a such a small aspect of the game I do not think it really matters.

I told this before, 1 aim shot deaths arent fun it also eliminates high gear wins factor thats why i offered the damage reduction of other clases, but a horde atacks me if i say something like that

[Ireliaa]

I don't agree with increasing their armor. I believe they should have increased damage reduction on razor and a heal which actually benefits the team.


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so you wanna make a mage out of rogue? what you describe is a mage

[Plqgue]

Smart rogues wouldn't cry. Just as there's not so smart sorcerers, there's also not so smart rogues. However, if very experienced players are saying this buff will suck, it's for a reason...and that reason is not out of greed. I personally do not expect to kill every class in the game. That's why I don't really complain if a warrior kills a rogue. In other MMOs, that is supposed to happen. The warrior is supposed to kill the rogue. However, in other MMOs, sorcerers are not so powerful where they remove the need for the rogue class. That's currently what's happening and what this proposed change will not fix.

That being said, Anyona does have a point where rogues will still die and if you increase the damage output too much, then rogues will be one hitting players. That is a legitimate concern, but if we do not want to increase survivability, then this is the only path that one can take. I would still personally prefer the damage over glass part of the game though. The reason being is that if you increase the defense of rogues too much, then the 1v1 balance is thrown off. I for one, don't really care about 1v1 because its a such a small aspect of the game I do not think it really matters.

With a small damage buff and damage reduction buff to razor as anyona stated it would make the class extremely useful
Add into account the class restriction that's so needed and there shouldn't be any problems finding a spot in a clash for a rogue

[Zeus]

so you wanna make a mage out of rogue? what you describe is a mage

Perhaps it's just that sorcerers do way too much damage in the first place. The way I look at it is developers have these options:

1. Make Nox Poison Immune to Curse + Increase Nox Poison to 3x. That would mean it is doing roughly 550 damage per tick.
2. Increase rogue survivability via small damage buff and damage reduction buff to razor.
3. Nerf Sorcerer Damage
4. Increase Rogue Aimed Shot capabilities


With a small damage buff and damage reduction buff to razor as anyona stated it would make the class extremely useful
Add into account the class restriction that's so needed and there shouldn't be any problems finding a spot in a clash for a rogue

VroomIGOfast stated in chatbox last night that he does not want to implement class restriction because it hinders people from playing together.

[Plqgue]

Perhaps it's just that sorcerers do way too much damage in the first place.



VroomIGOfast stated in chatbox last night that he does not want to implement class restriction because it hinders people from playing together.

That's seriously the only way for true balance because without the restriction nothing Will change it will still be a whole bunch if tank/mage stacks no matter how they buff rogue.

[Ireliaa]

Perhaps it's just that sorcerers do way too much damage in the first place.


be careful an army of mage gonna atack you for this, that words are Blasphemy

[Zeus]

That's seriously the only way for true balance because without the restriction nothing Will change it will still be a whole bunch if tank/mage stacks no matter how they buff rogue.

I agree. I think once you implement class restriction, people will use all three classes more and eventually with time, we will go back to balanced PvP. The best thing about this is that developers will no longer have to continue buffing and nerfing classes as gear changes.

[reiewaun]

Smart rogues wouldn't cry. Just as there's not so smart sorcerers, there's also not so smart rogues. However, if very experienced players are saying this buff will suck, it's for a reason...and that reason is not out of greed. I personally do not expect to kill every class in the game. That's why I don't really complain if a warrior kills a rogue. In other MMOs, that is supposed to happen. The warrior is supposed to kill the rogue. However, in other MMOs, sorcerers are not so powerful where they remove the need for the rogue class. That's currently what's happening and what this proposed change will not fix.

That being said, Anyona does have a point where rogues will still die and if you increase the damage output too much, then rogues will be one hitting players. That is a legitimate concern, but if we do not want to increase survivability, then this is the only path that one can take. I would still personally prefer the damage over glass part of the game though. The reason being is that if you increase the defense of rogues too much, then the 1v1 balance is thrown off. I for one, don't really care about 1v1 because its a such a small aspect of the game I do not think it really matters.

Agreed on the part wars kill rogues, we rogues we ok with it and can live with it,what we can't bear is dying from a mage team which hypothetical we are supposed to win.
Want my suggestion sts?No nerfs no nothing
NEW ARMOR AND HELM WITH GOOD AMOUNT OF HP AND ARMOR!!!
Everyone will be fine, if other classes still cry change game, we are still using 46 underhul set,and we on. 56 lvl cap 4 months now. Jesus!!!!!
On my war in bought new helm and armor with great amount of armor.
If that's not the solution what is it??? We missing survivability, I am fine with my damage

[Anyona]

Perhaps it's just that sorcerers do way too much damage in the first place.



VroomIGOfast stated in chatbox last night that he does not want to implement class restriction because it hinders people from playing together.

Possibly but then if damage is nerfed for mages then they should look at how only two skills provide an acceptable AoE and only one is used within PvP zones


so you wanna make a mage out of rogue? what you describe is a mage

Definitely not but increased damage does not help rogues in a clash and I believe that this is the main focus of the thread.



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[Ireliaa]

That's seriously the only way for true balance because without the restriction nothing Will change it will still be a whole bunch if tank/mage stacks no matter how they buff rogue.

ofc unless they nerf the other 2 in balanced way but again ofc you are all against this

[Plqgue]

I agree. I think once you implement class restriction, people will use all three classes more and eventually with time, we will go back to balanced PvP. The best thing about this is that developers will no longer have to continue buffing and nerfing classes as gear changes.

Exactly my point with class restriction all three classes would be viable and we wouldn't have to go through these long threads weekly about what this or that class needs

[Zeus]

ofc unless they nerf the other 2 in balanced way but again ofc you are all against this

I don't think warrior needs a nerf, buddy. They don't stop the need for another class in battle. Yes, the sword is a bit OP but that's okay because in a 1v1 scenario, rogue is supposed to lose to warrior. A warrior stack can still be defeated with a smart DPS. So, that doesn't make it the biggest issue for me at least.

[Ireliaa]

vrooms first suggestions were actually right on the spot, decreasing the survivability of other 2 class was a legit way to re-introduce rogue into pvp without making 1 shot kill aims, but without even being tested that ideas are gone

now people discussing how to make rogue into mage" give more heal " "buff razor DR" its mage what its defined here.

[Anyona]

The way I look at it is developers have these options:

1. Make Nox Poison Immune to Curse + Increase Nox Poison to 3x. That would mean it is doing roughly 550 damage per tick.
2. Increase rogue survivability via small damage buff and damage reduction buff to razor.
3. Nerf Sorcerer Damage
4. Increase Rogue Aimed Shot capabilities


Option 2 seems to be the only reasonable option as #1 basically negates the effect of a skill which only has one use, #3 is questionable as aimed already has more skill damage than light regardless of sorcerers having upwards of 200 more damage than rogues. #4 is another questionable topic as aimed already has immense power.



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[Ireliaa]

I don't think warrior needs a nerf, buddy. They don't stop the need for another class in battle. Yes, the sword is a bit OP but that's okay because in a 1v1 scenario, rogue is supposed to lose to warrior. A warrior stack can still be defeated with a smart DPS. So, that doesn't make it the biggest issue for me at least.

i meant the first suggestions from vroom he came up with it for a reason
and that smart dps you say is generally stacked mages in my experience

[Plqgue]

vrooms first suggestions were actually right on the spot, decreasing the survivability of other 2 class was a legit way to re-introduce rogue into pvp without making 1 shot kill aims, but without even being tested that ideas are gone

now people discussing how to make rogue into mage" give more heal " "buff razor DR" its mage what its defined here.

Again nerfing the other two classes and buffing rogues is not a balanced solution

[Ireliaa]

Perhaps it's just that sorcerers do way too much damage in the first place. The way I look at it is developers have these options:

1. Make Nox Poison Immune to Curse + Increase Nox Poison to 3x. That would mean it is doing roughly 550 damage per tick.
2. Increase rogue survivability via small damage buff and damage reduction buff to razor.
3. Nerf Sorcerer Damage
4. Increase Rogue Aimed Shot capabilities




thats valid sugestion, this could work, and i agree on it
but never gonna implemented because its written "nerf" and "sorcerer" on same sentence

[Ireliaa]

Again nerfing the other two classes and buffing rogues is not a balanced solution

maybe there is no room to move without doing that, have you ever considered that?

[Plqgue]

maybe there is no room to move without doing that, have you ever considered that?

Yes I have and there is plenty of room for them to implement other changed without touching the other classes

[DAmage126]

maybe there is no room to move without doing that, have you ever considered that?

And how exactly does nerfing warrs and mages gonna help out this situation at all? The reason why they are choosing not to nerf warrs and mages and instead give a buff is because rogues are always crying about things and look what happens

[Ireliaa]

And how exactly does nerfing warrs and mages gonna help out this situation at all? The reason why they are choosing not to nerf warrs and mages and instead give a buff is because rogues are always crying about things and look what happens

simple ,decreased damage gonna cause the need of nuke damage maker a rogue in clash situation if you stack warr and mages you will do less damage than before and wont be able to kill the other team without the help of damage maker as rogue

[DAmage126]

simple ,decreased damage gonna cause the need of nuke damage maker a rogue in clash situation if you stack warr and mages you will do less damage than before and wont be able to kill the other team without the help of damage maker as rogue

Yeah and then everyone will just play all rogues and not warrs or mages

[Ireliaa]

Yeah and then everyone will just play all rogues and not warrs or mages

no you cant stack rogue either, a mixed team will be superior to rogue stack team because of having a tank and valid heal from a mage not to mention the amount of cc

[Plqgue]

simple ,decreased damage gonna cause the need of nuke damage maker a rogue in clash situation if you stack warr and mages you will do less damage than before and wont be able to kill the other team without the help of damage maker as rogue
That would force people to use rogues but would force out mages and make us mana pools again

[DAmage126]

Nerfing mages and warriors will just make rogues dominant like they were for the longest time up until now

[Ireliaa]

Nerfing mages and warriors will just make rogues dominant like they were for the longest time up until now


That would force people to use rogues but would force out mages and make us mana pools again

as i said it wont make rogue dominant because a team wtihout a tank would be too squishy to survive and a team wtihout a mage would be too easyly worn off because of mana hunger of rogue an ideal team had to include a mage and a warrior at least one of each and a team with rogue should be able to beat a team without a rogue. thats what mixed team superioriy and losing with class stack means

[Zeus]

That would force people to use rogues but would force out mages and make us mana pools again

There's a lot more to sorcerer than just mana pool. However, lets lobby for class restriction since nobody can be happy. The only people that are going to complain are those who stack and abuse classes.

[mrm]

What about makeing bows more powerful then daggers? Due to daggers being a melee wep it wont proc if your not infront of the enemy hitting him and also wont do none skill related dmg with bows douge could have keept there destince and spam skill atks and that wep atk( not sure how to refure to it) with a bow giveing lot of weaker stats then daggers moste rouges would rater go with daggers just idee not sure if this will work
Another idee is new pasives each clash haveing there own based on there preforns

[Zeus]

What about makeing bows more powerful then daggers? Due to daggers being a melee wep it wont proc if your not infront of the enemy hitting him and also wont do none skill related dmg with bows douge could have keept there destince and spam skill atks and that wep atk( not sure how to refure to it) with a bow giveing lot of weaker stats then daggers moste rouges would rater go with daggers just idee not sure if this will work
Another idee is new pasives each clash haveing there own based on there preforns

They don't want to balance via weapons. That's what causes a lot of imbalance in the first place. IE: Lava Sword hiding a warrior's inherent weaknesses.

[Plqgue]

There's a lot more to sorcerer than just mana pool. However, lets lobby for class restriction since nobody can be happy. The only people that are going to complain are those who stack and abuse classes.

+1 good sir
Class restriction is literally the only viable solution.. with buffs and Nerf's well be at this for a few months because every time one class gets a buff /Nerf the other classes will start making threads demanding their class get a buff because the other classes buff is hurting their class

[Ireliaa]

class restriction never gonna happen thats what im sure of

we have a tiny pvp not like 8 vs 8 if you make class restriction 2 friend would hardly join in same room which also restricts playing experience

[mrm]

They don't want to balance via weapons. That's what causes a lot of imbalance in the first place. IE: Lava Sword hiding a warrior's inherent weaknesses.
Im not saying procs ect i mean make the bow just =dagers stats or just beter im not spesfing any wepon at long range rouges can still deal tons of dmg useing dager with skill but skills consume mana and have cd while in cd a rouge can just use normal atks while not going into the front the atk with daggers and if the wepon hase a proc it can hit on contact makeing bows beter there and the rouge can still stay behinde the pack

[Plqgue]

class restriction never gonna happen thats what im sure of

we have a tiny pvp not like 8 vs 8 if you make class restriction 2 friend would hardly join in same room which also restricts playing experience

Not unless everyone gets behind it....it's the best option there will be teams made up of every class and no more stacking any class
That would balance it out and actually improve the feedback from all three classes as they'd all be utilized in a clash and we could spot if a class is doing less than the others....this isn't about your friends joining a room this is about balance and if that means getting rid of a few clashes where it's you and your friends oh well, it's time for balance

[Deathclaw]

These days its hard to get a team of 5 with the class restriction implemented it will be a imbalance in teams and that's unfair also.

[Ireliaa]

Not unless everyone gets behind it....it's the best option there will be teams made up of every class and no more stacking any class
That would balance it out and actually improve the feedback from all three classes as they'd all be utilized in a clash and we could spot if a class is doing less than the others....this isn't about your friends joining a room this is about balance and if that means getting rid of a few clashes where it's you and your friends oh well, it's time for balance

class restriction is avoiding an existing problem that can be solved. and from what i see it should be solved without the user feedback,just by testing in developer level, Its running away from whats going on, im not supporting class restriction im thinking there should be a way to make a team with stacked class weaker than well mixed team

but ofc some will cry on it aswell as on everything

its like begging" please include rogues in your fights" and force player to do

[Plqgue]

These days its hard to get a team of 5 with the class restriction implemented it will be a imbalance in teams and that's unfair also.

Yes but needing and buffing wil never stop if this continues there's rogues that want makes and tanks nerfed and them to be buffed thinking this is somehow fair

[Deathclaw]

sts should look at a way to improve the rouges without touching other 2 classes.

[Croak]

The requirement of having at least one of each class in a pvp match seems quite logical at this point since everyone and their cousin's cousin's uncle wants their respective class buffed and the other classes nerfed. Test it with KDR turned off for a week and see what happens.

[Suentous PO]

For the love of god, if nerfing mage damage ends up being part of the answer-

MAKE IT A PVP ONLY DAMAGE REDUCTION!

my staff just got nutered recently

[mrm]

The requirement of having at least one of each class in a pvp match seems quite logical at this point since everyone and their cousin's cousin's uncle wants their respective class buffed and the other classes nerfed. Test it with KDR turned off for a week and see what happens.
Nope the best way to solve this problim is to bring back the test server imo its one off the only ways thay will have a live batlefeeld fo test on with out infecting the game it self intill thay found the right balnce

[Plqgue]

The requirement of having at least one of each class in a pvp match seems quite logical at this point since everyone and their cousin's cousin's uncle wants their respective class buffed and the other classes nerfed. Test it with KDR turned off for a week and see what happens.

This
#11chars

[Ireliaa]

For the love of god, if nerfing mage damage ends up being part of the answer-

MAKE IT A PVP ONLY DAMAGE REDUCTION!

my staff just got nutered recently

answer is 42

seriously without testing kdrless pvp there is no answer just jibberish

[Croak]

Nope the best way to solve this problim is to bring back the test server imo its one off the only ways thay will have a live batlefeeld fo test on with out infecting the game it self intill thay found the right balnce

Not everyone know of nor want to go the extra mile to install the test server, this alone with limit the data available for devs to evaluate. Furthermore, testing class requirement with KDR turned off will not have any significant impact on a live server, the worst that could happen is the class stackers will get a little sand in their...

[Breakingbadxx]

Impliment a class restriction of 2 of the same classes max, in the same PvP room please.

Our selfish human nature makes discussions for buffs/nerfs/changes a waste of time, as far as I'm concerned.

[Suentous PO]

answer is 42

seriously without testing kdrless pvp there is no answer just jibberish

I grok, lel.

im not taking sides in a fight to make a single target specialist who is supposed to be glass relevant in a group match against a mage who is in theory supposed to be the best in handling groups effectivly.

Just leave pve be plox

[mrm]

Not everyone know of nor want to go the extra mile to install the test server, this alone with limit the data available for devs to evaluate. Furthermore, testing class requirement with KDR turned off will not have any significant impact on a live server, the worst that could happen is the class stackers will get a little sand in their...
Oky the let the endlis buffs end nerfs contnue and the pve player come to fourms and conplain cause this is efecting them no one is forcing you to download it infact sts can just use a hand full of selcted serous players to take part as bata testing

[intrepd]

I said it 5 times "Just create a new CTF MAP with class restrictions this way you can play fair in it and play with friends in the old maps such as tdm and old ctf, even if they buff rogues there will still be an issue in the next cap or even before for one of the 3 classes just like the million post before.

[Croak]

Oky the let the endlis buffs end nerfs contnue and the pve player come to fourms and conplain cause this is efecting them no one is forcing you to download it infact sts can just use a hand full of selcted serous players to take part as bata testing

It seems you're having trouble understanding my last post and the concept of having a week of pvp with KDR turned off....

[Gouiwaa9000]

Pretty sure curse takes the auto attack damage of the target. Unless it ticks faster damage will be the same.

[Zeus]

These days its hard to get a team of 5 with the class restriction implemented it will be a imbalance in teams and that's unfair also.

Death, there are plenty of rogues that want to PvP. Use them.

[reiewaun]

Want my suggestion sts?No nerfs no nothing
NEW ROGUE ARMOR AND HELM WITH GOOD AMOUNT OF HP AND ARMOR!!!
Everyone will be fine, if other classes still cry change game, we are still using 46 underhul set,and we on. 56 lvl cap 4 months now. Jesus!!!!!
On my war in bought new helm and armor with great amount of armor.
If that's not the solution what is it??? We missing survivability, I am fine with my damage

[Deathclaw]

This mage/tank stacking issue didn't exist 1-2months ago all of a sudden it became a issue.

[Deathclaw]

Shiny, there are plenty of rogues that want to PvP. Use them.

I play with randoms and i believe you're mistaking me for someone else? lol

[Luciano Lobo]

I agree. Let's try it I see what happends.

[Breakingbadxx]

This mage/tank stacking issue didn't exist 1-2months ago all of a sudden it became a issue.
Tank stacking has always existed in PvP. Its just not that big a deal. It can be countered using a team with class diversity.

Stacking mages with tanks was already an issue in PvP BEFORE the rogue class got their armor value nerfed. The nerf just allowed that issue to become more apparent.

Mage stacking became the new fad after the mage class received a very significant buff to the arcane shield and their heal skill.

[Niixed]

Not unless everyone gets behind it....it's the best option there will be teams made up of every class and no more stacking any class
That would balance it out and actually improve the feedback from all three classes as they'd all be utilized in a clash and we could spot if a class is doing less than the others....this isn't about your friends joining a room this is about balance and if that means getting rid of a few clashes where it's you and your friends oh well, it's time for balance

Class restrictions are not a viable solution for the simple reason that you'd be denying a player the ability to play/participate just because they happen to be the wrong class at the wrong time. It would also exacerbate inter-class tensions.

[Plqgue]

Want my suggestion sts?No nerfs no nothing
NEW ROGUE ARMOR AND HELM WITH GOOD AMOUNT OF HP AND ARMOR!!!
Everyone will be fine, if other classes still cry change game, we are still using 46 underhul set,and we on. 56 lvl cap 4 months now. Jesus!!!!!
On my war in bought new helm and armor with great amount of armor.
If that's not the solution what is it??? We missing survivability, I am fine with my damage
There's 56 gears for rogue and once again they want to increase the cannon not the glass

[Plqgue]

Class restrictions are not a viable solution for the simple reason that you'd be denying a player the ability to play/participate just because they happen to be the wrong class at the wrong time. It would also exacerbate inter-class tensions.

Can't be much worse than what were going through right now endless buffs and nerfs

Like seriously when's it gonna end?

[Zeus]

I play with randoms and i believe you're mistaking me for someone else? lol

No idea how Death turned into Shiny, my bad on the auto correct. :)


This mage/tank stacking issue didn't exist 1-2months ago all of a sudden it became a issue.

It did exist, it just wasn't as known and therefore not as widely abused.

[Saud]

1. Make Nox Poison Immune to Curse + Increase Nox Poison to 3x. That would mean it is doing roughly 550 damage per tick.
2. Increase rogue survivability via small damage buff and damage reduction buff to razor.
3. Nerf Sorcerer Damage
4. Increase Rogue Aimed Shot capabilities



VroomIGOfast stated in chatbox last night that he does not want to implement class restriction because it hinders people from playing together.

If they do this
It won't be blance at all
rogues will be super powerful
Please vroom don't do it -.-

[Niixed]

Can't be much worse than what were going through right now endless buffs and nerfs

Like seriously when's it gonna end?
I don't think class restrictions will ever happen. The coding would be a substantial investment and the risk that it would have to be discontinued or redone again is high. The nerfs/buffs will end when true balance is achieved. We are almost there imo.

[Imback Al]

There something called timing, the rouge can avoid the curse ability if he waits patiently till the curse wears out or uses a pet such as nilbog to remove curse.

LOL IF YOU CAN SURVIVE 3+ LIGHTNINGS you are better than any rogue I've ever seen...it's impossible to survive a Mage through 4 combos. Impossible

[Deathclaw]

If rouges want survivability rouges should gain their normal armor back that's a reasonable proposal which shouldn't effect the balance at all.

[Plqgue]

If rouges want survivability rouges should gain their normal armor back that's a reasonable proposal which shouldn't effect the balance at all.

Their original armor was one of the factors that broke pvp the first time which is why it was nerfed to make the class more like its supposed to be

[Deathclaw]

Perhaps it's just that sorcerers do way too much damage in the first place. The way I look at it is developers have these options:

1. Make Nox Poison Immune to Curse + Increase Nox Poison to 3x. That would mean it is doing roughly 550 damage per tick.
2. Increase rogue survivability via small damage buff and damage reduction buff to razor.
3. Nerf Sorcerer Damage
4. Increase Rogue Aimed Shot capabilities






That would make the rouge the most overpowered class in game which will effect the balance of the game, aim shot already has the fastest cool down than any other skill in game, sorcerer damage already has been nerfed in the past so i wouldn't recommend touching on that. immunity to curse sounds ridiculous that's basically taking the skill away and making it completely useless. There is already a pet that has the ability to remove curse , two pets actually which is misty and nilbog.

[Shelllz]

Kk this is what I propose based on what Zeus proposed in regards to buffing rogues nerfing mage dmg.
1. Nerf rogue aim shot by 50%
2. Nerf aim shot by increasing the cd of the skill by 45 sec
3. Buff mage dmg by 30% and give mages involuntary for 10 sec
Thanks

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[Valkiryas]

153362

This picture shows perfectly how a Group of 2 Rogues + 1 Mage + 1 Tank Full Arcane can't beat a group of 2 Tanks and 2 Mages.

The score was 4 - 14 ( Our favor ) before mage join ( Used to be 2 rogues in their side ), now rogues are useless even at 1V1, I'd love to play agaisn't a developer, QC's Tester or Designer.

That would shows us why they can't get the idea of our rol.

I am pretty upset because I don't get the vision of developer, at the moment a Mage can beat really easy a rogue at 56 and tanks are way stronger than us.

I got an idea why this is happening, a Mage > Warrior, Mage > Rogue, Why?

* Mage's shield is got several buff including a really high damage absorbsion ( 75% Damage reduction + Upgrade Mastery around 85%)+ Impairing effect, this longs around 15 Seconds

* Warrior's Juggernaut can reduce an insane amount of damage ( Higher than 65% ) + Impairing Effects + ( VB ) More Streng + Heal Over time when their life is low + More Armor

* Rogue's Razor shield can Absorb 0 damage ( 10% with mastery ) + Impairing Effects


[b]As you can see, the survality of rogue is too low and that along the inmense damage by warriors with the Unfixed Dragon HUnter Sword and the unreview damage output by mage are making the rogues the lower class.

[Shelllz]

153362

This picture shows perfectly how a Group of 2 Rogues + 1 Mage + 1 Tank Full Arcane can't beat a group of 2 Tanks and 2 Mages.

The score was 4 - 14 ( Our favor ) before mage join ( Used to be 2 rogues in their side ), now rogues are useless even at 1V1, I'd love to play agaisn't a developer, QC's Tester or Designer.

That would shows us why they can't get the idea of our rol.

I am pretty upset because I don't get the vision of developer, at the moment a Mage can beat really easy a rogue at 56 and tanks are way stronger than us.

I got an idea why this is happening, a Mage > Warrior, Mage > Rogue, Why?

* Mage's shield is got several buff including a really high damage absorbsion ( 75% Damage reduction + Upgrade Mastery around 85%)+ Impairing effect, this longs around 15 Seconds

* Warrior's Juggernaut can reduce an insane amount of damage ( Higher than 65% ) + Impairing Effects + ( VB ) More Streng + Heal Over time when their life is low + More Armor

* Rogue's Razor shield can Absorb 0 damage ( 10% with mastery ) + Impairing Effects


[b]As you can see, the survality of rogue is too low and that along the inmense damage by warriors with the Unfixed Dragon HUnter Sword and the unreview damage output by mage are making the rogues the lower class.
Get better tanks and mages.....just saying. The people in your team kinda suck........ofc you can't win. It's like putting Zeus vs a gearless nab. Your team needed another tank not 2 rogues. It's a gimme 2 rogues 1 tank 1 mage can't beat 2 tanks 2 mages. But 2 tank 1 rogue 1 mage can beat 2 tanks 2 mages. Why are u even showing ss of 1 tank 2 rogues 1 mage vs 2 tanks 2 mages? Ur not making your point any stronger just looking silly.

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[Valkiryas]

Get better tanks and mages.....just saying. The people in your team kinda suck........ofc you can't win.

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No, our team have good player's buddy, and their team too, should be a 1/1 rol, instead that they got 20 kills and we just 1 since rogues leave.

[Shelllz]

No, our team have good player's buddy, and their team too, should be a 1/1 rol, instead that they got 20 kills and we just 1 since rogues leave.
Ok Ms. 4.5k crit lvl 46 mage. Whatever u say. I'll just nod.

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[Otahaanak]

I don't see how giving rogues more DoT damage is going to help. It's can be countered with curse and Jug (though realistically, not sure how many mages really use curse - it has easily been countered for several seasons by rogues, thus using it at endgame is a waste IMO. So it's hard for me to buy the curse argument the rogues here are playing...)

To me the issue for rogues is the same it was for us mages for a LONG time: survivability and contribution. If you can't survive and you can't contribute you will be replaced.

Give them something that will increase survivability - packs that heal much more over time, more packs, add armor to razor, etc. To help them contribute, up their damage a tad. Turn off KDR and test it for a week or two days to see if it works. There is no magic pill for this, it's going to take time.

All of that said I'm tired of reading attacks and outright entitled attitudes here and throughout the forums the last few weeks. Gary, Vroom, Cara and the rest of the STS team is doing a hell of a job.

Oh, and please anything but class restrictions for PVP. There is a solution, just not that.







IGN: Cryformana, Drizzitty

[Deathclaw]

153362

This picture shows perfectly how a Group of 2 Rogues + 1 Mage + 1 Tank Full Arcane can't beat a group of 2 Tanks and 2 Mages.

The score was 4 - 14 ( Our favor ) before mage join ( Used to be 2 rogues in their side ), now rogues are useless even at 1V1, I'd love to play agaisn't a developer, QC's Tester or Designer.

That would shows us why they can't get the idea of our rol.

I am pretty upset because I don't get the vision of developer, at the moment a Mage can beat really easy a rogue at 56 and tanks are way stronger than us.

I got an idea why this is happening, a Mage > Warrior, Mage > Rogue, Why?

* Mage's shield is got several buff including a really high damage absorbsion ( 75% Damage reduction + Upgrade Mastery around 85%)+ Impairing effect, this longs around 15 Seconds

* Warrior's Juggernaut can reduce an insane amount of damage ( Higher than 65% ) + Impairing Effects + ( VB ) More Streng + Heal Over time when their life is low + More Armor

* Rogue's Razor shield can Absorb 0 damage ( 10% with mastery ) + Impairing Effects


[b]As you can see, the survality of rogue is too low and that along the inmense damage by warriors with the Unfixed Dragon HUnter Sword and the unreview damage output by mage are making the rogues the lower class.

Gear also plays a huge factor in game don't forget that , rouges are also far superior in 1vs1 against rouges it all depends on your gear and skill.

[Valkiryas]

Gear also plays a huge factor in game don't forget that , rouges are also far superior in 1vs1 against rouges it all depends on your gear and skill.

Gear also plays a huge factor in game don't forget that , Mages are also far superior in 1vs1 against Mages it all depends on your gear and skill.

[Shelllz]

Gear also plays a huge factor in game don't forget that , Mages are also far superior in 1vs1 against Mages it all depends on your gear and skill.
Lololol since when are mages more superior in vs?
Btw. You vs voorg today. Can u tell me honestly if he crit anywhere close to 4.5k on you at any point in that vs? I'm just laughing.

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[Deathclaw]

153362

This picture shows perfectly how a Group of 2 Rogues + 1 Mage + 1 Tank Full Arcane can't beat a group of 2 Tanks and 2 Mages.

The score was 4 - 14 ( Our favor ) before mage join ( Used to be 2 rogues in their side ), now rogues are useless even at 1V1, I'd love to play agaisn't a developer, QC's Tester or Designer.

That would shows us why they can't get the idea of our rol.

I am pretty upset because I don't get the vision of developer, at the moment a Mage can beat really easy a rogue at 56 and tanks are way stronger than us.

I got an idea why this is happening, a Mage > Warrior, Mage > Rogue, Why?

* Mage's shield is got several buff including a really high damage absorbsion ( 75% Damage reduction + Upgrade Mastery around 85%)+ Impairing effect, this longs around 15 Seconds

* Warrior's Juggernaut can reduce an insane amount of damage ( Higher than 65% ) + Impairing Effects + ( VB ) More Streng + Heal Over time when their life is low + More Armor

* Rogue's Razor shield can Absorb 0 damage ( 10% with mastery ) + Impairing Effects


[b]As you can see, the survality of rogue is too low and that along the inmense damage by warriors with the Unfixed Dragon HUnter Sword and the unreview damage output by mage are making the rogues the lower class.

Mage shield gives 45% damage reduction uncharged and 55% charged with the mastery around 65% in total. Have you played mage at all ? its no where near 85%.
Here is a screen shot of the mage Arcane shield ability it clearly shows how much damage it absorbs.

153363

Don`t bring in false information please.

[Valkiryas]

Lololol since when are mages more superior in vs?
Btw. You vs voorg today. Can u tell me honestly if he crit anywhere close to 4.5k on you at any point in that vs? I'm just laughing.

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Yes sure, my heal as I said is 6.3K and 2.2K armor

With his light skill he was able to reduce my HP by 80% ( I am not sure if was a combo or just Light ) but that was With Razor shield on ( 10 Damage reduction ) and Nekro's shield, I mean that's broken as hell, I was wonder why mages are able to kill a stack of warriors until I saw this.

[Anyona]

The only time I was able to hit 4.5k on light without damage reduction etc was at the 46 expansion pre global nerf. At 56 mages only crit about 3k on an unshielded rogue.


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[Valkiryas]

Mage shield gives 45% damage reduction uncharged and 55% charged with the mastery around 65% in total. Have you played mage at all ? its no where near 85%.
Here is a screen shot of the mage Arcane shield ability it clearly shows how much damage it absorbs.

153363

Don`t bring in false information please.

@.@ Yes I was pretty sure that was 85% lemme check ;)

[Anyona]

@.@ Yes I was pretty sure that was 85% lemme check ;)

The mastery and another buff increase the absorption of the shield by 15% each, not the damage reduced.


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[Deathclaw]

@.@ Yes I was pretty sure that was 85% lemme check ;)

You aren't even sure yet you make up these numbers that's really not helping anyone.

[Shelllz]

@.@ Yes I was pretty sure that was 85% lemme check ;)
Btw here is my light dmg output. Not even close to 4.5k
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/5b24b2c27b2b77e7ef52ea84cddeef4d.jpg


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[Fredystern]

From what i see started from page 15 most rogue want to be a tankcannon got glasscannon, they want survive longer and higher damage, that was the worst, and it will become rogue legend again

[Deathclaw]

From what i see started from page 15 most rogue want to be a tankcannon got glasscannon, they want survive longer and higher damage, that was the worst, and it will become rogue legend again

I totally agree with you.

[Fredystern]

153362

This picture shows perfectly how a Group of 2 Rogues + 1 Mage + 1 Tank Full Arcane can't beat a group of 2 Tanks and 2 Mages.

The score was 4 - 14 ( Our favor ) before mage join ( Used to be 2 rogues in their side ), now rogues are useless even at 1V1, I'd love to play agaisn't a developer, QC's Tester or Designer.

That would shows us why they can't get the idea of our rol.

I am pretty upset because I don't get the vision of developer, at the moment a Mage can beat really easy a rogue at 56 and tanks are way stronger than us.

I got an idea why this is happening, a Mage > Warrior, Mage > Rogue, Why?

* Mage's shield is got several buff including a really high damage absorbsion ( 75% Damage reduction + Upgrade Mastery around 85%)+ Impairing effect, this longs around 15 Seconds

* Warrior's Juggernaut can reduce an insane amount of damage ( Higher than 65% ) + Impairing Effects + ( VB ) More Streng + Heal Over time when their life is low + More Armor

* Rogue's Razor shield can Absorb 0 damage ( 10% with mastery ) + Impairing Effects


[b]As you can see, the survality of rogue is too low and that along the inmense damage by warriors with the Unfixed Dragon HUnter Sword and the unreview damage output by mage are making the rogues the lower class.

I was agree with you, some player may not allow rogue in team but i mostly need a rogue to finish enemy tank faster or more lava will come

[Anyona]

Btw here is my light dmg output. Not even close to 4.5k
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/5b24b2c27b2b77e7ef52ea84cddeef4d.jpg


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Vs aimed shot... http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/33501a92b35feb7d5e5d02f16628b690.jpg


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[Fredystern]

Vs aimed shot... http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/33501a92b35feb7d5e5d02f16628b690.jpg


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5k damage :O that was amazing if critical 12k+ :O

[Deathclaw]

Vs aimed shot... http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/33501a92b35feb7d5e5d02f16628b690.jpg


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I'm assuming that screenshot of aim shot is taken from a average geared rouge, im sure there are rouges who have 6k in their numbers.

[Anyona]

I'm assuming that screenshot of aim shot is taken from a average geared rouge, im sure there are rouges who have 6k in their numbers.

This is 1.2k damage rogue with bow, daggers will of course reach more.


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[Shelllz]

Vs aimed shot... http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/33501a92b35feb7d5e5d02f16628b690.jpg


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That's 2.1k dmg more than mage. I'm just at a total wow with rogues asking for more dmg and claiming mages dmg is a threat.

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[Deathclaw]

Vs aimed shot... http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/33501a92b35feb7d5e5d02f16628b690.jpg


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I also want to add that the aim shot ability

+ reduces the targets armor by 15%
+ increases the aim shot damage by 10%
+ adds 10% crit (the 10% crit stacks each time the skill is used)

That`s a lot of buffs and debuffs for one skill, if sts wants to give rouges more survivability , the aim shot ability should be taken a look at so tanks and mages dont get one hit.

[Shelllz]

Once again, this wouldn't even be an issue, if magnum had a rogue to utilize in a clash. A certain rogue wouldnt sit in forums crying all day about mage stacking and buffing rogues and nerfing the other 2 classes.
Everyone thinks we are using mage stack to win. We just simply have no rogues to throw in a clash.
BTW
Opposition has far better geared mages than our side. Yet even 2 tanks 3 mages we win np being way undergeared. It takes skill not only gear to win. This has been proven over and over again. Yes gear definitely has a big part, but in 2 tank 3 mage clashes skill outweigh gear.

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[yubaraj]

That's 2.1k dmg more than mage. I'm just at a total wow with rogues asking for more dmg and claiming mages dmg is a threat.

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In addition to that don't forget about critical damage that aimed shot can deal. And most of the pvp rogues are able to hit critical every second attack.

Rogues are saying lighting hits same as aimed shot which is bs.

Still rogues are looking for more damage which is not gonna solve any crying. It will of course make them op in vs but rogues need little more suvivability in clash.

As far as I have seen playing with randoms, there is lack of coordination. Warriors not covering their rogues, and not healing them, busy procing . Also Mage not healing n giving mana to rogues. That's just my personal observation with random team. Yes rogues need warrior and Mage to survive but warrior and Mage doesn't need rogue to survive.

So if STS want to stop rogue crying. Rogues should be given little more suvivability in TDM and CTF only but not in duel arena.

[Deathclaw]

In addition to that don't forget about critical damage that aimed shot can deal. And most of the pvp rogues are able to hit critical every second attack.

Rogues are saying lighting hits same as aimed shot which is bs.

Still rogues are looking for more damage which is not gonna solve any crying. It will of course make them op in vs but rogues need little more suvivability in clash.

As far as I have seen playing with randoms, there is lack of coordination. Warriors not covering their rogues, and not healing them, busy procing . Also Mage not healing n giving mana to rogues. That's just my personal observation with random team. Yes rogues need warrior and Mage to survive but warrior and Mage doesn't need rogue to survive.

So if STS want to stop rogue crying. Rogues should be given little more suvivability in TDM and CTF only but not in duel arena.

If rouges gain more survivability the aim shot needs to be nerfed , the procs and debuffs that the aim shot ability has to be nerfed by 50% which is reasonable. One of the ways i would suggest increasing rouges survivability is giving their armor back and buffing razor shield a little.

[intrepd]

Once again, this wouldn't even be an issue, if magnum had a rogue to utilize in a clash. A certain rogue wouldnt sit in forums crying all day about mage stacking and buffing rogues and nerfing the other 2 classes.
Everyone thinks we are using mage stack to win. We just simply have no rogues to throw in a clash.
BTW
Opposition has far better geared mages than our side. Yet even 2 tanks 3 mages we win np being way undergeared. It takes skill not only gear to win. This has been proven over and over again. Yes gear definitely has a big part, but in 2 tank 3 mage clashes skill outweigh gear.

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Right now ur saying that it takes skills FAR more than gear but yet your claiming that your rogues are under geared so you don't use them. Nice logic there

[Shelllz]

Right now ur saying that it takes skills FAR more than gear but yet your claiming that your rogues are under geared so you don't use them. Nice logic there
Please read word for word. I said in a 2 tank 3 mage clash.......pls don't twist my words. Thanks

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[intrepd]

Please read word for word. I said in a 2 tank 3 mage clash.......pls don't twist my words. Thanks

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Sorry but does it matter? Either ways you're saying that your team is undergeared yet its no problem since you guys are skilled, how about a undergeared rogue then, or actually why is 2 tanks 3 mages clash no issue for you to be undergeared but adding a undergeared rogue is the issue, please explain why

[Fredystern]

153366

Even using 1war without ring, 2 rog, amd 1mage still could win when clash with 4warr :/ who say rogue didnt get place on pvp than?

[intrepd]

153366

Even using 1war without ring, 2 rog, amd 1mage still could win when clash with 4warr :/ who say rogue didnt get place on pvp than?

This was basically undergeared team even on blue, how about you try a maxed clash using 2 tanks 2 rogues 1 mage vs 2 tanks 3 mages?

[Shelllz]

Sorry but does it matter? Either ways you're saying that your team is undergeared yet its no problem since you guys are skilled, how about a undergeared rogue then, or actually why is 2 tanks 3 mages clash no issue for you to be undergeared but adding a undergeared rogue is the issue, please explain why
Because an undergeared rogue is a much easier target to a maxed out rogue who has 400 armor more than they do. Why are u asking dumb questions if you played a rogue. Just.... stop

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[Fredystern]

Undergeared? Sure they call a glintset warr, my team warr was undergeared too right? But only die twice, mage wasnt very good at rushing together they was risk themself of rush to enemy rogue, they could get anystun when shield wearoff and poof die

[Deathclaw]

This was basically undergeared team even on blue, how about you try a maxed clash using 2 tanks 2 rogues 1 mage vs 2 tanks 3 mages?

very few are maxed in this game, the majority of the players here are using average gear, it seems to me that your comment is directed at maxed out clashes then normal gear which would be a different case entirely.

[intrepd]

Because an undergeared rogue is a much easier target to a maxed out rogue who has 400 armor more than they do. Why are u asking dumb questions if you played a rogue. Just.... stop

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Sorry but saying you're far more undergeared is still the same, then you're an easy target to a undergeared mage no? If what you mages said is true, if you're rogue knows how to hide and aim then she should be fine even with that stat gap since its anyways a combo and down if you skilled mages helped her :D

How about this idea then, Create a new PvP map for example CTF with class restrictions, I'm not saying restrict the old maps only the new one, so if you want to play with your stack then feel free to go to the old one, want to play fair you got the new and old map, this will stop the buff and nerf and keep the Rock Paper Scissors.

[Plqgue]

Ok Ms. 4.5k crit lvl 46 mage. Whatever u say. I'll just nod.

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Lmaooooo
#11chars

[intrepd]

very few are maxed in this game, the majority of the players here are using average gear, it seems to me that your comment is directed at maxed out clashes then normal gear which would be a different case entirely.

Are you telling me that this warrior in blue team without Glintstone set is maxed? Glintstone set has became almost a must for clashes at that bracket

[Shelllz]

*yawns
Good night

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[Saud]

what about rogue get 50 armor for every aimshot she/he attack
that would be nice.. and the buff remain for 5 sec
this could be mastery or skill buff

[Safiras]

what about rogue get 50 armor for every aimshot she/he attack
that would be nice.. and the buff remain for 5 sec
this could be mastery or skill buff

Not sure if you play rogue, if not then you'd see that this is quite a useless suggestion. Aimed shot cooldown is 2 seconds, which means you're looking at a maximum armor stack of 150 armor. Which does not do anything significant. Also, no one spams aim and wastes tons of mana trying to keep up the armor stack in PvP. You'll just run out of mana before you can do anything of use in a clash. Hope you think things through before making suggestions in future.

[Saud]

Not sure if you play rogue, if not then you'd see that this is quite a useless suggestion. Aimed shot cooldown is 2 seconds, which means you're looking at a maximum armor stack of 150 armor. Which does not do anything significant. Also, no one spams aim and wastes tons of mana trying to keep up the armor stack in PvP. You'll just run out of mana before you can do anything of use in a clash. Hope you think things through before making suggestions in future.

Bruh
#11char

[Plqgue]

It seems anything except Nerf mages and warriors and buff rogues is instantly shot down

[Trenton]

1. Make Nox Poison Immune to Curse Maybe I'm just dumb but I feel like this is a main thing that should be done. Everybody threw a fit stating that doubling nox damage was actually a nerf because all mages would use curse, how about this get done to completely throw that argument away and we start with that..?



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[Ipoopsy]

Right now 3 mages takes out a rogue easily in clash so basically you're asking for them to wait until you find a rogue or easier buff rogue to be able to clash and participate? Answer please

That must be an OP Rog for 3 mages to kill 1 Rog....

[Kriticality]

Once again, this wouldn't even be an issue, if magnum had a rogue to utilize in a clash. A certain rogue wouldnt sit in forums crying all day about mage stacking and buffing rogues and nerfing the other 2 classes.
Everyone thinks we are using mage stack to win. We just simply have no rogues to throw in a clash.
BTW
Opposition has far better geared mages than our side. Yet even 2 tanks 3 mages we win np being way undergeared. It takes skill not only gear to win. This has been proven over and over again. Yes gear definitely has a big part, but in 2 tank 3 mage clashes skill outweigh gear.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

Y'all so funny about that. Chris yes. Voorg has better stats than me. Lol. Idk about the others. My pve gear for underhul is def better tho.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/2caf3cce183d80649af8b32e43934fae.jpg

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/2a08f5b93d33536745af46c14f0a4ed7.jpg

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/346fddfc232d370e88be22eb4686a789.jpg

My korr is my first shot. My normal is second.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Kingofninjas]

Maybe I'm just dumb but I feel like this is a main thing that should be done. Everybody threw a fit stating that doubling nox damage was actually a nerf because all mages would use curse, how about this get done to completely throw that argument away and we start with that..?



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk

The reason this shouldn't be done is because it makes one of mages skills completely useless. Let's be real here, nobody uses curse unless there is a lot of DoT being dealt. Mages are pretty much impervious to curse because they can shield. Tanks have jugg and no significant DoT for us to use against them.

[intrepd]

That must be an OP Rog for 3 mages to kill 1 Rog....

what are you talking about? im talking about 2 tanks 3 mages vs 2 tanks 1 rogue 1 mage, the rogue is pretty much a food for the 3 mages.

[reiewaun]

There's 56 gears for rogue and once again they want to increase the cannon not the glass

Have u even tested them??? They suck. U always spam in this thread believing u know everything lol

[reiewaun]

153366

Even using 1war without ring, 2 rog, amd 1mage still could win when clash with 4warr :/ who say rogue didnt get place on pvp than?

Do you even know play pvp?U are 3 years old?lol everyone knows that a full team of wars can't do anything,It's called NO DPS,how are they supposed to kill, especially when they got no arc sword, besides u had war, undergeared or no, he still has jugg,so pls get urself brain working before you post

[Fredystern]

Do you even know play pvp?U are 3 years old?lol everyone knows that a full team of wars can't do anything,It's called NO DPS,how are they supposed to kill, especially when they got no arc sword, besides u had war, undergeared or no, he still has jugg,so pls get urself brain working before you post
Beside that, they camp lava that could kill us, have you ever clash with 4warrior with camping lava skill? :/ 3 of them was camp lava, only 1 that chase me

Sent from my Lenovo P70-A using Tapatalk

[intrepd]

Beside that, they camp lava that could kill us, have you ever clash with 4warrior with camping lava skill? :/ 3 of them was camp lava, only 1 that chase me

Sent from my Lenovo P70-A using Tapatalk

why does it feel that we are talking about COD or CSGO? there was camping glintstone bombs as well, not really used that much but still, and its pretty easy to avoid pools as a mage since you wont get stunned, nekro shield-arcane shield, a good tank with glintstone set can help his team avoid pools by just pulling them away from corners.

[Fredystern]

why does it feel that we are talking about COD or CSGO? there was camping glintstone bombs as well, not really used that much but still, and its pretty easy to avoid pools as a mage since you wont get stunned, nekro shield-arcane shield, a good tank with glintstone set can help his team avoid pools by just pulling them away from corners.
Did you see my team got glint set?
And you say its easy right?
Well actually war got shield that do alot of damage, got pull into thier lava once or twice will break my shield, and same with nekro shield too :/

I got it now, since mage mostly participate in clash, endgame rogue think mage was a great class that rule the clash, lmao

Sent from my Lenovo P70-A using Tapatalk

[intrepd]

Did you see my team got glint set?
And you say its easy right?
Well actually war got shield that do alot of damage, got pull into thier lava once or twice will break my shield, and same with nekro shield too :/

I got it now, since mage mostly participate in clash, endgame rogue think mage was a great class that rule the clash, lmao

Sent from my Lenovo P70-A using Tapatalk

Maxed pvp clashes are mostly tanks and mages you cant deny it no? again im saying maxed dont compare random clash to maxed please

[Fredystern]

Maxed pvp clashes are mostly tanks and mages you cant deny it no? again im saying maxed dont compare random clash to maxed please
Ah if only use warrior and mage to clash with full tank it will took so long without koruption, so the fastest way is use rogue cant you accept it? Just say I WANT ROGUE TO GET BUFF SO ROGUE WILL RULE THE PVP AGAIN, I HIT MAGE AND WARRIOR NO ONE COULD KILL ME IM A TANKCANNON!!
Just say it :/

Sent from my Lenovo P70-A using Tapatalk

[Sheentaro]

Ah if only use warrior and mage to clash with full tank it will took so long without koruption, so the fastest way is use rogue cant you accept it? Just say I WANT ROGUE TO GET BUFF SO ROGUE WILL RULE THE PVP AGAIN, I HIT MAGE AND WARRIOR NO ONE COULD KILL ME IM A TANKCANNON!!
Just say it :/

Sent from my Lenovo P70-A using Tapatalk
says the one who cant play without 2 tanks and 2 mages.. lol...anyway , on the blue team , not even 4 tanks tho...the other one who left is a rogue and 1 of their warrior is also ringless.

On topic:

I can see that you dont support rogues to get a buff why? You and yourself knows that you like PvP being dominated by mages and tanks... Give some place to rogues....Do not anymore cover what's clearly obvious...

Ps: I play this bracket too and i always see you in a team of 2 tanks and 2 mages :)

[Fredystern]

says the one who cant play without 2 tanks and 2 mages.. lol...anyway , on the blue team , not even 4 tanks tho...the other one who left is a rogue and 1 of their warrior is also ringless.

On topic:

I can see that you dont support rogues to get a buff why? You and yourself knows that you like PvP being dominated by mages and tanks... Give some place to rogues....Do not anymore cover what's clearly obvious...

Ps: I play this bracket too and i always see you in a team of 2 tanks and 2 mages :)

The one who left if rogue yes, but after that glintset war in but forget take sc :/

And i wanted a balance in PvP not dominated by rogue or mage or warrior, yes mostly i run with that team since there isnt any rogue online, there only some rogue that i trust for a clash, the rest still need arc ring,pp, other, mostly the set was complete in my team was mage and warr so i run using that, but if need hitter than i will change my mage to rogue, thats i know rogue in this brackets didnt need to buff anymore :/ as i say before i dont want sts make any change to twink brackets -.-

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[Ireliaa]

mage invasion again? you guys are so good to help rogues

[Earlingstad]

Having read several posts, I would like to make another suggestion. Feel free to post your opinion on this.

Perhaps this Nox tweak may work (lets test it):

A. If the ticking damage (DOT) from one Nox attack is noticeable enough (cannonify it please)
and,
B. If CURSE IMMUNITY is implemented. Let there be a gap between 1 curse and the next, like freeze, stun immunity etc. This might discourage curse-mage stacking as well.

Let's try THIS? :distracted: http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?359949-PVP-Updates-Proposed-Balance-Changes-PART-2-(7-22-2016)&p=2545096&viewfull=1#post2545096

[Chrissam]

As for a PvP war this is just my feedback to STS for reading both threads n not from the 23+ pages from u ppl which took me about 1hr..... -.- don't go crazy on me after this.

So now if this change happens even rogues can threaten wars and jug now? That's awesome. Considering it's mostly what wars rely on in PvP and once it's down we're paper to mages and rogues anyways. Not sure what else to say besides the ridiculous cooldown of jug and not like if Mastery helps so much.

Plus mages got that 8-9k mana n plus kor advantage. *-* They're having a fiesta. :) Any war to sit on Kor pool will die even with jug. Very sad to know we're supposed to be the 'tanking' class against the others that deals so much damage. Even Taste(a mage) said I was ''useless'' in PvP yesterday. And I'm well geared btw. That's just to show how mages are now. Oh well something needs to be done about mages too in PvP! N this is just my opinion. How about reducing wars jug time?! Would be great!

Ty for working on all this STS. Hope u find a solution.

[intrepd]

Ah if only use warrior and mage to clash with full tank it will took so long without koruption, so the fastest way is use rogue cant you accept it? Just say I WANT ROGUE TO GET BUFF SO ROGUE WILL RULE THE PVP AGAIN, I HIT MAGE AND WARRIOR NO ONE COULD KILL ME IM A TANKCANNON!!
Just say it :/

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Are you serious lol? Everyone knows that the maxed clashes in 56 are 2 tanks 3 mages right now, please tell me ONE rogue that participated in maxed clashes lately and have won, I don't know a rogue that does participate in the first place other than Zeus

[Zynzyn]

:) Any war to sit on Kor pool will die even with jug. Very sad to know we're supposed to be the 'tanking' class against the others that deals so much damage..

If any warrior sits on Korruption pool and makes no effort to move out of it and lead his team away from it, then he deserves to die.

[intrepd]

As for a PvP war this is just my feedback to STS for reading both threads n not from the 23+ pages from u ppl which took me about 1hr..... -.- don't go crazy on me after this.

So now if this change happens even rogues can threaten wars and jug now? That's awesome. Considering it's mostly what wars rely on in PvP and once it's down we're paper to mages and rogues anyways. Not sure what else to say besides the ridiculous cooldown of jug and not like if Mastery helps so much.

Plus mages got that 8-9k mana n plus kor advantage. *-* They're having a fiesta. :) Any war to sit on Kor pool will die even with jug. Very sad to know we're supposed to be the 'tanking' class against the others that deals so much damage. Even Taste(a mage) said I was ''useless'' in PvP yesterday. And I'm well geared btw. That's just to show how mages are now. Oh well something needs to be done about mages too in PvP! N this is just my opinion. How about reducing wars jug time?! Would be great!

Ty for working on all this STS. Hope u find a solution.

Warriors are fine the way they are right now, I mean the mastery already reduces the juggernaut time already.

[Breakingbadxx]

My offer still stands:

I suggest the noxus bolt mastery for the rogue class be given a change.

The current mastery should be changed to such:

?% chance to disrupt/mute an enemy. Enemies disrupted/muted are unable to use skills or basic attacks for ?seconds.

*Ideally it should increase in chance to disrupt/mute and number of seconds enemies are disrupted/muted as it gets upgraded e.g. 1/10 will allow for 2% chance to disrupt/mute and 0.3 seconds of disruption/mute. Increasing at a rate of 2% chance and 0.3 seconds per upgrade. The end result would be 20% chance to disrupt/mute for 3 seconds.

*Upgrading the mastery to allow disruption/mute should increase the cooldown of noxus bolt.

*Upgrading the mastery could mean noxus bolt no longer does damage and its only purpose would be to disrupt/mute. Those who still desire damage on their noxus bolt would not touch the mastery and therefore not receive the ability to disrupt/mute.

*The disruption can also have AOE and affect up to 3 targets depending on the cooldown.

*Those affected by the disruption/mute will have their cooldowns frozen along with their skills and auto attack ability for the ?second duration.

*The disruption/mute won't affect skills that have already been casted e.g. juggernaut or arcane shield.

This is an ability given to glass cannons to increase their survivability and usefullness in many other games.

As you should know, glass cannons are built for 1v1 scenario's, but not all glass cannons want to be forced to play in such a way.

This ability allows for the heal and invulnerability cycle a team made up of warriors and mages have, to be broken at some point.

This gives the rogue class a purpose in team PvP scenario's, as increasing rogue armor is not an option and increasing rogue damage is will just make rogues stronger in 1v1 situations and the heal and invulnerability cycle will always negate it.

Suggesting damage increases will just mean we will be back for a PART 4, PART 5 etc. etc. as far as I'm concerned.

Give the rogue class a purpose in a team PvP scenario, because at the moment. They don't have one. Which is why rogues are not a desired class to use in Team PvP scenario's.

Mages offer me heals of health and mana, have higher survivability than rogues, cover me when I need it with their shields, are easier to keep alive than rogues and can use their seconds of invulnerability to rush and erase any rogues on the opposing side within seconds.

Why would I need a rogue?

What does a single target, non-support DPS class offer in a team PvP scenario?

Rogues have damage? So what? Mages have that too, and more.

- I am a warrior.

[sevenpain]

Maxed pvp clashes are mostly tanks and mages you cant deny it no? again im saying maxed dont compare random clash to maxed please

I'm just curious what is ur ign?? U talk about max end game clash a lot so I'm curious who u r exactly

[Chrissam]

Warriors are fine the way they are right now, I mean the mastery already reduces the juggernaut time already.

Oh ok. Well if rogs will probably get good stuff. They should get armor too right. Good to know my class skill again knowing wars will probably suffer even more again soon. But also majority of mages can tank a tank which most ppl know that. Im a geared glin set tank n damn I have doubts to go up against some mages like voorg, spell, rage, khar, etc. How about arc shield having same cooldown as jug since they're new tanks?! Perfect :D n do u even sleep?! U look like u wait for someone to pop up on here lol jk. I'm out Gn!

[Vorg]

Y'all so funny about that. Chris yes. Voorg has better stats than me. Lol. Idk about the others. My pve gear for underhul is def better tho.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/2caf3cce183d80649af8b32e43934fae.jpg

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/2a08f5b93d33536745af46c14f0a4ed7.jpg

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160724/346fddfc232d370e88be22eb4686a789.jpg

My korr is my first shot. My normal is second.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I have cryostar and effigy buff on that picture, those aren't my pure stats.


153368

These are my stats with no lix and buffs and munch happiness

[reiewaun]

Warriors are fine the way they are right now, I mean the mastery already reduces the juggernaut time already.


My offer still stands:

I suggest the noxus bolt mastery for the rogue class be given a change.

The current mastery should be changed to such:

?% chance to disrupt/mute an enemy. Enemies disrupted/muted are unable to use skills or basic attacks for ?seconds.

*Ideally it should increase in chance to disrupt/mute and number of seconds enemies are disrupted/muted as it gets upgraded e.g. 1/10 will allow for 2% chance to disrupt/mute and 0.3 seconds of disruption/mute. Increasing at a rate of 2% chance and 0.3 seconds per upgrade. The end result would be 20% chance to disrupt/mute for 3 seconds.

*Upgrading the mastery to allow disruption/mute should also increase the cooldown of noxus bolt.

*The disruption can also have AOE and affect up to 3 targets depending on the cooldown.

This is an ability given to glass cannons to increase their survivability and usefullness in many other games.

As you should know, glass cannons are built for 1v1 scenario's, but not all glass cannons want to be forced to play in such a way.

This ability allows for the heal and invulnerability cycle a team made up of warriors and mages have, to be broken at some point.

This gives the rogue class a purpose in team PvP scenario's, as increasing rogue armor is not an option and increasing rogue damage is will just make rogues stronger in 1v1 situations and the heal and invulnerability cycle will always negate it.

Suggesting damage increases will just mean we will be back for a PART 4, PART 5 etc. etc. as far as I'm concerned.

Give the rogue class a purpose in a team PvP scenario, because at the moment. They don't have one. Which is why rogues are not a desired class to use in Team PvP scenario's.

Mages offer me heals of health and mana, have higher survivability than rogues, cover me when I need it with their shields, are easier to keep alive than rogues and can use their seconds of invulnerability to rush and erase any rogues on the opposing side within seconds.

Why would I need a rogue?

What does a single target, non-support DPS class offer in a team PvP scenario?

Rogues have damage? So what? Mages have that too, and more.

- I am a warrior.

U play too much lol haha xd :P
,it's not useful The silence
Explanation : on arcane u most spam as rogue when u see vulnerability, besides won't help cause mages will still be able to use the curse eventually, no point on this upgrade on mastery.
Also will destroy the fun of rogue vs,totally depends on who will get silenced and not on skills, I hope u understand why ain't so good. NO disrespect.
If I am wrong u free to correct me
Also agreed wars are fine if some don't know how to switch from jugg to vb and cover if other war around that's their fault

[Breakingbadxx]

U play too much lol haha xd :P
,it's not useful The silence
Explanation : on arcane u most spam as rogue when u see vulnerability, besides won't help cause mages will still be able to use the curse eventually, no point on this upgrade on mastery.
Also will destroy the fun of rogue vs,totally depends on who will get silenced and not on skills, I hope u understand why ain't so good. NO disrespect.
If I am wrong u free to correct me
Also agreed wars are fine if some don't know how to switch from jugg to vb and cover if other war around that's their fault
How about this?

The noxus bolt will no longer do damage when it has been upgraded via the mastery and its only purpose will be to disrupt/mute.

This avoids the fear of the "curse" skill the rogue class currently fears correct?

Those who desire to do damage with their noxus bolt would not upgrade via the mastery and not receive the ability to disrupt/mute.

[Zeus]

The entire point to these buffs is so that rogues have a place in the team and are more effective than a warrior and mags stack.

There are many who are losing perspective of that and just throwing out useless suggestions just to insure that warrior and Mage stack still remains widely successful. It's ridiculous how selfish this is and should go to show how much these players do not care about balance - just themselves.

These players even admit this in their own posts so it goes to question the very nature of their "contributions" toward balance.

[Fredystern]

The entire point to these buffs is so that rogues have a place in the team and are more effective than a warrior and mags stack.

There are many who are losing perspective of that and just throwing out useless suggestions just to insure that warrior and Mage stack still remains widely successful. It's ridiculous how selfish this is and should go to show how much these players do not care about balance - just themselves.

Yes, you are right that have 1 or 2 rogue will be more effective, but if wanted to buff or nerf a class dont touch the twink brackets :(

[Plqgue]

The entire point to these buffs is so that rogues have a place in the team and are more effective than a warrior and mags stack.

There are many who are losing perspective of that and just throwing out useless suggestions just to insure that warrior and Mage stack still remains widely successful. It's ridiculous how selfish this is and should go to show how much these players do not care about balance - just themselves.

These players even admit this in their own posts so it goes to question the very nature of their "contributions" toward balance.

Anything that happens to one class effects all classes bro ...

[Fredystern]

Anything that happens to one class effects all classes bro ...

Truly agree with you

[Deathclaw]

Anything that happens to one class effects all classes bro ...

+1

Also want to say that at twink brackets rouges are highly demanded still.

[Deathclaw]

The entire point to these buffs is so that rogues have a place in the team and are more effective than a warrior and mags stack.

There are many who are losing perspective of that and just throwing out useless suggestions just to insure that warrior and Mage stack still remains widely successful. It's ridiculous how selfish this is and should go to show how much these players do not care about balance - just themselves.

These players even admit this in their own posts so it goes to question the very nature of their "contributions" toward balance.

Just because you disagree with people suggestions doesn't mean they are useless you just want to hear what u want hear not other peoples opinion.

[Deathclaw]

My offer still stands:

I suggest the noxus bolt mastery for the rogue class be given a change.

The current mastery should be changed to such:

?% chance to disrupt/mute an enemy. Enemies disrupted/muted are unable to use skills or basic attacks for ?seconds.

*Ideally it should increase in chance to disrupt/mute and number of seconds enemies are disrupted/muted as it gets upgraded e.g. 1/10 will allow for 2% chance to disrupt/mute and 0.3 seconds of disruption/mute. Increasing at a rate of 2% chance and 0.3 seconds per upgrade. The end result would be 20% chance to disrupt/mute for 3 seconds.

*Upgrading the mastery to allow disruption/mute should increase the cooldown of noxus bolt.

*Upgrading the mastery could mean noxus bolt no longer does damage and its only purpose would be to disrupt/mute. Those who still desire damage on their noxus bolt would not touch the mastery and therefore not receive the ability to disrupt/mute.

*The disruption can also have AOE and affect up to 3 targets depending on the cooldown.

*Those affected by the disruption/mute will have their cooldowns frozen along with their skills and auto attack ability for the ?second duration.

*The disruption/mute won't affect skills that have already been casted e.g. juggernaut or arcane shield.

This is an ability given to glass cannons to increase their survivability and usefullness in many other games.

As you should know, glass cannons are built for 1v1 scenario's, but not all glass cannons want to be forced to play in such a way.

This ability allows for the heal and invulnerability cycle a team made up of warriors and mages have, to be broken at some point.

This gives the rogue class a purpose in team PvP scenario's, as increasing rogue armor is not an option and increasing rogue damage is will just make rogues stronger in 1v1 situations and the heal and invulnerability cycle will always negate it.

Suggesting damage increases will just mean we will be back for a PART 4, PART 5 etc. etc. as far as I'm concerned.

Give the rogue class a purpose in a team PvP scenario, because at the moment. They don't have one. Which is why rogues are not a desired class to use in Team PvP scenario's.

Mages offer me heals of health and mana, have higher survivability than rogues, cover me when I need it with their shields, are easier to keep alive than rogues and can use their seconds of invulnerability to rush and erase any rogues on the opposing side within seconds.

Why would I need a rogue?

What does a single target, non-support DPS class offer in a team PvP scenario?

Rogues have damage? So what? Mages have that too, and more.

- I am a warrior.

With korruption already being in game effecting their heals , skill disruption would hit the nail in the coffin to the warrior class.

[reiewaun]

How about this?

The noxus bolt will no longer do damage when it has been upgraded via the mastery and its only purpose will be to disrupt/mute.

This avoids the fear of the "curse" skill the rogue class currently fears correct?

Those who desire to do damage with their noxus bolt would not upgrade via the mastery and not receive the ability to disrupt/mute.

Nox is used on pve too, silence what??? Mobs,?, If it some kind of stun on bosses why should there be stun pets and stun procs??? Sorry silence is not an option on this game

[Ireliaa]

Just because you disagree with people suggestions doesn't mean they are useless you just want to hear what u want hear not other peoples opinion.

i can confirm its useless
newbies shouldnt allowed on feedback about other classes which they dont even play

[Deathclaw]

i can confirm its useless

Could you explain to us why its useless? instead of just saying its useless?

[Zeus]

Just because you disagree with people suggestions doesn't mean they are useless you just want to hear what u want hear not other peoples opinion.

They're useless, being that I play the class daily, I think I would know what would actually benefit and what wouldn't benefit the class.

I've already stated why before. If you want rogues to be given a chance in team play, they either need more survivability, more damage, or more skills that contribute to team play. The proposal is none of that. It only encourages sorcerers to use curse against rogues. A skill which is highly effective once the DoT is running. In the nature of a team based fight, this skill will always be running.

It doesn't endanger the sorcerer much to use it despite the short range. The reason being is due to the sorcerer shield. Once debuffs are in play, sorcerers run the fastest of all classes. This is because their shield stops all speed debuffs and stuns. So, it's very simple for them to shield and curse the rogue as soon as the first Nekro shield goes down.

Effectively, what has now happened is that a rogue has two choices: use nox and get himself killed, or stop using the skill and greatly reduce any damage he's producing. Both of these do not work because of the fact that rogues do not produce enough damage to be seriously hurting the other classes. Aimed shot alone will not kill a class. In order to do that, you'll need aimed and nox. You cannot use SP because it puts you in the line of fire and will get yourself killed as soon as you use it. Even if by some miracle, you do survive after using SP, you are now in the line of fire and will be sucked back in by axes and sorcerer stack.

I hope this makes sense.

[Deathclaw]

i can confirm its useless
newbies shouldnt allowed on feedback about other classes which they dont even play

I clearly can see that you are angry please calm down, no need to insult me by calling me a "newbie" its just unmature.

[Ireliaa]

Could you explain to us why its useless? instead of just saying its useless?

i am saying it like 32142345423512 times already i dont wanna repeat same thing over and over and over again , 2-3 rogue left here to check whats going on rest is mages arguing about how to rogue

im judging you are new here acording to your join date on forum so please learn the game before suggestion and do not create a empty noise with useless sugestions. I would say that to you but you guys already derailed and ruined this feedback its too late

[Zeus]

i am saying it like 32142345423512 times already i dont wanna repeat same thing over and over and over again , 2-3 rogue left here to check whats going on rest is mages arguing about how to rogue

im judging you are new here acording to your join date on forum so please learn the game before suggestion and do not create a empty noise with useless sugestions. I would say that to you but you guys already derailed and ruined this feedback its too late

Yes, that's the part that's funniest. Sorcerers want to tell rogues how they should be fighting and be used. However, when sorcerers were getting buffed, they basically did not want rogues to give their opinions at all and were asking for just about everything in the book.

I can even go back to the buff thread and pull it up if anyone wants a history lesson on it.

[Deathclaw]

i am saying it like 32142345423512 times already i dont wanna repeat same thing over and over and over again , 2-3 rogue left here to check whats going on rest is mages arguing about how to rogue

im judging you are new here acording to your join date on forum so please learn the game before suggestion and do not create a empty noise with useless sugestions. I would say that to you but you guys already derailed and ruined this feedback its too late


I been playing AL since lv 31 cap , I have a lot of knowledge about this game rouges have been the most overpowered class the past two years, never have i seen a game where one class 1 hits the another that's just not right. Just because my forum accounts is new doesn't mean im a "newbie".

[Zeus]

I been playing AL since lv 31 cap , I have a lot of knowledge about this game rouges have been the most overpowered class the past two years, never have i seen a game where one class 1 hits the another that's just not right. Just because my forum accounts is new doesn't mean im a "newbie".

So what is your IGN?

[Breakingbadxx]

Nox is used on pve too, silence what??? Mobs,?, If it some kind of stun on bosses why should there be stun pets and stun procs??? Sorry silence is not an option on this game

If you take your time to read my suggestion, you will see that your comment needs editing.

Stop jumping to conclusions.

[Breakingbadxx]

The rogue community believes more damage is the way right? Well, enjoy yourselves in tdm or CTF after your "buff"!

I will always be a wall to negate your damage.

Mages will always out heal your damage, be invulnerable to your damage and use 'curse' to use your damage against you.

I couldn't really care less if the rogue class continues to remain undesirable in team PvP due to their choice on what will make them better.

A mage has much more to offer in a team than a rogue, so why not stack them?

I'm done defending you guys.

- I am a warrior

- gg

[Justg]

Devs

In the meeting earlier this week in which this course of action was decided, was there a spot at the table for the players? Someone should be acting as the in-house player advocate (devil's advocate? ;)

Vroom and Carapace are doing a good job of offering options and gathering feedback, but 25 pages of drama from Friday's post is not tremendously helpful.

Ultimately the developers have the most neutral and unbiased opinions on PvP, as well as access to a large amount of data that the community does not have.

We'll discuss on Monday and let you know what our thoughts are.