View Full Version : Challenging Rogues - Sorcerer vs. Rogue Duels
Hello,
As part of my campaign to buffing rogues, I will be challenging all rogues on my sorcerer - Poseidon. Now, I don't expect to win them all and I will list those who can beat me and those who I have dueled.
This is not intended to humiliate anyone, just show the fact that rogues are indeed weak. It will also be part of my campaign to show & help developers identify what to buff.
IGN: Poseidon
Duels:
Zulgath vs. Poseidon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMWZCXprd0U
Cottages vs. Poseidon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZGuZn2fOXg&feature=youtu.be
Periilous vs. Poseidon/Ruukia vs. Poseidon/Ikarem vs. Poseidon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DcCbfB129o&feature=youtu.be
Proud vs. Poseidon/TimePixie vs. Poseidon/Thaconan vs. Poseidon
https://youtu.be/K0nCOE9ctFg
yubaraj
08-23-2016, 10:58 PM
How you guys will determine that you guys are wearing somewhat equal gears?
Even you win most of the rogues. can it be because of gear difference and connection advantage. How to find it out?
And I don't think rogues needs a buff in duel. Rogues only need a buff in team environment.
Anyways it's nice videos.
How you guys will determine that you guys are wearing somewhat equal gears?
Even you win most of the rogues. can it be because of gear difference and connection advantage. How to find it out?
And I don't think rogues needs a buff in duel. Rogues only need a buff in team environment.
Anyways it's nice videos.
Even equal gears, I've won rogues. It's not about that. The secret lies in auto attack, sorcerers do not use it enough. Look how many times I auto attack in the video.
His gear is about the same as mine and his ping is pretty similar too.
kinzmet
08-23-2016, 11:46 PM
I hope this campaign will bear fruit! Keep it posted!
Psychoism
08-24-2016, 12:04 AM
Thank you for posting like this. i'm learning lol :banana:
resurrected
08-24-2016, 02:42 AM
I smell NCS [emoji14]
Anyways its good work doing all that and just showing that Devs should look more into class balance. STG should analyse your videos and videos of those who dueled you. IMO gaining data week is necessary and would help.
I killed zulgath with staff...
You've seen how good my gear is lel and how good my ping is. Nuff said. It isn't fair to rogues if you duel the nabs.
You should start streaming random TDM matches and maybe find some better rogues to duel :P
I also killed Temzy. What other rogues do you need me to duel? Every single one I've dueled, I've won against (excluding Imbaaaack).
The ones I killed and didn't get on video:
- Omenpl
- Ledsen
- Temzy
- Thaconan
Rogues are extremely weak. These aren't exactly new PvPers either. :D
That's news to me, from my stay in PvP it seemed like they had an advantage over the other classes in TDM.
Could it be your ping factor giving an advantage over them?
How did the fights go? Did you loose a few duels(match's in duels that is.)?
The damage reduction you were requesting, isn't that a bit too much? Won't stat buffs suffice like some developer stated in one of the other dozen threads?
No, I won every single round. However, if you mean did I die in the duels? Yes, however, that was poor timing on my part of heal. I just don't see a little bit of armor helping rogues during a rush especially when sorcerers can output crazy amounts of damage like this.
Here's a vs series compilation of some rogues I fought. The outcome is still the same. I'm not maxed out either.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DcCbfB129o&feature=youtu.be
Robhawk
08-24-2016, 05:16 AM
Well you did your homework and Grimm is a big factor in your fights, his passive: ("Damages multiple targets and has a chance to reduce Dex,Str, Int by 20, hit by 35%, and armor 20%")! This passive paired with Nekro or MM happiness bonus and a AA i dont know yet (its not Grimm`s original one). Since this game is all about debuffs over buffs i guess its another debuffing AA...
How about you use standard nekro like 90% of mages and fight them again? I guess the outcome is different! I mean you make a mage and gear it up to maximum. Arcane gun even with Kershal vanity, lol. A grimm equipped with Nekro/MM and other eggs for AA, para stones , arcane amulet...
How about you make a endgame warrior maxed geared too ? Do the homework again, find the needed eggs and just buy all things needed. Your warrior will do great !!!
To get to the point: A person like Zeus with all his skill and knowledge about AL`s mechanics, with all his money w7ill do great with ANY class BUT you can not convert this to the rest of the playerbase! Not everybody has the money and time to take it to that level !!! You can influence STS decisions like you want with threads like this but its not representative for the 99% !!!
1 thing is for sure: The days where rogues where the only class needed, in pve and pvp, will be back sooner then later with threads like this! So at the end of the year you can switch back to your rogue and 1 click the others like you where able to in the past...
reiewaun
08-24-2016, 07:50 AM
Those 2 shields is what makes mages tough to beat, u can't brake the first shield, mages have such huge damage output cause they can spam abilities and dps, rogues dagger don't make any damage from distance,btw I go now on pvp, if Zeus is on would like a try
Well you did your homework and Grimm is a big factor in your fights, his passive: ("Damages multiple targets and has a chance to reduce Dex,Str, Int by 20, hit by 35%, and armor 20%")! This passive paired with Nekro or MM happiness bonus and a AA i dont know yet (its not Grimm`s original one). Since this game is all about debuffs over buffs i guess its another debuffing AA...
How about you use standard nekro like 90% of mages and fight them again? I guess the outcome is different! I mean you make a mage and gear it up to maximum. Arcane gun even with Kershal vanity, lol. A grimm equipped with Nekro/MM and other eggs for AA, para stones , arcane amulet...
How about you make a endgame warrior maxed geared too ? Do the homework again, find the needed eggs and just buy all things needed. Your warrior will do great !!!
To get to the point: A person like Zeus with all his skill and knowledge about AL`s mechanics, with all his money w7ill do great with ANY class BUT you can not convert this to the rest of the playerbase! Not everybody has the money and time to take it to that level !!! You can influence STS decisions like you want with threads like this but its not representative for the 99% !!!
1 thing is for sure: The days where rogues where the only class needed, in pve and pvp, will be back sooner then later with threads like this! So at the end of the year you can switch back to your rogue and 1 click the others like you where able to in the past...
It's not the passive. Nekro would actually let me hit harder because the armor debuff applies more frequently. The only real reason I don't use Nekro is because I don't want to drop 4M on this character permanently. There's nothing that you can say that will make me.
Always an excuse man...my point is people are playing the class wrong.
Visiting
08-24-2016, 09:29 AM
You'll never beat my rogue in a duel :banana::banana:
To get to the point: A person like Zeus with all his skill and knowledge about AL`s mechanics, with all his money w7ill do great with ANY class BUT you can not convert this to the rest of the playerbase! Not everybody has the money and time to take it to that level !!! You can influence STS decisions like you want with threads like this but its not representative for the 99% !!!
Sorry, but rogues also need gold to buy the arcane dagger lv 56 and arcane amulet. And these items cost millions. Believe me, you do not take damage and resistance in team vs team with a rogue without it.
Sky_is_epicgear
08-24-2016, 12:32 PM
:/ im no genius but if you're trying to prove a point on this issue of mages being op you cant max gear your character and go challenging ppl. Its going to produce bias results. In almost all mmos ive played its gear > skill (what i mean by this is if player 1 has gears such as Zeus does and player 2 has a reasonably priced set of gear, obviously player 1 will have the upperhand. However if you're a bad player then the advantage the gear gives you is wasted).
So what should you do?
Right, get lvl 56 gear of the same type (ex. Icescale set [you're not going to use that though bcuz its weak, get something that you can find for both mages and rogues that you can say 'ah yes, if i wear this i wont be completely demolished if i go into a random PvP match"]). Grab jewels for your respective classes. No location buffs or both players have them. Now grab a bunch of ppl who know a fair bit about the game mechanics to participate in duels. Be sure that both players play with nekro since nekro is the meta for PvP as i see it and same eggs slotted in it if you choose to slot eggs in. Basically the only variables that shouldn't be the same in the duels are A: player skill (everyone has their own unique playstyle), and B: player class(mage v rogue).
Tbh i don't see the point of this mage v rogue clash. I remember back when i used to play endgame aka "rogue legends". Every now and then a mage would come on the forum and complain abt how under powered their class was. I remember how a lot of players would say things like "mages are meant for pve" or " mages are support class" or " you should make a rogue instead of complaining". And if im honest it's not like mages are what rogues used to be 3 seasons ago.
I might be 100% wrong and everything I've type is complete bs since i don't play endgame anymore. But idc.
OrangeUnicorn
:/ im no genius but if you're trying to prove a point on this issue of mages being op you cant max gear your character and go challenging ppl. Its going to produce bias results. In almost all mmos ive played its gear > skill (what i mean by this is if player 1 has gears such as Zeus does and player 2 has a reasonably priced set of gear, obviously player 1 will have the upperhand. However if you're a bad player then the advantage the gear gives you is wasted).
So what should you do?
Right, get lvl 56 gear of the same type (ex. Icescale set [you're not going to use that though bcuz its weak, get something that you can find for both mages and rogues that you can say 'ah yes, if i wear this i wont be completely demolished if i go into a random PvP match"]). Grab jewels for your respective classes. No location buffs or both players have them. Now grab a bunch of ppl who know a fair bit about the game mechanics to participate in duels. Be sure that both players play with nekro since nekro is the meta for PvP as i see it and same eggs slotted in it if you choose to slot eggs in. Basically the only variables that shouldn't be the same in the duels are A: player skill (everyone has their own unique playstyle), and B: player class(mage v rogue).
Tbh i don't see the point of this mage v rogue clash. I remember back when i used to play endgame aka "rogue legends". Every now and then a mage would come on the forum and complain abt how under powered their class was. I remember how a lot of players would say things like "mages are meant for pve" or " mages are support class" or " you should make a rogue instead of complaining". And if im honest it's not like mages are what rogues used to be 3 seasons ago.
I might be 100% wrong and everything I've type is complete bs since i don't play endgame anymore. But idc.
OrangeUnicorn
The rogues I'm fighting are maxed or pretty close to maxed. There will be more videos going up today against maxed out rogues. People say that mages don't win, but tbh, I'm not seeing it at all.
P.S: I'm not maxed out, I'm just full superbs.
Kharjojo
08-24-2016, 01:32 PM
It's supposed a rogue has to win in vs almost every single duel against a mage? Cause, honestly, i cannot see an issue in 1 vs 1 environment.
Pls Zeus, pick up ur rogue and duel a mage, i'm curious to see how many matches you'll win and how many you'll lose. Seems kinda fair to me to see you duel a mage as a rogue 'cause ur considered one of the best rogue in pvp environments so i don't see why you choose to spend your gold on ur mage to prove what you could had proven just with ur rogue.
As i already stated, there's an issue with rogues survavibility in clashes but this has nothing to do with mages being op imho.. is the team composition and the multiple heals from tanks and mages together, the nekros sincronicity and the glinstone set of tanks with multiple pulls.
I'd like to add another lil thing: respect for those rogues who've adapted to the current tanks and mages stacking using the speed set in a very efficient way.. and there are many out there which simply rocks and snype the opposite dps like devils.
It's supposed a rogue has to win in vs almost every single duel against a mage? Cause, honestly, i cannot see an issue in 1 vs 1 environment.
Pls Zeus, pick up ur rogue and duel a mage, i'm curious to see how many matches you'll win and how many you'll lose. Seems kinda fair to me to see you duel a mage as a rogue 'cause ur considered one of the best rogue in pvp environments so i don't see why you choose to spend your gold on ur mage to prove what you could had proven just with ur rogue.
As i already stated, there's an issue with rogues survavibility in clashes but this has nothing to do with mages being op imho.. is the team composition and the multiple heals from tanks and mages together, the nekros sincronicity and the glinstone set of tanks with multiple pulls.
I'd like to add another lil thing: respect for those rogues who've adapted to the current tanks and mages stacking using the speed set in a very efficient way.. and there are many out there which simply rocks and snype the opposite dps like devils.
I'm already maxed out on rogue. I can use speed set too in mage stacks and win. However, the fact is that the skill level between me and the mage stack I'm fighting against is HUGE. I should be beating them anyways. It also doesn't change the fact that a sorcerer can use speed set too and destroy the opposite rogue as I've proven numerous times. That doesn't deny the imbalance exists. In the vs, same imbalance exists. It helps you highlight why mage stack is so efficient. Even 1 on 1, I can destroy pretty much any rogue I meet.
Here's another rogue compilation clip: https://youtu.be/K0nCOE9ctFg
Please, bring me a rogue that I'll lose to. These rogues, by the way, did not even win one duel.
reiewaun
08-24-2016, 02:06 PM
It's supposed a rogue has to win in vs almost every single duel against a mage? Cause, honestly, i cannot see an issue in 1 vs 1 environment.
Pls Zeus, pick up ur rogue and duel a mage, i'm curious to see how many matches you'll win and how many you'll lose. Seems kinda fair to me to see you duel a mage as a rogue 'cause ur considered one of the best rogue in pvp environments so i don't see why you choose to spend your gold on ur mage to prove what you could had proven just with ur rogue.
As i already stated, there's an issue with rogues survavibility in clashes but this has nothing to do with mages being op imho.. is the team composition and the multiple heals from tanks and mages together, the nekros sincronicity and the glinstone set of tanks with multiple pulls.
I'd like to add another lil thing: respect for those rogues who've adapted to the current tanks and mages stacking using the speed set in a very efficient way.. and there are many out there which simply rocks and snype the opposite dps like devils.
A self try always best answer
30m gear over here ,i could only kill zeus mage only if i dogde some of the gun shots and the freezes.
The tactic i use on wars spam it until it procs apllies only on wars and not mages,its very effective against wars and one of the few ways to kill them while being a rogue.
not always works cause .......its all about proc rate
Best thing u can do on a fight vs mage is stay away from that extraordinary damage output,u drop from 80%hp to 30% in an eye blink
A self try always best answer
30m gear over here ,i could only kill zeus mage only if i dogde some of the gun shots and the freezes.
The tactic i use on wars spam it until it procs apllies only on wars and not mages,its very effective against wars and one of the few ways to kill them while being a rogue.
not always works cause .......its all about proc rate
Best thing u can do on a fight vs mage is stay away from that extraordinary damage output,u drop from 80%hp to 30% in an eye blink
You're timepixie, right? The other thing is that I position myself to create distance from your packs while still doing damage. So, if you want to kill me, you need to SP. The bad thing? My nekro AA and ice will slow you and make sure you don't get back to your packs fast enough. People just don't know how to play mage...I'm superb jewels and have a lot less invested into this class. Actually, Nekro passive is more effective against rogue because the armor debuff applies far more frequently. So, if I had nekro opened...it would be a slaughter.
reiewaun
08-24-2016, 02:26 PM
You're timepixie, right?
yep lol ,btw wanted ask how much gold u spent on mage,imbalance is easily proved when with same amount of gold spent u cant kill the other class
yep lol ,btw wanted ask how much gold u spent on mage,imbalance is easily proved when with same amount of gold spent u cant kill the other class
3.8M Amulet, 6M ring, 4M jewels, 10M pets, 5M gun. If you want to be picky, I can do just fine with planar pendant. I just like the green glow of arcane. :3
Keep in mind that rogue should be beating mage. Yet, obviously, as my videos prove, it cannot.
resurrected
08-24-2016, 04:07 PM
I'm already maxed out on rogue. I can use speed set too in mage stacks and win. However, the fact is that the skill level between me and the mage stack I'm fighting against is HUGE. I should be beating them anyways. It also doesn't change the fact that a sorcerer can use speed set too and destroy the opposite rogue as I've proven numerous times. That doesn't deny the imbalance exists. In the vs, same imbalance exists. It helps you highlight why mage stack is so efficient. Even 1 on 1, I can destroy pretty much any rogue I meet.
Here's another rogue compilation clip: https://youtu.be/K0nCOE9ctFg
Please, bring me a rogue that I'll lose to. These rogues, by the way, did not even win one duel.
Part about macro killed me LOL
Part about macro killed me LOL
Yes, I was dying. He was so confused...LOL.
reiewaun
08-24-2016, 04:17 PM
3.8M Amulet, 6M ring, 4M jewels, 10M pets, 5M gun. If you want to be picky, I can do just fine with planar pendant. I just like the green glow of arcane. :3
Keep in mind that rogue should be beating mage. Yet, obviously, as my videos prove, it cannot.
Add Tavern and locations on those xd,I go get lodge and socket mm to get it more even :P
Though on my previous posts on past pvp threads that mages technically is the best class if u know how to swap shields. Spamming isn't hard.That some wasn't doing it so long ain't my fault, only mages were saying rogues kill mages easily
yubaraj
08-24-2016, 04:29 PM
You're timepixie, right? The other thing is that I position myself to create distance from your packs while still doing damage. So, if you want to kill me, you need to SP. The bad thing? My nekro AA and ice will slow you and make sure you don't get back to your packs fast enough. People just don't know how to play mage...I'm superb jewels and have a lot less invested into this class. Actually, Nekro passive is more effective against rogue because the armor debuff applies far more frequently. So, if I had nekro opened...it would be a slaughter.
Yap I agree if rogue doesn't use SP they won't be able to kill mage.
What I have seen rogues are going straight for a combo. Don't forget that most of the mage will start fight with arcane shield which gives 2 sec invulnerability. That 2 sec invulnerability ensures mage withstand the first combo.
What happens if rogue decide to charge packs when mage are charging their shield and and charge their aimed after that. Remember that if mages get hit by a combo after 2 sec invulnerability. Mage also have to charge their lifeguard and tap their nekro AA. During that time rogue can go for packs as well as hit with their aimed shot and nox. While rogue can hit while moving mage won't be able to hit when they are charging their lifegiver. Make sure to do another combo and anything can happen lol.
Just a theory lol . ps I have a twink rogue .
Anyways I am always saying that mage wins if their light crit and rogue doesn't dodge gun attacks. Note that mages light doesn't crit as often as aimed shot.
I am sorry to derail this challenge rogue for vs thread. But I am curious who won duel between Zeus and Darthpapa. That may give us clear picture as they are one of the top players in respective class.
Yap I agree if rogue doesn't use SP they won't be able to kill mage.
What I have seen rogues are going straight for a combo. Don't forget that most of the mage will start fight with arcane shield which gives 2 sec invulnerability. That 2 sec invulnerability ensures mage withstand the first combo.
What happens if rogue decide to charge packs when mage are charging their shield and and charge their aimed after that. Remember that if mages get hit by a combo after 2 sec invulnerability. Mage also have to charge their lifeguard and tap their nekro AA. During that time rogue can go for packs as well as hit with their aimed shot and nox. While rogue can hit while moving mage won't be able to hit when they are charging their lifegiver. Make sure to do another combo and anything can happen lol.
Just a theory lol . ps I have a twink rogue .
Anyways I am always saying that mage wins if their light crit and rogue doesn't dodge gun attacks. Note that mages light doesn't crit as often as aimed shot.
I am sorry to derail this challenge rogue for vs thread. But I am curious who won duel between Zeus and Darthpapa. That may give us clear picture as they are one of the top players in respective class.
You can ask Darthpapa about that...I won't be revealing that info. How did you even know that we dueled each other? @.@
yubaraj
08-24-2016, 04:43 PM
You can ask Darthpapa about that...I won't be revealing that info. How did you even know that we dueled each other? @.@
Okay. And I knew because it was mentioned in another thread but Darthpapa didn't reveal the details either.
resurrected
08-24-2016, 04:47 PM
You can ask Darthpapa about that...I won't be revealing that info. How did you even know that we dueled each other? @.@
Someone said something about duel between him and you. Dont remember which thread @.@
Okay. And I knew because it was mentioned in another thread but Darthpapa didn't reveal the details either.
Oh, lol. That's why. And I only won't because we're friends and releasing that info brings all kinds of negativity on each other. (Not saying you guys)
reiewaun
08-24-2016, 05:09 PM
Yap I agree if rogue doesn't use SP they won't be able to kill mage.
What I have seen rogues are going straight for a combo. Don't forget that most of the mage will start fight with arcane shield which gives 2 sec invulnerability. That 2 sec invulnerability ensures mage withstand the first combo.
What happens if rogue decide to charge packs when mage are charging their shield and and charge their aimed after that. Remember that if mages get hit by a combo after 2 sec invulnerability. Mage also have to charge their lifeguard and tap their nekro AA. During that time rogue can go for packs as well as hit with their aimed shot and nox. While rogue can hit while moving mage won't be able to hit when they are charging their lifegiver. Make sure to do another combo and anything can happen lol.
Just a theory lol . ps I have a twink rogue .
Anyways I am always saying that mage wins if their light crit and rogue doesn't dodge gun attacks. Note that mages light doesn't crit as often as aimed shot.
I am sorry to derail this challenge rogue for vs thread. But I am curious who won duel between Zeus and Darthpapa. That may give us clear picture as they are one of the top players in respective class.
Mana limited in don't do combo unless I see that I will have a chance to launch it before Zeus pulls the shield on, did it 4 times, worked once,better than getting slaughtered ;P,also I used different playstyles just for practice cause I was long away from game, I wasn't packing away from where I would engage my spam,the thing is I couldn't stand that crazy damage output from the spam and my faking dagger's didn't want to proc. I was falling from 80% hp to 30% on an eye blink
Potato is me
08-24-2016, 06:22 PM
3.8M Amulet, 6M ring, 4M jewels, 10M pets, 5M gun. If you want to be picky, I can do just fine with planar pendant. I just like the green glow of arcane. :3
Keep in mind that rogue should be beating mage. Yet, obviously, as my videos prove, it cannot.
Not to mention full noble mind(at least) jewels set up,20++m, (Often the jewels are the ones that makes a huge difference)
Not to mention full noble mind(at least) jewels set up (Often the jewels are the ones that makes a huge difference)
I said 4M in jewels, so that's not noble minds. My jewels are superbs.
Potato is me
08-24-2016, 06:46 PM
I said 4M in jewels, so that's not noble minds. My jewels are superbs.
Fair enough.. btw that ker shal effect on gun vanity is a glitch?
Fair enough.. btw that ker shal effect on gun vanity is a glitch?
It's not a glitch, it's a vanity. The vanity effect will still show despite it being a gun.
Potato is me
08-24-2016, 06:51 PM
It's not a glitch, it's a vanity. The vanity effect will still show despite it being a gun.
ahhh so i just have to equip kershal vanity and use a gun the effect will show *.*
Mages have the best looks, ty for the info!
ahhh so i just have to equip kershal vanity and use a gun the effect will show *.*
Mages have the best looks, ty for the info!
No worries! Yes, mages have awesome looks. :D
Inb4MakeMagesUglier!
LOL no, I'm not that mean.
Horme
09-06-2016, 01:05 AM
After I watched the videos, the rogue mostly chasing the mage and move away from their pack.
Try these, force mage to use his main shield then stay away from mage hit range till mage main shield down. Is that possible?
Twerk
09-06-2016, 03:48 AM
After I watched the videos, the rogue mostly chasing the mage and move away from their pack.
Try these, force mage to use his main shield then stay away from mage hit range till mage main shield down. Is that possible?
You are missing fact that mage can chase you with shield. lol
Horme
09-06-2016, 03:58 PM
You are missing fact that mage can chase you with shield. lol
You can move away with nekro aa?
You can move away with nekro aa?
You have to use Nekro AA at start.
Horme
09-07-2016, 05:56 AM
You have to use Nekro AA at start.
When rogue aimed shot, mage always using arcane shield at the 1st time, thats the time to move away and packing under nekro shield.
Also, Is that possible for rogue or mage to kill a warrior with korruption?.
When rogue aimed shot, mage always using arcane shield at the 1st time, thats the time to move away and packing under nekro shield.
Also, Is that possible for rogue or mage to kill a warrior with korruption?.
A smart mage doesn't shield until he's close enough. And yes, it is Horme.
Horme
09-08-2016, 03:37 AM
A smart mage doesn't shield until he's close enough. And yes, it is Horme.
I always have a problem when a warrior pull then use korruption aa, it is like theres no way out cause no mana to heal.
I always have a problem when a warrior pull then use korruption aa, it is like theres no way out cause no mana to heal.
I just swap to speed and heal while in pool. Heal returns 20% mana.
Horme
09-08-2016, 05:04 PM
I just swap to speed and heal while in pool. Heal returns 20% mana.
Oh, I see. So that pack mastery is the point. Thanks, I should try this one.
Rogueuchiha
09-14-2016, 09:05 AM
I want to try when I get good gear :3
Richyboyyyy
09-17-2016, 03:30 AM
Wow nice men !
kinzmet
09-17-2016, 04:25 AM
Whats with Neasaquva? I've became more interested on the chat than the duel lmao... :D