Official Feedback Thread for Purchasing High and Low level Dungeon Access

[Samhayne]

We recently added the following premium features to Pocket Legends:

High level players can purchase the temporary ability to gain fractional experience in low level maps. This ability can be gained by tapping the blinking exclamation point icon when you enter a low level map.
Low level players can purchase the temporary ability to access high level dungeons. Note that you are likely to have a difficult time playing in dungeons that are above your level, better bring some friends! This ability can be gained by purchasing the relevant Enhancer or by attempting to join a friend/guildmate in a high level map


This change was brought primarily to better facilitate friends playing together despite level differences. Also, to provide variety for player to gain experience in different areas of the game. Rather than always having to run the same instances over and over (for example, as you progress toward the elite level cap) a player could forgo the chance at level appropriate loot to instead farm a lower level instance and still progress.

We know that there is some concern regarding the kill count leaderboards in light of this change. We are looking into that issue now.

Please use this thread to voice your thoughts on the matter. We would appreciate it if you keep the input constructive and friendly. Thank you for your feedback!

[Cascade]

To me it encourages low level players to leech and power level.

[WoundedEagle]

Repost from my closed thread:

Since we have these new elixirs, why not take advantage? I don't want to Boycott the idea, I think it was pretty brilliant. Let's take a look:

'Access All Game Instance' - Allows my level 6 to join Nuri's Hallows, yet I do no damage, and the enemies dodge every attack. Enemies still have a huge amount of health, although they don't pwn as bad as I thought they would. I would say if you do this, don't combo elixir, use just an XP elixir. Unless kill-farming, but that could be easily done in the Campaign matching your level. Same XP as Forest Haven it seems.

'Enable XP Gain' - Allows my level 50 (Now 52) to gain XP in Balefort Castle. I understand the XP amount is normally more in higher campaign, but it seems my One-Hit-Kills make up for the time it takes to kill one enemy in Sewers. I gained 5 XP for 2 kills in Balefort Castle - The Magic Castle, on 4x, kinda don't remember what I gained in Sewers, but it seems the kills are way faster. Time is the key factor of this whole concept. If I can gain XP faster by Killing 6 enemies at once with Blast Shot in Balefort Castle, why not? I like this elixir :)

- I understand some will be mad how easily kills are to get now, but why not take advantage of that too? 1 Platinum is an App on TapJoy. Say you get a app worth 5 Platinum, that's 25 mins. I gained about a 1000 kills in 25 mins going = Forest haven Whole campaign + Balefort Castle Whole Campaign + And a run in Fathom Crypt. Also gained over a 1 1/2 in 25 mins. Not bad to be honest (On a level 50, now 52).

So my question is, is it better to farm XP in a campaign matching your level? Or to farm XP and easy kills in low-level Campaigns?

[Yvonnel]

I am personally grateful for this update. It gets very monotonous running the same 5 maps to gain xp at the endgame level. The ability to change it up now is wonderful.

However, many people are going to complain about "kill farming" making a comeback. To me, "meh!" who cares, I never worried about my k/d ratio or the amount of kills I got anyway.

Also, I can see the same folks complaining about "power-leveling". But in reality, if you know the maps it is still really easy to power level, and it still goes on. I know precisely which maps to run to get the most xp. And if you don't want lower level players in your maps, LOCK THEM!!!!! Those who never learn the skill to play effectively don't stay long.

My thoughts....

Kill Farming: Simply remove the kill counting. Don't know exactly how the xp gain and kills are coded, but maybe it is possible to remove the kills and keep the xp. Again, this doesn't bother me but removing it would appease those it does. Or, to the ones on the leaderboards, get to work.

Power-Leveling: No solution, other than.... that the players take responsibility and LOCK GAMES!!!! If you don't want a lvl 1 in Mt. Fang, lock your game.

Honestly, pleasing everyone is impossible. STS has always exhibited an extreme willingness to try to please the community, but at some point the community needs to apply some common sense. If there is something that you can do to limit how changes affect "Your" gameplay, then don't you have the responsibility as a veteran to follow that course of action.

STS, Keep up the good work. I have and will continue to support!

See ya in Alterra!

[FluffNStuff]

While my official position is against it ... part of me loves the idea I can gain exp while wrestling with Vyx (one of my favorite stress relievers). Any chance we can get longer ones for perhaps a discount, or even without the discount. But discount of course would be better.

Oh, and on the other side, not sure why you are charging players for the privilege of getting booted.

[Aikiebo]

I really love the new elixrs. I am just curious, is there an important reason why we can only buy 5 minutes at a time? I am just wonderting, cause for players who really enjoy using these elixirs, might be easier if we can buy 30 minutes or 60 minutes at a time?

I am just blown away by the idea that now we can level up our characters in dungeons we enjoy the most instead of being forced to go through less favorite dungeons. Lost Expedition is really a well-planned and good looking dungeon. But, I have so much more lag than usual there. Usually huge portions of the landscape don't even render. I truly dread having to go through it for 5 levels. Now, I don't have to.

By creating these great elixrs for us, STS is telling us that the believe in us. It's like they are saying that they trust and believe in us enough that they don't have to spoon feed and micro manage every detail of our gaming experience. They are giving us more freedom so that we can have more fun and enjoyment.

Mixing high levels and low levels together can really increase the amount of training and knowledge players aquire as they level up. More experienced players can take their friends in and "show them the ropes" and give them more training and experience than before.

Not to mention, that the absolute number one point of this game for players is to have fun. People playing together with their friends is never a bad thing. I am glad that now even more people will be able to have fun with their friends.

I am really excited about these elixrs and am very glad to help support the game.

[Conradin]

I have issues with this-


At least if this must be done do not let players get large amounts of xp in low dungeons- it should be scaled. And i think this will introduce a generation of noobs worse then the mynas gens- the Plat gens....

[Gaddy]

I was soloing my lvl 65 bird with x4 elixir in AOII plas pyramid. It took me a little under 5 minutes (and I'm slower than some) to clear the lvl.

Thats 700 xp base plus the bonuses for mobs and bosses (whatever that adds up to) every 5 min...

I think thats pretty strong soloing, and I'll bet there are a few areas that are even better for racking up hefty solo XP runs.

I love the new elixirs!

[Silentarrow]

I was soloing my lvl 65 bird with x4 elixir in AOII plas pyramid. It took me a little under 5 minutes (and I'm slower than some) to clear the lvl.

Thats 700 xp base plus the bonuses for mobs and bosses (whatever that adds up to) every 5 min...

I think thats pretty strong soloing, and I'll bet there are a few areas that are even better for racking up hefty solo XP runs.

I love the new elixirs!

Balefort hidden passage, expect 1k xp in 5 mins lol :).

[Aikiebo]

A player can solo from Forest Haven all the way through sewers on 4x very rapidly. It is REALLY a nice break from grouping all the time.

That is one of the things all our elixrs are good for. By giving us more decision making power we have more flexibility. Some people like doing things "this" way and others like doing things "that" way. Some like mixing it up and trying all the options.

There is more than one way to play any game. And all the elixrs are allowing more freedom instead of "formula leveling" --- now we have fun leveling.

[CrimsonTider]

The argument about powerleveling is legit BUT not much different now than it was when the 4x elixirs were introduced. People will always find a way to powerlevel regardless of the elixirs which exist. I have personally seen over 20 60+ toons this past week with less than 5k kills. This update hasn't added that much fuel to the fire.

My opinion is keep the xp and do away with ability to kill.

[JaytB]

The argument about powerleveling is legit BUT not much different now than it was when the 4x elixirs were introduced. People will always find a way to powerlevel regardless of the elixirs which exist. I have personally seen over 20 60+ toons this past week with less than 5k kills. This update hasn't added that much fuel to the fire.

My opinion is keep the xp and do away with ability to kill.

I agree, getting rid of the kills would be a step in the right direction. I simply can not understand the use of allowing any super-low-level to participate in a high level dungeon. Didn't the devs change this in the not so distant past to prevent low levels leeching in high level dungeons? I can see the use for a high level gaining xp in a lower level dungeons, but letting any low level participate in high level dungeons will just get them booted from that game IMO. I can see it already, a lv10 running in mount fang. What possible contribution could that player make, other then leeching, slowing down the entire group because of dying when an enemy as much as farts in their direction, and getting some expensive pinks while not doing anything but running behind the group at a safe distance? Or am I simply overlooking something?

[Skeletonlord]

This is really awesome and love this change! Great job guys!

[Decur]

The fact that kills count when high level player use the elixir to enter low level maps effectively destroys the hours upon hours of hard work that all the people on leaderboards invested. To think that what took me a year to achieve can be negated by anyone with enough plats in a few days is disheartening, morale draining, and flat out infuriating. It also leaves the leaderboard with absolutely no credibility. Sad...

[mackjack]

I've suggested eons ago for the feature of being able to play and gain xp in any and all maps, with the unstated assumption that the mobs and bosses will be scaled accordingly to keep things challenging and interesting. The current implementation, where I can let my friend's 2 year old play my end game toon in forest haven and still gain xp and kills, is just outright ridiculous.

Let's cut through all the pretense, sugar coating, and BS and call this what it really is: selling xp for plat.

So my suggestion to STS is to scale the difficulties of mobs and bosses to the host, and if others are outside of +/- 5 levels of the host, then they don't get any xp or kills. This would give access to all maps while keeps things in balance.

[MightyMicah]

To everyone who is upset about kill counts being boosted-

There is one word I have for you. It's called "elixars." Kill count was screwed as soon as they added elixars for damage armor speed, etc. If you don't have money for elixars, you are probably not gonna hit the leaderboard. All this new elixar is doing is making it all the more easy to get kills...

And one more thing, I find it rather ironic that people complain about this elixar making it easy for kills to get boosted, when it would be just as easy to reinable xp lock kills. Think about it, if high levels get kills quicker, they already have an advantage over lower levels getting kills at a set level. Nuff said ;)

As Sindrom put it in The Incredibles, "When everyone's super, no one will be." In other words, if everyone's a booster, no one is.

My opinions on the new elixars? I like them. I like them alot. I don't know how many times I've wanted to play with my lower level friends and still gain progress. This helps immensly! Thank you sts. Thank you.

~MM

[Weak_Sauce]

Goodbye skilled players, the whole point of running the lower level maps is to hone your skills and learn how to play as a team while gaining xp. With every change I just see this going further and further out the window.

Every change that's been made lately seems to revolve around making more money, regardless of what it does to game play. When did it become so laborious to play this game that you needed to introduce another way to level faster? People who have reached the level cap have done it, mostly, through hard work and/or because they're longtime members. Level 65 isn't supposed to be a cake walk that people can reach in a day yet all of the people whining about not being able to reach the top level quickly enough are validated with every update.

You've removed almost all of the incentive and fun of being a lower level member. So hoist up the white flag because you win, no one wants to be a lower level and now with 4x elixers and buying 5 min elixers that allow u to gain kills and xp anywhere no one will ever have to be. Kills will mean nothing and people will play easy levels over and over to level up.

I saw someone complain about being bored with having to run the same 5 levels within a campaign over and over. Isn't that a big part of the incentive to level your toon? So that you can unlock the next campaign and start investigating all that it has to offer? Since alien oasis all of the campaigns have been clones of other campaigns with tweaks here and there. Quests take all of a day or two to finish and then what? Besides leveling there isn't much else to do. Maybe if new camaigns had more to do, secret dungeons, other things to do in town, anything, people wouldn't be sick of them after a day or two. Then you wouldn't need to keep adding new ways to level up faster because people would want to take the time to explore all there is to do in the campaign. Bring the creativity back please!

People have written long posts about all of these issues time and again and yet we hear nothing from you. We take the time to go through all of this because, as we should, we take ownership of the game. Many of us have invested a lot of time into playing, teaching, and growing this game they want to see it fulfill its potential.

If this is what your vision is for the future of pocket legends let us know now, we might as well save our money instead of buying platinum believing that you will come to your senses.

Maybe this is just me and maybe I'm coming off like a hot head, I guess I just thought that people were supposed to learn from and help eachother while working on gaining xp, not using the easiest map to solo the entire way.

Finally, if this is here to stay and no one can change your minds then could you at least stop putting the new elixers at the top of the list in the store and instead add them in to the current elixer list in order of how much platinum they cost.

[kallima]

Devs, the explanation was nice about WHY you chose to implement these lixirs and I do hope that you do a fix on kill farming since this new enable xp lixir negates a previous patch to just kill farm in order to achieve LB status. I say this with utmost sincerity as I do want to contunue playing the game I've come to love. I really didn't comment on previous changes as I understand STS is in business to make money but I truly DO NOT comprehend the contradictory actions that are in direct opposition to views that the you, yourself(selves) have stated clearly about intended game play, its mechanics and the integrity that the LB's are supposed to be about. Please fix this.

As far as the pay to play all maps, this also negates a previous update where access was limited to level requirements. That update fostered teamwork, encouraged players to hone thier skills while still giving them the freedom to tailor builds to thier individual style because it is more difficult to clear maps at the intended levels than to have other high levels breeze through maps while lowers tag along. This one bothers me less because frankly I can boot leechers but I did want to remind you that your STS team CHOSE to change this for a reason, why revert it? Are those reasons no longer valid? Do those reasons no longer apply?

As an aside, for those posters that wholeheartedly welcome these updates, please state why. There are many of you who did explain and thank you but spare me the "Great job! Thanks STS!" because positive and negative feedback both require the 'why' so the dev team can truly assess the benefits/repercussions and apply changes they see fit, if any at all.

[FluffNStuff]

From Crypt to the forbidden crypt:
Spent an hour rassling with Vyx on my 63-64 Mage using the 4x mega juice or whatever and here are the results:
Cost: 52 plat (40+12)
exp: average 100 per minute at both levels (63 and 64)
Vyxs : About 50
Pinks : Just a Conqs Ursan Helm
Fun: Hellz Yeah!

[MightyMicah]

@weak_sauce couldn't have said it better. I agree 100% well thought out and written post.

@Kallifa read my last post. Leaderboards are irrepairably screwed. Also, whos to say Sts didn't change their mind? What if they ended it in their last updates, then realized maybe it was a bad decision? Perhaps they are trying to do it differently now and make it more fair?

Honestly atm, I don't know what Sts is doing. My guess is they want everyone at top level. With each new update twinking is further shattered and leveling up is the ideal choice. With this update they have made power leveling easier and they have encouraged high levels to go to lower campaigns to get kills...and maybe hit the leaderboard!!!....all the while leveling up. See my point? My 2 cents is all

~MM

[bronislav84]

To me it encourages low level players to leech and power level.This is exactly my concern.

Low levels power get level and leech off higher levels, so you end up with players who are at high level and barely know how to play. This is bad, and should have stayed abolished.

Higher levels SHOULD NOT get kills with this elixir. Xp in lower level instances for a change of scenery is ok.

Please fix this for both games.

[MightyMicah]

1. Boot em, or lock your game.
2. Why shouldn't they? (not neccesarily disagreeing just wanting your opinion)

[Decur]

To everyone who is upset about kill counts being boosted-

There is one word I have for you. It's called "elixars." Kill count was screwed as soon as they added elixars for damage armor speed, etc. If you don't have money for elixars, you are probably not gonna hit the leaderboard. All this new elixar is doing is making it all the more easy to get kills...

And one more thing, I find it rather ironic that people complain about this elixar making it easy for kills to get boosted, when it would be just as easy to reinable xp lock kills. Think about it, if high levels get kills quicker, they already have an advantage over lower levels getting kills at a set level. Nuff said ;)

As Sindrom put it in The Incredibles, "When everyone's super, no one will be." In other words, if everyone's a booster, no one is.

My opinions on the new elixars? I like them. I like them alot. I don't know how many times I've wanted to play with my lower level friends and still gain progress. This helps immensly! Thank you sts. Thank you.

~MM

I got my kills without use of elixirs. Never even tried a free one. Money should not be the reason why people are on leaderboards and this is what these elixirs will cause. There's a level of pride felt when you achieve something through hard work and dedication that simply can not be purchased.

No, it's easier to get kills in lower levels. When I was level 61, acquiring kills were far faster than when I hit 66 and tried to get kills in Mt Fang.

My opinion of new elixirs? I hate them. I hate them a lot. When I want to play with lower level toons, I make a new toon.

[MightyMicah]

Awesome I agree, but elixars are, in fact, out there. And wether we admit it or not, they give a huge advantage. (this is coming from a guy who was on leaderboard before elixars became steroids) And of course killing is gonna be easier for high levelers...did I not say that?

Edit: ok I see what you are saying, and once again I agree! But I just don't see elixars being nuked anytime soon :\

[KingFu]

I already posted my opinion on the matter, and the entire thread I posted it on was deleted. My opinion clearly isn't a valued one:/

[Ellyidol]

Very much promoting solo play, but equally ruining team play for leveling IMO.

I can see it now, when a new campaign is released, people rushing to elite level will bypass the new campaign entirely until they hit elite cap on way lower levels and start farming once they hit cap/elite cap. The new level scaling system doesn't help either. Everything points towards not using the latest campaign, ease in kills in lower campaign, speed, density of mobs, number of mobs per map, and the loot. If you want end game pinks, you'll need to be (hypothetically speaking) 65/66 anyway, so might as well get there with ease first.

Since I don't see full guild groups of 60+ doing runs in Balefort Castle (more than, maybe two players over 60 doesnt really help with speed anymore), how about increase the XP bonus on full groups in the latest campaign?

[saool]

There really isn't a point to this game anymore...and I'm one that loves it. Blah! It was good before the elixirs, getting excited about grinding...now you can solo a low level dungeon and get all those points. :(

Oh well...

*Raises white flag*

If anything, they should release new campaigns more often, now that it's so easy to level.

[kallima]

@Kallifa read my last post. Leaderboards are irrepairably screwed. Also, whos to say Sts didn't change their mind? What if they ended it in their last updates, then realized maybe it was a bad decision? Perhaps they are trying to do it differently now and make it more fair?

~MM

First, my name is Kallima, typos are understandable but please at least take the time to get someone's name right. And ended what? Please have your pronouns refer to something in one of your previous sentences. Maybe they did change their minds and if so, thats why my last two questions were presented to the devs specifically. They don't owe me an explanation but I won't get one if I don't bother to ask. And please explain what about this you think makes it "more fair?" I'm not asking you what you think their viewpoints are, I'm asking you what you think since you presented the issue of fairness.


I already posted my opinion on the matter, and the entire thread I posted it on was deleted. My opinion clearly isn't a valued one:/

^^this^^

Why was an entire thread deleted while others were merely locked or left open?

[Aikiebo]

1. Goodbye skilled players, the whole point of running the lower level maps is to hone your skills and learn how to play as a team while gaining xp.

2. When did it become so laborious to play this game that you needed to introduce another way to level faster?

3. Level 65 isn't supposed to be a cake walk

4. You've removed almost all of the incentive and fun of being a lower level member.

5. I saw someone complain about being bored with having to run the same 5 levels within a campaign over and over. Isn't that a big part of the incentive to level your toon? So that you can unlock the next campaign and start investigating all that it has to offer?

6. I guess I just thought that people were supposed to learn from and help eachother while working on gaining xp, not using the easiest map to solo the entire way.

7. could you at least stop putting the new elixers at the top of the list in the store and instead add them in to the current elixer list in order of how much platinum they cost.

1. These new elixirs will make it easier for high level players train and help lower level players. The player base will become more skilled not less.

The whole point of running lower level maps and every other map is TO HAVE FUN and actually enjoy the game.

A player can hone their skills and learn to play as a team in any of the maps. Now they can get xp for do just that.

2. Because some people want to level faster. Some people want to level slower. Either way is perfectly ok. These new elixrs, well all the elixrs, give every player more options to fine tune THEIR experience so that their enjoyment will be greater. Having more options will make it more fun for all players regardless of their playing style.

3. There is no one "supposed to way". Different strokes. People's ideas about how THEY want to reach cap are going to vary a great deal. That is ok. It is their game, their fun time, they gaming experience. They should be in control of it.

4. Other than farming drones, few people want to remain low level. These elixrs are not removing the incentive, they are removing a barrier to becoming high level: i.e. they are making it easier to stop being a low-level, lol.

It is impossibe to decide for someone else what they are going to consider fun.

5. Exactly the point. Many people are bored doing the same thing over and over. All of our elixrs are giving people more freedom so therefore more fun.

As I said earlier, instead of "formula leveling" --- now we have fun leveling.

6. Once again, you are right. The new elixrs will allow people to work together, learn from each other - all while getting xp.

Nothing wrong with solo'ing. Fantastic way to play at least at times. Many people farm solo. And players should help each other learn to solo better if solo'ing is something you want to do.

7. No, no, no, lol, plz no!! As long as the only choices we have are 5 min. long, then please leave them right on top of the list. Otherwise, every 5 min. we going to have to scroll to the bottom of the long elixr list. No, please leave at top as long as 5 min. is our only choice.



because positive and negative feedback both require

Very useful: definently yes
Required: definently no

[saool]

Another suggestion is INCREASING EXP required to level... I mean it's fairly easy with them elixirs...

[Ellyidol]

What about difficulty scaling according to the average level of the group? That way, higher leveled players can still enjoy lower end campaigns but not just breeze through while getting the same or more XP than the last campaign. This would only work downwards though, for higher leveled players using the lower level campaigns and not vice versa.

So you get a 60 player going into a Balefort Castle map but with the difficulty of Fang, but a level 10 entering a Fang map shouldn't change the difficulty at all - for exploit purposes. This way, that 60 can still enjoy the campaign of BC but not disregard that he is a Lv. 60 player not a Lv. 25 player. This doesn't affect the farming players since they would be in the last campaign, this would only affect the leveling players.


What really irks me with this feature is the reducing emphasis towards team play and just promoting solo play. You'll have players skipping the entire middle campaigns and just jump from the lower campaigns to the last.

[Aikiebo]

What really irks me with this feature is the reducing emphasis towards team play and just promoting solo play. You'll have players skipping the entire middle campaigns and just jump from the lower campaigns to the last.

I can understand your concerns, but I really think that this is going to make people happy. The people who try solo play with these elixrs are going to fall into one of two categories.

1. People who solo'ed (at least occasioinally) before these new elixrs.

2. People who will try it for the first time. Some of them will learn that they like solo'ing at least once in a while. Others will learn that they can't stand it and will not try it again.

Either way, everyone going to be happy.

I see your concerns, it seems like if more people solo'ing that's going to hurt the idea of "team play". But, really, the fact that some gonna solo now doesn't hurt or even change team play. It just gives people more options. They can go back and forth and fine tune their experience in a way that will make them the happiest.

We're going to see players playing the maps they enjoy the most. If someone wants to skip the middle levels, guess they can. But, for me, my fav maps have always been (in this order) the AO's, B Castle and Skeller Returns. People are only gonna skip the middle maps, if they like other maps better for some reason.

I hope these changes work out for everyone.

[MightyMicah]

@kallima my apologies, and my comment was meant to be answering each of your statements accordingly. Obviously I failed.

"ended what?", xp lock kill farming.

Why I think reinabling it is fair is 'cause now high lvlers have the equivalent, only they are gonna stack the kills much faster than a low level player can. So, instad of forcing this low level player to level up, he could stay at a campaign and stack some kills, it would be fair because it's still insignificant compared to what high levelers are doing. Just an Fyi, the reason they disabled xp lock kills before is because it was "unfair." That's why I brought in the issue of fairness.

~MM

[Elf-Orc-Naga]

Wow!! Just few words! Amazing elixirs and must have in our game!!!!

This is a good way to expand the game making friends united! :)

[Slush]

Same as Myst. The devs know that when they make a thread they're only gonna hear what they want to hear, as to a thread made by a forum member. I'm disappointed as to how STS reacted to those threads.
Edit:Please don't tell me this post is irrelevant to the topic; I'm sure STS has read my opinion.

[Gaunab]

So, you disabled kills for exp locked chars, because it would "make the leaderboards meaningless", and got many twink farmers upset with this.

Now, I can't farm the low level maps with my lvl12, but rather rush through with my lvl66 and gain kills at 1k+ per hour.

Explain please, how does this make sense???

[Decur]

So, you disabled kills for exp locked chars, because it would "make the leaderboards meaningless", and got many twink farmers upset with this.

Now, I can't farm the low level maps with my lvl12, but rather rush through with my lvl66 and gain kills at 1k+ per hour.

Explain please, how does this make sense???

I've heard reports of over 500 in 5 minutes!!! Yes, 5 minutes!!! I can't get that many in two hours in Mt Fang...

[Ellyidol]

After trying both plat elixirs on an alt and on my main, I now see what Aik means, and I fully agree.

Having the option to level on different campaigns really brought back the interest to the game for me. It definitely gave me more options as to how to level up.

The only thing I still don't see the purpose of is the lower level elixirs allowing "power leveling". As argued by a lot, I also do not see how a lower level can contribute in any way to a much higher leveled campaign - they will only get booted. For friends with large level gaps, the higher level friend can still join the lower campaigns anyway. And now with the XP anywhere elixir, the higher level friend can also level up with the lower level.

I acknowledge that the leader board with these new XP elixirs will also be a new issue. Maybe some sort of reset + compensation to active players in the LB?

I also love the pricing. That 1 plat definitely gives me full satisfaction for my money. Only thing I would add is longer durations instead of constant 5 minutes.

[RedRyder]

Just disable the feature for kill counts outside level appropriate campaigns and the elite cap grind, and problem solved.

[kallima]

Very useful: definently yes
Required: definently no

You took that quote out of context. If everyone just says "new update is great thanks," or "update is bad," how could anyone determine what the benefits or repercussions will be? When I gave employee evaluations I didn't say "Hey Mr. Smith you are doing great, keep it up! I explained their strengths and weaknesses to develop them as an employee, that is what TRUE feedback is, not mindless compliments or criticism.

And as far as the rest of your post is concerned, when is easier better? Aphorisms like "No pain, no gain" and "anything worth having, is worth working for" exist for a reason. Put down the kool-aid this is not summer camp, we are not singing kumbayah - there will be unhappy people with whatever STS decides, but we are trying to save the game we have come to know and love from being a dumbed down version.

I know you are doing something similar by providing positive perspectives on how this could help and appreciate your attempts, but I do think will just create more clueless players, those that want to learn - do but as you said, most people don't want to remain low level and will take the shortest route necessary. They do it now and I fear it will be worse if STS continues.to make it easier for them.

[mackjack]

@kallima:

Nicely said. It's sad that STS is doing everything that they can to appease the instant gratification generation at the expense of alienating a lot of old timers. Guess we are just a few decimal points on their excel spreadsheet.

What's next? "premium" end game toons that can be bought for plat? Wouldn't surprise me a bit given the direction that STS has been taking lately.

[Ruby!!!]

I really am on the fence about the new elixirs. I was bored of Mt. Fang runs so I went to farm Vyx. 30 minutes on 4x and xp everywhere elixir gave 3600 xp. And that map isn't a grinding map at all as you have to wait for mob respawn after every lap. I guess running mega maze should easily drop 10k an hour. So for me this elixir is a great way to grind xp in 50 maps instead of 5.
But I also see that it could encourage a lot more power leveling. I guess many high level players didn't power level as much cause they didn't want to sacrifice precious xp grinding time. That would be different now.
Same for scaled farming: A potted 65, 4 level 20s in sandstone caves - everyone wins.
I don't care much about kill farming but I can understand that I wouldn't be amused seeing that some end level chars farms the same kills in Fathom Crypt that I had farmed in end game dungeons the hard way. I think kill count should stay disabled with the new elixir.

About the access all areas elixir - I don't get the point. I know pros used to solo plasma pyramid with level 10 twinks but running the elite dungeons with minimum level twinks is pro enough for me. And for new players I just can't see how running behind some high levels through Mt. Fang an dying every second room (if they didn't get the boot right away) is a good experience.

Earlier a level 7 wearing nothing but an omni crown and elixir shine asked me if I would run Mt. Fang with them. Kinda nice picture for the recent discussions about where pl is going :)

[Kalielle]

Everything points towards not using the latest campaign, ease in kills in lower campaign, speed, density of mobs, number of mobs per map, and the loot. If you want end game pinks, you'll need to be (hypothetically speaking) 65/66 anyway, so might as well get there with ease first.


Elly is dead on as usual. The scaling system is great for holiday loot, but as I've been leveling on my 61 I've often reminded myself that I basically have no chance of getting the loot that's truly important to own until I get to 65. It wasn't a big deal before, but with the new elixirs it's much more important to have attractive loot dropping for people who are leveling in their appropriate areas, since it's their only incentive to do that. A small chance at a level 61 pink isn't terribly exciting.

Would it be possible to keep the new loot scaling only for holiday dungeons, and change it to the way it was before in the other dungeon?

Or how about adding some rare vanity items that drop in all levels but only for people in who aren't in an area too low for them?

The fact that kills are counted definitely needs to be changed, or the leaderboards will become completely meaningless. Also if kills are not counted, that would be one more incentive for people to level in the appropriate areas.

As for paying to access higher level dungeons, I think it should be there for free or not at all. I've always been in favor of letting map access be more open, and letting the community deal with those who are in the wrong area. Or at least change the level difference allowed from 2 levels below to say 5-10 levels below. Nobody wants to see level 10s in sewers, but a level 32 in AO2? I used to see half-full groups of a mix of 30s and low 40s doing those maps with little difficulty.

Another idea would be to let a lower level player join a higher level map only if a friend invites him. If the intent was to keep friends together (which is a great idea), then this should do it.

But letting only people who pay access any level just feels way too much like cheating. And like others pointed out, you're charging people money for a product that may get them booted a lot if used improperly (or yelled at in public games if people can't boot). Imagine a game where the host doesn't have much platinum, so he had to unlock all maps by leveling and couldn't skip ahead. Then a lower level joins his game, who paid to be able to skip ahead. How sympathetic/friendly do you think the host will be to that player? I didn't use to boot people who were lower level but not so low as to not be contributing - partly because I would also join higher maps on my low levels, so I knew that being 10 levels below the recommended level wasn't such a big deal. But honestly if a lower level joins my game and I know he got there only because he paid plat, when other kids wouldn't have been able to afford doing that - I'm booting. Why should my team have to carry him just because he paid plat?? With the plat elixirs at least, everyone in the team gets an advantage if someone uses them. With this, one person gets an advantage and everyone else gets a disadvantage. It feels like non-plat users have to carry those who bought the platinum product.

[MoarPewPew]

I'm fine with the change to the game but heads ill be booting all players that are not made for that level they go in. AKA Leeches.

[Gaunab]

I think there are 3 major concerns with these new elixiers:

1) Low level chars leeching in high level dungeons:

Some people already mentioned it, and I also dont think this will be a big problem. If the group doesn't want the low level in the group, he can easily be booted, and if he hosts his own game nobody would join. So the lowlevels would most likely do runs with friends or people who don't mind if they have 1 non-efficient player in the party (eg when someone does solo runs, why shouldn't he allow a friend to "leech" some experience?)
A new player would have no chance to level only in high level dungeons, even if he had enough plat. So no paniking please :)

2) KILL farming in low level dungeons

I totally agree with eveyone who complained about this!
Devs, please! You disabled this feature for exp locked chars, with following reasoning:


No point in kill farmers anymore, as characters with xp turned off no longer gain kill stats. We want the leaderboards to mean something beyond who can farm the most with xp turned off.

Got many low level farmers upset, and the reasoning is pretty weak IMO, but at least it contains some sense.

But now any high level char can got to these maps, and farm kills at some k per hour! In some maps 3K+ would be no great problem. Dying is impossible. Now, THAT really renders the leaderboards meaningless... People invested hours and weeks in achieving their place on the leaderboards, now everybody could do it with some plat and fraction of the time. Please reconsider this aspect! (simply lock kills in maps out of the lvl range)

3) EXP farming in low level dungeons

I see, that this is a point many players are delighted of. And I agree, that it can be much more fun to have a whole variety of maps to run, than grinding only a few maps over and over again.
But the problem with this is, that farming lower maps is actually more EFFICIENT than the endgame maps! The leveling speed is at least twice as fast compared to Mount fang runs! :O As soon as most players will realize that, it could totally undermine the game concept: Everone how has the plat, would simply solo a low dungeon, making extreme amounts of xp and kills. No more need for teamwork. No more need for grinding groups. No chance to learn team mechanics.
This could create high level players, without any knowledge of any endgame teamplating concepts. Worse than all these powerleveled mynas-/ keepergens or 4xElixier junkies!
I think it is great that we can earn experience in lower maps now, but it shouldn't be more worthwile than the endlevel maps. I suggest that either the exp for low level maps is scaled (according to the level of the player) or the exp gained with endlevel groups is increased.

We definitly need some changes...

[Snipehard]

The update made some nice changes and overhauls on this game but the so called 'Kills farming' is ruining the leaderboard score.
So in conclusion i would say that I'm really disappointed, the elite vanity has lost the value of hard working (despite the fact that you get faster xp than in the new map), i have got all 3 elite vanities, i don't like to see the values being lost to this new update.

Kill farming is another issuse, i know the kill counts are meaningless but not compared to someone who have worked for it to achieve top in the leaderboard.

Lastly, the biggest issuses is that we don't like seeing low lvl players keep coming in new Mt Fang. (constantly booting is a bad timing...) This game is more of soloing rather than teaming, it is basically ruining everyone gaming experience.

[FluffNStuff]

@Ruby: Fun isn't it! How many Vyxs did you kill and did you get any pinks?
And of course +1 to elly for mentioning the level scaled loot. I am 64 and I can either level in fang where I have zero chance at a level 65 item, or farm more vyxs to get to 65, and THEN go farm level 65 items without being overfanged :)

[Weak_Sauce]

And as far as the rest of your post is concerned, when is easier better? Aphorisms like "No pain, no gain" and "anything worth having, is worth working for" exist for a reason. Put down the kool-aid this is not summer camp, we are not singing kumbayah - there will be unhappy people with whatever STS decides, but we are trying to save the game we have come to know and love from being a dumbed down version.


Kal, you are so dead on.

[Ruby!!!]

@Ruby: Fun isn't it! How many Vyxs did you kill and did you get any pinks?
And of course +1 to elly for mentioning the level scaled loot. I am 64 and I can either level in fang where I have zero chance at a level 65 item, or farm more vyxs to get to 65, and THEN go farm level 65 items without being overfanged :)

I had around 20 vyxs and one conq helm dropping :) And when I am bored of slaying Vyxs - one more 1000 snowballs quest this time with xp gain sounds fun!

Thanks for "overfanged" gonna use that from now on ;)

[Whirlzap]

Oh, so that's why my thread got deleted-.-
Still annoyed by this elixir>.<

But I do agree.
The only reason I am still fighting for this is because I care about this game.
I don't want it to turn into a crappy boring and money-game. If I didn't care, I would've walked away by now, and just let it rot on its own. That's why I'm making these threads. That's why I contribute my time into this. For someone who didn't care, they would just say, I don't even care whereever this game goes; if this game is becoming a greedy way for profit, I'm gone, and I won't give it second chance.
But I do care, and that's what this post means.

[CrimsonTider]

Ok. After 2 hours of leveling post-update, my stance is still pretty firm: keep the xp access, remove the ability to gain kills. As others have mentioned, I am now able to enjoy ALL levels of this game and also help new players, complete old quests, and gather xp all at the same time. Feels more like when I first started playing which is something I have missed.

No, I will NOT use these elixirs on my maxed out toons as I could care less about the LB or my KDR. And if we are all honest and think for a moment, how will these elixirs really effect the LB? And if it does, I only know of a coupke of people (really Dec and Chant) whom have never used an elixir. So whether these new elixirs change the LB or not is not the issue because elixirs are already being spammed to attain those top spots.

Now, I will restate that I think the kills should remain disabled but I honestly don't think the game will end nor will the LB change that much if they are left as is.

[noobmigo]

Erhm...I don't have any plat nor any time to download free plat, so I'll base my opinion on the comments on this thread. If these comments are incorrect, my fault. Will go try to get some plat to see how this is later.

And....Yes, I do get serious over games that I've spent plenty of money on.

So apparently:
-Level 66s can go to...Forbidden Crypt, Balefort Hidden Passage, etc. AND EARN XP, AND KILLS? No....
If this is correct, then this is the most bogus decision...I've ever seen in a video game that I've spent at least a hundred dollars on.

I mean...people are saying you can learn from this experience. Yeah, maybe the honest-abe learner's would use this elixir to boost their understanding of the game. But COME...ON! Those people are 1% of the community! The other 99% are going to be able to earn...something good? Sure! A WHOLE BUNCH OF XP SPAMMING SKILLS IN BALEFORT CASTLE HIDDEN PASSAGE RACKING UP 5 Trillion Kills/XP per 10 minutes.

-I saw Fluff's post on how it would make pinks more bountiful....


Do you have any idea what this would do to PL Economy?
It would:
-Make lower level prices DROP.
-Make higher level prices go UP.

What that means is....
Say...you just started the game. You don't have 20Million to blow on items. You decide to farm. But WAIT! Those twink items that used to be premiums are now....20...thousand? Huh? And the minor pinks (Crystalline Dagger for example) are now maybe....1K? It would take an assload of time to gather up 20Million to make the level cap set. To add salt to the injury, all higher level items will go UP in price due to no supply and high demand from lots of self-power leveled people who've been farming trash all this time.


I DO like the one where now lower levels can go to higher campaigns...but isn't it a little contradictory that they stopped people from power leveling, and now they open a elixir where it is allowed to Power Level? Huh...

If this is not correct, then I'm the retarded one.

[Yvonnel]

Ok. After 2 hours of leveling post-update, my stance is still pretty firm: keep the xp access, remove the ability to gain kills. As others have mentioned, I am now able to enjoy ALL levels of this game and also help new players, complete old quests, and gather xp all at the same time. Feels more like when I first started playing which is something I have missed.

No, I will NOT use these elixirs on my maxed out toons as I could care less about the LB or my KDR. And if we are all honest and think for a moment, how will these elixirs really effect the LB? And if it does, I only know of a coupke of people (really Dec and Chant) whom have never used an elixir. So whether these new elixirs change the LB or not is not the issue because elixirs are already being spammed to attain those top spots.

Now, I will restate that I think the kills should remain disabled but I honestly don't think the game will end nor will the LB change that much if they are left as is.

Beautifully said Crim! Agree 100%!

Tapatalk'd from my PowerWashed Fascinate

[Ellyidol]

The kill count issue is a no-brainer in my book; it should be completely removed from the XP anywhere elixir. IMO, it completely contradicts the reason why STS removed kill boosting from disabling XP gain: to preserve the remaining integrity of the LBs and to add more value to it. The ease in kill farming now may even be worse than before, any level can do it and you have to pay to do it.

I'm hoping this change against the kill farming is made soon. Before all the boosting has been done and the LBs will be left untouchable again after they revert the way of gaining kills.

[Aikiebo]

Low level players can purchase the temporary ability to access high level dungeons. Note that you are likely to have a difficult time playing in dungeons that are above your level, better bring some friends!

This change was brought primarily to better facilitate friends playing together despite level differences.



It is very clear that this is mainly ment for friends/guildies when they are playing together.

After the novelty wears off, there will probably be a lot less low-level players just zoning into hosted high-level games. There will be a lot of booting tho, when and if this happens. I am afraid that there is no point in asking people not to be rude jerks about this when the do it. Because there are some people who only believe the rules should be followed when they personally benefit or they totally agree with something. As if the universe revolved around them.

Any level player who is going to be bothered by very lower-level players being in their groups are probably gonna need to stay out of pick-up groups. But, you can hardly find a pug in Fang, so this shouldn't be much a problem.

People who don't want to play with people who are on low-level toons will just have to host groups or stay with hosts they know will boot.

The devs made it clear that this was designed for friends to be able to play together. That would also include guildies.

I think that, especialy for someone with no mmo playing experience before PL, there is a lot of curiosity about what the high-level dungeons are like. This change will bring a lot of fun to everyone. Fun that is impossible without these elixrs.


Mixing high levels and low levels together can really increase the amount of training and knowledge players aquire as they level up. More experienced players can take their friends in and "show them the ropes" and give them more training and experience than before.



Because of these new elixrs as well as all the other elixrs, the player base can now be BETTER trained then ever.






Very useful: definently yes
Required: definently no

You took that quote out of context. If everyone just says "new update is great thanks," or "update is bad," how could anyone determine what the benefits or repercussions will be? When I gave employee evaluations I didn't say "Hey Mr. Smith you are doing great, keep it up! I explained their strengths and weaknesses to develop them as an employee, that is what TRUE feedback is, not mindless compliments or criticism.

I understood what you ment. I asknowledged that by just saying "Good job, sts" or "Boo.. Sts" is not as useful as fully fleshed out comments.

Read the part: "Very useful: definently yes"

What is meant by that is: "Yes, that is definently very useful".

I suppose, I could have worded it this way: "That would definently be very useful".

Any of the three ways works, I just think the first way is, well, kind of snappy, especially when paired with the next thing I said:

Required: definently no.

I know what you said and fully understood. But not "everyone" did that. In fact, only one person did that. And you wasted no time in crawling up the nether regions. Your posts last night seemed, well, I won't say angry, I'll just say, overly passionate. Which is great actually. I am always glad to see people strongly passionate about the game. That's way better than being luke warm and apathetic.

But simply saying "Woot!! Great job STS" is perfectly acceptable on this and every gaming forum known to mankind.

On this forum everyone from brand new members to long time members do that dozens if not hundreds of times a day.

As far as the rest of you post, I don't know if you realize, but the phrase, "no pain, no gain" has been discredited in almost every area of society that it used to be used in. But that is off topic for this board. So if you really want to hold on to it, let's see what happens.

Hmm... "no pain = no gain" and "anything worth having is worth working hard for" (I can't remember exactly how you worded it, but this is the idea).

Hmm... I think it is obvious to most people what point I am going to make even before I make it.

I have read several different places a dev describing PL as a "lighthearted, fantasy-based mmo".

Most people don't want to experience pain when they log onto PL. Most people want to escape the work of the real world by logging into a role-playing, fantasy based game. Most people are logging onto this (and basically any mmo) to escape pain and hard work. They want to relax, have fun, crack up, experience excitement (as opposed to monotiny and bordem), achieve accomplishments and so on.

If the only way to achieve in this was to experience pain, most people wouldn't log on more than just a few times. If the only way to accomplish something in a mmo was to turn what should be fun into endless hours of tedious repition, most people wouldn't be that interested.

You mentioned being a supervisor. I bet your office is a fun place to work. I'm curious, it wouldn't be a marketing/ad agency by any chance? Because if STS ever asked you to come up with a advertising slogan, I thought of one you can work up and pitch to them:

"POCKET LEGENDS!!! The Most Painful and Hardest Work You'll Every Have to Tackle!!! DOWNLOAD IT TODAY!!!!"

I bet so many would try to download -- that the servers would crash. Give me five!

Moving on..........

Hmm... "This isn't summer camp....."

Really? Why not? Summer camp lot more fun than work camp.

Hmm.... "We are not singing Kumbaya."

YES! Yes! Gawd yes, I can't stand Kumbaya!! The Hokey-Pokey*** FTW!!!

Ok, seriously folks... I know many players derive great amounts of satisfaction out of a long hours of grinding using conventional group mechanics. Fullly acknowlinging that there is repition and that it can take along time to achieve various accomplishments. But it is all these factors that are seen as great and in fact what gives them a sense of accomplishment. These factors are deemed as being great because it is the commitment to continue on and on till the goal is accomphlished. They consider this to be "hard work" and that is seen as a very good thing.

And I totally agree. All these things are wonderful for the folks who care about this stuff. For these folks spending 40 hours grinding out an elite level without elixrs is a far greater and more important accomplishment than doing the same level in 10 hours with a 4x combo. And having these beliefs, these values is great, wonderful, nothing wrong with it at all.

I read all the time how someone says, "I worked my butt off to do. ..... (w/e it is they talking about). My first thought is, why? Why purposly go out of your way to turn fun into work? Because, overcoming serious, difficult, long-azz challenges is in fact a very great accomplishment. No one should ever mock that or say otherwise.

BUT NOT EVERYONE FEELS THIS WAY for their own gaming experience. Everyone has their own ideas about how they want to play the game and what they want to get out it. Everyone is going to have a different set of values for what defines for them "an accomplishment".

***When I mentioned The Hokey-Pokey I wasn't trying to offend anyone. I know there is a huge fan-base for the epic "Ants Go Marching". But the only reason I didn't mention it up there is because I didn't want to make this post any longer than it already was.

[Duped]

So far those in favor of the new elixirs have stated several reasons after reading through this whole thread:

1. Ability to play other campaigns with lower level friends

This change didn't give you that option, it's been there all along, it allows you to gain XP while playing in easier campaigns now.

2. Finishing quests that were abandoned

Again, to me, finishing all quests was important, so I made sure I did them. I was level 50 when I finished snowballs on my first toon, and all this allows you to do, is gain xp now, while doing quests in easier levels.

3. Teaching lower levels to play by showing them the ropes

Lets be honest here, of all the reasons given, this is by far the most bogus. How many teaching sessions happen while the elixir time is being used up. Personally, I've never seen one, and for the life of me, I cant imagine why anyone else would either. Lets say you are right however, this would be a hypothetical scenario.

Me: Hi, I'm Conanursan, I'm a really good bear, and you are lucky enough to be in my "class" today at the mega maze in Fathoms! I got tired of grinding in Mt. Fang, so I wanted some easy xp and came here. First thing any good bear needs to know is crowd control for mobs and to always stay in front. Now, young bear, your beckon and stomp are the two key skills involved in that process. Now, let me demonstrate... oh wait. I just used up all of my 5 min elixir on the intro, let me get a new one :). (Gulp gulp gulp) Ahh, I feel great! Now, where was I? Oh yea, beckon and stomp. So, watch I'm gonna run right into this mob, and then make a bee line for the nearest wall, and .... beckon... and... oh man, I killed them all with my beckon. Shoot, lemme try again, because your stomp needs to be done in the right way or you'll scatter them instead of contain them. Lets do the next mob. (jog over to the next group and the cub bear follows along) Here we go again, I run in... beckon... and... oh man. They are all dead again! Well, you get the idea right?

Cub bear: What's a beckon? I though its spelled bacon.

People are going in there to level up, if they only wanted to go in there for fun, that's always been available.

4. Ability to get to 65 (or 66!) running in vyx's lair or elsewhere to then try for the premium pinks at the highest dungeon.

Ok, this is what it boils down to IMO.
Should a person have their kills count while in a lower level? No, and so far I've not found anyone, and certainly not any group of ppl who think it should

Should you be able to gain xp in lower levels? I don't think so for this reason. Should Barry Bonds or Alex Rodriguez be allowed to drop down to AA baseball, but have that season count in MLB?

Would Shaq or Lebron James have fun playing in your local High School basketball team? Sure they would. Hed get to block every shot and dunk every time. Should that actually COUNT for anything though? No, I certainly dont think so, even if they paid 1 plat every five minutes.

[Weak_Sauce]

Low level players can purchase the temporary ability to access high level dungeons. Note that you are likely to have a difficult time playing in dungeons that are above your level, better bring some friends!

This change was brought primarily to better facilitate friends playing together despite level differences.



It is very clear that this is mainly ment for friends/guildies when they are playing together.

After the novelty wears off, there will probably be a lot less low-level players just zoning into hosted high-level games. There will be a lot of booting tho, when and if this happens. I am afraid that there is no point in asking people not to be rude jerks about this when the do it. Because there are some people who only believe the rules should be followed when they personally benefit or they totally agree with something. As if the universe revolved around them.

Any level player who is going to be bothered by very lower-level players being in their groups are probably gonna need to stay out of pick-up groups. But, you can hardly find a pug in Fang, so this shouldn't be much a problem.

People who don't want to play with people who are on low-level toons will just have to host groups or stay with hosts they know will boot.

The devs made it clear that this was designed for friends to be able to play together. That would also include guildies.

I think that, especialy for someone with no mmo playing experience before PL, there is a lot of curiosity about what the high-level dungeons are like. This change will bring a lot of fun to everyone. Fun that is impossible without these elixrs.


Mixing high levels and low levels together can really increase the amount of training and knowledge players aquire as they level up. More experienced players can take their friends in and "show them the ropes" and give them more training and experience than before.



Because of these new elixrs as well as all the other elixrs, the player base can now be BETTER trained then ever.






Very useful: definently yes
Required: definently no

You took that quote out of context. If everyone just says "new update is great thanks," or "update is bad," how could anyone determine what the benefits or repercussions will be? When I gave employee evaluations I didn't say "Hey Mr. Smith you are doing great, keep it up! I explained their strengths and weaknesses to develop them as an employee, that is what TRUE feedback is, not mindless compliments or criticism.

I understood what you ment. I asknowledged that by just saying "Good job, sts" or "Boo.. Sts" is not as useful as fully fleshed out comments.

Read the part: "Very useful: definently yes"

What is meant by that is: "Yes, that is definently very useful".

I suppose, I could have worded it this way: "That would definently be very useful".

Any of the three ways works, I just think the first way is, well, kind of snappy, especially when paired with the next thing I said:

Required: definently no.

I know what you said and fully understood. But not "everyone" did that. In fact, only one person did that. And you wasted no time in crawling up the nether regions. Your posts last night seemed, well, I won't say angry, I'll just say, overly passionate. Which is great actually. I am always glad to see people strongly passionate about the game. That's way better than being luke warm and apathetic.

But simply saying "Woot!! Great job STS" is perfectly acceptable on this and every gaming forum known to mankind.

On this forum everyone from brand new members to long time members do that dozens if not hundreds of times a day.

As far as the rest of you post, I don't know if you realize, but the phrase, "no pain, no gain" has been discredited in almost every area of society that it used to be used in. But that is off topic for this board. So if you really want to hold on to it, let's see what happens.

Hmm... "no pain = no gain" and "anything worth having is worth working hard for" (I can't remember exactly how you worded it, but this is the idea).

Hmm... I think it is obvious to most people what point I am going to make even before I make it.

I have read several different places a dev describing PL as a "lighthearted, fantasy-based mmo".

Most people don't want to experience pain when they log onto PL. Most people want to escape the work of the real world by logging into a role-playing, fantasy based game. Most people are logging onto this (and basically any mmo) to escape pain and hard work. They want to relax, have fun, crack up, experience excitement (as opposed to monotiny and bordem), achieve accomplishments and so on.

If the only way to achieve in this was to experience pain, most people wouldn't log on more than just a few times. If the only way to accomplish something in a mmo was to turn what should be fun into endless hours of tedious repition, most people wouldn't be that interested.

You mentioned being a supervisor. I bet your office is a fun place to work. I'm curious, it wouldn't be a marketing/ad agency by any chance? Because if STS ever asked you to come up with a advertising slogan, I thought of one you can work up and pitch to them:

"POCKET LEGENDS!!! The Most Painful and Hardest Work You'll Every Have to Tackle!!! DOWNLOAD IT TODAY!!!!"

I bet so many would try to download -- that the servers would crash. Give me five!

Moving on..........

Hmm... "This isn't summer camp....."

Really? Why not? Summer camp lot more fun than work camp.

Hmm.... "We are not singing Kumbaya."

YES! Yes! Gawd yes, I can't stand Kumbaya!! The Hokey-Pokey*** FTW!!!

Ok, seriously folks... I know many players derive great amounts of satisfaction out of a long hours of grinding using conventional group mechanics. Fullly acknowlinging that there is repition and that it can take along time to achieve various accomplishments. But it is all these factors that are seen as great and in fact what gives them a sense of accomplishment. These factors are deemed as being great because it is the commitment to continue on and on till the goal is accomphlished. They consider this to be "hard work" and that is seen as a very good thing.

And I totally agree. All these things are wonderful for the folks who care about this stuff. For these folks spending 40 hours grinding out an elite level without elixrs is a far greater and more important accomplishment than doing the same level in 10 hours with a 4x combo. And having these beliefs, these values is great, wonderful, nothing wrong with it at all.

I read all the time how someone says, "I worked my butt off to do. ..... (w/e it is they talking about). My first thought is, why? Why purposly go out of your way to turn fun into work? Because, overcoming serious, difficult, long-azz challenges is in fact a very great accomplishment. No one should ever mock that or say otherwise.

BUT NOT EVERYONE FEELS THIS WAY for their own gaming experience. Everyone has their own ideas about how they want to play the game and what they want to get out it. Everyone is going to have a different set of values for what defines for them "an accomplishment".

***When I mentioned The Hokey-Pokey I wasn't trying to offend anyone. I know there is a huge fan-base for the epic "Ants Go Marching". But the only reason I didn't mention it up there is because I didn't want to make this post any longer than it already was.

As much as I would like to comment on your entire post I am currently attempting to stand in a moving vehicle and I fear I might take a header into the dash. I still fail to see why leveling up gradually when you're just starting out or are a casual player is such a hard thing to do. If you're just starting the best way to learn the game is to take the time (it doesn't take a ton of time) to level up naturally. Start in campaigns made for you and your skill set. There is still a lot of "work" to do no matter how you choose to level so if someone is playing casually and wants to level really quickly by doing runs in fh or balefort over and over I would no longer identify them as casual. Furthermore, there are plenty of games both for android and for the iPhone that can be finished in a day, this isn't one of them. I thought the draw of this game is that there's so much to do you can play everyday and learn or experience something new.

This whole level up where ever you want thing is, in my eyes, going to hurt the ammount of fun players have. Those who see that they can level up the easy way and thus never visit certain campaigns are going to miss the little things that makes each campaign fun.

The game itself is already easy. Think of your video games, does Super Mario allow you to spend money so that you can bypass every level? The point of many many games is to level up with the incentive to unlock and experience a new level, I don't think this is an elitist way of thinking, I think its common sense. Just because people don't want to actually play the game doesn't mean we need to appease them.

The elite players aren't turning fun into work, we enjoy playing like mad fools or else we wouldn't be doing it. Elite is starting to become meaningless as the return of skeller crunch (it is crunch right?) campaign. Not every player is meant to be at the top, if they were there would be no such thing as levels.

Lastly, please explain how "no pain, no gain" has become irrelevant. Yes the upcoming generations live with the belief that they are entitled to everything and anything thanks to parents who never learned that boundries are a good thing but in the real world you still have to work to get something in return.

I would go on but I'm car sick and I didn't proof read so excuse typos and poor grammar.


Ps. When we were waiting for sewers to be released or for nuris to come a lot of new players leveled and added to the many players sitting around thinking now what do we do. Why wouldn't lower level players want to take advantage of all of this content instead of rushing to the end and then crying about how there isn't enough to do.

Also, I made almost all of my friends while I was leveling up and the rest of my friends when I joined my guild. It's a shame that people are missing that experience these days as I found it essential to my enjoyment of the game. Yes, players at any level can be friends, but maybe the people who will appreciate you the most are your peers.

[Duped]

The idea of no pain no gain, or anything worth having is worth working for, is still true in EVERY area of my life. I don't know where you live, or what your circumstances are, but I can't see how it would seem outdated unless you still lived in your parents house, and they provided anything you ever wanted.

[Epic Unicorns!]

I have a story about these elixers...I was leveling my new twink in the hidden passage, when a very highly-regarded player joined, a lv 65. I said hi just to be nice...then we went a few times around the middle, while he was on his low-level xp gain elixer. I died because I had aggro on two trolls. He laughed and said, "Lol noob." Did he have the right to call me that? When he was a 65 mowing down all enemies in a lv 15 dungeons, while gaining kills and xp? I think these elixers are stretching the good and bad player line apart. Then low level players can't do anything to get a single kill. I can see people getting frustrated with high levels taking their kills and quitting.

[Weak_Sauce]

I have a story about these elixers...I was leveling my new twink in the hidden passage, when a very highly-regarded player joined, a lv 65. I said hi just to be nice...then we went a few times around the middle, while he was on his low-level xp gain elixer. I died because I had aggro on two trolls. He laughed and said, "Lol noob." Did he have the right to call me that? When he was a 65 mowing down all enemies in a lv 15 dungeons, while gaining kills and xp? I think these elixers are stretching the good and bad player line apart. Then low level players can't do anything to get a single kill. I can see people getting frustrated with high levels taking their kills and quitting.

There's an aspect I didn't even think of, yet another issue with new elixers.

And no Epic, no one has the right to call anyone a noob. The only people who call people by that name are the actual noobs.

[Aikiebo]

So far those in favor of the new elixirs have stated several reasons after reading through this whole thread:

1. Ability to play other campaigns with lower level friends. This change didn't give you that option, it's been there all along, it allows you to gain XP while playing in easier campaigns now.

2. Teaching lower levels to play by showing them the ropes. Lets be honest here, of all the reasons given, this is by far the most bogus. How many teaching sessions happen while the elixir time is being used up. Personally, I've never seen one, and for the life of me, I cant imagine why anyone else would either. Lets say you are right however, this would be a hypothetical scenario.

3. People are going in there to level up, if they only wanted to go in there for fun, that's always been available.

4. Ability to get to 65 (or 66!) running in vyx's lair or elsewhere to then try for the premium pinks at the highest dungeon.

5. Ok, this is what it boils down to IMO.
Should a person have their kills count while in a lower level? No, and so far I've not found anyone, and certainly not any group of ppl who think it should

6. Should you be able to gain xp in lower levels? I don't think so for this reason. Should Barry Bonds or Alex Rodriguez be allowed to drop down to AA baseball, but have that season count in MLB

Hey Duped! This is a great post. You stated SOME, only a few of the reasons the new elixrs are excellent.

1. Yes, you are right. Its always been possible for high-level players to enter low-level maps and play with their friends. The only thing these new elixrs are doing in this area is allowing xp gain.

But, see that is the best part of this. People can have fun playing this game and leveling up in any map they want to. With friends or solo. Why does anyone have a problem with someone else getting xp in lower level map.

Why is it a problem for some level 53 to xp in Wyldwood vs. the sewers?

If that 53 is enjoying himself more in Wyldwood than he would if he was forced, FORCED, to be in the sewers. Where is the harm in that?

More people are having more fun = more people logging on to and playing the game = that is a very, very good thing.

Before the new elixrs, if you were 53 and wanted to get to 56 you were forced to go through the sewers. That doesn'e even make any sense. Why can't someone play in the maps they like and avoid the maps they don't like.

If people are having more fun they will play more often and for more minutes than if they are not having fun.

Why is anyone actually saying, well,

"I don't really care if you are having fun, you should play the game the way I was forced to" or

"you should play the game the way that I approve of"?

Why does anyone want to control the way someone else is playing their game. Let people fine tune their gaming experience so that they can get the most fun and enjoyment out of it.

2. Omg, this hypothetical scenario you typed out was amazing. I didn't repeat it, cuz no reason to. But that is exactly the kind of training that should happen. That is EXACTLY the sort of thing when I talk about training gigs and power leveling. The way you typed that was amazing. I know you were trying to be funny. But it was spot on! If a cub as you put it, just wasn't able to get beckon and stomp, yeah take him in there and actually show him.

Obviously, have him read at least a couple of guides first, and any video available. But if he still was having hard time, actually go in and show him, YES!!

Don't you think that is better than this retarded flaming and trashing of people on the forum.

You imply that this would be a costly way to spend time. Well, yes, again, this kind of training would be done among friends and guildies or maybe the occasional random person you wanted to help. But, getting a bit of xp while doing this is wonderful. Looking back, I would have loved getting bit of xp while doing the, literally, hundreds of hours I have spent power leveling.

Once again, I am just floored at how brilliant elixrs are.

3. Yes, people will use these elixrs and go into lower levels to level up and not JUST farm or have fun. But as I stated above, so what? There is no harm in this at all. In fact, it helps the game.

4. Again, this is a great thing. If someone leveled to cap in various maps instead of being spoon-fed content by the devs and then went to other maps to farm pinks there, who cares? Who cares where someone else became level 66 and are now farming pinks in Fang?

5. Actually, I agree. Every post I have made in this thread I kept forgetting to add, that the whole kill count thing I wish they would nerfed out of the new elixrs. I agree with those that are saying the lb are tainted, probably so bad that nothing can be done about it, but why add insult to injury (vs. rubbing salt in the wound, hehe). I hope the devs do change this.

6. Yes, absolutely. But reasons mainly alreaady stated above. The mlb analoogy, not working cuz there is no competition tween players in this game except pvp and lb. We aren't competing with each other over issues of xp.

Like I've said before, I hope these new elixrs work out well for everyone.

[Aikiebo]

[QUOTE=Epic Unicorns!:500935]There's an aspect I didn't even think of, yet another issue with new elixers.

And no Epic, no one has the right to call anyone a noob. The only people who call people by that name are the actual noobs.

Lol, NO!

First off, when someone calls you a noob, really gotta just laugh it off and as weak sauce said, that just proves that they are the noob.

But, this is no more a problem than low-levels being in a high-level's game. If either player has a problem, just host (and maybe lock) your games.

Obviously, if you a low level and you cant get kills, just go out and re-enter but this time host the game so you can boot. Don't need to lock unless you have some reason to or want to.

[CrimsonTider]

Have we forgotten? This IS a game.

[Slush]

What I don't understand is how some players are concerned about newer players not learning how to play the game properly and skillfully, 4x elixirs crushed that idea many months ago...

[kallima]

First, we live in the real world, this is no utopia and in the real world people have to WORK for anything they want. Maybe you have a soul sucking jobb and that's why you equate work with the inability to have fun but anything worthwhile in my life has required a certain amount of dedication and dare I say it, WORK. But that doesn't mean I don't have fun in the process. Let's just take school as an example since everyone has some degree of education. Well, to many folks, studying isn't fun should we just hand out the answers to every test? Sports aren't fun because Johnnyboy didn't win? Well let's stop taking score and hand out trophies to all! This kind of attitude is what waters down EXCELLENCE. Trust me, I am not pro, my KD ratio is abysmal, but I still want to improve. People who WANT to learn, will, but spoon feeding those that don't, will only wreak more spam in town, more begging, and less skilled gameplay. They want a game that's mindless? Let them have Farmville or Tapfish.

As far as your other comments go about where I work, so off the mark. Suffice it to say, when I left, anyone worth taking, went with me, the slackers who wanted every task giftwrapped, got left behind.

And DUPED made a wonderful point. How many people are REALLY going to take the time to properly teach game mechanics when their lixir is counting down? I'm sorry but I've spent more than 5 minutes showing someone how to enable toggle skills and map skills. So everyone who is arguing some ideal hypothetical about how this will better train new players are being purposefully delusional. Even on the flip side, how many new players will TAKE the time to learn when their precious lixir is counting down? TICK-TOCK TICK-TOCK I'm on the clock...

@Crim - YES this is a game but so was Super Mario, FF, and Zelda - how seriously did you take those games? ;p

[Elf-Orc-Naga]

Just additional comments:

This is my summary based on what i've read here:

1) count kills - i think this should be fixed but sts noted that in the first post so they know it actually. This is still beta version if my thinking is right.
2) scaled exp - i agree, low dungeon should offer low exp since mobs are easy to kill, my idea is divide into categories - dungeons which offer .25 .5, .75, 1 exp pt.
3) why spend plat - i do not think it is expensive. Sts needs this creative idea to expand their business. As what theyve said, dont use it if u dont have plat... Using plat saves time especially for players who are busy.question is it unfair? I dont think so, first spending plat will cost and there are some demerits - count kill will be loow if u try to lvl up on higher dungeon or youll be booted etc.... I actually praise people who dont use 4x elixirs. And with lvl cap getting increase we need this elixir for busy people. For those can't afford, lvling up is still fun, actually getting around all those dungeons are fun. Now that they changed the lvl experience curve too. If i were sts dev ill price 2 plat for low level to go to higher lvl dungeon but somebody of theres a chance to be booted so maybe 1 is enough.

4) elixir version - yeah, per 30 min elixir version is a great idea so you can save plat, perhaps and since tapping your screen every 5 minutes is cumbersome.

5) chance for power lvling - so what's the problem... You can aways boot. I remeber when PL in old days that you can go to higher dungeons and lvl up i see a lvl 5 in keepers crush with his friend playing but i chise to leave the game coz ill not play with lv 5 on that dungeon. On the other hand, balefort castle, lost expedition, oasis are good dungeons to make you lvl up faster (as what i did before) where you can still be good on killing if you have good gears.

6) friends - its good to know more people. Well i understand selfishness too hahahhaa sorry not related.

This is for now. One unrelated comment, dev i hope there will be discount on the price plat like other games in apple. They have something buy diamond this week for 20% discount :)

Enjoy all!

[FluffNStuff]

I have a story about these elixers...I was leveling my new twink in the hidden passage, when a very highly-regarded player joined, a lv 65. I said hi just to be nice...then we went a few times around the middle, while he was on his low-level xp gain elixer. I died because I had aggro on two trolls. He laughed and said, "Lol noob." Did he have the right to call me that? When he was a 65 mowing down all enemies in a lv 15 dungeons, while gaining kills and xp? I think these elixers are stretching the good and bad player line apart. Then low level players can't do anything to get a single kill. I can see people getting frustrated with high levels taking their kills and quitting.

One thing I foolishly hope is high level players in low levels realize they are 'guests' This is something that always bugged me about high level players farming the swamps or looking to loot the fridge. It is so not acceptable to boot or even be rude to a player who is in the right area for their level.
As to "stealing your kills" I can appreciate why that is an issue to a twink, but 99.78% of players that understand xp splits LOVE trailing a high level player.

[Weak_Sauce]

[QUOTE=Weak_Sauce: 500953][QUOTE=Epic Unicorns!:500935]

But, this is no more a problem than low-levels being in a high-level's game. If either player has a problem, just host (and maybe lock) your games.

Obviously, if you a low level and you cant get kills, just go out and re-enter but this time host the game so you can boot. Don't need to lock unless you have some reason to or want to.

What if you don't have enough players so you need to leave the game open? What if the maker of the game goes MIA and no one can boot? What if you made a game but no one was joining so you chose to join someone else's? Sure if you host you can boot anyone you want but what if there isn't anyone to boot? I almost always host and I've had this issue many times so I choose to join others games. Again, I could always leave a game if I'm unhappy but what if I'm half-way through and I don't want to abandon the work I've put in thus far?

Finally, coming from the era when any level could join any game, I had to boot feverishly so that a friend or player at the correct level could join. Everytime a spot was open it was a constant rush of low leveled players coming in saying "Don't boot!"

[CrimsonTider]

@Kallima - I have never taken any game seriously. The only thing about PL that I take "seriously" is disrespect/rudeness. No sense in playing a game if it's not fun.

And to piggyback on Fluff's comment about kills: if kills matter so much to ANY level, then those that do not pot are at a buge disadvantage.

[Zeus]

STS, with all due respect, I haven't liked the way STS has been going for a while now. I've spent roughly 3,000 dollars on both SL and PL combined. (I didn't always buy 800/2k platinum packs. If you calculate my amount spent, I'm sure it will end up between 2-3000 dollars).

I remember when I could go a month or two with only the 20 dollar platinum pack. That's all I ever needed to buy. Buying the 800 platinum pack was ungodly. 800 was considered A LOT!

People would complain about the rename being too expensive. Now? It's just a tad bit more expensive than the Thrasher Punch.

Now these elixirs are out. If I'm not mistaken about the market strategy used, GoA, SG, and AoA are more than just being helpful to the community. They are used to help out other players that are new and just starting off to rake in money. Is it a bad thing? No. It keeps that well of money that people think will eventually run out unlimited and always replenished.

These elixirs are just taking it way too far. At first, even with hardcore power leveling, it would take quite a bit of time to reach the cap. In both SL and PL it took at least a week. Now? I can just choose between campaigns I want to level in and level with those. Guess what!? It actually SAVES me platinum if I do the math. Why? I gain more XP per hour in those campaigns, thus maximizing efficient use of my platinum. Platinum=money. Most people are very careful on how they spend their money. If they can save platinum, they will.

All this is fine and dandy, but what are the effects? What will it come to?

Do you remember Ao2 & Ao3? Tombs of Mynas or Keeper runs? Remember that level barrier that you guys put into place BECAUSE of how uneducated people were on how to play their classes and BECAUSE of the vast complaints you got from forumers? It won't happen yet, but mark my words, within a few months, we will be back to stage 1. Only as Conradin put it, instead of being called the apellation of "Mynas Gen", these players will be called the "Platinum Gen". Can you blame them? No. Any sane player would want to save platinum in any way they possibly can.

I've been turning a blind eye for pretty long, but people have other purchases they plan to make in real life. When holidays come, then what? People will not have the surplus money to buy platinum because they bought gifts for their families. But that's okay, as we are getting new players to stay through the ingenious system that STS as created. I have much respect to it, but I have spite as well.

Your original stance on making the main spine free was this, "So the game is free to play, thus cheaper". How much cheaper is it now? Really? It seems a lot more expensive to me. I don't mind paying to play a game, even if it is ridiculous amounts. But spitting on those very players by allowing other players to just undermine their hard work and power through the game and not learn to play their classes is just insulting and a slap to the face.

So, I think this, I dislike the new elixirs. I dislike elixirs in general the day they became purchasable only through platinum, the good ones anyway.

Then there is the advertisements, Heyzap. I realize you guys have made a contract with them. I didn't think I would be forced to download another application just so I can play the game that I love. That should go in TapJoy with a platinum reward, not be put here. It's obtrusive, insulting, and just not needed.

I apologize if I came off as very insulting, but I am very irate regarding the way STS has made some of it's revenue boosting decisions.

All of this is not pertaining to just the feedback requested, but they are issues I strongly feel that need to be addressed.

Thank you for your time and my wonderful experiences/stay in not only SL and PL but also being welcome in the wonderful community you guys have.

~Parth

EDIT: To those who ask, "Why do you care so much about a game, Parth?". It's because I have spent good money on this game and enjoy it. I don't regret spending that money yet and hope that I never will have that opportunity. That's why I made this post. That is why I am giving feedback as it is, not sugarcoated information.

[Silentarrow]

+1^^

[Zeus]

+1^^

Thank you! I spent quite a bit of time thinking that post out. It was actually one of my longer ones. Hehe :) I tried to make it organized so it wouldn't be a bore to read. I just hope people see what I'm trying to say in it.

[kallima]

@Kallima - I have never taken any game seriously. The only thing about PL that I take "seriously" is disrespect/rudeness. No sense in playing a game if it's not fun.



I was joking, but most people take even games seriously. I will admit I definitely do, if my controller battery dies while in a level that I have yet to beat, is it frustrating? Heck yeah. Did I pout when my mom would walk into my room and turn the power off my NES because it was time for dinner? Most definitely, this was when there were no save spots or I had almost just reached one. I think every gamer has had those moments, I know if I walk in front of the TV while my bf is playing MW or another FPS he gets irritated. If you have never had one of those moments, I tip my hat to you. But just because it's JUST a game doesn't mean feelings aren't involved. Football is JUST a game to me but look at the legions of fans and the passion/anger/joy it inspires in them.

@APOLLO - the thought put into your post comes across, very well stated. Cheers man!

[NECROREAPER]

Im glad to see that some of our conversation from earlier today made it into that post. I'll post in a bit about how i feel about this change, but right now I have a Christmas Concert to go to ;)

[Protank]

I like the new elixers and don't see any problem with it.

people complain about power leveling? power leveling in my book is when a high level character joins a low level map to plow through the enemies for some low level friends. not the opposite that everybody else talks about.

people complain about the kill count? when I first started this game I was still getting kills when I wasn't even getting xp for mobs I was capped out on. then they changed that. then u had the kill count farmers that soloed the ao maps with there aoe staffs or what ever they felt like. the kill count was way higher then so u would get sooo many kills for just one level. u could also turn of xp and still get kills. people cried and the dev's nurf it. then the change to the amount of xp needed to level. now nobody else will ever be able to hit leaders for kills even if they soloed every single level. is that fair? I seen lvl 65s today with less then 5000 kills. I've seen some with over 100k kills. who cares really what there kill count says. it's really there choice to play how they want to play.

I think people complain to much on this game and I also think the dev's are way to cool to all the people on this game. honistly they are the coolest dev's on the planet but this constant catering to the players of the game kinda ruins it for others that get use to how it is and just accept it. it's like letting a kid have pop and then taking it away. kinda sucks for the kid right?

personally I thought one of the coolest things about this game was that u could turn your xp off and u still get kill count. owell things change its just life. love this game and the dev's rock. I will always support my favorite pass time and I will always support the devs no after what they throw at us.

all in all pocket legends is still best mmo on hand held for almost two years now. thx sts, u guys truly are some hard working mamajama's :D

[Protank]

ok I just read through all 4 pages and I guess I should have done that before I posted my 1st post about this.

ZOMG! so many peoole are worried about the kill farmers and protecting the leaderboards.. doesn't anybody realize these leaderboard names are from turning off the xp bar and farming kills? this option has been nurfed a while ago. nobody can hit the leaders for most kills now because of that. why protect it?

anyway I'm going to go help my lvl 3 friend get some xp while my lvl 65 gets xp at the same time b4 these pots get the big nurf.

[Aikiebo]

Now these elixirs are out. If I'm not mistaken about the market strategy used, GoA, SG, and AoA are more than just being helpful to the community. They are used to help out other players that are new and just starting off to rake in money. Is it a bad thing? No. It keeps that well of money that people think will eventually run out unlimited and always replenished.

2. Now? I can just choose between campaigns I want to level in and level with those. Guess what!? It actually SAVES me platinum if I do the math. Why? I gain more XP per hour in those campaigns, thus maximizing efficient use of my platinum. Platinum=money. Most people are very careful on how they spend their money. If they can save platinum, they will.

3. It won't happen yet, but mark my words, within a few months, we will be back to stage 1.

4. Your original stance on making the main spine free was this, "So the game is free to play, thus cheaper". How much cheaper is it now? Really? It seems a lot more expensive to me. I don't mind paying to play a game, even if it is ridiculous amounts.

5. But spitting on those very players by allowing other players to just undermine their hard work and power through the game and not learn to play their classes is just insulting and a slap to the face.

6. Then there is the advertisements, Heyzap. I realize you guys have made a contract with them. I didn't think I would be forced to download another application just so I can play the game that I love.



Apollo, I understand that some people are upset at these new elixrs. But do you really think that STS is just using the GoA and AoA programs as a way to increase revenue? You said that you didn't think what they were doing was a bad thing, right, but then what do you mean? What do you see as a good alternative? Not helping new players or not increasing revenue? What are you trying to say - is I guess what I am asking.

The second paragragh above when you are saying that you saved money by leveling in alternate campaigns, did you test that? I'd be really interested in learning what you found out. Don't you agree that saving plat is a good idea?

In paragraph 3, what is stage 1?

In paragraph 4, you seem upset at the amount of money that you have spent on plat. Yeah, wow, $3000 is an awful lot. I love the game and I love elixrs but I wouldn't have done that. You say you're not upset, but you seem so. If buying that much plat didn't make you happy, why did you do it? I am sorry if you regret spending that much. No body should buy more plat than they can afford. I know your not complaining, but it is good advice for others. People got to remember that NO ONE IS FORCING them to buy the plat. They DON'T NEED IT to play the game, And they should NEVER buy more than they can afford. When I don't have plat, I still play.

5. This is the part I really don't understand. How do these elixrs "spit on players who buy plat to undermine your hard work and power. What power are you saying some players have? Are you saying that players who have been playing a long time have power over other players? And how does "other people not learning to play their class" slap anyone in the face? Why does player A care how player B is playing the game? People can play their game anyway they want to as long as no TOS violations. Don't you agree? Or do you really thinnk that people who buy plat or who have been around a long time should be able to dictate and control how others play their game?

Paragraph 6. I am very interested in understanding what you mean. I didn't download an app. Are you saying that is going to become mandatory?

I hope that everything works out for you and that you still enjoy the game.

[Zeus]

Apollo, I understand that some people are upset at these new elixrs. But do you really think that STS is just using the GoA and AoA programs as a way to increase revenue? You said that you didn't think what they were doing was a bad thing, right, but then what do you mean? What do you see as a good alternative? Not helping new players or not increasing revenue? What are you trying to say - is I guess what I am asking.
Do I think STS is just using the programs to generate revenue? No. I don't. Do I think it boosts revenue? Yes. Is it a bad thing? No. My point was, these programs keep the money well flowing, which IS a GOOD thing. The bad thing though is, it just leads to higher and higher prices, as the pool of wealth is practically infinite.

The second paragragh above when you are saying that you saved money by leveling in alternate campaigns, did you test that? I'd be really interested in learning what you found out. Don't you agree that saving plat is a good idea?
If you noticed, I did say that it would save platinum and that any normal players would do that. I'm not sure if you read what outcomes it creates. You might have not been here for the Mynas Generation, but it was terrible. We could not even kill bosses because there were so many inexperienced CAPPED players at bosses. Thus, a chicken with his head cut off would have been more useful in my party than a mynas generation.

In paragraph 3, what is stage 1?

Stage 1 having players that were powerleveled and not knowing their class and having to deal with it on a daily basis. It is a lot more on the small scale compared to how it was before.

In paragraph 4, you seem upset at the amount of money that you have spent on plat. Yeah, wow, $3000 is an awful lot. I love the game and I love elixrs but I wouldn't have done that. You say you're not upset, but you seem so. If buying that much plat didn't make you happy, why did you do it? I am sorry if you regret spending that much. No body should buy more plat than they can afford. I know your not complaining, but it is good advice for others. People got to remember that NO ONE IS FORCING them to buy the plat. They DON'T NEED IT to play the game, And they should NEVER buy more than they can afford. When I don't have plat, I still play.

Again, I do NOT regret buying platinum. I will continue to buying as much platinum my play style sees fit. It is NOT about the money for me. It never was. What about for other players though? That's my point. Not everybody can afford STS's prices, but they still want those exclusives. There was a time when 20 dollars worth of platinum could last you more than a few months if used wisely.

5. This is the part I really don't understand. How do these elixrs "spit on players who buy plat to undermine your hard work and power. What power are you saying some players have? Are you saying that players who have been playing a long time have power over other players? And how does "other people not learning to play their class" slap anyone in the face? Why does player A care how player B is playing the game? People can play their game anyway they want to as long as no TOS violations. Don't you agree? Or do you really thinnk that people who buy plat or who have been around a long time should be able to dictate and control how others play their game?

With all due respect, I would appreciate not to play with a nincompoop that is not familiar with his or her own class. Why? The majority of the time, I'm on elixirs. I don't want other players that do not know how to play in my party. I know, your counter argument since you always have one is that I could always boot the people I do not want in my party. That, my friend, takes time which also costs money (literally). I do not want to spend that time sorting through masses of inexperienced players that are capped. When I make a PUG today, I get on the majority, players that know what they were doing. During the Ao2/Ao3 era? There were mynas generations running amuck. You couldn't even organize a party without having reliable friends. Now, I'm a person that doesn't like to be close minded. Thus, I don't always like running with friends only. I like getting to know other players, as socialization is fun and interesting. Note: I'm not a jerk because I do not want inexperienced players in my party. 1 or so every other run is fine, but these enhancers will eventually create is a multitude of these type of players. I can't and I won't educate all of them. So yes, if they are indirectly affecting my game play and my teammates game play because of their inability to learn their class properly, thus costing our elixirs, I do want to have a say on why this elixir should be banned.

Paragraph 6. I am very interested in understanding what you mean. I didn't download an app. Are you saying that is going to become mandatory?
As it is right now, when you're multitasking, at least on iOS, the HeyZap status bar takes 1/4 of your screen whenever you come back to the application. What does this do? It temporarily blocks access on 1/4 of my screen. I consider that obstructive advertisement, as sometimes I need the screen immediately once I come back. In short, I do not want advertising in the game period. Doesn't STS make enough money as it is on platinum based customers?

I hope that everything works out for you and that you still enjoy the game.
I still do enjoy the game. I'm just more than annoyed by the audacity of these changes, especially because of the preventative measures put into place to stop this. The only thing from STS taking those preventative measures away is now those very same measures help them profit and put us back to stage 1.



Bolded my answers.

[Aikiebo]

What if you don't have enough players so you need to leave the game open? What if the maker of the game goes MIA and no one can boot? What if you made a game but no one was joining so you chose to join someone else's? Sure if you host you can boot anyone you want but what if there isn't anyone to boot? I almost always host and I've had this issue many times so I choose to join others games. Again, I could always leave a game if I'm unhappy but what if I'm half-way through and I don't want to abandon the work I've put in thus far?

Finally, coming from the era when any level could join any game, I had to boot feverishly so that a friend or player at the correct level could join. Everytime a spot was open it was a constant rush of low leveled players coming in saying "Don't boot!"

You do realize that most games last 3 - 6 minutes.

Do you realize that the post of mine you quoted was speaking to a very specific situation? A player who I thought might be a newer player was in a map with a higher level who was rude to him. The op was saying that he couldn't get any kills cuz of this high level player, so I was suggesting ways he could remedy that problem.

STS has given us a whole list of ways to limit / choose who we play with. Hosting, locking, world map, quest log, passwords, friends list, guild list. .. I mean, it's not that hard to make or find a group that you can live with for 3 minutes.

Anyone who was around during Mynas Gen should have an AMAZING and WONDERFUL friends list. Plus have made decent enough contacts/friends to be in a really great guild. I can't believe it is that hard for you to get a group.

[Slush]

STS will apologise and everyone will drop $80 dollars on plat like nothing happened. The reason why STS has changed is partly because of YOU!

[Yvonnel]

There's an aspect I didn't even think of, yet another issue with new elixers.

And no Epic, no one has the right to call anyone a noob. The only people who call people by that name are the actual noobs.

Uhh. I actually call a couple of people noob all the time. I happen to have a couple of friends on my friend list that have noob in their name, and I call them "Noob".

These elixirs open up a whole new world for endgame level players. STS is more than welcome to take away the kills, doesn't bother me at all. But I am extremely happy that I can now gain xp in another dungeon and don't have to spend hours grinding in the a couple of specific maps to gain xp. Come on, who really wants to spend 12 hours (that is what it took me to get to 66) in just one or two maps.

Another thing is cost, if someone does the math, it costs more to use a 4x elixir and elixir to run lower level maps than it takes to run Mt. Fang. I spent 48 plat for 7.5K xp in the Rusty Grate in Balefort Castle. I can do 10k an hour in Mt. Fang. Just saying.

I just don't understand why everyone is so tied up with the leaderboards. To me they do not show who is the better player, they just show who has more time to spend playing a game. Just sayin'

[Zeus]

Uhh. I actually call a couple of people noob all the time. I happen to have a couple of friends on my friend list that have noob in their name, and I call them "Noob".

These elixirs open up a whole new world for endgame level players. STS is more than welcome to take away the kills, doesn't bother me at all. But I am extremely happy that I can now gain xp in another dungeon and don't have to spend hours grinding in the a couple of specific maps to gain xp. Come on, who really wants to spend 12 hours (that is what it took me to get to 66) in just one or two maps.

Another thing is cost, if someone does the math, it costs more to use a 4x elixir and elixir to run lower level maps than it takes to run Mt. Fang. I spent 48 plat for 7.5K xp in the Rusty Grate in Balefort Castle. I can do 10k an hour in Mt. Fang. Just saying.

I just don't understand why everyone is so tied up with the leaderboards. To me they do not show who is the better player, they just show who has more time to spend playing a game. Just sayin'

This is true, Yyon, but the situation I'm looking at regarding Elixir+ 4x is reverse from yours. There are quite a few "difficult campaigns" that players have to go through in PL/SL.

In PL, it's Ancient Swamps, A02 (Due to lack of games), Nuri's (Once again, due to lack of games and OP mobs) and I'm sure I missed a few other campaigns.

In SL, it's Slouch-o.

What I'm saying is, if you do the math for THOSE campaigns, it actually proves to be cheaper to simply purchase an elixir and go onto the next level, not to mention faster.

[Yvonnel]

This is true, Yyon, but the situation I'm looking at regarding Elixir+ 4x is reverse from yours. There are quite a few "difficult campaigns" that players have to go through in PL/SL.

In PL, it's Ancient Swamps, A02 (Due to lack of games), Nuri's (Once again, due to lack of games and OP mobs) and I'm sure I missed a few other campaigns.

In SL, it's Slouch-o.

What I'm saying is, if you do the math for THOSE campaigns, it actually proves to be cheaper to simply purchase an elixir and go onto the next level, not to mention faster.

I see what you are saying. But, the thing is (I haven't done it yet - but plan to) I plan on taking my 35 into Plasma Pyramid. Not to gain xp, but to run that level again. I remember when I use to run it as a 35 and have so much fun. Heck that is why my main has 3000+ deaths.

[Aikiebo]

t

1.The bad thing though is, it just leads to higher and higher prices, as the pool of wealth is practically infinite.

2. The second paragragh above when you are saying that you saved money by leveling in alternate campaigns, did you test that? I'd be really interested in learning what you found out. Don't you agree that saving plat is a good idea?
If you noticed, I did say that it would save platinum and that any normal players would do that.

3. Not everybody can afford STS's prices, but they still want those exclusives.

4. That, my friend, takes time which also costs money (literally).

5. When I make a PUG today, I get on the majority, players that know what they were doing.

6. During the Ao2/Ao3 era? There were mynas generations running amuck. You couldn't even organize a party without having reliable friends.

7. Now, I'm a person that doesn't like to be close minded. Thus, I don't always like running with friends only. I like getting to know other players, as socialization is fun and interesting. Note: I'm not a jerk because I do not want inexperienced players in my party.

8. I do want to have a say on why this elixir should be banned.

9. Heyzap



Hey! I didn't realize you responded so quickly.

1. I agree that what STS is not doing anything bad with the GoA/AoA programs. I am glad that you don't seem to think so either. But, it seems to me (apolgize if I am wrong) that you are saying that all these new players are bringing in a lot of money. But later you say these players cant afford STS's prices. But, I think everyone can agree that if we are getting a ton of new players and the GoAs and AoAs are helping them, and they are spending lots of money to support the game, then this is all a very good thing.

2. I am trying to ask something here, not about Mynas Gen or anything. Before these new elixrs were implemented, if you were level 63, you HAD TO xp in Fang if you wanted xp, right. I thought you were saying that you ACTUALLY TESTED and found out that a (for example) level 63 could xp in a lower map, say, Balefort Castle, and get faster xp and thereby saving plat/money. Is that what you meant to say in your original post, or did I misunderstand? If so, did you or someone you know actually test this and get these results or are you thinking that this is PROBABLY gonna be true?

3. If people can't afford the prices of elixrs or other items, well they shouldn't buy them. No one NEEDS to buy plat. You can play the game with out. No one should spend more than they got. And if STS is offereing something they can't afford, I'm sorry but sometimes that is the way it is.

4. Booting people takes a few seconds.

5. I'm glad we agree on this, because this is very true. Many people are rude and try to say other things. But, I feel very strongly about this and yes, you are right.

6. Anyone who has been playing snce Minas Gen should have an amazing, I mean an amazing friends list, be in a fantastic guild and have total mastery of all the tools STS has given us to organize groups. You have reliable friends, Apollo. I think you are more worried than you need to be.

7. Running with friends and guildies is not closed minded. It is the responsible thing to do. People who have same playing styles and attitudes should group together. Obviously that will make things smoother. People have a responsiblity to mitigate the problems involved in getting a group together and not expect other people to bow to their every wish.

I understand totally what you mean when you say you enjoy getting to know other players. Soooo... Well, human beings are imperfect, you want to go out of you way to include people you don't know into each of your groups. Well expect some surprises and some imperfrections and just roll with the idea that you are going to HAVE TO BE FLEXIBLE. If you purposly decide to include people you don't know into all your groups, well, obviously there are going to be minor to major differences in style, skills, approaches etc. So what, that is EXACTLY, the way I play almost 100% of the time. And it works out beautifully.

Apollo: You are a person who with your friends, your guildies, your skills and if on elixrs are rarely gonna have such a bad team that you can't continue.

People are really over reacting imo.

If you purposely choose to have people you don't know in your groups, either cuz they pug or just left wide open, then you need to be flexible with handling different people. And that is true WITH OR WITHOUT these new elixrs.

These new elixrs don't change much of anything in that respect.

Are you saying that not some players but ALL players need to play the ENTIRE game from level 1 to what ever level YOU happen to be in the exact way that you approve of just in case some day they may zone into some pug you are in?

I just don't understand why some people want to control how other people play their game?

8. Everyone has a say, well not so much a say, but everyone is completely able to give their opinions and feedback to STS about these new elixrs. Are you saying, I'm sure you are not, cuz this would be awful and I know that you are not this way, but are you saying you should have more say because you buy loads of plat?

9. The heyzap or w/e thing doesn''t sound like something I need to worry about right now. But, yeah, if it is like what you are saying (i.e. not some sort of bug), then that is awful and I agree with what you are saying.

Like I said, I do hope that everything works out well for you.

[Sassinya]

I like the idea. I'm not a kill counter so it doesn't offend my play style at all. In fact now I can gain some experience while completing all my quests! My kids can join me in the higher levels purely to see thezones as they won't likely get there for a while. Thank you STS! Though in future you're certain to once again magority rule, we plan to play together as much as possible until then!

[Zeus]

Hey! I didn't realize you responded so quickly.

1. I agree that what STS is not doing anything bad with the GoA/AoA programs. I am glad that you don't seem to think so either. But, it seems to me (apolgize if I am wrong) that you are saying that all these new players are bringing in a lot of money. But later you say these players cant afford STS's prices. But, I think everyone can agree that if we are getting a ton of new players and the GoAs and AoAs are helping them, and they are spending lots of money to support the game, then this is all a very good thing.

Yes, this is a good thing. You aren't getting the point though. The thing about this though is that when money is still coming in, STS is not going to fix problems that are already present such as the ever rising platinum prices. Why? Because there is always another player to take the other paying player's place. That's where I have the problem. I've said it multiple times; I'll say it again for emphasis, I have NO problem with STS making money, in fact I'll willingly support them for it. The outcomes are what I have a problem with.

2. I am trying to ask something here, not about Mynas Gen or anything. Before these new elixrs were implemented, if you were level 63, you HAD TO xp in Fang if you wanted xp, right. I thought you were saying that you ACTUALLY TESTED and found out that a (for example) level 63 could xp in a lower map, say, Balefort Castle, and get faster xp and thereby saving plat/money. Is that what you meant to say in your original post, or did I misunderstand? If so, did you or someone you know actually test this and get these results or are you thinking that this is PROBABLY gonna be true?

Read my above post addressed to Yvonnel, it should adequately answer your question.

3. If people can't afford the prices of elixrs or other items, well they shouldn't buy them. No one NEEDS to buy plat. You can play the game with out. No one should spend more than they got. And if STS is offereing something they can't afford, I'm sorry but sometimes that is the way it is.
You have a valid point there, but for OCD people like me, you just have to have every item. There are many of those out there; I'm one of the lucky ones that can afford it, but many others can't justify the purchases. However, in sales, it's generally acknowledged that lower sales=more customers=more overall profit. That's what I'm getting at. Once again, I'll state. I can afford the platinum, that is not the issue. The issue is those who can't justify hundreds of dollars in platinum purchases monthly. Why should those players by excluded to exclusive items such as the holiday items? It ruins that player's experience, especially if they are item collectors.

4. Booting people takes a few seconds.
Booting people takes a few seconds. By that time, the rest of your teammates are ahead and it's going to take you a bit to catch up. I'm not one to boot with one letter. If I'm booting, I'm booting with a full reason. Then, why should I have to play catch up in my own game. Also, that's just if one person joins. If another joins? Oh lord, the cycle continues.

5. I'm glad we agree on this, because this is very true. Many people are rude and try to say other things. But, I feel very strongly about this and yes, you are right.

6. Anyone who has been playing snce Minas Gen should have an amazing, I mean an amazing friends list, be in a fantastic guild and have total mastery of all the tools STS has given us to organize groups. You have reliable friends, Apollo. I think you are more worried than you need to be.

While I do like having friend only runs, I do not want to be limited by it as I was in the Ao2/Ao3 era. In that era, it was extremely difficult to even host a PuG with a semi-decent party. I love PUGs because of the new, experienced people I would never otherwise get to meet. I do not want to give up that experience.

7. Running with friends and guildies is not closed minded. It is the responsible thing to do. People who have same playing styles and attitudes should group together. Obviously that will make things smoother. People have a responsiblity to mitigate the problems involved in getting a group together and not expect other people to bow to their every wish.

I understand totally what you mean when you say you enjoy getting to know other players. Soooo... Well, human beings are imperfect, you want to go out of you way to include people you don't know into each of your groups. Well expect some surprises and some imperfrections and just roll with the idea that you are going to HAVE TO BE FLEXIBLE. If you purposly decide to include people you don't know into all your groups, well, obviously there are going to be minor to major differences in style, skills, approaches etc. So what, that is EXACTLY, the way I play almost 100% of the time. And it works out beautifully.

Apollo: You are a person who with your friends, your guildies, your skills and if on elixrs are rarely gonna have such a bad team that you can't continue.

People are really over reacting imo.

If you purposely choose to have people you don't know in your groups, either cuz they pug or just left wide open, then you need to be flexible with handling different people. And that is true WITH OR WITHOUT these new elixrs.

These new elixrs don't change much of anything in that respect.
Wait at least a month, then you will see what I mean. The new players WILL abuse it as they did in previous times.

Are you saying that not some players but ALL players need to play the ENTIRE game from level 1 to what ever level YOU happen to be in the exact way that you approve of just in case some day they may zone into some pug you are in?

No, there are the outliers. I just don't appreciate when a person who is capped, but skipped campaigns, does not play nearly as well as a L35 who played through the campaigns and learned the strategies that would benefit him in later levels.

I just don't understand why some people want to control how other people play their game?
In a host, I believe the developers give us the power to run the hosted game the way we desire and select based on our own criteria, within reasonable measure. If history goes to show anything, I don't want another Ao2/Ao3 age coming on again (I'm beginning to sound redundant, I know). If many people in our team are slacking because they do not know how to play their characters efficiently, while I can educate some of them, the masses these will create will just be too burdening to even attempt to help. I might as well put in an auto chat, "Hey you, to learn how to efficiently play your class visit www.spacetimestudios.com. Read the guides there, then come back"

8. Everyone has a say, well not so much a say, but everyone is completely able to give their opinions and feedback to STS about these new elixrs. Are you saying, I'm sure you are not, cuz this would be awful and I know that you are not this way, but are you saying you should have more say because you buy loads of plat?
That's not at all what I'm trying to say. You and I both know it. I'm trying to say that PL requires teamwork in parties. It's a reason why it's called a party. You're only as strong as your weakest link; I'm assuming you heard of that quote. But what happens when you have many weak links? That's when I feel there is a problem. Honestly, if the Ao2/Ao3 had to show us anything, it WILL happen. Also, I'd appreciate if you didn't twist my wording like that. It's not what I meant, you and I both know it.

9. The heyzap or w/e thing doesn''t sound like something I need to worry about right now. But, yeah, if it is like what you are saying (i.e. not some sort of bug), then that is awful and I agree with what you are saying.

They say it's a bug, but in a game that many people pay for, I don't see the need for advertising, period.

Like I said, I do hope that everything works out well for you.

My answers are in bold,

[Slush]

Hey Apollo, I completely agree with you, but by spending thousands of dollars on plat, you aren't doing your opinion, and everyone who supports it, any justice. You're only spurring on STS to do such things like these new elixirs.

[Protank]

ok I just spend 2hours helping my buddy from lvl 1-24. we went from forest haven to fathom crypt. I bought thrashers and the low lvl gain xp elixers. I noticed I get 2 xp per kill with the thrashers doing this. we unlocked all his maps and ran mostly zyla & vyxnaar maps. I averaged about 10000xp per hour. about the same I was getting in fang xp runs. the main diferance was I didn't die. it was cool to help a friend & I took care of a few old qsts too :D
another thing I think is cool about these new elixers is I can continue my goal of doing all qst's on my lvl 10 on the higher lvl maps. I was very upset when the ability to do so was taken from me. now I can continue doing that if i want to spend some rl $.
hmmm

[Protank]

Hey Apollo, I completely agree with you, but by spending thousands of dollars on plat, you aren't doing your opinion, and everyone who supports it, any justice. You're only spurring on STS to do such things like these new elixirs.

I don't really agree with the he no justice thing slush. tho I do agree with a lot of what Apollo is saying. there is only a select few that I know of that has spent over $1k on this game (me included) and I don't think that we are the cause of spacetimes business decisions. and becides the new elixers are only 1plat so idk.
i could be wrong but I doubt it

[Decur]

ok I just read through all 4 pages and I guess I should have done that before I posted my 1st post about this.

ZOMG! so many peoole are worried about the kill farmers and protecting the leaderboards.. doesn't anybody realize these leaderboard names are from turning off the xp bar and farming kills? this option has been nurfed a while ago. nobody can hit the leaders for most kills now because of that. why protect it?

anyway I'm going to go help my lvl 3 friend get some xp while my lvl 65 gets xp at the same time b4 these pots get the big nurf.

I never turned of xp to kill farm in low levels. I always played maps appropriate to my level. I made it there. Others can too, simply because you can't don't speak for all.

[Whirlzap]

So I read 5 pages and apparently the posts are insanely long.
This isn't an essay, dam it.
Everyone posting here, CARES FOR YOUR GAME, STS.
And yet we have heard NOTHING from the Developers.
Nothing. At. All.
I can put my finger on this greed idea.

[FluffNStuff]

So I read 5 pages and apparently the posts are insanely long.
This isn't an essay, dam it.
Everyone posting here, CARES FOR YOUR GAME, STS.
And yet we have heard NOTHING from the Developers.
Nothing. At. All.
I can put my finger on this greed idea.

Sam did edit his post stating they are looking into a way of removing kill count from the low level XP elix, which seems to be one of the more heated issues.

[Aikiebo]

1. Yes, this is a good thing. You aren't getting the point though. The thing about this though is that when money is still coming in, STS is not going to fix problems that are already present such as the ever rising platinum prices. Why? Because there is always another player to take the other paying player's place. That's where I have the problem. I've said it multiple times; I'll say it again for emphasis, I have NO problem with STS making money, in fact I'll willingly support them for it. The outcomes are what I have a problem with.

2. Once again, I'll state. I can afford the platinum, that is not the issue. The issue is those who can't justify hundreds of dollars in platinum purchases monthly.


3. While I do like having friend only runs, I do not want to be limited by it as I was in the Ao2/Ao3 era. In that era, it was extremely difficult to even host a PuG with a semi-decent party. I love PUGs because of the new, experienced people I would never otherwise get to meet. I do not want to give up that experience.



4. These new elixrs don't change much of anything in that respect.

Wait at least a month, then you will see what I mean. The new players WILL abuse it as they did in previous times.

5. Are you saying that not some players but ALL players need to play the ENTIRE game from level 1 to what ever level YOU happen to be in the exact way that you approve of just in case some day they may zone into some pug you are

I just don't appreciate when a person who is capped, but skipped campaigns, does not play nearly as well as a L35 who played through the campaigns and learned the strategies that would benefit him in later levels.

6. I just don't understand why some people want to control how other people play their game?

In a host, I believe the developers give us the power to run the hosted game the way we desire and select based on our own criteria, within reasonable measure. If history goes to show anything, I don't want another Ao2/Ao3 age coming on again (I'm beginning to sound redundant, I know). If many people in our team are slacking because they do not know how to play their characters efficiently, while I can educate some of them, the masses these will create will just be too burdening to even attempt to help. I might as well put in an auto chat, "Hey you, to learn how to efficiently play your class visit www.spacetimestudios.com. Read the guides there, then come back"

7. Everyone has a say, well not so much a say, but everyone is completely able to give their opinions and feedback to STS about these new elixrs. Are you saying, I'm sure you are not, cuz this would be awful and I know that you are not this way, but are you saying you should have more say because you buy loads of plat?
That's not at all what I'm trying to say. You and I both know it. I'm trying to say that PL requires teamwork in parties. It's a reason why it's called a party. You're only as strong as your weakest link; I'm assuming you heard of that quote. But what happens when you have many weak links? That's when I feel there is a problem. Honestly, if the Ao2/Ao3 had to show us anything, it WILL happen. Also, I'd appreciate if you didn't twist my wording like that. It's not what I meant, you and I both know it.


Apollo

I can see that you are upset. I honestly believe that people are more worried, some way more worried then they need to be. But, I realize it must be awful to be so upset, I mean, your so worried about what might happen that it seems to be causing like lots of extra stress.

I really think that it might not be perferct at first, but after the first 2 or 3 weeks things will settle down to where everything is more smoothly run. It may not be perfect. In fact it won't be. It will be different for sure. But the most important thing, is it will be BETTER.

I tried real hard not to twist your words. I hate it when people do that. They do that to intimidate and to try to unfairly (i.e. It's basically a lie when someone does that) sway public opinion in their direction. When people do that to me or others I will point it out. If I do that to you or others I hope people point that out because I wouldn't mean to do that on purpose.

But, if you read what I wrote (paragraph 7 in the above quote), I clearly said, SEVERAL TIMES, that I don't think that this is really what you are saying. It's right above - you can read it.

But, in your first post you said - and this is an exact quote - talking about the new elixrs - (you were just talking about how the main spine is now free and you don't mind spending plat) "But spitting on those very players by allowing other players to just undermine their hard work and power"

That's what I don't understand. I know that you aren't saying that people with real life money or people who have been playing the game longer than others should have a stronger say with STS. I mean, there may actually be people who think that, lol. But, I doubt you are one of them (as I stated several times, lol). But you are making statements that are confusing. I think maybe it is just cuz you typing out fast because you have such strong feelings on this subject.

How does these new elixrs undermine your "power" and what "power" are you even talking about.

In paragraph 1 above: Yes, I totally see how you believe that it is ok for STS to make profit. Obviously, I think we all feel that way. Some may think they making too much or w/e. But, I see how you are more reasonable and understand that they have to have profit or no game for us. When you say, "there is always another player to take another player's place", do you mean that if some people leave the game that there will be other players to take their place?

Well, that's a good thing. I don't see the problem. If your saying that STS can keep prices high and /or sell these new (or any elixrs) to the new players. Well, hmmm.... Isn't that GREAT!

The more profit they make the better our gaming experience will be. We need way, way more people playing the game. I realy wish we had more content and a greater varity of content. But to have either they are gonna have to have more money to pay their bills.

2. I know you can afford the plat. If you read what I wrote, I said, that I knew that, but OTHER PEOPLE should be reminded that they shouldn't buy more than they can afford. That is what I wrote the first time, the second time and now again.

3. Mynas Gen was nerfed - i.e. It ended - ALMOST A YEAR AGO.

Everything is better now. We have more people playing the game. We have guilds now. Guilds didn't exist back then. Any one who has been playing long enough to remember Mynas Gen has a friends list a mile long. We have grouping tools that you didn't have back then.

Many players feel that they have superior skills to most other players. I'm not saying that you are one of these. But there are quite a few who feel very superior. They have built guilds so that they can play with other folks who feel the same way. I think this is great. People with similar attitudes, playing styles, beliefs, etc. SHOULD PLAY TOGETHER. That is a good thing.

Things are way different and way better now than almost a whole year ago. People have better skills to manage groups.

I just don't believe that you or most anyone is not going to be able to get a four minute group. Only peple new to the game will experience this very often. And the GoAs and AoAs and all other more experienced players can and should help them. And btw, people who are really new to the game have a hard time forming groups before the new elixrs.
(Edit: When there are not enough players online at any given time, it can be hard to find groups, I am saying cuz of these new elxrs people aren't gonna have hard time find groups. In fact, new elxirs are designed to get more people playing which will make grouping easier.)


4. First off, if people do start abusing this, then STS will stop the abuse. I really don't know what people are worried about. I hope you're not hating on new players here. Because that wouldn't be very good at all. If anyone abuses these new elixrs, STS will end that abuse.

During Mynas Gen, low levels could just zone into higher level games anytime they wanted to, right? With these new elixrs, players have to play real life money to use them, that right there shows there wont be abused at least much BECAUSE IT WILL BE TOO EXPENSIVE. Maybe at first, but then the novelty will wear off and then things will settle into being normal.

But if there is abuse going on, STS will stop that. Abuses and exploits should never be tolerated.

5. I don't appreciate it when we are being spoon fed content like we are a bunch of idiots. There is no reason why people shouldn't be able to play in any map that they like.

Most mmo's on console/pc have huge free roaming areas. You can zone in all over the place. All kinds of variety. NO BOREDOM. The devs of that game say, hmm... I actually like my players.. I think I want to give the freedom and flexibility so they can enjoy the game more. So they can play the game the way they want to.

It was always reallly hard for STS to give us this freedom. Cause the mobile phone technology wont support such open zones, and so many of them.

That is one of the reasons that elixrs ARE BRILLIANT. Now we have WAY MORE freedom and flexibility to enjoy and play the game the way we want.

There are very few strategies that only apply to that map. EXCEPT FOR BOSS fights. And they vary from map to map anyways.

This whole thing about how these elixrs insult non elixrs users is ridic. No one can even show how that is true. Because it is not true. But, telling players that there is only one map they are allowed to play, because they are too stupid to learn how to play the game if developers don't spoon feed em and hold their hands all the way to the top, IS INSULTING.

6. Yes, I agree, when your a host you can control certain factors in a reasonable way. Of course that is true. And yes, the four minute group is not the place to "educate" people. You are not one of these people who are just consumed with conceit that they look down on just about everyone. Their little minds are on auto pilot twisting what is really happening into all this negative energy. I have never noticed that about you. But, this idea that you think that there are going to be so manay people "below you" that they should actually stop playing the game until they go get educated. This is really bizarre.

I know, REPEAT I KNOW, that the last part of that where you were saying that you may as well just put that into one of you auto-chats, you were being sarcasstic. You weren't really saying you were planning on doing that. But, in that paragraph, you were basically saying that some people shouldn't play the game until the get "educated" to your satisfaction. At least that is how it seems to me. Please tell me if I am wrong. If I am wrong, I AM NOT TWISTING YOUR WORDS. I simply misunderstood, I am shocked if I am right, that is why I am asking now, for clarification.

I hope people realize that I am as passioinate and headstrong and bla bla bla as anyone else on this issue. But, if we gonna discuss, it always a good idea to try to stay calm.

If I ever twist ANYONES words, please let me know. I never want to do that. If and when people twist mine, I will let them know also. When people do that, they are proving that they don't have no logic to support their position and they are proving to everyrone that they don't mind resorting to telling lies to try to boost their ego. So, if I ever do this, I ABSOLUTELY GARANTEE that I did it by accident because I misunderstood. But there are some who do it on purpose. But, on the part where you said I twisted your words, I DID NOT. In fact when you read that part, you will see that I said that I didn't believe that you were the one saying what others are saying.

People are upset about this stuff, shouldn't be. Cuz no matter what happens, things will work out to be ok. THEY ALWAYS DO. That's the good thing.

[RedRyder]

My lord, I am definitely not reading these essay responses... Just take it easy guys lol it's pixels.
They'll fix it as usual, the same way I stated in my first post, so just wait it out. You might as well do as everyone else is and benefit while you can. It's your money, use it as you please.

http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m279/MADNIGGA2K5/d9c586ae.jpg

[Zeus]

My lord, I am definitely not reading these essay responses... Just take it easy guys lol it's pixels.
They'll fix it as usual, the same way I stated in my first post, so just wait it out. You might as well do as everyone else is and benefit while you can. It's your money, use it as you please.

http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m279/MADNIGGA2K5/d9c586ae.jpg

For a second, I read, "we read every thread, but we don't respond on some incase we get annihilated." LMAO!

[RedRyder]

Lmfao

[Zeus]

Apollo

I can see that you are upset. I honestly believe that people are more worried, some way more worried then they need to be. But, I realize it must be awful to be so upset, I mean, your so worried about what might happen that it seems to be causing like lots of extra stress.

I really think that it might not be perferct at first, but after the first 2 or 3 weeks things will settle down to where everything is more smoothly run. It may not be perfect. In fact it won't be. It will be different for sure. But the most important thing, is it will be BETTER.

I tried real hard not to twist your words. I hate it when people do that. They do that to intimidate and to try to unfairly (i.e. It's basically a lie when someone does that) sway public opinion in their direction. When people do that to me or others I will point it out. If I do that to you or others I hope people point that out because I wouldn't mean to do that on purpose.

But, if you read what I wrote (paragraph 7 in the above quote), I clearly said, SEVERAL TIMES, that I don't think that this is really what you are saying. It's right above - you can read it.

But, in your first post you said - and this is an exact quote - talking about the new elixrs - (you were just talking about how the main spine is now free and you don't mind spending plat) "But spitting on those very players by allowing other players to just undermine their hard work and power"

That's what I don't understand. I know that you aren't saying that people with real life money or people who have been playing the game longer than others should have a stronger say with STS. I mean, there may actually be people who think that, lol. But, I doubt you are one of them (as I stated several times, lol). But you are making statements that are confusing. I think maybe it is just cuz you typing out fast because you have such strong feelings on this subject.

How does these new elixrs undermine your "power" and what "power" are you even talking about.

In paragraph 1 above: Yes, I totally see how you believe that it is ok for STS to make profit. Obviously, I think we all feel that way. Some may think they making too much or w/e. But, I see how you are more reasonable and understand that they have to have profit or no game for us. When you say, "there is always another player to take another player's place", do you mean that if some people leave the game that there will be other players to take their place?

Well, that's a good thing. I don't see the problem. If your saying that STS can keep prices high and /or sell these new (or any elixrs) to the new players. Well, hmmm.... Isn't that GREAT!

The more profit they make the better our gaming experience will be. We need way, way more people playing the game. I realy wish we had more content and a greater varity of content. But to have either they are gonna have to have more money to pay their bills.

2. I know you can afford the plat. If you read what I wrote, I said, that I knew that, but OTHER PEOPLE should be reminded that they shouldn't buy more than they can afford. That is what I wrote the first time, the second time and now again.

3. Mynas Gen was nerfed - i.e. It ended - ALMOST A YEAR AGO.

Everything is better now. We have more people playing the game. We have guilds now. Guilds didn't exist back then. Any one who has been playing long enough to remember Mynas Gen has a friends list a mile long. We have grouping tools that you didn't have back then.

Many players feel that they have superior skills to most other players. I'm not saying that you are one of these. But there are quite a few who feel very superior. They have built guilds so that they can play with other folks who feel the same way. I think this is great. People with similar attitudes, playing styles, beliefs, etc. SHOULD PLAY TOGETHER. That is a good thing.

Things are way different and way better now than almost a whole year ago. People have better skills to manage groups.

I just don't believe that you or most anyone is not going to be able to get a four minute group. Only peple new to the game will experience this very often. And the GoAs and AoAs and all other more experienced players can and should help them. And btw, people who are really new to the game have a hard time forming groups before the new elixrs.
(Edit: When there are not enough players online at any given time, it can be hard to find groups, I am saying cuz of these new elxrs people aren't gonna have hard time find groups. In fact, new elxirs are designed to get more people playing which will make grouping easier.)


4. First off, if people do start abusing this, then STS will stop the abuse. I really don't know what people are worried about. I hope you're not hating on new players here. Because that wouldn't be very good at all. If anyone abuses these new elixrs, STS will end that abuse.

During Mynas Gen, low levels could just zone into higher level games anytime they wanted to, right? With these new elixrs, players have to play real life money to use them, that right there shows there wont be abused at least much BECAUSE IT WILL BE TOO EXPENSIVE. Maybe at first, but then the novelty will wear off and then things will settle into being normal.

But if there is abuse going on, STS will stop that. Abuses and exploits should never be tolerated.

5. I don't appreciate it when we are being spoon fed content like we are a bunch of idiots. There is no reason why people shouldn't be able to play in any map that they like.

Most mmo's on console/pc have huge free roaming areas. You can zone in all over the place. All kinds of variety. NO BOREDOM. The devs of that game say, hmm... I actually like my players.. I think I want to give the freedom and flexibility so they can enjoy the game more. So they can play the game the way they want to.

It was always reallly hard for STS to give us this freedom. Cause the mobile phone technology wont support such open zones, and so many of them.

That is one of the reasons that elixrs ARE BRILLIANT. Now we have WAY MORE freedom and flexibility to enjoy and play the game the way we want.

There are very few strategies that only apply to that map. EXCEPT FOR BOSS fights. And they vary from map to map anyways.

This whole thing about how these elixrs insult non elixrs users is ridic. No one can even show how that is true. Because it is not true. But, telling players that there is only one map they are allowed to play, because they are too stupid to learn how to play the game if developers don't spoon feed em and hold their hands all the way to the top, IS INSULTING.

6. Yes, I agree, when your a host you can control certain factors in a reasonable way. Of course that is true. And yes, the four minute group is not the place to "educate" people. You are not one of these people who are just consumed with conceit that they look down on just about everyone. Their little minds are on auto pilot twisting what is really happening into all this negative energy. I have never noticed that about you. But, this idea that you think that there are going to be so manay people "below you" that they should actually stop playing the game until they go get educated. This is really bizarre.

I know, REPEAT I KNOW, that the last part of that where you were saying that you may as well just put that into one of you auto-chats, you were being sarcasstic. You weren't really saying you were planning on doing that. But, in that paragraph, you were basically saying that some people shouldn't play the game until the get "educated" to your satisfaction. At least that is how it seems to me. Please tell me if I am wrong. If I am wrong, I AM NOT TWISTING YOUR WORDS. I simply misunderstood, I am shocked if I am right, that is why I am asking now, for clarification.

I hope people realize that I am as passioinate and headstrong and bla bla bla as anyone else on this issue. But, if we gonna discuss, it always a good idea to try to stay calm.

If I ever twist ANYONES words, please let me know. I never want to do that. If and when people twist mine, I will let them know also. When people do that, they are proving that they don't have no logic to support their position and they are proving to everyrone that they don't mind resorting to telling lies to try to boost their ego. So, if I ever do this, I ABSOLUTELY GARANTEE that I did it by accident because I misunderstood. But there are some who do it on purpose. But, on the part where you said I twisted your words, I DID NOT. In fact when you read that part, you will see that I said that I didn't believe that you were the one saying what others are saying.

People are upset about this stuff, shouldn't be. Cuz no matter what happens, things will work out to be ok. THEY ALWAYS DO. That's the good thing.

I edited this part in my other quote, but I feel need to say it this time. This is a Feedback thread, therefore I am giving MY FEEDBACK. I don't think it's up to you to debate wether my feedback is to your liking or not. I know you like a good debate, but this is not the place for it. You can do that through PM. Therefore, I didn't read this new post and I am not going to as all we are doing is derailing this thread.

Cheers,

~Parth

[Protank]

I never turned of xp to kill farm in low levels. I always played maps appropriate to my level. I made it there. Others can too, simply because you can't don't speak for all.

I can't?
u just said it was possable to do it..
sorry for speaking for u.
guess I havnt looked at the leaders in a while
I appologize

[noobmigo]

Plat Gen starts NOW.

This is the ABSOLUTE SAME THING as the Mynas Gen situation, except STS makes money from it.

[Aikiebo]

I agree with some of what RedRyder is saying. Many people are totally over reacting. These new elixrs, like all the other elixrs, will make the game very much better.

Things are going to change. Except for an actual abuse, people will get used to the changes. And over all the game will be way better.

Mynas Gen was nerfed almost a year ago. The game survived. Players continued to play. The game has made a zillion other great changes. More people than ever are playing. The game is better because it is more fun.

I don't agree with RedRyder and Aollo IF what they are trying to say is that peple sholdn't discuss this. If they don't want people to disagree with their opinon, then instead of responding to them (I won't be rude and ignore their posts), I just won't respond directly to them, i.e. I won't quote them.

But, it is ok to discuss your opinons on this thread. All feedback threads have discussions: some of the best feedback grow out of discussion. But if they don't want me (or maybe anyone) disagreeing with them, like I said, I will just not respond to them directly, then they should be happy.

One of the reasons why the forum police are so annoying is because they usually only police comments that they disagree with. If my thoughts, (I was trying to stay calm and as supportive as possible), bother them then I will just respond outside of directly quoting them.

But, yes, RedRyder is correct when he says people are totally over reacting. These changes are designed to bring massive quanties of new people into the game. At least, that is what it seems to me to be. That is exactly what we need.

Some people are saying that people who spend a lot of plat should have a stronger voice with STS. Some people are saying that people who have been playing a long time should have a stronger voice with STS.

Naturally, neither of those things are true.

This game has kinda been focused on using the lure of elitism to draw people in. If you play long enough and hard enough you will be better than others and you will have much better gear than others. Because the best stuff is hard to get, it is legedary. And only a few will have it.

And this is fine, this is excellent as long as the few want to pay all of the bills. And when STS was young that was possible.

It is no longer possible. STS needs to start considering the needs of the huge majority of players instead of the small minority of players.

That is one of the things these new elixrs are desinged to do.

People are way too worried about power leveling. First off these elxirs aren't exactly strong forms of power leveling. As I have said before many times, power leveling when done correctly is fantastic and makes the game stronger because the players are better trained and better players.

These new elixrs are the dev's way of giving us players a compliment. They are saying, "we don't think you're idiots. We don't have to spoon feed you content. Feel free to explore the game and fine-tune your experience so that you are enjoying the game and happy."

All this belly aching and wa wa wa, actually coming to the forums and shedding tears, about how hard it is going to be to find a group is very undeeded.

The devs have already told us that one: that in order for a lower-level player to zone into a higher-level map, it will have to be through a friends list or the guild roster.

They have also alread told us that the amount of xp that higher levels will earn while in lower level maps will be fractional.

Relax, enjoy, stop trying to control how others play their game. Just relax and enjoy and have fun. It is just a game.

[Zeus]

^
I'm not trying to police your comments. I wanted to say this from my original post, but why are you debating my feedback? It was feedback, not a debate thread. I love debates myself, but this is not the place for it. (I'm not interested in having a debate on this thread, but will gladly do it through PM.) If you have feedback of your own, post it. But otherwise, why are you trying to convince others on how they should look at it? If the developers see each person's view, they will find a happy medium for it. That's all. I didn't PM you this because you stated earlier that you don't receive PM's?

[Aikiebo]

^
I'm not trying to police your comments. I wanted to say this from my original post, but why are you debating my feedback? It was feedback, not a debate thread. I love debates myself, but this is not the place for it. If you have feedback of your own, post it. But otherwise, why are you trying to convince others on how they should look at it? If the developers see each person's view, they will find a happy medium for it. That's all. I didn't PM you this because you stated earlier that you don't receive PM's?

Apollo, lol, I"m not for sure what to do here. If you guys, don't want me to like discuss what you say, say i agree with this,, or i disagree with that or w/e, then I won't. I'm ok with that. It's up to you. AND I'M ONLY RESPONDING TO YOU NOW CUZ YOU ASKED ME A DIRECT QUESTION. I'm really ok, not discussing someone's opinion if they don't want to be open to a challenge. Lol, idc. Some people just want to state their opinon. They don't care what others think and they don't really want others disagreeing with them directly. I.e. They don't have time for a debate, they are just sayin w/e they sayin. I'm ok with that. Totally understand.

I don't really understand, are you saying 1. no feedback should be debated or 2. people shouldn't debate your feed back? Maybe you haven't been reading THIS ENTIRE THREAD. It is full of people debating all sorts of issues relating to this topic. That is what people have been doing on this feed back topic and almost all feed back topics.

You have directly asked my why I was debating your feedback: answer

1. There have been debates on this thread from the beginning.

2. Most feedback threads have debates.

3. I always thought you were a real nice guy and open minded and didn't mind debating you opinins.

If you don't want me to I won't. Or, if you think that it should be in another thread. That is great. I'm waaayyy into that. But, we will have to ask the dev's if that is ok, because they want us to discuss things on this thread.

But, why discuss it in pm? Because people are disagreeing with you? I have said MANY times that I get pm's. I get em all the time on this device. I can only send pm when i log onto a pc. Which is not that often. But, I'm getting a pc for xmas. So, I'll be able to post a lot more than.

But, no reason to hide this debate from other people.

I'm not sure I'm trying to convince others of anything any more than you are. For that matter not any more than anyone else is.... hence the "debate part".

The forum rules say that the purpose of the forum is to foster open discussion and debate. It's in the first paragraph. But, like I said, I won't respond to your posts if you don't want. I'm way ok with that. It's really up to you.

Yes, I agree, all this ultimately up to the devs. They know what is best for the game.

I wish you lots of luck and fun.

[Zeus]

Apollo, lol, I"m not for sure what to do here. If you guys, don't want me to like discuss what you say, say i agree with this,, or i disagree with that or w/e, then I won't. I'm ok with that. It's up to you. AND I'M ONLY RESPONDING TO YOU NOW CUZ YOU ASKED ME A DIRECT QUESTION. I'm really ok, not discussing someone's opinion if they don't want to be open to a challenge. Lol, idc. Some people just want to state their opinon. They don't care what others think and they don't really want others disagreeing with them directly. I.e. They don't have time for a debate, they are just sayin w/e they sayin. I'm ok with that. Totally understand.

I don't really understand, are you saying 1. no feedback should be debated or 2. people shouldn't debate your feed back? Maybe you haven't been reading THIS ENTIRE THREAD. It is full of people debating all sorts of issues relating to this topic. That is what people have been doing on this feed back topic and almost all feed back topics.

You have directly asked my why I was debating your feedback: answer

1. There have been debates on this thread from the beginning.

2. Most feedback threads have debates.

3. I always thought you were a real nice guy and open minded and didn't mind debating you opinins.

If you don't want me to I won't. Or, if you think that it should be in another thread. That is great. I'm waaayyy into that. But, we will have to ask the dev's if that is ok, because they want us to discuss things on this thread.

But, why discuss it in pm? Because people are disagreeing with you? I have said MANY times that I get pm's. I get em all the time on this device. I can only send pm when i log onto a pc. Which is not that often. But, I'm getting a pc for xmas. So, I'll be able to post a lot more than.

But, no reason to hide this debate from other people.

I'm not sure I'm trying to convince others of anything any more than you are. For that matter not any more than anyone else is.... hence the "debate part".

The forum rules say that the purpose of the forum is to foster open discussion and debate. It's in the first paragraph. But, like I said, I won't respond to your posts if you don't want. I'm way ok with that. It's really up to you.

Yes, I agree, all this ultimately up to the devs. They know what is best for the game.

I wish you lots of luck and fun.

My stance is that feedback shouldn't be debated. Why? It's feedback. That means it's subjective. You are entitled to your own feedback; I am entitled to my own feedback. No, I'm not saying for my own face that we should debate in private, because I don't really care what people think of me. The only thing that upsets me is when people hate me. That is not the case. My point though is, that they asked for our own feedback.

So, what I'm saying essentially is, if it's feedback they are asking for. Give your feedback and be done with it. I don't have the time to nitpick and argue my points and reasoning why. I'm not saying for you not to debate with me, as I do enjoy your debates/questioning posts. I'm saying in a thread where debate is not needed and personal opinion is asked to better the game, why can't you just state yours and let others have their own opinions? Is it really too much to ask? Mind you, in this thread, I think I fulfilled that and didn't question other's feedback.

[Aikiebo]

My stance is that feedback shouldn't be debated. Why? It's feedback. That means it's subjective. You are entitled to your own feedback; I am entitled to my own feedback. No, I'm not saying for my own face that we should debate in private, because I don't really care what people think of me. The only thing that upsets me is when people hate me. That is not the case. My point though is, that they asked for our own feedback.

So, what I'm saying essentially is, if it's feedback they are asking for. Give your feedback and be done with it. I don't have the time to nitpick and argue my points and reasoning why. I'm not saying for you not to debate with me, as I do enjoy your debates/questioning posts. I'm saying in a thread where debate is not needed and personal opinion is asked to better the game, why can't you just state yours and let others have their own opinions? Is it really too much to ask? Mind you, in this thread, I think I fulfilled that and didn't question other's feedback.

Apollo, dude.... I'm not sure what you want me to do, lol. You keep telling me that you don't want me or I guess anyone to respond to/debate your opinions. You want them to lie still and be undisturbed.

I keep saying, "OK".

I keep saying, "that's fine with me, idc"

This is beginning to feel like entrapment, lol lol

If you don't want me to respond to your opinions, I won't. I got no problem with that. Which I said immediately and several times now.

BUT THEN YOU KEEP ASKING ME DIRECT QUESTIONS, lol. So.. .I respond not to your "no-challenge feedback" but to your direct questions, and you seem to be upset at me for that.

That is why -- 2x -- now, I have said I am not sure exactly what you want me to do. I will now add, I am not sure what you are upset at. I keep complying with your every wish, lol.

You said that "feedback shouldn't be debated, why because it is feedback, because it is subjective, because you are entitled to have your feed back and I am entitled to have my feedback".

But you could say the SAME EXACT THING about opinions. Opinions are subjective. Everyone is entitled to their opinions. But opinions are debated. So just cuz something is subjective doesn't mean it shouldn't be debated. (In fact proven objective facts can't be debated) Yeah, we all entitled sure.. I agree.

Then you said that the reason you wanted this debated in private is NOT becuase you care what others think about you (as long as they don't hate ya..No on hates you, Apollo, not at all)

Usually when someone is trying to silence a debate is is because they don't want others hearing both sides of the issue. This way the status quo stays in tact. Things don't change and get better when open debate is stiffled. Now, I HONESTLY don't believe that the idea to stiffle open debate is coming from you. I don't believe for a second that you are that kind of guy.

So then you repeat the idea the idea that people shold just state feed back and be done with it. I am not sure that is exactly an STS rule. I think that is how a couple of people are interpreting it.

1. All feedback threads have debate.
2. This thread was full of debate till you said it was time to stop.
3. Feed back is almost useless if it is left static, dormant, undisturbed which is what you are suggesting. (But if you don't want me to respond to yours I wont)

Why is it bad to let feedback rot while laying idle somewhere?

Because it gets bette as more and more people add to it.

Example: Early into this thread a few people suggested that the 1 plat new elixrs be moved to the bottom of the list with the other 1 plat elixrs.

Eventually, someone (moi) suggested: that until we have 30 minute and 60 minute choices, plz, plz, plz leave the 1 plat choices at top. Cuz I am not, repeat, am not going to scroll thru the whole list every 5 minutes. People will hardly ever use these elixrs if way down on the bottom. Too much like clerical work.

So now, STS has the feed back: Please move 1 plat choices to bottom of list.

But, imo anyway, a great addition to that idea: Sure, go ahead and move to the bottom of the list as soon as we have 30 min or 60 min choices.

So, each piece of feed back stays separate and intact as stand alone ideas. But, the second one is considered by some to be an improvement. The devs can look at both ideas then do w/e they think is best.

There are numerous other examples of this that I could give you from this thread alone. Plus from tons of other feedback threds. You know, in the business world this is how feedback usually works. Groups of people feed off of each others ideas till a good final one is thought of.

I don't belive for a seond that STS is really trying to stiffle discussion. There have been several harsh remarks to that affect on this thread, that I don't think is true.

You suggested that "I should let other people have their ideas", hmmmm.... debate, as stated above, leaves each piece of feed back in tact. People still have their opinions. There is no way ON EARTH that I could take someone's opinion or feedback from them. It's not possible. Opinions can be stiffled if I wanted to act all rude and obnoxious and manipulate and/or intimidate people. But that is a whole nuther matter.

You ended your last post by saying that in this thread you didn't question other people's feedback. Well, true, except. ......... you questioned mine, lol lol. Which is fine. I'm very open minded and not opposed to debate. So, I don't care that you questioned it, in fact I'm glad you did. I think your awesome and have no problem with the fact that you challenged some of my ideas.

Take it easy, have fun.

[RedRyder]

Woah there buddy, I merely implied that everyone needs to relax. It's a game, things change in games like this all the time, and STS jumps in to fix things. Everyone's jumping on the "STS are gluttons for $$$" train, and are bashing the life out of STS for trying to accommodate the casual audience. If no one complained however, STS wouldn't know what to fix.

Stop arguing back and forth so hard. The criticism is becoming less and less constructive. All everyone is doing is expanding the time that all of this is going to get fixed, with STS having to weed out the bad from the good.

I'm sure we can all agree that the best solution would be to just disable kills outside of the campaign of the toons appropriate level when the elixir is in use. For the elite cap issue, make the xp gain able ONLY in the campaign of the current level cap.

[kallima]

AIKIEBO -

I just have a question, because it seems to me, and I know that can not be the case but I must ask because this is what I have gathered from reading ALL your lengthy posts that you think your opinion is of more value than anyone elses. I ask this, even though I know it must not be true, because you have been monopolizing this entire thread since it was created. I scroll through the thread and my screen can not fit even one of your posts. Please, if this is not the case, I apologize but you say every one has a voice and every opinion counts but you drown out others' concise ideas with an overly long reply. Most people on here, are giving their feedback to the DEVELOPERS, and if you are a dev gone incognito, I apologize but why must they discuss/reply/debate/justify their opinions to you? Again, if this is not the case, but it sure seems to me it is, yet I know that it can not be, I am sorry but that is how I am taking it.

You say that you don't understand why some people want to control others gameplay yet you sit there and type that too many are over-reacting and complaining. Are you not complaining about our reactions? Again, it seems to me that you don't want people to control others yet you are saying that everyone is overreacting? I did not realize I could not express my opinion and just because it disagrees with yours, that means I'm overreacting. Don't tell me how I'm feeling or how I should feel, even though I know that can not be true, because it would be awful and I don't think you are this way, but is that what you are doing? Telling others how to feel.

I am happy that we both agree that everyone has an opinion because it's win-win right? That's good. Let everyone express how they feel and no one should have to justify it to another player since this is a thread for US to give our thoughts to the developers, not debate this with one person that is overwhelming this thread. I am glad you do not twist words because I don't like it when people do that me either. This is a good thing.

Hope everything works out well for you.

[Whirlzap]

Guys too much anger and essay ness here.
This is now the post your epic new elix modified char thread.
I'll go first.

Xwhirlz
Lv99(in 5 hours on new elix)
Plat Used: 99999999
Feelings: Other than the huge hole in my wallet, I feel great. Oh crap, now it's sinking in.


can't we just do that^?

Anyways, in responce DX

-First of all, there are other ways to make profit, about 40% of the whole higher level end of game players are on 4x Combo 24/7. Second of all, they don't have to literally make the game so easy a little kid could do it, just to make money.

-STS has done many great and impressive things from the past. I'm respecting that, but the quality of the things they do now, just isn't what it used to be.

Can we look at the new vanity armor? I'd rather wear some newb gear rather than that on my mage.

Can we remember all the "wowthisnewlv61vanityshieldlookshorribleandsucks." threads that were made? Yep.
Can we remember the OMFGhalloweenstuffarebroughtbackagain? Yes, we can.

I get the feeling STS is slacking off now. Same campaign layouts, and yep, 2-3 months, to push peeps that used to not use elixirs to start using them. I know of many friends that ended up having to pot 4x.

What else can I say?
Same drops, just new names.
Same holiday items, and maps. Yay. But OMG, the only thing that changed was the stuff from PLATINUM PACKS.
Hmm, I wonder what this means....

Oh, by the way, this post is constructive feedback. There is no vulgar language, so I don't see any reason to uhh, delete this post.

[Aikiebo]

AIKIEBO -

1. ALL your lengthy posts that you think your opinion is of more value than anyone elses.

2. and if you are a dev gone incognito,

3. yet you are saying that everyone is overreacting?

4. I am happy that we both agree

5. Hope everything works out well for you.

Kalima, thank you for getting back to me!

1. No

2. No

3. No

4. Me too

5. Likewise

Hope this was helpful.

[Decur]

That didn't take long... PvE K/D ratios already tainted...

[saool]

...another opinion...I dislike the shamrock elixir...didn't work...still doesn't, I know this isn't the elixir we are talking about but still.

I bought one to test it out...someone else got the pink that dropped...I got a green drop... -.-

I wasted 20 platinum, yes wasted. I usually use or spend platinum but with the shamrock elixir I WASTED platinum....

Anyways, I also agree with enabling exp gain if you must, but disable kill count. And yadah yadah yadah blah blah blah... I don't like the lixirs...new ones at least. But it didn't mean I will quit playing, or get mad about it just disappointed... ;(

[Moogerfooger]

And as far as the rest of your post is concerned, when is easier better? Aphorisms like "No pain, no gain" and "anything worth having, is worth working for" exist for a reason. Put down the kool-aid this is not summer camp, we are not singing kumbayah - there will be unhappy people with whatever STS decides, but we are trying to save the game we have come to know and love from being a dumbed down version.


Too late, maybe. For example, the other day I was standing in Balefort with the Cyber set on, and I had not one, but two lvl 55+, each with less than 7k kills, ask me where I got my Cyber set, and when I tried to explain "Go find Shadow ? Guy in the room where King Mynas spawns on Crush the Keeper" and neither was clear on what I meant, and one even asked me to go show them.

I think Red's suggestion was best. Disable kill farming/counts outside level-appropriate if they are going to keep these ill-advised elixirs. The LB's integrity is already somewhat suspect, now one can just buy their way onto the LBs with some plat and a little time. I do like the 'level-anywhere' possibility for people grinding to end game in a sense, to break up the monotony...because it is monotonous....but in my opinion, the cons outweigh the pros. It used to be that people at end-game were pretty dang good at their toons, even non-forumers...now you have no such guarantee, and this certainly will not improve the overall skill level. Casual player fun factor may be up, but overall skill level of population diminishing rapidly.

I think I heard Royce turning over in his PL grave somewhere ;)

[Yvonnel]

Too late, maybe. For example, the other day I was standing in Balefort with the Cyber set on, and I had not one, but two lvl 55+, each with less than 7k kills, ask me where I got my Cyber set, and when I tried to explain "Go find Shadow ? Guy in the room where King Mynas spawns on Crush the Keeper" and neither was clear on what I meant, and one even asked me to go show them.

I have actually had this same thing happen a couple of times in the last couple months. It is a shame actually. However, I see how this happens, people join while cap is 60 and they rush grind to level cap. They fail to explore all of the different maps, or do the quests. I have actually started doing the quests for all my twinks. Get all the quests done up to the specific maps their level is capped at. :D


I think I heard Royce turning over in his PL grave somewhere ;)

LOL! You are probably right!

Tapatalk'd from my PowerWashed Fascinate

[Weak_Sauce]

doesn't anybody realize these leaderboard names are from turning off the xp bar and farming kills? this option has been nurfed a while ago. nobody can hit the leaders for most kills now because of that. why protect it?

Flat out wrong. May be true for some but to lump all on leaderboards into that statement is ignorant.

[Weak_Sauce]

What if you don't have enough players so you need to leave the game open? What if the maker of the game goes MIA and no one can boot? What if you made a game but no one was joining so you chose to join someone else's? Sure if you host you can boot anyone you want but what if there isn't anyone to boot? I almost always host and I've had this issue many times so I choose to join others games. Again, I could always leave a game if I'm unhappy but what if I'm half-way through and I don't want to abandon the work I've put in thus far?

Finally, coming from the era when any level could join any game, I had to boot feverishly so that a friend or player at the correct level could join. Everytime a spot was open it was a constant rush of low leveled players coming in saying "Don't boot!"

You do realize that most games last 3 - 6 minutes.

Do you realize that the post of mine you quoted was speaking to a very specific situation? A player who I thought might be a newer player was in a map with a higher level who was rude to him. The op was saying that he couldn't get any kills cuz of this high level player, so I was suggesting ways he could remedy that problem.

STS has given us a whole list of ways to limit / choose who we play with. Hosting, locking, world map, quest log, passwords, friends list, guild list. .. I mean, it's not that hard to make or find a group that you can live with for 3 minutes.

Anyone who was around during Mynas Gen should have an AMAZING and WONDERFUL friends list. Plus have made decent enough contacts/friends to be in a really great guild. I can't believe it is that hard for you to get a group.

Wasn't referring to myself exclusively, although I have experienced all of these things, but to all players of any level. My statement was more hypothetical...

[Weak_Sauce]

There's an aspect I didn't even think of, yet another issue with new elixers.

And no Epic, no one has the right to call anyone a noob. The only people who call people by that name are the actual noobs.

Uhh. I actually call a couple of people noob all the time. I happen to have a couple of friends on my friend list that have noob in their name, and I call them "Noob".

Oh for the love of god, I'm not talking about friends teasing eachother or anyone who has noob in their name. I'm hoping this statement was a joke as it is blatently obvious I am referring to people using the term as a put down to players they don't know or are not friendly enough with to feel comfortable teasing them in such a manner.


On a whole other note I wish people would stop using the argument that this change is great because now you don't HAVE to run the same campaign over and over to level up.

Guess what, you don't HAVE to level up. If you don't want to run the same campaign over and over and do the work to level then don't. But don't come at the people who do level that way and want to get rid of the new elixers with the argument that the way we play is too tedious.

If you choose to level then you level in the campaign and play the game as intended, if you think that's too much work then don't level. Just like anything else in life not everyone is going to make it to the top and there are always people who take activities they're passionate about more seriously than others.

Not everyone is a pro athelete for a reason and yet sports are fun for people around the world without them reaching the elite pro status. People play as much as they can and only push themselves if they have a goal that they want to obtain, but everyone has to work hard at this "fun" activity to get to the top.

Same difference...

Getting to the top level isn't necessary to play the game and people are free to play in a way that's comfortable to them. Those people just have to realize that the game isn't going to change so that a guy who plays basketball on weekends for a hour or two can be drafted into the big leagues. He simply didn't earn the right to be there and had he been allowed to join the NBA you better believe all of the guys who dedicated their lives to the sport wouldn't be pleased with the outcome.


Lastly, on a whole other note... If the people who use any of the other elixers for nominal ammounts of platinum or use the elixers which you can buy with gold they have to scroll all the way down... Why should these be any different?

[StompArtist]

Keeping in this trend of XP gains in level "inappropriate" dungeons: Would there be a chance of making it so we can gain kills in a level appropriate dungeons with a character that is XP locked?

[StompArtist]

Oh for the love of god, I'm not talking about friends teasing eachother or anyone who has noob in their name. I'm hoping this statement was a joke as it is blatently obvious I am referring to people using the term as a put down to players they don't know or are not friendly enough with to feel comfortable teasing them in such a manner.

Noob! LOL

[Yvonnel]

Oh for the love of god, I'm not talking about friends teasing eachother or anyone who has noob in their name. I'm hoping this statement was a joke as it is blatently obvious I am referring to people using the term as a put down to players they don't know or are not friendly enough with to feel comfortable teasing them in such a manner.

Ummmmm...... Obvious Sarcasm, or so I thought.

Tapatalk'd from my PowerWashed Fascinate

[Samhayne]

Hey gang,

Thanks for your feedback and our apologies we haven't been in here answering questions more frequently. Suffice to say, we hear you. We know that not everyone is going to like everything we do. Just to reiterate, our main thrust with this change is to give low level players the option to play with higher level friends or vice versa. We're changing the price up to 5 Plat to give a bit more barrier to entry for this feature.

Thanks in advance for keeping the conversation friendly and constructive.

[PatsoeGamer]

I've been away for the weekend and come back to PL. I subscribe to the forum via RSS and there's been a lot of activity. So as I like to read everyones comments and thoughts, and listen and interact with the best community out in the world I thought I would just give my opinion. So those you've got to know me over the year or so should know I'm not one for confrontation, so here are my comments on this update:

I feel sorry for the players who've been affected by the kill rates, even though I have 70k kills, they have all come from being in the top point of the game at highest level, and my deaths only just went over 1K in nuri's, but I'm still proud of them. Just like Decur said it is a shame, I like Dec too whenever I'm in game at CS I always say hi, and actually, I would always look up to Dec as he's always working hard in game, during maps he's always trying his best.

Ellyidol and Apollo have some very good points also, I mean I remember the mynas stage too when low levels would be so annoying and booting people was out of control. I agree with Ellyidol to make the xp scaled for the lower levels. At the same time it would be fun to join lower level players and help them out whilst still getting xp, which I really only do now when I hit the cap because the grind is quite long. I'm not sure why we should pay plat to get xp in lower levels, which is why I agree with Elly, scale it as I think a lot of people wont run the new dungeons when they get released.

Finally, the kill leaderboard.. put a stop to the kill count on that elixer, its not fair on the players who've worked incredibly hard to get there.

--- Side note: This is something I've wanted to ask for a while...

Do the dev's work with the AoA's or GOA's with their ideas prior to the release? I think it would be a good idea if they dont already, because these players are the ones who are most influencial, and who have a personal attachment to the game, they care. They want PL to be the best game ever, one thats remembered with all the other greats. I can honestly say that ever since I started I have played every day and I love this game, but sadly just like Appollo said, its started to become a little revenue driven. I'm not to worried about that, but I think that as long as there is still something for the casual gamer who's not all about spending money thats fine. The latest releases have seen players leave, arguements on the forums between players. I think if we got these GOA's or AoA's involved in some of the planning prior to the releases and there was testing for these players, these immediate errors could be quickly identified. In this case I think the most immediate error is the kill count - if a panel was in place they would have quickly flagged it with the devs and players would have been happier :)

[Fyrce]

I actually had fun w/ the new elixirs, but I'm pretty sure I won't be using them at all at 5plat each.

I wasn't interested in storming the leaderboards. I just thought it was cool for farming, which usually is boring when all you get is waiting for the really, really rare item.

Maybe limit them to a certain number of times of usage per day? or you can buy for 1plat like 5 times, then it's 5plat? Though then everyone will complain how they didn't know and want refunds...


I've seen ignorant players before. They seem to be a bit more prevalent where there's lots of powerleveling, ie. Mynas gens, 4x elixirs.

I'm not sure the new elixirs have anything to do with them. I've seen people pretty much start a new character, think PL is a racing game. Within 5 minutes, they have a list of the 'courses' they have to run over and over to get to max level. Since there's only something like 5 courses they need to learn, there's not much exploration going on.

Culprits? Mainly other players I think. You can sit around Forest Haven and Dark Forest and Balefort and hear players tell one another where to go for xp. Almost none of it has to do with exploration.

Solution? Maybe xp for completing levels. Or can't enter one area w/o completing the previous area. Stuff like that, that most players don't like and would/may make them go to other games that are more mindless. So I'm not sure there's really a viable solution for 'exploration' games such as this one. Most people just are not explorers, unless the alternative is getting their teeth pulled.

:p

[Protank]

I knew it would not take long to nurf the new elixers.

u still get kills but they are 5 plat now.

I bought one not noticing the new 5 plat price tag and I will no longer purchase them. it's just not worth it to me.

[pastrychef]

Hey gang,

Thanks for your feedback and our apologies we haven't been in here answering questions more frequently. Suffice to say, we hear you. We know that not everyone is going to like everything we do. Just to reiterate, our main thrust with this change is to give low level players the option to play with higher level friends or vice versa. We're changing the price up to 5 Plat to give a bit more barrier to entry for this feature.

Thanks in advance for keeping the conversation friendly and constructive.

Raising the price to 5 plats doesn't solve the problem of leader board preservation at all. It just ensures that only the wealthier of players gets on it.

[Zojak]

Raising the price to 5 plats doesn't solve the problem of leader board preservation at all. It just ensures that only the wealthier of players gets on it.


I think what they need to do is make it so if we use that elixer, we can't get leaderboard kills, just exp, BUT at a price of 5 plat, they need to increase the time the elixer lasts, a plat a minute isnt worth it to anybody

[Decur]

Why is the elixir still only 1 plat in guild hall? Is that the guild discount?

[Ghastly]

Hey guys, it's ghastly. Haven't been on because I've been grounded for a months because I threw a frisbee at my teacher and she fell out the window ;)

And btw lets stay calm. STS can't make this perfect for everyone...

These threads get worse than YouTube comments...

Edit: you're right moar, these are worse then them without the swearing...

[MoarPewPew]

These threads get worse than YouTube comments...

These forums are wonderfully moderated. I'am in utter shock that you would say that.

On topic: Seems silly that STS limited the levels that can enter dungeon and now they let you join them if you pay....

[Decur]

The travesty continues. Bears PvE kills list will probably be tarnished before the night is over.

[MightyMicah]

So does this mean the 5 platinum for the elixar is a done deal?

[PatsoeGamer]

So does this mean the 5 platinum for the elixar is a done deal?

Nothing's changed still..

[PatsoeGamer]

The travesty continues. Bears PvE kills list will probably be tarnished before the night is over.

Such a shame Dec, you must be devastated mate...

[NECROREAPER]

--- Side note: This is something I've wanted to ask for a while...

Do the dev's work with the AoA's or GOA's with their ideas prior to the release? I think it would be a good idea if they dont already, because these players are the ones who are most influencial, and who have a personal attachment to the game, they care. They want PL to be the best game ever, one thats remembered with all the other greats. I can honestly say that ever since I started I have played every day and I love this game, but sadly just like Appollo said, its started to become a little revenue driven. I'm not to worried about that, but I think that as long as there is still something for the casual gamer who's not all about spending money thats fine. The latest releases have seen players leave, arguements on the forums between players. I think if we got these GOA's or AoA's involved in some of the planning prior to the releases and there was testing for these players, these immediate errors could be quickly identified. In this case I think the most immediate error is the kill count - if a panel was in place they would have quickly flagged it with the devs and players would have been happier :)


Not exactly, but they do give us a heads up of whats new sometimes. As far as beta testing anything, no we don't do that, the dev team does it themselves.

*EDIT* wewt, 1000th post

[Duped]

...........
--- Side note: This is something I've wanted to ask for a while...

Do the dev's work with the AoA's or GOA's with their ideas prior to the release? I think it would be a good idea if they dont already, because these players are the ones who are most influencial, and who have a personal attachment to the game, they care. They want PL to be the best game ever, one thats remembered with all the other greats. I can honestly say that ever since I started I have played every day and I love this game, but sadly just like Appollo said, its started to become a little revenue driven. I'm not to worried about that, but I think that as long as there is still something for the casual gamer who's not all about spending money thats fine. The latest releases have seen players leave, arguements on the forums between players. I think if we got these GOA's or AoA's involved in some of the planning prior to the releases and there was testing for these players, these immediate errors could be quickly identified. In this case I think the most immediate error is the kill count - if a panel was in place they would have quickly flagged it with the devs and players would have been happier :)

The answer is no. I did ask Sam that Q, but the answer is still no. Why they don't? I'll not know. Id think a sampling of players (merchant, GOA, AoA, guild leader, forumer, pot user, pot free user, and casual player) would be at the least helpful, but perhaps they are smart enough to figure out the implications of their actions before they release them.

[Elyseon]

There should be an elixir abstenence month each year xD

[NECROREAPER]

There should be an elixir abstenence month each year xD

Lol, and what would that accomplish?


It'd probably shut the game down due to heavily declined plat sales which would in turn shut down STS...

[Gluttony]

How about an elixir that causes the AI to increase level to the player, much like how the Halloween/winter events work but on a global level. I brainstormed the idea in a blog I like to call: Re-playability enhancer, read it HERE (http://www.spacetimestudios.com/entry.php?151-Re-playability-enhancer).

Edit: Can we at least get more colors to the elixirs/enhancers besides yellow? There are so many yellow elixirs it makes it impossible to guess which one the player is on without observing them for a while. I personally would like to know if someone is on a free daily vs xp increasing vs any other yellow elixir. I have to imagine there are other colors in the PL spectrum besides yellow.

[pastrychef]

How about an elixir that causes the AI to increase level to the player, much like how the Halloween/winter events work but on a global level. I brainstormed the idea in a blog I like to call: Re-playability enhancer, read it HERE (http://www.spacetimestudios.com/entry.php?151-Re-playability-enhancer).

Edit: Can we at least get more colors to the elixirs/enhancers besides yellow? There are so many yellow elixirs it makes it impossible to guess which one the player is on without observing them for a while. I personally would like to know if someone is on a free daily vs xp increasing vs any other yellow elixir. I have to imagine there are other colors in the PL spectrum besides yellow.

While I'm still against these elixirs, this is the best idea I've seen yet. I sincerely hope this gets implemented since it's obvious these elixirs are here to stay.

Yes, I agree with you about usage of additional colors for elixirs. Seems like a no-brainer to me.

[StompArtist]

Westcoastbird and Crazyazzbird have purchased their spots on the PVE K/D ratio leaderboard for archer. Congratulations!

Let the "you are not a true leader board achiever" bashing begin! All this could be avoided by breaking the link between XP and deaths and only allow to collect deaths in level appropriate dungeons regardless of XP gains. :D

[CrimsonTider]

Westcoastbird and Crazyazzbird have purchased their spots on the PVE K/D ratio leaderboard for archer. Congratulations!

How is this any different than purchasing a Thrqsher punch and running the upper levels? Also, do you realize how many toons are/were close to the LB before this elixir came out?

Let's not start false accusations/rumors if you do not know for certain the situation.

[mafiainc42]

I will say this in sts forums words so all understand.. The people that are on the k/d leaderoards did it by exploiting a glitch. The xp off button glitch. Why they are still on there is besides me.. So know your history before u start poppin off at the mouth..

[Decur]

How is this any different than purchasing a Thrqsher punch and running the upper levels? Also, do you realize how many toons are/were close to the LB before this elixir came out?

Let's not start false accusations/rumors if you do not know for certain the situation.

To jump from not being there to 1st??? Um... I don't think it can be achieved legitimately.

As for Thrasher on upper levels, there's still the risk of death and 500 kills in 5 minutes is not possible.

[mafiainc42]

The use of any elixer to boost taints yur stats. Umm thats common sense.. Cry and complain about one then you do the same for all.. I soloed my toon 20 to 66 with the new elixer and that was the outcome.. Placed myself on a already false and tainted leaderboard and broke no rules doin so... If your on the top of the kill count leaderboard and have ever used a thrasher to solo kills then u must be a cheat and not legitamate. Same thing dude. Pvp k/d ratio tainted. Sts came out with this awesome elixer and I used it..

[Protank]

i think turning the xp off and getting kills was not a glitch. it was that way for months.

I have a lvl one with over 10000 kills and a lvl 10 with the same kills. it was for fun and for farming. it just showed had u spent time on that character and nothing is wrong with that.

i think the only reason they changed it was becuase of the crying going on in this game. guess I'll start crying every day about the endgame vanities i dont have since I can barely kill the people who have the full set.

nah nevermind

all this talk of leaders is making me want to try to make it there Oo

sorry if I'm getting off topic I'll chill from this thread and go get on leader boards :D

[mafiainc42]

Sure would of loved farmin 216,000 kills and having no deaths, and turn around and say hey I was just doin low lvl farmin, lmfao, as I said before , "Common Sense." AWESOME excuse...

[CrimsonTider]

To jump from not being there to 1st??? Um... I don't think it can be achieved legitimately.

As for Thrasher on upper levels, there's still the risk of death and 500 kills in 5 minutes is not possible.

IMO... YOU are the only one who has done this "legitimately". I don't think anyone else on the LB for kills has achieved this without using at least one pot (damage or combo.) I can assure you the risk of death for anyone using a Thrasher combo is minimal as I have soloed many dungeons using these when I am bored on my bird.

The purpose of my post was to point out that accusations shouod not be tolerated. I just logged in game to check the LB and NOTHING has changed. The post pointing out the two individuals is invalid. The amount of time needed to pass the current Top 5 in each category will still take time rather this new elixir is used or not.

[mackjack]

STS should just add another elixir free leader board. The devs can filter the players' purchase history and anyone that has purchased elixirs for plat will be disqualified from this hardcore leader board. Problem solved.

[Chant]

The use of any elixer to boost taints yur stats. Umm thats common sense.. Cry and complain about one then you do the same for all.. I soloed my toon with the new elixer and that was the outcome.. Placed myself on a already false and tainted leaderboard and broke no rules doin so... If your on the top of the kill count leaderboard and have ever used a thrasher to solo kills then u must be a cheat and not legitamate. Same thing dude. Pvp k/d ratio tainted. Sts came out with this awesome elixer and I used it..

What took you 3 days to achieve your kills (WestCoastBird - 83164 and Crazyazzbird - 50000) took Naughtee ONE YEAR and took me over a year and a half.

I used to look forward doing ratio runs and targeted to farm 1-3k kills per day which would take me hours. Thrasher Pwnage Punch elixirs was released and ruined it!!! So, I decided to stop. I just couldn't keep up with plat potters. You did not cheat. That's true. Devs loves you!!! It was either you or someone else.

However, I'm just disappointed and appalled that what I have accomplished in game would be placed in the same category as to how you achieved your spots. Thanks Devs for your "awesomeness and ingenuity" on how to earn your profits.

[Delphina]

Please remember to keep your comments constructive.

[Moogerfooger]

We have leaderboards?

[CrimsonTider]

We have leaderboards?

Aren't you #1 for deaths?? :p

[Fortress]

We recently added the following premium features to Pocket Legends:

High level players can purchase the temporary ability to gain fractional experience in low level maps. This ability can be gained by tapping the blinking exclamation point icon when you enter a low level map.
Low level players can purchase the temporary ability to access high level dungeons. Note that you are likely to have a difficult time playing in dungeons that are above your level, better bring some friends! This ability can be gained by purchasing the relevant Enhancer or by attempting to join a friend/guildmate in a high level map


This change was brought primarily to better facilitate friends playing together despite level differences. Also, to provide variety for player to gain experience in different areas of the game. Rather than always having to run the same instances over and over (for example, as you progress toward the elite level cap) a player could forgo the chance at level appropriate loot to instead farm a lower level instance and still progress.

We know that there is some concern regarding the kill count leaderboards in light of this change. We are looking into that issue now.

Please use this thread to voice your thoughts on the matter. We would appreciate it if you keep the input constructive and friendly. Thank you for your feedback!

I like this idea. I tried it once at Uncharted!

[Moogerfooger]

Aren't you #1 for deaths?? :p

No, but I bet I'd be up there for inane post leaderz....right behind a 'bama terd :D

[CrimsonTider]

I know knot how 2 reed oar sea you're syllables!!

[Weak_Sauce]

Hey guys, it's ghastly. Haven't been on because I've been grounded for a months because I threw a frisbee at my teacher and she fell out the window ;)


Lmfao, u just made my day.

[Weak_Sauce]

Maybe I'm way off base but it seems to me that the elixers allowing leveling in any level are just a way to recycle old content instead of creating new content that does not get old in a few days. I just wonder if people would hate grinding as much if the campaign they were leveling in had more to do, see and experience. This is mostly true for the higher levels seeing as they require the most time spent leveling (not to mention the race to the level cap for new campaigns).

I would even be okay with players gaining xp in the correct campaign for their toon and the two campaigns below it. But since we haven't seen content lately that people aren't bored with after a week I guess sts figured they would take the easy way out and just send us back to campaigns we have already played.

[pastrychef]

Gratz to Draq for purchasing a spot on the PvE bears kill list.

[MightyMicah]

I have to say I'm with Chant. I used to be legitly on LB, took me about 3 months to get at the lowest spot possible. Now, all that was waste simply because Johnny's dad is richer than me. I used 0 Elixars. Now in PL thats just unheard of...IMO stats were more legit with xp lock kills! (IKR) At least that took more than a few hours...

[Draq]

Pastrychef i was on boards when they first came out. I reclaimed my spot. Im sry u rnt good enough to enjoy boards. Get facts straight before u throw rediculous statements out there.

[CrimsonTider]

Gratz to Draq for purchasing a spot on the PvE bears kill list.


You obviously do NOT know your PL history nor the players who have been around for a long time. I have known Draq for almost a year and if it wasn't for breaks he takes, he would be much higher on the warrior LB.

Calling people out on the forums due to misinformation is worse than the "crime" you are accusong him of.

[Gluttony]

You obviously do NOT know your PL history nor the players who have been around for a long time. I have known Draq for almost a year and if it wasn't for breaks he takes, he would be much higher on the warrior LB.

Calling people out on the forums due to misinformation is worse than the "crime" you are accusong him of.
This is a side effect of elixirs in general; there is no real way to differentiate those who do from those who don't without having personalized information. For instance, I get accused of using plat elixirs all the time due to having what "some" consider a good ratio approx 80k kills and 500 deaths as a pure DEX bird. I am quite blatant about the fact that I don't use plat elixirs and aside from the occasional 1.5x purchase and the daily freebee this is a roid-free zone. It's all about perception; the name jumped on the list after the introduction of a new tool that allows players to gain kills with much less work. It seems only natural to make assumptions as to how the name actually got there, and honestly there is no way to know.

Also, there is no crime to mention, players are power leveling to cap without any kills or deaths, others are making cap in hours, the stuff is there and those who want to use it are able. Why everyone is fighting for the position of leader board leader is beyond me. I mean look at the pvp boards, am I really supposed to believe that players are going 2k and 0 legit? Are there enough unseasoned players out there that they cannot even pull off an upset just once to cut that ratio in half?

[pastrychef]

Pastrychef i was on boards when they first came out. I reclaimed my spot. Im sry u rnt good enough to enjoy boards. Get facts straight before u throw rediculous statements out there.

Weren't you doing a bunch Plasma runs recently? Unless the xp anywhere elixirs were used, I don't think kills count there at lvl 66.

[pastrychef]

You obviously do NOT know your PL history nor the players who have been around for a long time. I have known Draq for almost a year and if it wasn't for breaks he takes, he would be much higher on the warrior LB.

Calling people out on the forums due to misinformation is worse than the "crime" you are accusong him of.

Suffice it to say that with these elixirs, anyone new names on the the leaderboards will be questioned.

[Ghastly]

Like some people said already, (sorry don't feel like reading 9 pages of comments) just disable kill count with these elixers.

[CrimsonTider]

Suffice it to say that with these elixirs, anyone new names on the the leaderboards will be questioned.

Maybe... maybe not... but it is not your place to judge. Same with your Plasma reference. What someone is doing in game is frankly non of your business. What you are doing is called trolling and needs to cease.

[Draq]

I was helping a friend lvl if u must know. Who would go to plasma to do anything except lvl friend and farm gold.

[Moogerfooger]

Maybe... maybe not... but it is not your place to judge. Same with your Plasma reference. What someone is doing in game is frankly non of your business. What you are doing is called trolling and needs to cease.

Werd. If people in general quit worrying about what other people were doing or have, and spent more time having fun, however that may be (twinking, PvP, farming) then the forums would be a better place.

[StompArtist]

Werd. If people in general quit worrying about what other people were doing or have, and spent more time having fun, however that may be (twinking, PvP, farming) then the forums would be a better place.

That is my only problem with some elixirs (a bit out of subject here, I know) like the big combo elixirs. When you are running PUGs, mainly, and a couple players on combo elixirs show it it does affect MY game-play because at that point I either have to leave or basically become a leech... Everything else I could not care less. :D

[mackjack]

So about 2 weeks and 9 pages of feedback/comments/flames later, what exactly have the devs done? Raise the cost of these 2 elixirs to 5 plats.

That's it? Or will more changes be forth coming?

[elrond]

I guess I don't have to much to add after reading through this entire thread. I play a level 65 bear and may get to 66 before the next campaign is released, who knows. I don't buy any elixers, I don't buy any plat. I don't really care about or look at the leaderboards.

The one thing I do notice is the boredon of running the same maps over and over while leveling up. I will occasionally go play other maps just to break up the monotany even though I don't get experience there anymore. I have thought that they could implement a scaled system for experience throughout the game. Say drop the experience by 5-10% per campaign below your appropriate level. This would allow you to get experience anywhere in the game, but at a slower pace since it is so much easier at lower level campaigns. As to the mechanics of this, they may not want to add decimal places to your experience, then just add a % chance of getting experience for each kill. Then if they want an elixer for those who are in a hurry, an elixer can give you a 100% chance of experience in any campaign. This would allow for higher level players to take a break and for STS to make some money off the people who buy elixers.

As to kills, it seems that the leaderboards are screwed up anyway. What should they do? I would probably lock the old leaderboards and keep them visable, disable kills in inappropriate campaigns, and start a new leaderboard from zero. I don't know how you deal with elixers though, maybe have seperate leaderboards for kills with and without elixers. You could be on both. You get a kill on the appropriate board if you are on an elixer or not. I really am not sure on this though.

Just my thoughts, I know as someone who does not buy plat I am not the player STS most wants to cater to, but I do think they provide a balance to the game.

[Draq]

They cant have 2 different boards. That would be rediculous. So many ppl buy plat. Then it would just be free for all. As to experience issue that is good idea

[elrond]

Why could they not have two boards. They would need to keep track of one more stat, which they already need to check. If you are on an elixer at that moment, you get an elixer kill, if not you get a non-elixer kill and they have a board for each. Seems simple enough. People who claim elixers are killing the LB would have a board with no elixer kills on it and people who run on elixers all the time could compete with each other.

As for me, I enjoy the game and could care less about the boards anyway. I was just looking for a way to make the boards more meaningful to those who do seem to care about them.