Patch Coming This Week and Changes to Mount Fang Boss Gauntlet

[Samhayne]

We are planning to update Pocket Legends the week of Jan 9 - 13. Among other things, this update will include:

Turn off the 2011 Winter Festival (announcement here (http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?47284-End-of-the-Winter-Fest-is-Nigh!))
Add a player requested 1v1 PvP Map (discussion thread here (http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?47176-STS-Can-we-have-a-1v1-map&p=529831&viewfull=1#post529831))
A round of bug fixes
A new zone added similar to the Mount Fang "Vampire Feast" Boss Gauntlet, but with full loot drop.

I want to elaborate on the addition of a new Boss Gauntlet area to Mount Fang. There has always been some confusion with the Boss Gauntlet areas. Players generally expect the bosses drop all of their loot, however they don't in the current Boss Gauntlets. These gauntlets were intended as quick ways for players to hone their skills for the boss. If you want a chance at the full loot, you need to fight in through the full zone to get to the boss and take them down there. The reality is that the current Boss Gauntlets are very rarely played.

After the patch, the a new Boss Gauntlet will be added to Mount Fang that will be upgraded to give the full loot tables to the bosses. To maintain the rarity of the ep1c lewtz it will use the Premium Access System that was used by the Winter Festival. This gives players an option when farming for loot. They can play for free, as they always have, and do runs of the current zones, fighting in to the boss and taking them down for their loot. Or, you can pay Platinum to access the upgraded Boss Gauntlet and farm there.

In the future, we intend to offer this type of content for all level ranges, from Forest Haven's Boss Gauntlet on up. We will not remove any currently existing Boss Gauntlets, but will instead add new ones for Premium Access.

Spacetime Studios philosophy with premium options is just that – they are optional. All players can play Pocket Legends from level 1 to the elite level cap without paying any real world money. We appreciate and value all of our players, however they choose to play. As always, thank you for your support.

[wvhills]

Sam, could I make a suggestion? Please consider leaving victory lap free to play without changing the drop tables. A lot of people use this map to complete the cyber quests. Also, Bayou Boss Brawl is still played alot and I personally would like to see it remain free as people do still farm there a lot.

Edit: Especially, for us older players. The lower levels weren't free when I started playing. I had to pay for them and they (the boss maps) were included in the purchase price. I don't really care about the others expect for Boss Brawl and VL. I feel you would be taking away something I have already paid for.

[JaytB]

Looking forward to that 1 vs 1 map :D

[Samhayne]

Sam, could I make a suggestion? Please consider leaving victory lap free to play without changing the drop tables. A lot of people use this map to complete the cyber quests. Also, Bayou Boss Brawl is still played alot and I personally would like to see it remain free as people do still farm there a lot.

Edit: Especially, for us older players. The lower levels weren't free when I started playing. I had to pay for them and they (the boss maps) were included in the purchase price. I don't really care about the others expect for Boss Brawl and VL. I feel you would be taking away something I have already paid for.

Good point, Robert. We can probably create an alternate area for those level ranges to use for Premium access.

[LwMark]

All i can say is lol
...
And u alredy fixd 1h set

[wvhills]

Good point, Robert. We can probably create an alternate area for those level ranges to use for Premium access.

Thanks sam!

[Relytekal]

Sam, could I make a suggestion? Please consider leaving victory lap free to play without changing the drop tables. A lot of people use this map to complete the cyber quests. Also, Bayou Boss Brawl is still played alot and I personally would like to see it remain free as people do still farm there a lot.

Edit: Especially, for us older players. The lower levels weren't free when I started playing. I had to pay for them and they (the boss maps) were included in the purchase price. I don't really care about the others expect for Boss Brawl and VL. I feel you would be taking away something I have already paid for.

Completely agree. If I was forced to be nickle and dimed for levels I already paid for I would file a charge back with my credit card company for the several hundred dollars worth of plat. I paid for something don't even think about trying to charge me for it again. I am getting upset just thinking about it. This whole idea of plat to play a round is crazy. Charge by the month if you want too. I love this game but I will be damned if I am going to be nickle and dimed every time I want to play.

EDIT: I didn't pay for "alternate areas" I paid for the real maps. WTF?!?!?!?!

[Skeletonlord]

Good going! Will this be a patch or just a content update?

[FluffNStuff]

Will this be a 'per use' fee or a one time fee or a subscription option?

[FluffNStuff]

Wait, what, this can't be right???? Are you doing this to just Vampire Fest, or to the other boss levels? Like I actually PAID for Swamps, and you are now saying I have to pay each time I want to enter the boss brawl???????????????

[CrimsonTider]

I am fine with this being implemented with the Mt. Fang Boss Gauntlet. One reason why noone goes there (like with the Nuri's Boss Gauntlet), is because bosses no longer require real "strategy". They have basically become a "survive and advance" style with no way to strategically control them like the previous campaigns. Not much practice needed to spam pots/heal/rev/skills until the bosses are dead. :)

Also, what is the issue with the 1h Orlok set. I know mine has the red smoke the other Fang sets have. Is there an issue with the actual bonus?

Thanks for the info Sam.

[Hankomachos]

This game feels more like a "I can do anything I want for plat" everyday.

Believe me, I'm no MMO buff, but what's the point in legendary items, if you can pretty much get them as a guarantee by paying plat.

The cs will more than likely be flooded with mount fang pinks, thus lowering the rarity and ultimately, the value of items.

I get you have to run a business, but this, IMO, is pushing it.

My solution?
Get rid of the gauntlets all together.
Problem solved.

[ninjaduck]

This game feels more like a "I can do anything I want for plat" everyday.

Believe me, I'm no MMO buff, but what's the point in legendary items, if you can pretty much get them as a guarantee by paying plat.

The cs will more than likely be flooded with mount fang pinks, thus lowering the rarity and ultimately, the value of items.



I get you have to run a business, but this, IMO, is pushing it.

My solution?
Get rid of the gauntlets all together.
Problem solved.


So true :(


Off topic: thanks alot for the help you and matt gave today, much appreciated :)

[FluffNStuff]

If this is Pay per use, and it people use it, it will flood the game with Gauntlet pinks, removing the incentive (read: addiction) of farming bosses the regular way. Please, Please, Please reconsider this idea. PLEASE!!!!

[StompArtist]

This game feels more like a "I can do anything I want for plat" everyday.

Believe me, I'm no MMO buff, but what's the point in legendary items, if you can pretty much get them as a guarantee by paying plat.

The cs will more than likely be flooded with mount fang pinks, thus lowering the rarity and ultimately, the value of items.

I get you have to run a business, but this, IMO, is pushing it.

My solution?
Get rid of the gauntlets all together.
Problem solved.


I believe that the solution needs to involve extra revenue. Getting rid of the gauntlet is the same has leaving them as-is.

[Draopwnzall]

If this is Pay per use, and it people use it, it will flood the game with Gauntlet pinks, removing the incentive (read: addiction) of farming bosses the regular way. Please, Please, Please reconsider this idea. PLEASE!!!!

But I can farm a set! :O

[Samhayne]

This game feels more like a "I can do anything I want for plat" everyday.

Believe me, I'm no MMO buff, but what's the point in legendary items, if you can pretty much get them as a guarantee by paying plat.

The cs will more than likely be flooded with mount fang pinks, thus lowering the rarity and ultimately, the value of items.

I get you have to run a business, but this, IMO, is pushing it.

Hey Hank, thanks for taking the time to voice your opinion and keeping it constructive. I'd like to throw out the alternate viewpoint that a player who doesn't want to purchase Platinum can get everything if they have enough time to farm it. That, like much else in life, is the dividing line. Do you want to spend your time getting it, or do you want to pay to speed up the time investment? To reiterate, this premium option is optional. You can play for free, as you always have, and do runs of the current zones, fighting in to the boss and taking them down for their loot.

[cjackyo]

So first I would like to say I love pl. I don't rage on forums and im not about to start. Just want to add my two cents. Back when lvl cap was 50 how many of these areas were already purchased will plat? Im just saying alot of us vets have already paid for this lower level and have fought and earned our way to access them. I agree that sts is a company and ur trying to make money to continue to bring us a great and awesome game. Please do again I love pl and the community. Just seems a lil unfair to have to pay for something we all ready paid for. Please don't flame or get carried away with this post just my option. And last thank you Sam and sts for all your hard work and for a great game.
Also Sam or flip let's do some pvp. Yeah im calling ya out lol.......just don't kill us to much lol have a great day!!! :)

[Snakespeare]

Players generally expect the bosses drop all of their loot, however they don't in the Boss Gauntlets. These gauntlets were intended as quick ways for players to hone their skills for the boss. If you want a chance at the full loot, you need to fight in through the full zone to get to the boss and take them down there.

If only this were completely true...

Sam, I like this change. Personally I don't like Boss Gauntlets anyway. They make it so the gear becomes trash. Up until the FH revamp, they all DID drop the same loot as their counterparts in the level maps. I recall Cinco saying in chat that he never wanted to make the Bayou Boss Brawl but the players were so vocal that he did, in the end, and still regretted it. Even worse, they responded to whining about Swamps being difficult by first making an easier campaign that had the same loot as the Swamps (with different names), and then by nerfing the Swamps. At that time STS was in learning mode and they were crowd-sourcing by letting the people who post on the boards partly guide their decisions. If they were more hard-nosed, trusted their own judgement, like they are now, these greed zones would never have been made. And now the program is just so huge that map sections have to be recycled in order to create new zones. So I agree that the best way to reduce the excessive pink farming (so excessive that all but one set of pinks is desired and every other drop is called garbage) is to put a price on these zones.

But I would be happier to see them tossed out to make room for the kind of content the designers envision... the kind we see in SL where, incidentally, there are no boss gauntlets.

[FluffNStuff]

Hey Hank, thanks for taking the time to voice your opinion and keeping it constructive. I'd like to throw out the alternate viewpoint that a player who doesn't want to purchase Platinum can get everything if they have enough time to farm it. That, like much else in life, is the dividing line. Do you want to spend your time getting it, or do you want to pay to speed up the time investment? To reiterate, this premium option is optional. You can play for free, as you always have, and do runs of the current zones, fighting in to the boss and taking them down for their loot.

While technically true that others getting something easier does not diminish what someone gets, that theory is dangerously ignoring the primal reason people play these games, which is addiction. Addiction in this sense is not a bad things, and is a very real part of human nature. Addiction requires two things, a chance at a 'victory' (a high) and also a greater chance at a 'loss' (low). In this case, killing a boss and getting a pink is a high, and not getting a pink is a low. The lows are what drives the highs, as can be seen by the failure of the all pink Shadow Caves. Every roll became a victory, with no chance at a loss, so there were no lows to drive the highs, and people got annoyed.
Currently in Mt. Fang, there is an excellent balance of highs and lows, but by adding this plat option, you are throwing off the balance for everyone involved by increasing the victories for some, which reduces the over all highs for all players. While 'sell price' and gold are just numbers on a screen, by playing, we have bought into and have contributed to the idea that those numbers have value. All Mt. Fang players want to get a Sanguine Long Bow drop because it has a ~value~ of 3 million gold, and currently are doing runs after runs in order to get that. Why? There is no real reason for it, but our minds put a high value on it, so we become addicted to the idea of having it drop. When the CS starts filling up with the bows, and they become common and drop in 'imaginary' value, that will reduce the highs of farming. Once those highs become diminished, players will slowly stop playing. They might not even know why they stopped playing, they will just feel like the game is not what it used to be, and find reasons to stop, reasons previously blocked by their minds.

[LwMark]

Snakespeare i really like what you said about taking them out completely to make room for better stuff that we/sts envisions

[CrimsonTider]

Hey Hank, thanks for taking the time to voice your opinion and keeping it constructive. I'd like to throw out the alternate viewpoint that a player who doesn't want to purchase Platinum can get everything if they have enough time to farm it. That, like much else in life, is the dividing line. Do you want to spend your time getting it, or do you want to pay to speed up the time investment? To reiterate, this premium option is optional. You can play for free, as you always have, and do runs of the current zones, fighting in to the boss and taking them down for their loot.

Ok. Forgive me for my ignorance (on some strong meds right now, LOL) but are you stating the dungeon access purchased with plat will have a higher "legendary" drop rate than running the maps in the current manner? Example:

I run the First Floor with a PUG and Emma has, say, a 10% chamce of dropping pink. With the "plat" option, I can run the Boss Gauntlet and Emma may have a 20% chance at dropping pink. So I would have 5 bosses which have a 20% pink drop rats...make sense?

[Elitephonix]

Hmm i say stick with PVP LOL
But...I have to say this game was much better...before sl came out bc after u started charging plat for everything.....
I only ran the winter fest 3 time for my quest and guess what i paid 6 plat for it....
Make the game like it was before balfort sewers
Every rare pink riht now is gonna become pinks like Ao3 lev 45 pinks...there worthless

[JaytB]

Ok. Forgive me for my ignorance (on some strong meds right now, LOL) but are you stating the dungeon access purchased with plat will have a higher "legendary" drop rate than running the maps in the current manner? Example:

I run the First Floor with a PUG and Emma has, say, a 10% chamce of dropping pink. With the "plat" option, I can run the Boss Gauntlet and Emma may have a 20% chance at dropping pink. So I would have 5 bosses which have a 20% pink drop rats...make sense?

My guess is that drop rates will remain the same, it's only a bit quicker to kill the bosses, since you don't have to mow your way through any mobs.

But yeah, I'd also like to hear if that's the case or not.

[Apocolypze]

I still want lvl 1 stashing :(

[PL Playa]

That's my sisters birthday! Why am I getting a present?

[maneatingtree]

Lol totally randon twinkenstein :)

[Snakespeare]

p.s. since we're talking about drop rates and balance and gauntlets, can you PLEASE restore AO1 to normal? If that gauntlet goes plat and gets drop rates adjusted, it's only fair to put the drop rates in the main levels back to normal. The rates were lowered when rushing first became a problem and they were never raised back to normal when the boss spawning solution was applied.

[Fyrce]

You know... Vegas doesn't make the odds better for the rich -- they understand the Pavlov principle: You need the random rewards to draw people in. Instead the gamers are given really cheap perks -- people who might spend millions at the gaming tables get a few thousand in perks; people who spend thousands at the gaming table get maybe a few hundred in perks. But they still have to spend a lot of time in hopes of the rare high (reward).

I think in an MMO, the Pavlov reward would be the drops (in this case, pinks), as they require a whole area/campaign to be designed and programmed. So any reward involving areas should be on a random reward basis.

The cheap rewards would be the free vanities or maybe even the twitter games, or basically something that requires much fewer resources to be in the game. There could be alternative/other cheap rewards I haven't thought of. However, even cheap rewards can't be constant, or they would not be considered rewards.

I think an MMO is more complex but certainly, there should be some salivating.

[Lowlyspy]

I have no problem with feast and madness getting this pay-to-play thing added to them, assuming this additional revenue will spur more creativity in future campaigns. Previous campaigns however I am absolutely opposed to, I too was one of those people who bought all the campaigns when they were pay-to-play and it would be incredibly unfair of STS to charge me more for something that I already paid for.

I bit my tongue pretty well here so please don't ban me again lol

[Zombiemurder]

Ik this is about pocket legends but Sam wen is the star legends winter festival ending just wondering because I love a big tree and snow wen I'm walking around blackstar it would be neat to keep the snow till spring then have rain or something just an idea for u and sts to ponder

P.s. Don't complain about plat it's a choice none of that gear or enchancers is needed to win ik many ppl on sl and pl at the cap hardly usin enchancers except for the free win which is all u rely need in my opinion at least and this goes for both of the sts games.

[KNOW_BRAINER]

they have a record of who paid for these areas. dont charge those people.

[Snakespeare]

Didn't we get shields when these places went free?

[ghost.mw]

Can't wait so see the update.

[Silentarrow]

While technically true that others getting something easier does not diminish what someone gets, that theory is dangerously ignoring the primal reason people play these games, which is addiction. Addiction in this sense is not a bad things, and is a very real part of human nature. Addiction requires two things, a chance at a 'victory' (a high) and also a greater chance at a 'loss' (low). In this case, killing a boss and getting a pink is a high, and not getting a pink is a low. The lows are what drives the highs, as can be seen by the failure of the all pink Shadow Caves. Every roll became a victory, with no chance at a loss, so there were no lows to drive the highs, and people got annoyed.
Currently in Mt. Fang, there is an excellent balance of highs and lows, but by adding this plat option, you are throwing off the balance for everyone involved by increasing the victories for some, which reduces the over all highs for all players. While 'sell price' and gold are just numbers on a screen, by playing, we have bought into and have contributed to the idea that those numbers have value. All Mt. Fang players want to get a Sanguine Long Bow drop because it has a ~value~ of 3 million gold, and currently are doing runs after runs in order to get that. Why? There is no real reason for it, but our minds put a high value on it, so we become addicted to the idea of having it drop. When the CS starts filling up with the bows, and they become common and drop in 'imaginary' value, that will reduce the highs of farming. Once those highs become diminished, players will slowly stop playing. They might not even know why they stopped playing, they will just feel like the game is not what it used to be, and find reasons to stop, reasons previously blocked by their minds.

Perfectly said Fluff, I for one am AGAINST this choice by STS. Everyday something new seems to cost money in PL. I wish we could just go back to the old days when you only ha to pay for the campaigns to be a "good player".


STS...

Why not charge us for campaigns again? Or at least charge us a flat fee for the boss gauntlent...

[Samhayne]

My guess is that drop rates will remain the same, it's only a bit quicker to kill the bosses, since you don't have to mow your way through any mobs.

But yeah, I'd also like to hear if that's the case or not.

As I understand it, that is the case - it would be faster to kill the bosses, but that they have the same loot tables.

[Samhayne]

Ik this is about pocket legends but Sam wen is the star legends winter festival ending just wondering .

Star Legends Winter Fest is also planned to end on Monday, Jan. 9th as we announced here: http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?47286-Star-Legends-Winter-Fest-End-Time

[PatsoeGamer]

I would not be happy to pay for maps again I've already paid for

I would not want to pay to play the other lower boss gauntlets eg bayou boss brawl

As others have voiced their opinoins time and time again, I am also unimpressed with STS looking to make a quick buck from loyal players.

If I remember, STS said in their last update they were discussing the pvp kills. No mention here?

I'm a believer in the quote - if it ain't broke don't try and fix it. The game isnt broke, and the boss gauntlets do the job just fine. So why do a cowboy job to make a quick buck when you could do something amazing and delight your loyal customers instead.

Every day the players put forward their thoughts and provide suggestions and feedback into the suggestions and feedback thread in the forum- where 9/10 state they are willing to pay play for these enhancements to be made.

STS - youre not listening to your customers needs and wants. More load out slots, new game styles, new vanity items, favouriting friends lists, improved maps with new content. This is just a few suggestions of thousands out there suggested.

On a positve note, I like the PVP option

[Samhayne]

To address the concern of existing Boss Gauntlets no existing Boss Gauntlets will be removed. Instead, new ones will be added for premium access.

[Lowlyspy]

To address the concern of existing Boss Gauntlets no existing Boss Gauntlets will be removed. Instead, new ones will be added for premium access.
Fantastic then we're all on the same page. Awesome update imo, gonna love that 1v1 map :)

[CrimsonTider]

To address the concern of existing Boss Gauntlets no existing Boss Gauntlets will be removed. Instead, new ones will be added for premium access.

Sounds like a winner!

[FluffNStuff]

To address the concern of existing Boss Gauntlets no existing Boss Gauntlets will be removed. Instead, new ones will be added for premium access.

Will the drop rate in the current Boss Gauntlets be affected? If not, what would be the difference between the current and premium Gauntlets, or are you implying that new ones will not be added for campaigns that already have one?

[roufus]

So all in all the people that spend alot of plat get richer cause they can farm pinks with the quickness and flood the cs while the play for free people get to watch their long grind for farming pinks get trashed on the cs

[PatsoeGamer]

To address the concern of existing Boss Gauntlets no existing Boss Gauntlets will be removed. Instead, new ones will be added for premium access.

Forgive me for asking, this may have already been mentioned, but checking I couldnt see it - Will the boss gauntlets be a 'pay per run' like the winter festival?

[Samhayne]

So all in all the people that spend alot of plat get richer cause they can farm pinks with the quickness and flood the cs while the play for free people get to watch their long grind for farming pinks get trashed on the cs

That remains to be seen Roufus. There's a guy on south Congress with a sign that saying, "The End is Nigh, Repent Your Sins!" Let's please not jump to the conclusion that the sky is falling and instead wait to see how it pans out. We love the game and value our all of our players however they choose to play. If the sky does fall, we are agile and can quickly address the situation. Thanks in advance for your understanding.

[Samhayne]

Will the drop rate in the current Boss Gauntlets be affected? If not, what would be the difference between the current and premium Gauntlets, or are you implying that new ones will not be added for campaigns that already have one?

The only thing going out with the patch we have planned for Monday is the addition of a new area in Mount Fang that is a boss gauntlet that you can access with the same premium system (a la "pay per run" that Patsoe mentions below) used in the Winter Festival. The change to other area's boss gauntlets was just a head's up that we're thinking about doing that. We appreciate everyone's feedback on the subject. There is a good bit of internal discussion about it and we'll see what the design team comes up with.


Forgive me for asking, this may have already been mentioned, but checking I couldnt see it - Will the boss gauntlets be a 'pay per run' like the winter festival?

Yes - the new Boss Gauntlet. No change to the existing Mount Fang Boss Gauntlet.

[WarTornBird]

Sorry Sam I don't seen to be understanding this, ONLY the new boss gauntlet is going to be pay per play correct? The old boss gauntlets will be free like AO and Swamps. I'm mostly worried about AO. I've still yet to get cyber and now it will be postponed even more due to midterms.

[razerfingers]

Im all thumbs up for this idea AS long as it makes the unaffordable cs greedy people to shoot their prices down so a normal person can afford some endgame gear instead of stuck with the old endgame gear cause some greedy player wants to be the big shot and feel rich. My 2 cents
EDIT: it appears pl and sl is becoming p2p to have any sort of revenue in the game and have fun looting items aswell as leveling up imo.

[mike1298]

Woo more updates that force you to buy plat, next thing you know we will be paying 2 plat everytime you want to chat in game.

[Urqui]

Edit: Just got it...

[Artentreri]

Man, I for one just won't be playin these levels. I just don't have the plat, but then again if the cs does flood and prices for everything does go down, that's not really all bad is it?

[WarTornBird]

Man, I for one just won't be playin these levels. I just don't have the plat, but then again if the cs does flood and prices for everything does go down, that's not really all bad is it?

I guess its a good dispute, for the people who wanna make cash they pay the plat and in return were getting cheaper equipment. So I see where your coming from and you have changed my looks upon it. Someone may have said this In the comments above, I probably missed it. Not sure.

[FluffNStuff]

That remains to be seen Roufus. There's a guy on south Congress with a sign that saying, "The End is Nigh, Repent Your Sins!" Let's please not jump to the conclusion that the sky is falling and instead wait to see how it pans out. We love the game and value our all of our players however they choose to play. If the sky does fall, we are agile and can quickly address the situation. Thanks in advance for your understanding.

Players were shouting the sky is falling when pay per play winter fest came out, but we waited and saw. Some of us felt betrayed by that but shrugged it off as a one time thing. But it seems wf 'played out' a different way for devs and it now appears it was a success. So yes, the sky is falling on some of us, but then again, the sky has fallen in many games I have played over the years. The key is to either evolve with it, or accept that you had a good run and move on. It is after all, just a game.

[MightyMicah]

I just can't rap my mind around the fact that sts would make a p2p AGAIN. Last time everyone freaked out, many people rage quit. It was getting ridiculous but it's calmed down since then. I can't say this was a good move, but then again I don't know the half of it which the devs do know.

As far as it affecting me, it really doesn't. I currently never farm at all. I doubt I ever will. I just play the cs for profit and hey, nearly finished my endgame set :\ This will only make it easier for me because prices will drop slightly. I still don't like the idea, but it's not like it hurt me in any way.

[roufus]

Ok so now causal players can come drop some plat and fully gear their chars and make some money so u result to using plat to get to cap then u use it to get your gear why not just add the plat items they already get for using plat to the loot tables while your at it

[Aculeas]

There's a guy on south Congress with a sign that saying, "The End is Nigh, Repent Your Sins!" Let's please not jump to the conclusion that the sky is falling and instead wait to see how it pans out. We love the game and value our all of our players however they choose to play. If the sky does fall, we are agile and can quickly address the situation. Thanks in advance for your understanding.

Dont let others know we are screwing them hard via their wallet. If we do something to earn money that ultimately hurts us, we will address it. But until then, we will invest our time into making as much money as possible until our bubble bursts and the money dries up. See you in WoM.

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/8605/af0897d243dff5d7797701d.gif

[Rare]

Forgive me for asking, this may have already been mentioned, but checking I couldnt see it - Will the boss gauntlets be a 'pay per run' like the winter festival?

The new ones will, yes.

[Rare]

So, how about stashing those components?

[ninjaduck]

After discussing with some friends, I think removing all the old gauntlets and some other maps would:

1. free app space ( for future maps )
2. Less confusion for newer players


:)

[shanmarie33]

Will the drop rate in the current Boss Gauntlets be affected? If not, what would be the difference between the current and premium Gauntlets, or are you implying that new ones will not be added for campaigns that already have one?

I am also interested in the sts answer to this. Thanks!

[mackjack]

This is rich.

When we complained about the pay per play nature of WF STS' reply is that they'll look into it. Look into it they did. Guess STS liked it so much that they're gonna add pay per play maps to every campaign here on out.

Yeah, technically this game is playable without spending real $ on it, but jeez it's rapidly getting to the point where it's simply not enjoyable unless one constantly blows plat on this game.

Oh well. It was fun while it lasted.

[Gluttony]

I'm a little lost here, I used to think that STS made a strong stance on the point that items purchased with platinum couldn't be sold or traded to prevent players from essentially turning plat into gold, but due to recent changes that's basically what's going on. Personally, I didn't participate in this years wint fest due to the decision to make it pay to play but I do notice that the cs is flooded with these new winter items which basically carry a 2 plat price tag with them. Same with the recipes in Mt Fang, I have yet to see one drop so I can only imagine that some/most/all of the crafted gear in cs was created via a plat recipe; now we toss boss gauntlets (and the pinks they have to offer) into the fray. It still remains to be seen if the sky does actually fall on the on us, or if Chicken Little's cry is a bit premature.

I really don't understand the decision in the end. What's this boss gauntlet have to offer that the other doesn't besides the "premium option" associated with it. If the loot tables remain the same and the bosses aren't easier after paying the entrance fee to take a look around, what's going to keep the customers coming back? Seems like its just going to be more wasted pixels that bog the game down and deprive us from a much more enjoyable map.

[superme]

I'm just wondering, but when is a new world going to come out?

[superme]

When is a new world going to come out?

[Mothwing]

When is a new world going to come out?

February 2nd

EDIT: After reading the post, im a little confused. Mainly angry at what this game has turned into. TBH, if this update follows through, ill most likely be quitting because this is what will happen in the future: (Theres already enough evidence there. All the level caps, 56, 61, and 66 are just money suckers for STS to encourage players to purchase plat.) Anyway this is what will happen: All the levels will be the Pay-Per-Level Format, the elite levels will continue to suck in players by offering the best gear of the game. This is the PL that I, nor anybody else wants.

I really hate to bang on my favorite game to play, but its really sad seeing it dissapear into some money making machine. I agree with the whole platinum thing. TO AN EXTENT. All the DOTD, Plat Store, Elite Levels are there to persuade players into buying platinum. As long as STS keeps the plat stuff in the plat store WHERE IT SHOULD BE, and not popping up on my screen i.e. DOTD and the player menu advertisements, then im happy.

I am excited for the other new content, but this, im not too thrilled. Hopefully it will change.


After discussing with some friends, I think removing all the old gauntlets and some other maps would:

1. free app space ( for future maps )
2. Less confusion for newer players


:)

And this would be unrealistic because some people could play those maps regularly and be unhappy to see them going. Its also limiting your level experience.

[onemadzhau]

So all in all the people that spend alot of plat get richer cause they can farm pinks with the quickness and flood the cs while the play for free people get to watch their long grind for farming pinks get trashed on the cs

its just likr real life bud. Some people have money to drive bmw, mercedes, lamborghini im stuck with a sunfire cause thats the way it works. But the one thing that matters is we are all driving something am i right?

[DJMdivine]

Why create a map for the sole purpose of "plat per runs"? Didnt like, I dont know... more than half the playerbase totally dislike it the first time. You said you were going to see how well it would work... on a holiday such as christmas I have no idea why. But now you guys are taking the steps of implementing it... Please for the sake of Pocket Legends just make the PvP map or both the gauntlet and the PvP map a flat fee...

[StompArtist]

Another idea would be to put 2 different PvP maps. The first is free and same as today but does not give kills. The second cost 1 plat entry fee and counts kills for leaderboard. :D

[Silentarrow]

Lol^^

[Cahaun]

Another idea would be to put 2 different PvP maps. The first is free and same as today but does not give kills. The second cost 1 plat entry fee and counts kills for leaderboard. :D
LOL

[adidaman]

While we're at it, let's make the founders helm a drop on the new premium boss gauntlets. (sarcasm, but sadly it's the way this game is going)

Dos equis guy-

"I don't always buy plat"
"but when I do,"

"the devs laugh in my face"

[onemadzhau]

Ok i am not looking for any flaming but has anybody tried playing on xbox live or ps network for free? Well if you did you were dissapointed cause you cant this game is a free game with added bonuses you have to pay for. most companies make games for two reasons fun and its a job everybody needs money to survive. Its still free guys maybe it would have been better if it started this way then we would be able to stop hearing about "the old sts" sts did their job making a good game to get us hooked then slowly added enhancers for $. dont want to spend your money? Simply dont thanks and once again not to be flamed upon :)
Ps sts isnt our puppets they should do as they please. They know whats at risk

[Mothwing]

Ok i am not looking for any flaming but has anybody tried playing on xbox live or ps network for free? Well if you did you were dissapointed cause you cant this game is a free game with added bonuses you have to pay for. most companies make games for two reasons fun and its a job everybody needs money to survive. Its still free guys maybe it would have been better if it started this way then we would be able to stop hearing about "the old sts" sts did their job making a good game to get us hooked then slowly added enhancers for $. dont want to spend your money? Simply dont thanks and once again not to be flamed upon :)
Ps sts isnt our puppets they should do as they please. They know whats at risk

PSN is free ^.^. Also, we understand STS has to make some kind of profit, but not cancel out the content that shouldnt be paid for. For example the new gauntlets, why would we have to pay for a level on top of a campaign we already paid for? Also to add, you have to pay EVERY TIME you visit that map. Thats like paying $5 every time you turn your water faucet on.

[Elyseon]

1v1 pvp map- cool
Orlok set- i thought it was already fixed
Pay-per-run maps- YUCK!

[Aikiebo]

This gives players an option when farming for loot. They can play for free, as they always have, and do runs of the current zones, fighting in to the boss and taking them down for their loot. Or, you can pay Platinum to access the upgraded Boss Gauntlet and farm there.

The fact that this is happening, shows that STS has done a fantastic job with the games. I really want to congratulate Spacetime Studios.

The great thing about free2play is that all players benefit. Even the players who do not spend any or very much real world money to play. WE ALL benefit.

[Elyseon]

Hmm why dont u just add a fee for every boss you kill, it could cost plat to list things in cs, maybe charge 2 plat when ever we want to equip a different weapon, it could cost if we want to kill some one in pvp, 2 plat every time we change characters, 2 plat to host any game, 2 plat to boot anyone, add pvp potions that could only be purchased with plat, cost 2 plat every time you want to pm someone

[Aikiebo]

you have to pay EVERY TIME you visit that map. Thats like paying $5 every time you turn your water faucet on.

Do people realize that 2 plat = $0.09. Yeah, 2 plat costs 9 cents.

Anyone who uses a lot of plat, e.g. pink farmers, should use the $90 plat pack.

So, it is nothing like paying $5 every time you turn on a faucet. It's like paying 9 cents everytime you try to farm a pink in an OPTIONAL area.

And you are going to get more than one chance to farm that pink for 2 plat. There will be several bosses of course.

Having 2 plat per run boss gauntlets makes perfect sense. As we all know:

1. This new boss gauntlet is OPTIONAL.

2. Free-2play games like Pocket Legends make their income from OPTIONAL content.

3. The free-2-play business model IS DESGINED FROM THE VERY BEGINNING so that only a small portion of players buy the optional content.

4. This benefits the other players who don't/can't spend money. They get to play the game for free.

5. Free-2-play video games is a multi-million dollar industry.

6. They all operate on this same principle. Everyone gets to play. The only people who pay are the ones that WANT to.

There's no reason to complain about this new OPTIONAL level. If you don't want to have fun by playing there, you don't have to.

[Ardon]

Hmm why dont u just add a fee for every boss you kill, it could cost plat to list things in cs, maybe charge 2 plat when ever we want to equip a different weapon, it could cost if we want to kill some one in pvp, 2 plat every time we change characters, 2 plat to host any game, 2 plat to boot anyone, add pvp potions that could only be purchased with plat, cost 2 plat every time you want to pm someone

That post cost 2 plat to post lol :p

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

[Onaraasider]

*sigh* just used up my last gift card for winter festival,looks like im going back to free offers

[Onaraasider]

Hmm why dont u just add a fee for every boss you kill, it could cost plat to list things in cs, maybe charge 2 plat when ever we want to equip a different weapon, it could cost if we want to kill some one in pvp, 2 plat every time we change characters, 2 plat to host any game, 2 plat to boot anyone, add pvp potions that could only be purchased with plat, cost 2 plat every time you want to pm someoneif that happened, i would quit lol

[Onaraasider]

Do people realize that 2 plat = $0.09. Yeah, 2 plat costs 9 cents.

Anyone who uses a lot of plat, e.g. pink farmers, should use the $90 plat pack.

So, it is nothing like paying $5 every time you turn on a faucet. It's like paying 9 cents everytime you try to farm a pink in an OPTIONAL area.

And you are going to get more than one chance to farm that pink for 2 plat. There will be several bosses of course.

Having 2 plat per run boss gauntlets makes perfect sense. As we all know:

1. This new boss gauntlet is OPTIONAL.

2. Free-2play games like Pocket Legends make their income from OPTIONAL content.

3. The free-2-play business model IS DESGINED FROM THE VERY BEGINNING so that only a small portion of players buy the optional content.

4. This benefits the other players who don't/can't spend money. They get to play the game for free.

5. Free-2-play video games is a multi-million dollar industry.

6. They all operate on this same principle. Everyone gets to play. The only people who pay are the ones that WANT to.

There's no reason to complain about this new OPTIONAL level. If you don't want to have fun by playing there, you don't have to.actually it cost .20 cents 5plat=.99cents

[Aikiebo]

Hmm why dont u just add a fee for every boss you kill, it could cost plat to list things in cs, maybe charge 2 plat when ever we want to equip a different weapon, it could cost if we want to kill some one in pvp, 2 plat every time we change characters, 2 plat to host any game, 2 plat to boot anyone, add pvp potions that could only be purchased with plat, cost 2 plat every time you want to pm someone

Because, as it has been said dozens of times, to play the game is FREE. You can play the whole game for free. It is the optional stuff that STS earns their revenue from.

Why would you even ask such a question?

But, there is a game that charges for chat box activity.


There's no reason to complain about this new OPTIONAL level. If you don't want to have fun by playing there, you don't have to.actually it cost .20 cents 5plat=.99cents[/QUOTE]

I don't know if you own a calculator. Most smart phones have them. In fact, most Trac Phones have them, lol.

Enter: 90
Enter: / (divided by)
Enter: 2000
Enter: =
See: 0.045 (that's 4 1/2 cents)
Enter: x (multiply)
Enter:2
Enter: =
See: 0.09 (that's 9 cents)

Anyone using a lot of plat should buy the $90 plat pack. If they don't they can't complain how expensive things are.

[Aikiebo]

Yeah, technically this game is playable without spending real $ on it, but jeez it's rapidly getting to the point where it's simply not enjoyable unless one constantly blows plat on this game.

Nothing is changing about Mt. Fang. The only thing that is happening is an ADDITIONAL map is being added that is 2 plat per run. This doesn't change the fun of the game at all except for the better. People who want to farm themselves a set can now do that way easier. People who want to farm to make in-game coin can now do that way easier.

It changes nothing for the people who just want to play the main spine free.

I am excited about this change for many, many reasons. One, I kind of gave up hope for getting a crafted 65 set. I have every component that is needed. I can't get the gear in drops and to date have not been able to afford to buy the uncrafted set. So, this is really exciting.

This is exactly the sort of thing that we need to attrack and hold 1,000s and 1,000s and 1,000s of new players.

[Lowellpimpd]

how is it a free game if u have to pay lots of real money even at high lev to keep up with people poted and even live with having a chance at a pink

[Lowellpimpd]

Good point, Robert. We can probably create an alternate area for those level ranges to use for Premium access. its not like most of the boss end maps even drop that well anyways

[Aikiebo]

how is it a free game if u have to pay lots of real money even at high lev to keep up with people poted and even live with having a chance at a pink

I understand what you are saying. And I realize, if someone wasn't looking at it from a business angle, it could seem frustrating.

It costs several million dollars to create, maintain and expand a game like PL, SL and DL. So, you kinda got to ask yourself why someone would spend that kind of money. They do that because they are hoping that they will make even more money than it cost to develop and operate the game.

They want to make more money than they're spending.

Free-2-play games are litterally taking over virtually the entire game industry. Real soon, it is going to be an extreme rare thing for a game to not have at least some free-2-play elements. And by that I mean, spending rl money on in-app purchases.

Even WoW has become a hybrid free-2-play/pay-2-play game. Which of course is much better than the 2-week free trial they have had for so long. They have several in-app purchase ops and some believe that rmt has been implemented.

As far as "having" to keep up with others. You don't have to. There will always be people at all levels to play. If someone doesn't use elixrs that's ok, there are people your level who are playing the game every minute of every day.

And from what I understand, technically speaking, the chances of getting a pink is the same in a free map or a 2-plat map. The difference will be is that 2-plat map players will see more bosses than the free player will see in the same amount of time played.

Anyways, hope this helps.

[FluffNStuff]

@aiekbo:
If they still give out the guardian shield, then you sir deserve it. Too bad we can not designate our successors because I would happily give my shield to you. People might think I am being sarcastic but I assure you I am not.
I have defended the developers from a lot of criticism, and people would ask if I support everything STS does. My reply was always no, there are things I disagree with, but I believe in the general direction the game is going.
I can no longer say that, so how can I be a guardian of what I don't believe in? You do believe in it, so I ask you to guard it. But never forget you must protect Alterra from all enemies, BOTH foreign and domestic.

[Late]

How do I take this down ? Only can edit

[MightyMicah]

@Aikiebo, i think where most of us are concerned is the direction of the game, not so much it's current state.

Honestly I really like reading your comments because I see you are smart enough to reason with everyone and "take on" so to speak the tons of people who are against you. In short, you're the underdog and I like that.

I can see you have a very logical brain and my respect for you has gone up insanely. Cheers mate ;)

[mackjack]

@aikiebo

Man, you are like the George RR Martin of this forum: Pages upon pages upon pages...

Sure 2 plats ain't much in the grand scheme of things, but it's the principle. 2 plats today, 5 plats tomorrow, etc. Pretty soon if you want any hope of looting the best items before the next campaign comes out, you're gonna have to pay for these "optional" farming maps. Again, it's not the cost, but the principle.

And seriously, did you think that STS' "looking into" our concern about pay per play would turn into this?

Toot STS' horn all you want, just realize that most us won't be convinced by (and probably won't even suffer through) your walls of text to dance to your tune.

[Mothwing]

Do people realize that 2 plat = $0.09. Yeah, 2 plat costs 9 cents.

Anyone who uses a lot of plat, e.g. pink farmers, should use the $90 plat pack.

So, it is nothing like paying $5 every time you turn on a faucet. It's like paying 9 cents everytime you try to farm a pink in an OPTIONAL area.

And you are going to get more than one chance to farm that pink for 2 plat. There will be several bosses of course.

Having 2 plat per run boss gauntlets makes perfect sense. As we all know:

1. This new boss gauntlet is OPTIONAL.

2. Free-2play games like Pocket Legends make their income from OPTIONAL content.

3. The free-2-play business model IS DESGINED FROM THE VERY BEGINNING so that only a small portion of players buy the optional content.

4. This benefits the other players who don't/can't spend money. They get to play the game for free.

5. Free-2-play video games is a multi-million dollar industry.

6. They all operate on this same principle. Everyone gets to play. The only people who pay are the ones that WANT to.

There's no reason to complain about this new OPTIONAL level. If you don't want to have fun by playing there, you don't have to.

Do people realize that $0.09 can add up? Do people realize that if i wanted 30 plat thats $2.70? Do people realize that everytime you buy that "oh its only 2 plat weapon" that youre wasting hundreds of dollars? And yes there is a reason to complain. I dont want to have to pay $0.09 everytime i do a simple action. I was watching the news today and they said that airplanes will eventually start charging you to use the bathroom, wash your hands, get a paper towel. Thats the same concept here. Say u had to use the bathroom 5 times on a trip. You use the bathroom, theres $0.45. You wash hour hands, another $0.45. Use some paper towels, $0.45 gone.

I think Elyseon put it pretty clearly. I dont want to have to spend money on every small action i do. Because $0.09 adds up. Before you know it youre spending hundreds of dollars on a video game, yes, a video game.

[Maynard]

Sam, Have you considered a subscription option?

[Aikiebo]

@Aikiebo, i think where most of us are concerned is the direction of the game, not so much it's current state.

Honestly I really like reading your comments because I see you are smart enough to reason with everyone and "take on" so to speak the tons of people who are against you. In short, you're the underdog and I like that.

I can see you have a very logical brain and my respect for you has gone up insanely. Cheers mate ;)

Thank you very much for the kind words. I appreciate them a great deal.

I don't know if you realize, but you have made the absolute most logical statement on this whole thread. You said that peeps were more concerned with the direction the game is heading vs. its current state. Wow! That hits the nail on the head!!!

The direction the game is heading, is the exact direction that the entire video game industry is heading. And I mean the entire industry: free-2-play, pay-2-play, console, pc, facebook, mobile, EVERYTHING about the gaming industry.

Ok, we have the 'Magic Mirror' in the game, right. Just imagine there were two of these mirrors facing each other. You'd think all they would reflect is each other, right? But, picture in one mirror is the entire video game industry. But in the other mirror - instead of a simple mirror image, you see STS, and the direction that STS is moving. They are exact mirror reflections of each other.

@fluffnstuff, please don't give up anything. There is no reason to. STS is going down a very, very healthy path. It is just not obvious to every player yet. But it is true.

[onemadzhau]

@aikiebo

Man, you are like the George RR Martin of this forum: Pages upon pages upon pages...

Sure 2 plats ain't much in the grand scheme of things, but it's the principle. 2 plats today, 5 plats tomorrow, etc. Pretty soon if you want any hope of looting the best items before the next campaign comes out, you're gonna have to pay for these "optional" farming maps. Again, it's not the cost, but the principle.

And seriously, did you think that STS' "looking into" our concern about pay per play would turn into this?

Toot STS' horn all you want, just realize that most us won't be convinced by (and probably won't even suffer through) your walls of text to dance to your tune.
all i can say if this game was completely free it wouldnt exsist cause sam and all them would end up hopeless and ill say what im sure sam is wanting to say, "read my lips this game is free" and ill reiterate YOU DONT HAVE TO USE PLAT only ppl that need plat are impatient ppl like me. he said he isnt changing anything all he is doin is adding the option

[Aikiebo]

@aikiebo
Pretty soon if you want any hope of looting the best items before the next campaign comes out, you're gonna have to pay for these "optional" farming maps. Again, it's not the cost, but the principle.

And seriously, did you think that STS' "looking into" our concern about pay per play would turn into this?



Do people realize that everytime you buy that "oh its only 2 plat weapon" that youre wasting hundreds of dollars?

And yes there is a reason to complain. I dont want to have to pay $0.09 everytime i do a simple action.

I think Elyseon put it pretty clearly. I dont want to have to spend money on every small action i do. Because $0.09 adds up. Before you know it youre spending hundreds of dollars on a video game, yes, a video game.

Hey!

As far as - did I know that STS was going to do this on Jan. 9th, 2012. No, I didn't know that.

But, I knew with certainty that this is exactly, I mean EXACTLY the direction that STS was gonna go. I knew it with absolute certainty.

Why? Because, this is the direction the entire video game industry is going in. Even WoW is moving towards free-2-play and in-app purchases (in their case, in-game purchases, lol)

I agree, it's not the cost, but the principle. Yeah, the cost is free. The principle is: no one pays for OPTIONAL unless they WANT to.

The questions that Elyseon was asking - STS will never charge for those things!! Never!! How do I know?

Is it because, STS will eventually come to their senses and choose to run their business using sentiment vs. good business decions? No, that, folks, is never gonna happen. None of us would want that to happen. That would kill the game. No business runs on sentiment. Ftlog, charities don't run on sentiment.

So, if STS is not going to cave in to the wishes of about 40 or 50 people and let sentiment be their guide, how on earth can I possibly say, that the things that Elyseon was saying is NEVER gonna happen? Why-0-Why???

Because: What Elyseon was talking about was a Pay-to-Play. A very odd model of pay-to-play, but none the less, it was pay-to-play. If, the main game is not free then it is pay, right?

Someone asked, Sam?, have you considered a subscription model? Right?

Hmmm.... That would be a conventional pay-to-play model, right?

The problem with pay-to-play is this: THE MAJORITY OF THE MILLIONS OF GAMERS IN THE WHOLE WORLD AND IN THE USA HATES PAY-TO-PLAY. Pay-to-play is gasping through a rapid and vicious, brutal death.

Pay-to-play is out. Free-to-play is in.

And with f2p comes IAPs.

If STS decided to go with ANY pay-to-play option, they would be committing business suicide.

The subscription plan would be the worse decision they could make. WoW is right now and has been for some time a hybrid free-to-play/pay-to-play game. It is no longer just subscription based. They have in-game purchases and some folks believe they have real money trading.

Yes, there is nothing to complain about. You say you don't want to "have to" spend money to play the game. You don't have to. Please, be the gaming industry's guest and play free if that is what you want to do.

[Arterra]

Boss Gauntlet, but with full loot drop.

so sandstone halls gauntlet will be updated soon?

[XghostzX]

Really looking forward to the 1v1 update as well as other updates. I'm positive STS will do there best to give us the best of what they can provide but balance it with making their money. :)

For those that are concerned, give this time and a chance to actually update. The minute it's implemented is not the exact way it will end out. Patience :D

[lionblaze149]

I think it should give you an option at the beginning of the level instead, like "would you like to get a guaranteed luck elixir for 2 plat? ", or something so you can work the two together without making premium places like this.

[Graarizhaka2]

I personally feel like all gauntlets should drop all items because for those who can't buy platinum, it means we can't get the items we want without farming for hours.

[Aikiebo]

I personally feel like all gauntlets should drop all items because for those who can't buy platinum, it means we can't get the items we want without farming for hours.

I know how you feel. I have all the components for lev 65 crafted set, but I couldn't get the drops and I can't afford to buy it on the CS. I had totally given up hope of having that set, ever. But, now, cuz of these new plat boss gauntltets, I got hope that I will be able to get the drops I need for a complete set. I'm really excited by that.

But, I understand that your saying not everyone buys a lot of plat. I buy some, but not nearly as much as I would like to. In a way, that is basically how life works. There are lots of things that I would like to do - that I can't. I talked about in another thread how I wish I could start collecting vintage comic books. I can't.

STS has given us two games and are working on two other games that are free to play. We can play all day long, every day if we want - totally free. The only thing that costs money is optional stuff that is not even needed to be able to play the game.

The reason why STS is doing it this way is because 95% of the world-wide video game industry is already doing it or going to be doing it in the next two years.

Why, is everyone shifting to free-to-play? Because almost all video gamers can't stand pay-to-play anymore. We want free-to-play.

The industry follows the consumer because the consumer has money.

Here are three examples to show you what I mean:

1. WoW: In the first nine months of last year, WoW lost over 2 million subscribers. That means they lost what -- about $25 - $30 million a month. That's a whole lot of orc food. According to Blizzard, these 2 million people who stopped playing WoW live in Asia, mainly China. It is in Asia that free-2-play was born and is wildly popular. Blizzard continued to say that these 2 million people left WoW so they could play free-to-play games instead. WoW is now a hybrid f2p game, with multiple in-game purchase ops and aparently even real money trading. Many analysts believe that Blizzard is going to expand its f2p options.

2. On Facebook, there is a game called FarmVille. This game is made by Zynga. It, like Pocket Legends is free-to-play. All, Zynga's games are f2p.

For the first nine months of 2010, Zynga earned $829 million dollars. Almost all their income is from microtransactions/In-app-purchases. In other words, from players spending real life money to buy virtual goods. (Like us buying plat.)

Let me repeat that s..l..o..w..l...y......... $820 million dollars of virutal goods in just nine months.

Let me say that again:

1. $820 million dollars spent on virtual goods
2. in just nine months
3. in just one company.
4. This company, Zynga, didn't even exist three years ago.
5. Now it has 2000 employees.

3. The Entertainment Software Association (ESA) reports that in 2010, digital game content sales (like our plat) totaled over $25 billion dollars.

$25 billion dollars in just one year.

That's a whole lot of In-App Purchaes!

-------------------

In the next couple of years, virtually every game on any platform is going to be free-to-play. The console market is disinegrating. The future is mobile, social, f2p, and cloud.

So, what does all this mean? Well, basically it is just a whole lot of chatter that boils down to the fact that our STS games, just like all other great games, are going to be so that I can play the main game free. But, if I want to do extra stuff, that is how I will choose to support the game developers by buying plat.

[drewcapu]

4. This company, Zynga, didn't even exist three years ago.


I believe they're a little over 4 years old. I was playing their poker app early 2008. Back then it was fun. I knew all the top 50 players. You were l33t if you had a million dollars then. Now it's all bloat. When facebook took away local networks (basically what city you were from), it hit Zynga's Hold'em app pretty hard. No longer could you easily play with people just from your area. I still stop by once in awhile, but long gone are the days when my old friends would be on every night. I pop into random tables and there's absolutely zero chatting going on. Totally foreign idea back in 2008.

But, I digress.

The reason why Zynga makes so much money (despite their stock still not getting above their IPO price) is because they know perfectly well how to take advantage of the OCD in everyone. Without facebook, Zynga would be nothing. The OCD in facebook is the vehicle for Zynga's success. There's really nothing creative about any of their apps as most of them are spoofs off of someone else's work. Aside from poker, the only other app of theirs that was somewhat social is YoVille, and that app they bought from someone.

Now, if STS found a way to integrate their games (and various quests) into facebook with their feeds / wall posts and whatnot, you can bet they can find the same gold mine that Zynga has claimed all to themselves.

[Lowellpimpd]

I understand what you are saying. And I realize, if someone wasn't looking at it from a business angle, it could seem frustrating.

It costs several million dollars to create, maintain and expand a game like PL, SL and DL. So, you kinda got to ask yourself why someone would spend that kind of money. They do that because they are hoping that they will make even more money than it cost to develop and operate the game.

They want to make more money than they're spending.

Free-2-play games are litterally taking over virtually the entire game industry. Real soon, it is going to be an extreme rare thing for a game to not have at least some free-2-play elements. And by that I mean, spending rl money on in-app purchases.

Even WoW has become a hybrid free-2-play/pay-2-play game. Which of course is much better than the 2-week free trial they have had for so long. They have several in-app purchase ops and some believe that rmt has been implemented.

As far as "having" to keep up with others. You don't have to. There will always be people at all levels to play. If someone doesn't use elixrs that's ok, there are people your level who are playing the game every minute of every day.

And from what I understand, technically speaking, the chances of getting a pink is the same in a free map or a 2-plat map. The difference will be is that 2-plat map players will see more bosses than the free player will see in the same amount of time played.

Anyways, hope this helps. im not

[Lowellpimpd]

I understand what you are saying. And I realize, if someone wasn't looking at it from a business angle, it could seem frustrating.

It costs several million dollars to create, maintain and expand a game like PL, SL and DL. So, you kinda got to ask yourself why someone would spend that kind of money. They do that because they are hoping that they will make even more money than it cost to develop and operate the game.

They want to make more money than they're spending.

Free-2-play games are litterally taking over virtually the entire game industry. Real soon, it is going to be an extreme rare thing for a game to not have at least some free-2-play elements. And by that I mean, spending rl money on in-app purchases.

Even WoW has become a hybrid free-2-play/pay-2-play game. Which of course is much better than the 2-week free trial they have had for so long. They have several in-app purchase ops and some believe that rmt has been implemented.

As far as "having" to keep up with others. You don't have to. There will always be people at all levels to play. If someone doesn't use elixrs that's ok, there are people your level who are playing the game every minute of every day.

And from what I understand, technically speaking, the chances of getting a pink is the same in a free map or a 2-plat map. The difference will be is that 2-plat map players will see more bosses than the free player will see in the same amount of time played.

Anyways, hope this helps. ive could as well might be the biggest plat buyer in the game wow kinda lame and eq has just gone way to overboard and should just rename there game

[blurryeyes]

I think all of the ones who complains forgot we are living under the world of capitalism.

What does this mean?

If you are rich, you can have nice cars, nice house etc...
If you are poor, you can't buy nice cars and nice house but you still can live

Same with PL...
If you can afford plats, go buy elixirs to speed up leveling, go buy pay per access for farming
If you can't afford plats, just play the game without using a single plat at all

the thing is STS didn't force us to buy anything at all. They did encourage us to buy plat like the DOTD, but in the end it's still your choice to buy or not.

[Lowellpimpd]

We are planning to update Pocket Legends on Monday, January 9th. Among other things, this update will include:

Turn off the 2011 Winter Festival (announcement here (http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?47284-End-of-the-Winter-Fest-is-Nigh!))
Add a player requested 1v1 PvP Map (discussion thread here (http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?47176-STS-Can-we-have-a-1v1-map&p=529831&viewfull=1#post529831))
A round of bug fixes (including correcting the problem with the set bonus for the crafted Mt. Fang 1H + Shield strength set)
A new zone added similar to the Mount Fang "Vampire Feast" Boss Gauntlet, but with full loot drop.
I want to elaborate on the addition of a new Boss Gauntlet area to Mount Fang. There has always been some confusion with the Boss Gauntlet areas. Players generally expect the bosses drop all of their loot, however they don't in the current Boss Gauntlets. These gauntlets were intended as quick ways for players to hone their skills for the boss. If you want a chance at the full loot, you need to fight in through the full zone to get to the boss and take them down there. The reality is that the current Boss Gauntlets are very rarely played.

After the patch we have planned for Monday, the a new Boss Gauntlet will be added to Mount Fang that will be upgraded to give the full loot tables to the bosses. To maintain the rarity of the ep1c lewtz it will use the Premium Access System that was used by the Winter Festival. This gives players an option when farming for loot. They can play for free, as they always have, and do runs of the current zones, fighting in to the boss and taking them down for their loot. Or, you can pay Platinum to access the upgraded Boss Gauntlet and farm there.

In the future, we intend to offer this type of content for all level ranges, from Forest Haven's Boss Gauntlet on up. We will not remove any currently existing Boss Gauntlets, but will instead add new ones for Premium Access.

Spacetime Studios philosophy with premium options is just that – they are optional. All players can play Pocket Legends from level 1 to the elite level cap without paying any real world money. We appreciate and value all of our players, however they choose to play. As always, thank you for your support. ya cuz of the fact of pinks dont drop on boss gauntlets if we needed to hone i skill any more i dont think we would have made it to the boss gauntlet dont u think so cuz basicly a normal person would think that after clearing maps to the gauntlet u should be able to have the epic achevment to not have to run throw the whole map any more and just get down to the biz and farm the bosses all in one map for pinks

[Siejo]

Well I have never seen pinks in the regular gauntlets so I think I will pass on this one. I have been challenged to rant and rave about STS and their choices lately but I do not engage in flame wars. So I will simply say I will not participate in these. If it makes me a bad player then so be it. I don't see the need to be rude or disrespectful to anyone simply because it is a plat purchase. If I don't want to buy it then I don't have to. It is ok really. No biggie.

[Onaraasider]

...If you can't afford plats, just play the game without using a single plat at all...
Free offers and contests, i lived off of them

[FluffNStuff]

While I am clearly against this, I do know that it is comming, and I thought I would ask a few questions to consider. First, what level would the bosses drop? Will they be scalled, or will they only drop top level equipment? Will only top level players be able to join?
Second, how are you going to work the 'completion'? As this cost money to run, what are the players 'guarenteed'. With winter festival, the players were 'guarenteed' a drop from the boss, and that signaled the completion of their purchase. With a guantlet, there are four bosses, so what will signal the completion? Possibilities:
1) A drop from all four indvidual bossess. Consequence: Players remaking after killing three bosses repeatedly.
2) A drop from at least one boss. Consequence: Players complaining about booting / being put in a late game and not getting their 'plats worth'.
3) A total of four drops, reguardless of the boss. Consequence: Remake after three, and then get a total of seven.
4) Time limit. Would make the most sense, but also the most risk of a player not getting to kill any bosses, as players would want to minmize their time there so non-elixired players would be considered a 'dead weight' to elixired players.

Just some thoughts.

[Samhayne]

While I am clearly against this, I do know that it is comming, and I thought I would ask a few questions to consider. First, what level would the bosses drop? Will they be scalled, or will they only drop top level equipment? Will only top level players be able to join?
Second, how are you going to work the 'completion'? As this cost money to run, what are the players 'guarenteed'. With winter festival, the players were 'guarenteed' a drop from the boss, and that signaled the completion of their purchase. With a guantlet, there are four bosses, so what will signal the completion? Possibilities:
1) A drop from all four indvidual bossess. Consequence: Players remaking after killing three bosses repeatedly.
2) A drop from at least one boss. Consequence: Players complaining about booting / being put in a late game and not getting their 'plats worth'.
3) A total of four drops, reguardless of the boss. Consequence: Remake after three, and then get a total of seven.
4) Time limit. Would make the most sense, but also the most risk of a player not getting to kill any bosses, as players would want to minmize their time there so non-elixired players would be considered a 'dead weight' to elixired players.

Just some thoughts.

Some good points, Fluff. Thanks for voicing them.

The way the Mt. Fang Premium Access Boss Gauntlet works is exactly the same way as the Winter Festival did, with the exception that there are 5 bosses to kill, corresponding to 5 rolls on loot. When any of the 5 bosses dies, it removes the flag from your character that allows entry into the Mt. Fang Premium Access Boss Gauntlet. All 5 bosses have the same loot table. It's a pretty big loot table, so the chances of you getting exactly what you want are not the best. But the chance of you getting something pretty decent is there as well (5x rolling on the table if you get in for all 5 boss kills). Entry will cost 3 Platinum.

There is some QA still going on with the patch. I'll post to Twitter and here when the patch is going up.

[blatta]

... First, what level would the bosses drop? Will they be scalled, or will they only drop top level equipment? Will only top level players be able to join?...

I would like to add to this question: Is it planned to release the plat gauntlets right with new maps or at a later date?

Both will have consequences for farming/merching scaled items. For example the prices for scaled Nuri items are far higher now then the normal level items. A gauntlet that would come late, e.g. with the release of the next map, and without scaled drops wouldn't do much to this market.

A note: For me i think it is important, regardless how much plat i ever spent in game, that there are spaces where you get rewards without any plat involved. Even if i feel good, when i get a winter pink, i know that i have paid for it. I always use plat to reach a point faster in my lvls/items, from where i can have fun without further using plat at a regular basis. Farming/merching scaled items is one of that. This is not because i not like to give my money to STS. They made a game which brought me much fun. Its more that plat use seems to make time rare. I hurry when i bought reroll elix for winter maps. People booting unpotted players and so on.

[shanmarie33]

I saw your post responding to the difference between the new pay to play room and the old room. It really didn't answer the question. What is the difference?

I understand STS is a business, you add platinum purchase only to feed the fam and make some money. It is a choice to pay to play. I personally choose to pay for an upgraded play, although honestly my bubble is gonna burst soon. I have already spent too much money playing a video game. Not actually my point anyway. As a CUSTOMER I would apreciate it if STS would be more honest and upfront and fully disclose to your CUSTOMERS what exactly they get for their purchase. What exactly is different about the new room? Why should I choose to purchase it?

In the past I, and I know I'm not alone, have felt duped on plat products.
For me:
1. Free spine...I purchased it all, and got a shield...a shield I cannot stash, give, or sell
2. Faces...I purchased with plat, but certain faces, like the crow, became free to new players...no restitution
3. Announcing the Fang release date, and then putting it out earlier...I did make it to the elite cap a day earlier using thrasher exliers totaling maybe 700 plat. My choice, yes. I know many players who did the same, but didn't make it because of the early release. Most I know have quit. They spent real money, by choice, to achieve an in game status only to feel lied to and duped.
4. Shamus elixer...Especially before the Fang Drop fix and luck elixer fix, Shamus did not work the way we thought. Really it still doesn't, but it has been somewhat decoded by several players and posts...not by STS...and no refund of plat spent on it while Shamus wasn't working at all because nothing level 65 was dropping in Fang.
5. Lowered the xp to level quicker. This one almost did me in. It was announced that it was a special that would end by a specified date. I chose to spend alot of money (plat) to buy elixers to level up really fast to take advantage of that. Many, many players did the same...STS announced that was no longer a special, but would be permanant...Great for any player who didn't already spend a bunch of plat because it was sold to them as a limited time offer. I personally felt very taken by that move.
6. Winter Fest...well I do not think it made many people happy, but ultimately I chose to pay the plat for the content I wanted, but again, I personally can't justify spending so much real life money on this anymore. Maybe lower the prices, make it go further or something to avoid burned out CUSTOMERS.

POST SIMPLIFIED:

As a person choosing to spend money on something virtual, I need to have a better understanding of that. I do not feel entitled to run your business or make threats or demands about the way it grows. I do feel entitled as a CUSTOMER to know exactly what I am getting for my money. If there was a little more transparency with platinum purchases that are available, I think it would help some players to happily choose to spend.

[Samhayne]

Hey Shanmarie33,

I think this thread is an example of transparency in operation. I realize that we haven't been perfect in the past, and we're likely to make mistakes going forward. We are human afterall.

[shanmarie33]

Hey Shanmarie33,

I think this thread is an example of transparency in operation. I realize that we haven't been perfect in the past, and we're likely to make mistakes going forward. We are human afterall.

I feel so special now. Thank you for acknowleding my post. I look forward to reading all about the new map and how it works, and possiblely buying some runs. I know I certainly realize the humanity behind the company and the company behind the video game. I read these forums as often as my toddlers allow me, and I do believe this community realizes it as well. :adoration:

[Samhayne]

Thanks Shanmarie!

[Aikiebo]

The reason why Zynga makes so much money (despite their stock still not getting above their IPO price) is because they know perfectly well how to take advantage of the OCD in everyone. Without facebook, Zynga would be nothing.

Aside from poker, the only other app of theirs that was somewhat social is YoVille, and that app they bought from someone.

Hey!

The only poker that I have played has been in real life, lol. I was mainly bringing up Zynga as one of three examples of how the entire gaming industry is changing. I talked about Zynga, Wow and how much money players spent last year in all In-App Purchases. I am not actually trying to say how great Zynga is, but to just show industry trends.

I was really trying to make a point that nobody should be upset at STS because they are part of industry trends that is literally making history.

I am gonna talk about Zynga and more expamples in this post, then get to that STS part in a second post. This way, the post won't be so long.

But, drewcapu, I don't know what you're thinking, I guess a lot of stuff has changed since you played a lot. Zynga is way, way, way into social interaction. The only reason they make all these millions of dollars is because of HARD FOCUS on constant social interaction between their customers.

Here are some other examples to show that what STS doing is really just the direction that the ENTIRE global video game business is heading. And it really does work out better for all!

SOE's DC Universe Online:

Last January, Sony Online Entertainment (SOE) launched, DC Universe Online. It was a subscription based game.

Six months later SOE implemented a 'cash shop' where players bought items to help them enjoy the game more. At this time, they cautioned us to not assume they were going to make a total transition to free-2-play. Because, they said they had been planning to open the cash shop for a long time.

Then last October, switches to a completely free-2-play game. No more subscriptions. The game is now totally supported through In-App Purchases.

Listen up!

IN ONE MONTH:

1. The user base grew by 6% PER DAY.

2. More than 85% of daily log-ins were returning players.

3. They had a 700% increase in daily revenues.

ALL IN ONE MONTH. This was just last October. Just two months ago.

Okay, enough about DC Universe Online.

Originally, Turbine's Lord of The Rings Online cost $40 to buy and of course was subscription at first. Last year, when they converted to free-2-play, their revenue tripled.

More info about Zynga!

Zynga has 60 million active players everyday. Which is more than the next 14 game developers combined. These players interact with each other 416 million times a day. You're right about their dependence on Facebook. In fact that is a small part of why the IPO didn't exactly sizzle.

Their Texas HoldEm poker game only has 30 million players a month. It's most popular game, CityVille, attracts 51 million users a month. Farmville, is a close second. Just some of their other games are Mafia Wars 2, CastleVille and Empires & Allies.

They are using Facebook to build peer pressure to mulitply social pressure well beyond what occurs in the physical world. Zynga games are fun, and they are more fun when played with and completing against your friends. As I said above, 60 million people interact with each other 416 million times every day.

Zynga works hard to get friends to join each other in-game by giving social awards for joining up. It's been fine-tuning this balance since the company launched.
This is Zynga's marketing engine. The customers, even the one's who don't pay, are emissaries. It is this social interaction that earns them $820 million last year.

The fact is Zynga's games are EXTREMELY socially interactive. The only reason they made $820 million dollars last year is because of an INTENSIVE FOCUS on social interaction.

One of the reasons these games are so successful is that they help people do something they are already keen on: keeping up with their friends online. In CityVille, for example, there are incentives for players to help with the running of other cities managed by their friends.

Zynga's IPO was the largest US internet company since Google's (in I believe 2004). Google raised 1.7 billion, Zynga raised. 1 billion with its IPO.

Zynga is profitable unlike other Web outfits like Groupon.

Forbes and business analysts after the IPO said that "It's [Zynga's business strategy] is absolutely the right way to run an online game business". "Zynga will do well with its new cash war chest. And we will see an explosion of businesses built in the cloud". "There is change afoot, exciting times coming and money to be made. Thanks, Zynga"

(BTW, I made a shorter version of this post, and I was gonna post it behind a spoiler tag, but I wasn't sure if it would work cuz I'm on the app. And, if it didn't work then this post would have been even longer.)

The future of gaming is:

Mobile
Free-to-play
Social (e.g. Facebook)
Cloud (thin-client)

There will be some console gaming, but not anything like we know.

Honestly, STS is not doing anything that the almost the entire gaming industry isn't doing. The future is really free-to-play.

[drewcapu]

How many of their games can you actually chat with someone (besides hold'em and yoville)? FarmVille, no. Mafia Wars, no. Haven't played much of any of their other games (they once had an app that was a Risk knock-off which had chatting, but they've abandoned it). Clicking on a link on a wall post or notification that a friend has given to you isn't social interaction, it's basically like clicking on an ad or spam.

For me, chatting is a big part of gaming. It's what keeps me coming back. For me, SubSpace/Continuum and other games developed by JeffP (Infantry/Cosmic Rift) had awesome chat functions. Rodvik even posted about it:
*Suggestion* Password Protected Private Chat Channels (http://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?41757-*Suggestion*-Password-Protected-Private-Chat-Channels)

But back to Gauntlets...

This will spawn a new kind of guild. Basically, guilds that farm gauntlets. But, it will only be a success if the farmers get enough good pinks to offset their plat usage. For those with bottomless plat, that won't be an issue. These will be the new uber-merchants. But if they merch improperly they'll end up hurting themselves by driving down prices, especially for end game gear.

But hey, I'm all for seeing crafted longbows at 300k!

[Samhayne]

Hey guys, there are some remaining things that the team wants to change, so this patch is sliding out a day to Tuesday, Jan 10th

[JaytB]

Hey guys, there are some remaining things that the team wants to change, so this patch is sliding out a day to Tuesday, Jan 10th

Thx for the heads-up :)

[Snakespeare]

In general this concept eludes me... If I used to have to pay for extra cheese at Subway and beginning today the extra cheese is free, can I really ask Subway to refund all my previous extra cheese purchases? I think they would laugh at me.

[Engelhard]

So it looks like we will have snow in Texas and in Alterra for one more day <(^_^)>v That being said I guess I will hunt for another snow gun before its to late

[Luchta]

Snake, I have not tried that because I avoid eating dairy. But good point. LOL!

[Jugernugett]

Looking forward to that 1 vs 1 map :Dumm.. 1v1?? It'll be cool to have another map but.... Taking time to make it is useless. That's why their are locks for other maps. I see no point to making 1v1.

[Nick41324]

Tuesday? *goes to cry in a corner*

[maneatingtree]

*joins nick in corner and cries to*

[JaytB]

umm.. 1v1?? It'll be cool to have another map but.... Taking time to make it is useless. That's why their are locks for other maps. I see no point to making 1v1.

If they implement it as has been suggested (immediate respawn and full health/mana after each kill), I definitely see a LOT of use for it. No more waiting endlessly (low level PvP) until your health and/or mana is regenerated.. Doesn't that sound like a win to you?

[FluffNStuff]

In general this concept eludes me... If I used to have to pay for extra cheese at Subway and beginning today the extra cheese is free, can I really ask Subway to refund all my previous extra cheese purchases? I think they would laugh at me.

But what if they came up to your table after you bought a sub and told you there was now going to be a per bite charge to eat it?

Any way, to the people trying to compare this move to zynga or wow or xbox live, well none of them have a pay each use model. If you want something to compare, you need to go back about ten years, because STS is trying to turn your device into a coin arcade.

[maneatingtree]

Whats a coin arcade? Sounds so prmitive. Lol jk those words will be said in 10 years when they have cyber technology! Maybe compare it to food (second best subject in the world) its per can of coke like say a buck. But you could just stay home and drink water right? Thats more accurate than the pay per bite thing i think.

[Snakespeare]

Fluff, your take on my question misses the point. Nobody in Subway is going to walk up to me and make me pay-per-bite. I'm talking about EXTRA cheese. Starbucks charges for an extra shot. If they decided that three shots is now standard, you seriously can not expect them to reimburse you for all the add shots you paid for.

My device already IS a coin-op machine, practically. That's how Steve Jobs made it. I can get music, videos, and games for money on my device. I pay to use it. If I want more data, I pay for that, too. If I didn't have the unlimited text option it would cost the equivalent of 1 plat per text message, even.

STS made PL for profit. It was free but we paid for higher levels. Then we paid for bonus areas. Then we paid for hats. Some people said they'd never buy a hat. Now everyone has hats. You were there, and you know what I mean. What fool would turn this down? If they'll pay for hats, make more. If they'll pay for vanities, make more vanities. Then they had the Cinco Loco event and all elixirs went plat but the main spine went free. Someone asked, what is the best way to get the most money yet increase the player base? That was the answer and it worked. More people played AND more people spent plat! Well, you'd have to be a died-in-the-wool commie like me not to milk that for all it's worth.

But you can't milk a dead cow, so I am sure the main spine will always be free. (Unless they change their paradigm completely.)

And as for pay-to-play in boss brawls, well... I am still hoping that leads to the boss brawls getting deleted to make room for better content.

[Aikiebo]

But what if they came up to your table after you bought a sub and told you there was now going to be a per bite charge to eat it?

Any way, to the people trying to compare this move to zynga or wow or xbox live, well none of them have a pay each use model. If you want something to compare, you need to go back about ten years, because STS is trying to turn your device into a coin arcade.

There is no subscription plan to eat at Subway. Subway sells sandwhiches one sandwhich at a time. This is a business model that has been used for centuries and will continue to be used.

We buy one sandwhich at a time. Likewise, we now get to buy one OPTIONAL boss gauntlet in hopes to get a better chance at pinks.

If someone wanted to get ridic and suggest that this is like Subway selling one bite at a time. The equal analogy to that would be a video game suggesting a charge per every minion/trash mob killed.

There are 20 minions to a boss like 20 bites to a sandwhich.

But, there is no subscription to Subway saying that you can go there as many times as you want for one flat fee. It doesn't work that way. Why? Because it wouldn't work that way.

Zynga made $829 million dollars in nine months in 2010. ALMOST ALL OF IT was from in-app purchases.
This is why virutually the whole video game industry is moving to free-to-play.

Zynga's FarmVille, millions are buying crops, seed, farming equipment, repairs, fertilizers, etc. Zinga's CityVille has tons of things to buy for a player's city.

WoW is now a free-to-play/pay-to-play hybrid. Most analysts believe they are going to vastly expand their free-to-play options. WoW has in-game purchases and apparently real money trading.

And the only comparison to x-box that I was making was to say that the console market is hurting and hurting bad. Because most gamers just flat out don't want to pay a subscription for anything.

As far as the coin-op things goes. It's hysterical that you brought it up. Cause actually, that is exactly the buzz going around the industry. Developers realize that we all got a lot to learn from coin-op.

The only reason why more people aren't playing pinball machines is:

The future is:

Free-to-play
Digital
Social (e.g. Facebook)
Cloud (thin-client)

[Aikiebo]

How many of their games can you actually chat with someone

For me, chatting is a big part of gaming. It's what keeps me coming back.

Drewcapu, I'm really, really not trying to say that Zynga's games are great. I'm just using Zynga as an example of how and why the industry is moving in the direction they are.

I was schooled as a youngin not to bash other people's game choices. Just cause I play Game A, doesn't mean there is anything "wrong" with Games B - Z.

So, I am not saying there is anything wrong with their games, but as far as I can tell, they wouldn't exactly interest me a lot.

The gaming industry is moving at rocket speed towards free-to-play because it's hard to argue with:

Just Zynga:

$820 million dollars in nine months

60 million players a day, EVERYDAY

416 million interactions 'tween those players EVERYDAY.

Other Game:

6% increase in the user base EVERYDAY

85% of logins = returning players EVERYDAY

700% increase in daily revenues EVERYDAY

[StompArtist]

@ Aikiebo: What's your take on this http://www.onlive.com/ ?


Also: The gaming industry is constantly reinventing itself. Zynga was a pioneer (not the first but the first truly successful) in it's genre. No.2 never gets the prize. The key is to find the next big thing not to be a happy 2nd.

[Mothwing]

In still on the fence with this one. Either way PL will still be my favorite game :)

[drewcapu]

I don't bash Zynga (much). I know a couple people who work for Zynga, one of whom I actually encouraged to do so while Zynga was still "young".

STS is already on the right track as they are doing something even Zynga doesn't do which is mass appeal on multiple platforms on a standalone basis (ie, not riding on the coattails of facebook). And now with PL/SL on Chrome, they've shown they can get their games to work beautifully on browsers.

All I'm saying is that:
A) Zynga apps aren't truly very social anymore. It's glorified spamming. Even spammers bow down to Zynga
B) If STS finds a way to integrate into facebook, watch out (and I mean Zynga watch out).

Facebook is the obvious next step for STS (even getting 10 friends to "help" on daily quests for gold/credits shouldn't be that complicated for STS devs). But it has its definite dangers. If they decide to go that route, they'd have to defend against a lot of people who come up with exploits and hacks.

[Appleisaac]

I thought we were going to get it today... Eh o well :)

[Appleisaac]

I don't bash Zynga (much). I know a couple people who work for Zynga, one of whom I actually encouraged to do so while Zynga was still "young".

STS is already on the right track as they are doing something even Zynga doesn't do which is mass appeal on multiple platforms on a standalone basis (ie, not riding on the coattails of facebook). And now with PL/SL on Chrome, they've shown they can get their games to work beautifully on browsers.

All I'm saying is that:
A) Zynga apps aren't truly very social anymore. It's glorified spamming. Even spammers bow down to Zynga
B) If STS finds a way to integrate into facebook, watch out (and I mean Zynga watch out).

Facebook is the obvious next step for STS (even getting 10 friends to "help" on daily quests for gold/credits shouldn't be that complicated for STS devs). But it has its definite dangers. If they decide to go that route, they'd have to defend against a lot of people who come up with exploits and hacks.

Sorry for double post, and this might seem selfish, but I'm not sure I would want all of Facebook on pl :( im not sure that would be good for community... Eh it probably won't happen (at least for a while) anyway.

[zappaxe]

[QUOTE=Samhayne] We are human afterall.[/QUOTE
:O

[Aikiebo]

@ Aikiebo: What's your take on this http://www.onlive.com/ ?


Also: The gaming industry is constantly reinventing itself.

The key is to find the next big thing not to be a happy 2nd.

Omg! You are so right. The key is finding the next big thing:

Next big thing = free-to-play.

Next big thing = mobile

Next big thing = cloud/thin client (e.g onlive/gaikai/valve's steam)

Next big thing = social (e.g. Facebook)

Yes, it is reinventing itself right now. That is why consoles are taking a hit. As I have said, a gazillion times is in this thread and other threads, yes, the gaming industry is in upheaval and is changing almost COMPLETELY to the four things above.

I am writing more about this stuff as I can.

[Aikiebo]

All I'm saying is that:

A) Zynga apps aren't truly very social anymore. It's glorified spamming. Even spammers bow down to Zynga

Drewcapu, hmm... Drewcapu. You are missing my point. You are saying that Zynga's game are not "truely social" that they are glorified spam.

I am saying, that that, has nothing to do with my point about Zynga.

In a way, I don't care if their games are truely social or not. I am only using Zynga as one of many examples of:

;;;; drum roll ;;;;

;;;; cymbols slam together ;;;;

;;;; gong bangs;;;;

;;;; birds stop singing ;;;;

;;;; fish stop swimming ;;;;

The main, most important reason why virtually the entire gaming industry is changing to FREE-2-PLAY.

Zynga is just one of dozens examples of why virtualy the entire gaming industry is changing to FREE-2-PLAY.

I am bringing this stuff up so that people can see why STS is doing the things that they do.

I don't have a lot of interest in Zynga. I am not saying they are good or bad. I am saying, that they know why FREE-2-PLAY is basically the only way to go for almost every game.

You say, they aren't very social. That it's all basically a bunch of spam, is that what you mean? (If not, I apologize)

I don't know about that.

60 million people are playing Zynga games every day.
They are interacting with each other 416 million times every day.

What on earth makes you think that you know what these 60 million people are doing?

60 million people are having a lot of fun 416 million times a day. Something got to be good somewhere!

The stuff about Zynga in my first two posts in this thread comes from the big wigs, the brainiacs, the major players of the financial world. I didn't make it up.

So, maybe you're right, maybe not. Maybe these 416 MILLION interactions EVERYDAY is nothing more than spam. Not too many others seems to think so. But, hey, maybe so.

But, it has nothing to do with what I am talking about. It is a separate subject. Completely irrelevant to what I am saying.

I am just saying, Zynga is one of MANY examples of why free-2-play is:

;;;; drum roll ;;;;

;;;; cymbols slam together ;;;;

;;;; gong bangs ;;;;

;;;; birds stop singing ;;;;

;;;; fish stop swimming ;;;;

The next BIG THING!!!!!

[Luchta]

The next big thing would probably be PL and SL in one game. I mean seriously, that's how it's going to be. All these free stuff and paid for stuff will be in that one game and we're all going to chant our own mantras while we wait for pink loots.

[roufus]

Your fb games and all that might be a big hit but you looking at the wrong age group id never give my son a credit card for that junk we were all lured into pl and sl and as they progressed more content became free and more people came and they progressed further no they have lots of people and are starting to nickle and dime people making it really annoying yes u say free to play but what's the point if u don't accomplish anything without having to buy plat you lvl at a crawl you can't make any money cause junking items doesn't add up at all and all the plat players will have already flooded the market with pinks so there foes making money to afford a recipe to get custom gear you'd get booted from games for having low gear or low lvl cause your still trying to lvl to where you can get the decent gear normal runs in general will go down cause plat users will elixer to cap then move to pay per play your farming time will be cut cause you wont have to do as many runs anymore either so that's less time you have to play then you just sit there capped and fully geared with nothing more to do I do think that plat gear should be separate from main spine gear why not just use the plat gear for the pay to play instances that way u have something extra to go after your already have an edge using plat to get pinks if you get the pinks faster how much longer after that are u gonna play I mean most of y'all cap out on gear and lvl then start complaining about when will new lvls come out how about giving them pay to play quests and expand the story line a bit im pretty sure most of y'all know nothing about the story line

[Plaguemaw]

Any clue what time this thing is expected today?

[StompArtist]

Omg! You are so right. The key is finding the next big thing:

Next big thing = free-to-play.

Next big thing = mobile

Next big thing = cloud/thin client (e.g onlive/gaikai/valve's steam)

Next big thing = social (e.g. Facebook)

Yes, it is reinventing itself right now. That is why consoles are taking a hit. As I have said, a gazillion times is in this thread and other threads, yes, the gaming industry is in upheaval and is changing almost COMPLETELY to the four things above.

I am writing more about this stuff as I can.


I do believe that in your apparent eagerness you are failing to see the following points:

- None of these are the "next big thing", they are all existing and successful models.
- Zynga and social "app" companies are tapping into a previously unexploited user base with games that are usable by anyone on extremely low end devices and strive to attract an older age group which was previously almost absent from the gaming scene. Everyone, even my mum plays or has at least checked out Farmville. Not everyone plays and even considers checking out Mass Effect on the Xbox. Entirely different business model targeted at entirely different groups.
- Consoles sales are going down simply because the market is saturated and the fact that no new console has been released in almost 10 years.

What's the next big thing? If I had to put my money on something it would be TVs with Onlive and Netflix capabilities built in, but again that's still not the "next big thing". The next big thing will have to entirely bridge the gaps between simple low end everyone can use it type applications (which Zynga currently dominates) and high end PC gaming applications which are currently limited by hardware growth and processor speeds.

I say holograms... But hey, what do I know?

[Aikiebo]

but what's the point if u don't accomplish anything without having to buy plat you lvl at a crawl

It is so funny, but just a few short months ago (a few people still think this way), the majority of the players on this forum would go on endlessly, waxing poetic about how using elixrs 'ruin the experience', 'take your time', 'take it nice and slow', 'got to go slow, real slow, otherwise you're not smart enough to learn your class', 'the game was meant to be played slowly', 'you should play the game the way it was meant to be played'.

OMG, lol lol lol, none of those things are even accurate. But, people went on and on and on for months constantly hating on elixrs, hating on all kinds of stuff. Years and years ago, people used to call people who played games this way - the 'slowbies'. I used to hate that, cuz it was being used as a high insult. There is no reaason to resort to insults. Frankly, if someone wants to take forever to level, or if it takes them longer than other players to learn how to play, there is no reason to ridicule them.

Then last fall STS gives us a bit of time with reduced xp. Almost everyone thought it was great. Then it was announced that the xp requirements to level was gonna be permanent. OMG, one of the most exciting STS announcements ever. Almost everyone who posted loved that.

I can't believe the number of posts I have read since where people are actually critisizing STS for not telling us in advance in that the change was going to be permanent. This is one of the most ridic things I have heard. In this thread someone went so far as to suggest that STS has 'duped us', lol. NO, we have never been duped by STS.

1. They are not OBLIGATED to tell us anything.

2. But, the more open communication is the better for the players and the better for STS.

3. They probably didn't know it was going to be permanent until they ran a test to see if they players were interested and liked the idea.

4. Once, they ran the test, they saw that players loved it, then announced that it was gonna be permanent.

-------------------

This in fact disproves another farce that some players like to say, that supposedly STS doesn't listen to it's players. Obviously, they listen.

1. They came up with an idea to reduce xp requirement.

2. Instead of just instituting it before finding out if players were going to like it, they ran a test.

3. They found out that players love it.

4. They made it permanent.

If they were just using elixirs to be greedy, they wouldn't have reduced the amount of xp to level. They did this to balance out the needs of those who pay and those who don't. Once again, proving how STS thinks ALL their players are valuable.

Also, you can get to cap in about 1/10th time time for many other traditional MMOs. And, I mean w/out elixirs.

People have the nerve to call STS greedy. Saying that elixrs are just a way for STS to make money. STS reduced the xp requirements for ALL players. F2p games, like ours, really want all people to play even if some are not spending very much money.

So, we have a game that originally didn't take that long to level and then to make it even more fun for folks, they reduce the xp needed by a very large amount. You don't need to use elixrs to level to cap. NO ONE does.*** But:

1. I have said like 1,000 times, that elixrs are brilliant idea

2. Because they make the game 1,000 times more fun.

3. For 1,000's and 1,000's and 1,000's and 1,000 players.

4. This means 1000's of players are attracted to the game who wouldn't have been otherwise.

5. This means that 1,000's stick with the game who otherwise wouldn't.

Now, (and during rage fest '11) people are complaining that "it takes forever" to level without elixirs. They are trying to say that this proves that STS is being greedy. NO, duh no, no way, uh uhh, heck no! Plain flat no, NO, that is negatory in at least three languages.

No

Elixirs are brilliant because they make the game more fun. Most people don't want to take forever to level. Most people are not half brain-dead so it doesn't take forever to learn how to play. So, a person is very smart if they use elixirs. HOWEVER, if you don't want to, or if you 'can't' buy plat, you can still have a ton of fun and level faster than most games all the way to cap.

A company wants to make their product as attractive and enticing as possible. When you walk past a bakery case, you don't see a bunch of cakes with nothing but plain, white frosting. You see the cakes all decorated. They are tying to entice you to buy - not repulse you with boring.

So, one of STS's main products is elixirs. They are going to make the idea of using elixirs as attractive and enticing as possible. YOU WOULD TOO if you worked for a video game company. So, yeah, as I have said 1,000 times using elixirs is more fun, but in no way is it 'necessary' to have fun and play the entire game.

It cracks me up when I see people say they are being 'forced' to buy plat.

No


*** The one exception might be for the players who sadly only have a tiny few hours a week to play. I am sorry for those. I wish that people had more time to play. Shoot! I wish I had more time to play.

In three months, any player who has at least 10 hours a week can get thru the 5 levels then to cap with out using elixirs. Frankly, it shouldn't take most that long.

But, a game company can't say, "ok, we'll wait for those few who only got 4 hours a week". It's got to plan its game around the majority of players. I'm sorry for that, but it really can't be helped.

[Snakespeare]

Your fb games and all that might be a big hit but you looking at the wrong age group id never give my son a credit card for that junk we were all lured into pl and sl and as they progressed more content became free and more people came and they progressed further no they have lots of people and are starting to nickle and dime people making it really annoying yes u say free to play but what's the point if u don't accomplish anything without having to buy plat you lvl at a crawl you can't make any money cause junking items doesn't add up at all and all the plat players will have already flooded the market with pinks so there foes making money to afford a recipe to get custom gear you'd get booted from games for having low gear or low lvl cause your still trying to lvl to where you can get the decent gear normal runs in general will go down cause plat users will elixer to cap then move to pay per play your farming time will be cut cause you wont have to do as many runs anymore either so that's less time you have to play then you just sit there capped and fully geared with nothing more to do I do think that plat gear should be separate from main spine gear why not just use the plat gear for the pay to play instances that way u have something extra to go after your already have an edge using plat to get pinks if you get the pinks faster how much longer after that are u gonna play I mean most of y'all cap out on gear and lvl then start complaining about when will new lvls come out how about giving them pay to play quests and expand the story line a bit im pretty sure most of y'all know nothing about the story line

That's the whole post but I will respond to specific phrases, ok?


yes u say free to play but what's the point if u don't accomplish anything without having to buy plat

This is a classic exaggeration. There are many young players who have never bought plat who have elite items because they reached elite cap. They also spend a lot of time in PvP because they have run out of other things to do.

Here is your list of the reasons why you can't accomplish anything without plat:


you lvl at a crawl
you can't make any money cause junking items doesn't add up at all
all the plat players ... have already flooded the market with pinks
you'd get booted from games for having low gear or low lvl
They changed the xp required to about 1/2 or 1/3rd of what it used to be. Personally I am grateful for that. You get 170 or 200 gp per item in Fang just for the oranges. A flooded market means lower prices, so if it really is flooded you should be able to buy the pinks. People boot for many reasons, but if it is because of low gear, visit the CS. There's no shame in wearing greens.

Here is your list of things that could go wrong:

normal runs in general will go down cause plat users will elixer to cap
then move to pay per play your farming time will be cut cause you wont have to do as many runs anymore
then you just sit there capped and fully geared with nothing more to do
if you get the pinks faster how much longer after that are u gonna play
most of y'all cap out on gear and lvl then start complaining about when will new lvls come out
The problem here is, the topic. We are discussing the pay-to-play Boss Brawls idea. It doesn't really have anything to do with XP elixirs. But if your point is that those who rush to level cap will not have anything to do because they are kids and they can't afford to pay-to-play in the boss brawls, then don't worry. Those kids will just play another game.

Here are your suggestions:

plat gear should be separate from main spine gear
why not just use the plat gear for the pay to play instances
how about giving them pay to play quests
Well, plat gear is worse than the gear that drops, by design, so it won't motivate anyone to farm.

Anyhow, you had quite a few interesting points there, but I think most people enjoy it more when you use punctuation. That way they can see each idea and think about it before moving on. I, on the other hand, read poetry a lot and I'm used to this ee cummings style. ;)

[Snakespeare]

@Aikiebo

Most of what you say is, in my experience, true. Your style is entertaining, too, in small doses.

But some people WANT to play a game the hardcore way, assuaging the benefits of elixirs. Good for them! I think it's an excessive characterization to say they are "hating on" elixirs. They are simply purists. And the purists in any game have always existed. Of course the problem with purists is they frequently forget where their responsibility for themselves ends and their responsibility for others begins. It can happen that a purist lashes out at non-purists for diluting his experience, but this sort of pattern happens a lot in their lives and they eventually accept the dirty truth, that most people are not as pure as them. But I wouldn't take the whole community to task for the things a few purists have said in the heat of passion.

I think this game does benefit from the purists. They "keep us honest". While I might feel a sense of accomplishment from reaching 65, even though I used a few 4x pots, whenever a purist gets there, I have to acknowledge their accomplishment is greater than mine.

I have advocated a special insignia for the truly hardcore. I made it in suggestions a few times. I was saying that, when they get their first death, they then get to choose to play on as a regular character or delete and remake. Perhaps a similar insignia could exist for the purists. As long as they never sip a single elixir, the badge would be on their avatar page. Even the free daily would blow the insignia away forever. I'd love to see a level 66 player with this honor.

Anyhow, like I say, I mostly agree with you. Just... the purists are part of the game and I like them. I'm proud of them. Guess I went off on a tangent...

[edit] Oh! I remember my point now, LOL! They are a minority. I don't think they speak for us all.

[Luchta]

I remember when the global cool time was announced and it made everyone furious. Before the GCD, the sewers were ran in less than a couple of minutes before the XP elixirs ran out. STS, understood the need to tweak what they think would benefit the players and themselves. Some of the new players didn't even know what multi touching was all about. I just ran across a players with 3 level 66 characters.

My point being is that let's give it a try. The way I understand it (correct me if I'm wrong Sam) that these new dungeons will have slightly weaker bosses with the same loot table. It sounds no different than running a level with all players having 2x/3x combo elixirs. So in other words, there's still no guarantee that you'll get a pink each run since the loot table is the same. It's only a faster way to confront bosses like what we used to do in AO3 VL farming those void/cosmos/rift pinks. To me, it's more like buying elixirs with plat to kill bosses.

[Imsebastiaanl]

Question to samhayne: some people say lvl cap is in januari, some people say febuari. I trained 27k xp, in the privious lvl cap 21. Never have enough time for max lvl. I guess you can do nothing to this, but its a bit annoying for me because people in pvp almost always have those bonusses. Just wanted to say, maybe for next lvl cap I dont know.
Gratz with finishing 1 v 1 map!!!
-sebastiaanl

[Aikiebo]

@Aikiebo

1. But some people WANT to play a game the hardcore way, assuaging the benefits of elixirs. Good for them!

2. I think it's an excessive characterization to say they are "hating on" elixirs.

3. But I wouldn't take the whole community to task for the things a few purists have said in the heat of passion.

4. have to acknowledge their accomplishment is greater than mine.

5. As long as they never sip a single elixir, the badge would be on their avatar page. Even the free daily would blow the insignia away forever. I'd love to see a level 66 player with this honor.

6. Anyhow, like I say, I mostly agree with you. Just... the purists are part of the game and I like them. I'm proud of them. Guess I went off on a tangent...

7. [edit] Oh! I remember my point now, LOL! They are a minority. I don't think they speak for us all.

Hey!

1. Yes, anyone who wants to play without elixirs should be encouraged to do so. If I was in a group and someone was booted for not using elixirs, I would leave after telling the host why I left, then I would try to find the booted player and group with them. I would encourage them to host their own games so they don't have to deal with that sort of donkey, lol. (The same holds true for the reverse situ.)

2. Now, c'mon! Lol, Not to long ago, in the Dark Ages i.e. the days before Vinny the Merchant, I was about the only one who commented more than one time about the sheer brilliance (hehe) of elixirs. For the few that agreed, they were usually shunned, lol. Well, I was too, but I persisted, lol. But, I think anyone who was around then remembers the ridic threads and comments about our poor, sweet, misunderstood and maligned little Vinny, lol. And even before Vinny, very few kinds words for elixirs and very many harsh ones, lol.

3. In the post you are quoting, I am just talking about elixirs cuz a few in this thread and during rage fest complained about how 'it takes forever to level' if you don't use elixirs. And somehow saying this suppossedly proves that STS is greedy. No.

So, I was just doing a compare and contrast kinda thing. Technically, elixirs are off topic for this thread. Other than to say stuff like, these new boss gauntlets are optional just like elixirs are, etc.

So, when I brought up the Dark Ages, I wasn't really trying to address that, the only people I was talking to (not trying to take anyone to task, just responding) were the one's complaining today about how they feel 'forced' to buy plat or 'can't have fun' if they don't. It was just a compare/contrast dealio.

4. I see what you mean, but, it's not so much greater as it is totally different. Looonnnggg time ago, in my very first conversation with Whirlzap, I said that I have huge respect for those that level up Old School, with no acceleration. That is how I did it so many times in games with way, way, way longer clilmbs than this one. However, 'greater' is in the eye of the beholder. Some people think it is 'greater' to level smart rather than slow. But, yeah, I know what you mean.

5. Until VERY recently, like the last two weeks, I would have totally agreed with you. Imo, there is no shame in using some acceleration or doing it Old School. Either way is great. And, yeah, I see how some sort of way to tell the difference would be important. And I used to advocate that totally.

But, I have learned, that in the last six months or so, gaming industry leaders and analysts have had reason to believe that would slow down sales of xp accelerators. If so, then, unfortunately, it may not be a good idea. For me, personally, I would have no problem with that at all. But, it might be a bit counter productive.

6. I agree totally. And don't worry about a tangent, not really was one.

7. Agree totally. And you are right when you say everyone is important.

@ StompArtist, I am getting to your questions as soon as I can. Sorry.

[Fncrazy]

Dude u got some long post.

[Apocolypze]

[QUOTE=Samhayne] We are human afterall.[/QUOTE
:O
Daft Punk? :D

[plmafiaboss]

Can u have this argument some other time I Gots a question. What time is update xD

[Jugernugett]

@Aikiebo

1. But some people WANT to play a game the hardcore way, assuaging the benefits of elixirs. Good for them!

2. I think it's an excessive characterization to say they are "hating on" elixirs.

3. But I wouldn't take the whole community to task for the things a few purists have said in the heat of passion.

4. have to acknowledge their accomplishment is greater than mine.

5. As long as they never sip a single elixir, the badge would be on their avatar page. Even the free daily would blow the insignia away forever. I'd love to see a level 66 player with this honor.

6. Anyhow, like I say, I mostly agree with you. Just... the purists are part of the game and I like them. I'm proud of them. Guess I went off on a tangent...

7. [edit] Oh! I remember my point now, LOL! They are a minority. I don't think they speak for us all.

Hey!

1. Yes, anyone who wants to play without elixirs should be encouraged to do so. If I was in a group and someone was booted for not using elixirs, I would leave after telling the host why I left, then I would try to find the booted player and group with them. I would encourage them to host their own games so they don't have to deal with that sort of donkey, lol. (The same holds true for the reverse situ.)

2. Now, c'mon! Lol, Not to long ago, in the Dark Ages i.e. the days before Vinny the Merchant, I was about the only one who commented more than one time about the sheer brilliance (hehe) of elixirs. For the few that agreed, they were usually shunned, lol. Well, I was too, but I persisted, lol. But, I think anyone who was around then remembers the ridic threads and comments about our poor, sweet, misunderstood and maligned little Vinny, lol. And even before Vinny, very few kinds words for elixirs and very many harsh ones, lol.

3. In the post you are quoting, I am just talking about elixirs cuz a few in this thread and during rage fest complained about how 'it takes forever to level' if you don't use elixirs. And somehow saying this suppossedly proves that STS is greedy. No.

So, I was just doing a compare and contrast kinda thing. Technically, elixirs are off topic for this thread. Other than to say stuff like, these new boss gauntlets are optional just like elixirs are, etc.

So, when I brought up the Dark Ages, I wasn't really trying to address that, the only people I was talking to (not trying to take anyone to task, just responding) were the one's complaining today about how they feel 'forced' to buy plat or 'can't have fun' if they don't. It was just a compare/contrast dealio.

4. I see what you mean, but, it's not so much greater as it is totally different. Looonnnggg time ago, in my very first conversation with Whirlzap, I said that I have huge respect for those that level up Old School, with no acceleration. That is how I did it so many times in games with way, way, way longer clilmbs than this one. However, 'greater' is in the eye of the beholder. Some people think it is 'greater' to level smart rather than slow. But, yeah, I know what you mean.

5. Until VERY recently, like the last two weeks, I would have totally agreed with you. Imo, there is no shame in using some acceleration or doing it Old School. Either way is great. And, yeah, I see how some sort of way to tell the difference would be important. And I used to advocate that totally.

But, I have learned, that in the last six months or so, gaming industry leaders and analysts have had reason to believe that would slow down sales of xp accelerators. If so, then, unfortunately, it may not be a good idea. For me, personally, I would have no problem with that at all. But, it might be a bit counter productive.

6. I agree totally. And don't worry about a tangent, not really was one.

7. Agree totally. And you are right when you say everyone is important.

@ StompArtist, I am getting to your questions as soon as I can. Sorry.u expect me to read this?????

[Imacoolbirdd]

O.O what time is the update?

[Mothwing]

The next big thing would probably be PL and SL in one game. I mean seriously, that's how it's going to be. All these free stuff and paid for stuff will be in that one game and we're all going to chant our own mantras while we wait for pink loots.

Not very likely. Pl and Sl are two different franchises bringing in more money for STS (which i have no problem with)

[Snakespeare]

5. Until VERY recently, like the last two weeks, I would have totally agreed with you. Imo, there is no shame in using some acceleration or doing it Old School. Either way is great. And, yeah, I see how some sort of way to tell the difference would be important. And I used to advocate that totally.

But, I have learned, that in the last six months or so, gaming industry leaders and analysts have had reason to believe that would slow down sales of xp accelerators. If so, then, unfortunately, it may not be a good idea. For me, personally, I would have no problem with that at all. But, it might be a bit counter productive.


Just curious if you have a source on that, even though it's conjecture. Were they quoted in a gaming magazine?

I think if anyone was hardcore enough to turn down the "free daily" all the way to level 66, it would be incredibly rare. I wonder if anyone reading this has NEVER taken the free daily on any of their toons. I doubt it.

[StompArtist]

Just curious if you have a source on that, even though it's conjecture. Were they quoted in a gaming magazine?

Appeal to authority is all...

[TANKKAAR]

I'm just wondering if the title to this thread is going to be changed again to Wednesday, or of we will actually be seeing an update today?

[Swimmingstar]

Same.

[Samhayne]

I'm just wondering if the title to this thread is going to be changed again to Wednesday, or of we will actually be seeing an update today?

As this my friends is why we generally do not quote specific dates. Another issue with a behind the scenes change is holding up the patch. Wednesday (or after) it is.

[Swimmingstar]

Ok, cool! Can't wait for the 1v1 pvp map.

[Jugernugett]

When's update? Lol

[Imsebastiaanl]

As this my friends is why we generally do not quote specific dates. Another issue with a behind the scenes change is holding up the patch. Wednesday (or after) it is.
Can you please read my post? :)

[Samhayne]

Level cap raise is still a bit further out. Happy leveling.

[MightyMicah]

Well Sam, thanks for at least giving us an estimate, I like that better than just.........SURPRISE! Lol I appreciate it. :)

[Snakespeare]

It's a brilliant idea. That's why I like it. It takes away nothing that we were using, and it gets them the Money needed to pay the developers.

[Imsebastiaanl]

Level cap raise is still a bit further out. Happy leveling.
K thx.

[Riccits]

Useless now, but useful for plat. And as much as I am against this, it is a brilliant idea and will be a huge success. Of that I am certain.

yes for next dungeons, if u have ur toon already at elite level and u prefer save time but spend plat to get ur equip this is a good way. should there be more pinks in cs it will lower the horrend prices too, so i kinda like it, not even sure if i ever will use.

[Snakespeare]

I intend to try it about ten times before I decide. Now that I'm L65, I don't need to spend plat on 4x XP pots, and with any luck the drop rate will give me at least one pink over 10 tries. My 4x pot never gave me a single pink. Then I'll decide if I feel it was worth it to me. The pinks that drop are all better than the ones you can buy for plat, so it will beat that, at least.

[springtime]

It seems crazy to charge for premium play. What about kids who can't really get plat In Relation to adults with endless supply of cash. What happened to this game. It used to be really fun. Now pinks rarely drop and you can't really make any money.

Is it so difficult to statistically figure out a good drop rate ratio. Why can't bosses in gauntlets just drop pink on occasion. It all does not make sense anymore....something is off here. You should be motivating us to play instead of charging us for everything.

I also agree with victory lap.. Keep it as is please..it's the only useful map there is.

Developers Please reconsider the direction you are going with this game.

[Samhayne]

Hey Springtime,

I'd like to invite you to re-read my original post:



I want to elaborate on the addition of a new Boss Gauntlet area to Mount Fang. There has always been some confusion with the Boss Gauntlet areas. Players generally expect the bosses drop all of their loot, however they don't in the current Boss Gauntlets. These gauntlets were intended as quick ways for players to hone their skills for the boss. If you want a chance at the full loot, you need to fight in through the full zone to get to the boss and take them down there. The reality is that the current Boss Gauntlets are very rarely played.

After the patch we have planned for Tuesday, the a new Boss Gauntlet will be added to Mount Fang that will be upgraded to give the full loot tables to the bosses. To maintain the rarity of the ep1c lewtz it will use the Premium Access System that was used by the Winter Festival. This gives players an option when farming for loot. They can play for free, as they always have, and do runs of the current zones, fighting in to the boss and taking them down for their loot. Or, you can pay Platinum to access the upgraded Boss Gauntlet and farm there.

In the future, we intend to offer this type of content for all level ranges, from Forest Haven's Boss Gauntlet on up. We will not remove any currently existing Boss Gauntlets, but will instead add new ones for Premium Access.

Spacetime Studios philosophy with premium options is just that – they are optional. All players can play Pocket Legends from level 1 to the elite level cap without paying any real world money. We appreciate and value all of our players, however they choose to play. As always, thank you for your support.

I can well understand your perception. If I was in your shoes, I would undoubtedly feel the same way.

I would also argue that the game is doing fine and a whole lot of people have fun with it everyday. There is a reason that Spacetime Games are played over a million times every week.

[ninjaduck]

YAY thanks Sam :)

[Samhayne]

Looks like I get to eat my hat again. Patch is being held up with a behind the scenes issue. Thanks for your patience.

[13lacklegionz]

So first I would like to say I love pl. I don't rage on forums and im not about to start. Just want to add my two cents. Back when lvl cap was 50 how many of these areas were already purchased will plat? Im just saying alot of us vets have already paid for this lower level and have fought and earned our way to access them. I agree that sts is a company and ur trying to make money to continue to bring us a great and awesome game. Please do again I love pl and the community. Just seems a lil unfair to have to pay for something we all ready paid for. Please don't flame or get carried away with this post just my option. And last thank you Sam and sts for all your hard work and for a great game.
Also Sam or flip let's do some pvp. Yeah im calling ya out lol.......just don't kill us to much lol have a great day!!! :)

You know they can set their characters' stats to whatever they want. Ex: 99999 dmg.

[Whirlzap]

Looks like I get to eat my hat again. Patch is being held up with a behind the scenes issue. Thanks for your patience.

I look forward for the Patch this Month thread name update.
More time=more farming for WF.

[CrimsonTider]

Sam... just remember: "Roll Tide!"

[Appleisaac]

I don't get why people are mad about the new bossgauntlets costing plat. It isn't as bad as the WF because it wasn't like everyone was expecting new gauntlets for flat fee anyway! :) I might try a few out, but I wont be a regular on them! :D thanks for the 1v1 maps too! This will be a great solution to all those 1v1 vs FFA problems in pvp :)

Also didn't samhyne say that they wouldnt be getting rid of any old gauntlets?

[Shellkaz]

Sam, i can understand the reluctance to announce specific dates for updates, but, from my perspective, I'd rather cope with a delay, than to be shocked by an early release, like what happened with Fang.

Also there are wonderful "wiggle words" like expect or anticipate that let us all know that you are hoping to release something on a certain date, but the date is not set in stone.

[shanmarie33]

Sam, i can understand the reluctance to announce specific dates for updates, but, from my perspective, I'd rather cope with a delay, than to be shocked by an early release, like what happened with Fang

Agreed, I think they get that now.



We are human afterall.

[Shastacola]

I wonder if anyone reading this has NEVER taken the free daily on any of their toons. I doubt it.


I can honestly say I have never accepted the free daily on two of my toons. :-) Thats why they are still lvl 12&20 something.

[Xcrucherx]

Nice update!!!
I really hope I get 66 before the new Lvl cap :)

[Snakespeare]

I can honestly say I have never accepted the free daily on two of my toons. :-) Thats why they are still lvl 12&20 something.

I didn't wonder if anyone had any toon that didn't ever use the free daily. I wondered if anyone never took the free daily ever on any toon.

(I have twinks who have not even been played since the free daily started... so I didn't wonder that.)

[drakkvala]

even though im horriable at pvp its still a lot of fun and 1 on 1 will be a lot of fun too lol

[Jugernugett]

Hey same how do I change my forum name?

[OvigorothO]

Sam? Is there a possibility the original foresthaven campaign will be made into a new premium campaign? I rlly wish it could! Make it like five platinum and with it introduce a brand new line up of rare lvl 10 items! But on the other hand might not get good feedback from the players against "recycled content" but i honestly dont have a problem with introducing old concepts

[Jugernugett]

Sam? Is there a possibility the original foresthaven campaign will be made into a new premium campaign? I rlly wish it could! Make it like five platinum and with it introduce a brand new line up of rare lvl 10 items! But on the other hand might not get good feedback from the players against "recycled content" but i honestly dont have a problem with introducing old concepts how will newbies lvl up? They r not gonna know how to get platinum and they wouldn't pay for like 6 lvls>.<

[Aquilasoul]

I want see hhehehe any videos of boss gountlet? :D

[Ebakriki]

:banana: :banana: :banana:

[Swords]

celebrate ur time, come on!! ( dance,dance )