Need. Help. From. Over. 49. Level. Characters. [Archive]

NECROREAPER

02-18-2012, 01:39 PM

Buubuuftw

02-18-2012, 01:52 PM

Don't beg to be power leveled.

The best way to learn and enjoy the game is to get to know your class by playing through it the whole game without power leveling. Learn all it's strengths, weaknesses, and limitations. By doing so, you're better preparing yourself for endgame play where most don't tolerate Inept players and will simply boot. you'll also be able to better play your character and be a greater asset to your team since you'll know when to combo, heal, or beckon/stomp, etc. (depending on your class of course).

In short, you're only selling yourself short by power leveling. It's like if you're with a girl (or boy for some of you guys out there, lol [jk]), and instead of going from first, second, etc. base, you just jump from 1-home. You'll essentially miss most of the fun because you pretty much just skipped over it. So, do yourself a favor and don't go for the home run just yet ;)

Great example! XD

OP: What Necro said is true, not knowing your class well enough isnt tolerated in the higher levels. More than likely your just going to get booted. For example, say your class is a mage. People get extremely ticked off when mges dont know how to heal or revive, trust me. Happened to me once, the mage didnt ever put a single point in revive. So I had to boot because she obviously didnt know her class. I believe this was when I was lvl 58 though, back at Nuri's. So play your class a little, there are times when powerleveling is ok, now isnt.

Aikiebo

02-18-2012, 02:22 PM

Please, send me a friend request and I invite you in my matches so you can help.

Hey, Hazbuz

Power leveling is a really, really great way to level up. If that is what you are asking for, the best way in this to do that is with elixirs. You can get to level 55 in a few hours if you are using 4x combos.

I'm not sure exactly what you have in mind, but if it simply fast leveling, power leveling is fine and the best way in this game is to use elixrs: 4x combo.

If you are not buying plat, try to get some free. Cuz, elixirs are really your best bet.

If you're not using elixirs, the people most likely to want to help is friends or guildies or people who are also power leveling at the same time you are. Of course, if you are working with friends or guildies, you might want to think about getting the xp-anywhere elixir.

You can ask for power leveling on the forums, that is perfectly ok to do. The forums are for everyone who plays Pocket Legends/STS games even if they don't power level or even if they do. So, there is no reason not to ask.

Nobody should beg for anything on the forums. It would be kinda rude. But, no need to worry. You weren't begging. Asking in the way you did is perfectly great.

A lot of people pay for power leveling, but, personally, I don't recommend that at all, but a lot of folks do it.

Some people don't like power leveling. That is their right to feel that way. But, the majority of players really enjoy it. So, if that is what you want to do, that is great.

If you have any other questions ask. But, if you get elixirs, you'll level fast!!

wvhills

02-18-2012, 04:38 PM

adidaman

02-18-2012, 04:45 PM

He's not begging to be power leveled, he's asking for help. To all the forum police- there's a difference between the two.

NECROREAPER

02-18-2012, 04:51 PM

To all forum trolls, I said don't, not STOP.

Aikiebo

02-18-2012, 04:58 PM

He's not begging to be power leveled, he's asking for help. To all the forum police- there's a difference between the two.

Yes, there is a difference.

Also, what people need to understand,

Is that when someone resorts to name calling and bullying, they hurt the game and the forum. It also shows that they have no actual reason, logic, or substance to their point of view. So, they try to intimidate others into thinking like they do.

Power leveling is one of the best ways to level up. It is also one of the best ways to learn how to play the game. Power leveling is HUGELY popular. It is not only permitted: it is encouraged.

I believe that people who are curious or interested in power levelling should hear the pros and cons then make up their own minds.

But, resorting to bullying and name calling hurts the game in many ways. Only one of which, is it can start a lot of flaming on the forum and create hard feelings where there don't need to be and should not be.

If you don't want to power level, don't. Share your opinions, but just cause you don't have facts to back up your opinion, please do not resort to bullying or name calling.

Power leveling is a fantastic and fun way to play. And it is a huge draw to any game.

Be nice.

adidaman

02-18-2012, 04:59 PM

To all who make absolutely no sense, is saying "don't beg" not the same as "stop begging"? You just made yourself look like an idiot bud. And if sticking up for someone makes me a troll, that doesn't seem fair. Pm me next time you have a problem with my posts so I don't have to embarrass you in front of everyone.

Edit- talking to necro, not the guy who just posted above me

Aikiebo

02-18-2012, 05:00 PM

To all forum trolls, I said don't, not STOP.

Necro, I'm sorry, but what do you mean here? And, again, gotta be careful with the 'troll' word. There is no reason to get upset. This is a discussion.

NM, I now see what you mean. But, if you didn't think he was begging, why did you bring it up?, lol.

There is no reason to get upset.

Let's be nice.

adidaman

02-18-2012, 05:11 PM

Anyway, Haz, ignore the haters and add iamdaman. I'll help you (:

NECROREAPER

02-18-2012, 08:50 PM

Necro, I'm sorry, but what do you mean here? And, again, gotta be careful with the 'troll' word. There is no reason to get upset. This is a discussion.

NM, I now see what you mean. But, if you didn't think he was begging, why did you bring it up?, lol.

There is no reason to get upset.

Let's be nice.

Brought it up to save him the trouble of getting flamed later, especially when he's a higher level. Also, people dislike it even more when people come to the forums to ask for leveling, and especially if it's those first character.

Mageprodigy

02-19-2012, 04:07 AM

Aikiebo

02-19-2012, 02:19 PM

The best way to learn and enjoy the game is to get to know your class by playing through it the whole game without power leveling.

You're wrong, Necro, this is not the best way to learn to play the game. Power leveling is much better. It is more fun, a billion times less boring, it brings people to a game and keeps them longer than slow leveling, and they become great players: they've had a better experience.

Most people are not slow-minded. It doesn't take them forever to learn how to do what are really basic moves.

The vast majority of players prefer fast leveling over slow leveling - It is the BEST way to learn how to play the game - and they are very smart to feel that way.

you're only selling yourself short by power leveling.

Again, this is wrong: the oposite is true. People who are lucky enough and/or smart enough to power level have a much better experience.

That is just one reason why virtually every game out has power leveling. Power leveling is one of the biggests money makers for game developers available.

Don't beg to be power leveled.

He wasn't begging. He was asking.

Don't be rude.

Thank you.

Hankomachos

02-19-2012, 02:48 PM

You're wrong, Necro, this is not the best way to learn to play the game. Power leveling is much better. It is more fun, a billion times less boring, it brings people to a game and keeps them longer than slow leveling, and they become great players: they've had a better experience.

Most people are not slow-minded. It doesn't take them forever to learn how to do what are really basic moves.

The vast majority of players prefer fast leveling over slow leveling - It is the BEST way to learn how to play the game - and they are very smart to feel that way.

Again, this is wrong: the oposite is true. People who are lucky enough and/or smart enough to power level have a much better experience.

That is just one reason why virtually every game out has power leveling. Power leveling is one of the biggests money makers for game developers available.

He wasn't begging. He was asking.

Don't be rude.

Thank you.

I really hope you're being sarcastic...lol. No, power leveling- especially if it's your first time- will make you a noob later on. Don't believe me? Explain why bears at end game levels have no idea how to keep (or even understand the definition) of aggro, or crowd control. Explain why mages who are power levelled don't know how to support (heal, buff, rez) at end game levels. I played with a level 65 mage yesterday who didn't revive anyone. Any mage who took their time to learn their class would know that their team comes before them. hence the meaning "support."

I wasn't power levelled when I started playing a bear. I learned my class eventually, on my own. Which is why I'm probably better than most bears who either 4xed to end-game levels, or were power levelled.

To reiterate, power levelling does not make you a more experienced player. Quite the contrary, in fact.

Aikiebo

02-19-2012, 02:52 PM

Brought it up to save him the trouble of getting flamed later

This just cracks me up. If someone spends a huge amount of time going around bossing people around. Acting like they were some kind of mall cop 'enforcing rules' and trying to make others think that their OPINION was more important then everyone else's, wouldn't that make that person really weirdly arrogant?

And then, if that person, when ever he had the wim to do so, tried to make other people feel like they had to follow the rules, but he didn't. I mean, everyone ELSE has to follow the rules, but not our wanna be mall cop!! He can break the rules anytime he wants. Wouldn't that make him a hypocrite?

Power leveling is not only a great idea, it is STRONGLY ENCOURAGED. If someone doesn't like power leveling, they don't get to flame people who do. People who don't like power leveling are in a teany, tiny minority.

Power leveling is encouraged. Flaming is against the rules. No one has the right to flame others. Any good mall cop should know that.

adidaman

02-19-2012, 03:08 PM

@aikiebo- you're my new favorite person. Standing up against the status quo and voicing your opinion no matter what people say is what I'm all about.

Anyway, the point of this whole thing is think before you talk. Why do people act like their opinion is god, and nobody else is allowed to have a contradicting opinion? Is it really any if your business, to the police, whether he is power leveled or leveled on his own? How would it affect you in any way, other than affecting your "everybody must do it the right way" attitudes? Ok I got my point out.

Aikiebo

02-19-2012, 03:13 PM

Also, people dislike it even more when people come to the forums to ask for leveling

Players can and should come to the forums anytime they want when they need help. No one should beg for ANYTHING. But, if someone needs help leveling, they should come here. If someone doesn't want to help, that's fine. But, they shouldn't resort to trolling.*

especially if it's those first character.

It doesn't matter if it is their first character. In fact, power leveling your first character is a great idea. Just like power leveling any other character a player might make is a good idea.

The only people who should be advised not to power level are the ones that are really slow to learn. That they have to repeat the same action over and over and over again, 63,000 times to get to level 55. Because the only way they can learn is by repeating it that many times. But..... even then, if they want to have fun, now that I think about it, power leveling would be a good idea for even them.

Aikiebo

02-19-2012, 03:56 PM

Thanks, adidaman, very kind words.

When people start a yacking about power leveling, everything they say boils down to:

1. Is power leveling a FANTASTIC way to play the game?

2. Does it hurt the game/forum when the tiny minority who don't like power leveling get to insult and TO TRY TO INTIMIDATE others into behaving in a way they aprove of?

The answer to both questions, is of course yes.

But since they are two different issues, that is one reason it can be a bit hard to discuss the subject.

Hankomachos

02-19-2012, 04:28 PM

It doesn't matter if it is their first character. In fact, power leveling your first character is a great idea. Just like power leveling any other character a player might make is a good idea.

I'm intrigued by your logic, aikeibo. Please tell me, how does being power levelled make me a good player? How do I learn skill with a big ol' level 66 plowing through mobs while I gain xp for doing nothing? I'm up for a good discussion. Enlighten me!

On a side note, I didn't learn any good skill until I hit 55. No, I wasn't power levelled, I just couldn't grasp how to play my class well (at the time.) So, if it took me 55 levels to learn my class, how many levels will it take a power levelled level 65 to learn their class and play well?

Aikiebo

02-19-2012, 05:45 PM

I'm up for a good discussion. Enlighten me!

Hey, Hank

Sorry it took you so long to learn to play. If, you had been power leveled, it wouldn't have taken so long.

I'm curious, I can tell by the tone of your threads/blog posts that you consider yourself to be a good player now. But, you said you weren't very good until lev 55. What happened at that point that made you a good player?

And once you learned to beckon and stomp properly, did you have to do that 63,000 times to learn how to do it well. I mean, those first 62,000 times that you tried, you simply failed? Did people call you 'noob'. Yeah, being called 'noob' 62,000 times must be ruff. I'm sorry if they did.

They, no one, has any right to be so judgemental. After all, it takes some folks 63,000 times of doing the same thing over and over again to learn how to do it 'properly'. Doesn't mean they are a noob, just means, that they are unique. Embrace the differences between peeps. DON'T HATE: APPRECIATE!!

So, people who are only level 45 (for example), and who haven't been lucky enough to power level, so.. are you saying they are really lousy, crappy players?

Or for the SL players who were at cap when the cap was 25. They were really lousy, crappy players because it is obvious that you can't get good in SL till level 40 (or w/e cap is for now, I don't play SL, lol)

Or, hmm.. are the current 40s in SL, no matter who they are or how good they think they are, are they really crappy players too? Because, the cap will eventually be raised higher. So, there not any good now. They all have to wait to get good?

Oh, no, wait..... I see what you're saying. We'll maybe I see, maybe I misuderstand. Let's see: Are you trying to say that all people learn at different rates? Some it takes longer. Some do it faster. That it depends on literally dozens of variables.

Are you saying that people learn at different speeds in different ways? That there is no one way to learn for everybody? If so, I'd have to totally agree with you.

Hankomachos

02-19-2012, 06:09 PM

Hey, Hank

Sorry it took you so long to learn to play. If, you had been power leveled, it wouldn't have taken so long.

I'm curious, I can tell by the tone of your threads/blog posts that you consider yourself to be a good player now. But, you said you weren't very good until lev 55. What happened at that point that made you a good player?

And once you learned to beckon and stomp properly, did you have to do that 63,000 times to learn how to do it well. I mean, those first 62,000 times that you tried, you simply failed? Did people call you 'noob'. Yeah, being called 'noob' 62,000 times must be ruff. I'm sorry if they did.

They, no one, has any right to be so judgemental. After all, it takes some folks 63,000 times of doing the same thing over and over again to learn how to do it 'properly'. Doesn't mean they are a noob, just means, that they are unique. Embrace the differences between peeps. DON'T HATE: APPRECIATE!!

So, people who are only level 45 (for example), and who haven't been lucky enough to power level, so.. are you saying they are really lousy, crappy players?

Or for the SL players who were at cap when the cap was 25. They were really lousy, crappy players because it is obvious that you can't get good in SL till level 40 (or w/e cap is for now, I don't play SL, lol)

Or, hmm.. are the current 40s in SL, no matter who they are or how good they think they are, are they really crappy players too? Because, the cap will eventually be raised higher. So, there not any good now. They all have to wait to get good?

Oh, no, wait..... I see what you're saying. We'll maybe I see, maybe I misuderstand. Let's see: Are you trying to say that all people learn at different rates? Some it takes longer. Some do it faster. That it depends on literally dozens of variables.

Are you saying that people learn at different speeds in different ways? That there is no one way to learn for everybody? If so, I'd have to totally agree with you.

You're contradicting yourself a lot, or was that intended? Lol. Anyway

1) I blame the fact that I was full strength, and few of my pulls ever connected. Haha. Thanks to necroreaper; who wasn't power levelled, told me I needed dexterity for a higher hit percent. Mind you I was full strength up until level 55 or so. You ever see a full strength bear in sewer gear? Low hit% = Bad crowd control. Or did you not know that? Lol.

Enough about me, let's get back on topic, eh? We're talking about how power levelling makes us inexperienced players. I'm guessing you were power levelled, otherwise how would you have solid proof that power levelling does indeed, make us a better player?

But, that all comes down to our own opinion, right? You definitely can't convince me that power levelling makes me a good player, even though you're trying your hardest with your posts.

What it all comes down to is: I'd rather learn the hard way and excel in the long run, then be a power levelled level 64 with 3k kills and 700 deaths, who also doesn't know how to play their class well.

Wouldn't you?

Aikiebo

02-19-2012, 06:38 PM

I wasn't power levelled when I started playing a bear. I learned my class eventually, on my own. Which is why I'm probably better than most bears who either 4xed to end-game levels, or were power levelled.

On a side note, I didn't learn any good skill until I hit 55.

Hey Hank,

I want to thank you for sharing your story with us. When someone get's something like that 'off their chest' it can make them feel better. And, I"m not ashamed to admit that I had to take a break to compose myself, becuase it was heart-wrenching.

But, that is only one reason I'm glad you shared your story. The second reason is this: You established proof for one of the main reasons why power leveling is so fantastic. In fact, I was moved.

I really want to thank you.

When people power level, they usually learn their class/game mechanics faster than most. But, let's not forget the unique ones who might use 4x combo and group or solo (in a few hours) all the way to 55 and not learn their class.

There is plenty of time. There is no reason, they have to slowbie all the way to the top. There is plenty of time.

People get to play their game their way. And no matter how conceited someone is, other people don't have to live up to the standards of the self-centered.

Power leveling 1 or even 2 characters to the top (or near top at least) is actually one of the very, very, very best ways to play a game you have never played before.

This is twice as true if this is the first mmo that someone has played.

Aikiebo

02-19-2012, 07:00 PM

You're contradicting yourself a lot, or was that intended?

even though you're trying your hardest with your posts.

Uhh.... uhhhh... uhhhh... For someone who claims to prefer the high road, that wasn't appropriate at all.

I didn't contradict myself. Not at all. You know that. But, saying it like that, without pointing to examples is just the same as resorting to name calling cuz there is no substance to what you're saying.

Of course, you can't point to examples because there are none.

You are tying to make people think that what I am saying doesn't make sense. But, I didn't contradict myself. That's why you can't point to an example. Same way as if you said some name.

Criticism of the idea is ok - not criticism of the person (that's part of the forum rules, btw)

As far as me trying to convince you of anything, hmm... no - not at all. When, I started posting on this thread, I don't think you had even started participating yet. Geez.. It's not all about you, Hank, lol.

Bottom line: I didn' contradict myself. You know that. And, if you don't want to like power leveling, idc.

Taipan

02-19-2012, 07:47 PM

1. Is power leveling a FANTASTIC way to play the game?

The answer to both questions, is of course yes.
I my opinion power leveling is NOT a "FANTASTIC" way to play the game

Aikiebo

02-19-2012, 07:58 PM

But, that all comes down to our own opinion, right?

Nope! Not at all. I got facts, truck loads of 'em!

1) I blame the fact that I was full strength, and few of my pulls ever connected. Haha. Thanks to necroreaper; who wasn't power levelled, told me I needed dexterity for a higher hit percent. Mind you I was full strength up until level 55 or so.

So, Hank, I really gotta thank you again. You are doing reallly good. You have managed to prove yet another major point that shows that power leveling is such a excellent and fantastic way to level. I really appreciate your help, btw.

You, have admitted to everyone that you choose not to power level. You trudged through 63,000 points of xp the hard, long, slow way, not having any idea how to play your class. And no one helped you till you were 55 levels into this game.

This is exactly why there are SOMETIMES high level players who are not aware of certain aspects of game mechanics (either group mechanics or other parts of the game).

It's not because they were power leveled. It is because of the nature of this game. That sounds like a criticism, but its not. It is actually a compliment.

BTW, there are about 2 dozen HUGE reasons why power leveling is so awsome and many smaller reasons. We've only talked about 2 (and the second one not completely),

anto

02-19-2012, 10:10 PM

why isn't Aikiebo a mod yet. ?

Aikiebo

02-19-2012, 10:26 PM

I realize that what I said in my last post wasn't really complete, so I want to add this:

Why is it possible that sometimes a player gets to a high level and not know everything there is to know about the game. These are the reasons - think about these things:

1. the closed instances
2. auto grouping
3. extremely short group times
4. lack of guilds (for what, the first year and a half
5. running vs.standing still while fighting
6. lack of hard kbs
7. only a few quick chat and other chat options
8. being able to warp just about everywhere
9. and more*

These are all reasons that make it a chore, sometimes a challenge and often times an impossibility to actually take a few minutes or even more and actually help someone out.

Not to mention, that sometimes a few minutes just isn't enough time to explain.

Not to mention, that a lot of times when you do try to help someone they react in negative ways.

Those 9 reasons above, we need in this game. They all are good: very, very good. But, in old school mmo's we didn't have those things. Why did we help each other? Well, the list of reasons is a mile long. But, it boils down to: in order for us to meet our goals we had to help others.

That's not true in this game. You don't need to help anyone in order to succeed. The only time you help someone is to be nice, or some other optional motiviation.

You can totally ignore every player that needs help and still succeed. That is what many people do.

But, it's true today -- in this game. In order to get what you want, you don't HAVE TO help anyone. Sadly, many people don't take that time.

Buubuuftw

02-19-2012, 10:33 PM

Nope! Not at all. I got facts, truck loads of 'em!

I disagree that powerleveling is a "fantastic way to play" but can you share some reasons why its so good? What can I get out of it other than fast leveling. I understand if you know how to play the game and your making another character just cause for PVP or just as an alt to play as then thats when I believe it's fine to get an elixer and buddy and rack up exp but not if its your first time playing the class. So, can I have a few reasons?

Cool4ever100

02-19-2012, 10:34 PM

Welcome! I hope you can find as much help as you need, after all this community loves to help

Aikiebo

02-20-2012, 12:04 PM

can you share some reasons why its so good? What can I get out of it other than fast leveling.

Thank you for asking. I know that this is a sensitive topic for many.

There are at least 2 dozen reasons why power leveling is extremely helpful and great way to play. This post talks about just one of those reasons. I will add to this thread to discuss the others.

[This post turned out to be super long. So, I am going to split it up between 3 posts. This way it will be easier to read. I'll just reserve the 2nd and 3rd posts. So, when I add the content, it won't bump the thread.]

I used to do what we called, 'training gigs'. It is here that a lot of advanced training happened. Being power leveled by me was like being in boot camp. Not because I acted like a drill seargent, but because it was very intensive. I power leveled friends and guildies and eventually people who knew my friends and guildies.

What ever area of game play that someone wanted help with is what we worked on.

One thing is when you are using the standard tank/dps/healer group mechanic, and you have done the same exact thing 100,000 times, or 200,000 times or more. You get real good at handling the mundane and predictable.

But, it is easy to get 'into a rut' so to speak.

What happens when something totally unexpected happens. Like a roamer spawns. The healer is getting beat on from behind and no one saw it coming. Your tank or healer goes link dead. Well sometimes folks couldn't handle the surprise, couldn't think on their feet, panicked and failed. So what to do about that?

In the controlled environment of a power leveling session, I could control the frequency and intensity of the 'surprise'. How? Well, while power leveling, I was always on my healer. I could hold agro for hours by healing.

People used to joke that the only reason I couldn't tank the dragon is cuz I didn't have the hp (it was a joke, healers didn't tank dragons). One place I used to go was these tents where 5 orcs would INSTA spawn.

The stream of attacks never ceased as long as you were standing in the tent. So, we'd go there. I'd hold agro while the group pounded away. But, at random intervals, I'd just stop healing. It only took a couple of seconds for all five orcs all of a sudden turn their attention to the group. It happened so fast, they didn't see it coming. And had to learn to think fast and act faster. I used these orc tents for other exercises as well.

Aikiebo

02-20-2012, 12:04 PM

Whatever aspect of game play someone wanted to work on, we could devise multiple ways of improving their skill. Some of these ways, like the orc tents, I used for up to 18 months. I frequently ran timed trials and I got good at training mobs onto my group if that was needed.

One of the first things I'd do is when someone started, maybe they wanted to work on their healer (for example). I'd say "ok, but let's start by logging onto your tank. What? You don't have a tank. Ok, good, this is a great time to start. Let's go."

So, we'd start level 1's. And we'd level till he learned to tank. Then we'd work on his healer. You can learn so much more about your class, by learning other classes also. Everything I know about healing, true healing, I learned from tanks.

Long time ago, I was thinking up ways I could do this in Pocket Legends. But, no one seemed interested. There are a lot of similarities in game play between old school and our mmo. But, there are a lot of differences as well. I was working on an idea. I never finished or really tested it and fine tuned/tweaked it to completion because no one seemed to be interested.

But, I remember how people used to hate the traps and barrels in the sewers. So a training gig similar in style to what I used to do could happen in the second map of Wyldwood. (After I planned it out carefully, went down there for multiple testing, and me and few friends beta'ed it.) I would go there on prob a level 23 toon. (Not so low, I'd insta die, but low enough to be vunerable) I'd run around like a nut, getting in los, just generally putting myself in harm's way. And my group would have to save me with out setting off barrels while I was near by. I'd get past traps constantly. They'd have to learn the timing to follow.

Then of course, usually, when we figured we did everything we could do in Wyldwood, we'd hop on toons high enough to go to the sewers and do the same thing there, lol.

I'm not saying this is necessarily a good idea to do. Working the sewers is not that complicated. I am just trying to show what I mean by training gig by giving an example.

But, when I say that being power leveled allows a player to stand tall with the best on the server, what do I mean by that?

Aikiebo

02-20-2012, 12:05 PM

Well, once a guy has performed the motions of standard group mechanics enough times, he can get real, real good. So good in fact his brilliance lights up the night sky. But it is easy to fall into a trap.

He might get to the point where he figures -- I won't say he thinks that he knows it all -- I'll just say, he figures that there isn't anything else to learn. He stops even trying and sinks into a love/hate relationship with Carpal Tunnel Syndrome.

OTOH, there's the player, who is worried about a certain skill, insecure about a particular aspect of game play. In fact, I've seen lists by players with over 20 areas they wanted to improve. This is the guy who says, "ok, let's go, when can we get started". "I'd like to do some of this before the weekend for w/e reason" "Com'on, let's start".

This is the guy who keeps trying and trying, learning and learning, just getting better and better.

This is the guy who doesn't have to keep reminding people how good he is. People know, they can see it for themselves.

This is the guy that can handle anything, anywhere, anytime instead of just the routine and mundane.

This is the guy with less medical bills cuz of that Carpal Tunnel Syndrome.

StompArtist

02-20-2012, 12:52 PM

This is the guy with less medical bills cuz of that Carpal Tunnel Syndrome.

LMAO

NECROREAPER

02-20-2012, 01:01 PM

In your post above, you're regarding to "training" as power leveling, which re two totally different things.

Training is something I whole-heartedly agree with since it does promote good teamwork, a better understanding of the fundamentals of how to play your class individually and in a group setting, provides direct feedback and guidance from someone with more experience, and it also helps to promote friendship and overall good feelings in game.

However, the power leveling you speak of and the power leveling the rest of the community envisions when the word is said are not the same thing. The power leveling we're referring to is the blatant leeching of xp from a higher level character who does all the work while the lower level character just reaps all the benefits. THIS power leveling promotes bad team mechanics, no idea how to play their class effectively and proficiently, high level "noobs," and generally "bad looks" from people.

The power leveling that I (and the majority of the community) is referring to is the one that helps to destroy the game. Back in the AO2/AO3 days, we had GREAT tanks, GREAT healers, and GREAT birds. Names of players who excelled at their class quickly arose: Tankaar, Ellyidol, Apollo, etc., and they were recognized because of their great understanding of not only their class, but also team dynamics and fundamentals. Nowadays, there are no new "Elly's or Tankaar's" because a lot of high level end game players still have no idea what they're doing in the dungeons, *especially* in a team environment. Power leveling is predominately to blame, although there are other factors that come in to play here as well.

This is where YOUR version of power leveling comes in. By "training" them, you can remove their training scars and help them to become better players, have a better understanding of their class, and even be a better asset to the community since they can in turn go out and train less educated players themselves.

Aikiebo

02-20-2012, 01:37 PM

two totally different things.

Training is something I whole-heartedly agree with

generally "bad looks" from people.

The power leveling that I (and the majority of the community) is referring to

Necro, advanced training and simply fast leveling are 2 parts of the same thing.

Fast leveling is a very important part of power leveling. I simply started where I started cuz buubuuftw asked specifically what is there more than just fast leveling. So can we keep this a real friendly tone. I don't know if you were getting upset in the above post. But please don't. No need to. I started where I started mearly to answer buubuuftw's question.

I'm not trying to downplay the importance of fast leveling. But, power leveling has both these major parts. One is not better or more important than the other.

I know that most people on the forum just think of it as fast leveling. I have said, dozens of times that it is more than just that tho. Cuz, it is. And if need be, I can explain that in detail.

Fast/power leveling can be where a high level and low level go together and get fast xp. Or, can be the use of elixirs to speed up xp.

[Omg, I just noticed you said 'bad looks'. That's not supposed to be a euphanism for 'frowned upon', is it?lol, that's funny. I mean this in a good, kind way. I think that is funny. Haha]

Ok, back to the post, lol.

Mynas Gen: If I was a player who knew nothing about power leveling, but was playing back then and lived through that ridic mess, you know what??? I'd hate power leveling too. But, in all complete honesty and sincerity, power leveling is so much more.

I don't just mean the advance training. I mean actual wonderful benefits to elixir use and/or high level helping method.

But, I want to talk about ^^^ in my next post. Cuz I don't want to make this too long AND

I have one serious issue with some of you post: Please lets stay calm. But, the idea, that I see, well, fairly often, certainly too often, that the original players of PL are the last great ones and there will never be others that are as good, or maybe even good at all.

Can you pause and hear what your saying. Don't you think that is really rude and kinda arrogant? I really believe you don't mean it that way. You are upset at things you don't totally understand or agree with, I see that. But, to say there are no great players today is a very awful thing to say. What do you think people are thinking when they read that. Don't you think it is insulting?

And the reason MAYBE there are no big names like their used to be has:

1. Not only has nothing to do with power leveling

2. It has nothing to do with any game play at all

3. It has to do with the things that people say on the forum.

What if people kept telling you that you never gonna amount to anything?

Please think, about what other people are thinking.

And, power leveling has got nothing to do with that.

I'm gonna respond to more of what you said, I'm not trying to avoid anything. Just don't want to make this too long. Ok?

NECROREAPER

02-20-2012, 02:03 PM

No bad tones intended in my above post. I'll post my retort later, I'm at the beach :D

Lowlyspy

02-20-2012, 02:03 PM

Meh aikiebo, shorten your posts dude. You add spaces and start new paragraphs when they don't need to be started, these are the main reasons people never fully read all your posts, too much to read. (yes I have plenty better things to do than read your 6 page essay posts) Paragraphs are 4-5 sentences, not 1-2 sentences bud.

Grammar Nazi, Awayyyy!

Hankomachos

02-20-2012, 02:15 PM

there is no substance to what you're saying.

Thank you for bringing this up! It had me thinking... do your "arguments" have any substance? It's not like you have any solid proof that power levelling makes you a better player.
Like I said, it's all opinion. You may think otherwise, but that backs up my point; it's all opinion. Just like I can't prove not being power levelled makes me a better player. Although, I know that me being not power levelled made me a better player, however, I can't speak for others. Just like you can't either.

Side note, I'm so touched my story moved you. :) If only others would follow in my footsteps, they would be great players too. :D

StompArtist

02-20-2012, 02:17 PM

Looking at the whole power leveling argumentation here...

My question is: Why do a lot of games, on the market today, take measures to prevent power levelling to an extent?

Hankomachos

02-20-2012, 02:31 PM

Looking at the whole power leveling argumentation here...

My question is: Why do a lot of games, on the market today, take measures to prevent power levelling to an extent?

Imho, so players can learn skill and teamwork. What's the fun in a game if you just leech through it? Also, there's that sense of accomplishment when you level on your own (or with a party your level.) Part of MMOS-to my knowledge- is story, and learning good teamwork. Then again, this is the only mmo I've ever played, so what do I know eh? :p

Eddison Sukansingh

02-20-2012, 03:57 PM

My IGN is fireboyeddy and i wouldn't mind helping you level up while you get to learn about your character.
Its nice to have some hard core fighters protect and help you level up, i know the feeling.lol.
My mage is level 65 n am hard core fighter.
My help is genuine n i don't need any type of payment just have fun playing this gr8 game n make lots of nice friends who can "benefit":D you.
At the same time try not to ask people for much unless you can't help it. This game has allot of "pride/ego":p filled people am one of them but i also really like helping noobs, helping out new players is kinder the objective of the guild am in xplicit.
A group of hard core fighters aimed at helping out noobs.

Take the advice of the others here cos they are also pros :)

Sent from my GT-I5800 using Tapatalk

Gaunab

02-20-2012, 03:58 PM

I wasn't quite sure if I should laugh or cry about this thread...

Some facts:

fact #1:
I have had my mage powerleveled at the 56 cap, while I leveled regularly with my bird, and guess what - I'm a horrible mage. I was used to the dodge and all the bird skills and combos. My mage was extremely squishy (because I was used to a very agressive playstyle with my bird), my combos were weak and I was as unsopportive as possible. Not what I would expect of any endgame mage. And that eventhough I read through guides and had endgame experience!
I ended up starting a new mage and leveling the hard way, and learned how to play properly. Heal is one of the first spells a mage learnes and at the beginning of the game important to use supportive which I learned this way. At early levels you won't die in a few hits, you can take time to learn, and you also can't rely on the rest of your group doing all the work for you because everyone is a noob! :D

fact #2:
If powerleveling a better way to learn the class, how comes that there is concrete evidence that many powerleveled chars fail to understand their own class as well as group mechanics? How comes that I see chars with very low kill counts at lvl65 that are just following the group without activly engaing in combat? Bears not leading the group, mages not healing and birds just spaming their skils randomly?
Maybe that's because they never had to bother about those things because they were just following a high level char and now that they are at endgame they can't live up with the speed and difficulty the gameplay needs.

I have experienced powerleveling as well as playing with people who have been leveled this way, and I will never promote it.

On another note: I believe that to become an absolute pro player, you should have some PvP experience. You learn much about skill ranges, get quicker reflexes and kiting skills. ;)

Just my 2ct.

Aikiebo

02-20-2012, 04:02 PM

My question is: Why do a lot of games, on the market today, take measures to prevent power levelling to an extent?

Hey Stomp,

Every single top-grossing f2p game that I have played has without fail, WITHOUT FAIL has enabled power leveling. Millions of gamers are power leveling. Virtually no one wants to level slowly.

What games are you talking about? Power leveling is all the rage, lol.

Power leveling is making game companies millions of dollars.

STS is not limiting power leveling. It is expanding it.

Basically, they power leveled every player in one fell swoop when the lowered xp requirements. Why did they do that? Was it because most people want to level slowly and they were hoping to iritate people? Umm.... No. That is not the reason. They did it because most people don't want to take forever to level. They want to level faster. There is no reason that it should take a long time to level.

Is STS trying to discourage elixir use? Umm... No. They have increased the types of elixirs. Why are they increasing this? Because people want to buy them. They don't want to take forever to level. There is no reason they should take forever to level.

Every f2p game that I know of has power leveling. These are popular games making huge amounts of money. Why are they making money? Cuz people don't want to level slowly. They want to level faster.

What games do you mean?

Aikiebo

02-20-2012, 04:04 PM

No bad tones intended in my above post. I'll post my retort later, I'm at the beach :D

Geez!! You're having more fun than me, lol. Take your time, have fun!

Elysony

02-20-2012, 04:13 PM

STS Please tell us is power leveling a good thing I am completely dumbfounded with this thread and how some people keep saying it is good !? I am requesting a lock for 2 reasons . 1 : This is insane and this thread is now just a argument . 2 : This is encouraging power leveling a lot which is not a good thing and is not showing kindess watching a couple people disagree . Just to let Necro and Hank know I am for SURE on all of you all's side . Once again requesting a lock . - Elysony .

StompArtist

02-20-2012, 04:20 PM

Hey Stomp,

Every single top-grossing f2p game that I have played has without fail, WITHOUT FAIL has enabled power leveling. Millions of gamers are power leveling. Virtually no one wants to level slowly.

What games are you talking about? Power leveling is all the rage, lol.

Power leveling is making game companies millions of dollars.

STS is not limiting power leveling. It is expanding it.

Basically, they power leveled every player in one fell swoop when the lowered xp requirements. Why did they do that? Was it because most people want to level slowly and they were hoping to iritate people? Umm.... No. That is not the reason. They did it because most people don't want to take forever to level. They want to level faster. There is no reason that it should take a long time to level.

Is STS trying to discourage elixir use? Umm... No. They have increased the types of elixirs. Why are they increasing this? Because people want to buy them. They don't want to take forever to level. There is no reason they should take forever to level.

Every f2p game that I know of has power leveling. These are popular games making huge amounts of money. Why are they making money? Cuz people don't want to level slowly. They want to level faster.

What games do you mean?

Not sure we are using the same definition for power leveling...

But okay here are a few games with brief explanation of the measure taken to combat power leveling:

STS PL: Low level toons can no longer enter higher level instances to prevent players from leeching XP from higher level players. Plenty of mentions of this by the devs on these forums.

WoW: Blizzard actively filling lawsuits against powerleveling services for cash and banning accounts.

SWTOR & LOTRO: Average level of players decreases XP reward rendering it null if the high levels in a group are too high for the bosses. Must make damage on enemies to earn XP.

That's the ones I am familiar with. :)

Aikiebo

02-20-2012, 04:27 PM

What's the fun in a game if you just leech through it? Also, there's that sense of accomplishment when you level on your own (or with a party your level.) Part of MMOS-to my knowledge- is story, and learning good teamwork. Then again, this is the only mmo I've ever played, so what do I know eh? :p

Hank, you partially right. Many people enjoy leveling that old-school, slow way. They do get that sense of accomplisment when they play this way.

There's nothing wrong with that. It's a great way to play.

But, this is an ideal that most people don't care about. Not that there's anything wrong with what you and others like. But, there is nothing wrong with playing a different way as well.

Most people get a sense of accomplishment by living their own ideal-what they think is important. They hate it when someone tries to force some other ideal down their throats. Or insult them just cause their different.

And it is ludicsous to think that someone has to slowly go through 63,000 xp in order to learn their class. Most people are not that slow-minded.

There is no reason to insult people who use elixirs just cause you don't like the fact that they do.

Remember, different people have different ideas of fun. You think it is more fun to level slowly. Others think it is more fun to level faster. One way is not better than the other.

Otukura

02-20-2012, 04:30 PM

STS PL: Low level toons can no longer enter higher level instances to prevent players from leeching XP from higher level players. Plenty of mentions of this by the devs on these forums.

BUT there are elixirs to do so.

WoW: Blizzard actively filling lawsuits against powerleveling services for cash and banning accounts.

Not really the same; those ones are for cash.

SWTOR & LOTRO: Average level of players decreases XP reward rendering it null if the high levels in a group are too high for the bosses. Must make damage on enemies to earn XP.
In new games(where the cap is easily reachable), I think they discourage it a lot more than older ones(where the cap is harder to reach). I assume you've heard of Blizzard's 3x xp for new recruits thing? I'm guessing SWTOR might do something along those lines when it has a cap of 80.

StompArtist

02-20-2012, 04:32 PM

BUT there are elixirs to do so.

Not really the same; those ones are for cash.

In new games(where the cap is easily reachable), I think they discourage it a lot more than older ones(where the cap is harder to reach). I assume you've heard of Blizzard's 3x xp for new recruits thing? I'm guessing SWTOR might do something along those lines when it has a cap of 80.

Yeah... I do believe there are several definitions of power leveling here and that is what is keeping the debate going. Semantics will get you every time. lol

Gaunab

02-20-2012, 04:36 PM

Asking to be powerleveled is just like if a pupil asks if he could please get his graduation without doing all these annoying years of school.
If that would possible, I'm sure many bored/annoyed students would do so (if their parents woudn't disagree) and therefor miss a great opportunity!
Leveling is a learning process. You get to know the game like you get to know the principles of society in school. That does take its time, and that is good and OK.

Sure, if you dont go to school you could still learn those things or also become successfull without, but it will be harder because you are expected to be at a higher level than you actually are. Some might manage it, but many won't. Same for leveling, some may not need so much time to learn, but the majority does (as I figure).

That might not be the perfect metaphor, but I think you are getting my point.

Use the opportunity that is given by leveling regularly. What's the point of starting to learn once you are at the cap? No need to rush things, it won't make it any easier.
Enjoying the game is one thing, but you should also make it enjoyable to others - by correctly playing your class. :)

StompArtist

02-20-2012, 04:43 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Experience_point#Power-Leveling

Power-Leveling
Power-leveling is most frequently employed in multi-player games, where it usually refers to a player that is of much greater power assisting a player of much lower power in defeating enemies that are far too powerful for the low-level player, but are easily and quickly killed by the more powerful player.
This practice is related to "tanking", in which a more durable character protects a more vulnerable character by causing the monsters to prioritize the tank as a target. Defeating high level challenges rewards the lower level player with experience points more rapidly than normal. In general this is considered a form of cheating, or manipulation of the game system for unintended results. However, some view it as a strategic means of gaining levels, especially on single-player RPGs and among friends on MMORPGs.
To combat power-leveling and leeching, some game designers have devised better means of rewarding a player based on their actual contribution to the completion of the task. Another method used is to cap how much experience a character can gain at any single moment. For example, the game might not allow a character to gain more than 20% of the experience they need to level up by defeating an enemy. This is controversial in that it also punishes players who are skilled enough to face challenges more difficult than regular players or that band together with other players to face more difficult challenges. Another anti-power-leveling method, popularized through widespread adoption of the CircleMUD code base, is to distribute experience points from an enemy across a party pro rata by level, such that each party member gains a fraction of the enemy's experience points corresponding to the fraction of a party's total level ownership possessed by that character. For example, after any given battle, a level-30 character in a party would earn twice as much experience as would a level-15 character. Power-levelers sometimes circumvent this provision by what could be called "passive power-leveling", where a high level character who has access to healing abilities does not formally join the lower-level character's party, instead a) healing and/or "powering up" the lower-level character, b) targeting the enemy with spells or effects that do not involve joining the battle, and/or c) fighting alongside the lower-level character until the enemy is nearly defeated and then pausing the battle (e.g., through use of "calm" or a similar command) and allowing the lower-level character to resume, finish, and claim all the experience points for itself. Finally, power-levelling may be rendered more difficult by having very large jumps between experience points required for each subsequent level of experience. It is common practice to have experience needed increasing in a non-linear way relative to experience levels to push players to the next town or land, but it can also reduce the opportunities for power-levelling as a player would be forced to find a different power-levelling technique for every couple of experience levels and move and do that technique.
Power-leveling increased in EverQuest as it became more common to sell characters through the Internet. Techniques of kill stealing and power-gaming would make this pursuit considerably more attractive.
Some online companies offer power-leveling services, whereby a customer pays a fixed amount for the company to level up their character. Essentially, the customer provides the company with the username and password for their account, and the company assigns an employee to play the character for the customer until a desired level is reached. However, this is usually against a game's rules and will often result in the character being banned and/or legal action being taken against those involved. Some of the said services have been also known for marketing their services through spamming, which adds to the dubious legality of power-leveling services. As a customer is surrendering their username and password, an unscrupulous service may "steal" the character, for later resale to another customer desiring a "pre-made" high-level character.

This is the definition I am going by.

As far as my own personal opinion on the matter goes I am neither for nor against powerleveling as long as it doesn't interfere with my gameplay. I play games for MY enjoyment and could not care less what others do. :vmad:

Aikiebo

02-20-2012, 04:45 PM

Not sure we are using the same definition for power leveling...

Thank you for reminding me. I have said many times, that when it comes to issues of abuses, exploits, mods, RMT or w/e, I am 100% against that. It's been a long time since it has come up, so I should have already said it. I forgot. Anything that is not approved of by devs of any game should be completely 100% not allowed. But, that's anything. Not just power leveling. RMT is (well not so much anyore, lol) outlawed, but games aren't gonna get rid of gold.

In STS games low levels and high levels can play together. Low levels can get xp. That's been true as far as I know, well for forever, lol. But, if not well over a year.

And I'm talking about the millions of people, MILLIONs of peole who play f2p games. Power leveling is in every single top-grossing game that I know of.

Millions of people pay to power level EVERYDAY.

I heard WoM was gonna? Is that true?

You may be right about us not using the same definition of power leveling. (Edit: Yes, we are using different definitions. I am using a very broad one. Others are using a more narrow one. Which is ok with me, because, the high-level helping low-level is a realy great way to play for those who want to do it.)

Power leveling is acceptable and HIGHLY ENCOURAGED.

MILLIONS power level EVERYDAY. They are having tons of fun.

NECROREAPER

02-20-2012, 05:10 PM

Just to be clear to all those involved and reading:

This is in no way, shape, or form an argument/bickerfest/rage thread, it has developed into a intelligent and meaningful DISCUSSION over the pros, cons, and definition of power leveling in PL

StompArtist

02-20-2012, 05:12 PM

I think it's an interesting discussion to have and I am enjoying it. Thanks to all involved.

Aikiebo

02-20-2012, 05:21 PM

I think it's an interesting discussion to have and I am enjoying it. Thanks to all involved.

Just to be clear to all those involved and reading:

This is in no way, shape, or form an argument/bickerfest/rage thread, it has developed into a intelligent and meaningful DISCUSSION over the pros, cons, and definition of power leveling in PL

And I totally agree.

Just for the record, I'm not blind to any down side. ALL THINGS have pro's and con's. That's true for power leveling. That's true for everything.

I am glad that we can have a useful discussion.

And, I also say thanks to all involved.

Hankomachos

02-20-2012, 05:38 PM

And just to clarify, aik, i mean no disrespect to you, or anyone in my posts. I'm glad we're having this discussion. :)

Aikiebo

02-20-2012, 06:01 PM

And just to clarify, aik, i mean no disrespect to you, or anyone in my posts. I'm glad we're having this discussion. :)

I feel the same way, very much so.

mackjack

02-20-2012, 11:09 PM

Before arguing the pros/cons of "power-leveling", it's probably best to define what this term means.

- Aikiebo's definition of power-leveling: higher level players training lower level players

- Just about everybody else's definition of power-leveling: higher level players blasting everything in sight and the lower level players just blindly follow and leech xp

So when Aikiebo argues that "power-leveling" is the best thing ever, take it to mean that it's great if lower level players can find higher level palyers to train them in the finer points of the game, and in the process gain xp as well.

When other say that "power-leveling" sux, take it to mean that lower level players just stand around and leech xp without any clue as to what's going on.

Carry on.

Epic Unicorns!

02-20-2012, 11:19 PM

This poor guy just wanted some help leveling and learning .-. Lol

Thasaint

02-20-2012, 11:24 PM

IMO he just wants some help leveling. Whether he chooses to level the old fashioned way where you grind for hours to achieve your goal level, or he gets power leveled and skips the experience is completely his choice. Not for others to decide.

Otukura

02-20-2012, 11:25 PM

Aikiebo

02-20-2012, 11:39 PM

BUT there are elixirs to do so.

I assume you've heard of Blizzard's 3x xp for new recruits thing? I'm guessing SWTOR might do something along those lines when it has a cap of 80.

Ok, just to clarify. Because, we do seem to be using different definitions of power leveling. Let me say, how I am using the term, ok?

Category A: Standard xp with no type of acceleration what so ever.

Category B: Anything, anything at all that accelerates xp to a rate faster than just the basic, normal rate.

This includes items or player assisted acceleration.

Items could be buffs, drinks, foods, equipment, something earned that devs of the game altered on your toon (like a special ability), etc.

Player assist could be where the high level is doing the killiing and low levels help, plain leaching, healing from outside the group or w/e else might work.

Category C: Various ways providing advanced training.

I think the only real controversy is in category B (other than does category c even belong here, yes, but its a small point, so idc.)

For the record: I support every possibility in all three categories. Except: for anything that violates the ToS of a game. That I will never, ever support. No exceptions.

I think some ways are better than others. For instance, I have said many times that plain leaching is the most useless form of power leveling (more on this in different post).

So, I just wanted to clarify for the record: When I am talking about power leveling - in general: the above is what I am referring to.

*